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- [00:01]
Ben Ferguson
Welcome. It is Verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you, and it is our debate show. If you watch the Republican debate, you saw some lively moments. Senator, you watched it, I watched it. Give me your overall takeaway. Who was the big winner and was there any even a second place?
- [00:22]
Senator Ted Cruz
So you and I are recording this. It is 11:41pm East coast time. I'm in D.C. so the debate just ended a few minutes ago. I gotta say, my reaction to it, this was a bumpy debate. There were a lot of rocky moments. I think most of the candidates did not help themselves. But my clear conclusion from tonight is the big winner was Ron DeSantis.
- [00:47]
Ben Ferguson
Why is that?
- [00:48]
Senator Ted Cruz
Well, I did not think that in debate one. So remember debate one, we came together and I said the winners in debate one were Vivek Ramaswamy and Nikki Haley and a little bit Mike Pence. And the real winner was Donald trump because all three of them were elevated. Elevated. And that hurt DeSantis. And DeSantis needs to make it a two man race with Trump. And so that was my take on debate one. I think going into tonight, Desantis needed to do well and I think he rose to the occasion. I think he did by far the best of anyone on the stage. Several reasons. Number one is just the behavior of the others. I think they bickered like children and I don't think it helped them. I think when they were just yelling at each other back and forth and back and forth and back and forth. When you see a bunch of people screaming at each other, they don't look like presidents. They're not behaving like presidents. Presidents don't have to yap at each other. And I thought there were times, particularly early in the debate, when the debate kind of got away from the moderators. As the debate went on, the moderators did a better job of getting a little bit of control of it and having a little bit more discussion. But DeSantis had several. He had the best answers of the night. The single best answer of the night was his answer on education. And he was. The topic came up about education, it came up about school choice. And he gave a strong, powerful answer about school choice, about how, number one, Florida had implemented universal school choice. Florida has led the country in school choice, so they've got a heck of a record to talk about. He was asked about the attacks on their efforts to root out critical race theory in Florida. And he directly confronted that. And I thought it was a tight, crisp answer that was strong. A second answer that was very Very strong is where he talked about having victories. And listen, the reason people got excited about DeSantis when he launched the campaign is the victories that he had in Florida, big policy victories. He emphasized that. The third answer that was really strong is where he talked about winning and he talked about winning in Florida even as nationally we were getting clobbered in 2022, he won by 19 points. And I think he did an effective argument in many ways. His strongest argument against Trump is that he won by while many other candidates that Trump had supported nationally did not win that cycle. And his argument, you want a winner, you want someone who can beat the Democrats, I'm that guy. I think he articulated it much, much better tonight than he did in the first debate. That's why I think Ron DeSantis won tonight.
- [03:27]
Ben Ferguson
You know, he mentioned that, you know, there's, we've lost the last three times, as he described it, right. We were supposed to win in the last midterm elections. We were supposed to win the election before that and the one before that, and we didn't. And he, he also compared, in contrast, as you mentioned, I think, extremely well. And it clearly clicked, I think with people watching, as I was watching it live, just like you were there, I was like, okay, this is, this is one of those quasi moments where, where he was reminding people of history, like not only did we win when the nation was losing, when Republicans were losing on nights we should have won, but we won an expanded in Florida. That was a potent moment to remind people that we should have control of the Senate right now and we don't because we had some bad candidate selection. Let's just be honest.
- [04:16]
Senator Ted Cruz
Look, Republicans desperately want to win. The Biden record is an absolute train wreck. And I gotta admit, I lay awake at night in cold sweats that we will see the democrats reelected in 2024. The damage they've done to the country in the last two and a half years, holy cow, if they get another four, what a bad outcome for the country. So as I'm looking for a candidate, I want someone who can win the damn race. And in many ways, that is DeSantis strongest argument. And, and in the first debate, he didn't really make it. And he, he came a lot closer to making it tonight. So I, so I think he did better as a result.
- [04:53]
Ben Ferguson
Let's talk about the, the poll numbers coming out of this real quick. Give me your predictions of who rises and who falls. We had already had one candidate out of Arkansas who's fallen off the debate stage. Did not qualify for this one. Everybody's goal is to make it to Miami to the next debate in what, four or five weeks. That's the, that's obviously the center goal. But, but who helped themselves? Who, who is going to go backwards and who could be in real trouble?
- [05:22]
Senator Ted Cruz
Look, I think the ends of the debate stage, we saw Asa Hutchinson fall off. I think the ends of the debate stage are at real risk of being eliminated from the stage. Doug Burgum, his numbers, it's not clear that he qualified for tonight, but they allowed him on the stage. But, but I think his numbers, he's going to have to do a lot of, a whole lot of movement to qualify for the next debate stage. I think Mike Pence, he's the vice president, former vice president of the United States, he's a good man, he's a friend, but I think he's right at the edge of not making the next debate. Also, narrowing the debate stage is a good thing. This race, if there's going to be a real race, look, in many ways, this is sort of like a basketball playoff where it's a playoff to see who gets to go against Donald Trump. And I guess you can sort of think about it, that Trump gets a buy. He's the former president, he's decided to skip the debates. So in some ways.
- [06:23]
Ben Ferguson
Let me ask you this real quick, though. Is that still, you think the smart strategy, obviously, I think was the right strategy for debate number one at the end of tonight. Was it also the right strategy for him to skip debate number two?
- [06:35]
Senator Ted Cruz
Maybe, maybe not. Look, I think he's enough ahead in the polls, the national polls, he's up 40 plus points. I mean, that's a strong lead. And I think his analysis, and it's not a crazy analysis, is he so far ahead? Why would he go and from his perspective, elevate the other candidates? You know, you think about in 2016, you had two debates, you had the main debate, and then you had what everyone called the kids table, which were the candidates that were at 1 and 2%. And very few people watched the kids table. What Trump has effectively done by skipping the debate is he's trying to turn everyone else into the kids table. Like this is not the real candidates. He's the only, only candidate. I understand that strategy. That is a perfectly rational debate strategy. I will say, you know, Trump got popped a little more tonight than he did on the first night. And in particular, I think Desantis hitting him on abortion and life. Look, Trump's answer, where he said it was a terrible thing that the state of Florida passed a law protecting life. That's an answer. If you're talking to pro life activists in Iowa, I don't know how you defend that answer. And I think Trump did a good, or rather DeSantis did a good job of really holding Trump to account for it. Now, if he'd been there, Trump could have given an answer. Trump would have presumably said, look, I'm the guy that appointed three justices that overturned Roe versus Wade. I mean, he would have made a forceful response, but he wasn't there. And that's one of the consequences of not being there is someone can take a swing, they can hit you, and there's not anyone there who's going to respond or defend you. So there were several shots at Trump. I think that's the two that hit in any material way where I think DeSantis point on abortion hit. And I also think the general point about we want to win and what DeSantis argued is that he won in Florida while Trump supported candidates elsewhere were losing. Those were two shots that scored some blood. Now, do I expect major movements in the polls? No, I think the polls will be very similar next week to where they are this week. So I don't think you're going to see a dramatic move. But I think DeSantis took a meaningful step towards making this a two man race. And the only conceivable way anyone has a shot at beating Trump is for this to be a two man race. And I think this was a step in that direction.
- [09:06]
Ben Ferguson
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- [11:26]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yeah, look, Vivek had a much rougher night tonight than he did in the first debate. The first debate, he did excellent. He surprised a lot of people. He got on a lot of people's radar. He really did well tonight. Look, the other candidates don't like Vivek and they did not hide that they were taking shots at him. And it was, there were some pretty sneering moments. I do think that the shot that scored the most was the argument that several candidates made, that Nikki Haley made, that Tim Scott made about Vivek being in bed with communist China. And they made some pretty specific allegations of him being paid by the same players that paid Hunter Biden 5 million.
- [12:11]
Ben Ferguson
By the way, paid Hunter Biden $5 million. The same people, which, when you hear that on stage, that's a big, for me, a red flag. Right.
- [12:20]
Senator Ted Cruz
And Vivek did not have a good answer to that. He just, he didn't respond on the substance. He just said, well, we need to follow Ronald Reagan's 11th Commandment, so don't criticize me. And I gotta say, in the last debate, Vivek did not follow Ronald Reagan's 11th Commandment. And I will say to Tim Scott's credit. Tim's best moment was when he turned to him and said, hold on a second, Vivek. You said every one of us is bought and paid for. Who the hell are you to say that? That was a good moment for Tim, because it really was a pretty obnoxious thing for Vivek to say, to allege that the other candidates are bought and paid for. And if you're going to do that, if you're going to. If you're going to say to the other candidates, you guys are all prostitutes. You don't get to complain moments later, hey, don't criticize me. Be nice to me. We shouldn't be be criticizing each other. And so I think that.
- [13:15]
Ben Ferguson
That was almost one of the big inexperience moments. When I laugh, when people say, I want a new face who hadn't done this before. And I'm like, until you don't. And my point is, sometimes experience in politics is actually important. And it's important, especially when you get elected. It's really important when you're dealing with foreign leaders and world leaders at a very high level, when you're dealing with negotiations. If you've never been there before, this whole idea of, oh, I'm the new guy on the block, it's cute, until it's not.
- [13:44]
Senator Ted Cruz
Look, I think the job of President of the United States is a very serious position. I think the burdens of it are enormous. There's a reason why just about every president who's ever served seems to age about 20 years in the job. It is an insanely difficult job. You know, I'm reminded of when Trump was newly elected in, I think it was March of 2017. Trump had Heidi and me and the girls to the White House for dinner, and we had. It was a marvelous time. It was very nice of him to invite them. And we brought our girls there. And as we're walking, we're walking by the Rose Garden, Trump looks at me and says, wow, who knew this job was so tough? And I got to admit, I was. I am rarely at a loss for words. I was genuinely flabbergasted. I was like, yeah, yes, Some of us kind of had that idea. I mean, it was really a kind of. And listen, don't take that comment wrong. I think when Trump was president, we accomplished an enormous amount. But I also think this is a job that requires a seriousness of purpose, a seriousness of execution, an ability to communicate, to motivate, to get the job done. And it is a. I am generally skeptical of any candidate who's never served in any government position, waking up and saying, you know, I should be President of the United States. Other than generals who won world wars, there's not a great history of that.
- [15:21]
Ben Ferguson
Yeah, great point. When you look at this moving forward and you, and you sit there and you go, okay, I'm Donald Trump tonight. Afterwards, I'm obviously going to watch this thing. He did his counter programming with, you know, uaw, et cetera. But, but afterwards, eventually you're going to sit down, you're going to take a look at this. Are you uneasy or do you still feel very confident that you're still going to have a 40 point lead after all this?
- [15:45]
Senator Ted Cruz
Oh, look, I think Trump will still have a big, big lead, but he's not happy that DeSantis did. Well, Trump would have been very happy if Ron DeSantis had sucked tonight, because as long as there are a bunch of candidates, it's. Why in debate one, I said the biggest winner in debate one was Donald Trump. Because if there are two or three or four people on the stage that are gaining a point or two, he's winning. As long as that field is fractured, he's winning. If DeSantis gets some real momentum, if he makes it more of a two man race, that's not ideal for Trump. And so I'm confident Trump is not happy about that aspect. I do think the next debate we will see one or two people eliminated from the stage. I think the smaller it gets, the more of a threat it poses to Trump. And everyone in the media was saying this race is over. Listen, that is at least ahistorical at this point, at this point in the race. We're still in September, before the election, at this point in the race, Jeb Bush was still the dominant leader. He was starting to fade. And Scott Walker was becoming the dominant leader in 2016. After Walker, you had a Ben Carson moment where he sizzled for about two weeks. He had a huge surge. And then after that, you had Marco Rubio. And at the end of the day, if you look at 2016, Trump and I went head to head. We were 1 and 2 in almost every single state. No other candidate won more than a single state. Kasich won Ohio, Rubio won Minnesota, and Trump and I won every other state in the country. I won 12 states. He won the rest of them. So my point is, the people who were dominant leaders in the polls today in the 2016 cycle did not win a single state. So the world can change a lot. That being said, Trump is still in a very strong position. I mean, a 40 point lead in the polls is not nothing. It just doesn't mean the race is over, as some in the media are.
- [17:49]
Ben Ferguson
Want to say, let's talk about foreign policy. I actually was a little bit disappointed in the depth of that conversation, and I want to get your reaction to it. There was obviously a lot of talk about China, specifically with Vivek, but then you deal with Ukraine and you deal with border. The border issue, for examp, it didn't seem to have a lot of depth there that I think many people were hoping for.
- [18:15]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yeah, there wasn't a whole lot of substance. There wasn't a whole lot of analysis of what caused the border crisis. I don't think any of those candidates have spent significant time at our southern border. I didn't get the sense that any of them fully understood it. You didn't have an explanation as to the real human tragedy that our crisis at the southern border is and why Joe Biden is directly responsible for it. Look, I will say Chris Christie, Chris Christie is the one candidate on that stage who attacks Trump and does so repeatedly. I don't think he helped himself a whole lot tonight. So, for example, one of his big attacks on Trump, and he's been doing this on, on Twitter before, is he says Trump didn't build the wall and he didn't make Mexico pay for it. Now, look, I get that's probably a pretty good line if you're dealing with hedge fund owners and donors, but it's a stupid policy attack. Look, there are things that I wish Trump had done differently as president, but on immigration, his record on immigration is excellent. And when Trump left the White House, we had the lowest rate of illegal immigration in 45 years. He negotiated the remain in Mexico agreement. The remain in Mexico agreement with worked. It worked spectacularly well. Joe Biden inherited an incredible success on illegal immigration. And Joe Biden deliberately blew it up within days of becoming president. And so I think Christie attacking Trump. Look, do I wish he'd built more border walls? Sure. But not acknowledging that on securing the border, Donald Trump did more to secure the border than any president we have had in our nation's history. And, and, and any candidate not saying that is being dishonest. So if you want to find grounds to disagree with Trump, fine. But, but that attack, I, I don't know of a Republican voter who's persuaded by that attack, unless it's someone that already hates Trump and then they're like, yeah, yeah, Mexico didn't pay for it. It's like, come on, guys. I, I mean, he did more than anyone else has ever done. And the results were really good. And look, yeah, he was, he was.
- [20:28]
Ben Ferguson
Clearly trying, Chris Christie was clearly trying to have a moment. I want to play that because it was a very interesting part of the debate. You just mentioned it. Here is Chris Christie in his own words.
- [20:37]
Senator Ted Cruz
Governor Christie, as governor of a non border state in 2010, you supported a path to citizenship, but when you run For President in 2016, you flipped saying immigrants should be tracked like FedEx packages. Where do you stand now on a path to citizenship for 11 million of.
- [20:59]
C
The problem is that since no one has done anything since we first had this discussion 13 years ago, we're not in a position to be able to do any of that anymore. What we have to do now is first treat this like the law enforcement problem it is. Our laws are being broken every day at the southern border, every day. And Joe Biden and his crew is doing nothing about enforcing that law. They are letting it go. And by the way, they announced during the presidential race they were going to let it go. And we need to have a president, president who acts like I did as governor, enforce the law first and foremost. And that means what I'll do on day one is sign an executive order to send the National Guard to partner with Customs and Border Patrol to make sure that we stop the flow of fentanyl over the border, but also to make sure that we send a much different message. We want you here in this country to fill the 6 million vacant jobs we have, but only if you come here to follow of the law and only if you come here legally. If you come here illegally, we will apprehend you and we will send you back across the border from which you came. And the fact is that until we set a law and order agenda in this country, not only now, but in the future, we won't, we won't be able to continue this. And I'll look, I'll tell you this. Donald Trump failed on this as well. He said he was going to build a wall across the whole border. He built 52 miles of wall and said Mexico would pay for it. Guess what? I think if Mexico knew that he was only going to build 52 might have paid for the 52 miles.
- [22:31]
Ben Ferguson
But by the way, if he would have just stopped before he took the cheap shot at Trump, which I don't think landed with anybody that was watching, certainly not Trump supporters, it would have actually been a pretty decent response to the question.
- [22:44]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yeah, look, there is not a single human being on planet earth that thinks Chris Christie would be better on stopping illegal immigration than Donald Trump was. There just isn't. The question began with, gosh, you flip flopped and you've embraced amnesty repeatedly in your career. And Chris Christie built his career as a blue state governor and a liberal to moderate Republican. And so the attack. Look, I think in debates and in politics, truth and authenticity matters. That when you make a point that's from the heart, that's real, that can land. And so it's why I think Desantis point about we need to win, and we didn't win the way we should have in 2018, 2020 and 2022. That's a real argument. That's something primary voters are like, holy crap, we can't lose in 24. And I'm a little bit nervous. I don't want us to lose. Like, that's an argument that has some teeth. The argument that Trump didn't care enough about securing the border, it's just not true. And I don't think it hurts any of the candidates to acknowledge truth and reality to say, yeah, look, I mean, we had some real successes on securing the borders. There more to do. Sure, but you didn't have anyone explain what caused this crisis was the decision, one decision from Joe Biden, which is to embrace catch and release so that now when illegal immigrants are apprehended, they let them go and they don't deport them. As long as you do that, you cannot solve the problem. That means the next president. If you simply say, if you cross into this country illegally, we will catch you, we will put you on a plane, and we will fly you back to your damn country. That's the answer. That's how you secure the border. And you didn't have anyone with that clarity. But I think Christie's answer on that, it didn't land because it was hitting Trump on an area of strength and not an area of weakness.
- [24:45]
Ben Ferguson
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- [27:16]
Senator Ted Cruz
Well look, you know, it's interesting you just said a minute ago in your question you said this President Joe Biden is compromised. On China. It was interesting. There was not a word said tonight about Biden's corruption, about the which was shocking. And there was very little said about Biden's record. There was very little said what I found curious and it's why I think most of the candidates did not have a great night tonight. There was very little said about why they were the best candidate to beat Donald Trump and in the primary. That's the only question is who can win the primary. And there was very little said about why they were the best candidate to beat Joe Biden. And at the end of the day, that's what Republican primary voters are looking for. And it was odd. When it came to Trump, most of the candidates seemed to forget that he existed. And when it came to Joe Biden, by and large, most of the candidates forgot he existed. And, and you're trying to prosecute a case, you're trying to make the case that I'm the guy or I'm the gal to take us to victory. And, and on China, look, there was some rhetoric, China's bad, China's bad, China's bad. But what we didn't hear from anybody was a systematic, comprehensive plan to how do we beat China. And I believe I've talked about this a lot, that we need the sort of systematic plan that Reagan had to win the Cold War, a plan that takes on that, that combats China's lies, its murder, it's torture, it's genocide, it's espionage, it's theft, it's propaganda that goes after China. And there was very little said about how specifically we do that. There was some general rhetoric, China bad, but not a whole lot of substance.
- [29:08]
Ben Ferguson
So therefore, what I was shocked by what you just mentioned. And let's dive into this for a moment. I think it was a huge mistake to not bring up the big breaking news that you and I broke on this podcast yesterday.
- [29:24]
Senator Ted Cruz
You made a quarter million dollars sent to Joe Biden's house.
- [29:27]
Ben Ferguson
Yeah. From Beijing. And no one mentioned it. On top of the fact that it broke after we did that show, that based on the plea deal agreement that was given by David Weiss, it said in that plea agreement that during the time that payment was made, the residence for Hunter Biden was in California. That's in the plea agreement that came out as kind of like, hey, if you think that he was living in this house, that's the same residence of the, of the, of the President of the United States of America, you know, in Delaware, you're wrong. The plea agreement said during the time, and it also came out afterwards, Senator, that in his own book that Hunter Biden wrote, he also said in his book that he was living in California at the time that wire transfer would have come through. So there's even a bigger problem there. And no one said anything about it on stage. That was a huge mistake, I think, for all of them.
- [30:20]
Senator Ted Cruz
Well, if you think about any moment, and this was a long debate, this was a two hour debate. And by the way, I got to say, there's something weird about the debate at the Reagan library. So in 2016, we had a debate at the Reagan Library right on the stage where they were. And the 2016 debate, that was the CNN debate. And it went three hours. It was the longest debate of the entire cycle. And I remember, I don't know if this was true tonight, but in 2016, the Reagan Library did not have air conditioning that was made to survive the klieg lights of a television debate. And so it was hot.
- [30:57]
Ben Ferguson
And that many warm bodies in the room. People don't realize those rooms get hot when you have that many people in there.
- [31:01]
Senator Ted Cruz
There was a whole audience of people. There are bright lights. I remember by the third hour, we were drenched in sweat. And I was standing there. I was actually standing. Mike Huckabee was next to me. Marco Rubio was next to me. Actually, Marco, to his credit, had a handkerchief which he let both Huckabee and me use because we were both sweating like crazy. And it was. By hour three, it was unpleasant. Now, the good news is I think there were six people in the entire world that stayed up to watch the third hour of that debate. So it didn't matter that we all looked like we were drowning in our own sweat. I couldn't tell if they had the same issue this time, but I will say in two hours, it was striking that there was not really an effective case made. Here's how we beat Joe Biden, and that matters a lot. Nor was there an effective case. You know, Dana Perino tried to get to it when she said, okay, write down on your, your piece of paper, who you're going to vote off the island. And by the way, I will credit the candidates for all of them saying, no, we're not playing that kind of BS game. That that was the right response for them to say no. But even though you don't write on a card, you're not playing Jeopardy. There wasn't really anyone making the case other than DeSantis, which is why I think he won tonight. There wasn't really anyone making the case. I'm the right standard bearer to win the primary, and I'm the right standard bearer to win the general, and here's how and why.
- [32:31]
Ben Ferguson
Yeah, there was also a lot of Mrs. People said, @ least in response online, that this debate was on Univision and they didn't feel like the candidates did a good enough job reaching out to Hispanic voters. Your reaction to that as well?
- [32:46]
Senator Ted Cruz
Look, I think they did almost nothing. I mean, I mean, To Hispanic voters. Listen, the Hispanic community, our community, is fundamentally conservative. It is culturally conservative. You look at the values that resonate in the Hispanic community.
- [33:01]
Ben Ferguson
Family oriented, very family oriented.
- [33:03]
Senator Ted Cruz
Family, faith, patriotism, hard work, the American dream. Those are values that are fundamentally conservative. You didn't see anyone saying, you know what you want to talk about the Hispanic community, the Hispanic community in South Texas and in California and Arizona is getting hammered by 7.6 million illegal immigrants. By the way, every candidate tonight got the number wrong. They all said 6 million. Your numbers are a million and a half off. It's up to 7.6. The candidates should get their numbers right. But they didn't talk about the misery that is being imposed on the Hispanic community by this crisis of illegal immigration. They didn't talk about Hispanic families that are getting hammered by rising inflation. They didn't talk about Hispanic families that are getting hammered by rising crime rates. They didn't talk extensively about the Democrat efforts to defund the police and George Soros prosecutors. They had some of that. Actually their discussion of crime. There were some decent moments. But the point you just made, Ben, nobody connected it to the Hispanic community. No one connected it to the African American community. And that's a point that I think is important to make that I hope in subsequent debates we get people making more clearly.
- [34:18]
Ben Ferguson
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- [36:14]
Senator Ted Cruz
Yeah, it was a mistake. It, it, it, that moment was harsh and it seemed too harsh. Look, look, Haley's a talented candidate. She's a talented communicator. She's one of the best communicators on that stage. She had a really good night in the first debate. This one was not nearly as good. That shot was, was mean spirited. It wasn't substantive. In a debate, I think you're almost always better disagreeing with someone on substance rather than just sort of one line, ad hominem attacks. And, and by the way, look, you can disagree with Vivek because you could say that he doesn't have the experience to be president, you could disagree with him on policy, but the guy's not dumb. He, he's a smart guy. So the claim, every time I listen to you, I feel dumber. Like that is a pretty condescending comment that, going back to my point before in a debate, you want truth and authenticity. You want the words coming out of your mouth for people to say, yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, I agree with that and I don't think very many people agreed with that. And so it diminished her more than it diminished Vivek. Now I do think the other candidates on that stage are pretty chippy towards Vivek because he was pretty condescending and nasty to them in debate number one and he made him shine. But there's some grudges that were playing out tonight. I'll also point out that there were moments when Nikki Haley and Tim Scott were going at each other and they were just yelling at each other back and forth and back and forth. And it was kind of a South Carolina pissing fight. And my take on it, that didn't really help either one of them. It was too parochial. I don't know that a whole lot of people care about the internecine fights in South Carolina, and I think the effect of it is that both of them seem to be taking their eye off the ball, that the objective is first to win the primary and then to beat Joe Biden in the general. And I think that back and forth bickering didn't help either one of them in that respect.
- [38:17]
Ben Ferguson
Yeah, it's going to be very interesting to see who gets kicked off that stage come Miami in the next debate there. Don't forget, if you missed our big podcast yesterday, go back and listen to it. We talked about those payments coming in, the Biden crime family from Beijing. That news is still not being covered by the media. If you missed it, make sure you go back and listen to that as well and share it on social media. Also, in the in between days between verdict, make sure you download my show, the Ben Ferguson Podcast as well. I'll keep you updated on the breaking news in between verdict shows and we'll see you back here in a couple of days.