#4651 Live, Lüft, Love

Summary

TBTL #4651 "Live, Lüft, Love" – January 28, 2026

Hosts: Luke Burbank & Andrew Walsh
Special Guest: Cassie Chattelane

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Episode Overview

In this laid-back and engaging episode, Luke and Andrew welcome their longtime friend and former TBTL contributor Cassie Chattelane. The trio breezes through an assortment of personal stories, house talk, and a deep dive into "Lüften," the German art of house ventilation, also known as house burping. Topics include small-town transitions, adulthood, the meaning of home, shoes-off versus shoes-on culture, and quirky rural Americana.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Quirky News Segment: The Dog-Like Cat (00:00–01:36)

• Opens with a quirky local news story about Clarence Armstrong and his unusual cat Tigre, who acts more like a dog, completes astoundingly patient waits outside restaurants, and boasts a wardrobe to make Elton John jealous.
• Fun banter and sound clips set a playful, offbeat tone.

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2. Awkward Podcasting Moments & Listener Associations (01:36–13:54)

• Andrew recounts the discomfort of explaining to a FedEx delivery person that he podcasts out of his garage studio, "Madrona Hill."
• Luke describes the pressure and mild embarrassment that comes with revealing the show's name and premise in real life.
• Fun detour into how listeners and longtime fans continually associate TBTL with specific pop culture elements like Juggalos (the fanbase for Insane Clown Posse).
  • Luke: “When the listeners of this show, the longtime listeners of this show see Juggalos in the news, they think of TBTL.” (12:33)

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3. Drugs, Delusion, and Shared Hallucinations (05:07–08:19)

• Andrew references a BBC article about mushrooms in China that reportedly cause users to see dozens of tiny human beings—remarkably, the same hallucination for all who consume them.
  • Andrew: “…the mushroom making people hallucinate dozens of tiny humans. And I think this is the first time anybody's found something...that creates the same hallucination for everybody.” (06:05)
• The hosts riff about social contagion and drug reportage, with playful skepticism and self-disclosure of mild psychedelic experiences.

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4. Havana Syndrome and Sonic Warfare News Update (08:26–11:05)

• Luke and Andrew briefly pivot to recent headlines: new developments in the mysterious Havana Syndrome cases affecting U.S. diplomats via a radio wave device.
  • Luke (reading): “The device acquired produces pulse radio waves...which some officials and academics have speculated for years could be the cause of the incident.” (10:23)

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5. Juggalo Chronicles & Nostalgic Reflections (11:05–15:57)

• Classic TBTL tangent on Juggalos, including nostalgia for their earlier coverage and drops from listeners.
  • "We just set the show back by about 15 years…" (15:57)
• Conversation about evolving personal identities—referencing an interview with Chuck Klosterman—and how podcasters’ content and personas shift over time.

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6. The Case for a Shoes-Off Household (16:08–18:52)

• Luke explains his gradual adoption of a shoes-off policy at home and in his garage studio, contrasting practical cleanliness with social custom.
  • Luke: "This shoes-off lifestyle is really working." (18:12)
• Andrew shares continued discomfort with being "a grown man in socks at a house party," preferring shoes-on socializing while respecting host preferences.

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7. The Psychology of Cleanliness & Home Rituals (18:52–23:36)

• Deep discussion on the satisfaction of freshly cleaned floors, the anxiety of sullying them, and strategies for maintenance.
  • Luke: "My obsession becomes, do not, under any circumstances, mess this floor up, Perbs." (21:26)
• Both hosts talk about housecleaning help and idiosyncratic routines for minimizing tracked-in dirt.

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8. Vacuum Geekery & Product Endorsement (23:36–27:34)

• Extended, humorous dive into the world of cordless vacuum shopping, the frustrations of cheaper models (TEMCO) and enthusiastic endorsement of the Ryobi cordless stick vacuum.
  • Luke: "...it is no joke. I would say it's better than any of the Dyson products..." (27:11)

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9. Donor Thank Yous & Small-Town Identities (27:45–46:12)

• The hosts break for their daily—irreverently grateful—donor roll, bantering about Washington geography, mispronounced town names, and nostalgic vacations in Loon Lake.
• Cassie shares fond and humorous memories of small-town life (Garfield, Washington) and growing up during Garfield (the cartoon) mania.
  • Cassie: “My hometown...has a tavern, because the tavern don't quit. And we have a butcher.” (63:27)

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10. Cassie Chattelane’s Big Move: Bay Area to Eastern Washington (41:04–49:01)

• Cassie discusses her "lesson in hubris and arrogance": after years vowing never to return, she finds herself happily back in rural eastern Washington.
  • Cassie: "I can make an enormous life decision in like a 10-minute span." (42:30)
• Recounts burnout in the Bay Area, a spontaneous, decisive move, deepening ties to family, and a sense of agency in shaping her new hometown’s culture.

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11. House Projects, Hosting Anxieties & “The Loon Lake Principle” (49:01–53:33)

• Cassie and Luke commiserate about the pressure to host guests perfectly, contrasting it with their fondest memories of childhood cabins with imperfect accommodations—a concept Luke dubs “The Loon Lake Principle.”
  • Luke: “What was the most fun I ever had in my life? Loon Lake...despite your sunburn, probably the most fun you ever had was sleeping on that chair. Shitty couch.” (51:55)
• They reflect on how genuine warmth and informality make gatherings memorable.

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12. Lüften (House Burping) and German Airing Habits (54:31–58:47)

• Luke introduces the recent Washington Post article on "lüften," the German practice of thrice-daily aggressive ventilating—opening windows regardless of the weather to prevent stale air and mold.
  • Luke: “It’s called lüften, and it means airing out or ventilation...it is written in stone for these German families.” (56:28)
• Andrew shares his version: “Almost every morning I come into my little basement studio and I do open up my window a little bit and I let Bingo sniff the air. I think it’s important for Bingo.” (57:08)
• Discussion of Querluften—strategically opening windows at opposite ends for maximum airflow.

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13. Finding Joy in Rural, Slower Living (58:47–72:31)

• Cassie describes the unintentional lüften she does several times a day thanks to dog routine, and whimsical games with her pets.
  • Cassie: “Whenever I let the dogs out, now I just...I pretend that they're going on a little mission to buy themselves hamburgers.” (60:10)
• Talks rural homeownership, shifting life pace, and the joys and quirks of Colfax, WA—including the thrift store “Thrifty Grannies” and singular local establishments like Fonks ("the strangest place...but we loved Fonks").
• Andrew and Cassie bond over their respective small-town upbringings, with Cassie emphasizing the autonomy and opportunity to influence her small community now as an adult.
  • Cassie: “You're the adult now. Like, you can set the tone of the community. You can correct some of that.” (45:18)

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14. Home Improvement Talk & Thrifting in a Small Town (72:31–78:34)

• Conversation about the difference between home improvement enthusiasts (Cassie, Luke) and those who are overwhelmed by it (Andrew).
• Cassie extols the virtues of Colfax thrifting—specifically the beloved "Thrifty Grannies," where prices are low and the profits aid the local community.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On rural transition:
  Cassie (41:58): “Decades I was like, I would rather, you know, jump off the Bay Bridge than ever move back to east... And then I got really burned out by the hustle and bustle of it all.”
• On house burping/lüften:
  Luke (56:28): “It’s called lüften, and it means airing out or ventilation...Three times a day, all the windows in the apartment needed to be opened...Rules were the rules.” Andrew (57:08): “Almost every morning I come into my little basement studio and I do open up my window a little bit and I let Bingo sniff the air. I think it’s important for Bingo.”
• On shoes-off policies:
  Luke (18:12): “This shoes-off lifestyle is really working.” Andrew (18:52): “I don’t like socializing in my socks. That’s basically it.”
• Luke on the anxiety of preserving a freshly cleaned house:
  (21:26): “My obsession becomes, do not, under any circumstances, mess this floor up, Perbs.”
• Cassie on setting community tone:
  (45:18): “You're the adult now. Like, you can set the tone of the community. You can correct some of that. You can get in and like you have full autonomy.”
• Luke on "The Loon Lake Principle":
  (51:55): “What was the most fun I ever had in my life? Loon Lake...that’s what is like makes these kind of moments with friends and family and stuff like important is the friends and family...”
• Andrew on self-knowledge:
  (68:07): “I think I'm just different, you know...I'm just built different. I don’t have whatever that energy is. I want somebody else to create [spaces] for me.”
• On thrifting:
  Cassie (76:07): "My new hometown, Colfax, has the best thrift store on earth, called Thrifty Granny or no, Thrifty Grandmothers...It's the sweetest thing. Thrifty Grannies."

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• 00:00–01:36: Cold open/news magazine about Tigre the dog-like cat
• 01:36–13:54: Podcasting out of the Madrona Hill studio & Juggalos brand association
• 05:07–08:19: Hallucinogenic mushrooms and shared hallucinations
• 08:26–11:05: Havana Syndrome news update
• 11:05–15:57: Juggalos nostalgia & pop culture references
• 16:08–18:52: Shoes-on vs. shoes-off at home
• 18:52–23:36: The psychology and logistics of house cleanliness
• 23:36–27:34: Vacuum cleaner product talk (Ryobi endorsement)
• 27:45–46:12: Donor thanks, life in small towns, and Loon Lake memories
• 41:04–49:01: Cassie’s Bay Area to Eastern Washington odyssey
• 49:01–53:33: Hosting anxiety and “The Loon Lake Principle”
• 54:31–58:47: Lüften/House burping, German-style and TBTL hosts’ approaches
• 58:47–72:31: Rural routines, new paces of life, and quirky small-town living
• 72:31–78:34: Home improvement differences & thrifting culture in Colfax
• 74:03: Show title selection debate—settling on “Live, Lüft, Love”

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Tone, Atmosphere, & Takeaway

The episode encapsulates the core TBTL experience: warm, meandering conversations about the oddities of adult life, nostalgia, and finding personal meaning in the little things. The hosts and guest keep it friendly, loose, and self-deprecating, inviting listeners into their inner circles as they riff on everything from house maintenance to memories of childhood lakeside cabins. The German house-burping segment and Cassie's candid recollections stand out as especially relatable and memorable.

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For listeners new and old, "Live, Lüft, Love" is a quintessential TBTL episode: personal, humorous, and packed with both practical and existential life advice—served with a side of vacuum reviews and thrift store tips.

Transcript

[Scott Rensberger]

Clarence Armstrong has a unique cat.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, he's pretty unusual.

[Luke Burbank]

Let's go. Hey, come on.

[Scott Rensberger]

His name's Tegree, and he's more like a dog than a cat.

[Andrew Walsh]

I think he's more intelligent than a dog.

[Luke Burbank]

He likes this.

[Scott Rensberger]

Every day when the weather's nice, Clarence and Tegry go for a walk. And they usually end up at a fast food restaurant in Renton.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Would you like that with cheese?

[Scott Rensberger]

Today, Clarence goes inside and gets a cup of coffee, and Tegree waits for him outside.

[Andrew Walsh]

He'll just sit right there.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Sits, darling.

[Luke Burbank]

In the summertime, sometimes when it's too hot, I don't bring him over.

[Scott Rensberger]

Tegree will wait for Clarence for hours. Customers are amazed.

[Andrew Walsh]

When I first walked up the ramp, I thought it was a statue. He's the best.

[Luke Burbank]

We've known him for about, what, three years?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, he's a little sweetheart.

[Scott Rensberger]

Clarence says he takes Tigre everywhere. To the grocery store, bowling alley and library. Clarence and Tegree are best friends.

[Luke Burbank]

Tegree, you ready to go? Hey, you ready to go home? And this is his Christmas sweater.

[Scott Rensberger]

Elton John would be impressed with Tigre's sunglass collection. And when it comes to hats, Tigre has a different hat for every occasion.

[Luke Burbank]

Here's his Christmas scarf that goes with it. When he wants to swing in it, he'll push it and get it started.

[Scott Rensberger]

And just when you think you've seen it all, Clarence pulls out Tigre's favorite snack food.

[Luke Burbank]

Now this is my cat's Grey Poupon.

[Scott Rensberger]

Now you've seen everything. Scott Rensberger, Cairo News Channel 7.

[Andrew Walsh]

TBTL. Hi.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Podcast.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, no.

[Luke Burbank]

I consider myself to be an absolutely dead center, normal, average American. You negligently ruined her iPhone. You have to pay for that. Simple as that. Isn't that rocket science? What is rocket science?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Rocket science is when the scientists find out things about space.

[Luke Burbank]

As far as I'm concerned, they're the worst looking things I've ever seen. I mean, they are pathetic looking.

[Scott Rensberger]

They're homely.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I don't know what exactly the attachment is. I think they're cute, but kind of funny looking.

[Luke Burbank]

This is what happens when you hire.

[Andrew Walsh]

Two guys with a podcast.

[Luke Burbank]

Let's get to the jokes.

[Andrew Walsh]

All right.

[Luke Burbank]

Hello, good morning, and welcome, everyone, to a Wednesday edition of tbtl, the show that just might be too beautiful to live.

[Andrew Walsh]

It's a kind of magic.

[Luke Burbank]

My name. My name is Luke Burbank. I am your host. I just want you to be normal. And clearly you're not. Coming to you from the Madrona Hill studio, perched high above the mighty Columbia.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Well, well, well. Look who's back.

[Luke Burbank]

I was getting a delivery last week, and the FedEx guy looked over at the. I. I have the name Madrona Hill Studio. Not studio, but Madrona Hill on the outside of this little converted garage. For reasons that I don't fully understand, I think I wanted to feel like I was going somewhere, like, designated to work. And it's actually odd to me how many people that pull up here to drop things off and deliver things are not curious about that. But this guy was. He said, what's Madrona Hill? And then I had to explain that I do a podcast in here five days a week. And then he asked me the dreaded question, which is, what's it called? So Anyway, shout out, FedEx guy, if you're listening. That's what's going on inside that building. That says. He also told me that he was really into madrona trees and he read online that you can make tea out of their berries. So he and his kid picked a bunch of madrona berries and made tea. And it was awful. It was undrinkable. So that's a story about Madrona Tree berry tea right here on episode 4651 in a collector's series. Let the fun begin. We're gonna talk about house burping today and why it is that I chose to play that drop. You're a gross person. It's actually something that my friend Andrew Walsh referenced, I don't know, a week or two ago without even knowing that he was very on trend. Speaking of my friend Andrew Walsh, he's the longest running cobra of the show, maybe best known for his depictions of the tall ships. He sometimes will, in a pinch, he'll hold the door around him, which we really appreciate. And he is joining me right now. Good morning, my friend.

[Andrew Walsh]

Good morning, Luke. I thought when you were telling that story about the Madrone berries, I call it Madrone.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, I see.

[Andrew Walsh]

Which I did.

[Luke Burbank]

Also. I mentioned that to the FedEx. I go, another thing is it also can be called madrone.

[Andrew Walsh]

I thought maybe. I didn't think this. I was half expecting or maybe kind of hoping, Although that would be child endangerment. I was kind of wondering if you were going to say they started tripping from drinking this tea.

[Luke Burbank]

It does sound ayahuascan.

[Andrew Walsh]

It sounded like I was like, oh, where is this going?

[Luke Burbank]

And to be honest with you, looking at this particular FedEx guy, I believe he had sort of longer hair, may have been in a ponytail. He had some pretty powerful My name is Otto and I love to get blotto vibes.

[Andrew Walsh]

It smells like Otto Jacket. Did you happen to see. I think I forwarded it to you. Did you see this piece? Maybe we can get deeper into it later if you feel like it's worth it. But something about there's some mushrooms somewhere in China, I think that people have been taking. I think for a long time in the small village or something. But the weird thing about them is they're not just causing hallucinations, they're causing the same hallucinations to everybody.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. You sent me that story a while ago and I saw the headline. I didn't actually delve into it. So that's the deal, is that they're. It's not just that they're hallucinating, but the hallucination is the same.

[Andrew Walsh]

And the hallucination is you see dozens of tiny little human beings. And I almost didn't send it to you. I saw this in, like, my social media stream somewhere, and I was like, oh, this could be like, total Zergnet. But it's from the BBC. Yeah, the big black comedy show that I.

[Luke Burbank]

In Las Vegas. That's what I was assuming.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah. No, this is from the British Broadcasting Corporation. The headline is they saw them on their dishes when eating. That's a quote. The mushroom making people hallucinate dozens of tiny humans. And I think this is the first time anybody's found something. I don't know if you want to classify it as a drug or something edible that creates.

[Luke Burbank]

I consider it medicine.

[Andrew Walsh]

The same hallucination for everybody. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't want to be. I do not want to be. No, but here. Because that's your job. But I wonder. It sounds. The thing that would be hard to pin down is, you know, when you hear about something where the same thing happens to a bunch of people, sometimes it can be described as a sort of mass hysteria or mass delusion or like, you know, a bunch of teenagers in a particular town start fainting or something. It's kind of. What's that called? Social contagion or something. And so my mind immediately wonders if there's a social contagion aspect. And then it's also the fact that the people reporting this are on the drugs. Although I will tell you, I am not against a little psilocybin ingestion. I actually find mushrooms to be a quite pleasant experience. I've never had, like a. I've never had a hallucination. I don't think I'm. When I. When I've had mushrooms. I'm not having enough of them. And I'm okay with that. I don't want to see little men like that. Actually, it doesn't sound relaxing to me. That sounds unsettling. Like, I like the amount of psilocybin that just kind of like, makes everything a little more chill.

[Andrew Walsh]

Well, I will say that. So this is a really long article. It's pretty in depth. And it mentioned. I don't know, I guess you were joking when you said the. The reporters are on the drugs. I don't think that's necessarily.

[Luke Burbank]

No, not the reporters. The people talking to them.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, right.

[Luke Burbank]

But people are saying they're having the same delusion or. Excuse me, hallucination. Were hallucinating, which to me lowers their believability, I guess, is what I'm saying.

[Andrew Walsh]

But the interesting thing about it is it was known in this one, it says small village in China. But then they found it in other parts of the world where the same thing was happening to people who were not in conversation with those small things. And this has been being studied since the 90s. So I don't know. I do sort of trust this. It says in academic literature published in 1991. So it seems like it's pretty in depth. And I will say that I don't know that I made it through the whole thing, but I'm scrolling here, and it goes on and on and on.

[Luke Burbank]

That sounds more legit.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, I think this is a little.

[Luke Burbank]

Bit more legit than maybe my initial instincts.

[Andrew Walsh]

Whatever happened with the. Where did we land on the Cuba thing with the hearing, Remember? Like some.

[Luke Burbank]

This. Oh, yeah. Well, they found the device.

[Andrew Walsh]

They think they did find the device, yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

You mean the kind of like the sonic warfare that was being perpetrated against people in, like, the embassy?

[Andrew Walsh]

I swear that story first broke when you and I were working together at Cairo. Could that story go back further than 10 years at this point?

[Luke Burbank]

Cuba Syndrome I just saw, or whatever they call that. Right, Yeah, I think Havana Syndrome.

[Andrew Walsh]

Havana Syndrome, right. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Pentagon reportedly testing radio wave device linked to Havana system. This is from Scientific American, which is the only comedy show I go to. This reported machine may be linked to Havana Syndrome, a debated condition characterized by a strange panoply of symptoms that were experienced by US Officials stationed in Cuba. Boy, if there was ever a Scientific American sub headline, you just heard it.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, right.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Andrew Walsh]

I thought that was the last graph.

[Luke Burbank]

Nope, that's where they're starting. So it looks like they have. They've located a device that they think might Be what was making people have that experience of Havana Syndrome.

[Andrew Walsh]

This is bananas that you and I, or I guess we accidentally stumbled onto this today. Like, this is newish news that we're talking about. This was just like last week. This was.

[Luke Burbank]

I could have reported on it when I was in Miami. I was very close to Cuba. That's right. This is a headline from cnn, which is even more interesting. Pentagon bought device through undercover operation some investigators suspect is linked to Havana Syndrome. So again, just based on the headlines, it sounds like they were. They bought this. The Defense Department has spent more than a year testing a device purchased in an undercover operation that some investigators think could be the cause of a series of mysterious ailments. Diplomats, troops, a division of the Department of Homeland Security purchased the device for millions of dollars in the waning days of the Biden administration. I knew nothing useful could have been happening under the current administration. You know what I mean? Like, they're not smart enough to do an undercover buy of the thing that was doing Havana Syndrome. The waning days of the Biden administration. Using funding provided by the Defense Department, the device is still being studied and there is ongoing debate and in some quarters of a government skepticism over its link to the dozens of anomalous health incidents the device acquired. Produces pulse radio waves, one of the sources said, which some officials and academics have speculated for years could be the cause of the incident. So there you go. They may or may not have figured out what was making that happen.

[Andrew Walsh]

I don't know if I like how close we got to actually reporting news here. Luke, Luke, this is. This is topical. I mean, usually I'm more comfortable, like, Reviewing Star Trek 4 the Way Home or whatever it's called. That's more like what we like to do, or Juggalos.

[Luke Burbank]

Or Juggalos, as we discussed last week on the program. That's your go to. I think you've. I think what you really demonstrated, Andrew, for all of us, was your antipathy towards the topic of Juggalos. Well, I said that. Oh, I'm not trying to call you out. I'm mostly just joking. But I think you're actually right. Like, the Juggalos really, they served their purpose on this show, and they served with distinction and honor and faygo all over their heads. But. But, like, that was a period of time. And what's funny about that is. And I think was that kind of. That was sort of before your time.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes, that's what I was going to say. So it's not even like, by the time I was on the show, you were already a little fatigued by Juggalo content. You know, it was probably a small but hardy part of TBTL in the early days.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, yeah, but what it really was was it became like other things on this show have become extremely strongly associated with the brand. So for years, and probably even to this day, we'll get Juggalo content from people. And again, I. There's, you know, absolutely no harm in that. But it's when people. When the listeners of this show, the longtime listeners of this show see Juggalos in the news, they think of tbtl.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes. And you specifically. I'm looking. I'm a little distracted. I did. I do have some Juggalo related.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yeah. Most people think I'm on drugs because I'm always happy.

[Andrew Walsh]

Are you on drugs?

[Luke Burbank]

No, I'm not.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I'm high on life.

[Andrew Walsh]

A listener sent me that a long time ago. That's a Juggalo who's high on life.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. I didn't know that was a Juggalo.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah. What is this one? See, I'm worried about some of these because they're. Some of them are kind of like from Juggalo promotions, where they, like, yell at you in a deep voice.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Andrew Walsh]

Like that's.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah. Where it's like coming this weekend or whatever. Not this weekend, but Cave in Rock, Illinois. We used to play those a lot about.

[Cassie Chattelane]

This is a. It's a puzzle, and each of every one of us is an interval piece that puts a big pitch and once we're all together, puts a big picture, lets us to see the big picture.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's actually me just trying to get through a Monday on TBTL is what that was.

[Luke Burbank]

This was something. Do I dare play something called juggalo barbecue? That's 12 seconds long?

[Andrew Walsh]

Sure. Do it to it.

[Luke Burbank]

I have a feeling this is going to be a. I was listening to Chuck Klosterman on the Pablo Torre Finds out podcast, and, man, I'm too. Oh, man. How great was that interview?

[Andrew Walsh]

That was pretty good. I mean, it was a little bit backgroundy for me, but I thought it was interesting that. Not to get into formatics, but it was like Pablo was just kind of like, all right, go. Like, I don't even remember a setup for it. It just sort of seemed like, just let him talk. And he was just sort of rat tat tatting for a really long time.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, well, I mean, I'm a Klosterman head, so I like. I thought it was actually interesting that Pablo started off by saying, like, I'M a fan of yours. Although my college, that was considered in poor taste.

[Andrew Walsh]

I don't actually know how I heard that. Or.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, yeah, that's how he literally started. Like, it was like one minute into the interview. I was like, all right, we know you went to Harvard, Pablo, but simmer down. But the thing Chuck Klosterman was saying was that his old people will come up to him and they'll. They'll reference a book that he wrote when he was, like, in his late 20s, and he says, you know, I'm really not that person anymore, and I haven't reread that book ever. And they actually know more about that version of me than I do because they just maybe finished that book that I wrote when I was much younger, and that's not who I am anymore. And I. That really hit me because it made me think about the eras of TBTL and the kind of things that we used to say and jokes we would make or even tape that we would play and how, you know, that's really kind of not who we are anymore, you know, and how do you make sense of that or how do you think about that? Like, things that you said and did that you sort of don't currently stand by. So with that all being said, I'm going to play something called juggalo barbecue that's 12 seconds long that I'm almost sure I don't stand by. I don't know what it is, but I'm pretty sure I'm going to regret it anyway. Here we go.

[Andrew Walsh]

Every year this party becomes more outrageous as the thousands of free cheeseburgers, hot.

[Luke Burbank]

Dogs, and ice cold fago rain from the stage. All right, that was not bad.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's the stuff. I have a bunch of that too, I think, from the same promo. What is this adventure so awesome that.

[Cassie Chattelane]

The memory will live on with you forever.

[Andrew Walsh]

Um, anyway, what about.

[Luke Burbank]

Do you think Juggalo Michael Jackson Trial? That seems.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, interesting.

[Luke Burbank]

That seems fraught. 16. I have something called Juggalo Michael Jackson Trial.

[Andrew Walsh]

This year, the lucky Juggalos in attendance.

[Luke Burbank]

Will be jamming out to the awesome.

[Andrew Walsh]

Sounds of the greatest Michael Jackson tribute band in history.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, tribute band. See, I couldn't see Tri. That Tri was actually not enough. I. It was. It was the opposite of tmi. It was not enough information. I was totally, totally wrong about that.

[Andrew Walsh]

But anyway, we just set the show back by about 15 years, and now we're just saying how we are shedding this.

[Luke Burbank]

Send in all your Juggalo content folks.

[Andrew Walsh]

Send in the Clowns, as it were.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, actually, that's a, that's a. That's pretty good. Hey, I've been, I mentioned this like a lot kind of a long time ago on the show, like I think before you went to Vegas. And it was funny because you had a sort of an audible kind of response to it and then you brought it up in passing. I can't remember if it was on the show or off the air, but I had mentioned that I'm kind of becoming a shoes off situation here at the Madrone Hill studio and even in my house a little bit. And I didn't see it coming. For me, basically the deal is, as you know, to come out here to this converted garage. I come leave my little house and come out here. So of course I'm going to have to have shoes on. But it also means that I'm then tracking a lot of dirt and debris into here and I'm the area that I'm broadcasting from. There's an, there's an area rug that is like my chair is on and everything's on. It's supposed to kind of absorb some of the sound. But I wisely bought something that has a lot of kind of white in it, which I don't know why I keep doing that. And so I find myself needing to vacuum this rug a lot.

[Cassie Chattelane]

But.

[Luke Burbank]

Because I come on in and I walk over and I sit down, I start talking to you and I'm always tracking dirt onto this rug. And then one day I realized, you know, I've got two different pairs of clog lake shoes. I've got some Birkenstocks and I've got some other ones that I bought from the Internet. It's called CVs, I think basically look like Birkenstocks. And I realized that what I can do is as I'm leaving my house, I slip into these slip ons, I come out here, I walk in here, and then right before I get to the corner, corner of the carpet, I step out of the slip ons and I walk over here and I start doing the show with you. So yes, I don't have shoes on right now. I do have socks, but it has totally solved this vacuuming problem. And then what I notice is when I go back into my house, then I just take the slip ons off again. And then I'm in my house in my socks and I'm not tracking dirt in there. And I'm absolutely loving it. Now the caveat is I'm not making anyone else do this at my house. That's not the rule of my home. But what I'm finding is for me personally, Andrew, this shoes off lifestyle is really working.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah. And I don't, you know, I just want to reiterate here. This comes up a lot because I say that I am not comfortable. Go. I don't like socializing in my socks. That's basically it. Like if I'm going to a party as I did this last summer, and I was quite uncomfortable and it was, you know, a decent sized house party at my friend's very beautiful house and shoreline and it was a shoes off party. I knew it was going to be and get there and it's just like you see this huge pile of shoes at the front door and everybody's taking their shoes off. And then the whole time I just feel like a child. I feel like I don't. It's just not how I wouldn't want to take off my shoes walking into a bar and I don't want to take off my shoes walking into a party. That's how I feel.

[Luke Burbank]

I've seen you imagine the shoes off bar.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, I'm sure they have them. Are you kidding?

[Luke Burbank]

How long before. How long before Portland or the Lower east side I was a shoes off bar. I'm sure.

[Andrew Walsh]

I almost guarantee they have them. But that's not me saying to other people, you can't have shoes off parties. I'm just saying. But I'm at an age where I also have enough autonomy and kind of enough give a shitness just to say, yeah, I kind of don't care if this. I would say a lack of. Lack of. Give a shittedness about like, yeah, yes. You know, take me as I am. But I'm telling you, I'm probably not interested in like coming to your party if it means I'm hanging out in my socks all night. But I would never tell people that they can't have that rule for their house. I'm just saying that that's. It's not for me.

[Luke Burbank]

Right. And I'm not. This isn't a criticism of you, but what this is for me, I think is the, the camel's nose under the tent. Because it starts with, I'm like a hard no on shoes off things. Although I'm not quite as. I don't have the same boundaries you have. So if I went to someone's house and it was shoes off, I would take my shoes off. I would just. I would just feel insecure the whole time.

[Andrew Walsh]

Well, I mean, I do I mean, that is what happens to me.

[Luke Burbank]

What has happened.

[Andrew Walsh]

I've just tried to now kind of avoid it a little.

[Luke Burbank]

If, you know that's what's going to be happening.

[Andrew Walsh]

I don't know if I want to go to that New Year's Eve thing, if it's going to be at the house where I know they don't wear shoes.

[Luke Burbank]

But, like, what for me, I feel like is the evolution of this is it starts with I'm a no shoes off guy, or I don't like it. And then in my own life, I start to realize, wow, there really is kind of something to this. Like, because what happens is my level of anxiety about how dirty the rugs are getting. It's sort of like that level of anxiety drops. So it's an overall. It's a real net positive for me because as I'm sitting here talking to you, no part of my brain is being occupied with, with, with when was the last time I vacuumed this rug that I'm on? And the other same thing's happening in my main home environment, which is I have started to, on occasion, like, probably maybe once a month or once every other month, I will hire someone to come over and do some sort of housekeeping stuff for me. And while my house is, generally speaking, very tidy, what she and her cleaning partner do is they. They really clean the floors and the sink and the oven, and they, like, steam the floor, which I didn't actually know was. Maybe that's something you talk about on Spotless. But, like, when I come home, the perf. For me, the perfect version of this is if this can happen while I'm on, like, a work trip. And then when I come home, the house is, like, so clean.

[Andrew Walsh]

It's.

[Luke Burbank]

The floor is clean, Andrew, to a level that, you know, there's nothing you. You could think your house is clean. And then the afternoon sunlight comes in a window and you're just like.

[Andrew Walsh]

Especially as the seasons change.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm living in an absolute pigsty right now. They get the floor so clean that, like, it can even stand up to the harsh scrutiny of the sunlight. The afternoon, the low winter afternoon sunlight coming in. And then my obsession becomes, do not, under any circumstances, mess this floor up, Perbs. The game is how long can I preserve this level of cleanliness in this house because it's so nice right now? I don't want to use anything. I don't. I don't want to walk on the floors. I don't want to besmirch anything that's been smirched. You know, what's the act of. Is it smirch? If I be smirch it, then was it smirched?

[Andrew Walsh]

So when I come in from the outside, like, I. Especially during these winter months, like, I also actually. It's weird because I'm actually. I do this more than Genevieve does. In fact, I actually. If I'm coming in from outside and I've been out and about during the Seattle winter, I always kick off my shoes when I get home because I don't want to track shit all over my house either. But I have a couple of pairs of sort of indoor shoes that are like. We've had this conversation before. Sperry Topsiders. It was funny because you didn't know what Sperry Topsiders were. You were picturing them incorrectly. They're just like little sneakers that you slip on and they have rubber bottoms. They were mentioned in this book that I was reading recently as something were wearing way back in the 1960s. So I didn't realize that they're kind of a classic shoe, but I had.

[Luke Burbank]

Them in high school.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, they're just like slip on shoes. No laces, rubber bottoms, canvas top, Very, very basic design. And I have a couple of those. And like one of them is like kind of quasi inside, outside. So in other words, I have one pair that is almost only inside and then another pair that I'll wear inside. But then if I'm going to take the garbage out, I'll wear those outside, take the garbage out, then kick them off at the door and put the other ones on. I kind of rotate them. So I'm not totally blind to, you know, I'm not all over the place all the time. Also, I had a question for you. I assume that you have a wireless vacuum out in your studio. You're not bringing a vac, you're a cordless and.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, I do, but it sucks. Remember how we descended into vacuum talk? Good point that. You know what?

[Andrew Walsh]

I'll allow it.

[Luke Burbank]

No, that was good. That was some far side humor and I'm here for it. Remember that when the show descended into vacuum talk for like a long time. Oh yeah, because I was buying those. Temco. I basically like, Becca had recommended this like cheap, like very like maybe $100 version of a cordless vacuum, as opposed to the really fancy Dyson one which I had purchased in the past, but which seemed to always break on me. And they were very expensive. They're like four or five hundred dollars. And I thought, well, I can Buy two of these TEMCO ones. I can have one in the house and one out here. Well, you know, you do. I think you kind of get what you pay for these, these, these temcos, what they do. The problem. So I do have one out here, but it's not very effective. Have you ever had a cordless vacuum or even a regular vacuum that it won't hold what it has sucked up? This is hard to explain, but basically, while I'm activating it, so while I'm pressing the button, it is sort of vacuuming stuff up. But it's got that long kind of tube. Right. And the second that I take, I turn it off. It releases a bunch of stuff that it had up in the tube. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I have a whole. I have developed this really ridiculous system.

[Andrew Walsh]

Where it's like diaper for it.

[Luke Burbank]

Totally. It's like I'm vacuuming a vacuum, a vacuuming, and then I'm holding it and then I'm walking outside with it still activated because as soon as I tell it to stop sucking, it's going to just release, like, most of what it. So. And the. So that's the. That's what's going on with that vacuum cleaner. I have one out here, but it's not particularly effective. Now, I did break down and buy another cordless vacuum from Ryobi and Andrew.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Cannot recommend this thing highly enough. First of all, it's not as expensive as that animal. I think it was maybe 150 bucks or something. But it uses. I have all these different Ryobi products that are all on the same battery system. So, like, I have a Ryobi drill that uses the same kind of battery. The vacuum cleaner, which is gorgeous.

[Andrew Walsh]

They're using the same battery.

[Luke Burbank]

They all use the same Ryobi battery.

[Andrew Walsh]

How many batteries do you have?

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, you would be pleasantly appalled. You'd be pleasantly appalled. I might have, like eight of these batteries.

[Andrew Walsh]

I've got to do it. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

At all times. I've got a whole, like a whole charging station down in the basement of these Ryobi batteries. Because my. I have a Shop vac. A Ryobi Shop Vac that uses this battery system. So it's very. It's very elegant that way. Very convenient. But that thing.

[Andrew Walsh]

Love this.

[Luke Burbank]

It's. That thing is like. It's got so much suction to it that it will like. It's. It's sort of like a dog that's overly aggressive. And you try to take it to the Dog park. And it's just like going after every other dog. If this Ryobi thing hits on a piece of like area rug, it's just like it's pulling up all of the area. I'm like, okay, all right, buddy. I'm like, he's nice. He just, he's nervous. He. That's his reaction to being nervous. I was a little scared right now.

[Andrew Walsh]

Saying, I'm going to bring a rescue. I was going to bring my Dyson over to have like kind of a vacuum. Vacuum party.

[Luke Burbank]

A playobi does not do particularly well around Dysons.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, yeah, he was.

[Luke Burbank]

His previous owners used to torture him with a Dyson vacuum by running it near him. And he's still a little shell shocked from that.

[Andrew Walsh]

Does it have a headlight? I'm looking at some of these. Some of them have headlights. I'm not trying to make you jealous if they don't. If yours does.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't know if my Ryobi cordless vac. I'll tell you the kind that I have stick vacuums.

[Andrew Walsh]

Let's see, they offer powerful cordless.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, I've got the Ryobi one.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

I think it's got a. I think it's got a. That's this thing, by the way, you can buy it@home depot.com. not an advertiser on the show, but we would accept it. Yeah, I've got this Ryobi stick vac and man, Andrew, it is no joke. It is like. It is. I, I would say it's better than any of the Dyson products of peace and love. I know we have a listener who works for Dyson, but like, this thing is friggin phenomenal. Would recommend.

[Andrew Walsh]

Nice. Nice. I love that.

[Luke Burbank]

Thank you, baby. All right. Hey, let's thank a couple of donors here. These folks are supporting TBTL financially and it's. Well, it's how this thing can happen five days a week, 52 weeks a year. I had a moment, Andrew, the other day. I don't know why, but I just. I had. I don't know, you probably had this too, where I just. I had this moment of realizing that we're probably going to be doing this for the rest of our life, or at least for a long time, and that we have to do five of them a week. I'm not complaining. We're very lucky to have this job. I'm very grateful, but like every once in a while I'll just go, like, what if I don't have anything to talk about in Eight months on a particular Wednesday. You know what I mean? Like we've just been doing it for so long, it seems to work out, but I just all of a sudden it hit me like, what if I just lose the ability to form words or I just. Nothing interesting happens to me or like I do something about the fact that we're going to do this as long as there is financial support for it. Almost like it struck me out of the blue and I had a moment.

[Andrew Walsh]

Do you worry that I am unemployable at this point and so you feel an obligation to me to keep this going because otherwise what in the world would I do?

[Luke Burbank]

Well, I mean, I think they're. No, I don't. I think you're highly employable. I think you're more employable than I am because I have absolutely no ability to take any sort of constructive or non constructive feedback from bosses anymore. I really think what would happen is if, if I couldn't do the show anymore for whatever reason, if I was incapacitated in some way. I think you, I would hope you would keep doing the show and I would think you'd either pull maybe Veevs in or John in or even maybe friend of the program, Cassie Chattelane, who happens to be standing by in of all places, Pullman, Washington. Hi, Cassie.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Ahoy hoy, guys.

[Andrew Walsh]

Hi.

[Luke Burbank]

So nice to see your shining face.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, good to see you guys always.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, good to see you. Thanks for joining us today.

[Luke Burbank]

We're going to be talking to Cassie in a moment here about the big move from the Bay Area to eastern Washington. I've been following this on Instagram and it had been too long since we had talked to Cassie. In the meantime though, let's thank some of those donors, some of the people making it so that we have to do this for the rest of our life. That doesn't sound properly grateful. Does it have to?

[Andrew Walsh]

We don't have to.

[Luke Burbank]

These are the people making it so we get to do this for the rest of our life. Andrew, we're talking about Charlie Hanichek who's in Des Moines, Washington.

[Andrew Walsh]

Nice. Thank you, Charlie.

[Luke Burbank]

Appreciate growing up. Did you grow up on the east you grew up in. Why do I think of Garfield, Washington and you, Cassie, is that, that's where you hail from, right?

[Cassie Chattelane]

That's where I hail from. The large metropolitan area of Garfield, 500 people population.

[Luke Burbank]

Now, did you grow up calling it Des Moines or did that, did the name of that city ever even make its way over to Garfield, Washington?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Never made its name over it wasn't until I moved to Seattle that people had to kind of correct me on.

[Luke Burbank]

That pronunciation because you want to call it Des Moines, like they do in Iowa, but. But Washington says, no, live free or die. We're gonna mispronounce it. And that's where Charlie is. Thanks, Charlie. Thanks to Laura Peterson, who's in Seattle, Washington. Had you heard of Seattle, Washington?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Like, within a fifteenth of a second of me graduating high school, I was like, bye. Going to Seattle.

[Luke Burbank]

You walked off the stage into a taxi, a waiting taxi cab, which drove you directly to Seattle.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yes.

[Andrew Walsh]

Which hits that. Exactly what I want to talk to you about later on in the show, because you have. You have. It sounds like gone from country mouse to city mouse to country mouse again, which is very interesting. I love me. Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

You know who else loves it? Andrew Henderson, who's in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada.

[Andrew Walsh]

Nice. Our neighbors to the north. I just came up with that. But it.

[Luke Burbank]

That's a good idea. Formerly known as our friends to the north.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes, my friends.

[Luke Burbank]

Not the current state of things. I really. I had a thought the other day. This sounds like I'm making a joke, but I kind of wasn't. I was like, could Canada and Europe get together and take over this country, please? Like, I was like, I'd be okay with that. I'll. I'll. You know what? Come on over and I'll take. I'll take Canadian troops in the streets. That's.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

You know what I mean? Like. Like, I, you know, I wouldn't love that either, but I would. I would like it more than the current situation. Like, have we. Have we ever had a moment in America where it'd be like, there's a. There's only about five countries that I would think would be worse if they took us over at this point. That leaves a lot of countries that I'm open to the idea with, and.

[Andrew Walsh]

We'Re in a good geographical position to allow them in. You know what I mean?

[Luke Burbank]

Exactly.

[Andrew Walsh]

Come right through Mexico.

[Luke Burbank]

Come on up. Canada, Come on down, you know. So, Andrew, if you want to get on that, I'm just telling you, we are. We're very, very open to the idea. Scott Decay is in Clayton, Washington. Now, that's a place I don't think I've heard of. Clayton, Washington. Is that anywhere near Garfield? Cassie?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Never heard of it. But you know what?

[Luke Burbank]

He.

[Cassie Chattelane]

He's never heard of Garfield either, most likely. So I was going to apologize, but.

[Luke Burbank]

I don't have a Heathcliff, Washington guy.

[Andrew Walsh]

Those orange cats.

[Luke Burbank]

Is. Is Garfield named for The President.

[Cassie Chattelane]

It's named for the President. But I love that joke. Luke. I've never heard. I've truly.

[Luke Burbank]

Really.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I never heard that. Really.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm proud of myself because I feel like you would have heard every Garfield related, you know, joke. Every. Particularly the cartoon. Garfield growing up when I liked was.

[Cassie Chattelane]

A friend of mine. This is like 20 years ago. He goes, I'm in Garfield, like lasagna, you know.

[Luke Burbank]

Also you're growing up there, Cassie, in the like height of the. Jim Henson Garfield. Not Jim Henson, Jim Davis Garfield. Like Powers. Like I was obsessed with that comic so much in that era. And you're living in a city with the name.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I know. And of course now I, I'm a dork and I have like Garfield T shirts and stuff like that. Oh, I've totally leaned into it.

[Luke Burbank]

Love it all. Sean Heer is in St. James, New York. St. James, New York, another New place to be. I don't know if I've heard of St. James. It sounds like a place. When I picture St. James, New York, I picture like explorers, like French explorers in a painting and they're in a canoe and they're pointing towards something. That's what I think of when I think they're pointing towards a place that they're going to go ruin is kind of what I think of.

[Andrew Walsh]

I know that TBTL is a show that only looks forward and never looks back and never kind of what we said about 2026. That's going to be the new thing. But I do want to go back very briefly to come.

[Luke Burbank]

Clayton.

[Andrew Walsh]

Do you guys know where Loon Lake is?

[Luke Burbank]

Is that. Do I know where Loon Lake is, Andrew?

[Andrew Walsh]

Well, I guess. Good question.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm gonna, I'm. This is Loon Lake is where I learned how to make the loon call with my hand. Take a listen.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh gosh.

[Andrew Walsh]

He's still got it. He still got it.

[Luke Burbank]

Lake, my friends, that is.

[Andrew Walsh]

Sorry. So I was just gonna say Clayton is right below Loon Lake, way over in the eastern part of the state, right above Spokane.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, that is, that is that is it. I believe it's near Deer Park, I think.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

When we were kids and I've told this story a million times, we had these friends from the church, this woman named Marianne Coyne and her kids Gabe and Cassie and her family had a cabin on Loon Lake. And it was like classic, nothing fancy. It was, you know, just like this teeny tiny little, you know, at that time, hundred year old cabin that had like a screened in porch where I Would sleep.

[Andrew Walsh]

I can smell, like.

[Luke Burbank]

I can smell just a million old, like, abridged books and Readers Digest large print, just like, just tons and tons of, like, fun books to read on a summer. And they had a old ski boat that was not powerful enough to get my dad out of the water and like a little dock and stuff. And what was so incredible was like, they, you know, they had a big family and Cassie, or, excuse me, Marianne, was like one member of I don't know how many siblings. So imagine this place is like a third hers or a fourth hers. And the whole everyone, her brothers and everyone's coming out to the family cabin and she's like, could I bring like nine Burbanks? And incredibly, the people said, yes. These were. These were the. I think we did it two or three times. These were the most fun summers of my entire life. And then I tried to recreate them by renting a cabin years later as an adult on Loon Lake and then a different lake in Idaho, all to try to recreate that childhood feeling of being on Loon Lake.

[Andrew Walsh]

And did it work?

[Luke Burbank]

No. You can't go home again.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I know. It's so hard to redo. Can I quickly tell you about my. I had a friend who had a cabin in northern Idaho and loved it. Again, some of the best summers of my childhood, but also the worst sunburn of my life. The furniture in the cabin. This may be the same I feel at every cabin. They don't furnish it with brand new furniture.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, no.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Weird old furniture from the 70s that, like, nobody wants anymore. So it had this scratchy, like, Brillo pad couch from the 70s that I was sleeping on with the worst sunburn of my life.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, that sounds horrible. Yeah. We were not. We do not come from the sunscreen generation. No, we do not come from the. We did not know what SBF was referring to in our child. At least we didn't. Did you in Ohio, Andrew, was anyone telling you to put. When you went to Florida in the minivan with the. With the tv and it was someone telling you to put on sunscreen?

[Andrew Walsh]

I feel like we talked about it probably not with the same intentionality and purpose that we would in 2026. But speaking of sunburn, the thing that I think of first in my life now is that is nature reminding me that I'm a bald now, because that was just never a thing. And as a kid, I had a big mop of hair and I always had really thick hair until I started losing it. And of course, I look at myself in the mirror. And I can see this huge forehead I have. And I know that I'm bald there, but I forget that the top of my. You, the back of my head, the little male pattern baldness thing on the crown. And I'll go out even just here in Seattle, you know, notoriously sunny Seattle on a summer day, and work in the yard all day and then come in and take a shower. And you get underneath that hot water and that hot water is hitting your dome right away. And you're like, brother, you gotta SPF.

[Luke Burbank]

The head these days, Andrew, you're not bald. You are, as I saw on a T shirt in the 80s, a solar powered sex machine. That's how you get your power is through your head.

[Andrew Walsh]

Wow, that is amazing. And I am going to get that T shirt.

[Luke Burbank]

That's just the kind of comedy that Lisa Pettic of Renton, Washington is paying good money for.

[Andrew Walsh]

Apologies, Lisa, but thank you, Lisa.

[Luke Burbank]

Thank you. And thanks to all of our donors. We really do appreciate you. I am very grateful. I mean this. To have this as a job. I hope it didn't sound like I don't want to be doing this earlier.

[Andrew Walsh]

I'm so grateful to have hair. It's like, well, you should be.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, no, I don't know how much the topic stops. I don't know how much my hair. I've actually, you know what, Andrew? I've wondered about that on a couple of levels. One is because what happens is you put a little this powder in your hair and it kind of sticks to your hairs through static cling. It's like keratin fibers. And so it creates a little more density. But I don't know if that is an effective sunblock or not. Like, I don't know if I should be doing. And then the other thing is, I wonder if I jump in a swimming pool and I've got it in my hair. Is there like a black. Is there some little, like, dissipation of this stuff that like, follows me? One time I stayed over at Camaro, Kev and Anita's, and Kevin, like, the next time I saw him, he goes, Anita was wondering what that. What was on the walls of the shower after you took a shower. Then I was like, oh, right. Because this was right when I had started putting it in. And what I didn't realize now I'm very up to speed on this is if you have it in your hair, it stays in your hair for days and days. And then when you shower and you do the shampoo, if Some of the shampoo goes on the wall of the shower. It will have the little pieces in it. So now I'm very careful. I hose down all the walls of the shower after. After every shower. If I still have that stuff in.

[Andrew Walsh]

Two things. First of all, I think adding SPF to this hair product would be a great idea. I don't know if that's physically possible or scientifically.

[Luke Burbank]

Here's my million dollar idea.

[Andrew Walsh]

Secondly, I'm now picturing you just taking the saddest shower. When you said that your hair product ended up on the shower walls, I was picturing you, like, I don't know if you've ever seen, like, ig. It's a very sad scene where somebody's just like. They're just like, leaning up against. They're just like, leaning up against the shower. Yes, exactly. Yeah. And so I was just picturing you just taking the most depressed shower. For some reason, you're leaning your head against the wall and just weeping in there.

[Luke Burbank]

No, it's less. I mean, as long as I don't look down, I generally. Most of my showers have been tears free for many years. But no, it's just something I have to be mindful of. Where I really try to be careful is at a hotel. Because I don't want the poor housekeeping person to have to extra scrub out the shower and also to be like, what happened in here?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, right, Right.

[Luke Burbank]

It's definitely on my radar. Hey, Cassie, congratulations on making your big move. Which I didn't really know. I consider us friends, but more I consider myself an online observer of your life through Instagram. And, like, I would always see you kind of having adventures in the Bay Area. And then one day I saw that you were in Eastern Washington with your family, but then you were there for a long time.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I was like, huh, Longer.

[Luke Burbank]

Longer than a vacation. And I was like, wait, did Cassie actually move over there? And you did? What's the story?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I did. It's. It's funny because first of all, we are real friends, but then it's fun to follow each other on Instagram too, and get, like, the CliffsNotes of people's lives. So I totally get that. Oh, it's. It's funny. Okay, so this is a lesson in hubris and arrogance. That is one of my specialties, really.

[Luke Burbank]

Years.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Decades. I was like, I would rather, you know, jump off the Bay Bridge than ever move back to east.

[Luke Burbank]

Which you can't anymore, right? Because they've got those nets.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Actually, that's the.

[Luke Burbank]

That's the Golden Gate.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Exactly. Which good? Good. Safety. Safety.

[Luke Burbank]

Zero. People in the last half of last year took their lives on the Golden Gate Bridge because of those nets.

[Cassie Chattelane]

That truly is good. Although it doesn't stop me from using that and saying, my friend and I joke, and we're like, it was a big bridge. Bridge jump day today.

[Luke Burbank]

You know, that's shorthand for today. Didn't go great.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Exactly, exactly. But I was so arrogant. I was like, I'm never gonna. I'm just so done with that. Isn't that. And then I got really burned out by the hustle and bustle of it all. In the city. In the city. And, um, I. I'm somebody who. Maybe it's adhd. I don't know what it is, but I can make an enormous life decision in like a 10 minute span. You know, I try and weigh out the. The scenarios, but I had just kind of.

[Luke Burbank]

Once your brain starts to. I'm the same way, Cassie. Like, once your brain starts to consider it as a possibility, it could be 10 minutes before now you're locked in.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Absolutely. I had a really bummer week, or I had like a super bummer day at work in the Bay Area. And I was like, you know what, what am I doing here? What am I doing here? I'm done within an hour of like, that day ending and me being at home. I had gone on Amazon and got like a bunch of moving boxes and bags and, like, things to wrap my belongings. Stuff. I was like, yeah, I'm out of here. You know, I was like calling my, you know, like the. The like 401k office. And I was like, how does that work if I leave?

[Luke Burbank]

Like, how do I port this over to my other job or whatever? Right?

[Andrew Walsh]

Like, how do I liquefy this?

[Cassie Chattelane]

How do I. Yeah, really?

[Luke Burbank]

That's a call I've made, actually, a couple times.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, yeah. But I was just like, yeah, I'm gonna kind of blow this up. You know, how does that work?

[Luke Burbank]

Now? Now, why did you decide to go back to the part of Washington state, roughly speaking, that you grew up in, as opposed to somewhere where you didn't know anyone but where, like, say, the cost of living was lower and the pace of life was a little slower. Why'd you decide to go back to where you from?

[Cassie Chattelane]

A few reasons. One, I. I came to visit this last summer and I had such a good, wholesome time hanging out with my little nephews who are like 10 years old, 12.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm heavily invested in the one that's a basketball player. Now.

[Cassie Chattelane]

So cute. I'm actually going.

[Luke Burbank]

I'd like you to FaceTime from those games, please watch them. There's nothing I want more than to be invested in a 9 year old or whatever 11 year old's basketball life.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Talk about reliving your youth. Hello. You were a baller. I know this. And this weekend we're actually going to his get this basketball jamboree. Oh my God. So there was that and then. But I had a reluctance originally because I was like, people there can be such like jerks, you know, I grew up with people think, oh, small town, everybody's probably so warm. And I'm like, actually they can be like hyper judgmental, you know, and they can be really close minded, you know? Sure, that. But then you guys are. Okay, you guys are hopefully gonna like this. I had a moment where I was like, guess what, man, Cassie, you're the adult now. Like, you can set the tone of the community. You can correct some of that. You can get in and like you have full autonomy.

[Luke Burbank]

Right.

[Cassie Chattelane]

To bring it back to another grim subject. Some of those people who were like that are probably long dead. Since I was a kid.

[Luke Burbank]

And this doesn't have to be the town or the area that was the town or the area that you grew up in. It could, it could, it could change and evolve and you could be part of that. Maybe.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Absolutely. Absolutely. I'm like, let's. Yeah, let's. Let's try that.

[Luke Burbank]

How psyched was your mom?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, God.

[Luke Burbank]

Because your mom is really the breakout star of your, of your Instagram account.

[Cassie Chattelane]

She is, she is one of the weirder people on earth.

[Luke Burbank]

She and Susie, I feel, would really vibe like she has my mom and your mom, they like, they kind of look similar. Their energy seems really similar.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Very similar. Luke, like when you show me some of the like snacks that like your mom will bring over and stuff or. Oh my God. The one where this was on your Instagram. Your mom in one of her like antique nightgowns.

[Luke Burbank]

No, that's not a nightgown. That was a dress she was wearing. Love that blue thing. I.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yes, yes.

[Luke Burbank]

That was an outside dress that she picked up somewhere.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Okay. Love it, love it. I feel like that is like my mom 100% as well. Like our moms could be sisters and it is wonderful. I love a good like heart of gold, but weirdo, like. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Walsh]

Cassie, I have one question for you before we get deeper into the story is are you moving back to literally the same community you grew up in nearby or. Or what? Are we talking here?

[Cassie Chattelane]

So I was living with my. At my parents house for like a month and I was like, I'm really going to dig into living in Garfield, you know. Then I was hashtag losing it.

[Luke Burbank]

So you dug down too deep and then water started filling the hole. And then you said.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I was like, I gotta get out of here. So now I'm at an Airbnb like close by until I close on my house in Colfax, which is like 20 minutes away.

[Andrew Walsh]

Nice. Congrats.

[Luke Burbank]

That is so awesome. I've now fully stocked on. I fully stocked your house. I Google. I walked around the neighborhood. I checked out the little. That little courthouse is so stinking cute. I mean, I hope you never end up in there like in trouble. But like, I was like. I was like, yeah, no. Congratulations, Cass, on your new house. That looks so. I mean, new old house. It's a cool like total classic. When was it built?

[Cassie Chattelane]

1917.

[Luke Burbank]

Nice. Wow. Amazing, you guys.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I'm like dreaming in colors of paint and tile and like, you know, I want to be honored the history. But you know how it is. You guys know how it is. When you get into a project, it. It is all consuming. I'll wake up in the middle of the night and I'm like, oh, wait, let me remember to look at these linen curtains that you know, that just. I'm obsessed.

[Luke Burbank]

It's like you're. That place looks so unbelievably cool. And what a fun project too. Like, there's like, just seems like the kind I can imagine you putting your. Putting your touch on it. And you were saying to us in text message that like, that's one of the things also that you're able to do in moving to where you moved versus living in the Bay Area. I was like, I was like looking. It's not the Bay, but I was looking at like this. I always read that New York Times column that's like they had $900,000 and we're looking for a place in fill in the blank. And the other day it was like, this was like more Southern Cal, but it was like they had $900,000 to spend in Rancho Cucamonga. And again, peace and love to our friends in Rancho Cucamonga. But like, I went through the whole thing of these three different homes they looked at and I was just. And they weren't all in Rancho. They were in just different areas near there. And it was absolutely brutal what $900,000 would get you. It's like it was, you know, so I mean, that's an issue in California, obviously. But, like, it sounds like this is something also that you're able to do from relocating.

[Cassie Chattelane]

And I never, in my wild streams, thought that I love home stuff. I love this kind of.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, because your apartment in, like, Oakland was. I would just see pictures of. In the backgr. You had those amazing windows and stuff. Like, I sense that you're a person for whom your home environment's, like, a really big deal to you. Kind of like I am.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Exactly. Luke, I've related so hard to you when you're talking about how, you know, when you have guests over and you get kind of obsessive over, like, the. Just the exact optics of how it's going to look.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Cassie Chattelane]

People. I'm just like that, like, I was, like, screaming at TBTL when you guys were talking about what kind of cup you should have in your bathroom for your, like, toothbrush rinse.

[Luke Burbank]

What do you go with?

[Cassie Chattelane]

See, I was feeling like, a cool ceramic, like a thick ceramic that's not totally breakable.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes. That's what I have now, by the way, in the upstairs. I could go get it. I think you would like it. It's kind of earth tones. It's a little bit of like. It's almost like it's somewhere between fiesta wear and an earth tone, kind of gray, kind of beige. Ish. But it's thick, but it's ceramic, so.

[Cassie Chattelane]

But then you guys had a really good idea. I think Andrew had a good suggestion about like. Like kind of a nice, thicker plastic, so it's not breakable. I don't know what you.

[Andrew Walsh]

Let me ask you this, both of you guys, about i9, how do you feel? Or do you have a little cloth coaster or anything? Or how do you feel about setting the ceramic down on the sink? Does that give you an okay feeling that you take the. You take your pill or your sip of water, then you're setting ceramic down on a sink. How does that feel?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I know. I know exactly, exactly what you're saying. And there is kind of a yucky, grindy feel on that.

[Andrew Walsh]

Or a clink. I'm just asking.

[Luke Burbank]

In my little upstairs bathroom, you put it actually on a little shelf that me and my dad built. That goes next. Because it's such a small bathroom. It's a wooden shelf, such a small bathroom that the sink doesn't even have enough surface area. Really?

[Andrew Walsh]

Okay, that's good.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, that was our fix.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Contrasting textures. I love, like, wood with ceramic. That kind of thing. Oh, you guys.

[Luke Burbank]

But here's the thing. Cas you, when you were talking about your Idaho cabin experience, it was reminding me of what I'm calling for my own purposes, the Loon Lake principle. And this goes to like the idea of when you're having people over because yeah, I fall into this real trap of like thinking it's only going to be fun for people if I can create some sort of like total 5 star experience where like for instance, that bathroom I'm talking about, it's now that next to that little tumbler or whatever you call it is another cup thing that has like a bunch of single use toothbrushes that are individually wrapped. Because I feel like when people come over and if they're staying over, they, and they forget their toothbrush, they'll feel good if there's a replacement toothbrush for them, blah, blah, blah. And like when I have my family over, I'm like, everything has to be so perfect. And then I remember what was the most fun I ever had in my life. Loon Lake, despite your sunburn, probably the most fun you ever had was sleeping on that chair. Shitty couch. I mean that's what is like makes these kind of moments with friends and family and stuff like important is the friends and family and, and like, you know what I mean? Like, I have this weird obsession with wanting it to be so impressive to people that, that is building the experience. But that's not what anyone. That Loon Lake cabin was so unimpressive. So like if I've got people crashed out on the couch in my house or if there's not enough, if there's a line for the bathroom or whatever, that's okay. Like the, like for instance, I had my whole family over to, for a Christmas thing and then we were watching the football game and I realized I do not have like enough seating for like 13 people in really my house anywhere. And so we were like getting folding chairs out and people are finding like it's like it was a, it was a totally improvised event, but it was so fun and that was okay. Like, so I'm trying to lean into that and remember that to kind of lower my anxiety because I'm imagining you're going to start having some get together is once your place is all dialed in.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yes, absolutely. And I've, I've done that at other homes where I'm like, oh, I'm gonna have people over this and that. And I'm running around literally sweating, not enjoying, I'm trying to enjoy the moment, but I'm really not entirely because I'm Trying exactly. To do that five star experience. And Luke, it reminds me of some of the best times. Similar to your Loon Lake principle. Best times on earth have been around one of those, like, plastic lawn tables with the kind of, you know, those plasticky chairs that like the leg always one of the legs break.

[Luke Burbank]

In fact, there was a trend for a while of like, if your friends were sitting in one of those, you would just walk up and kick out a leg and it would just shatter.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Right?

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, yeah.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Because the sun had made the plastic so brittle.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Cassie Chattelane]

And somebody was always gonna hit the skids at some point. Probably loaded. But those are. Have been the best times ever.

[Luke Burbank]

Absolutely. Like, yeah, the fun. I just watched this Errol Morris documentary called Vernon Florida, which is totally insane. It's from 1981. Errol Morris was like. His plan was to go to this town because Vernon, Florida had an unusually high number of insurance claims from people who had lost a limb. So he wanted to figure out what was going on. But when he got down there, no one wanted to talk to him about losing limbs. So they just. He just started interviewing everyone in this town. And it is a real backwater and the people there are real, real, let's just say rural.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yeah, yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

And like. And it'll just be like a guy who. It just has. I mean, not even a chair like that, Cassie, but like something equivalent. And it's just in his yard and he just goes. And he just sits in his yard and he's got a possum in a cage and he just goes and he stares at the possum. And that could be a whole afternoon. And this guy seemed to be much happier than I am.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

This guy that's staring at his possum.

[Cassie Chattelane]

He'S got the Loon Lake Loon Lake principle dialed in.

[Luke Burbank]

Dude, he is living la vida Loon Lake now. What about house burping, though? Are you gonna do your proper house burping, Cassie? And do you even know what I'm talking about?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I have zero idea. But tell me, tell me.

[Luke Burbank]

This is great. This is. On the subject of the home environment, this is something, Andrew, that you referred to, I don't know, a couple weeks ago, about how when it's really cold and you've got everything all kind of like super, you know, windows closed and doors closed at the home because it's too cold outside. But then, like, there's not enough ventilation. There's not enough natural air moving through. And I said something about. Yeah, like the Germans really like to do that. Like at Night, like open a window and the room is cold, but they're under a feather thing. Well, I didn't realize the Washington Post was putting out an entire article about this from a guy named Aaron Weiner, who's actually their Berlin correspondent. House burping is a cold reality in Germany. Americans are warming to it. And I didn't realize this. It's not just like at night when the Germans like to open the window and let a little fresh air in. They have this whole practice of throughout the day. This is this guy Aaron writing. After moving to Berlin from Honolulu, Wyatt Gordon was surprised when his new German roommate marched into his bedroom at 8am and threw open the windows. It turns out that his cohabitant, Laura, maintained a strict ventilation regime. Three times a day, at precise times, all the windows in the apartment needed to be opened. It didn't matter whether it was the dead of winter or a weekend morning or if Gordon had company. Rules were the rules. Quote, I had men and women in my bed that I'd brought home from the club or wherever, said Gordon, now 35, a city planner originally from Richmond. As is common on Berlin weekends, they would crawl into bed around dawn, only to be woken up an hour later by a blast of ice cold air. How do you explain to the person lying in bed next to you that this is what the German culture demands of us? It's called luften, and it means airing out or ventilation. And it is apparently like, according to this article, it is written in stone for these German families. They don't even have to teach their kids because the kids have been raised.

[Andrew Walsh]

With it, loves it. I don't do this with such intentionality as they do, and I've never heard that term before, but I do sort of do this. Like, winters don't get as cold here, obviously, in Seattle as they do in other places. And so I want to be, you know, I want to recognize that. I was talking to my stepmom the other day, who is like, by the way, wonderful woman, but you wouldn't describe her as a hardy soul at all. She's not a hardy person, but she lives in the Cleveland area. And she's like, well, I don't know. I've just been cold lately. I mean, it's 19. I know 19 degrees is not something to be complaining about. And I'm just kind of like, it's like 36 here right now, and I'm shivering and I'm wondering, will I survive getting into the door of my house? And people in Ohio are Like, Well, I know 19 isn't really cold, but all of that is to say here, where I do think that it gets very cold, especially at night. And in the mornings. Almost every morning I come into my little basement studio and I do open up my window a little bit and I let Bingo sniff the air. I think it's important for Bingo the cat to be able to sniff the cold air. And if there's like the other day, Genevieve, I was taking a little nap, a late afternoon nap, and I woke up and Genevieve was going out to some sort of dinner party thing, and she was bringing fried tofu. And I don't know if you're familiar with other people's food smells, but like, there's something very different about you're making a meal and you've made the house smell like the food to like waking up to the smell of somebody else's fried tofu. As soon as Genevieve left the house, I house burped. I opened up every window opened. I loofed it, actually, I opened.

[Luke Burbank]

No, you know what you did, Andrew? You actually. Let me see, let me get the exact terminology. There's a few different ways to do this. There's a specific word for when you open different. Oh, it's called querluften, which is cross ventilating. You open windows on opposite ends of a home so as to move the air.

[Andrew Walsh]

I did that. I turned down the ceiling fan and I opened up like our front door and I dropped the storm window down. And then I went to our bedroom, which is like on the opposite, and I opened up that and I tried to create as much ventilation as possible. It's cold for a little bit, but then you close it back up, you heat the house back up. And I think it's worth it.

[Luke Burbank]

Cassie, it's very cold there in the eastern part of Washington state where you are. Would you consider any amount of lufton any amount of house burping in your new place?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I'm loving, loving that the. I'm loving this. And so I do a multi times a day unintentional lufton as well. Because you guys know I have two dogs.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes.

[Cassie Chattelane]

And so sometimes they'll tuffy. The smallest one who's like maybe three pounds, will be a complete diva about going out. She'll like tease and want out, but then she'll not quite go out. So like I'll. I'll keep the door open for like a minute and a half straight and be like, leave. But it's funny because I love having dogs. Because you can just make up. I. This is my. My recent thing that I do when I let the dogs out.

[Luke Burbank]

You can make.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Nonsense.

[Luke Burbank]

You're the one that did it.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Wait, what?

[Luke Burbank]

Somebody. We've been wondering for years who let the dogs out? And it's finally getting some clarity.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Speaking of that song, here's. My mom likes to sing that song, but she does it so poorly. She does it like this. Who let the dogs out?

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, my God. She is one. We need to run like a 23andMe on your mom and my mom. I know they might have been. They might be related. They may have been separated.

[Andrew Walsh]

I know.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I'm like, mom, you're doing such a poor job, but it's adorable. So I'm into it. But. So whenever I let the dogs out, now I just. Sorry.

[Luke Burbank]

Now I've ruined it. I'm sorry.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh my God. I. I'm. I'm like, don't forget your hamburger money. I like, I pretend that they're going on a little mission to buy themselves hamburgers. And so. So I'll let the. I'll. I'll do the Lufton. Yes, I'll let them out. It takes them a little while to decide if they want in or out, this and that. But the house is getting nice and aired out. And then I'm like, don't forget your hamburger money.

[Luke Burbank]

Bye. My problem is that my house, I still haven't figured out how to actually heat and cool it properly. Because what I should have done probably when I. When I did all this crazy renovations, I should have just sucked it up and put in like a straight up normal heating system. Like we all kind of maybe grew up with where you turn the thermostat and air comes through the floor or something. I was sold this bill of goods about these mini split technologies. And so, so sometimes I'm like, if I can't looft, I can't lift right now. Because if I do, it'll take me three hours to get the house back to like a comfortable temperature. Like, it could be an all day project. Cassie, in your new place, do you have, like, are you gonna have a fenced area or whatever? Like, you can just let them go out in the yard and not have to. To be stressed about their whereabouts.

[Cassie Chattelane]

God, that's another thing that I love Oakland, but I don't miss about Oakland is I'd have my head on a swivel whenever I took the dogs out. And now whenever I took the dogs out. But now I can just like, yeah, there's A little fence. I'm going to put in another, like, larger fenced area and just open the door and enjoy your hamburgers, guys.

[Andrew Walsh]

So I have a bunch of questions for you because you and I both grew up. Grew up in very different parts of the country, but very small towns. Right. Mind Valley City, Ohio, which comes up on the show from time to time. And as you were alluding to earlier, by the time you had some autonomy, you were like, your. Your bag was packed, you had a trunk, and you waited for a taxi to pick you up, and you threw it in the back and. And you raced to the city and.

[Luke Burbank]

You, Mary Tyler, moored your hat off the second you got to Capitol Hill. Seattle.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's right.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I had one of those little sticks with a handkerchief on the back.

[Andrew Walsh]

Right, right. And so anyway, I was similar. It took me longer to get to a city because I lived in New Hampshire for a long time. I'm glad I did. And it was near Boston, but I was living in New Hampshire, and all I wanted to do was live in Boston. Finally, in my 30s, moved out to Seattle and have not lived in a rural place since and simply cannot imagine going back. I mean, I fantasize about it sometimes when Genevieve and I are driving through some country area with long, winding roads, but I fantasize that I'm rich and I could buy a second house or something out there. It would be really hard. Like, I want to ask this question gently, not to get in your head, but do you have anxieties about not being able to go to the a.m. p.m. To grab a soda in the middle of the night or any of these weird scenarios I come up with?

[Luke Burbank]

Well, you have not Google street stocked Cassie's place, because she's right there in the heart of Colfax.

[Andrew Walsh]

Are you. Is there a place you can go get your soda in the middle of the night? As if you'd want to.

[Cassie Chattelane]

There is a grocery store, and I. I have to look up the. The. The hours. But I will say my hometown, Garfield. You guys know, here's what we have. We have a tavern, because the tavern don't quit. And we have a butcher. So those are the two businesses in my hometown.

[Luke Burbank]

Wow.

[Cassie Chattelane]

So you can't even get, you know, a. Whatever. A Coke in the middle of the night or whatever. But Colfax, my new place. Yeah, I think. I think it's going to be a little more.

[Luke Burbank]

A little more jumping off, popping off.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I know, I know.

[Luke Burbank]

I actually am probably. I may be more. I may be more sort of like remote from those services maybe, than Cassie is here at the Madrona Hill studio. I've got this, like. I mean, it's walking distance in the sense that, like, anything is walking distance. I mean, you know, Los Angeles is walking distance if you walk long enough from my house. But there's this. That weird, weird market that, like, just has, like, random Dale Earnhardt.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

Lampshades and then, like, Velveeta cheese and then, like, no half and half. Like, they have none of the things.

[Andrew Walsh]

One skateboard for sale. Am I remembering this?

[Luke Burbank]

Skateboard?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes, they had a skateboard. So. Well, they're the strangest little places. And I feel like, man, I. I want to just, like, come in and, like, I want to, like, go bar rescue on it. I want to be like, here. Here's why people come to you. We. We ran out of milk. We ran out of butter. Like, you are here because we don't want to go into town. So you need to have the thing that we ran out of, and it. We didn't run out of Dale Earnhardt lampshades. We have plenty at home.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Yeah, exactly. Look like they won't have eggs. Have those triangular party hats.

[Luke Burbank]

Why, yes, They're. They're trying to. Literally. The one near me is still trying to sell a, like. How do I put this? It's like a. Not a vending machine, but it's a. It's a heated cupboard that you would have hot dogs in. Like, at some. At one time, they were trying to sell hot dogs, and no one was buying hot dogs. So now they're trying to sell the thing that. The hot dogs. They've cleaned it and it's sitting there. So you could buy the thing that they were trying to sell hot dogs from. For what? Your market. Maybe you have more hot dog traffic than they did, but, like, it's that kind of place. It's been the whole time I've lived here, they've been trying to sell a hot dog case that was clearly purchased when they were trying to sell hot dogs.

[Andrew Walsh]

And it doesn't cook hot dogs. It just keeps them warm for your customers.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes, I think it's a. I haven't. You. I'll be honest with you. I've been eyeing the Dale Earnhardt lampshades more than the hot dog machine. So I don't know if it also cooks them, but it's. It's just like. It's that kind of a place. Although I will say this. There's a gal who works there who is 94 years old and she is an absolute firecracker. I love her so much. She is the grandmother of the owner of the store. And the owner of the store has a night job stalking the shelves at the Safeway in town because wages are too high in this country. So he's got this little corner store, but then he also has a real job. And so she covers for him when he's, I guess, sleeping after his shift. And she and I had the longest conversation about Little House on the Prairie recently because it's also one of those places that has a TV that just has an over the air antenna and it's just always playing, you know, whatever's on MeTV.

[Andrew Walsh]

Is it a tube TV?

[Luke Burbank]

Is it a tube, tube TV, my friend? A freaking tube TV. And she and I, and then I said something about a particular episode of Little House and she corrected me and she was right. And then she told me, she was like, I live down in town, I just moved to these apartments and I love it so much. And she was showing me the view from her balcony is the field of the local community college. And she said, I just sat on my balcony the other day and I watched the guy paint the lines on the soccer field. And she goes, you know how they do that? And I go, I don't know. She goes, they got a robot. They have. There's some kind of Roomba that paints the lines on these sports fields now so that it can be. Exactly. And she. You want to talk about the Loon Lake principle? This lady had wild away an entire afternoon watching the robot paint the lines on the lower Columbia College field.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Got it mega dialed in.

[Luke Burbank]

I know. I was like, I got. I'll have what she's having to say. I could totally at peace.

[Andrew Walsh]

It seems, it seems wonderful to me. But it also seems very much like there's nothing you like to fantasize about, but just like looking, just looking out your window at things.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, I will say, and I'm very fortunate here that the whole premise of this little place that I got is that it's, that it's got some good looking territory. Some, some good territory for looking. And like, I thought, Andrew, that I was going to miss urban America more than I have if my girlfriend didn't live in urban America. I could go longer stretches than I expected out here. Now, granted, I'm very fortunate that I've made this home environment very comfortable. We can get Amazon deliveries. Like, it's, I'm not totally cut off, but it's like this agrees with me more than I expected. I think.

[Andrew Walsh]

I think I'm just different, you know, And I built different. I'm just built different. I don't like to say this, but I'm saying it to you guys because I trust you. But I'm built Ford tough. No, I'm not built for tough. I'm built, like, just so weak and soft, and so I feel like I need the. I just. I remember feeling like living in Walling was too rural for me. Like, I'm not even joking. I told V is like, Wallingford was a much nicer kind of neighborhood than what we live in now, but it was so residential that I had to walk, you know, I think about a mile to get to the grocery store. And I did it plenty. But I alie's.

[Luke Burbank]

Was that your spot?

[Andrew Walsh]

No, no, just the QFC that used to be Wallingford. QFC? Yeah, 45th.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I used to live in Wallingford, too. Yeah, that was my.

[Andrew Walsh]

That.

[Luke Burbank]

Did you live there when that would remember? That was the Piggly Wiggly, Cassie. Not the Piggly Wiggly.

[Andrew Walsh]

It was.

[Luke Burbank]

Had a different crazy name that that grocery store that became the qfc, but.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I did in Wallingford. Are you guys familiar with the Dern Good Grocery?

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, I have a hat that's. I said alfies. I was wrong. I was trying to. I was referring to that one that Andrew's got a hat from.

[Cassie Chattelane]

You have a hat from the Dern?

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes, so that they. They claim, or some folks claim. And I don't even think the people who own it now claim this, but I have read that that Darn Good grocery, which is on the corner of, I believe, stone and 40th, I want to say. Or maybe. Yeah, close. Close to there. It's like a small, like, what I would grow up. I would call it a quick E Mart or something like that, but it's always been family run by various families over the years. And some say. Some say that it's literally the oldest grocery store, if you call it that, in Seattle. I don't know how that could possibly be true, but people have said that. And what I like about it is they don't make a big deal about themselves, like they're some sort of a landmark or anything, but they would sell the family that owns it now, they sell, like, little things that say Dern Good Grocery. And it is dern with a U. And I bought myself a cute little green trucker hat with, like, white mesh on the back and green in front. I love that hat.

[Cassie Chattelane]

That was my place for, like, oh, gosh Three years.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yes, I'd say I was there.

[Luke Burbank]

Practically. Beautiful T shirts as well, Andrew. They've got merch.

[Andrew Walsh]

Oh, they have it online now.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm on their website. I don't know if you can buy it online, but I'm on their website looking at. Well, I'm on their Yelp page, I guess. And yeah, it's got somebody wearing like a durn good T shirt that's got the same logo that's on your hat.

[Andrew Walsh]

Nice. I'm looking to see if I'm just totally talking out my keister about this being the longest running grocery store in Seattle, but maybe we should.

[Luke Burbank]

Cassie, did you land a new job, by the way, in the eastern part of Washington state too?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I landed a new job, highly employable. I wasn't sure how long I was gonna have my like little mini sabbatical, you know, because, yeah, like rarely do I have get to get like a breather. I was like, I should really take advantage of this. But then I was, you know, I was like at my folks house and I didn't have a job and I was kind of starting to freak out. It was like, yeah, like there's only so much like romping around in my bathrobe that I can do before I start to. I was starting to feel kind of bummed, like, just. So I got a new job. I got a new job and I, I like the people a lot and I'm actually, I'm just like so pumped that I did. I like it's actually working out here. I can't believe.

[Andrew Walsh]

And how long has it been? How long has it been?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Like two and a half months, but it feels like 77 years.

[Luke Burbank]

That's great though. I mean, you're saying that because a lot has changed or because the pace of life actually feels like the day goes a little longer than it did when you were in the bay.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I, I think actually. Good question. I think both, honestly, so much has happened, but also like, things do. There's definitely a slower pace here in my ADHD is like sometimes like cranked up and I'm like, things are so slow. Everything's a little more relaxed and I'm just like, let's go. I'm losing it. But like, I, I, I've noticed recently this is my thing where I'll take like long drives on the back roads and stuff like that. And I started listening to like relaxing classical music and I was, I was telling like laughing to myself. I was like, this is the kind of thing where this music sounds like if you were to walk into a high end custom framing shop ran by an elderly lady, that's the kind of music I'm into these days.

[Luke Burbank]

Yes.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Sedate, calm.

[Luke Burbank]

Melos Quartet radio is what I would recommend. It's literally M E L O s Melos Quartet Radio. It is exactly that. It would be. It's just like classical music, but nothing too edgy. Yeah, that's it.

[Cassie Chattelane]

That's it, Luke. Nothing too edgy like that.

[Luke Burbank]

Nothing from Bartok. Nothing that's sort of, you know, kind of jarring. It's like, it's. It's very chill classical music.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I just wrote this down and I need that because just yesterday the piano was. The pianist was. It was getting a little wild and I actually. This is the state of life I'm in. And I turned it down. I was like, this is getting out of control. Meanwhile, it's like I used to run the streets of San Francisco like a maniac. Like, what is going on?

[Andrew Walsh]

So I'm not trying to rush us out the door, but I want to make sure I get your guys input on something here. I've been playing around. I've been playing around with show titles. So originally I'd written down the loon lake principle. I think that's kind of just a nice name for the show and where it was. But then Luke brought up the word lufton and then I started playing around. I got heavy Lufton. I have loofed with your legs or I have live loofed. Love. Which one do. What do we. What do we want to go with.

[Luke Burbank]

For a live laugh, love, joke?

[Cassie Chattelane]

I like maybe that one. I think the last one we'll go.

[Andrew Walsh]

With live loft love. All right. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

I think it also that if I might click on that. If I was scroll. If I was running around the Internet and I saw that, I. I might click on that.

[Andrew Walsh]

All right, we'll go with that.

[Luke Burbank]

Whereas loofed with your legs might sound like it's a workout podcast.

[Andrew Walsh]

It is. It's a German workout podcast. But you know what? It doesn't smell sweaty in there. It always smells nice and fresh and breezy.

[Luke Burbank]

That's right. Three times a day, opening those windows.

[Andrew Walsh]

That's right.

[Luke Burbank]

Well, Cassie, I'm like, I'm. I'm so excited for you. I'm so intrigued. It's fun to get to follow your adventures. I'm really, really stoked for you about this house project. Maybe we can get some updates because Andrew is a little coy about his. He's gonna embark on A project at his house, which I tried to engage him on that recently, and he just kind of said, I don't even know.

[Andrew Walsh]

No, we'll talk about it. I'm just very different from you guys. Like, projects like this. When you talk about, like, waking up in the middle of the night and being like, oh, I need to check out those. Those curtains, or whatever. Like, I'm somebody who really. I appreciate and enjoy a nice space, I think, but I'm. I don't have the drive to create it myself. I'm just, like, deeply lazy, and I don't have whatever that energy is. I want somebody else to create that for me. So I'm kind of entering my very first big home reno project, which is relatively minor by some people's standards, but, like, we've hired somebody and who's helping us design this area of our basement, and there are decisions to be made about, like, what are we going to be putting in? We're going to be putting in, like, a. What he's calling an appliance garage. And there's all these decisions that I got to make that you guys would be loving making these things right now. And I just keep on staring at this contract, being like, yeah, I guess I got to open up and read that at some point and sign it. Like, I get more overwhelmed by it. I just want it to be done. I don't like the project side of things.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I got it. We should all collaborate, truly. Let's keep. Keep talking at some point, because I could talk about, like, the most minor stuff like this. We'll push you in the right direction, Andrew. I could talk like tile for an hour and a half.

[Luke Burbank]

I've got thoughts. I got a lot of thoughts, and.

[Andrew Walsh]

I got a Genevieve, too, so that helps, too. I'll put you guys all in touch. I'll be back.

[Luke Burbank]

Is there some pretty decent thrifting over there? Because. Because it's not picked over. Like, in a major American city.

[Cassie Chattelane]

It is cuckoo. Okay, A few. A few things. First of all, yes, there is. And it's my antiquing, and thrifting is my favorite thing in the world. But my new hometown, Colfax, has the best thrift store on earth, which is called Thrifty Granny or no, Thrifty Grandmothers. We just call it the granny shop for decades. I'm gonna go to the granny shop every. Okay, so first of all, everything there is, like, 25 cents, 10 cents, cents, 50 cents, a dollar. And it's ran by grandmothers who work there, volunteer their time to Work there. And then all the proceeds go towards the community and like little scholarships and things like that. It's the sweetest thing. Thrifty Grannies.

[Luke Burbank]

I'm looking at it.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, me too. This is great. I do that. I say I don't like shopping and I really don't. I don't like purposeful shopping. Like, we need this thing. Let's go out and find this thing. But I love just mindlessly wandering through stores.

[Luke Burbank]

What do they sell at? Fonks.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, God, yeah. Fonks. One of my favorite places in the world.

[Luke Burbank]

Huh? There's. I'm just walking down the streets of Colfax, Washington. There's a. When I was growing up, we had Vernfonk Insurance in the Seattle area.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Vernfonk, yes, I heard this is.

[Luke Burbank]

But this place, just a place that just says Fonks F O N K.

[Cassie Chattelane]

S. Fonks used to be this absurd store. Okay, Luke, you know how you were talking about the corner store, right? They just sell the Dan or Dale Earnhardt. This is that type of place. It used to sell like, like weird, like strange, like dollar store plastic toys for kids that were like bleach from the sun. Also, like just like, you know, dried up ink pens. And it was just the strangest place. But we loved Fonks. But now they turned it into like a really cool coffee shop.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Named Fonks. And I have a fox hat. I should send you guys a fox hat.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, we'll go on the. We'll go on the website. We'll support Fonks. We'll buy some merch from them. This is giving me. As I, as I wander around Colfax. It actually seems like a much more robust version of Friendship, Wisconsin.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, maybe that's.

[Luke Burbank]

Maybe that's every Main Street USA of a relatively small place. You know, I mean, you're always going to have your. You're gonna have the place that used to be the J.C. penney's, you know, and like the kind of like there's a certain Main street feel. I mean, I'm literally on Main Street. But no, this is.

[Cassie Chattelane]

That you're walking around in there. It's like so cool to think of. Yeah.

[Luke Burbank]

It makes me so happy. Did you ever spend any time in Chewela? Is the real, the important question.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Oh, there's a casino, right?

[Luke Burbank]

That's what I used to go to when I. So I had my whole, I'm gonna go stay in eastern Washington at this lake for a month and get back in touch with my child. And what I ended up doing was driving to the casino in Chewelah most days.

[Cassie Chattelane]

You know, Good, Luke. I can see that.

[Luke Burbank]

Good decisions all around.

[Cassie Chattelane]

I'm laughing because actually my dad used to. He. For some reason he pronounced casino. Casino.

[Andrew Walsh]

Uh huh.

[Luke Burbank]

Sure.

[Cassie Chattelane]

You know people like that.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Anytime the commercial come on, be like Chewela Casino. Just weirdos, you know.

[Luke Burbank]

Oh, my gosh. Well, I'm so excited to follow all your adventures, Cassie. And thanks for spending your lunch break at your new job jumping on tbtl.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Gosh, this was absolutely so fun. You guys are the best. You know, I love you.

[Luke Burbank]

And the nice thing is you have so much more time to listen to TBTL as you drive around the highways and byways in Washington. So.

[Andrew Walsh]

Yeah, let them know. Let them know. Let Colfax know about.

[Luke Burbank]

Yeah, please. That's. We see that as a growing edge for us. If we could get more people in Colfax. Right now we have one listener in Colfax and Tuffy by accident. What's the other dog's name?

[Cassie Chattelane]

Dagmar.

[Luke Burbank]

Dagmar and Tuffy. Two solid dog names. So. All right, thanks, Cass. We appreciate you. Thanks to everybody for listening. We're gonna be right back here tomorrow with more imaginary radio for all of you. So if you can please join us for that. In the meantime, have a great Wednesday, everybody. Take care of yourselves and please remember, no mountain too tall.

[Andrew Walsh]

And good luck to all.

[Cassie Chattelane]

Power out.