GPT-5.2 Reactions, Jacob Elordi vs AI, Disney x OpenAI Deal Breakdown | Diet TBPN

Summary

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TBPN Podcast Summary

Episode: GPT-5.2 Reactions, Jacob Elordi vs AI, Disney x OpenAI Deal Breakdown
Hosts: John Coogan & Jordi Hays
Date: December 13, 2025
Show: Diet TBPN

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the blockbuster Disney x OpenAI deal (which allows AI generation of Disney character media), the latest updates on GPT-5.2 and its reasoning abilities, reactions from AI skeptics and public figures like Jacob Elordi, and the broader state of enterprise AI. The hosts offer incisive commentary on tech industry culture, the challenges and opportunities for both OpenAI and Disney, and the surprising evolution of attitudes toward generative AI and intellectual property.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Meaning Behind Sam Altman’s “Death Star” Post

• [00:02–01:13]
  • The hosts revisit Sam Altman’s (OpenAI CEO) August 6 “Death Star” social media post, made cryptically before the Disney deal announcement.
  • It’s now interpreted as foreshadowing OpenAI’s integration of Disney (Star Wars) IP, or a show of force against Google.
  • “It wasn’t a vague post. It was just early, a preview, a deal that would take shape four months later.” — Jordy [00:05]
  • The post was controversial at the time, implying something “so all powerful” was about to launch.

2. Disney x OpenAI Deal: Details and Strategy

• [01:13–07:24]

  • Disney invests $1 billion into OpenAI and grants a three-year IP license for AI-generated content with 200+ major Disney characters, including one year of exclusivity.
  • Disney also sent Google a cease-and-desist, setting the tone for future negotiations with other AI providers.
  • “Bob Iger knows that AI Generated Disney will happen with or without the company’s blessing. So partnering with OpenAI today while setting up negotiations with Google and other players makes a lot of sense.” — John [03:03]
  • The deal’s strategic importance is significant for OpenAI’s product and distribution, even though $1 billion is minor compared to “trillion-dollar” ambitions.
  • Disney’s massive global reach (140M park visits, 128M Disney+ subscribers) can supercharge AI’s mainstream appeal.

  On the Consumer Value Proposition:

  • Personal anecdotes from the hosts about using AI to generate “dino” versions of photos for their kids illustrate the joy and stickiness of personalized content with trusted IP [04:44–05:06].
  • The ability to feature Sora/ChatGPT content on Disney+ and perhaps through curated short-form feeds sparks debate about “curation” and the challenge of not turning this into another endless-slop content situation for kids.

3. Will AI-Generated Disney Content Be Immediately Abused?

• [07:24–08:52]
  • John predicts day-one jailbreaking and viral misuse, while Jordy argues that modern models are much harder to exploit.
  • “I just trust that the Internet immediately will figure out…with hundreds of millions of people trying to jailbreak it, they will pull it off course.” — John [08:32]
  • Discussion of open-source models faking Sora watermarks/outputs to troll or critique Disney/OpenAI.

4. What Content Will Disney Allow? (Brand Safety & Enforcement)

• [10:02–12:54]
  • Tyler and Jordy amuse about how far users might push content boundaries (e.g., violence between Luke Skywalker and Spider-Man).
  • “Where do you think the line is? …How do they even think about a framework for upholding the brand?” — Jordy [10:39]
  • The hosts reference Hollywood precedent: actors contractually forbidden to “lose” fights, raising parallel questions about AI content enforcement.

5. Industry Attitudes are Changing

• [12:03–12:54]
  • Jordy reflects on how critics decried letting AI generate IP-based content months ago, but reality changed fast: “Two months later. How the times have changed.”

6. Speed of AI Progress & Shifting Benchmarks

• [13:02–13:18]
  • Rapid image model progress: what looked “so good” last summer now appears outdated, highlighting shifting expectations for generative AI visuals.

7. GPT-5.2 Performance & Reasoning Models

• [15:47–19:40]
  • Vibes around OpenAI are rebounding after recent crises.
  • Deep dive on founder equity (e.g., Altman compared to Jobs, Gates, Bezos, Musk) and the structural challenges of OpenAI’s nonprofit-to-corp evolution.
  • Technical discussion of “reasoning” vs. “scale” in new models with references to ARC-AGI benchmarks.
  • “The jump to reasoning models will be studied for years. They are still wildly underrated... Add a bit of reasoning and performance immediately jumps.” — Jordy [18:27]

8. The Oracle Data Center Delays

• [19:40–21:25]
  • Report of Oracle’s delayed datacenter projects for OpenAI to 2028, possible signs of AI infra bubbles, and Oracle’s public denial of any “delays to sites required to meet contractual commitments.”

9. Land as the Underrated Asset Class

• [21:25–21:48]
  • Anticipation of flat S&P 500 returns; John argues “land is the most criminally underrated asset,” critiquing meme coin and “poly market” mania—a brief, humorous investment aside.

10. Klein “Smell” Controversy & Tech Industry PR

• [21:48–24:31]
  • Recap of the social media firestorm where a Klein AI engineer’s offhand “imagine the smell” comment at a hackathon led to accusations of racism, the CEO first defending, then firing him, and facing backlash for caving under pressure.
  • “Cowardice doesn’t happen by accident... betraying people or principles is...less excusable.” — John, quoting Lulu [23:25]
  • Discussion on how such PR crises escalate and the lasting fallout for leadership and company culture.

11. US Politics & “AI Is Boring”

• [24:31–29:15]
  • Brief news item: Trump musing about eliminating taxes on gambling winnings—hosts note the unserious viral moment this created in prediction and gambling circles.
  • Actor Jacob Elordi’s viral quote lambasting the AI hype: “I have no tolerance for AI and find it all so effing boring. I would much rather kiss on the beach and read a novel and be sunburnt.” [28:43]
  • Hosts laugh at Elordi’s “pick me” vibes and the divide between public figures dismissing AI and technical folks obsessing over it.
  • “He would not like this show!” — John [29:10]

12. Enterprise AI Hype — The Reality

• [25:54–29:11]
  • Announcement: OpenAI’s top priority for 2026 will be enterprise AI (“This tracks with hiring [the] Slack CEO as CRO” — John [25:54]).
  • John reads a hilarious parody monologue of how enterprise “AI transformation” is sold internally—tracking metrics no one understands, board slides, and the emptiness of performative tech adoption.

13. Major US Rare Earths Discovery

• [29:31–29:44]
  • Hosts briefly mention a new Utah discovery of rare earth minerals, the “most significant critical mineral reserve in the US.” Celebrate America’s continued natural resource luck.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Death Star post. Now it makes sense. It all makes sense.” — Jordy [00:02]
• “Bob Iger knows that AI Generated Disney will happen with or without the company’s blessing. So partnering with OpenAI today…” — John [03:03]
• “Will the functionality be immediately abused? Yes. Will it create uncomfortable moments for Disney’s leadership? Yes. Is it a smart move for Disney? Yes. Will OpenAI have to shell out billions to maintain exclusive access over the long run? Yes.” — John [07:24]
• “Where do you think the line is?...How do they even think about a framework for upholding the brand?” — Jordy [10:39]
• “The jump to reasoning models will be studied for years. They are still wildly underrated… Add a bit of reasoning and performance immediately jumps…” — Jordy [18:27]
• “I have no tolerance for AI and find it all so effing boring. I would much rather kiss on the beach and read a novel and be sunburnt.” — Jacob Elordi (quoted by John) [28:43]
• Parody of enterprise “AI adoption” (John, [26:25–29:11]):
  “Success means a pilot didn’t visibly fail. The CFO asked about our roi. I showed him a graph. The graph went up and to the right. It measured AI enablement. I made that metric up…”

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Segment Timestamps

• 00:02 — Death Star post’s true meaning and Star Wars IP
• 01:13 — The Disney x OpenAI deal breakdown
• 03:03 — The business rationale for Disney and OpenAI partnership
• 04:44 — Personal anecdotes: AI’s magical moments for families
• 07:24 — Will AI-generated Disney IP be abused?
• 10:02 — What content is permissible? (Disney and violence)
• 13:02 — AI visual progress and shifting standards
• 15:47 — OpenAI after the “Code Red”; founder equity comparisons
• 18:27 — Reasoning in new LLMs and ARC-AGI leaderboard
• 19:40 — Oracle datacenter delays; S&P 500 return skepticism
• 21:25 — Land as an underrated asset class
• 21:48 — The Klein “Smell” controversy in tech PR
• 24:31 — Trump, taxes, and the viral nature of prediction markets
• 25:54 — OpenAI’s pivot to enterprise AI for 2026
• 26:25–29:11 — Hilarious enterprise “AI transformation” satire
• 28:43 — Jacob Elordi’s “AI is boring” quote
• 29:31 — Major US rare earth mineral discovery

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Takeaways

• The Disney x OpenAI licensing deal is historic for mainstreaming AI-generated content with major IP, making OpenAI the first mover with trusted, global brands (“real differentiation”).
• AI’s evolution is so rapid that audience expectations are always catching up and strategic partnerships are becoming essential for both tech companies and legacy media giants.
• Brand safety remains a critical challenge for deploying AI-generated content at scale, particularly for family-friendly franchises.
• The business world is still figuring out what to do with AI, with much of the focus on optics, metrics, and internal “AI transformation” rather than functional deployment.
• Cultural figures outside tech (like Jacob Elordi) are already “over” AI discourse, but the hype and innovation around large language models and generative tools continue inside the tech industry.
• Infrastructure and resource constraints, as well as corporate and cultural controversies, will shape the next act for OpenAI, Disney, and the generative AI industry.

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Transcript

[Jordy]

Death Star post. Now it makes sense. It all makes sense.

[John]

It all makes sense.

[Jordy]

It wasn't a vague post. It was just early, a preview, a deal that would take shape four months later. Right. That's what was happening. Sam Altman, of course, what Was this? On GPT5 day, August 6, he posted a picture of the Death Star rising on the horizon. Very confusing post at the time. Now we understand and we get it. He was saying, hey, want to. One day we're gonna have rights to Star wars property through this deal with this Darth.

[John]

Of course, Darth Samma.

[Jordy]

People did not like this post at.

[John]

The time and the timing was really funny. It implied that they were about to release something so all powerful.

[Jordy]

Yeah, it was easy to read it that way.

[John]

Yeah.

[Jordy]

You could also read it as like, maybe they're going on the offensive against the Death Star, the Empire, which is Google. They're gonna attack Google. There were a number of different ways to read into it, but it was, it felt confusing.

[John]

It was confusing. And then, and then it, and then it was. I feel like people were somewhat let down.

[Jordy]

We had a bunch of different takes on it. We think it makes sense now, but now, you know, it's even more clear with the Disney deal. But you wrote about the Disney deal. You dug into the deal and you kind of crystallized your take. So take me through it.

[John]

I wrote 127 days. That's the gap between Sam's Star Wars Death Star vague posts and yesterday's announcement that Disney is investing $1 billion into OpenAI and giving them a three year license that allows users to generate AI photos and videos of the most popular 200 Disney characters. Most notably, OpenAI is guaranteed a one year exclusive on the IP. And while the posts and the deal are probably not connected, I think it's funny to imagine that they are. Right before the deal was announced, Disney sent Google a cease and desist letter claiming Google had been violating Disney's intellectual property by allowing users to generate a variety of Disney characters. Many people outside tech seem shocked that Disney would license their IP in the first place, given their history ruthlessly protecting it. There's a number of examples of Disney coming after kids birthday parties, or at least that's how they positioned it. Of course, these are businesses effectively using Disney characters to monetize.

[Jordy]

I read your draft and I was like, wait, they sued a child for having a Disney theme?

[John]

There's two notable examples. One, one is coming after basically a birthday party service company, like a business.

[Jordy]

That sells and we will do your birthday party and then they were selling and it'll be princess themed.

[John]

Well, so what they, it wouldn't, they wouldn't directly call the charact that you could like rent the the same names. It wasn't like Elsa.

[Jordy]

Okay.

[John]

But it was clear in the reviews what Disney noted in the reviews. People would call the characters by the Disney name. So that was one of their proof points. And there was also a story of a father who like wanted to do a spider man tombstone for his like very young son. That passed. And, and I think it was the effectively got blocked. It wasn't necessarily directly by Disney, but anyways Disney has long standing policy of not letting other people PR nightmare.

[Jordy]

If your legal team comes to you and says like we want to sue.

[John]

A dead person, like no, it was just like it wasn't a lawsuit.

[Jordy]

Or maybe it was a tombstone company.

[John]

They were just saying like, no, you can't make a spider man. Many people outside of tech seem shocked that Disney would license their ip. But Bob Iger knows that AI Generated Disney will happen with or without the company's blessing. So partnering with OpenAI today while setting up negotiations with Google and other players makes a lot of sense. Again, I just expect this, like cease and desist is the start of a negotiation process in order to get the same type of IP and capability ultimately into Gemini, but in 2027, not yet. Yeah, well, and maybe not, right? Like one question I have is they have a one year exclusive after that period, does Disney say, okay, you can keep having the exclusive, but you need to pay us like a billion dollars.

[Jordy]

A year and at least Google's at the table negotiating. Is that what you mean?

[John]

Yeah, exactly. The strategic significance of this deal for OpenAI has been broadly underappreciated, mainly because for a company that frequently talks in the trillions Disney investment, a paltry 1 billion just isn't enough to turn heads. But the advantage this deal gives OpenAI from a product and distribution standpoint is extremely significant. OpenAI has 20 to 30 million paid users out of a total of 900 million globally. Disney, on the other hand, had 140 million people visit Disney parks in the last year and 128 million paid subscribers to Disney Plus. If you're an adult spending thousands of dollars to take your kids to Disneyland or a Disney plus subscriber, surely you'll pay an incremental amount to OpenAI to extend and personalize your Disney experience as a parent. Some of the most magical moments with AI that I've had are simply generate. I've Talked about this before. I take a real photo of me and my son and I turn it into dinosaur mode, generic design source dino mode. It really brings us both a lot of joy. It's his reaction to the picture that I'm getting joy from because he just like absolutely loves it.

[Jordy]

I had a similar experience where I would like take a picture of. We'd create a scene of toys and then we'd say make these LEGO versions of this or something. But the models got so good at a certain point that I was just like, okay, I made his toys look like toys and it just looks exactly like what I made. I was like, I need to just take a photo. I need more creativity to come up with something remarkable.

[John]

My household is not into the Disney world yet. The kids are just young. But I can imagine how excited if you're a Frozen superfan, an Avengers Superfan, being able to put yourself, your kids into their world I think is going to be pretty exciting. So having a license to generate high quality images and videos of 200 of these characters creates a temporary but very real differentiation for tons of current and future ChatGPT users. Knowing Sam and Josh, they've likely negotiated to get Sora ChatGPT broad exposure across Disney properties, both online and offline. And we already know that select Sora videos will be featured in Disney plus. I think they're gonna be taking really making sure they're hand selecting those because.

[Jordy]

I wonder what that means. I wonder if that means the Apple TV app or the Disney plus app on the phone. On an iPad, on a phone. It feels a little bit more natural just in terms of the Star wars property. Like there's, there are the original Star wars films and then there's young Jedi Adventures, which is Star wars for kids. You know, there's even less violence. It's more, more G rated than a PG13 rated. Even with Bluey, very popular children's show on Disney. On Disney, there are full episodes that are like a full episode might be, I want to say like eight minutes long, but then there's minisodes that are even shorter. So like the short formification is happening within the Disney app already. But I think a lot of parents would have a sort of negative reaction to just a feed. A feed? Yeah, an endless scrolling feed of short form Sora content. That's going to be really tricky. It needs, it needs a twist. It needs curation. They said that there's already going to be curation, but I wonder how that's.

[John]

Going to roll out Curation. But it could still very well be infinite.

[Jordy]

You could essentially have like a, like a film festival that's running and kids submit their generations and then those get.

[John]

Film festival of seven seconds videos. I'm sure Hollywood will love that.

[Jordy]

Back in the, back in the vine days like the creative skill ceiling was incredible. People were doing remarkable, remarkable things with that. I still believe that there's some really interesting things that you can do with generative systems with generative AI. And I imagine that we will see some cool stuff come out of the Disney partnership, but I don't know that I'd want a kid sitting there watching Endless Slobber.

[John]

I finish it out by saying my long held assumption is that over time everyday consumers won't pay for LLMs. There will be great ad and commerce supported LLMs that provide the monetization to serve great models. But OpenAI's challenge is that even with future hall of Famers like Fiji, Simo and Denise Dresser on board, Denise is of course the former CEO of Slack who's now the CRO at OpenAI. They can't massively scale monetization of the free product overnight. They can't just say, hey ChatGPT agent, yeah, create a massive ad platform. Don't make mistakes. I don't expect those business lines to really begin ramping until the second half of next year and they need to show continued revenue growth now. Hard to think of a better time for this deal to get done than 11 days into OpenAI's code red and right as Sora was about to fall out of the App Store's top 25. Will the functionality be immediately abused? Yes. Will it create uncomfortable moments for Disney's leadership? Yes. Is it a smart move for Disney? Yes. Will OpenAI have to shell out billions to maintain exclusive access over the long run? Yes.

[Jordy]

I want to debate you on this idea that it will be abused immediately. I think it's actually really, really hard to abuse these systems. Oh, jailbreak it. I got it to say something crazy like that's like, it's just like, seems like a thing of the past. What do you think?

[John]

I just, I just trust that the Internet immediately will figure out if you have.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[John]

But hundreds of millions of people trying to jailbreak it, they will pull it off course. But the other thing that will happen is people using different models that are like, already don't have the same guardrails and making it look like they're sore outputs even though they're insane.

[Jordy]

Oh, totally, totally, totally. Again, I'm just saying like open source model that's completely unrestricted. You do something crazy and then you throw the soil watermark on it just.

[John]

To take a shot at stick Bob and Sam.

[Jordy]

What do you think, Tyler?

[Tyler]

Yeah, I was going to agree with Jordy. Like, I think, hey, what's this?

[Jordy]

What's this?

[Tyler]

Oh, yeah, I've just been, you know, I got double jaw surgery.

[John]

Double jaw and a little bone smash. Yeah.

[Tyler]

Just trying to get my looks.

[Jordy]

You're looking fantastic. This is remarkable. I really, I really can't. Hats off to the production team. This is a, this is a fantastic new feature to. To allow Tyler to look like the absolute.

[Tyler]

How I do every day.

[Jordy]

Yes. How you do every day. Sheesh.

[Tyler]

I was gonna say, like, yeah, day one, there's gonna be people on X that like, easily jailbreak it. I can't.

[Jordy]

I can't take you seriously.

[John]

Just look at us.

[Tyler]

And then, and then they're just gonna post it and then it's gonna go super viral. And then you'll have parents.

[Jordy]

Chad podcast. Tell me your actual take.

[John]

Okay.

[Tyler]

Yeah, so. So I think like day one.

[Jordy]

Oh, he's back.

[John]

Oh, what?

[Tyler]

What? What happened? Day one.

[Jordy]

There we go. There we go. Okay.

[Tyler]

Day one, you have people who jailbreak it. Even if it's like one person, then it goes super viral next. And then it's like, oh, Mickey Mouse, like shooting a gun. And then it goes viral. Parents see it and they're like, okay, my kids aren't going to be on this because even if it's like mostly like, you're going to have a ton of backlash where it could be bad backlash, go super viral on CBS News or whatever.

[John]

Nah, I don't buy that. I think it will be very magical and I think that they'll immediately be getting shared in family group chats between friends. And I think we're maybe underestimate the adult Disney audience as well.

[Jordy]

They could go two ways. Adult Disney.

[John]

Okay, easy, Jon.

[Jordy]

Where do you think the line is? So you think that they would. Whenever this rolls out, maybe it's already out. It might be out soon, but let's just assume it rolls out. January, you go to Sora, you can generate, you know, Luke Skywalker fighting with Spider man because those are two Disney properties. Can you have Luke Skywalker cut Spider Man's arm off? Because Luke Skywalker does cut off people's arms in the PG13 rated Star Wars. I think Spider man does not ever get cut. He never gets his arm cut off because he's more of a PG character. And I'm just wondering like, where Is the line for the Disney execs, Like, where would they draw the line? How do they even think about a framework for holding, upholding the brand?

[John]

I think we'll know it when we see it. It'd be a funny scenario where they only allow violence on Warner Brothers characters.

[Jordy]

But they don't have the rights. But it's just like, oh, yeah, like, you can. Well, they do that in Hollywood. There's some. There's some actors who have it in their contracts that they never will lose a fist fight. Basically, they'll say, like, you know, you can cast me in this movie, but if we're. If I'm fighting up as somebody, I don't lose. We can tie, basically. So you know how you watch a lot of, like, Jason Statham and the Rock and, like, Fast and Furious, and they're, like, bashing each other through walls for, like, five minutes, like this crazy action scene, and then at the end, you're like, oh, like, neither of them won. It's like, that's because it's in the contract. They don't want to be. They don't want to be depicted as, like, losers.

[John]

They don't want to be Aura Farm.

[Jordy]

They don't want to be Aura Farm. Exactly. I got roasted by the anti AGI crowd for suggesting that IP holders might want their characters in Sora. They insisted that real entertainment companies would never willingly allow their characters to be used in AI Slop. Two months later. How the times have changed. I completely agree with this take. I think it is interesting how there is just the reality that if you hold ip, you need to exist in the world. You need to exist a lot. You can't just stay on the shelf. You can't be the Humphrey Bogart. And yesterday when Dylan from Puck was here, he was mentioning a bunch of old Hollywood references. And I was laughing to myself because I know you have not seen Casablanca and you have no idea what he means by get on the plane or Rosebud or any of these references.

[John]

Has Anyone else noticed VO3 has no IP constraints prompt Mickey Mouse welcoming you to Disney. Look at this, John. This was going on back June 16th.

[Jordy]

What's crazy is that this somehow looks this. This looked so good at the time. And I was like, oh, it's over. It's so over. And yet this. Now looking back, this looks washed out. It doesn't have. It's, like, overly saturated or something.

[John]

It looks like a green screen.

[Jordy]

Yeah, it doesn't actually look that good to me anymore. And it's because the goalposts have moved, as they always do. Do you want to hear. Do you want to hear my full movie? Okay, this is the full list. You can pick. And, Tyler, you can play along, too. First up, the Godfather. Have you seen it? No. Wow. Okay. Taxi Driver?

[John]

Never heard of it.

[Jordy]

Star Wars? You've seen Star Wars?

[John]

Seen at least a couple.

[Jordy]

Raging Bull?

[John]

No.

[Jordy]

Scarface?

[John]

Yes.

[Jordy]

You've actually seen Scarface? Yes. Full Metal Jacket.

[John]

But I didn't study it. I watched it, but I didn't take notes.

[Jordy]

Full Metal Jacket?

[John]

No.

[Jordy]

Die hard.

[John]

Maybe like, 10 years ago.

[Jordy]

You gotta see Die Hard. Goodfellas? No, you gotta watch Goodfellas. This is so good. Reservoir Dogs. Mmm. Maybe Pulp Fiction.

[John]

Seen it.

[Jordy]

Okay. Heat.

[John]

Heard of it? Haven't seen it.

[Jordy]

Casino?

[John]

Never heard of it.

[Jordy]

Braveheart?

[John]

Heard of it. Haven't seen it.

[Jordy]

You've never seen Braveheart? Wow. Okay. Hackers?

[John]

No.

[Jordy]

Apollo 13? No. Contact?

[John]

No.

[Jordy]

The fifth element?

[John]

No.

[Jordy]

Saving Private Ryan? No, you haven't seen Saving Private Ryan.

[John]

Wow. I have seen John Wick. Funny story. I was on a flight back from London, and it was, like, effectively 3am Whole plane's dark, and Keanu Reeves just walks by my seat.

[Jordy]

Wait, in the actual plane?

[John]

Yes.

[Jordy]

That's wild.

[John]

Just walks by and it was like.

[Jordy]

Wait, and you were watching John Wick on the show?

[John]

No, I wasn't.

[Jordy]

Okay.

[John]

Yeah, but he walks by and imagine seeing, like, Keanu. Like, you're just. You're on an overnight flight, it's dark in the plane, and he just, like, walks by. I think he was using the restroom, and I ended up watching it after that.

[Jordy]

Yeah.

[John]

To be. To be fully immersed. More importantly, Hero thousand presents says 5.2. How about 5.2 cold ones with the boys? It's a beautiful Thursday night, folks. This latest model is state of the art on beer bench, which is. If I crack it open, it makes a fizzy sound, and I go, hell, yeah. Very good. GPT 5.2. Also knows exactly which are the best Paul McCartney songs. And it can write a poem in Spanish as good as the median Pablo Neruda poem.

[Jordy]

Tyler Cowan loves the GPT models. He's obsessed.

[John]

The most obsessed. And yet I've never seen somebody make the claim that he was one shot.

[Jordy]

That's true. That's true.

[John]

Pretty.

[Jordy]

He's pretty. He's using responsibly. He's using responsibly. So it does feel like OpenAI is a little bit of the. The coming out of the trough of disillusionment potentially. You know, the vibes have been really bad with the 1.4 trillion. But the global economy has not collapsed and the market is rallying. And there were in fact not an Enron scenario. None of the big tech companies blew up. Like we've moved on. Now maybe it happens but in general it seems like expectations have sort of reset and now we're going into 2026. It's kind of a new game. OpenAI still has a really dominant consumer business and it what looks like it's shaping up to be an oligopoly in the enterprise side or the B2B side. Nothing is a five alarm fire. They're in the Code Red but it feels like they will emerge stronger from it. The big question is how will Sam Altman be perceived? Will he be one of the greatest founders of all time? Founder CEOs and I was trying to benchmark him. Let's say that, let's say that he, he, you know, lands the plane, gets out of the Code Red Baja, blasts his way into the public markets and he winds up, you know, being the founder CEO of a multitrillion dollar consumer tech company. He's in the MagSavant. It's, it's the Mag 8. How will he be remembered for most CEO founder CEOs if they get the company out into the public markets at a trillion dollars or something like that? They typically own a ton. Steve Jobs is notably at various times not a major shareholder. At one point he owned five and a half million shares out of almost a billion shares. So he had half a percent or 0.6% in 2011. Bill Gates on the other hand, absolutely an absolute dog. 13.7% ownership of Microsoft. Jeff Bezos is at 14% with Amazon. Jensen is at 3.7%. 3.77% of Nvidia. Elon Musk almost 20% at Tesla, 19.7% meta. Well, it's interesting to think at 13.5.

[John]

Given, given how much dilution OpenAI has had to take and all the shareholders.

[Jordy]

Starting as a nonprofit.

[John]

There's well that. But there's a world where if the company had just been formed as a C corp back in the day in 2015 and they had just raised a bunch of rounds, rounds back to back to back and there was a bunch of co founders initially. Would Sam actually have, it's rumored what he's going to get something like 7% was a proposal, sure. Would he have, would he have less than that in that scenario? I don't think, I don't think in the fullness this will end up working out that badly for Sam.

[Jordy]

The jump to reasoning models will be studied for years. They are still wildly underrated. ARC AGI1 has been out for six years. GPT 5.2 is a five order of magnitude scale up and yet it still lands at 12%. Add a bit of reasoning and performance immediately jumps and so you can see the Arc AGI1 leaderboard. GPT 5.2 is only at 12%. But when you get to low, medium, high, extra high over in the reasoning models or you switch to the pro models, you're getting up to 90% on ARC AGI. Of course the test that any human can do and yet AI has struggled with for a long time. Not for long. AI is starting to make headroom or make headway on the Arc AGI leaderboard. Grok 4 of course is also doing well. I'm excited to see what happens with Arc AGI V3. It feels like we're not even showing those scores yet because I think that none of the models are scoring at all yet. They're not even finishing and I think it's an optimization problem to get the least number of moves Oracle is a.

[John]

Train Wreck how did they not disclose these delays on the call two days ago? And Bloomberg is reporting that Oracle delays some data center projects for OpenAI to 2028. Oracle has pushed back the completion dates for some of the data centers it's developing for OpenAI to 2028 from 2027. Delays are largely due to labor and material shortages, said the people asking not to be identified. Oracle has been working to deliver over on a $300 billion contract to supply the computing power necessary to train and run OpenAI's models since it was inked this summer. Even with the delays, the timelines for the project in the US Remain ambitious for sites that are set to become some of the largest in the world. Oracle was basically saying like we're going to build AWB in two years and that just felt like, you know, applaud the sort of ambition. But I think some of these delays, labor shortages, etc. Are were predictable. Bloomberg says our take on on Oracle's massive bet on AI is Oracle's AI bet has fast become a bubble barometer, little bub talk. Oracle spokesperson said in a statement that the company remained confident in its ability to meet its obligations and future expansion plans. There have been no delays to any sites required to meet our contractual commitments and all milestones remain on track. Meanwhile, Apollo, according to Compound248, casually predicting zero returns for the S&P 500 over the coming decade. The historical relationship between the S&P 500 forward PE ratio and the subsequent 10 year annualized returns show that investors should expect to get zero return in the S&P 500 over the coming decade. They have a chart below. They're like, hey, can we interest you in some private credit opportunities where.

[Jordy]

Or you know, the other option. What's the other thing you want to invest in when the stock market isn't looking so good?

[John]

Puts land. I've talked about this. Land I think is the most criminally underrated asset. Nobody wants to make steady returns. Landmaxing. They want to. They want to hit the thousand x meme coin. They want to hit the. The 1% poly market, whatever it is.

[Jordy]

Timeline has been in turmoil over Klein. Some posts are getting deleted. So I don't even know if we're going to be able to pull these up. But here's what happened. Yeah. Break it down.

[John]

Somebody at Klein commented on a picture from a hackathon.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[John]

And said imagine the smell.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[John]

People thought he was making. They thought it was like a racist comment.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[John]

People started piling on.

[Jordy]

Yes.

[John]

The CEO initially defended him and said, I'm like, I know I can vouch for this guy, he's fine. People kept piling on. The CEO ended up turning around and said, actually we've let this guy go. And then now the CEO is getting even more hate from letting the guy go. And then now he's deleting the post. And so maybe the guy maybe ends up rehiring. Feels like damage is pretty done at this point. It'd be hard to imagine him saying like going back and saying like I'm actually going to rejoin the team that just.

[Jordy]

I have a brief screenshot saved a little bit. I think I can. I think I can read it, some of it. This is the CEO of clients says a few days ago a tweet from our head of AI offended a lot of people and it definitely offended a lot of people. There's an article in the Hindustan Times in India, like this is like newsworthy in India. Well, I don't believe his original tweet was attended intended to be offensive. His response, refusing to apologize does not reflect my position or Klein's. We recognize this caused real pain and that deserves blah, blah, blah. Lulu says this stinks. She's not a fan of it.

[John]

Yeah. She says re comms mistakes, everyone makes them. Sometimes things fall flat. It's happened to me and it also happens to people much smarter. But betraying people or principles is in a different category. It's more preventable and less excusable. Cowardice doesn't happen by accident. In the case of Smell Gate, it could be argued that Posh made the first kind of mistake, overlooking how the joke could be interpreted. But then the CEO inarguably made the second kind of mistake, and that one to me is much worse. Nat Eliason posted. Friend of the show I'm not sure if he's in the chat today. Said considering the unanimous reaction to the CEO's post saying that he will fight that they let go of the engineer. Nat says will he fire himself now? Only seems fair.

[Jordy]

Certainly the entire company is fired.

[John]

Fireception just everyone gets fired.

[Jordy]

No, the funny thing is that the only reason I know about this joke is from a bunch of Indian friends who seem to have been making it on anonymous accounts years ago in some sort of funny attempt to reclaim the formerly racist joke.

[John]

But Lulu says when you cave to the mob instead of standing by your employee and now people are more mad at you than before and she quotes, your worst sin is that you have destroyed and betrayed yourself for nothing. Trump, in an interview yesterday, said that he would consider eliminating taxes on gambling winning.

[Jordy]

So crazy.

[John]

Frank silence. Prediction markets be like, never mind. It is gambling.

[Jordy]

It is gambling because they always use trade. They always use like, it's not. It's not bad.

[John]

You trade on future trade, trade on.

[Jordy]

Sports, trading on this. This. This just feels like a whole series of of people. It's like Trump likes being edgy and funny, making jokes and he says, I'd consider it. And then Watcher Guru takes it and turns it into a viral thing and then somebody dunks on it and they get viral points and it all feels deeply unserious and not really like it's going to reshape the market anytime soon.

[John]

Yeah, I think a lot of people would hope that it'd be like, no, we're not going to create tax incentivized gambling in this country. But he didn't.

[Jordy]

Stranger things have happened.

[John]

Stranger things have happened.

[Jordy]

Scoop OpenAI CEO Sam Altman gathered news leaders for lunch in New York City on Monday. He told them enterprise AI will be a massive priority for OpenAI in 2026. And Greg Brockman says, yeah, enterprise AI is going to be a huge theme for 2026.

[John]

And this tracks with hiring Slack CEO as CRO, right?

[Jordy]

Totally. Yeah.

[John]

Yeah. The question is, what does this actually look like? I think a lot of people are using ChatGPT at work. They're using a variety of LLMs There.

[Jordy]

Was another going after Harvey. That's the big question. Harvey seems to be doing really well. And I think of law firms as enterprises, and I think of law firms as potential targets for an OpenAI Enterprise Plan. Am I crazy?

[John]

I don't think you're crazy. Last quarter, I rolled out Microsoft copilot to 4,000 employees. $30 per se, per month, 1.4 million annually. I call it digital transformation. The board loved that phrase. They approved it in 11 minutes. No one asked what it would actually do, including me. I told everyone it would 10x productivity. That's not a real number, but it sounds like one HR asked how we'd measure the 10x. I'd said we'd leverage analytics dashboards. They stopped asking three months later. I checked the usage reports. 47 people had opened it. 12 had used it more than once. One of them was me. I used it to summarize an email I could have read in 30 seconds. It took 45 seconds plus the time it took to fix the hallucinations. But I called it a pilot success. Success means a pilot didn't visibly fail. The CFO asked about our roi. I showed him a graph. The graph went up and to the right. It measured AI enablement. I made that metric up. He nodded approvingly. We're AI enabled now. I don't know what that means, but it's in our investor deck. A senior developer asked why we didn't use Cloud or ChatGPT. I said we needed enterprise grade security. He asked what that meant. I said compliance. He asked, which compliance? I said all of them. He looked skeptical. I scheduled him for a career development conversation. He stopped asking questions. Microsoft sent a case study team. They wanted us to feature. They wanted to feature us as a success story. I told them we saved 40,000 hours. I calculated that number by multiplying employees by a number I made up. They didn't verify it. They never do. Now we're on Microsoft's website. Global Enterprise achieves 40,000 hours of productivity gains with Copilot. The CEO shared it on LinkedIn. He got 3,000 likes. He's never used Copilot. None of the executives have. We have an exemption. Strategic focus requires minimal digital distraction. I wrote that policy. The licenses renew next month. I'm requesting an expansion. 5,000 more seats. We haven't used the first 4,000, but this time we'll drive. Adoption. Adoption means mandatory training. Training means a 45 minute webinar. No one watches. But completion must be tracked. Completion is a metric. Metrics go in dashboards. Dashboards go in. Board presentations. Board presentations get me promoted. I'll be SVP by Q3. I still don't know what Copilot does, but I know what it's for. It's for showing we're investing in AI. Investment means spending. Spending means commitment. Commitment means we're serious about the future. The future is whatever I say it is, as long as the graph goes up and to the right. Jacob Elordi says he has no tolerance for AI and finds the whole conversation around it so effing boring he would not like this show. He says, I would much rather kiss on the beach and read a novel and be sunburnt. Most pick me. Moment of It's a crazy live of the year.

[Jordy]

It's a crazy line.

[John]

91,000 people agree.

[Jordy]

Technical deep learning tutorial says yo Jacob, come on my live tomorrow. We're going to be review this paper. It's almost as good as the stuff you mentioned. See you tomorrow buddy. And it's a surprising effect of negative reinforcement and LLM reasoning sucks.

[John]

Says God blessed us again. Shocker. A thousand year American empire Major deposit of rare earth and critical minerals has been uncovered in Utah, which the Wall Street Journal calls the most significant critical mineral reserve in the us. We did it again.

[Jordy]

We did it again.

[John]

If you're a nation without, you know, a lot of critical minerals, it's probably a skill issue. You thought this week was Christmas week?

[Jordy]

We're just getting started.

[John]

We're just getting started. We hope you have an incredible weekend. Thank you for being with us this week. We'll see you soon.

[Jordy]

Goodbye.