What's Next after Kirk's Tragedy, Christians Persecuted in Nigeria & Tucker plus Osama Bin Laden Equals Week In Review

Summary

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The 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson

Episode: What's Next after Kirk's Tragedy, Christians Persecuted in Nigeria & Tucker plus Osama Bin Laden Equals Week In Review
Date: September 13, 2025

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Overview

In this emotionally charged week-in-review, Ben Ferguson is joined by Senator Ted Cruz to reflect on three major stories:

1. The aftermath and societal impact of Charlie Kirk’s assassination.
2. The underreported, ongoing persecution of Christians in Nigeria and Senator Cruz’s related legislative efforts.
3. Controversial recent comments by Tucker Carlson regarding Osama bin Laden, Hamas, and American foreign policy.

With candid conversation, personal anecdotes, and pointed critique, the episode navigates the current divides in American politics, religious freedom abroad, and the boundaries of political and moral discourse in media.

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1. The Aftermath of Charlie Kirk’s Assassination

(00:35–06:48)

Key Discussion Points

• Personal Impact:
  Ben recounts the difficulty of explaining Kirk’s murder to his son, reflecting on the fear and tension felt by conservative commentators today.

  “When I put him to bed last night, he knew that daddy's friend had died and he said, ‘daddy, is someone going to shoot you for what you do?’ … I said, buddy, you know Daddy carries a gun. You know, Daddy shoots back and he just started crying.”
  —Ben Ferguson (00:56)

• Broader Societal Divide:
  Both recognize the climate of political hatred, invoking parallels to past high-profile assassinations (JFK, Bobby Kennedy, MLK) and recent attacks (Trump in Butler). Senator Cruz expresses disgust at those celebrating Kirk’s death online:

  “It made me physically sick, the joy at his being murdered.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (03:40)

• A Call for Unity:
  Cruz highlights a conciliatory post from progressive commentator Cenk Uygur as an example of how Americans might respond differently:

  “If you really want to strike back at whoever did this, listen to each other. Instead of hating one another, they want us to hate each other. Treating… as a united America, would be an historic act of defiance.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz, quoting Cenk Uygur (05:20)

• Charlie’s Legacy:
  They recall Kirk’s belief in dialogue and his commitment to liberty, faith, and love.

  “Charlie’s message was one of love. It was one of liberty. It was one of the constitution... It was one of hope. It was one of faith.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (06:22)

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2. The Persecution of Christians in Nigeria

(08:06–18:22)

Key Discussion Points

• Scope and Scale of Violence:
  Senator Cruz details the staggering numbers:

  • Over 50,000 Christians murdered by Boko Haram since 2009 (08:54)
  • 18,000+ churches and 2,000+ schools attacked (09:17)
  • 145 priests kidnapped between 2015–2025 (09:40)
  • Recent attacks killing over 200 Christian villagers (10:36)

• Legislative Response:
  Cruz introduces his Nigeria Religious Freedom Accountability Act of 2025:

  • Mandates the State Department to classify Nigeria as a "country of particular concern" on religious liberty (11:17)
  • Direct sanctions on Nigerian officials complicit in persecution
  • Continued terrorist organization designation for Boko Haram and ISIS West Africa

• Government Complicity and U.S. Inaction:
  Cruz criticizes the Biden administration for turning a blind eye, contrasting this with his own advocacy and providing an historical example—Miriam Ibrahim’s imprisonment and eventual release due to international pressure (13:10–15:39).

  “Her crime was being a Christian. … She gave birth to a little girl… in that prison cell. … She was in the mud giving birth in leg irons."
  —Senator Ted Cruz (14:19)

  He recalls asking Ibrahim how she kept hope:

  “She looked at me very, very calmly and she just said, ‘Jesus was with me.’”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (17:13)

• Moral and Strategic Leverage:
  Cruz advocates using visa sanctions on Nigerian officials to effect change. (17:57)

  “If you sanction the individual government officials who are complicit... that can have a real and powerful effect.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (17:57)

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3. Tucker Carlson, Osama Bin Laden, and the Politics of Condolence

(19:44–32:16)

Key Discussion Points

• Tucker Carlson’s Comments on Bin Laden:
  Carlson’s willingness to express condolences to Bin Laden’s family sparks incredulity:

  “I would be totally comfortable sharing condolences with Osama bin Laden's family. I hate Osama bin Laden. On the other hand, if somebody dies, it's okay to say I'm sorry to his family that he had a toddler.”
  —Tucker Carlson (20:28)

  Cruz reacts sharply:

  “This is a bizarre position… By his same reasoning, he'd be just fine giving condolences to Adolf Hitler's family. Let me tell you right now, I am not remotely sorry that Osama bin Laden is dead… If people are evil, psychotic mass murderers, then society celebrates that they are no longer with us.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (21:13)

• Discussion of Hamas:
  Carlson implies Hamas may be more political than terrorist, a claim Cruz and Ferguson strongly dispute:

  “I don't know if that's true, by the way. It seems more like a political organization, but whatever it is, they're telling us constantly they're Al Qaeda, so it can't also be true that Christians are a member of Al Qaeda.”
  —Tucker Carlson (24:49)

  Cruz retorts:

  “Let me be very clear. Hamas is a terrorist organization... Globally, it's designated as such by the United States… by Australia, by Canada, by Paraguay, by Israel…”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (25:38)

  He provides extensive evidence from the Hamas Charter, Wikipedia, and historical attacks (25:53–27:56).

• Critique of Carlson’s Media Approach:
  Cruz notes Carlson’s pattern:

  • Criticizing U.S. foreign policy
  • Hosting adversarial leaders with soft interviews (Iran, Russia)
  • Targeting then-President Trump’s staff via proxy

  “He doesn't have the courage... to actually attack Trump. So he just attacks everything Trump does.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (30:27)

• Concerns Over Moral Relativism:
  Both hosts stress the dangers of equivocating over obvious acts of evil and aligning rhetoric with figures on the political far-left.

  “If you say something publicly and the words you said are indistinguishable from something said by Ilhan Omar or Rashida Talib, that ought to be a sign you've got a problem.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (31:41)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• Ben on Explaining Violence to Children:

  “When I put him to bed last night, he knew that daddy's friend had died and he said, ‘daddy, is someone going to shoot you for what you do?’” (00:56)

• Cruz's Historical Analogy:

  “You and I were not alive when JFK was shot or Bobby Kennedy was shot or Martin Luther King was shot. But I do kind of wonder if that's a little bit what this felt like…” (02:46)

• Miriam Ibrahim’s Faith:

  “‘How did you not lose hope?’ … She just said, ‘Jesus was with me.’” (17:13)

• On Moral Clarity:

  “If people are evil, psychotic mass murderers, then society celebrates that they are no longer with us. There is justice.”
  —Senator Ted Cruz (21:41)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Charlie Kirk's assassination and aftermath: 00:35–06:48
• Persecution of Christians in Nigeria: 08:06–18:22
• Tucker Carlson, Osama bin Laden, and Hamas: 19:44–32:16

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Tone and Style

The episode is direct, impassioned, and unapologetically conservative. Both hosts combine personal reflection, advocacy, and combative criticism of political opponents and perceived moral ambiguity in media. The tone alternates between somber (Kirk’s death, Nigerian persecution) and fiery (responses to Carlson, defense of U.S. positions).

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For listeners seeking unvarnished conservative commentary and inside-the-Beltway takes on recent news and political culture wars, this episode offers potent, emotionally resonant analysis and a call to defend American and Christian values at home and abroad.

Transcript

[Mary Kathryn Ham or Carol Markowitz]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Ben Ferguson]

Welcome. It is verdict with Ted Cruz. We can review Ben Ferguson with you. And we had some really tough stories that you may have missed that we talked about this week. First up, we're going to take some time and talk about Charlie Kirk, our dear friend, and the assassination and what comes next. We're going to deal with that first. We're also going to talk about the persecution of Christians in Nigeria and Senator Cruz is leading the way on trying to stop what's happening on that. And finally, some shocking comments coming from Tucker Carlson on Osama bin Laden and his family. It's the weekend review and it starts right now. Center. I also want to talk about. There is a question. I'm sure you've gotten it. I've gotten it too. And that is what's next. This is a moment where my 9 year old asked me that I think the toughest question I've ever been asked by him. When I put him to bed last night, he knew that daddy's friend had died and he said, daddy, is someone going to shoot you for what you do? And I gave him the best answer I could. I said, buddy, you know Daddy carries a gun. You know, Daddy shoots back and he just started crying. And I think there are so many people right now that are worried about where we are in this divide and this feeling that the left is just wanting to take out anybody that is successful in articulating conservative or Christian views. I do worry about where we are as a country. I also think that you and I and so many others that do this, everybody that I've been texting and talking with, I don't think any of us are going to back down. We maybe do things a little differently. We may take different precautions, but I don't think they're going to silence any of us. I'm not backing down. This is my mission field. I think you feel the same way I do.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Absolutely. And listen, I think Charlie inspired many people to speak up and to be brave, to be courageous. I think more people will be inspired. I will say his assassination, it wasn't just a murder it was an assassination. Yeah, he was taken out because of who he is and because of what he was saying. And he was taken out because of fear that what he was saying was so persuasive that people wanted to hear it. Look, when he went to a college campus, he welcomed leftists to come argue with them, to present their side of the story. But, but, but the power of the truth, he was saying, was what was dangerous. And look, I gotta say, I feel a little bit. You and I were not, not alive when, When JFK was shot or Bobby Kennedy was shot or Martin Luther King was shot. But I do kind of wonder if that's a little bit what this. That felt like just, just, I have to say, like seeing this happen, particularly the parallel to President Trump's being shot in Butler, that it was the same thing over and over again, and it was almost a successful assassination of the president. And tragically, it was a successful assassination of Charlie. Like, what is going on? That there is this hate. And I gotta say, by the way, we have seen leftists, we saw people on MSNBC cackling. I saw an image on Twitter of this one soulless young woman dancing and singing that Charlie Kirk had been shot in the neck. I wanted to. It made me physically sick, the joy at his being murdered. But rather than focus on that hate, and we could play those clips, but you don't need to hear those angry haters. I want to focus actually on. On some people on the left that took a right message. And one of them was. Was Sank Angyar, who's. I don't know him, but he's.

[Ben Ferguson]

He's liberal, hardcore liberal. Yeah, he's the young guy.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Yeah. And he put.

[Ben Ferguson]

And. And he got it right, by the way.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

So here's what he posted on X. He said, a while ago, I put out these rules for the Internet. One, when we disagree, we fight. Two, we have a beer afterwards. Three, when we agree, we unite. I got a lot of flack, surprisingly, for the line about the beer, people would ask, oh, yeah, would you have a beer with Charlie Kirk? Well, I did, and I'm glad I did, because now I won't get to. Yes, Charlie and I disagreed a lot about really important things, but somehow we didn't lose our humanity. We were still fellow Americans. We can all choose to hate each other now. That's a normal human reaction. We can choose to blame each other, and I'm sure we will endlessly, or we can defy the voices of division in the country and have a beer together this time. In grief. If you really want to strike back at whoever did this, listen to each other. Instead of hating one another, they want us to hate each other. Treating one another as brothers and sisters, as a united America, would be an historic act of defiance. Since I'm on the left, I'll go first. For everyone on the right, and most especially the Kirk family, I am so sorry for your loss. I share your grief and I want you to know that our hearts are with you. I appreciate sank saying that. I retweeted it and just said bravo like that. I don't want to focus on the haters, on the anger, on the rage, on the evil bile that we see, because that was not Charlie's message. Charlie's message was one of love. It was one of liberty. It was one of the constitution. It was one of the gospel. It was one of hope. It was one of faith. That's where we should focus. And I hope that that is a powerful, powerful legacy coming out of the 31 short years that Charlie had on this earth.

[Ben Ferguson]

Now, if you want to hear the rest of this conversation, you can go back and listen to the full podcast from earlier this week.

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[Mary Kathryn Ham or Carol Markowitz]

Hey there. I'm Mary Kathryn Ham. And I'm Carol Markowitz. We've been in political media for a long time. Long enough to know that it's gotten, well, a little insane. That's why we started normalely a podcast for people who are over the hysteria and just want clarity. We talk about the issues that actually matter to the country without panic, without yelling, and with a healthy dose of humor. We don't take ourselves too seriously, but we do take the truth seriously. So if you're into common sense, sanity, and some occasional sass, you're our kind of people. Catch new episodes of normally every Tuesday and Thursday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen.

[Ben Ferguson]

Now on to story number two. All right, Senator, I want to talk about. We're talking about standing up for people of faith. And this is a story that has certainly been unreported or underreported at best, and it deals with what is Happening with the persecution of Christians in Nigeria. We also just had this attack, as you mentioned, at the beginning of the show, where 60 plus were murdered. Talk a little bit about this and what you're doing to stand up.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Well, in Nigeria, the persecution of Christians has been nothing short of horrific. And I've spent my tenure in the senate advocating for those who are being persecuted for their faith, advocating for Christians who are facing imprisonment and torture and murder. The sheer scope of it in Nigeria is staggering. Boko Haram, the radical Islamist group in Nigeria. Since their 2009 insurgency, Boko Haram has killed over 50,000 Christians in Nigeria. Over 50,000. And that's according to a 2023 report from the International society for civil liberties and the rule of law, which is a Nigerian human rights watchdog. Over 18,000 Christian churches and over 2,000 Christian schools have been attacked during the same time period. And to put that in comparison, the watchdog also concluded that 34,000 moderate Muslims died from jihadist attacks. So the jihadists they target, they target Muslims who don't embrace jihad, but they, especially in Nigeria, target Christians. Between 2015 and 2025, an estimated 145 priests were kidnapped in Nigeria. Uh, multiple priest kidnappings have happened this year, including one that Boko Haram carried out in June. The terror group abducted Father Alphonsus Affina, held him in captivity for weeks before releasing him, and thank God he was unharmed. Athena spent over 50 days in captivity, and. And he had previously spent six years in ministry in the United States. And violence against Christians in Nigeria has been a horrific problem. In June, just a couple of months ago, jihadists killed over 200 Nigerian Christian villagers in a farming community that is 97% Catholic. This is a massive problem. And. And it's a problem that occurs with the complicity of many officials, of judges, of ministers, of officials in the Nigerian government. So what I did this week is I filed legislation that's called the Nigeria Religious freedom Accountability act of 2025. And it does several things. Number one, it requires the Secretary of state to classify Nigeria as a country of particular concern. And that would add Nigeria to a list of countries where religious freedom is severely limited. The State Department's list right now includes Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, North Korea, Iran, Cuba, and other nations outside the western world. And severe violations of religious freedom include torture, detention without charges, forced disappearance, and other flagrant denials of basic rights. Additionally, my legislation would ensure that the State department keeps the Islamist terrorist groups Boko Haram and also ISIS West Africa, designated as entities of particular Concern a classification for non state actors responsible for egregious violations of religious liberty. Boko Haram stronghold is in northeast Nigeria, and it has an active presence in several countries bordering Nigeria. In addition, my bill sanctions Nigerian government officials who facilitate persecution against Christians and other religious minorities. And if the bill were enacted, the State department would have 90 days to submit a report on the Nigerian officials responsible for pushing blasphemy laws and for justifying violence from Islamist groups. This is a very important role for the United States to defend religious liberty, to defend persecuted Christians. And it's been a passion of mine since getting elected to the Senate 13 years ago.

[Ben Ferguson]

You know, this is something that really does concern me. It worries me. And we're seeing and witnessing now so much not just anti Semitism, but just anti faith, anti Christian. And it's happening not just around the world, but also.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Well. Well, Monday's pod. Monday's pod focused on how the Biden Department of Justice actively discriminated against Christians and systematically targeted Christians. Now, thank God they weren't doing things on the level of Boko Haram. They weren't. Weren't kidnapping and murdering them. But. But there was religious discrimination. And part of religious discrimination is the Biden administration effectively turned a blind eye to the persecution of Christians abroad. So it wasn't committed committing these atrocities, but it also was not acting nearly as vigorously as it should be to defend religious liberty abroad.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah, great point there. We're gonna. In this moving forward. Hopefully we'll set a standard that America's not gonna just stand by and allow this to happen, right?

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Well, yes. And Ben, I'll give an example. An example. During the Obama administration, there was a young woman in Sudan named Miriam Ibrahim. And Miriam Ibrahim was sentenced to receive 100 lashes and then to hang by the neck until dead.

[Ben Ferguson]

Wow.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

And her crime was being a Christian.

[Ben Ferguson]

That's it.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

For. For the crime of being a Christian, she was sentenced to that. She was in a prison cell. She had a toddler named Martin who was 18 months old, and she was pregnant. She was pregnant. She gave birth to a little girl named Maya. Maya was born in that prison cell. While Miriam Ibrahim had her legs and leg irons. She was in the mud giving birth in leg irons. Now, during the Obama administration, I repeatedly spoke out for Miriam Ibrahim. I went to the Senate floor. I spoke about Miriam Ibrahim. I called for Sudan to release Miriam Ibrahim from this persecution. Others spoke out. Other foreign governments spoke out. The Pope spoke out in defense of Miriam Ibrahim. You know who wouldn't speak out in Defense of her.

[Ben Ferguson]

Who is that?

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Barack Obama.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

The entire course of his presidency, he would not say her name. Samantha Power, who was Obama's ambassador to the United Nations. I have a pretty good relationship with Samantha. And on Miriam Ibrahim, Samantha Power was actually quite good. She spoke out, urging Sudan to let Miriam Ibrahim go. I practically begged, Samantha Power, why won't Obama say her name? Look, we can disagree on political and partisan issues.

[Ben Ferguson]

Political.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

But she's in prison and sentenced to die for being a Christian. The entire course of his presidency, I could not get Obama to say her name even once. Ultimately, though, the international pressure became so acute that the government of Sudan gave in. She was married. Miriam is married to a man from New Hampshire. And so Sudan released her and she came to the United States to be with her husband. I met Miriam Ibrahim at a gathering and she was speaking about her experience and speaking out for religious liberty. And I gotta say, Miriam is a tiny woman. She's maybe, I don't know, five foot one. I would be surprised if she weighs even 100 pounds. She's a very, very small woman. And she was soft spoken. And I asked her, look, you and I are both Christians. Our faith matters to us.

[Ben Ferguson]

Sure.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

But you know what? I've never been tested. I've never been imprisoned for my faith. I've never been told I'm gonna die. We will murder you unless you renounce your faith. I hope and pray and believe I would do the right thing and say, absolutely not. But I've never been tested with that. And so when I met her, I asked her, I said, look, when you're in that prison cell, when they are threatening to torture you and murder you, when you're looking at your babies, your. Your toddler son and your newborn daughter and you know that they're about to execute you, how did you not lose hope? How did you not give in to despair? And, Ben, she looked at me very, very calmly and she just said, jesus was with me.

[Ben Ferguson]

Wow.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

And it was powerful. And I'm hopeful that my voice then played a part in ratcheting up the pressure to get her released from prison. And so my hope in Nigeria, I'm going to press to get this legislation passed. I want to see the Trump administration designate Nigeria and use pressure. And in particular, there is power to pressuring the Nigerian government officials, because you know what, ministers of foreign governments, they like to get visas and take their wives to New York to go shopping.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

And if you sanction the individual government officials who are complicit, who are facilitating it who are enforcing and prosecuting so called blasphemy laws that can have a real and powerful effect. And so my hope is this legislation is shining a light, will protect the Christians who are in Nigeria and will stop the the, the wide scale of murder of Christians that has been going on in Nigeria.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah, Amen to that. As before, if you want to hear the rest of this conversation on this topic, you can go back and download the podcast from earlier this week to hear the entire thing.

[NFL Shop Announcer]

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[Mary Kathryn Ham or Carol Markowitz]

Hey there. I'm Mary Kathryn Ham. And I'm Carol Markowitz. We've been in political media for a long time. Long enough to know that it's gotten, well, a little insane. That's why we started normalely a podcast for people who are over the hysteria and just want clarity. We talk about the issues that actually matter to the country without panic, without yelling and with a healthy dose of humor. We don't take ourselves too seriously, but we do take the truth seriously. So if you're into common sense, sanity and some occasional sass, you're our kind of people. Catch new episodes of normally every Tuesday and Thursday on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen.

[Ben Ferguson]

I want to get back to the big story number three of the week. You may have missed at number two to the list real quick because if you, if you go Hitler first, let's throw in there next for, especially for people that are, I don't know, 45 and under. The, the most evil guy that we probably saw in our lifetime in, in real life and that was a guy by the name of Osama bin Laden, right? Like throw him out there. 9, 11, if you were alive, if you remember it, Osama bin Laden's another one. Don't, don't side with Adolf Hitler. And if you were my age, I'm 44 now. Don't, whatever you do, don't side with Osama bin Laden. Which brings us to this unhinged Tucker point number two.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Yeah, okay. I just want you to listen to what Tucker had to say about Osama bin Laden. Give a listen.

[Tucker Carlson]

Let me just say I would be totally comfortable Sharing condolences with Osama bin Laden's family. I hate Osama bin Laden. On the other hand, if somebody dies, it's okay to say I'm sorry to his family that he had a toddler. That's what I'm saying.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Tucker Carlson]

That's immaterial. I would say that to the family of an executed murderer in a prison. It doesn't mean I support the murder or the murderer. But this is family like that's okay. That's called like human decency. And anyone who's against that.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Tucker Carlson]

And it seemed that we're setting up this.

[Ben Ferguson]

Let me just be clear. If I meet any of the Osama bin Laden family member center, I'm not going to walk up back. Let me give you an American hug real quick. Thoughts and prayers like, no, that's not gonna happen.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Look, this is a bizarre position that, that Tucker says he's okay with giving condolences to Osama bin Laden's family. By the way, on his same reasoning, he'd be just fine giving condolences to Adolf Hitler's family. Let me tell you right now, I am not remotely sorry that Osama bin Laden is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that Adolf Hitler is dead. By the way, I'm not remotely sorry that Jeffrey Dahmer is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that Ted Bundy is dead. I'm not remotely sorry that Charles Manson is dead.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

If people are evil, psychotic mass murderers, then society celebrates that they are no longer with us. There is justice. I believe in the principle of justice and understand Osama bin Laden led Al Qaeda. He planned 9 11. He executed 9 11. In which case nearly 3,000 people, most of whom were Americans, were murdered on September 11th. You and I were both alive. I was in Washington D.C. heidi was in the White House at the U.S. trade Representative's office. On 9 11, she evacuated the White House because those terrorists were murdering people. I lost a friend of mine, Barbara Olson, in the plane that crashed into the Pentagon when the two towers collapsed in New York City. That was a grotesque act of war, by the way. I'm also not sorry I that the kamikaze pilots in Pearl harbor who murdered American sailors. I'm not sorry that they're dead. There is something bizarre. There is a moral relativism to saying, well, we should, number one, carry out an incredible military act that takes out Osama bin Laden. But then, number two, express condolences to the family, to the toddlers. We're so sorry we took out your psychotic daddy who murdered nearly 3,000Americans. No, we're not sorry. And this moral relativism, I gotta say, it is a weird thing.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

When someone who considers himself. Calls himself a conservative sounds exactly like Ilhan Omar. It is a weird thing when a supposed conservative sounds like Rashida Tlaib the sounds like the AOC and says, gosh, we ought to be saying I'm sorry to Osama bin Laden's family. No, we should not.

[Ben Ferguson]

By the way, it's also weird that he goes in this way, like attacking America and our foreign policy, in essence, and. And anybody that doesn't feel sorry for terrorists while also giving propaganda out there on behalf of Vladimir Putin in Russia with the interview that he did with him and then going shopping at the grocery store saying how great life is in Russia, which If you go 20 miles outside of Russia in any direction of Moscow, it's very different than what it looks like for the elite that are in Moscow. And everything in his trip was, by the way, also controlled. They only let you see what they want you to see. It's not like he can roam freely and decide, hey, I don't want to go the earth shore you sent me to. I want to go to another one. That ain't going to happen. And that. And then, then you go from this to what he had to say about a terrorist organization that has killed countless Jews and has said from the river to the sea, they want to take out and annihilate all, all Jews in Israel. They want Israel to cease to exist. And he's like, well, hold on a second. Maybe they're not a terrorist organization. Maybe they're just a political organization. We should think about that. It's like, what the hell's going on?

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Yeah, give a listen to what he said about Hamas, because this is utterly bizarre. This, this is where Tucker has gone full on woke leftist. And don't take my word for it. Listen to Tucker.

[Tucker Carlson]

No one can plausibly claim that a Christian family are in Hamas. Okay, so, like, what? Tell me. You can't claim that they're in Hamas while simultaneously claiming that Hamas is, you know, group of jihadis. They're Islamic extremists, which they also claim constantly, which I don't. I don't know if that's true, by the way. It seems more like a political organization, but whatever it is, they're telling us constantly they're Al Qaeda, so it can't also be true that Christians are a member of Al Qaeda.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Sorry. Yeah, yeah.

[Tucker Carlson]

So then we know they're not in Hamas. So why did they get killed? Why was their church?

[Ben Ferguson]

I go back to this and I. Again, it's like he's become an apologist for a terrorist organization. And he's saying, well, they're not really a terrorist organization. They, they, they, they're. And, and then the Christian aspect of this and intertwining that they're going, well, then why do we kill them? We kill people that are terrorists, and that's what we do.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Well, what he's saying there is bizarre. I don't know that Hamas is a terrorist organization. Let me be very clear. Hamas is a terrorist organization.

[Ben Ferguson]

They'll tell you that. By the way, am I wrong? Like, they'll actually tell you they're a terrorist organization. They're happy to tell you this and show you how good they are at it.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

Al Qaeda is a terrorist organization. ISIS is a terrorist organization. This is not just a question of opinion. This is a question of fact. So let's give some fact. Article 8 of the 1988 Hamas Covenant states, quote, jihad is its path, and death for the sake of Allah is the loftiest of his wishes. This is who Tucker Carlson is defending. Globally, Hamas is designated a terrorist organization by the United States of America. That's as a matter of federal law. By Australia, by Canada, by Paraguay, by Israel, by Japan, by New Zealand, by the United Kingdom and the European Union. Now, Hamas is not formally designated by Arab countries, but Hamas is a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. By the way, I have legislation in the Senate right now to designate the Muslim Brotherhood as a terrorist organization because they unquestionably are. Article 2 of Hamas Charter describes them as, quote, one of the wings of the Muslim Brotherhood in Palestine. Yeah, the Muslim Brotherhood, the umbrella organization, is designated as a terrorist organization in Bahrain, in Egypt, in Saudi Arabia, and in the uae. They have always been a terrorist organization. If you just look at Wikipedia. No, no friend of Israel, no enemy of Hamas. Here's what Wikipedia says. Quote. From 2000 to 2004, Hamas was responsible for killing nearly 400 Israelis and wounding more than 2,425 attacks. According to the Israeli Ministry of Foreign affairs, from 2001 through May of 2008, Hamas launched more than 3,000 Qassam rockets and 2,500 mortar attacks into Israel. And of course, Hamas is who carried out the October 7 attacks, who sent death squads into Israel, where they systematically went house to house, murdering every person in the house, targeting them because they are Jews. They murdered elderly people, they murder women, they murdered children, they murdered infants, they murdered toddlers, they Raped women and little girls, and they murdered over 1200 Israelis, many of whom were Americans. It's one of the worst terror attacks in history against American citizens. And Tucker says, well, I think they're a political organization. He bases this on the weird fact. Yes, it is true that in the Gaza Strip, when they had elections, Hamas won. The fact that the voters elected a terrorist organization does not make them a political organization. They were in elected office when they carried out the October 7th terror attacks. And so I got to say, look, this bizarre statement was in the course of an episode where Tucker was interviewing this disgruntled State Department employee who was fired. Fired by the Trump administration.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yep.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

And he was giving him an opportunity. And by the way, he was also slandering a young man who works for the State Department, works for Mike Huckabee, the President Trump's ambassador to Israel, works for Marco Rubio. And Tucker did an entire segment attacking this young man. Why? Because he's Mark Levin stepson. I gotta say, it is grotesque for Tucker to go after. I get. He hates Mark Levin.

[Ben Ferguson]

He does. And let's explain why real quick. Because, look, Mark's a dear friend of mine and yours as well. This is a relative Mark Levin. Mark Levin is clearly an advocate for Israel. He has stood there.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

And for America, let's be clear. And for America.

[Ben Ferguson]

America. And so now since Tucker Carlson, I guess, is like, all right, well, anybody that I don't like, right. Mark Levin, a family member. Let's just hammer that person to somehow make it hurt. I wish he had this much animosity towards Vladimir Putin when he was interviewing him.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

No, and by the way, not just Vladimir Putin. He had the president of Iran. And I mean, it was a love fest. I mean, he practically spooned with the president of Iran. I don't know if he was big spoon or little spoon, but, but, but there was no skepticism. And by the way, he's literally interviewing someone who is actively trying to murder Donald Trump. And this is a weird game. So listen, Tucker recognizes that the folks that listen to him will get very mad at him if he explicitly criticizes Donald Trump. So what does he do instead? He just criticizes everything Trump does. He blast. He has a whole segment on how Mike Huckabee is terrible. Well, who is it that appointed Mike Huckabee the ambassador to Israel? That would be Donald J. Trump. And everything he attacks about Ambassador Huckabee, he is doing on behalf of Trump. But Tucker is unwilling. He doesn't have the courage. He doesn't have the backbone to actually attack Trump. So he just attacks everything Trump does. He attacks bombing Iran. Well, who was the commander in chief who made the order? And by the way, that was an incredibly successful military operation that made America safer. I got to say, listen, if you say something publicly and the words you said are indistinguishable from something said by Ilhan Omar or Rashida Talib, that ought to be a sign you've got a problem. And I don't know what's going on with Tucker. I don't know what is driving. It's one thing to feel kind of isolationist and to say, gosh, you know, I don't like wars. Okay, fine. That, that, that is a view. And to be clear, Donald Trump doesn't like wars either. Joe Biden and the Democrats get us in war. President Trump has gotten us out of war. But getting us out of war, you do it through strength. And getting us out of war does not mean that you refuse to defend America. Fine. If Tucker wants to be isolationist, knock yourself out.

[Ben Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Senator Ted Cruz]

But this bizarre apology and defense of Osama bin Laden and defense of Hamas and defense of the president of Iran, that is, there is something unhinged. And I hope people around Tucker go in and say, come on, man, come on, let's say we love America and we're not going to lie to the American people.

[Ben Ferguson]

As always, thank you for listening to Verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you. Don't forget to download my podcast. And you can listen to my podcast every other day. You're not listening to Verdict or each day when you listen to Verdict afterwards. I'd love to have you as a listener to again, the Ben Ferguson Podcast. And we will see you back here on Monday morning.

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[Senator Ted Cruz]

Com.

[Mary Kathryn Ham or Carol Markowitz]

This is an iHeart podcast.