What’s Three Trillion Between Friends?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "What’s Three Trillion Between Friends?"

Podcast Information:

• Title: The 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson
• Host/Author: Premiere Networks
• Episode Title: What’s Three Trillion Between Friends?
• Release Date: August 15, 2020

Introduction In the episode titled "What’s Three Trillion Between Friends?" hosted by Ben Ferguson on The 47 Morning Update, the discussion centers around the escalating figures in coronavirus relief bills proposed by different factions within the U.S. government. The conversation delves deep into the specifics of each bill, their implications on the economy, and the underlying political motivations driving these massive expenditures.

1. Overview of Coronavirus Relief Bills

The podcast begins with an analysis of the current state of coronavirus relief legislation in Washington, D.C. Senator Ted Cruz introduces the primary focus: the discrepancy in proposed spending between the House and Senate bills.

• Senator Cruz's Observation:
  "Some people want to spend 1 trillion, some people want to spend 3 trillion. I'm sure by the time this is all over, we'll be up 10, 11, however many trillion."
  (00:00)

This statement underscores the concerns about unchecked government spending and its long-term economic repercussions.

2. The House vs. Senate Proposals

The heart of the discussion lies in contrasting the House and Senate relief bills.

• House Bill (Pelosi’s Proposal):
  Michael Knowles critiques Speaker Nancy Pelosi's bill, highlighting its substantial size and lack of bipartisan negotiation.
  "That was a bill, frankly, that she didn't negotiate with senators, she didn't talk to Republicans. She just passed it on a party line vote. And it's basically every gift she can give to her party supporters. It's intended to be a campaign document."
  (04:26)

  Notably, the House bill allocates significant funds to sectors like the marijuana industry, which Knowles suggests is a strategic move to appease specific voter bases without directly addressing job creation.

• Senate Bill (Republican Proposal):
  In contrast, the Senate's version, proposed by Senate Republican leadership, aims to spend $1 trillion. While it mirrors some elements of the House bill, it emphasizes more on sustaining employment and supporting businesses.
  "It sends everyone a $1,200 check again. It re ups the PPP, the Paycheck Protection Program, so it spends more on that."
  (06:02)

3. Unemployment Benefits and Economic Incentives

A significant portion of the discussion centers on unemployment compensation and its role in economic recovery.

• Critique of Expanded Unemployment Benefits:
  Knowles points out the unintended consequences of enhanced unemployment benefits, where recipients receive more than their previous wages, potentially discouraging them from returning to work.
  "68% of the people receiving these unemployment benefits are making more from unemployment than they were making their jobs. 20% are making twice as much."
  (13:17)

  This leads to the argument that such measures, while well-intentioned, may hinder the overall recovery by reducing the incentive for individuals to seek employment.

4. Introduction of the Recovery Act

In response to the shortcomings of both major bills, Michael Knowles introduces an alternative, the "Recovery Act," which prioritizes tax cuts and deregulation to stimulate job growth.

• Key Components of the Recovery Act:

  • Elimination of Payroll Tax:
    "Eliminating the payroll tax for the rest of the year. That has an immediate effect of giving every worker in America a raise."
    (11:38)

  • Tax-Free Earnings:
    "For the next $10,000 you earn this year, it's totally tax-free, no federal income tax."
    (11:47)

  • Health Savings Accounts Expansion:
    "Every American can have a health savings account. And that lets them save for healthcare in a way that is tax advantaged to meet their needs."
    (16:19)

  • School Choice:
    "A federal tax credit for contributions to scholarship granting organizations in K through 12. Education massively expands choice for parents."
    (17:02)

  These measures aim to create a more conducive environment for businesses to thrive and for individuals to return to work by reducing financial and regulatory burdens.

5. Political Strategies and Motivations

The discussion delves into the political underpinnings influencing the creation and support of these bills.

• Pelosi and Schumer’s Political Agenda:
  Knowles speculates that the Democratic leaders are leveraging the relief bills as tools to secure political favor ahead of elections, potentially prioritizing party interests over effective economic solutions.
  "They may have made the political judgment. We'll blame it all on them."
  (18:50)

• Republican Concerns:
  Both hosts express frustration with the bipartisan deadlock and the potential long-term economic implications of excessive government spending.

6. Broader Political and Social Commentary

Beyond the relief bills, the hosts touch upon various other topics reflecting on the current political and social climate.

• Impact on Comedy and Media:
  "Comedy is incredibly potent, especially because the left has destroyed comedy... Saturday Night Live on comedy has been spectacular, but it's not funny anymore because their only script is we hate Donald Trump."
  (20:43)

  This segment criticizes the perceived decline in genuine humor within mainstream media, attributing it to partisan biases.

• Election Concerns and Potential Unrest:
  The conversation transitions to anxieties surrounding the upcoming elections, discussing fears of political violence and societal division.
  "If Trump wins reelection, I think the left will go in paroxysms of... they view it as a crazy fluke and their resolve never to let it again."
  (25:11)

  The hosts express concerns over the stability and unity of the nation amidst heightened political tensions.

7. Conclusion: Optimism Amidst Uncertainty

Despite the grim outlook, the hosts conclude on a note of optimism, emphasizing the belief that truth and justice will ultimately prevail. They acknowledge the challenges ahead but maintain confidence in the resilience of democratic principles.

• Final Thoughts:
  "Truth doesn't win every skirmish. It doesn't win every battle. It doesn't guarantee the result in this election. But I believe over time, truth prevails."
  (27:29)

Notable Quotes:

• "We will get into the specifics of each bill being proposed." – Ted Cruz (00:00)
• "Marijuana appears more frequently in the Nancy Pelosi bill than does the word jobs." – Michael Knowles (05:10)
• "68% of the people receiving these unemployment benefits are making more from unemployment than they were making their jobs." – Michael Knowles (13:17)
• "Eliminating the payroll tax for the rest of the year. That has an immediate effect of giving every worker in America a raise." – Michael Knowles (11:38)
• "Comedy is incredibly potent, especially because the left has destroyed comedy." – Michael Knowles (20:43)
• "If Trump wins reelection, I think the left will go in paroxysms of..." – Michael Knowles (25:11)
• "Truth doesn't win every skirmish. It doesn't win every battle. It doesn't guarantee the result in this election. But I believe over time, truth prevails." – Michael Knowles (27:29)

Conclusion

In "What’s Three Trillion Between Friends?", Ted Cruz and Michael Knowles offer a critical examination of the proposed coronavirus relief bills, highlighting the disparities in spending and the potential economic consequences of such large-scale government expenditures. Through their in-depth analysis and alternative proposals, they advocate for policies that prioritize job creation and economic freedom over extensive government spending. The episode encapsulates the prevailing political tensions and debates surrounding the best path forward in the midst of the COVID-19 pandemic.

Transcript

[Ted Cruz]

The senators remain in D.C. a coronavirus relief bill is back on the table. Some people want to spend 1 trillion, some people want to spend 3 trillion. I'm sure by the time this is all over, we'll be up 10, 11, however many trillion. Well, everybody is here trying to spend money. Nobody's pocketbook is safe. We will get into the specifics of each bill being proposed. This is Verdict with Ted Cruz. Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz. I'm Michael Noel and I gotta tell you, Senator, we're talking about a lot of big numbers today, but beyond legislation, there's a really big number on this show. We're now north of 14 million downloads. And beyond that, we have 4.7 out of 5 star reviews. That's our average rating. And I got to tell you, usually for political shows, the lefties come in and they spam you with one star reviews. So that is pretty good.

[Michael Knowles]

So do you think the folks watching this one could up that to 4.8?

[Ted Cruz]

You know, it would help if you could just go leave a five star review on Apple podcasts, Google Play, Stitcher, wherever you're at. That would be terrific. You can also obviously find us on YouTube all over the place. We'll send you an audio cassette on a carrier pigeon if you like. Thank you so much to everybody who's.

[Michael Knowles]

We don't have audio cassettes.

[Ted Cruz]

We don't have the A track.

[Michael Knowles]

There are no audio cassettes.

[Ted Cruz]

I'm so conservative. I'm really looking back in time.

[Michael Knowles]

Well, we are writing it with a.

[Ted Cruz]

Quill pen though, every episode.

[Michael Knowles]

Do you know, by the way, that every time you argue a Supreme court case, the U.S. supreme Court, you get not one but two quill pens?

[Ted Cruz]

What?

[Michael Knowles]

They give the advocates two quill pens.

[Ted Cruz]

That seems like wasteful government speaking, but it's very cool.

[Michael Knowles]

On my desk in the Senate office is a cup holder filled with quill pens from arguments I've done.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, you've argued a number of these. I've got to go and see these quills at some point.

[Michael Knowles]

And by the way, you know what you can do with a quill pen?

[Ted Cruz]

What can you do?

[Michael Knowles]

You can hit subscribe on YouTube. It may not work.

[Ted Cruz]

I don't know.

[Michael Knowles]

It'd be worth trying. You could like poke at it.

[Ted Cruz]

We don't want any liability here for damage to your computer screen, but we do want you to subscribe. So go on and ring that bell and hopefully we'll bring that number north of 15 million or 16 million or maybe north of 3 trillion as we talk about this coronavirus spending. I would like to pivot a moment to something that I know is on everybody else's mind as well. The fact that you are still in D.C. is, I think, not something that senators are very happy about, because the senators are supposed to be home on vacation right now. But you're all still in town.

[Michael Knowles]

Well, actually not quite yet. So we were supposed to be here anyway. So this week was scheduled to be the last week of session and then.

[Ted Cruz]

You go into vacation.

[Michael Knowles]

So actually vacation's not the right phrase for it. So to be fair, look, nobody accuses politicians of working too much. But I will say the usual schedule of the Senate, like in any given week, any given month is typically you have three weeks in session and one week that it's called like the state work period, where you're back in the state, but if you're doing your job, you're on the road, you're traveling a state like Texas, you're traveling all over the place. So, so it, when you're not in session, you're still working, it's not, not.

[Ted Cruz]

Exactly relaxing to be going all over the state.

[Michael Knowles]

So for the month of August, typically there are five weeks where you're not in session. And you, you plan all sorts of different. You plan trips, you plan events, you plan all sorts of things. Now, in Covid, it's a little weird because scheduling anything is difficult. One of the strange things about the Senate. So we don't know if there's gonna be a deal between the House and Senate. We don't know what's gonna happen.

[Ted Cruz]

This is specifically on a Covid stimulus relief package.

[Michael Knowles]

And so at this point, I think probably what will happen is most senators will go back to their states next week.

[Ted Cruz]

Okay.

[Michael Knowles]

And what leadership has said is, well, if there's a deal cut, we'll give you 24 hours notice and you come back.

[Ted Cruz]

You gotta come back.

[Michael Knowles]

And it's.

[Ted Cruz]

So where does that stand? Because I know there have been a lot of deals on the table. Nancy Pelosi had one, then Mitch McConnell had one, then some Senate Republicans have disagreed with the Republican plan.

[Michael Knowles]

So who would do that?

[Ted Cruz]

I can't imagine what kind of rabble rousers.

[Michael Knowles]

There you go.

[Ted Cruz]

I would never. What is, I mean, even before we get into the merits of it, just what is in those different plans?

[Michael Knowles]

All right, so Nancy Pelosi's is the biggest. And it's a bill that the House passed a couple of months ago, and it's over $3 trillion, about $3.4 trillion.

[Ted Cruz]

What is 3 trillion between friends.

[Michael Knowles]

Look, even in federal government terms, that is a crap ton of money.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

That was a bill, frankly, that she didn't negotiate with senators, she didn't talk to Republicans. She just passed it on a party line vote. And it's basically every gift she can give to her party supporters. It's intended to be a campaign document.

[Ted Cruz]

I mean, I saw one story that she had a handout to the marijuana industry to help cure Covid.

[Michael Knowles]

So the word marijuana appears more frequently in the Nancy Pelosi bill than does the word jobs. And I guess if you're high enough, you don't notice that you're unemployed and broke.

[Ted Cruz]

Who cares?

[Michael Knowles]

I mean, there is a certain kind of Nancy Pelosi sense to it.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, that's right.

[Michael Knowles]

You know, it is. So that's one bill is the House.

[Ted Cruz]

Version doesn't sound great.

[Michael Knowles]

The Senate version that was drafted by Senate Republican leadership is only a trillion. So it's really a bargain still. I mean, it. And unfortunately, it has many of the same elements. It doesn't have all of the. I mean, look, they threw into the Nancy Pelosi bill, voting by mail. They threw all these priorities that have nothing to do with coronavirus, but they figured, all right, let's make all our special interest happy. The Senate version spends a trillion dollars, so it sends everyone a $1,200 check again. Does that again. It re ups the PPP, the Paycheck Protection program, so it spends more on that.

[Ted Cruz]

This is basically for businesses to keep people employed.

[Michael Knowles]

It sends about $100 billion to schools. Now, mind you, many of the schools that are saying they're not gonna open, so it's not clear what they need $100 billion to not teach our kids well.

[Ted Cruz]

But the teachers unions still need money.

[Michael Knowles]

And so there's all these different pockets of money. And right now there are a couple of areas of disagreement. One is just price tag. The difference between 1 trillion and 3.4 trillion. I've joked they're going to compromise and spend 5.

[Ted Cruz]

So is there an alternative to these?

[Michael Knowles]

Well, as it so happens, I rolled one out today. And at the Senate lunch today, I addressed my Republican colleagues and I said, look, my principal criticism with both the Pelosi bill and the McConnell bill is not just the price tag. I think the price tag's too much. But it's a more fundamental concern, which is neither of these bills are focused on jobs. Yeah, we've seen 51 million Americans lose their jobs in the last four months. I mean, you and I, in our lifetimes, that's never happened. Last time we've had numbers like that were the Great Depression.

[Ted Cruz]

That number is so huge. And every week it's ticked up from 20 to 30 to 51 million American workers.

[Michael Knowles]

It's staggering. And so the most problematic aspect of the CARES act. And look, I voted for the CARES act. It was 96 to nothing in the Senate. So every Republican, every Democrat supported it. I supported it. Bernie Sanders supported it.

[Ted Cruz]

CARES act is the first relief bill.

[Michael Knowles]

It's the first big one. There were a couple of smaller ones, but the CARES act was a big bill. It had lots of elements, some that were pretty good, some that were not. The worst element was concerning unemployment compensation. There is a federal plus up of $600 a week. Now, what does that mean? So we've had an unemployment compensation system for a long time where if you lose your job, you can file for unemployment and you get a percentage of your wages, typically. And it's administered at the state level.

[Ted Cruz]

So you don't get 100% of your wages usually.

[Michael Knowles]

You typically get a much smaller percentage. So it's designed to help you, like, make ends meet, but not be comfortable. But, you know, it's not designed to be a permanent situation. Well, in the CARES act, federal government plus that, up 600 bucks a week in the state of Texas. Let me give you some specifics. Used to be the maximum under unemployment was $521 a week.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

Add 600 new federal dollars, that takes it from 521 to 1121 a week. Now, 1121 a week, that works out to about $58,000 a year. That's about $28 an hour. Now look, if you're, if you're a doctor, if you're making 100 bucks an hour, $28 an hour is not deeply attractive. But if you're working in an hourly job, if you're working at a movie theater, if you work at a bowling alley, if you're a waiter or a waitress and you're making 9, 10, 11 bucks an hour, suddenly the government is paying you more, and in a lot of instances, a lot more not to work than to work.

[Ted Cruz]

So why do they put that in the. It seems to me they put that in the bill. I don't think it's a coincidence that it's an election year.

[Michael Knowles]

So look, shoveling money out of Washington is something the Democrats are good at.

[Ted Cruz]

Right.

[Michael Knowles]

And in this instance, I think it's the most cynical portion. So in Nancy Pelosi version, it just continues that $600. Pl. Okay, just. Just keeps going and going and going. And there's a reason for that. I think Pelosi and Schumer have decided that the way they win in November is if 51 million people are still unemployed, that their objective is shut the entire country down, shut every business down, shut every school down, and have everyone sitting at home alone and broke and unemployed and pissed off and depressed and pessimistic about the future. And I think they think, bingo, Joe Biden wins if that happens. And so every bit of the. Of the Democratic bill is designed to make sure nobody goes back to work. They don't want anyone to go back to work. Now, the stupid thing about the Republican bill is it has the same ideas. It just spends less money. I mean, we basically take Pelosi's agenda and say, well, we're gonna be cheaper. We'll do the same things.

[Ted Cruz]

Right. We just won't fund it as well.

[Michael Knowles]

But, and I urged Republican senators today, I said, look, in a battle to be Santa Claus, the Dems will always outbid us. There's no limit to how much money they will borrow and try to give away. So here's what we ought to do instead, is we ought to bring jobs back, which means we ought to be cutting taxes, cutting regulations from small businesses. Millions of small businesses shut down during this crisis. A lot of them are just starting to open, but they don't know if they're gonna survive. They're scared. We had to be cutting taxes, cutting regulations, so that those small businesses can open and they can rehire their employees and they can survive.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

So I introduced a bill called the Recovery act. And it is focused, instead of just spending cash, it's focused on reducing taxes and reducing regulations to get people back at work. So what are some of the elements of the Recovery Act? Eliminating the payroll tax for the rest of the year. That has an immediate effect of giving every worker in America a raise. Right now, in your next paycheck, you.

[Ted Cruz]

Get a raise, and it makes. It's not that it only gives the workers a raise. It also incentivizes the employers who pay part of that to rehire their workers.

[Michael Knowles]

So half the payroll tax is paid by the employer, half is paid by the employee. So it makes it less expensive for employers to have employees and the employees get a raise. And that is an incentive then for people to go work. It's an incentive for small businesses to hire employees. But not only that, the Recovery act also says for the next $10,000 you earn this year, it's Totally tax free, no federal income tax. Again, it's about a marginal incentive. If you look at economics, you look at basic principles of economics, what matters are the marginal incentives. The incentives on if you do X, what is your reward or your detriment?

[Ted Cruz]

Okay, it's funny because it's a technical point you're making. So I want to make sure we're getting it right because it seems so simple. You know, in the Democrat bill, or I guess even in the Republican leadership bill, it's just about tossing money out. Whereas here it's very simple, just on the margins. If you want to see an action, you need to incentivize that action.

[Michael Knowles]

If you want more work, you want more jobs, you want to incentivize more work and more jobs, make it more profitable for employees and for employers to have more work and more jobs. And look, I've said a bunch of times, you know the little book, everything we need to know in life we learned in kindergarten. We know that at our home with our family, if you want your kids to, to do the dishes, you say, I'll give you five bucks to do the dishes like that.

[Ted Cruz]

Or you get to eat more candy or you get to stay more.

[Michael Knowles]

Whether it's carrot or stick. What the Democrats are doing is incentivizing, not working. To give you. I mean, the stats are amazing. Right now, 68% of the people receiving these unemployment benefits are making more from unemployment than they were making their jobs. 20% are making twice as much. And you know, when we passed the CARES act, we actually had a Republican amendment at the time, very reasonable, common sense amendment that said simply capped unemployment benefits at whatever you were making.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

Just said you shouldn't make more on unemployment. It shouldn't be more profitable than working. Even that has significant disincentives to work. But we said, okay, look, at a basic minimum, let's not pay people more, not to work, sit at home. Yeah, we had a big debate on the Senate floor. So Dick Durbin, who's really one of the smartest and most capable Democrats.

[Ted Cruz]

Okay.

[Michael Knowles]

He is a worthy adversary and he and I have debated many issues many times. He's on Senate Judiciary with me and we go round and round a lot.

[Ted Cruz]

You know, that's interesting because I pay attention to the Republican senators much more than to the Democrats. There are some who seem not particularly impressive. You're saying Dick Durbin is, is one of the more.

[Michael Knowles]

Durbin smart guy. And one of the things that, that he's good at is he sounds quite reasonable. He doesn't sound as shrill as some of his colleagues he is, but he doesn't sound it and that makes him more effective. So he was down there and I was making this argument on the Senate floor and he came back and he said, you know, that just shows the problem with Cruz. Cruz thinks that the people who've lost their jobs are lazy jerks that just wanna sit on the sofa and don't wanna work. And he's insulting every person who's lost their job in this crisis.

[Ted Cruz]

Is that what you said? I must have missed that.

[Michael Knowles]

Well, and it actually was a great illustration of the argument back and forth of a lot of the differences between Democrats and Republicans because Durbin was doing what demagogues do often, which is turning it into a morality play where you're saying that these people are bad and evil and shiftless. And I actually got up and responded. I said, no, I'm actually saying exactly the opposite, which is people are rational and they respond to incentives and we need to think about what those incentives are. And I said, you know what, you're a single mom and let's say you're waiting tables and suddenly the government pays you twice as much money to stay home. You love your kids, so you're going to respond to that incentive. Of course you are. And it's not that. It's not that you're lazy. It's your, like, if you tell anyone, I'm going to pay you twice as much to do X than Y. Most people will say, all right, I'll do X. Yeah, but that's not helping those individuals. It's not helping the small businesses, it's not helping the economy. But I think Pelosi and Schumer are fine with that because they don't want anyone to work right now. They want everything shut down.

[Ted Cruz]

Right.

[Michael Knowles]

I want to mention a couple other elements in the Recovery act that are important. Health savings accounts.

[Ted Cruz]

Oh, great.

[Michael Knowles]

So really important part of health care reform, Tax advantaged account that you could save to pay health care costs. Here's the problem. Federal law makes it illegal for anyone to have a health savings account unless they have a high deductible insurance policy. And most people don't. So the overwhelming majority of Americans are not allowed to have health savings accounts. So one of the things I have in the Recovery act, every American can have a health savings account. And that lets you look, it's a time of pandemic. People are worried about healthcare for their family. It lets them save for healthcare in a way that is tax advantaged to meet Their needs.

[Ted Cruz]

I have a health savings account. I love it. It's great.

[Michael Knowles]

Most Americans are not allowed to. And we can change that.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

School choice, as you know, I'm passionate about it. I have legislation that provides that you get a federal tax credit for contributions to scholarship granting organizations in K through 12. Education massively expands choice for parents, particularly for parents. Like if you're sitting there and your school is not teaching, you ought to be have the choices to find something else to teach your kids.

[Ted Cruz]

Right.

[Michael Knowles]

These are policies that are pro growth, pro jobs, that are consistent with conservative principles. And actually, to be fair, the school choice proposal that I have is right now in Mitch McConnell's bill. So that's an element. He took my legislation and included it. Now I'll confess I'm quite worried. The teachers unions hate my bill. So I'm quite worried that the Democrats, if there is a deal, will say hell no and that leadership will negotiate it away. That it's basically trade bait. So they're including it, but they aren't gonna fight it. Fight for it.

[Ted Cruz]

Right.

[Michael Knowles]

So. But that would be a very important reform.

[Ted Cruz]

Right. Even the fact that that exists. Right. There are provisions of these bills that are just there to use as leverage when you're negotiating with the other side sometimes certainly. Yeah. So you'll either go home or you'll stick around here. But eventually the Senate will have to come in and vote on this and we'll see what's in the final package.

[Michael Knowles]

Well, maybe there may not be a deal. Really? I don't know. I'm not convinced Nancy Pelosi wants a deal. It's. I think they've made the decision. They may have made the decision. Do no deal insists on give us everything even as bad as Republicans are like surrendering 100% is too big an ask. And I think the Democrats may have made the political judgment. We'll blame it all on them.

[Ted Cruz]

We'll make it really tough until the election for the country and then they.

[Michael Knowles]

Think they're gonna win. If that's the case, if everyone is at home and broke. Yeah, that's how you have a terrible election. And what I'm urging the President, what I'm urging Republicans is, look, I get why Nancy Pelosi wants that. I understand the political self interest. It's cynical, it hurts millions of Americans. But I understand why she's doing it. Why would Republicans be complicit in that though?

[Ted Cruz]

It doesn't help Republicans.

[Michael Knowles]

Are we lemmings? Are we all rushing off the same cliff going, yes, please let's crash on the rocks below. What's up with that?

[Ted Cruz]

Well, unfortunately, I think certainly for some people, that that's exactly what they're doing.

[Michael Knowles]

By the way, did you ever read Douglas Adams, Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy?

[Ted Cruz]

I actually never have. Albeit a classic.

[Michael Knowles]

All right, just for the record, that makes me far geekier than you. I wasn't gonna say it, but okay, so it's three series. The second one is Restaurant at the End of the Universe. And there is a scene when, if I'm remembering right, although I haven't read this in 30 years, but if I'm remembering right, there's a scene where they're sitting at the restaurant and up to the table walks a creature that identifies. This creature has been bred with something that talks and a cow and a lemming, so it's able to speak and it's suicidal. And it walks up and says, so I'm for dinner tonight and let me tell you. So my hindquarters are very, very tender. And I've been. And like your dinner discusses with you which portion of the dinner to be served. And so it's just with the lemming example, it.

[Ted Cruz]

That's an image of the Republican Party.

[Michael Knowles]

Perhaps sometimes it's a little bit. We're walking up going, okay, so which, you know.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, here's where you should go. After us, here's. Yeah, that's sad. But unfortunately, I think it's fair.

[Michael Knowles]

And by the way, comedy is incredibly potent, especially because the left has destroyed comedy.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah, right, right.

[Michael Knowles]

Like you and I were talking last night. I love Saturday Night Live. I grew up watching Saturday Night Live.

[Ted Cruz]

Oh, yeah, There are some great eras of that show.

[Michael Knowles]

It is. Have you watched young Eddie Murphy on Saturday Night Live when he's like 18 years old and just such a talent? And by the way, SNL on comedy has been spectacular, but it's not funny anymore because their only script is we hate Donald Trump. It's just a screed. And it's like, okay, fine, look, are there jokes to tell about Donald Trump?

[Ted Cruz]

Sure, one or two.

[Michael Knowles]

Yeah. But when it all just becomes rage.

[Ted Cruz]

Or, you know, after, after Hillary lost, they had that nauseating sketch where they. They're playing Hallelujah, just crying. And it was, where's the humor coming in? I don't.

[Michael Knowles]

You look at the late night hosts. I mean, I loved listening to, you know, Johnny Carson and Leno and actually, I like jokes at my expense. I laugh at them. The late night hosts are not the one exception, I would say, is Jimmy Fallon. Jimmy Fallon tries to be more even.

[Ted Cruz]

Handed, is a little more old school.

[Michael Knowles]

About the job, but you know, Colbert is just a unwatchable. It is liberal ID raging and how about just be funny again? And so what that means though is there's a huge space for humor. That's not Marxist, like, that's just not woke.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah. You know, on the topic of humor, we got a compliment from RD who says, first of all, both of your timely humor has gotten me through the insanity of 2020. Thank you, RD. Appreciate it. Seriously, it's the best.

[Michael Knowles]

You need to work on your timeliness there.

[Ted Cruz]

I know that was not timely. That was not at all time. When Trump wins, I like the confidence there. When Trump wins, do you see absolute chaos in the big cities occurring again? Is anyone preparing? I have guns. Don't worry about me. Just don't like seeing America burn.

[Michael Knowles]

You know, there's a Freudian concept of projection that what you're doing, you accuse others of doing. Have you noticed all the Dems and all the media saying, what if Trump doesn't accept the results of the election? I have noticed that they still haven't admitted who won 2016.

[Ted Cruz]

They haven't admitted who won 2000, for that matter.

[Michael Knowles]

Well, there is that. And by the way, Stacey Abrams is a damn fine guy.

[Ted Cruz]

She's wonderful.

[Michael Knowles]

She's wonderful.

[Ted Cruz]

She's doing a great job.

[Michael Knowles]

They're literally in just this alternative reality where it. Did you see, what was it? There was a. So I only read the headlines, so I may get the details wrong, but it's close enough for government work. I guess they were doing political war games where they had John Podesta, who was the chairman of Hillary's campaign, this.

[Ted Cruz]

Was in the New York Times, who.

[Michael Knowles]

Was playing Joe Biden, and in the war game refused to accept the outcome of the election. And they had them like, what was it? California, Oregon and Washington seceding from the union because Biden lost.

[Ted Cruz]

Well, you know, when they introduced this scenario, which, you know, who am I to doubt the mainstream media, they said, John Podesta, they expected in this war game for him to concede on election night, just as he did in 2016 on behalf of Hillary. But he didn't. People forget this. He didn't concede on election night on behalf of Hillary. He came out and he said, we'll wait to see what the results are. And finally, by the way, why didn't.

[Michael Knowles]

Hillary speak that night?

[Ted Cruz]

I think she was probably a little upset in whatever hotel room she was waiting in.

[Michael Knowles]

Do you know of Any other campaign where the candidate doesn't speak where you send. I mean, that's weird. Let me just like for the record.

[Ted Cruz]

John Podesta's exact words were, you know, Hillary, Hillary's here, she thanks you so much for being here for her. Cuz she's always here for you. And my thought at the time, I said, except right now, when it's most important for her to show up on stage, she refused to do it. Where was she?

[Michael Knowles]

Listen, I have been in campaigns where I won, I've been campaigns where I lost. By the way, winning is much better. Not even close. But in every instance on election night, you come out and talk to the people. That's a pretty basic social compact. So if Trump wins reelection, which I hope he will, I think he will, but I think it's very volatile. I'm worried about this election.

[Ted Cruz]

I agree.

[Michael Knowles]

If Trump wins reelection, I think the left will go in paroxysms of. Part of how they've rationalized the last three and a half years is they view it as a crazy fluke and their resolve never to let it again. But their rage, I think they lose their minds if he wins. And look, do you see more violence from them? Probably we're seeing violence now.

[Ted Cruz]

I see it as an implicit threat. When you have very prominent Democratic politicians, including Joe Biden, who have said, we can't take four more years of this, they're referring to the left wing violence in the streets. That sounds a little bit like a threat to me.

[Michael Knowles]

There's reason to be worried.

[Ted Cruz]

There's reason to be worried. I was hoping you'd make us feel so much better about. But the reality of it is there's reasons to be worried.

[Michael Knowles]

And here's the reason to feel better. Truth prevails over time. Look, I am an optimist through and through, and I believe that you and I, a couple of weeks ago we were out in LA and we did a bunch of pods and radio shows. One of the most interesting is you and I together did Dennis Prager's show. Now, Dennis is so brilliant, he's so encyclopedic, I gotta say, by the way, is an interesting observation. Doing the podcast has spoiled me. Yes, I know, because the radio format, you had just these little snippets of four or five minutes and then you broke for a commercial and I was like, what? What do you mean?

[Ted Cruz]

For five or six minutes of commercial? And then it goes.

[Michael Knowles]

But it was just, you can't, you.

[Ted Cruz]

Can'T get into it as fast.

[Michael Knowles]

And I've done a ton of radio before, and I had never really noticed it until we've done podcasts where if you don't talk about an issue, you talk about an issue. Yeah, but Dennis and I, and I think the world of Dennis, but we had actually a substantive disagreement where I made a reference. I said, I agree with Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. That the arc of history bends towards justice.

[Ted Cruz]

Yeah.

[Michael Knowles]

And Dennis said, well, I don't think that at all. Actually. Hold on. Michael does a great Dennis Prager impression. So he says, so give me Dennis.

[Ted Cruz]

Now, Senator, I hear you, but I do not believe the ark of history bends toward justice.

[Michael Knowles]

That's strong.

[Ted Cruz]

I need a little more size, a little more height.

[Michael Knowles]

So he said. And he came back and he said, well, where was the arc of history in 1939 Germany? And he said, where was the arc of history in the Soviet Gulags? And I actually came back. He had said earlier in the interview, he said, well, Ted, disagree with me if you want to. And I said, well, actually, Dennis, I'm going to come disagree with you on that. You asked where was the arc of history in 1939 Germany? It was on those stark cliffs when our boys scaled the impossible heights and led the world in defeating the Nazi menace and freeing the globe from that evil. Where was the arc of history in Solzhenitsyn's Gulag? In the hellhole that was there? It was standing before the Brandenburg Gate when Ronald Reagan said, Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall. And I believe, look, truth doesn't win every skirmish. It doesn't win every battle. It doesn't guarantee the result in this election. And if Biden and Schumer and Pelosi win this election, we will go through a dark couple of years of some terrible policies. But I believe over time, truth prevails. And so that's a reason to be optimistic.

[Ted Cruz]

And there is just, in a very basic Christian sense, there is a happy ending to this story. Trouble is, things can get very dark before you arrive at that happy ending. But I suppose we'll just have to wait and see. In the meantime, Senator, that's all the time we have. I'm Michael Knowles. This is Verdict with Ted Cruz.

[C]

This episode of Verdict with Ted Cruz is being brought to you by Jobs, Freedom and Security Pack, a political action committee dedicated to supporting conservative causes, organizations, and candidates across the country. In 2022, jobs, freedom and Security PAC plans to donate to conservative candidates running for Congress and help the Republican Party across the nation.