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Capital One Bank Guy
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Anuj Tana
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Elise Hu
This episode of TED Talks Daily is brought to you by upwork. Scaling a business means solving for today and preparing for what? What's next. And to do that, well, you need the right talent at the right moment. That's where upwork comes in. Whether you're looking for support in design, development, marketing, or AI, upwork connects you with highly skilled freelancers who are ready to hit the ground running. For over 20 years, Upwork has been creating a better way to work, helping companies of all sizes tap into a global marketplace of trusted experts. You can post a job for free, browse profiles, even get help crafting your job post or book a consultation for from start to finish, upwork makes hiring more flexible, more affordable, and more efficient. So if you need an extra pair of hands or 10, visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That's Upwork.com to post your job for free and connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's upwork.com upwork.com you're listening to TED Talks Daily, where we bring you new ideas to spark your curiosity every day. I'm your host, Elise Hu. Africa's informal economies and its vibrant hustle culture aren't broken, but instead they're a brilliant space for creativity, community and grit. That's according to entrepreneur and investor Anuj Tana, who started and led Mesh, Africa's first social media platform for hustle culture. In his talk, he shares why he believes we shouldn't be trying to fix informal economies, but rather unlock their true potential. It's coming up.
Anuj Tana
All right. So get a degree, get a job, build your future. No matter where you're from. It's like page one of the universal parenting handbooks. And if you grew up with parents, anything like mine, you knew it was one of those just casual, non negotiable suggestions that they had for you. But no matter what our parents might say, it's a path that for so many, just doesn't hold up. Not here in Kenya, not across the world. Every month, more than a million young people enter the workforce across sub Saharan Africa. For fewer than one in four will get access to a formal job. And at first glance, it looks a lot like a crisis, right? Like this jobless generation. Honestly, I used to see it that way too. I'm a third generation East African. I've always believed in the power of business and technology to fuel development. For the longest time, I thought that meant one helping to create formal jobs. But after more than a decade of working with young people here in Kenya, I started to see something very different, right? People like Kelvin running his cyber cafe, or Melissa with her hair salon, or Mercy with her auto repair shop. And the thing is, they are not outliers. They're part of this powerful engine. Millions of young people contributing over $540 million a month into Kenya's economy. The informal economy is an engine that is already turning. It's how 85% of people across Sub Saharan Africa and 60% of the global workforce earn an income. So a few years ago, a couple of colleagues and I decided to take a step back, ask ourselves a different question. Not how do we pull people out of the informal economy, but what if we invested in it and helped it grow more efficiently and at scale? And that's what led us to build mesh in 2021. It's this platform to help this hustle economy grow. It's a professional social network where Today more than 800,000 micro entrepreneurs come to connect and learn and trade and access a marketplace of opportunities each month. And the thing is, as we built mesh, we started to see these patterns and behaviors start to emerge that often challenged some of our long held assumptions, but also revealed some of the levers that really drive growth in the informal economy. And so I wanted to take this opportunity to share three of our big lessons with you today. Because if we're serious about building a sustainable future, we can't ignore the billions navigating the informal sector. So our first and honestly, possibly coolest lesson that we've learned is that the most powerful lever for income growth in the informal economy is identity. See, young people have been told an incredibly unhelpful story for most of their life, that success means getting a formal job. And when that path doesn't open up, it can be paralyzing. But when identity shifts, behavior shifts. So when they stop seeing themselves as unemployed or jobless and actually as entrepreneurs, things change and pretty quickly. So take Brian. Brian studied to be a teacher, but he spent years bouncing between gigs. And he will be the first to tell you, he never saw himself as someone who could run a business. One day he was chatting with a connection he made on the platform, a woman named Eunice. At some point she said, honestly, Brian just why not business? Something eventually just clicked for him. He said, I started admiring her business. I thought maybe I could do that too. And so he did. He started small, selling fruit, then donuts, Then he moved into charcoal. Today Brian is running three small businesses and he's saving up for his own permanent stall. And Brian wasn't alone. When we started measuring this more closely, we were blown away by just how powerful this shift in identity could actually be. 78% of our mesh members were telling us that they had either started a brand new business or improved by adding to an existing one, often within just a couple of months of signing up for the platform. And amongst that group, the number earning more than national minimum wage, more than double. So when I see myself differently, I act differently. And when that happens amongst our peers, that change can often be contagious. So our second big lesson was really about the importance of designing for the real world. And the best example of that that I have is how we approach skills development. So most programs aimed at the informal economy assume that growth looks a lot like a ladder, right? You, you know, study hard, get a certificate, use that to get the job, to build credentials to move up step by step. And so the learning systems are all designed to match this, right? You know, longer courses, modules, quizzes, formal learning pathways. That's how we approached it too. The problem is that's not how growth really happens in the informal economy. Growth here is often entirely non linear. It's, it's characterized by rapidly shifting needs or new opportunities that you need to jump on. It looks a lot less like a ladder and it looks a lot more like a jungle gym. My favorite example of this is Caroline. Caroline graduated with a degree in analytical chemistry, but she could not find a job. She started a business selling clothes, saved up some money. Fashion wasn't her thing, but she spotted a new opportunity that she really loved, hair. And so she invested in a one month wig making class and she just ran with it she built a business. She picked up pricing tips from other measures. She learned digital marketing skills to build and grow her online sales when she needed to. She picked up basic bookkeeping to help her manage her cash flow. Today, Caroline's a full time entrepreneur, but she didn't climb a ladder. She moved across this jungle gym, one business and one pivot at a time. And all along the way, she invested in the skills she needed to keep her growing. And we saw this happening all across the platform. Young people were not engaging with our formal learning tools, but their incomes were growing. So 66% of our measures tell us that they have learned a new skill which has improved their business on the platform. But not from a course, often from a peer. Another micro entrepreneur just two steps ahead, just sharing what they'd figured out. And the learning itself, it's so practical, it's so immediate. It's like a 90 second video on how to price your sandals or a group chat on how to save water in your agribusiness. One of our favorites, why bad loans are a lot like bad boyfriends and how to spot the red flags. It is learning that just mirrors real life. So our third lesson is a pretty fundamental one. It's about trust. In the informal economy, there are no contracts or insurance policies or formal protections. If a deal goes wrong, it's on you. Take Alfine. Alfine trained to be a photographer. She saved up painstakingly to get her first camera. And one day a client reached out. They paid a deposit. It seemed legitimate. She showed up for the shoot and within minutes her gear was stolen. It set her back. She was set up and she had to start all over again. And this is why a lot of micro entrepreneurs, they choose to play it. They stick to trusted circles. And when we ask our MESH members, how do you know who you can actually trust? The word that we hear most often is serious. I look for serious people. I knew he was a serious guy. It's shorthand, right? For someone reliable, for someone who shows up. But we wanted to understand that a little bit better. So we ran an experiment. It was really simple. We brought 30 micro entrepreneurs into a room. No profiles, no CVs. Everyone got a blank poster and a marker just to describe who they were in their own words. And then everyone got five post it notes to put on the profiles of the individuals that they would most like to work with and to tell us why. And consistently, the most sought after profiles weren't the ones with the highest education weren't or the most established businesses. They Were the ones who wrote about helping others, mentoring peers, supporting their communities, the ones with social capital? Because in the informal sector, trust and reliability aren't about what you have, they're about what you contribute. Seriously. And that kind of social capital is what makes the informal sector function, Right? It's how you know who you can work with, lend to, buy from. The problem is it isn't really bankable beyond your immediate circle, and unfortunately, least of all at the bank itself. But that is a massive opportunity, because when young people are able to build visible, trusted identities online that showcase all the ways that they show up, it unlocks a whole new world of peer to peer trade and a massive opportunity for the formal world, right? So for lenders, for corporates, for organizations that are looking to assess trustworthiness, if we lean into these models, all of a sudden we can begin to lend with more confidence or find talent or offer gigs in ways that just have not been possible before. So in the informal economy, what we're seeing is that this is absolutely working, right? Today, when we do surveys, markets are expanding on mesh. 49% of our audience are telling us that they have now begun to work with and earn from other mesh members on the platform. And what we're seeing isn't just a way to facilitate trade or establish trust in the informal sector. It's a glimpse into how more resilient economies could work. Because when we think about a world facing climate constraints or rising inequalities, economies that reward this type of contribution, rather than just consumption might be one of the most sustainable shifts that we can actually make. Look, honestly, we've learned a ton over the last five years. The most important lesson is the informal economy is not a problem to be solved. It is this phenomenally powerful engine to be supported. And I'm not saying jobs don't matter. Of course they do. Right? But the road to those jobs and to broader economic growth might just run through the informal economy first. And what we're seeing goes beyond mesh. So from digital lenders experimenting with social and behavioral data, to renewable energy companies leveraging community distribution models to expand their reach and sales, when we design for the informal economy, we unlock massive new possibilities. And whether that is growing new markets or expanding livelihoods or even accelerating climate action, this generation and the economy that they power are central to all of it. So the solutions that we build have to work for them here and now. And so the real opportunity here isn't to fix the informal economy. It's to fuel it. Thank you.
Elise Hu
That was anuj Tana speaking at TED Countdown Summit Nairobi in Kenya in 2025. If you're curious about Ted's curation, find out more@ted.com curationguidelines and that's it for today's show. TED Talks Daily is part of the TED Audio Collective. This episode was produced and edited by our team, Martha Estefanos, Oliver Friedman, Brian Greene, Lucy Little, Alejandra Salazar and Tonsika Sarmarnivon. It was mixed by Christopher Faizy Bo Additional support from Emma Tobner and Daniela Belarrazo. I'm Elise Hu. I'll be back tomorrow with a fresh idea for your feed. Thanks for listening.
Capital One Bank Guy
Banking with Capital One helps you keep more money in your wallet with no fees or minimums on checking accounts and no overdraft fees. Just ask the Capital One bank guy. It's pretty much all he talks about in a good way. He'd also tell you that this podcast is his favorite podcast too. Ah, really? Thanks Capital One Bank Guy. What's in your wallet? Term supply See CapitalOne.com Bank Capital One NA Member FDIC founders Are you tired of bidding on your own brand keywords to stay relevant in paid search? Well, we have the solution for you. More than half of podcast listeners say they're more likely to buy a product after a host endorses it on their podcast. Meaning instead of paying for clicks, half of which are bots, let's be honest, you're paying for attention and trust that actually converts to sales. We at Adopter Media are committed to the idea that you don't need 5 million listeners, you need the right 50,000. If you're ready to start aiming with precision, book your free intro call and a custom 30 60, 90 day plan at adopter Media. Again, that's Adopter Media podcast advertising that works. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever think about switching insurance companies to see if you could save some cash? Progressive makes it easy to see if you could save when you bundle your home and auto policies. Try it@progressive.com Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states.
Host: TED
Speaker: Anuj Tana
Release Date: August 12, 2025
In this compelling episode of TED Talks Daily, entrepreneur and investor Anuj Tana challenges the conventional wisdom that a corporate job is the primary pathway to success. Speaking at the TED Countdown Summit in Nairobi, Kenya, Anuj argues that Africa's informal economies are not a problem to be fixed but a vibrant engine of growth and innovation. He emphasizes the immense potential within these informal sectors and outlines strategies to unlock their true capabilities.
Anuj begins by highlighting the staggering statistics that paint a picture of the informal economy's vastness:
“These economies aren’t just surviving; they’re thriving and driving substantial economic contributions,” Anuj notes (02:37).
In response to these challenges, Anuj and his team developed Mesh in 2021—a professional social network tailored to Africa’s hustle culture. Mesh serves as a platform for:
Anuj shares, “Mesh is not just a platform; it’s a movement to support and scale the informal economy” (02:37).
Anuj underscores the transformative impact of identity on economic behavior:
Notable Quote: “When identity shifts, behavior shifts. So when they stop seeing themselves as unemployed or jobless and actually as entrepreneurs, things change and pretty quickly.” (03:15)
Case Study: Brian
Anuj presents data showing that 78% of Mesh members have either started new businesses or expanded existing ones shortly after joining, with many doubling their income.
Traditional skill development programs often follow a linear, ladder-like progression, which doesn’t align with the dynamic nature of the informal economy.
Notable Quote: “Growth here is often entirely non-linear. It’s characterized by rapidly shifting needs or new opportunities that you need to jump on. It looks a lot less like a ladder and it looks a lot more like a jungle gym.” (07:05)
Anuj highlights that 66% of Mesh members have learned new skills that directly improve their businesses, primarily through peer interactions rather than formal education programs. This grassroots, practical approach ensures that learning is immediate and relevant.
Trust is paramount in the informal economy, where formal contracts and insurance are often absent.
Notable Quote: “In the informal economy, trust and reliability aren't about what you have, they're about what you contribute.” (12:20)
Anuj explores how Mesh fosters trust through:
He envisions a future where digital platforms can extend this trust beyond immediate circles, enabling peer-to-peer trade and secure transactions on a larger scale.
Anuj concludes by advocating for the support and expansion of the informal economy as a cornerstone for sustainable development:
Notable Quote: “The real opportunity here isn't to fix the informal economy. It's to fuel it.” (14:00)
Anuj emphasizes that leveraging the strengths of the informal economy can unlock massive new possibilities for growth, inclusion, and sustainability.
Anuj Tana’s insightful talk redefines success by highlighting the critical role of Africa’s informal economies. By shifting identities, designing adaptable growth models, and building trust through social capital, platforms like Mesh can empower millions of micro-entrepreneurs. This approach not only addresses unemployment but also fosters a resilient and innovative economic landscape poised for sustainable growth.
Final Thought: “If we're serious about building a sustainable future, we can't ignore the billions navigating the informal sector.” (14:35)
Produced and Edited by: Martha Estefanos, Oliver Friedman, Brian Greene, Lucy Little, Alejandra Salazar, and Tonsika Sarmarnivon.
Mixed by: Christopher Faizy Bo
Additional Support: Emma Tobner and Daniela Belarrazo.
For more curated insights from TED, visit TED.com/curation.