Elon Musk: 1-on-1 Exclusive at the White House-DOGE, AI, Trump, Mars & Killer Robots (Part 1)

Summary

Elon Musk Exposes Government Corruption and Discusses AI at The 47 Morning Update

The 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson, hosted by Ben Ferguson and Senator Ted Cruz, featured an exclusive, in-depth interview with Elon Musk on March 17, 2025. Filmed at the White House, this episode delves into Musk's revelations about corruption within the federal government, government waste, AI advancements, and his personal insights on his evolving public image.

---

1. Unveiling Government Corruption and Waste

a. The Extent of Corruption

Elon Musk began by addressing the alarming levels of corruption and inefficiency within the federal government. Comparing the government's disarray to being in "a room where the walls, the roof, and the floor are all targets," Musk emphasized the daunting challenge of reforming such a system.

• Musk [02:48]: "It's hard to compete with the federal government."

He elaborated that the government's poor management presents more opportunities for significant improvement, as a well-run entity would inherently resist change.

• Musk [02:55]: "It is worse than I expected. But on the plus side, that means there's more opportunity for improvement."

b. Case Studies of Mismanagement

Musk highlighted specific instances of government excess, such as the over-allocation of software licenses and media subscriptions. He revealed that every government department has more licenses than the number of employees, leading to substantial financial waste.

• Musk [03:59]: "In every government department... far too many software licenses and media subscriptions."

Similarly, he pointed out the over-issuance of government credit cards, noting that the number of cards far exceeds the number of employees, with high credit limits often going unused.

• Musk [04:54]: "We found that there are twice as many credit cards as there are humans."

c. High-Profile Frauds

Musk criticized the allocation of $1.9 billion to Stacey Abrams' nonprofit, alleging it was a major scam involving lavish salaries and misuse of funds under the guise of legitimate projects.

• Musk [06:16]: "It's just obviously one of the biggest scam portholes we've uncovered."

He further introduced the concept of "magic money" computers—autonomous systems that issue trillions in payments without proper oversight, exacerbating financial discrepancies.

• Musk [08:46]: "14 magic money computers. They just send money out of nothing."

d. Musk's DOGE Initiative

Musk discussed his DOGE initiative, aimed at combating government waste and fraud through technological intervention. He projected that DOGE could save a trillion dollars by Fiscal Year 2026 if allowed to continue unimpeded.

• Musk [12:52]: "I'm reasonably confident that we'll be able to get a trillion dollars of waste and fraud out."

He emphasized extreme transparency, with all actions documented on DOGE.gov and social media, countering criticisms by asserting the effectiveness of DOGE in cutting fraudulent left-wing programs targeting illegal immigrants.

• Musk [13:17]: "We put it on the website."

---

2. Impact on the Political Landscape

a. Electoral Manipulation through Fraudulent Entitlements

Musk warned that Democrats' reliance on fraudulent entitlements for illegal immigrants aims to secure long-term political power by creating voter blocs dependent on government handouts.

• Musk [16:27]: "And it doesn't take much to turn the swing states blue."

He suggested this strategy would lead to a permanent shift toward a "deep blue socialist state," as controlled voter demographics would undermine swing states and solidify Democratic dominance.

• Musk [16:57]: "The House, the Senate, the presidency and the Supreme Court will all go hardcore down."

b. Personal Experiences Reflecting Political Bias

Musk shared personal anecdotes, such as the near-collapse of Tesla due to COVID restrictions in California, highlighting the political biases against him and his enterprises.

• Musk [17:51]: "The COVID actions almost killed Tesla because every other auto plant in the country was allowed to open, but ours, which was in California, was not allowed to open."

---

3. Public Image and Threats

a. Shift from Admiration to Hatred

Musk acknowledged the dramatic shift in his public image, from being hailed as a tech visionary to becoming a target of extreme hatred. He attributed this shift to the success of DOGE in exposing government fraud, which antagonized left-wing factions.

• Musk [14:36]: "DOGE is being effective and DOGE is getting rid of a lot of ways before people on the left were taking advantage of."

b. Organized Threats and Attacks

Addressing the increasing threats against him and his businesses, Musk speculated that domestic left-wing organizations and billionaire networks like ActBlue orchestrate these assaults.

• Musk [19:31]: "At least some of it is organized and paid for, I think by domestic left wing organizations in America."

Musk: "ActBlue is a huge scam. Next level." [21:14]

---

4. AI and Future Technologies

a. The Rise of Artificial Intelligence

Musk shared his vision of AI surpassing human cognitive abilities within the next decade, accompanied by the proliferation of humanoid robots and widespread autonomous vehicles.

• Musk [22:49]: "In 10 years, probably 90% of miles driven will be autonomous."

b. Economic Implications

He discussed the economic landscape, predicting that goods and services would become nearly free due to AI and robotics. While this could lead to a higher standard of living, Musk raised concerns about societal fulfillment and purpose in a highly automated world.

• Musk [24:02]: "Goods and services will become close to free... the challenge will be fulfillment."

c. Existential Risks of AI

Addressing the darker potentials of AI, Musk estimated a 10-20% chance of killer robots annihilating humanity within 5-10 years but remained cautiously optimistic about AI fostering extreme prosperity.

• Musk [24:54]: "In 10 years, probably almost [AI] will be smarter than the smartest human."

d. Geopolitical Control Over AI

Musk emphasized the critical importance of America maintaining control over AI chip production. He warned that geopolitical tensions, such as a potential Chinese invasion of Taiwan, could disrupt global AI advancements.

• Musk [26:36]: "If they were to invade in the near term, the world would be cut off from advanced AI chips."

---

5. Personal Reflections and Legacy

When asked about his legacy, Musk expressed a desire to be remembered for SpaceX’s achievement in sending humans to Mars, highlighting his commitment to interplanetary exploration.

• Musk [27:41]: "If SpaceX got humans to Mars, that's what they would remember me for."

---

6. Cultural Preferences and Light-hearted Interactions

The interview concluded with lighter questions about Musk's preferences between "Star Wars" and "Star Trek," favoring "Empire Strikes Back" and the original "Star Trek" films. The hosts engaged in humorous banter, adding a personable touch to the intense discussions.

• Musk [28:51]: "Empire Strikes Back."
• Musk [29:26]: "Wrath of Khan."

---

7. Conclusion

The episode wrapped up with a teaser for part two of the interview, promising further revelations on government corruption and Musk’s ongoing initiatives.

---

Notable Quotes

1. Elon Musk [02:48]: "It's hard to compete with the federal government."
2. Elon Musk [03:59]: "In every government department... far too many software licenses and media subscriptions."
3. Elon Musk [06:04]: "You're not supposed to get it, but the government sent it to you and nobody from the government asked for it back."
4. Elon Musk [08:46]: "14 magic money computers. They just send money out of nothing."
5. Elon Musk [12:52]: "I'm reasonably confident that we'll be able to get a trillion dollars of waste and fraud out."
6. Elon Musk [16:56]: "If the Dems can bring in 200,000 illegals... it will no longer be a swing state."
7. Elon Musk [19:31]: "At least some of it is organized and paid for, I think by domestic left wing organizations in America."
8. Elon Musk [24:54]: "In 10 years, probably almost [AI] will be smarter than the smartest human."

---

Insights and Analysis

The interview with Elon Musk provides a critical examination of federal government inefficiencies, presenting a compelling case for technological interventions like DOGE to enhance transparency and accountability. Musk's candid revelations about government waste and fraud underscore the need for systemic reforms. Additionally, his insights into AI and robotics highlight the dual-edged nature of technological advancements—promising unprecedented prosperity while posing significant existential risks.

Musk's portrayal as both a tech visionary and a political target reflects the polarizing impact of his initiatives. His warnings about electoral manipulation and the strategic use of fraudulent entitlements by political factions add a layer of urgency to the conversation about governance and democracy.

For listeners, this episode offers a thought-provoking exploration of government accountability, the ethical implications of AI, and the personal challenges faced by a prominent figure in the tech industry.

---

Note: This summary captures the essence of the podcast episode, focusing on key discussions, insights, and notable quotes with proper attribution and timestamps, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the episode.

Transcript

[Ted Cruz]

Welcome. It is verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you. And today is a very special day as we are doing part one of our two part conversation at the White House with Elon Musk. Now, Elon is going to break news during today and Wednesday's show on Doge and some credible shocking information about corruption within our government. I want to make sure you hit that subscribe button, that auto download button right now so you do Not Miss Part 2 on Wednesday. Also, please help this go viral as we're exposing government waste by sharing this episode on any social media platform that you are on. But before we get to that, after more than a year of war, terror and pain in Israel, the need for security essentials and support for first responders is still critical. Even in times of ceasefire. Israel must be prepared for the next attack when wherever it may come from, as Israel is surrounded by enemies on all sides, that is where the international fellowship of Christians and Jews and you come in. They are the ones that help give the support that is needed and the people of Israel need now more than ever before, life saving security essentials. And your gift today will help save lives by providing bomb shelters, armored security vehicles and ambulances, firefighting equipment, flak jackets and bulletproof vests and so much more. Your generous donation today will help ensure the people of Israel Israel are safe and secure in the days to come. So give a gift to bless Israel and her people by visiting support IFCJ.org that's one word. Support IFCJ.org or call 888-488ICJ. That's 888-488 IFCJ 888-488-4325 or support IFCJ.org so without any further ado, here is part one of our sit down conversation at the White House with Elon Musk.

[Ben Ferguson]

Well, we're in the White House right now and we're here with my friend Elon Musk, who really has not been doing much of anything, has not made any news, is. And nobody has noticed. Yeah, the impact. Welcome, Elon.

[Elon Musk]

Thank you.

[Ben Ferguson]

Holy crap.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. Wow.

[Ben Ferguson]

Let me just say, never a dull moment. Never a dull moment. The first 50 days the President has spent in office over the top and the first 50 days you've spent, I don't think there's ever been anyone to have an impact the way you have. Let me start with a question. You know a lot about which was worse, the mess you found at Twitter or the mess you found in the federal government?

[Elon Musk]

Well, it's hard to Compete with the federal government.

[Ben Ferguson]

What surprised you about the federal government? I assume you came in and assumed it was bad. Is it worse than you expected?

[Elon Musk]

It is worse than I expected. But on the plus side, that means there's more opportunity for improvement. So if you look on the bright side, there's actually a lot of opportunity for improvement in federal government expenditures. Because it's so bad, if it was a well run ship, it would be very difficult to improve. So now it's like if people say, well, how will you figure out how to save money in the federal government? Well, it's like being in a room where the, the walls, the roof and the floor are all targets. So we shoot in any direction. Yeah. And you're can't miss. Wow. Again, I'm sure you would agree.

[Ben Ferguson]

So a lot of folks have talked about, like, you can't miss.

[Elon Musk]

You can't miss. Yeah, just go any direction.

[Ben Ferguson]

A lot of the crazy expenditures, things like 2 million bucks for sex change, surgeries in Guatemala, an essential ascension, you know, transgendered mice and Sesame street in Iraq, a lot of that has gotten attention. But some of the stuff you've told me about, like, tell us about computer licenses and government agencies.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. So most of what Doge is finding, you don't need to be Sherlock Holmes. Okay. It's very obvious. Basic stuff. So in every government department, I say every, because we've not yet found a single exception, There are far too many software licenses and media subscriptions, meaning many more software licenses and media subscriptions than there are humans in the department.

[Ben Ferguson]

Like you were saying, like an agency with 15,000 people might have 30,000 licenses.

[Elon Musk]

Yes.

[Ben Ferguson]

And even of the 15,000 employees, a good chunk of them hadn't used the license, had never logged on or used the application.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. We found entire situations of software licenses or media subscriptions where there were zero.

[Ben Ferguson]

Logins, and yet we were paying for it.

[Elon Musk]

Yes, the government was paying for thousands of licenses of software or media subscriptions and no one had ever logged in even once.

[Ben Ferguson]

Or like credit cards, you found the same thing with government credit cards.

[Elon Musk]

We found that there are twice as many credit cards as there are humans. And I still don't have a good explanation for why this is the case. And these are $10,000 limit cards, so it's a lot of money.

[Ted Cruz]

Is it incompetent that you're finding, or is this like the biggest money laundering scheme in the history of the world that you're finding?

[Elon Musk]

Look, I think it's mostly. If you say, look, what's the waste to Fraud ratio, in my opinion, it's like 80% waste, 20% fraud. But you do have these sort of gray areas.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Ted Cruz]

Example.

[Elon Musk]

Example would be. So we saw a lot of payments going out of treasury that had no payment code and no explanation for the payment. And then we'd try to figure out what that payment is. And we'd see that, ok, that contract was supposed to be shut off, but someone forgot to shut off that contract. And so the company kept getting money.

[Ted Cruz]

Wow.

[Elon Musk]

Now is that waste or fraud?

[Ben Ferguson]

Both.

[Ted Cruz]

Both?

[Elon Musk]

Yeah.

[Ted Cruz]

You know, you're getting something you're not supposed to get.

[Elon Musk]

You're not supposed to get it, but you. But the government sent it to you and nobody from the government asked for it back. Take for example, the one. The $1.9 billion given to Stacey Abrams. A fake NGO.

[Ben Ferguson]

Utter insanity.

[Ted Cruz]

Explain it.

[Ben Ferguson]

That's just corrupt. I think that's paying off cronies at that point, 1,000%. Yeah, yeah. And by the way, she knew like when you get $2 billion, you don't miss that. That's not an accident.

[Elon Musk]

Allegedly. It was for like, you know, environmentally friendly appliances or something. And they've given like 100 appliances so far for $2 billion. It's a very expensive toaster, one hell of an appliance.

[Ben Ferguson]

That's something. Zero fridge boy. It's nice.

[Elon Musk]

It's just obviously one of the biggest scam portholes we've uncovered, which is really crazy, is that the government can give money to a so called nonprofit with very few controls and there's no auditing subsequently of that nonprofit. So there's no. So this is with the 1.9 billion to Stacey Abrams. They then give themselves extremely lavish, like insane salaries, expense everything to the nonprofit, buy jets and homes and all sorts of things.

[Ben Ferguson]

Live like kings and queens.

[Elon Musk]

Yes.

[Ben Ferguson]

On the taxpayer dimensions.

[Elon Musk]

Correct. You mentioned this is happening at scale. It's not just one or two. We're seeing this everywhere.

[Ben Ferguson]

Now. One of the things you told me about is crazy is what you call magic money. Computers at the crazy. So tell us about it, because I never heard of that until you brought that up.

[Elon Musk]

Okay. So you may think that the government computers all talk to each other. They synchronize, they add up what funds are going somewhere and it's, you know, it's coherent that the, you know, there's. And that. And that the numbers, for example, that you're presented as a senator.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Elon Musk]

Are actually the real numbers in.

[Ben Ferguson]

One would think.

[Elon Musk]

One would think they're not.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Elon Musk]

Okay. I mean they're not totally Wrong. But they're probably off by 5% or 10% in some cases. So I call it magic. Magic computer. Any computer which can just make money out of thin air. Best magic money.

[Ben Ferguson]

So how does that work?

[Elon Musk]

It just issues payments.

[Ben Ferguson]

And you said there's something like 11 of these computers at treasury that are sending out trillions in payments.

[Elon Musk]

They're mostly at Treasury. Some are, but there's some at HHS, some at. There's one, I think one or two at State. There's some at DOD. I think we found now 14 magic money computers. They just send money out of nothing.

[Ben Ferguson]

You have an ability to see where leverage points are and how things actually happen. So I remember back, I think it was September, October of this year, before the election. We didn't know who was going to win. And I was at your house in Austin. We were talking about it, and you said, you said, look, I don't want a job in Washington. And you said, all I want is the login for every computer. And I remember thinking at the time that sounded kind of weird, like I just didn't get it. And I have to say what's interesting on this, if I would have thought, like, okay, how do you reform government? Like, sort of the traditional way to think about it is, okay, give me an org chart. Let me sit down with the people who are running agencies. And what you saw immediately is to understand what's really going on, get to the payment systems, get to the computers. Why is getting to the computer so critical to understanding what's actually happening?

[Elon Musk]

Well, the government is run by computers. So you've got essentially several hundred computers that effectively run the government. And if you want to know, did.

[Ben Ferguson]

You know that, Ben?

[Ted Cruz]

No.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. So when somebody, like, even when the President issues an executive order, that's got to go through a whole bunch of people until ultimately it is implemented at a computer somewhere. And if you want to know what the situation is with the accounting, and you're trying to reconcile accounting and get rid of waste and fraud, you must be able to analyze the computer databases. Otherwise you can't figure it out, because all you're doing is asking a human, who will then ask another human, ask another human, and finally usually ask some contractor who will ask another contractor to do a query on the computer.

[Ted Cruz]

Wow.

[Elon Musk]

That's how it actually works. So it's many layers deep. So the only way to reconcile the databases and get rid of waste and fraud is to actually look at the computers and see what's going on. That's what I call that's. What I sort of cryptically refer to reprogramming the matrix. You have to understand what's going at the computers. You have to reconcile the computer databases in order to identify the waste of fraud.

[Ben Ferguson]

I don't know that there was anyone in Congress who understood, certainly myself included, who understood the leverage that comes from the computer and the data in particular, that Congress would think about. Give me a report on what your expenditures are rather than actually getting into the pipes. And I think that has been fascinating that it's let you uncover a bunch of crap that just nobody knew.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. I mean, in order for money to go to event count, it's not like we're sending truckloads of cash all over the place. We're wiring money.

[Ben Ferguson]

Right.

[Elon Musk]

We're sending money through the ACH system or through the SWIFT system. So in order for money to flow, it's going to flow electronically. So that's what you need to look at. You need to look at the actual electronic money flows.

[Ben Ferguson]

And Tesla and all your companies, you have accounting and you have every expenditure, you have it coded for what it's going for. Federal government doesn't work that way. They don't code with the money's going for.

[Elon Musk]

They do now.

[Ben Ferguson]

But they didn't.

[Elon Musk]

They didn't.

[Ben Ferguson]

And like one of the things that you told me, you said if any company kept its books the way the federal government does, they'd arrest the officers and put them in jail.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. If it was a public company, it would be delisted immediately, it would fail its ordered, and the officers of the company would be imprisoned. That's the level of wealthiest in the federal government, unfortunately.

[Ted Cruz]

It's deliberately. Or do you think this is incompetence again?

[Elon Musk]

It's 80%. It's 80% incompetence or. And 20% malice.

[Ted Cruz]

So if you look at, if you look at Doge now and you look at the government and what you're finding, what percentage have you guys even gotten to and how much of it is Mars where you haven't even gotten there yet? Because there's so much you're finding out here. I mean, how many. You seem like a timeline guy when you say, all right, I want to get in there and get all these, you know, numbers and things. How far are we from the end game where you've seen it all, been able to process it all and fix it? I mean, are we years away? Months away?

[Elon Musk]

Not years. I mean, I'm reasonably confident that we'll be able to get a trillion dollars of waste and fraud out. And that meaning that it will have. We'll have a net savings in FY26, which starts in October, obviously, of a trillion dollars, provided we're allowed to continue and our progress is not impeded. And we're very public about what we do.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah, you put it on the website.

[Ted Cruz]

It's on the website.

[Elon Musk]

I don't know how we could be more transparent. Literally every action we do, small or large, we put on the doge.gov website and we post on the X handle. And when people complain about it and they say, oh, you're doing something cost usual, I'm like, well, which of these costumes you're doing in the daylight?

[Ben Ferguson]

Everyone knows exactly what you're doing.

[Elon Musk]

Extreme transparency. Yeah, I don't think anything's been this transparent ever.

[Ben Ferguson]

So five years ago you were a hero to the left. You were cool, you had electric cars, you had space. And in five years you've go to.

[Elon Musk]

A party in Hollywood and not get dirty looks.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Elon Musk]

In fact. Yeah.

[Ben Ferguson]

And now you might not even get invited.

[Elon Musk]

I should get invited, but I don't know if I should go.

[Ben Ferguson]

I don't think it's an exaggeration to say today after Donald Trump, the left hates you more than any person on earth.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. I appear to be number two. I mean, if you judge by the various signs, it's derangements.

[Ben Ferguson]

It's Trump Derangement syndrome and Elon Derangement syndrome. How is that for you? That's a little bit of whiplash of going from being like Mr. Cool to the devil incarnate in just a couple of years. Is that kind of weird to experience that transformation?

[Elon Musk]

Yes.

[Ben Ferguson]

Why do they hate you so much?

[Elon Musk]

Well, because we're clearly over the target. If those was ineffective, if we were not actually getting rid of a bunch of ways and fraud and a bunch of that fraud. I mean, the fraud we're seeing is overwhelmingly on the left. I mean, it's not zero on the right, but these NGOs are almost all left wing NGOs that are being funded, for example. So they hate me because DOGE is being effective and DOGE is getting rid of a lot of ways before that they were. That people on the left were taking advantage of. That's what it comes down to. And the single biggest thing that they're worried about is that DOGE is going to turn off fraudulent payments of entitlements. I mean, everything from Social Security, Medicare, unemployment, disability, Small Business Administration loans, turn them off to illegals. This is the crux of the Matter. Okay, this is the thing that why they really hit my guts and want me to die.

[Ben Ferguson]

And do you think that's billions, Hundreds of billions. What do you think the scale is of that?

[Elon Musk]

I think across the country, it's well north of 100 billion, maybe 200 billion. So by using entitlements, fraud, the Democrats have been able to attract and retain vast numbers of illegal immigrants.

[Ben Ferguson]

And buy voters.

[Elon Musk]

And buy voters, exactly. Basically bring in 10, 20 million people who are beholden to the Democrats for government handouts and will vote overwhelmingly Democrat, as has been demonstrated in California. This is overwhelmingly.

[Ted Cruz]

It's an election strategy.

[Elon Musk]

Yes.

[Ben Ferguson]

It's power.

[Elon Musk]

Yes. And it doesn't take much to turn the swing states blue. I mean, often a swing state might be won by 10, 20,000 votes.

[Ben Ferguson]

Sure.

[Elon Musk]

So if the Dems can bring in 200,000 illegals and over time get them legalized, not counting any cheating that takes place. Because there is some cheating. But even without cheating, if you bring in illegals that are 10x the voter differential in a swing state, it will no longer be a swing state.

[Ben Ferguson]

Right.

[Elon Musk]

And the dams will win all the swing states. Just a matter of time and America will be permanent deep blue socialist state. The House, the Senate, the presidency and the Supreme Court will all go hardcore down. They will then further cement that by bringing in even more aliens so you can't vote your way out of it. Their objective is to make it one party socialist state. And it'll be much worse than California because at least California is mitigated by the fact that someone can leave California.

[Ben Ferguson]

Right, you can go to Texas.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah, exactly. It's going to make everywhere California. But worse.

[Ben Ferguson]

By the way, the middle of the pandemic, I spent 45 minutes on the phone with Elon. He was still in California. I was walking my dog, Snowflake, and trying to convince you, come to Texas. The commies in California can't stand you. We love you, we want you here. And you didn't quite go then, but you went not that long afterwards.

[Elon Musk]

I mean, the COVID actions almost killed Tesla because every other auto plant in the country was allowed to open, but ours, which was in California, was not allowed to open.

[Ben Ferguson]

Wow. Wow.

[Elon Musk]

So they almost killed Tesla.

[Ben Ferguson]

So as a personal matter, do you ever regret it? Like five years ago you go to the Oscars and we're Mr. Cool and now you've got death threats every day.

[Elon Musk]

Well, these days the Oscars are boring. I wouldn't want to go.

[Ben Ferguson]

God bless the movies. They nominate. No one on earth has ever seen like, like, could they actually nominate a movie that human beings go watch?

[Elon Musk]

I mean, the. How many great movies have come out in the last several years? Very few.

[Ben Ferguson]

Depressingly few.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. Very few last Oscars came and went. I didn't watch it. There's nothing to see.

[Ben Ferguson]

I, I was sad that Gene Hackman just passed away because Unforgiven was spectacular. But that was a long time ago when Unforgiven came out.

[Ted Cruz]

You've mentioned today here and before, about the possibility of someone wanting to take you out dealing with the death threats we see.

[Elon Musk]

It's not in my imagination. You can just look on social media.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, but like, is, is it because.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah, and look, I'm, I'm very familiar with that.

[Elon Musk]

And they've got signs. They're people with signs and demonstrations saying that I need to die.

[Ben Ferguson]

Do you think, are these just whack jobs or do you think there are.

[Elon Musk]

Hopefully foreign, not sane people?

[Ben Ferguson]

Do you think there are foreign entities behind this? Do you think there are domestic entities behind the threats and also the attacks to Twitter? Not Twitter, Tesla. I mean, you know, you're getting Tesla's charging stations lit on fire. Do you think that's organized and paid for?

[Elon Musk]

Yes, at least some of it is organized and paid for, I think by domestic left wing organizations in America. Funded by left wing billionaires, essentially.

[Ben Ferguson]

Is it like ActBlue or what?

[Elon Musk]

ActBlue is one of them. You know, Arabella, you know, the classic. It's funded by the, you know, the blue. Basically the left wing NGO cabal.

[Ted Cruz]

How big of a threat is this to like what you build at Tesla? I mean, I remember when Teslas came out, it was people that, they didn't want to have gas cars. A lot of it was environmental reasons. I jokingly said, I was like, I'm a Texas guy. I'm always going to have something that burns gas. My kids, now, all three of my boys think that the, that Teslas are awesome. The cyber truck is the car they want their dad to buy, which I laugh because I never could have imagined that five years ago. And now I'm looking at, well, we're.

[Ben Ferguson]

At the White House and the President's Tesla sparked right outside the West Wing, which is the coolest damn thing.

[Ted Cruz]

But I mean, you've changed a generation. When you look at, my kids are 6 and 8 and they're going, dad, buy a cyber truck. And I'm considering it. That's a, that's a full circle in a weird way.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. Well, I do have this theory that the most entertaining Outcome is the most likely. So yeah, that seems often to be true. You say like, what twist or turn of fate would generate the highest ratings? If we were a TV show, what twist or turn of fate would generate the highest ratings? There's a good chance that happens.

[Ben Ferguson]

Well, I will say if ActBlue and Arabella network.

[Elon Musk]

ActBlue is a huge scam. Next level.

[Ben Ferguson]

Do you think it's foreign money? Chinese money? Where do you think the money in ActBlue is coming from? How do you figure that out?

[Elon Musk]

Well, it's not coming from a whole bunch of, from a groundswell of public support because when individual donors are looked at and Act Blue, a bunch of them turn out to be like die hard Republicans. People have never given money in their life. So you're going to track down a bunch of these people where it says, oh, I gave $16,000. And they're like, I didn't give $16,000. What are you talking about? Well, if those friends of mine found themselves on the Act Blue list, they're.

[Ben Ferguson]

Like, so that's if it can actually be shown that they are funding firebombing of Tesla charging stations. That's objectively a criminal act. That is funding terrorist activity. And the statutes make clear that an incendiary device qualifies.

[Elon Musk]

So that's a terrorist activity.

[Ben Ferguson]

Let me ask AI, in 10 years, how is life going to be different because of AI for just a normal person?

[Elon Musk]

Well, 10 years is a long time. In 10 years, probably AI could do anything better than a human can cognitively. Probably almost. I think in 10 years, based on the current rate of improvement, AI will be smarter than the smartest human. There will also be a massive number of robots. So humanoid robots.

[Ben Ferguson]

By the way, I gotta ask, how come your robots look so much like the creepy robots for my robot? Was that intentional or just.

[Ted Cruz]

I was hoping he was going to say yeah, just to mess with you.

[Elon Musk]

It's not meant to look like any prior robot. And we'll iterate the design and you'll be able to have a lot of the robot parts are cosmetic. You'll be able to switch out the snap on cosmetic parts of the robot, make it look like something else if you'd like. So there will be ultimately billions of humanoid robots. All cars will be self driving in 10 years. In 10 years, probably 90% of miles driven will be autonomous.

[Ben Ferguson]

Huh, wow, that fast?

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. In five years, probably 50% of all miles driven will be autonomous.

[Ben Ferguson]

Now if AI will be smarter than any person, how many jobs go away because of that? And what do people do if you've got billions of people that are losing their jobs? A lot of people are understandably freaked out about that.

[Elon Musk]

Well, goods and services will become close to free. So it's not as though people will be wanting in terms of goods and services.

[Ben Ferguson]

So why is that? Why are goods and services free in an AI world or close to free?

[Elon Musk]

Well, you have, I don't know, call it tens of billions of robots. They will make you anything or provide any service you want for basically next to nothing. It's not that people will be. Will have a lower standard of living. They'll have actually a much higher standard of living. But the challenge will be fulfillment. How do you derive fulfillment and meaning in life?

[Ben Ferguson]

Is Skynet real? Like, you get the apocalyptic visions of AI? How real is the prospect of killer robots annihilating humanity?

[Elon Musk]

20% likely, maybe 10%.

[Ben Ferguson]

On what time frame?

[Elon Musk]

5 to 10 years.

[Ben Ferguson]

So soon you see a world where that's possible.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah, but you can look at it like the glasses. 80 to 90% full, meaning 80% likely. We'll have extreme prosperity for all.

[Ben Ferguson]

I guess my view we're in a race to win AI. We're in a race with China. And my view is if they're going to be killer robots, I'd rather they be American killer robots than Chinese. How likely are we winning right now? Is America winning right now? And how likely is America to win the race for AI vis a vis China or anyone else for the next few years?

[Elon Musk]

I think America is likely to win. Then it will be a function of who controls the AI chip fabrication, the factories that make the AI chips, who controls them. If more of them are controlled by China, then China will win more.

[Ben Ferguson]

The factories that are making the AI chips, you think that will determine it?

[Elon Musk]

Yes.

[Ben Ferguson]

And how are we doing versus China on that front?

[Elon Musk]

Well, right now, almost all the advanced AI chip factories, they call them fabs, are in Taiwan.

[Ben Ferguson]

And what if China invades Taiwan?

[Elon Musk]

Miles away from.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah. What happens if China. If China invades Taiwan, what happens to the world?

[Elon Musk]

Well, if they were to invade in the near term, the world would be cut off from advanced AI chips. Currently, 100% of advanced AI chips are made in Taiwan.

[Ted Cruz]

How fast could we put that online in America? And how important is that for national security?

[Elon Musk]

I think it's essential for national security. And we're not doing enough.

[Ben Ferguson]

You're 53 years old. I'm 118 days older than you. What the hell have I done in my life?

[Ted Cruz]

I know, right?

[Ben Ferguson]

53 years old.

[Elon Musk]

You're doing pretty well. Well, so 71 was a great year.

[Ben Ferguson]

And I was December 70. So I was just. Just right before you were. The summer of 71.

[Elon Musk]

I was born 69 days after 420.

[Ben Ferguson]

Wow. I did ask Ben.

[Elon Musk]

This is true.

[Ben Ferguson]

Look, this is true.

[Ted Cruz]

All right? You just opened up your can of words.

[Ben Ferguson]

I did ask Ben. Should I show up and pull up a joint and say, can we beat Rogan's views? But I was pretty sure it might cause a scandal if we spit a.

[Elon Musk]

Pot in the White House. It just turned out to be like a chocolate cigar.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah. Let me ask you if today was your last day on Earth.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. What?

[Ben Ferguson]

I'm not suggesting it's going to be, but if it were, what do you think your biggest legacy would be of everything you've done 100 years from now? What do you think people would remember if it were zero to today?

[Ted Cruz]

And will you ever go to space.

[Elon Musk]

In the distant future, 100 or 1,000 years ago? If SpaceX got humans to Mars, that's what they would remember me for.

[Ben Ferguson]

All right, final set of questions. Who's the smartest guy you've ever met? You hang out with some brilliant people. What's a CEO you look at other than yourself? What CEO do you say? Damn, that guy's good.

[Elon Musk]

Larry Ellison's very smart, so I'll say Larry Ellison's one of the smartest people. You know, Larry Page. I mean, there are a lot of people that are very smart. It's hard to say. Like, you know, I think to some degree smart is as smart as. So, you know, what have they done that is difficult and significant? You know, Jeff Bezos has done a lot of difficult and significant things. I mean, there are a lot of smart humans. I call them smart for a human. A lot of people who are in the smart for a human category.

[Ben Ferguson]

All right, final lightning round. Star wars or Star Trek?

[Elon Musk]

The first movie I saw in the theater was Star wars, so I think it had a profound effect on me. I was six years old, I think. Imagine if first movie you ever see in a theater is Star Wars. It's gonna blow your mind.

[Ben Ferguson]

Best Star wars movie.

[Elon Musk]

Empire Strikes Back.

[Ben Ferguson]

The only objectively right answer. I stood in line three hours with my dad to see it on opening day. Kirk or Picard?

[Elon Musk]

I like them both. Picir.

[Ben Ferguson]

Again, objectively right answer, by the way.

[Elon Musk]

Kirk.

[Ben Ferguson]

James T. Kirk is a Republican and Picard is a Democrat. And the left gets very mad when I say that. Best Star Trek movie.

[Elon Musk]

I mean, the original. The first Star Trek movie, maybe that's okay. Wrath of Khan, Wrath of Khan, both Wrath of Khans were pretty good. But yeah, the original Wrath of Khan.

[Ben Ferguson]

Ricardo Montalban Revenge is a dish best served cold. It is very cold in space. Although I will say Wrath of Khan is objectively the right answer. But. But 4 is a sleeper. When they go back to San Francisco and go find the whales and you know, Scotty picks up, picks up the mouth and talks to it. Then goes a keyboard. How quaint. That's a sleeper. All right, last question. Did Han shoot first?

[Elon Musk]

It seemed like he shot second.

[Ben Ferguson]

This is verdict. And by the way, I apologize, Ben. So Ben was a jock and played tennis at Ole Miss. And so occasionally when we geek out.

[Ted Cruz]

A little bit, I love watching y'all geek out over there.

[Elon Musk]

He might have shot first though, because the guy, he's still on the question I love. He missed his. The alien missed his blaster shot. So why did he miss his blaster shot? Must have been because he got shot first. Now he's missing a point blank bastard shot unless they got knocked off kill.

[Ben Ferguson]

But it's a question of real quick, which is, is Han Solo simply a hero or an anti hero? And so I'm in the Han shot first category. I don't like sanitized stories.

[Elon Musk]

He would have had to have shot first because otherwise why would the alien miss a point blank range?

[Ted Cruz]

Are you ever going to go to outer space? Is that something in your life goals?

[Elon Musk]

Yeah, I'd like to go to Mars at some point. And people have said, do I want to die on Mars? And I say yes, just not on impact.

[Ben Ferguson]

Now that's a very good answer. The astronauts on the space station, are they political prisoners?

[Elon Musk]

Some of them are because.

[Ben Ferguson]

Because you could have given them a ride back and Joe Biden said no purely for politics.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah, I mean, you know, there's been some debate about this online, but the thing is that it was a very high level decision. So it wasn't really even a NASA decision. It was just that the Biden White House did not want to have someone who was pro Trump rescuing astronauts right before the election. So they pushed it.

[Ben Ferguson]

Well, if you're one of those astronauts, you got to be pretty pissed off about that.

[Elon Musk]

Well, if they're a Democrat, yes. Republican, yes. If they're Democrat, like, everything's fine.

[Ben Ferguson]

Fair enough.

[Elon Musk]

So I think one of them is a Republican Democrat. So it depends on which one you ask.

[Ben Ferguson]

Well, thank you, Elon. This was awesome. And let me say, and by the way, I put out on X the day before yesterday, if you were having a beer with Elon and could ask him anything, what would you ask? And got lots of responses. The most common response people said is say thank you. Look, Texans and the American people appreciate what you're doing. You don't have to put up with this BS and you're doing it. I'm grateful. You're making a hell of a difference for this country. I appreciate you and the Americans appreciate you.

[Elon Musk]

Yeah. It's essential for the future of civilization. Otherwise I wouldn't be doing it.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yes.

[Elon Musk]

It's not like I want to get death threats, you know.

[Ted Cruz]

No. All right. Now part two of this interview with Elon Musk and some bigger breaking news that we're going to have for you about corruption the government will hit on Wednesday morning. So make sure you hit that subscribe or auto download button right now. And again, please help this show go viral so that we can continue to expose government waste wherever you're on social media. Hit that little forward button and post this episode on social media and the center and I will see you back here with Elon Musk Part two, Wednesday morning.