Searching for paradise

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: TED Radio Hour – "Searching for Paradise"

Date: July 17, 2026
Host: Manoush Zomorodi
Main Theme:
Exploring humanity's search for paradise in a world challenged by climate change, disaster, and shifting notions of utopia. Through personal stories, expert insight, and global examples, the episode navigates the complexities of seeking, losing, and redefining paradise.

---

Overview

"Searching for Paradise" weaves together stories from people who have lost and rebuilt their homes, thinkers who philosophize about the real meaning of paradise, government innovators tackling the climate crisis, and survivors finding unexpected sanctuaries. The episode unpacks paradise as both a physical place and a state of mind, urging listeners to reevaluate what it means—and how to nurture it—amidst personal and planetary turmoil.

---

Key Segments, Insights & Memorable Moments

1. Paradise Lost: The Gores and Paradise, California

Timestamps: 00:41–05:14; 11:26–12:50

Key Points:

• Richard and Zeta Gore moved to Paradise, CA, in 2018, fulfilling their dream of living in an idyllic small town.
• The Camp Fire, started by a faulty electrical line, devastated Paradise, destroying 18,000 structures and killing 85 people—it was the deadliest fire in modern U.S. history until Maui 2023.
• The Gores barely escaped after evacuating on foot, hiking twelve miles to safety.
• Returning to their property with a sheriff a week later, they found "burned out remains."

Quotes:

• "Nothing. No feeling compares to the feeling about a week later when the sheriff escorted us up there...stood there at our burned out remains." — Zeta Gore (04:06)
• "Couldn't hold back the tears." — Richard Gore (04:21)
• On the new, post-fire Paradise: "There's more open sky. We can actually see our neighbors across the way now. There's a lot more community and camaraderie now." — Zeta Gore (12:12)

---

2. Preventing Megafires: George Whitesides' Solutions

Timestamps: 05:14–11:26

Key Points:

• George Whitesides, founder of Megafire Action (now elected to Congress), identifies three pillars for combating megafires:
  1. Fire-adapted communities—homeowners taking preventive actions (e.g., clearing brush, fire-resistant roofs).
  2. Resilient landscapes—restoring forest health through brush management and prescribed burns, drawing on Indigenous knowledge.
  3. Innovative fire management—rapid detection and response (e.g., using helicopters in Southern California's Quick Reaction Force).

Quotes:

• "Eight of the ten largest mega fires in California history have happened over the last five or six years..." — George Whitesides (05:42)
• "If you take one lesson from this talk: we need to bring our western landscapes back into a healthy balance..." — George Whitesides (08:27)
• "Let's get to work. Let's learn from fire, and let's build a resilient, sustainable future." — George Whitesides (11:12)

---

3. Reframing Paradise: Writer Pico Iyer’s Global Journey

Timestamps: 15:29–33:19

Key Points:

• Pico Iyer questions the universality of paradise, reflecting on both literal and metaphorical Edens worldwide.
• He finds that paradise is subjective—often shaped by circumstance, illusion, and contrast.
• In Iran, the notion is divided between religious martyrdom, secular pleasures, and the Sufi idea of paradise within.
• A poignant story: Iyer’s taxi driver in Iran, who risked his life to flee, but returns each year, highlighting the duality of longing and belonging.
• Varanasi, India: A city where the realities of death and joy coexist; Iyer observes that paradise may be found in accepting the fullness of life’s pageant, not in searching for a flawless realm.

Quotes:

• "Paradise is a projection and often an illusion… what lay on the other side… is very much in the heart of reality." — Pico Iyer (15:43)
• "Sometimes it's notions of paradise that get in the way of our finding it." — Pico Iyer (19:54)
• "Our full contentment and realization probably never comes from just one place. It comes from the many places that mean a lot to us and that we love." — Pico Iyer (24:44)
• "The struggle of your life… is your paradise." — Ido Roshi, quoted by Pico Iyer (31:49)
• "It's in the very struggle that you find your paradise… more encouraging and inspiring than saying you can find it on a sandy beach." — Pico Iyer (32:14)

---

4. Building a Renewables Paradise: Uruguay’s Example

Speaker: Ramón Méndez Galain
Timestamps: 35:25–44:23

Key Points:

• Uruguay’s 98% renewably powered grid is "a kind of Renewables Paradise," achieved in just five years.
• The transformation was a response to economic and energy crises.
• Méndez, a physics professor-turned-policy leader, led the effort focusing on wind, solar, and biomass, with unique public buy-in and robust planning.
• Emphasis on narrative ("the best solution") and demonstrating that rapid, large-scale change is possible.

Quotes:

• "This is what we need to do all over the world in order to face climate change. This is paradise and we have to recognize it." — Ramón Méndez Galain (35:25)
• "Renewables are the best option… they reduce costs, create jobs, and foster sovereignty for your country." — Ramón Méndez Galain (38:51)
• "The message is… there is a solution… which creates jobs, reduces cost, which makes you independent… and it works." — Ramón Méndez Galain (42:18)
• "What's making me happy is trying to be part of a global process to live a better world for our kids… it's real. And so this makes me happy." — Ramón Méndez Galain (43:55)

---

5. Finding Sanctuary: Ramona Pierson’s Story of Radical Collaboration

Timestamps: 44:23–51:37

Key Points:

• After nearly dying in an accident at 22, Pierson was sent to a senior home to recover—after 18 months in a coma.
• The seniors pooled their practical skills and wisdom to help Ramona relearn basics: eating, speaking, crossing the street, and eventually, returning to independent life.
• Their radical collaboration—decades before "crowdsourcing" was a buzzword—helped her rebuild her life.

Quotes:

• "If you think about all of the skills and talent that are in this room right now, that's what a senior home has. The one advantage that they had… is wisdom, because they had a long life, and I needed that wisdom." — Ramona Pierson (45:32)
• "We didn't have words like crowdsourcing and radical collaboration when I had my accident, but the concept held true. People working with people to rebuild me… I wouldn't be standing here today if it wasn't for extreme, radical collaboration." — Ramona Pierson (51:15)

---

Thematic Takeaways

• Paradise is not static nor simple: It is lost, found, remade, and reimagined in the face of crisis and change—both environmental and personal.
• Resilience and community are central: Whether rebuilding from fire, navigating disability, or redesigning an energy grid, collective action and mutual support create the conditions for paradise to reemerge.
• Paradise is subjective and evolving: It is tied not only to place, but to mindset, relationships, and the ability to find meaning within reality’s complexity.
• Embracing imperfection: True paradise, as Pico Iyer and other guests argue, may be found not in fantasy or escape, but in finding depth, connection, and even joy amid struggle.

---

Notable Quotes Roundup

• "The struggle of your life… is your paradise." — Ido Roshi, via Pico Iyer (31:49)
• "Sometimes it's notions of paradise that get in the way of our finding it." — Pico Iyer (19:54)
• "If you take one lesson from this talk… we need to bring our western landscapes back into a healthy balance…" — George Whitesides (08:27)
• "We didn't have words like crowdsourcing and radical collaboration… but the concept held true. People working with people to rebuild me." — Ramona Pierson (51:15)

---

Episode Structure & Timestamps

• Paradise, California: The Gores lose and rebuild (00:41–12:50)
• Fire management and climate adaptation with George Whitesides (05:14–11:26)
• Notions of paradise around the globe with Pico Iyer (15:29–33:19)
• Uruguay’s renewable energy transformation with Ramón Méndez Galain (35:25–44:23)
• Ramona Pierson’s recovery through radical community (44:23–51:37)

---

For listeners who missed it:
This episode’s intertwining stories illustrate how paradise is at once deeply personal, profoundly social, and inextricably tied to the world’s evolving circumstances. Whether escaping wildfire, seeking spiritual fulfillment, reengineering an energy system, or returning from the brink of death, the quest for paradise is fundamentally about resilience, adaptation, and meaning-making in the real world.

---

Transcript

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

This message comes from U.S. bank. Simplify how you do business with business essentials. A powerful combination of no monthly maintenance fee, checking and card payment processing. Deposit products are offered by U.S. bank National association member FDIC.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

This is the TED Radio Hour. Each week groundbreaking TED Talks. Our job now is to dream big. Delivered at TED conferences to bring about the future we want to see around the world to understand who we are. From those talks, we bring you speakers and ideas that will surprise you. You just don't know what you're gonna find challenge you.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

We truly have to ask ourselves, like, why is it noteworthy and even change you.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I literally feel like I'm a different person. Yes. Do you feel that way? Ideas worth spreading from TED and npr. I'm Anoosh Zumarodi. And on the show today, paradise lost and found. And for Richard and Zeta Gore, paradise is a real place. They found it and they moved there in 2018.

[Zeta Gore]

We enjoyed the small town, lots of trees and, you know, fresh air up above the valley.

[Richard Gore]

We loved the house we had just picked out. We remodeled a few things on it and it had just become the house of our dreams.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Paradise is Paradise, California. A town that at the time had about 26,000 people surrounded by dense forest covered canyon in the Sierra Nevada foothills. And with a name like paradise, there's

[Zeta Gore]

a lot of lot of jokes about it. You're now ascending into Paradise. And when we go to our sons, we tell them we're now descending out of paradise to come down to the valley.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

But then in November 2018, just seven months after the Gores moved into town, they got a phone call.

[Richard Gore]

We'll never forget to this day.

[Zeta Gore]

I remember looking out the window of our bedroom and noticing that it looked kind of overcast. And I said, that's strange. I don't recall it being any clouds, but I didn't pay any attention. And Then at about 7:45, our son called and said, did you know your town is on fire?

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Just west, a faulty electrical line had started a small fire that combined with the bone dry brush from California's ongoing drought, coaxed that small fire into a massive blaze that quickly descended on Paradise. But of course, the Gores didn't know any of this at the time.

[Richard Gore]

We saw the sky, we saw the ashes. We were told that we should leave, but we didn't think it was urgent because we didn't see any flames at that time.

[Zeta Gore]

And we said, okay, we need to evacuate, but we'll be coming back. Our home will be fine.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Zayda and Richard packed up A few clothes and drove off. But they quickly hit gridlock and things got serious.

[Zeta Gore]

Then the wind started kicking up. That's when ashes are flying around in embers. Hard to breathe. Explosions are happening all every minute or two.

[Richard Gore]

And then people were saying, there's a house on fire just up the road. And were then hitting us. Wow, this is going to be bad.

[Zeta Gore]

In a matter of a few hours, the entire town was inundated. And it was absolutely that feeling in our guts. We absolutely thought we were going to die. And we're both praying. And I said, look, we're not going to die sitting in our car in the road.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

They pulled over and hiked down into a canyon. They ended up walking over a dozen miles to another town where their son could finally come and pick them up. Richard and Zeta were exhausted, but fine. Their house, however, was not.

[Zeta Gore]

Nothing. No feeling compares to the feeling about a week later when the sheriff escorted us up there to our property and we pulled up and got out of the cars and stood there at our burned out remains.

[Richard Gore]

Couldn't hold back the tears.

[Zeta Gore]

Yeah, I was very emotional.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Paradise. The word evokes lush, abundant beauty. A refuge from harm. But is it futile to search for anything idyllic when we live on a warming planet that feels less at peace than ever? Today on the show Paradise Lost and found, ideas about looking for utopia and coming to terms with reality. So back to Paradise. California. 18,000 structures were destroyed in 2018, 85 people died at the time. It was the deadliest fire in modern US history. That was until the fires in in Maui just five years later.

[George Whitesides]

This risk is increasing and if we don't get our act together, we're gonna have more Paradises, we're gonna have more Santa Rosas, we're gonna have more Lahainas, we're gonna have more Marshall Fires like the one they had in Colorado.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

This is George Whitesides. He's the founder of a new organization that's working to help local governments in California manage fires better and stop megafires like the one in paradise from happening in the first place.

[George Whitesides]

Eight of the ten largest mega fires in California history have happened over the last five or six years. Partly that's due to global warming, but it's also due to how we've been managing the forests. And I think that's kind of a crucial piece that over suppression over the course of many decades has created conditions akin to almost a bomb in our forests. And we really need to defuse that bomb by managing our forests and our wildlands in fundamentally different Ways many people

[George Whitesides (continued)]

feel overwhelmed by this situation. I know I did.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

George Whitesides continues from the TED stage.

[George Whitesides (continued)]

So two years ago, I closed a chapter of my life in aerospace and I started a new journey to see if I could understand the wildfire crisis better and what could be done about it. I started working with leaders from firefighting, entrepreneurship, science, tribal communities. And together we co founded an organization called Megafire Action, whose sole purpose is to solve the megafire crisis. The path forward has three solutions. The first is fire adapted communities. The second is resilient landscapes, and the third is innovative fire management.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I mean, we have seen these really dramatic scenes of wildfire just ravaging towns. But you say that the first steps people need to take to protect their homes, it's actually pretty straightforward.

[George Whitesides (continued)]

Yeah, sure.

[George Whitesides]

In fact, it could be as simple as individual homeowners doing the work that is required to make their home more resilient to wildfire. So, like, on the cheaper side, you know, everyone can clear out the 5 or 10ft immediately around their home from brush and shrubs and plants. Basically, that makes a big difference. Everyone can put metal screens in their eaves and vents around their home so that when a big fire comes through and embers start blowing, you know, at high speed, they don't blow through into your attic and burn your home down from the inside out. Other things are more expensive. Like, it's really great if you can have a roof that is made of something that's fire resistant. Those make a huge difference. Arguably up to 50% of your risk is, you know, what those materials are. And we have a huge interest to having everybody in that community take these steps, particularly those around the perimeter. Because if you can protect some of those outer boundaries, then you have a way of reducing the risk that that fire penetrates deeply into the city.

[George Whitesides (continued)]

The second solution is resilient landscapes. And if you take one lesson from this talk, it's this. In order to solve the megafire crisis, we need to bring our western landscapes back into a healthy balance by reducing the overgrown brush and trees in the wildlands and the forest. Here we're starting to take to heart the wisdom of the indigenous peoples of the Americas who knew that fire was a natural part of the landscape and who introduced low intensity fire, good fire, on a regular basis at the right times. When this is done well, as around the communities of South Lake Tahoe, then it can actually divert a mega fire as bad as the one that they experienced in 2021.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I mean, there might be some indigenous people who hear you say that. And think, yeah, no kidding, that you need to be having prescribed burns, I think is what they call it. Right. Like, this is something that some populations have been doing for centuries.

[George Whitesides]

Yeah, thousands of years. And there are now, you know, many places that are working on this stuff. And, you know, great example is the area immediately around South Lake Tahoe, you know, which spent on the order of over $100 million on forest treatments. And that's a hopeful example of a situation with the Caldor fire where you had this terrible, huge megafire bearing down on South Lake Tahoe. But those forest treatments were credited by some as sort of giving the firefighters enough pause, bringing the fire intensity down enough, they were able to keep it from tearing through South Lake Tahoe, where you don't do that work. And actually, as part of that same fire, some of those treatments weren't done. And actually there were communities that were lost in that fire, tragically.

[George Whitesides (continued)]

What we need is innovation and technology that can rapidly detect and assess fire and then quickly put it out when it gets bad. Here we need to look at the example of the quick reaction force of Southern California, which is really designed in some ways for these toughest days. The QRF is a public private partnership which now has three Chinook helicopters. These are the big ones with the two rotors on the top. And each of them can drop up to 3,000 gallons of water on a fire, day or night. And they can do it very precisely. They can also refill up to six times an hour. So they can bring a lot of mass to the problem. Over the course of two years of demonstrations, these, the QRF has demonstrated that this model has great potential. That in fact, if you can bring a lot of fire management resource to a fire very quickly, you can get on top of fires before they get big and unmanageable. We can build a world in which communities are resilient to wildfire and in which forests are brought back into a healthy balance. So let's get to work. Let's learn from fire, and let's build a resilient, sustainable future.

[Zeta Gore]

We were not going to go back to paradise at all. And it actually took us, oh, I'd say almost about a year to decide.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Again, Richard and Zeta Gore.

[Zeta Gore]

We had a clean slate. We were starting from scratch. We could virtually move anywhere.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

But after scouting out towns in Utah, Arizona and Idaho, the Gores decided to go back to paradise and rebuild. The area has new building codes. The town also has a new early warning system. And they say it feels good to be home.

[Richard Gore]

I did not feel there was any high risk of fire anymore. Everything was so burned. And I actually was proud to go back and rebuild the city, you know, try and heal.

[Zeta Gore]

We actually enjoy the geography better now because it's not so overgrown with trees and underbrush. You know, a lot of that has been burned off. There's more open sky. We can actually see our neighbors across the way now. It seems, at least to us, that there's a lot more community and camaraderie now since the fire, that those that have stayed and are rebuilding have, you know, really banded together and bonded. And it's really much more of our town feeling now than just a town before the fire.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Many thanks to Richard and Zita Gore of Paradise, California. And that was George Whitesides. He's the co founder of Mega Fire Action. And since we spoke, he's been elected to the US Congress representing California. You can see his full [e-mail] on the show today, paradise Lost and found. You're listening to the TED Radio Hour from npr. I'm Anoush Zamorodi. And we'll be right back.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

This message comes from NPR sponsor Carvana. Carvana makes car buying easy 100% online prices down to the penny delivered to your door. Why make car buying hard when it could be easy? Visit Carvana.com today. Terms may apply. This message comes from Capella University. You know that feeling when there's a spark building inside you that you were meant for more? That's your own drive pushing you towards what's next. Capella University gets that with their Flexpath learning format, you can set the pace and earn your degree without putting life on pause. You've built experience and know what you're capable of. Now this is your time to turn that momentum into more. The only real question is what can't you do? Learn [e-mail]. this message comes from wise. The smart way to manage your money around the world. With Wise, you can send, spend and receive money in over 40 currencies at the mid market rate. Learn [e-mail] Ts and Cs apply. This message comes from BetterHelp, whose survey found that while 85% of Americans believe getting mental health support is wise, 74% say society discourages it. Don't let stigma stand in the way.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Visit betterhelp.com NPR we know you have very specific tastes. That is why you are here. Whether you want a roundup of the headlines, the latest in pop culture or or deep dive investigative reporting, we have a newsletter for you. It's NPR journalism, tailored to your interests, right in your inbox. Check out the Full [e-mail] Newsletters now back to the show. It's the TED Radio Hour from npr. I'm Minouche Zamorodi. Today on the show, paradise lost and found ideas about our search for utopia.

[Pico Iyer]

You know, I've been lucky enough to go to many of the idols that we might think of as paradise, from the Seychelles to Tahiti to Bali.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

This is writer Pico Iyer.

[Pico Iyer]

And I remember when I was in my 20s, I flew through the day and through the night, and I arrived in Bali and I woke up and there was this golden morning all around me and there were these smiling, kind people bringing me fresh fruit and tea to enjoy on the terrace of my bungalow. Down this palmy little lane was a golden beach of my dreams. And I thought, this really is paradise. But then night fell. I heard the weird, jangly sound of the gamelan orchestras in the distance. Wild dogs were barking. And apart from anything, I thought, even if this is paradise for me, it's probably not for the locals. They're working so hard to make me and other visitors comfortable. And then it also made me think, because I was living in New York City, well, if the wonderful Balinese people around me were to arrive in Manhattan tomorrow, they'd probably think that's paradise. Which it wasn't for me, working in Midt on 25th floor office. And so it was a nice way at an early stage in my life of realizing how much paradise is a projection and often an illusion, and then thinking about what lay on the other side of them and not in the realm of fantasy, but very much in the heart of reality.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Pico is a novelist, essayist, and he's best known for writing about his travels. He thought often about this idea that paradise is just a fantasy. But it wasn't until he was stuck at home during the pandemic that he decided to explore it further.

[Pico Iyer]

I think, like pretty much everybody across the globe, I was in this state of uncertainty and close to grief, feeling death breathing around the corner and wondering how I could find hope and light and inspiration even in the middle of this difficulty. And I thought, if I can go to places of conflict and difficult difficulty and find something that sustains me even there, maybe that will give me a hope that can take me even through a global pandemic and all the other challenges, life is sure to throw up.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Yeah, you write. After years of travel, I'd begun to wonder what kind of paradise can ever be found in a world of unceasing conflict, and whether the very search for it might not simply aggravate our differences. We are talking about a very sort of philosophical approach that you took, which led you all around the world.

[Pico Iyer]

Exactly. From Iran to North Korea and war torn Kashmir to war torn Sri Lanka and Varanasi, and as you say, all the places that are not the ones that instantly come to mind.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Pico Iyer continues from his book, the Half Known Life.

[Narrator/Interpreter]

The natural place to embark upon such an inquiry seemed to be the culture that had given us both our word for paradise and some of our most soulful images of it. The old Iranian term paradaja had been brought into Greek by Xenophon when he'd served as a mercenary in Persia. And for centuries, Persians, as most residents of Iran were then known as had cultivated detailed and ravishing visions of paradise in their walled gardens, as emblems of enticements towards the higher garden that awaits the fortunate. But what gave particular power to the world's largest theocracy right now was that so many competing visions of paradise seemed to be crisscrossing every hour here with furious intensity.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

So you begin your search for paradise in Iran, a place that you visited, I should say, before the war that's been going on. And you write that in Iran there are these competing visions of what paradise even is. What are those visions exactly?

[Pico Iyer]

The ruling clerics in Iran currently have a very precise notion of paradise. They believe that paradise belongs only to the faithful and most of all, to those martyrs who give their lives to Islam. And of course, so many of the Iranian citizens have a very different notion of paradise, I think much more worldly one taking place behind closed doors of maybe sex and drugs and rock and roll and all the delights of the earth. And meanwhile, I think both the rulers and the regular citizens are quoting the great Sufi poets like Rumi and Hafiz, who remind us that paradise exists only within. So Iran seemed like the perfect convergence of many different ways of thinking about paradise, and maybe a way of reminding me that sometimes it's notions of paradise that get in the way of our finding it.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Let's talk about the young man who you ended up spending time with.

[Richard Gore]

Yes, yes.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

He had his own notion of paradise, and it was a really surprising example. Can you share it?

[Pico Iyer]

Yes. I mean, my very first night in Iran, in the great holy city of Mashhad, I had spent a wonderful day seeing the official sites with my guide and my driver, but I wanted to see the place unchaperoned.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

To do so, Pico politely sent his guide and driver to dinner, saying he was going to turn in early.

[Pico Iyer]

But instead I slipped down to the taxi desk in the hotel of my lobby and I asked them if they could find somebody to take me into the heart of town. And very quickly, a young man, very friendly, in his late 20s, speaking pretty good English, led me off into his battered compact.

[Narrator/Interpreter]

You come for the festival? He asked. Festival? This week, the driver explained, the anniversary of Imam Reza. Five million people had gathered from every corner of the Shia world, he said, from Yemen and Pakistan and Beirut and Iraq, from all the provinces of Iran, to mark the auspicious occasion. As we pushed through through a tiny entrance behind a wall of bodies, all we could make out was celebration.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

This driver took Pico through busy streets to a mosque in the heart of Mashhad, which is actually the largest mosque in the world, with seven huge marble courtyards and at the center, a shrine to Imam Reza, the saint that was being celebrated.

[Narrator/Interpreter]

The crowds here were so intense that little boys were being passed from shoulder to shoulder so they could arrive at the front and kiss the golden grill behind which lay the saint. A man wailed, and a great sound rose up around us. More than 30 million pieces of silver on the walls and chandeliers turned us all into a shiver of reflections. I was humbled as I moved among the sobbing bodies. Men were running their hands down their faces and weeping as at their mother's funeral. More people pressed in and the whole crowd seemed to sway and tremble as if we were truly part of a single massed body. I'd lost contact by now with my driver, but then I caught sight of him across the room,

[Pico Iyer]

and I saw that there were tears in this young driver's eyes. His hand was on his heart and he was literally moving backwards, walking backwards, so he would never present his back to the long dead saints. And I thought, my goodness, this is a perfect image of Islamic piety. But then when we were out of the shrine and walking back towards his car, he started telling me about his wife, who was a blessed blonde Yorkshire woman waiting for him in England and expecting their first child. And then he told me that he had paid a human trafficker $2,500 to smuggle him into England in the back of a truck, breathing through a tube so he wouldn't be detected. And then he told me how the British government had very generously given him a court appointed lawyer and translator, and they had worked night and day for three years in order to win him asylum in Britain.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Wow. So this taxi driver has this harrowing journey to start a new life, and yet he was back.

[Pico Iyer]

Yes. In other words, he'd risked his life to flee Iran and to make a new life for himself in England. And yet, having done that, every single summer, he stole back into Iran to see the hometown and the mosque and most of all, the mother that he loved so much. So, having risked his life to flee Iran, he risked his life every single year to come back to Iran. And it made me think that as long as he'd been in Iran, everything outside Iran, such as Britain, seemed like the great paradise that he aspired to. But having made a lovely new family life for himself in England, suddenly he remembered all he was missing. A part of him and a part of paradise lay in the place that he'd run away from. And maybe the paradise that he was creating for himself was a collage. I suppose it was also a reminder to me that for most of us, our full contentment and realization probably never comes from just one place. It comes from the many places that mean a lot to us and that we love.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I mean, it's an archetypal story convention, right from Dorothy and the wizard of Oz to what I think many of us experienced during the pandemic for those of us who were lucky enough to actually enjoy the stopping of the constant movement and just be home. And it. It felt like, oh, I neglected my own little corner of paradise that actually was right here in my living room.

[Pico Iyer]

Exactly. There's always this sense of a better world, a better life, a better self out there. And I think that's an exciting sense because that's what gives us the energy for aspiration and for not being complacent or too comfortable with the world we have. But I think we have to remember that to some ext. It's an illusion. And I think, just as you suggested, I'm guessing quite a few people realized, wait a minute, there's beauty right down the street. And I think as much as anything, the thought of paradise is a way of reminding yourself how lucky you are, how little we want to take for granted.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

That encounter with his taxi driver taught Pico that different and competing notions of paradise can exist in even within one person. He ends his journey with a trip to India, where his parents are from, and a place he knows well.

[Pico Iyer]

I think a lot of India can be a shock to the system. It's so loud. It's so colorful. It's so crowded. It's this psychedelic intensity that makes you feel that you've entered some other realm of consciousness.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Pico writes that one feels this especially in Varanasi, which is one of the oldest cities in the world and also among the most sacred.

[Pico Iyer]

Varanasi is India to the max as the holy center of Hinduism. And as you walk along the holy river Ganges that flows through Varanasi, night and day, there were these great fires burning to the north and burning to the south that are reducing dead bodies to ash. And as you walk through the narrow alleyways of the old city, people are constantly surging past, carrying their loved ones on stretchers as dead bodies to be committed to the flames or the holy waters. And one of the things that's so striking is that, of course, it's a city of death, but it's also a city of joy. The people who are racing past you are not mourning. They're not in grief. They're so grateful that they can come to the holy place and, I think, ensure moksha, liberation for the loved one who has just passed. So it's a confounding place that really overturns all your simple ideas about the world.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

You describe the river there being absolutely filthy, and yet people drinking from it as though it was wine. You talk about men and children covered in ash, people carrying corpses around with them, fire being everywhere. And there's. To me, it almost felt like there was this porousness to it, you know, that this was the River Styx, the road to the afterlife here on Earth. Is that how you think people see it?

[Pico Iyer]

Yes. That's perfect. And I can't speak for a devout Hindu who would probably put it differently, but I felt, just as you, there aren't many places on the planet that have this kind of mythic intensity where you feel that one's walking along next to the river of Life, and on the far side of the river is whatever unknown awaits us all. And just as you said perfectly, the fact that the holy river is, According to the WHO, contains 3,000 times the amount of bacteria deemed safe for consumption, and that people are bathing in it and even drinking in it, for me, was a very tonic and liberating idea that the holiest place doesn't have to be the purest place, that at some level, most of us can probably never find an immaculate place, a place that's absolutely pure because we're human beings. I think one of the memorable moments that comes to mind as we talk about it is that there was this whole cacophony. And even though I'm Indian, I was really freaked out by it and I suddenly heard two people call my name. And I turned around and were two Tibetan Buddhists I know from New York City. And my friend came up to me and he surveyed the scene of absolute chaos and intensity. And he said, isn't this glorious? This is the whole human pageant. This is life and death and everything in basically, I think he was saying this is the only paradise we can ever hope to find and to make our lives in. The paradises that our minds create are never going to come to fruition in real life. But here is real life to the hilt. And this is the place where we have to live and where we have to find our comfort and delight and warmth. And maybe because he was a monk, he seemed to be doing it. He was just rejoicing in the cacophony.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I want to end by asking you about a quote that you include at the end of your book. You write that I recalled how the Zen teacher Ido Roshi, thinking of the cries of abandonment of Jesus upon the cross, had delivered a teaching that must have unsettled many of his students. It's really this line that I want to ask you about. The quote from Ido Roshi, the Zen teacher, is that the struggle of your life, he'd said, is your paradise. Oh, that's tough words, I think. Pico, tell me how you interpret that.

[Pico Iyer]

It's a very shocking sentence and it's a harsh conclusion for the book. But, you know, I think the good times take care of themselves. I, as a traveler, know that it's not so difficult to find fun and wonder and beauty in the world. It's really the tough times in life that ask difficult questions of us and force us to rise above. Above ourselves. And that notion that it can be in the very struggle that you find your paradise is to me almost more encouraging and inspiring than to say you can find it on a sandy beach. You know, in Japan. When I first went there, I heard. I think it's a Buddhist notion that life is about joyful participation in a world of sorrows, that sorrows are non negotiable. Unfortunately, they come to all of us, but that doesn't preclude the possibility of joy and wonder and hope. And the older I've got and the more I see that even when life is going smoothly, it's full of surprises. Your house suddenly burns down and a pandemic closes down the world and a loved one dies, and then happy surprises too. I've come to think that I want and I have to find my paradise in the middle of my daily life, which is also reassuring because I don't have to travel across the world to find it. I just have to open my eyes to reality and to see life as it really is.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

That was writer Pico Iyer. He is the author of the Half known In Search of Paradise. And you can see all of Pico's previous [e-mail] on the show today, Paradise Lost and Found. I'm Anoush Zamorodi, and you're listening to the TED Radio Hour from npr. Stick with us.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from Carvana. Selling your car. Carvana has offers so good they're almost inexplicable. Sell your car 100% online in minutes. Visit Carvana.com today.

[Capella University Sponsor Announcer]

This message comes from Capella University. That spark you feel, that's your drive. For more. Capella University's flexpath learning format lets you earn your degree at your pace without putting life on pause.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Learn [e-mail] the last time Antonio Mays Sr. Heard from his son, it was in a note the 16 year old left in the family's garage.

[Pico Iyer]

He told me he was going to make me proud.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Antonio Jr. Left home to join a protest in Seattle. A week later, he was shot and killed there.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

I need some arrests made.

[Pico Iyer]

Justice for my son.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Listen to We Keep Us Safe on the embedded podcast from npr. One year ago, Congress eliminated over a billion dollars in funding for public media. Yet we the people, haven't backed down. When you donate to the independent nonprofits that make up the NPR network, we hold the powerful to account together. It's the kind of journalism democracy requires that we, the public, must protect. Join the community of people who power this work. @donate.NPR.org it's the TED Radio Hour from NPR. I'm Anoush Zamarodi. And on today's show, paradise Lost and found and a new vision of what paradise can be on our rapidly changing planet.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Yes, this is what we need to do all over the world in order to face climate change. This is paradise and we have to recognize it.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

This is Ramon Mendez Galine, and he's referring to his home country, Uruguay. Three and a half million people live in this small country on the east coast of South America. But Uruguay has done something extraordinary. It's become a kind of Renewables Paradise. 98% of its electric grid runs on wind, solar and water. It has so much renewable energy that it exports some to its neighbors, Argentina and Brazil. And the country managed to transform itself in Just five years. How? Well, like many stories, this one begins with a crisis. About 15 years ago, Uruguay was in financial trouble. And Ramon was a self described simple university physics professor.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Our economy was growing too fast and the demand was growing very fast.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Here's Ramon Mendez Ghaline on the TED stage.

[Ramon Mendez Galine (continued)]

Fifteen years ago, Uruguay energy sector was going to a deep crisis. Economy was growing at unprecedented rates and poverty was increasing. Was so great, of course, but at the same time, energy demand was growing rapidly, which was not so great. Uruguay has no proven reserve of fossil fuels. We have already used our large rivers to start hydropower plants. And our two neighbors were having their own difficulties to supply internal demand. So it was not easy for them to help us in dry years when you have to import much more fossil fuels. Or we were forced to import electricity from our neighbors at extraordinary prices, cost overruns could be as high as $1 billion. And for a small economy like Uruguay, this is 2% of its GDP. And we're still, we're beginning to have blackouts. We're living the perfect storm. But crisis is also opportunity.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Can we go back to 15 years ago? The reality at the time was energy costs were soaring, there were blackouts, and you didn't see a way forward for the country.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Yeah.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

And what was your idea to change it, to take me through what, what you thought needed to change.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

So I dramatically changed my, my work and I began to be involved in the energy issue. This is what I did after writing my thoughts and then the paper and ended up with a comprehensive proposal for what my country could do in order to be aware of these difficulties. And the surprise was that these propos had reached my president of my country. And one day me, as a simple university professor had received a phone call inviting me to be the political responsible of our energy agency. And well, I did something crazy.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

I accepted that is a little crazy. You get a call from the president and you became the country's national director of energy and you made a plan to shift Uruguay from fossil fuels to renewables. But how did you explain it to people?

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Absolutely. So renewables are the best option not only for the global climate issue, but also at a national level, because it reduce costs, it stabilize cost, it has the most sovereignty for your country, it creates a lot of jobs. So it's overall the best solution. So what I try to do is just to fix a new national narrative. This is crucial. This is not just to fight against climate change, this is because it's the best solution. The most difficult point was not to convince that this was the best. But to make it work, this was a more difficult point. And you know what? Many, many colleagues from the government at that time, they're still saying, to be honest, Ramon, we never believed what we were saying. We let you go because you didn't have any other options. So, okay, why not? Let's try it. Why not? But I knew that it was possible.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Do you remember the first time you went to visit a solar field and saw it for yourself, actually collecting energy?

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Oh, yes, of course. Yes, absolutely, absolutely. The very first one was a very small solar farm of only 2 hectares. This means it was only about 1 megawatt, almost nothing. It's very close to the largest hydropower plant in the country, and it has a very beautiful park surrounding. And I thought it was a very symbolic thing to have, because hydropower is the best of our country and the future is solar.

[Ramon Mendez Galine (continued)]

In just five years, we went to an almost completely decarbonized one that already in 2017 was 98% renewable. What makes Uruguayan Cage unique is that almost half, half of that electricity is obtained from non traditional renewable sources. Wind, solar and sustainable biomass. Wind alone can produce up to 40% of the total electricity consumed in the country in a year, a percentage comparable to the other world wind champion, denmark. But also 15 or even 20% of our electricity is obtained with sustainable biomass. Of course, none of this was easy. We have to innovate. We have to understand that such a power system requires the planning and operation quite different than the traditional one. Our academics worked for years to design a groundbreaking software to handle energy dispatch, specifically designed to manage intermittent sources such as wind and solar, but also how to use water. This allows us, for example, to have a prediction of the amount of wind electricity and solar electricity that we're going to have in the grid with a week in advance. And this also allows us to know how and when we have to use water from the dams.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

You are not in government anymore, but you have kind of taken your message and what you've learned on the road. You're on the international stage talking to all kinds of people, and they must ask you, what do you wish you knew? What do we need to know? If we want to take some of the lessons from Uruguay and apply them to our own countries, what do you tell them?

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

Well, the message is very simple. The message is, first, there is a solution right now which is the best solution at our national level. There is a solution which creates jobs, which reduce cost, which makes you independent of fluctuation of the prices of energy commodities. And the second message is, it works. All our power systems had been designed having in mind fossil power plants. And this is not a problem. I mean, this is just history.

[Ramon Mendez Galine (continued)]

This is what we had developed all over the world.

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

So if we want to run a system which is driven by renewable sources but intermittent sources, planning is absolutely crucial. Public policies are crucial. But we prove in Uruguay that it's the best solution and it works. That's it. Nothing more than that.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

So what does the future look like for you?

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

It's not just having renewable electricity. It's much more than that. To ask ourselves every day, why am I buying something, why am I consuming something? And what makes me happy? And I'm very happy of living in this country and not consuming fossil fuels or impacting the climate. But this is not enough. This is just one part of our road and we should focus much more on the way we consume and the way we transport ourselves. And once again, why make us happy in life?

[Anoush Zamorodi]

What makes you happy, Ramon?

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

What's making me happy is trying to be part of a global process to live a better world for our kids. I'm happy every morning when I see that what we have succeeded to do in Uruguay can be replicated elsewhere and is receiving such an important recognition is not just wishful thinking. It's real. And so this makes me happy.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

That was Ramon Mendez Galine. He's the executive director of Associacion Ivy, a nonprofit working on a sustainable future. You can see Ramon's full [e-mail] on the show today. Paradise lost and found. And sometimes paradise can be the right mix of people at the time you need them most. After a near fatal accident, Ramona Pearson wasn't sure she would ever recover. But she ended up finding a safe haven where she least expected it. A senior citizen's home. Here she is on the TED stage. In 2011, when I was 22 years

[Ramona Pearson]

old, I. I came home from work, put a leash on my dog and went for my usual run. While I was preparing my dog for the run, a man was finishing drinking at a bar, picked up his car keys, got into a car and headed south or wherever he was. I was running across the street and the only thing that I actually remember is feeling like a grenade went off in my head. What had happened is he ran a red light and hit me. My dog, she ended up underneath the car. I flew out in front of the car and then he ran over my legs. I had no idea what was going on, but strangers intervened, kept my heart moving, beating. I say Moving because it was quivering and they were trying to put a beat back into it. Somebody was smart and put a big pin in my neck to open up my airway so that I could get some air in there. Somehow I ended up at the hospital. I was wrapped in ice and then eventually put into a drug induced coma. 18 months later, I woke up. I was blind. I couldn't speak, and I couldn't walk. I was 64 pounds. I had more than 50 surgeries, but who's counting? Eventually, the hospital decided it was time for me to go. They needed to open up space for somebody else they thought could come back from whatever they were going through. Everybody lost faith in me being able to recover. So they basically put a map up on the wall, threw a dart, and it landed at a senior home here in Colorado. And I know all of you are scratching your head. A senior citizen's home. What in the world are you going to do there? But if you think about all of the skills and talent that are in this room right now, that's what a senior home has. The one advantage that they had over most of you is wisdom, because they had a long life, and I needed that wisdom at that moment in my life. But imagine what it was like for them when I showed up at their doorstep. At that point, I had gained four pounds, so it was 68. I was bald, wearing hospital scrubs, and I had a white cane in one hand and a suitcase full of medical records in another hand. And the senior citizens realized that they needed to have an emergency meeting. So they pulled back and they were looking at each other and they were going, okay, what skills do we have in this room? This kid needs a lot of work. They eventually started matching their talents and skills to all of my needs. But one of the first things they needed to do was assess what I needed right away, which I needed to figure out how to eat like a normal human being, since I'd been eating through a tube in my chest and then through my veins. And then they had to figure out, well, she needs furniture. So they went to their storage lockers and all gathered their extra furniture, gave me pots and pans, blankets, everything. The next thing that I needed was a makeover. So out went the green scrubs and in came the polyester and floral prints. We're not going to talk about the hairstyles that they tried to force on me once my hair grew back, But I did say no to the blue hair. So eventually they decided that, well, I need to learn to speak. And I had to learn how to coordinate my new throat with my tongue and my new teeth and my lips. And I was an adult and it was embarrassing. So I acted like a two year old and refused to work. But the men, they were going to make it fun for me. So they were teaching me cuss word scrapple at night and then secretly how to swear like a sailor. So I'm going to just leave it to your imagination as to what my first words were. And a former teacher who happened to have Alzheimer's took on the task of teaching me to write. The redundancy was actually good for me, so we'll just keep moving on. One of the pivotal times for me was actually learning to cross the street again as a blind person. So there were two obstacles I had to get through. One was post traumatic stress disorder. Every time I approached the curb, I would panic. And the second one was actually trying to figure out how to cross that street. So one of the seniors just came up to me and she pushed me up to the corner and she said, when you think it's time to go, just stick the cane out there. If it's hit, don't cross the street. Made perfect sense. But by the third cane that went whizzing across the road, they realized that they needed to put their resources together and they raised funds that I could gain the skills to be a blind person and also to go get a guide dog who transformed my life. I was able to return to college because of the senior citizens who invested in me and also the guide dog and the skills that I had gained. Ten years later, I gained my sight back. Not magically, and I opted in for three surgeries. And one of them was experimental. The biggest change for me was looking down at my hands and seeing that I'd lost 10 years of my life. I thought that time had stood still for some reason and moved on for family and friends. But when I looked down, I realized that time marched on for me too. We didn't have words like crowdsourcing and radical collaboration when I had my accident, but the concept held true. People working with people to rebuild me. People working with people to re educate me. I wouldn't be standing here today if it wasn't for extreme, radical collaboration. Thank you so much.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

That was Ramona Pearson. She's the founder of several tech startups and you can see her full [e-mail] thanks so much for listening to our show Paradise Lost and Found. Before we go, I want to let you know about my newsletter, which is about my own expertise how to live better with our technology for our mental and physical health. The newsletter is called Body Electric, and it builds on the podcast series we did last year. Please join me and more than 40,000 other [e-mail] body electric newsletter. It means a lot, so thank you. This episode was produced by James Delahusy, Matthew Cloutier, Andrea Gutierrez, and Harsha Nahada. It was edited by Sanaz Meshkinpour and me. Our production staff at NPR also includes Rachel Faulkner White, Fiona Guerin, and Katie Monteleone. Irene Noguchi is our executive producer. Our audio engineers were Gilly Moon, Robert Rodriguez, Neil Tivo, and Margaret Luthar. Our theme music was written by Ramtin Arablouei. Our partners at TED are Chris Anderson, Michelle Quint, Alejandra Salazar, and Daniela Belarozzo. I'm Minouche Zamorodi, and you've been listening to the TED Radio Hour from npr.

[Capella University Sponsor Announcer]

This message comes from Capella University. That spark you feel, that's your drive for more. Capella University's flexpath learning format lets you earn your degree at your pace without putting life on pause. Learn [e-mail]. this message comes from Instacart. Instacart makes grocery shopping easier. And just because you're not doing the shopping yourself doesn't mean you don't care how it's done. With Instacart Shopper Notes, you can add details about what you want right in the app, like extra crispy rotisserie chicken or lettuce you'd pick yourself. Just leave a note so your shopper can get it right without having to ask. Download the Instacart app and shop.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Today this week on the NPR Politics podcast, President Trump it is the greatest

[Ramon Mendez Galine]

threat to our country.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

It's trying to tie Democrats to communism,

[Pico Iyer]

including World War II or even 9, 11. Both he and his team feel this is resonating with his base.

[Anoush Zamorodi]

Why the White House is pushing communism as a new line of attack ahead

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

of this year's midterms.

[George Whitesides]

Listen now on the NPR Politics Podcast.