146 - Jefferson Airplane - Surrealistic Pillow - Cathy Richardson

Summary

Podcast Summary: The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers

Episode 146 – Jefferson Airplane: Surrealistic Pillow (with Cathy Richardson)
August 20, 2025

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Overview

This episode of "The 500 with Josh Adam Meyers" counts down Rolling Stone's 500 Greatest Albums, focusing on Jefferson Airplane’s 1967 psychedelic classic, Surrealistic Pillow (ranked #146). Josh is joined by Cathy Richardson, powerhouse vocalist and current lead singer of Jefferson Starship, who brings deep insights as both a lifelong fan and an inheritor of the band's legacy.

Together, the hosts and Cathy—along with regular contributor Morty Coyle—dig into the album’s historical significance, timeless tracks, the San Francisco music scene, Grace Slick’s legend, the evolution from Airplane to Starship, and what it's like embodying such iconic voices. The episode blends musical analysis, band lore, and passionate personal storytelling.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Personal Connections and the Band’s Legacy

• Cathy's Origin Story

  • Cathy describes discovering "White Rabbit" on an oldies station as a young teen and becoming obsessed. She bought The Worst of Jefferson Airplane just to listen to the song repeatedly.
    • "She was like, you've listened to this song for the last 40 minutes... I'm like, it's so short. It ends too soon. I just want to keep going." (08:43 - Cathy Richardson)
  • Her first Jefferson Starship concert was in 1983; she never imagined she’d someday join the band.
    • "Now…I live on the tour bus with them." (09:49 - Cathy Richardson)

• Transition to the Lead Singer

  • Cathy was invited by Paul Kantner to join Jefferson Starship after he saw her perform Janis Joplin music, seamlessly bridging generations of legendary frontwomen.

2. San Francisco Scene and Airplane’s Place in Music History

• According to Morty, Jefferson Airplane was arguably the biggest band out of the San Francisco scene, even headlining over the Grateful Dead, which weren't a radio band at the time (11:32 - Morty Coyle).

• Discussion on why Airplane isn’t always included in the "greatest American rock bands" conversation, despite their massive hits and cultural influence. Shorter career span, shifting identities (Airplane, Starship), and constant lineup changes are cited as reasons (12:27 - Josh & Kathy).

3. Band Origins, Lineup and Sprawling Projects

• Morty outlines the band’s formation in the mid-60s: from folk roots, the creation of Matrix nightclub, early members and the eventual arrival of Grace Slick from Great Society (15:41 – 19:45).
• Emphasizing the shared writing and vocal duties—no single frontperson, even after Grace joined.

4. Surrealistic Pillow as an Era-Defining Album

• The album is described as sonically encapsulating the psychedelic 60s.
  • "It’s the times encapsulated in music." (12:27 – Kathy Richardson)
• Not just "White Rabbit" and "Somebody to Love," but also Marty Balin’s ballads ("Today" & "Coming Back to Me") are praised.
  • Story: Marty writes "Coming Back to Me" on a joint-induced inspiration, records it in one take with only Jerry Garcia, Grace, and Jack present (21:14 – Kathy Richardson).

5. Vocal Interpretation and Iconic Frontwomen

• Cathy’s experience performing both Janis Joplin and Grace Slick parts:
  • Deep study of Janis’ voice: "Her sound was like a scratchy record…imitating the actual sound of the needle in the vinyl." (27:32 – Cathy Richardson)
  • Both Janis and Grace named as "tied for Queen" when it comes to female rock singers (29:59 – Cathy Richardson).
• Discussion about tribulations and growth in embodying such legends.

6. Track-by-Track Highlights and Analysis

• "She Has Funny Cars" – Not the most obvious opener, but a solid example of the band’s collaborative energy (33:03).
• "Somebody to Love" ([43:13])
  • The band's breakout hit, originally written by Grace's brother-in-law Darby Slick. Grace’s entry with the Airplane version gives the song an uncompromising, hard-rock edge.
    • "For really Grace's first moment on this record... she fronts the band, dude." (44:18 – Morty Coyle)
  • Always a live closer for Cathy’s Starship, guaranteeing a fist-pumping response.
• "My Best Friend" – The album’s folk-pop "flower power" side, likened to Mamas & Papas (55:58 – Kathy Richardson). The band’s "secret knock" is based on its drum intro!
• "White Rabbit" ([66:30])
  • Grace’s masterpiece—a swirling, mind-expanding journey through Alice in Wonderland, capturing the psychedelia zeitgeist.
    • "This is the most radio-friendly psychedelic song…this is it. This makes me want to take acid." (67:06 – Josh Adam Meyers)
  • Discussed as one of the ultimate 60s songs, alongside "Strawberry Fields" and "Eight Miles High."
• Other Faves
  • "Embryonic Journey" – Instrumental that foreshadows the Airplane's journey into different territories.

7. Band Evolution, Business, and Legacy

• Airplane’s complex record deal (11-album contract with solo albums for each member); the creation of Grunt Records (38:08 – 38:40).
• The constant lineup shifting and transition into Jefferson Starship, then Starship, and now both bands exist with various original members.
• Paul Kantner’s lasting influence: "He was just such a unique character…he was the Jefferson in of all of that." (57:32)
• Frictions and factioning when hits and outside songwriters shifted the sound ("We Built This City," "Nothing's Gonna Stop Us Now"); Kantner’s distaste for this direction (65:00).
• Comparison to the Grateful Dead’s enduring scene: Airplane/Starship’s shape-shifting arguably hindered a singular legacy.

8. Female Rock Legacy and Influence

• Cathy discusses her love for Heart, Chrissie Hynde, Fleetwood Mac, and other classic female-driven acts, relating how the industry shifted to allow more female voices in the 80s and 90s ("the Lilith Fair era") (50:59+).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Cathy on Joining the Band:
  "Being in the band was just not even a thought…like, someday I want to do, you know, I want to be in the band. That's so weird. So, yeah, it's, it's a trip. I don't. And it is actually a perfect fit for me as being the fan that I am." (23:19 – Cathy Richardson)

• On Airplane's Place in History:
  "It's the times encapsulated in music." (12:27 – Cathy Richardson)

• On “Somebody to Love”:
  "There's almost like a Steppenwolf 'Born to Be Wild' feeling… For really Grace's first moment on this record…she fronts the band, dude." (44:18 – Morty Coyle)

• On “White Rabbit”:
  "This is the most radio-friendly psychedelic song…the ultimate 60s time machine." (67:06 – Josh Adam Meyers, 80:16 – Kathy Richardson)

• Cathy on Kantner’s Advice: "The only advice I can remember him giving me is, you know, that weird stuff that you do do more. Told me to be more weird, you know, and I'm like, okay, what great direction." (57:22 – Cathy Richardson)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 08:43 — Cathy shares her "White Rabbit" origin story.
• 21:14 — Story of Marty Balin writing "Coming Back to Me."
• 27:32 — Cathy on learning to channel Janis Joplin.
• 29:59 — "Tied for Queen" Grace Slick and Janis Joplin.
• 43:13 — Deep dive on "Somebody to Love."
• 55:58 — "My Best Friend" as folk-pop/flower power side.
• 66:30 — Discussion of "White Rabbit," its cultural impact, and Grace's creative intent.
• 70:13 — Cathy on band’s relationship to drugs and production pace.
• 80:16 — Elevator pitch: “If you want to know what the 60s sounded like, listen to this album.” (Kathy Richardson)

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Episode Wrap-Up

Final Q&A with Cathy Richardson

• Favorite Song on Surrealistic Pillow:
  • "White Rabbit" (79:22)
• Track to Skip:
  • "My Best Friend" ("to me, that's a throwaway") (79:27)
• Elevator Pitch for the Album:
  • "If you want to know what the 60s sounded like, listen to this album…It is a time machine to the 60s." (80:16)

Closing Messages

• The hosts encourage listeners to support legacy artists and see them live:
  “Go see them now and tell your kids about it because we're witnessing history and the end of it.” (81:35 – Morty Coyle)

• Cathy promotes upcoming Jefferson Starship tour dates (78:04+).

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For New Listeners

This episode serves as a vibrant crash course in Jefferson Airplane’s legacy, the 60s psychedelic scene, and the enduring power of Surrealistic Pillow. It’s also a warm, funny, and enthusiastic celebration of classic rock history—anchored by Cathy Richardson’s perspective as both superfan and standard-bearer for one of America’s iconic bands.

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Next episode: Steely Dan – Aja (#145 on the list).

Transcript

[Josh Adam Meyers]

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[Josh Adam Meyers]

This show is brought to you by Distro Kid. Bring your music to the masses.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

The 500 the 500J been walking us down through that 2012 edition so it ain't nothing too. Hundreds more to go and in need of a friend the king of peace for angelo talking the 500 until the end talking the 500 until the end with my man jail on the 500 talking the 500 until the end.

[Kathy Richardson]

Don'T.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

You want somebody to love? Don't you need somebody to love? Won't you love somebody to love? You better find somebody to love.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

That is Someone to Love by Jefferson Airplane from their 1967 record Surrealistic. I can't even say that Surrealistic Pillow is number 146 out of 500 on the 500 with Josh Ademars. What's up party people? We're digging in, guys. Going through Rolling Stone magazine list of the 500 Greatest Albums. I'm a comic. I only know so much, but I'm having a great time. I am probably in, I would say Berlin right now. I'm not sure. Either way, I'm having fun. Come see me in Plano, Texas, August 29th and the 30th at the mic Drop Comedy Club. Then Pittsburgh at a casino. I will be in Baltimore. I will be in Dubai with Bill Burr. I will be in Las Vegas, New Orleans, Vancouver, Calgary, Winnipeg, La Jolla. I've got a lot of gigs. Arizona, Phoenix. I'm just. I'm out. I'm out for the rest of the year. It's a little lighter in in fucking September, but October, November, December, I am packed, guys. Josh Adamyers.com for tickets and at Josh Adam Myers on all social media. All right. Want to watch the podcast? Subscribe to the YouTube channel the 500 Podcast. Subscribe to my YouTube channel, Josh Adammeyers 79 and subscribe to the Patreon patreon.com backslash the 500 Podcast. Get merch for 25amonth. Five dollars a month just gets you nothing. But you support and we love you. Big ups to DJ Morty Coyle, Emily, Peter, Adam, JT Logan. We love you guys. Thank you for helping out on this show. Wayne Fetterman too. He's a man. All right, I think I got everything. Let's dig into this. It's our second Jefferson Airplane record. And who do we have? We have the current singer of the Jefferson Starship, the one and only Kathy Richardson. She is a powerhouse of a performer. Her voice is immaculate. It is a real rock and roll. We're stoked to get her on because she was originally a huge Jefferson Airplane fan and Starship fan growing up throughout her music career, all before Paul Cantor asked her to join as their lead singer back in 2008 while touring with Janis Joplin's band. Since then, she's written with Grace slick for the 2020 feminist anthem it's About Time. Has been carrying the torch with her epic vocals on the road with Jefferson Starship for the past 17 years. You can check Jefferson Starship on tour right now, dates and ticket [e-mail] backslash tour or go to their Instagram at Jefferson Starship, their YouTube @Jefferson Starship, and Facebook at official Jefferson Starship. Oh, yeah. And then also CR Band for her music. Her. Her Instagram is at The Kathy Richardson YouTube Kathy Richardson and Facebook Kathy Richardson. I feel like I said enough. Let's dig into it. Raid review. And most importantly, subscribe to the 500 listen free on all platforms or anywhere you get your pods. Follow me at Josh Adam Myers on all social media. Follow the podcast at the 500 podcast on all social media, email the [e-mail] follow the Facebook group run by Crazy Evan. And for all things 500, go to the website the500podcast.com. All right, y', all, here we go with number 146 out of 500 with surrealistic pillow by Jefferson Airplane, Jeremiah. What number episode is this gonna be? Because I'm just pulling up my one sheet.

[Morty Coyle]

This is 146.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

146. Dude. I know.

[Morty Coyle]

We're in the home stretch now. It's all gold. Every. Every episode.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

It really is. It really is. And you know, it was funny because we did volunteers.

[Morty Coyle]

No. Do we do volunteers or bathing?

[Josh Adam Meyers]

No, we did. We did. Volunteers. We did it. Remember? We did it with Lisa Traeger.

[Morty Coyle]

Right.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

And she was a fan. You know, her parents really loved the Jefferson Airplane. Is it Jefferson. Is it the Jefferson Airplane or Jefferson Airplane? So it's like Eaglestone, by the way. I feel like I'm one of the only few people and people me weird when I go, yeah, I just saw Eagles. And they're like, what? And I'm like, even they sometimes put.

[Morty Coyle]

The article in of the. Because it's used. Not. It's not used as a capital like the Beatles, but when they use it, they go, oh, yeah, we went to the Eagle show, meaning their show. But yeah, that's one of those ones. It's like Talking Heads. The name of this band is Talking Heads, not the name of this band is the Talking Heads. Yes, they were very particular about that.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

But the. The thing is, is, like, I didn't feel in Volunteers, I got the full grasp of what the band was. I think I got a groovy record. You know what I mean? And I enjoyed it. But really digging into this, like, this is the album, dude. This is the album surrealistic pillow from 1967. This has two of probably their biggest songs on it. And what's funny, you know, I do this show where comedians do stand up and they sing a cover song. I don't know if you know about it, but when we played Billy Graham arena right out front with Burr, we did the Jam with like, me, Pete Davidson, Michelle Bouto, Les Claypool with Side Stage. And because we were in San Francisco, we opened with We Built this City, but we did this whole thing. We were like, while doing the intro and I mean, I don't know how much of the crowd really, like, even put two and two together because they were a younger crowd of like, this is San Francisco. We figured this would go over really well and blah, blah, blah, we murdered it. But it's just such an in, you know, the. The. The scope of their career and just, you know, grace and, you know, all of all the members and it's like, for. For. For you. Like, you. You know, were you always a fan of. Of just Jefferson Airplane?

[Morty Coyle]

By the way, welcome, Kathy Richardson.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah, I was, Jer. Dude. I was getting to that, you know.

[Morty Coyle]

Okay, okay.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

That's what I was trying to do. But I was like. I was kind of like, ease into the bathtub. I'm still thinking about, you know, dumb and Dumber right now. I gotta. I gotta click over to this. To the. To the. To the swinging 60s. But, like, you. You're the lead singer of Jefferson Starship right now. Is that correct? Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

So.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

So tell me about your history with. With, you know, with Airplane and then how you ended up, you know, filling in a role that I can only imagine. You know, it must have made you nervous, but also, like, just filled you with so much joy.

[Kathy Richardson]

Absolutely, because I've been such a fan since I was in my early teens. You know, I remember hearing White Rabbit for the first time on my dad's, like, oldies station that he used to listen to. And I said, what is that? You know, and that's Jefferson Airplane. And I'm like, jefferson Airplane. I've heard of Jefferson Starship because they were popular at that time. And so I went out and bought the worst of Jefferson Airplane. And I listened to White Rabbit over and over and over again so many times that my mom knocked on my do. She was like, are you okay? Like, yeah. Why? She said, you've listened to. Been listening to the song for the last 40 minutes. I'm like, it's so short. It ends too soon. I just want to keep going.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

So, yeah. And I mean fast.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Over.

[Morty Coyle]

Feed your head.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah. I became a big fan. I started going to the concerts in. I think my first Jefferson starship concert was 1983.

[Morty Coyle]

That was a good year to go. I mean, if you're going to see them, that's the year to go see them.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

That was, like, kind of the last year with Paul. So it was Grace Paul, David Freiberg, Donnie Baldwin on drums, Craig Chiquiso, Pete Sears and Mickey Thomas. So it was like a really ultimate version of the band. And I saw them probably, like, in the last row of the Holiday Star Theater in Merrillville, Indiana. And, you know, I remember, like, wishing that I could go on their tour bus, that I could meet them and all this stuff. And now. And now I live on the tour bus with them. So, of course, the only people still left are David and Donnie from that group still left in the band. People are still alive, but they don't.

[Morty Coyle]

Play with us, of course, so.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Good.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah. No, I was going to say when. When you're ready. I'll just catch up the audience with sort of what got us here for this band, because they have a tremendous history and they are one of the big. I mean, if we're going to talk about San Francisco bands from this era, there's a very small number of them. And it's usually like the Dead. And then we start getting peripheral. We get Moby Grape and even Hot Tuna, which is we'll talk about them after. But the biggies of the San Francisco scene are, you know, Santana eventually, but really the Dead and you know, and, and the Airplane. Jefferson Airplane and so many different. I mean it's, it's a cast of characters.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yes. And arguably they were the biggest band at that time that came out of San Francisco. You know, they were like the headliner.

[Morty Coyle]

And radio hits, like, that's the thing that people forget is the Dead wasn't getting radio maybe here and there, but they weren't, they weren't a radio band. They were like a headband and a freaky band, but they were definitely not, you know, so then they didn't have Gracie.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Mike, My question is then why. Why are like the Grateful Dead, you know, considered one of the greatest rock band American rock bands of all time, you know, and have been able to tour. But also because I'm. I'm in the. In the shadows. I only know only certain amount about this, you know, the Starship and Airplane. So then why aren't Airplane in that discussion of like one of the great American rock bands? Because their just career was a lot shorter and they switched to Starship maybe.

[Kathy Richardson]

But I think, I mean, I still think they're considered one of the great American rock bands. I mean there's certainly. I mean they're the music and especially we're talking about Surrealistic Pillow. It's just. It sounds like the 60s. It's the times encapsulated in music. And there's. There's very few songs besides like White Rabbit. You know, they play that scene in a movie, you know, somebody's about to do drugs. You know, it's like it just puts you in a time and a place and it's just like psychedelic rock, you know, and you.

[Morty Coyle]

And we know. I know a little something about that. Just speaking for myself about the psychedelics of that era. Even being a kid of the 70s and 8, I'm born in the 60s, but 70s and 80s of when it sort of. When that had its heyday, you know, 20 year old come around again when everyone's like reevaluating their parents music and everything and they're like, like, oh, you know, one pill makes you larger. And then also the cautionary book Go Ask Alice where there was a kid who was absolutely like, you know, are you on drugs in there, Kathy?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, well, that's. I think that's what she was worried about.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, they smelled incense and they're like, you're doing drugs. It's not champa. Yeah. So to catch, to catch up the audience and where are with this? Okay, I'll try to barrel through this because I'm sure Kathy's bored of the stories of on the tour bus. But also it, they really do have a fascinating history. In the early 60s, the folk music had taken over pretty much all of youth culture. You know, we, we've talked about this now that we've had many episodes to talk about this. Rock and roll. From the 50s, it come to the 60s, we have Bob Dylan, the Birds, the Jangly Sound, the Beatles, they, they start adding rock elements. And then at this time, Jorma Kaukonen and Jack Cassidy, these guitar players are playing in bands in Washington D.C. your, your, your run around town, Josh and JT in the early 60s, Jorma goes to San Francisco and while he's there, he meets a local guitar player and singer named Paul Kantner. At about the same time, there's a young vocalist in the area named Marty Ballen who had a couple unsuccessful singles before going on this folk rock direction. In 65, he converts this pizza place on Fillmore street in, in. In San Francisco to a nightclub called the Matrix, which is incredibly important. Kantner and Balin had earlier met on. Is it Balin or Balin? It's Balin. I don't know why I, I did. I, I corrected somebody else on that and then I left it wrong in my head. Balance. That's what it is. And they, they had met earlier in the San Francisco scene and they're looking, you know, balance. Looking for a house band for the place. And so they, he gets, let's put something together for the Matrix. They add a couple of members, they go through things. They end up with Sydney. Sydney or Sydney, I don't know how to pronounce exactly. Anderson. And then Cantner got Jorma to play guitar. They put together this name. They were like, let's just come up with a ridiculous name. The Friend's Dog or, you know, Roach Clip, whatever the name is, depending on who you ask. And they come up.

[Kathy Richardson]

The Roach Clip was named after the band.

[Morty Coyle]

Oh, okay. So, yeah, all right.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, it was like Blind Lemon Jefferson or something. And I, I don't know. They're like, let's just be weird.

[Morty Coyle]

Basically, which everyone, this was in the air at the time, San Francisco, in the 60s. Everyone was starting. I mean, this is why Sgt. Pepper's only heartska Band is called that. Because Paul was looking at what was going on on the west coast in America and was like, look at all these guys are Naming their bands the Wild Plastic Jumping Beans. And they went, Where's Sgt. Pepper's only hearts Club Band? And that's really what it all comes down to is the San Francisco scene, you know. And then they have, you know, all the stores that are opening up and, you know, you know, a very military. It was like, once again, their come around from the 60s would have been the stuff that they looked back on that was available at thrift stores. So they. They get them. They get a record deal in this. Now, remember, Gracie isn't in the. Grace isn't in the band yet. And there's a couple little differences that they have going on in the band. Kalkonen brings in Jack Cassidy now to play bass in the band. It's starting to fill. And then they get Spencer Dryden in to play drums. No, no, no. They get Skip Spence in originally to play drums, I believe. And then he splits at some point after to do mid-66.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

And then it's soon replaced by Spencer Dryden.

[Morty Coyle]

Spencer Dryden, who becomes the main. The drummer in the band.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

They half nephew of Charlie Chaplin, by the way.

[Morty Coyle]

Yes, yes. We all know A little tramp. That's what they say. You know, like that. Really. The half nephew of Charlie Chapin is my second favorite band to come out of San Francisco. Yeah, they were sadly underrated after one successful album, which is when they. Where. Where they do their first album, which is Takeoff. Jefferson Airplane takes off or Takeoff. Signe leaves after having a baby. Now at the time, she's replaced by. Now they're playing around town. There's a band called High Society and that's got.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I'm sorry.

[Morty Coyle]

I'm so sorry. Great Society. I was high when I read that Great Society, which had Grace Slick, beautiful, intellectual woman, also a songwriter, a powerful voice, and she's married to a fella whose brother we'll get to a little later because he wrote one of the biggest songs that's on this record. And Grace wrote the other one. Bill Graham, you know, becomes their manager, sees them. He sees the two hit songs that we're going to talk about, and he's like, you guys are a smash. We're going to make this happen. So this is, you know, so let's catch up. So they play everywhere. They play the San Francisco festivals, they're playing all the shows. They, they. They basically become synonymous with the San Francisco scene in a big way also because they've got a woman in the band there. They stand out amongst a lot of the bro kind of scene. That's going on at the time. They do their whole thing. They end up doing this record. It becomes wildly popular. And so let's just start where we are now because some of the members end up leaving after to go do Hot Tuna to do offshoots later. But for now they are pretty much this solid faction of the band. And this is the first record, even though it's the second Jefferson Airplane record in a way, it's kind of the debut album because it's the first record with Grace Slick on it. Who by the way, is really the part time lead singer because Marty Balin and Paul and even Jorma sort of have take turns having lead vocal duties. So it's not even. I'm not, I'm not putting it down, but I'm saying is, it's not even like they went, okay, you know, we have our lead singer, here's our Jim Morrison, and we'll all just be here. And it's Grace and the band. They're always changing who's walking up to the microphone, even into their later career, as we all know. They go from being Jefferson Airplane and then eventually Jefferson Starship and then eventually Starship and now back to Jefferson Starship for this iteration that you're a part of. And they have hits all through. I love their 70s stuff. I love Miracles. I love. I mean so many of those songs hit me in a way from that 70s, freaky kind of cocaine glint of what was on the radio at the same time as Steely Dan and stuff. So where we are today is this is if you're going to get one, if you don't get the worst of. Which by the way, is the best of. If you don't get the worst of the Jefferson Airplane. This is really the record where you're like, I know that. Oh, I know that. I know that. And you'll find yourself kind of going, this is all on one record.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

You know, which I imagine is most of your show. If you're going to do the 60s stuff, it's pretty much this record.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, we've. We along when Paul was still alive. We used to play all these songs and we, we actually did an album show one time where we toured and we played all the songs in order.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, wow.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, so I, I do know all the songs intimately from. From singing them, but also from listening to them too. I mean, you obviously you've got White Rabbit, Somebody To Love, two huge hits. And then you've got the Marty ballads today and coming back to Me, two of the greatest songs Ever written. And I do have a story that Marty used to tell about writing coming back to me. They were in the studio and he said, I'm going home and going to bed. And Paul Butterfield gave him this joint, and he said, smoke this before you go to bed. So he smokes this joint and he's laying there and he can't sleep. This song just pops into his head. And he got out of bed and he went back to the studio, and he used to say that no one was there except Jerry Garcia, Grace and Jack. It's like, no one except Jerry Garcia. Okay. Anyway, they just recorded the song in one take. And he wrote it, they recorded it, and that's what you hear on the album, which is pretty insane. Wow. And it's such a. Such a great song. David will sing that with us now. And he would. He said when that song came out, he listened to it over and over, like I listened to White Rabbit. He just, you know, it's just such a beautiful, beautiful song. Like the best love songs.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

So I'm looking over just, like, some of your history. It's like, you know, you seem like. I mean, the stuff that you've been able to perform, especially if you're performing Grace Slick stuff, you know, you must have an incredibly powerful voice doing, you know, Janis Joplin parts. So you were doing. I don't know, was that. That's with your own band, or were you doing just, like, a cover band of, like, Big Brother and the Holding Company?

[Kathy Richardson]

Well, I was actually in Big Brother.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, you were? Oh, my God. I'm so sorry. Jesus.

[Kathy Richardson]

But I. I did a play, an off Broadway show called Love Janice, and it.

[Morty Coyle]

Do we know if that movie's getting made? They've been talking about it for. Yeah, it's 20, 30 years. Okay.

[Kathy Richardson]

No, they don't know. They don't know how to do it.

[Morty Coyle]

And there's Brittany Murphy at one point.

[Kathy Richardson]

And, yeah, there's competing scripts, and if the family isn't on board with it, it's not gonna happen. So, yeah, they've been talking about forever, but so this was a play. And so that's how I. I start. I mean, I used to cover Janice in. In my band and Jefferson Airplane, but so I got cast in this show eventually. I ended up doing it in San Francisco and moving there. And that's when Big Brother asked me to go on tour with them in this package with Starship headlining. And I was so excited just to open for Jefferson Starship. And never in my wildest dreams did I think I was going to be in these bands. I was never do that. I, you know, always had my own band. I write songs, I produce albums. I've done thousands of shows just as. As myself, you know, so it was just, it was never. I just always wanted to be an artist. I didn't want to cover somebody else. But when, when the band asked me, I said, are you kidding me? I like, it's like a. Beyond your wildest dreams. Like I didn't ever imagine being in the band. I wanted to, you know, I wanted to be like them or wanted to do what they were doing. But being in the band was just not even a thought that, that comes to you, you know, like someday I want to do, you know, I want to be in the band. That's so weird. So, yeah, it's, it's a trip. I don't. And it is actually a perfect fit for me as being the fan that I am. And you know, after I bought the worst of Jefferson Airplane, I bought everything. I bought every album. So when Paul came to my apartment, I got out all the vinyl so I could so he could see what a big fan I was. But I only asked him to sign one record out of all of them and that was his solo record. Because I thought I'm going to really ingratiate myself to him. I'm not going to overwhelm him saying sign 20 albums. But. So I had him sign my copy of Blows against the Empire and we sang. We got out a couple guitars and sang Ride the Tiger and he's like, you're in. You know, they had already seen me sing with Janice, just do the Janice stuff, which is very different type of singing. But I've somehow both of those women have worked their way into my vocal cords. So it's, you know, the influence is.

[Morty Coyle]

Obvious by the way, just to catch everybody up. I was, I. I'm friends with China, which who is Paul Kantner and Grace lake's daughter for 30 some odd years. She's under the weather but I asked her to come on here. But I want us to end a shout out to Jude Gold who plays guitar currently. But shout out to China. I got to meet Grace and Paul over the years. He came to a Troubadour show and I've seen Grace, you know, a bunch of times at our place. By the way, if you look at the COVID of sun fighter from 71, which is Paul and Grace together, that's China, the baby that's being held up on the COVID of that. Of that album. So the question I have about the vocal style, because Josh and I both sing, is people come to expect very specific things. Janice was kind of a wild card on stage and live. There was so much of what she did of the moment. Like, you'd see her at Monterey, and she really inhabited. Like, I know she loved Bessie Smith and, you know, real authentic blues shouters and singers. But because people want to hear what they remember from the recording, you know, they don't want to hear. You know, even if it was Janice, sometimes they don't want to hear. They want to hear, wow, wow. Take it. You know, they want to hear, like, the exact inflection. How do you get to get with stuff like that? Because she was so. You know, she was so extemporaneous.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah. When I did Janice, I listened and I just got everything I could get my hands on as far as live anything, any film footage, any. And I would just. I lived it. It was on in the background 24 hours a day. And whenever I was awake, I was just absorbing Janice. And it took me a few years to get really good at it because my natural voice doesn't sound like her. I am a belter and, you know, and soulful singer, but her sound was like a scratchy record. And I. And I really got to understand that when her brother gave me these recordings that were unreleased of Janice in college, and she's, you know, she's listening to all these old scratchy blues records, checking them out of the library, then learning about Bessie Smith and stuff, that was like something she had to look into, you know, and that's where I feel she was such a. Her voice. She could do so many different voices and different things with her voice, but that. That scratchy sound, I feel like, is her imitating the actual sound of the needle in the vinyl, you know, and she could. You know, Sam Andrew, or guitar player, used to say that she had about seven different voices, and she. She didn't get to use them all because she died too young. But she was really as far as a singer doing Janice made me grow in ways. You know, a lot of people don't. You know, some people are like, oh, her voice, it's not. It's scratchy and it's not good, you know, but she had a clear voice, too, if she wanted to. And she. She could do a Broadway voice, and she could, you know, if you ever heard. They made. They recorded Happy Trails and to send to John Lennon on. On his birthday and Happy Trails to you, you know, and you're like, That's James voice, you know, and so she just doing her was growth, huge growth.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I mean are, are Janice and Grace like in the discussion, like at least in the top five of the strongest rock vocal singers, female especially.

[Kathy Richardson]

But they're, they're tied for Queen as far as I'm concerned. Yeah, of course they are the queens.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah. You know, it's, it's Janice. It's like we were talking about like people that I would love to see, you know, who, if anybody, if there could have somebody who had passed away early in music, if you could see somebody have a career like they, they could have like who would you have loved to kept around and, and, and that was. Somebody was like, God, it was. I would have loved to have seen the transition that she would have done, you know, Janice, like throughout the years because you see what Grace did and see how the music changed and she changed with it and yet she still kept the rock star and the voice and, and the coolness. But it's, you know, there's, there's something about like that's, that's really impressive on your end of just of being able to sing both of those two incredible performers parts and nailing it and then joining the bands. I mean, kudos to you. It's like, dude, it's one of those like little like pinch me moments as a kid. Like if you would have somebody who told like you know, 14 year old you like, you'd.

[Kathy Richardson]

No, you're crazy.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

When the truth is bound to me I still do it. It's funny, we just talked about Jeff Daniels on about Jim Carrey and it was like I was listening to the record and I was like, I kind of want to watch Jim Carrey do it in Cable Guy because he nails it.

[Kathy Richardson]

But true rock star.

[Morty Coyle]

So.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah, I mean, do you want to just talk about some of the tracks? Morty, you want to. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We kind of get us.

[Morty Coyle]

I think, yeah, we should go, we should go through as much. I was also going to say I play in a band with Dan Rothschild, whose dad was Paul. And so I've heard also other stories because he, he was working on her last album when she died. The last release, Pearl is posthumous release. So a lot of that stuff you hear by Janis Joplin where you're like, oh, that's you know, Mercedes, Ben, whatever it is that are on that last album, she never heard like, she never heard on the radio. They never came out. She died after going to Barney's Beanery and then going back and you know at her hotel, you know, right in that area. So it was, you know, it's sad. Like similarly, we talk a lot about Otis Redding, as you could see in Josh's background. Another, you know, another guy that sort of went to Bay Area from, you know, and, and has such a connection sort of in that world and was. And was embraced by that culture. But another guy that died so young that, you know, Doc of the Bay, he never heard that on the radio. He never heard it completed.

[Kathy Richardson]

Wow.

[Morty Coyle]

You know, and so that's, you know, that's a. You know, I've. So I've heard really strong things about her that you were talking about, like her voice. So I mean, we could talk about the record. The record starts off with if. Now, if you are a casual listener, you know, a few of the songs on this record. But she has Funny Cars is a pretty groovy. That's a Yorma Marty song. That's a pretty groovy song.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

How many of these.

[Morty Coyle]

I know you've done the whole album, but let's say you have a 30 minute set. Do you go into Starship proper and do like one off that one off this?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, we do. So we actually do two airplane songs in our 30 minute set and they're White Rabbit and Somebody Love.

[Morty Coyle]

Sure.

[Kathy Richardson]

And then we, we kind of, you know, it's so hard to play for 30 minutes with this. You have as much material as this band has and I feel it's almost unfair to the fans because they, they don't get to hear everything they want to hear and we don't get to play any B sides and I barely even get to talk, you know, and I'm pretty funny and I tell a lot of jokes and I'm like, I can't even tell my jokes. So it's work. We're song, song, song, song, song. But yeah, the 2 airplane. And if we had a longer show, we would encore with volunteers and then end with just feedback destruction for like the last two minutes.

[Morty Coyle]

You would go 4/5 of a mile in, get a little, get a little more into it. I mean, she has funny cars. What I found about this, I don't know how you felt, Josh. I was so. As I have been. There's something in the air at that point. We know the Beatles were doing a lot of these sort of riff songs. You know, you have Day Tripper and you have Paperback Writer. And then we know Paperback Writer, Boyce and Hart, Tommy Boyce and Bobby Hart heard that and sort of incorporated into what he thought they Were singing at the end was about a train, which was just the paperback writer and he wrote Last Train to Clarksville. This song really had that vibe to me of like, you know, it's a perfect opening track, even though it's not like a grace song sort of proper.

[Kathy Richardson]

It's all her little weird answers.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah. She makes herself known. She doesn't. Yeah. But I mean, you know that Somebody to Love is coming up. And that's not the first voice you hear on this record. Blows my mind that they were like, no, man, this will be like a beatly kind of. Because it really goes down. I'm like, this is a perfect 60s pop tune. And by the way, for a psychedelic band, there's not a lot of long songs on this record, which is an anomaly and which goes out the window the next year. But it's really impressive that this record is still a tight, like, record of pop songs. It doesn't. It doesn't sit around going, we're going to do a volunteers and do like, you know, an eight minute chantalong, you.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Know, Morty, wait, hold on. Who is the guy that I know that was in Starship, that was in Quicksilver Messenger Service?

[Kathy Richardson]

David. David.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah. Yeah. So that's. That's so odd because, you know, is it like, you know, Quicksilver Messenger Service? Every song was like, you know, super long. I remember. So is that.

[Morty Coyle]

Is that like the show also?

[Josh Adam Meyers]

We did that. Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

And so was their audience and, you know, it sounded good to them. I don't know. I can't listen to this.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah. It does not. It doesn't age at the same clip. That.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

No, for sure. I didn't, I didn't. I didn't dislike it, but I think the podcast was better than the. Than the episode, the actual album. I honestly, you know, I agree with what you're saying, it being a good song, but I. Listening to this record a couple times, I really think they should have bookended the record. Open with Somebody to Love and close with White Rabbit. I think that would have been perfect sequencing, you know, and we talk about that a lot on the podcast. And I'm not saying opening with this track is a bad idea. It's a great song, but it's always like, you know, we talk, Morty, about the full circle, you know, or the. What is it?

[Kathy Richardson]

You.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

You.

[Morty Coyle]

Full circle.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah. The four corners. Yeah. Side one, side end to side one. You know, beginning aside, two, end of side two. And it would have, like, really. I don't know. I just think it. I Think, dude, I hate to say this, but I think if you put those songs as opening in the closer or at least open with somebody to Love, this might have been lower on the list. Because sometimes I think a sequencing really can boom. It hits you and then you're in. You know what I mean? And, and then you, it's almost like making a mixtape for somebody. You come out strong, then you bring it down, then you start building it back up. You know, it's not, not bad.

[Morty Coyle]

It would have been hard to beat that as a first. Like the second song would very much be like. I mean, what they do with sequencing a lot of time is they open with the high we are and then the second song is the punch you in the face and then usually like a ballad and that sort of does it. Because sometimes if you open too strong, you'd have nowhere to go for the second song. You know, I mean, the record feel.

[Kathy Richardson]

Like in today you front load your album with the best songs, you know, the hits.

[Morty Coyle]

That's the Spotify.

[Kathy Richardson]

It was more of a journey. And you know, I was gonna ask though, if, you know, was, was the Takes off album, was that on RCA or was that on.

[Morty Coyle]

I thought, I thought they started on RCA was when they got signed and that's why they recorded. Hold on, let me make sure. Because I thought that that's who signed them in the beginning and they stayed with them. I thought they were with them all the way until they volunteers.

[Kathy Richardson]

Really fascinating things about their deal with RCA was that it was 11 albums and a solo album for everyone in the band. And that's how you got Paul's blows against the Empire. And I think Hot Tuna probably was born out of that there. And they also had their own vanity imprint Grunt, their own label, and they signed their friends and, and they, you know, they, they just put out their own records, which is pretty insane. But they were part of rca.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, I believe they're, yeah, once Corinth happened around J. Around the J A. What is it? Bark around, like the record that looks like a poker chip or just like the big logo thing. They're with them. I mean, they're with them. I, I, they might have done all 11 records. Yeah. I'm even looking now. And they're with them up until the 70s. Grunt. And then, then it's by that point it's grunt. RCA. But then hot Tuna goes their direction and then the Airplane goes there and then the Starship Jefferson. Starship goes their direction.

[Kathy Richardson]

But that was on Grunt too, right? Starship.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, it became very difficult to sort of, especially I assume for fans, it became. It became very difficult to sort of keep your scorecard to realize who was in which band and why you like them. You know, like we said, the first album, Grace isn't even on right. And really her two big moments are on this record. The next song, which we can talk about because the, the story of this song is kind of neat.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Hey everybody. So you guys have probably heard me talk about how I've been in bands my whole life. I love writing songs, performing in front of crowds, just like with comedy. As a musician, it can be kind of hard to cut through the noise and really stand out as an artist. I feel like half the music projects I've been in have ended just because we couldn't figure out the answer to that eternal question of how do we get people to hear us? But then again, that was before there was Distrokid. Distrokid is a digital music distribution service that brings your sound to the masses. It's a one stop shop for getting your songs on itunes, Spotify, Apple Music, YouTube Music, Amazon, Deezer, Tidal, and many more. What's Deezer? I never even heard of Deezer. How many of them are there? I know that's like the holy grail of streaming services though. And getting paid. They want to. We want to get you paid for your music. That's huge because a lot of bands go broke before they get big. But Distrokid collects earnings and payments and sends 100% of these earnings to artists minus banking fees and applicable taxes. And that's just one of the tons of benefits of using Distrokid. You can send big files to anyone with their Instant Share feature. You can use the Hyper Follow feature to promote your release and get pre saves on your song. You can even create personal landing pages for yourself, your band, your brand, and whatever you like. It has a free Spotify Canvas generator too, to generate your own Spotify Canvas for your songs. And the Mixia feature instantly masters your tracks for higher quality audio. So if you're ready to bring your band to the next level, it's time to check out Distrokid. The Distrokid app is now available on iOS and Android. Go to the app or Play Store to download it. Listeners of this show can get 30% off their first year by going to distrokid.com the500. That's distrokid.com VIP the500 for 30 off your first year. Dig it. Yeah, take us there, dude.

[Morty Coyle]

A shout out to Sly Stone, too. Because this first version, it sounds like. I'm saying I'm going in a weird direction. But the truth is, when they started working on this thing, this is a great society song written by Darby Slick, who was Grace's brother in law. This is a song they did in the band before she was in Jefferson Airplane. Sly Stone, actually, I believe, produced the first version of this prior to. I think maybe even prior to the Airplane doing it. And he. I think he played like everything. They weren't. I. I don't think they were capable yet of doing the song justice. And it felt a little. Felt a little softer when you hear this version, it's when the. And it just goes boom. And this one, I think sort of had, you know, it sort of brought you in a little bit more. And I think one of the lyrics was different. It was like, don't you want someone to love or somebody. It was like a switch on the wording a little bit. But, man, when this song, this song is uncompromising and immediately brings you in. And for a psychedelic band, when you think about psychedelia and you think about, you know, the flower, this is love.

[Kathy Richardson]

That Motown.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, it's love, but it's love. Like it. Here we go. Yeah, you know, which is. I mean, when you. When the truth is found. I mean, she's talking about lies and she's, you know. Don't you. This isn't just like love the one you're with. No, this is gimme.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, it's strong. Very strong.

[Morty Coyle]

What is that like to open? What. I mean, do you guys open with this or how does that work? Or do you save it till the end or how does that work?

[Kathy Richardson]

No, we play it last. We played. Yeah. And it's. It's just a great killer closer, you know, and everybody's on their feet and singing along and fist pumping and, you know, it's just a great rock and roll song. And, you know, I. The. The great society version is nowhere near right. And, you know, Paul used to say to me, and I'm sure he said to Grace too, you just didn't have the right band yet, you know, which is true. Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, this, this. I mean, there's almost like a Steppenwolf born to be wild feeling of this song, which when you think about it, doesn't. It's because it's. Oh, it's a female vocalist and it's a. But there's nothing. I mean, it's comparable to me to like Pat Benatar doing Heartbreaker like, where she's just boom. Or heart coming out of the box with just fire. You know, like, for. For really Grace's first moment on this record where she's not in the band. She fronts the band, dude.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Like, did this. Like, did this completely just make them superstars. I can only imagine. Like. Like, how big was this when this came out?

[Morty Coyle]

I mean, I think this was the first single. If I'm not mistaken, this might have been the first single off the record. I'm trying to remember what the. What the order was for singles off this, because. I know. I think. I think Funny Cars was a single, but later. Oh, no, no. My Best Friend was the first single, and then Somebody Love and then White Rat.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Right.

[Morty Coyle]

But I think it was more of a.

[Kathy Richardson]

That song's flower power.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

You know, I think that's what I think.

[Morty Coyle]

I think the band had a lot to say about what the first single would be.

[Kathy Richardson]

Sure.

[Morty Coyle]

And then the record company went, all right, are we done with that? Yeah, now, you know, now let's. Let's go get to this thing. I mean, I think if you're going to talk about the 60s, there's, like, five songs that you can get the rights for, because that's what happens to you. Watch these movies and you're like, nobody ever listened to the Beatles, you know, like. But then you always get. You always get. I mean, for a cover, because, I mean, Darby wrote the song. It's not a cover because it's from another band. But you get, like, all along the Watchtower. Hendrix. That is just. There's going to be Vietnam. There's gonna be. Gotta be racial.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

Someone's gonna be smoking out of a rifle. Someone's gonna put a tower in arrival. It's gonna be riots and everything. And this is another one where you just go. It's just absolutely. Of its era.

[Kathy Richardson]

It's a time machine.

[Morty Coyle]

This is my big moment on stage.

[Kathy Richardson]

What's up?

[Morty Coyle]

Is this the big moment on stage?

[Kathy Richardson]

Oh, it's one of. There's a lot of big moments, actually. You know, we do miracles.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, wow.

[Kathy Richardson]

And we do it, you know, I sing it a lot harder than Marty. And we really. We build that song dynamically. And at the end, I'm just hitting a big note and, you know, that's a big showstopper. Nothing's gonna stop us now. Big showstopper. Big ending.

[Morty Coyle]

Shout out to Mannequin.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yes.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

What a weird.

[Kathy Richardson]

What a weird video. I just saw that. Some call me crazy. Yeah. You gotta get the eyes when you.

[Morty Coyle]

Oh, yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

You know what the best. The best music video moment of all time is? And I'm gonna do it just because he passed away, is. Do you remember the song that Ozzy Osbourne did with Lita Ford?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

What is it? No, it's like. It's. It's. The song is. There's a. It doesn't make a difference, but if you look at the music video, I used to do this on stage. It's really funny where it's like. It's got Lita Ford, like, in the recording studio, and she's like, would you ever trust me? And then they do this weird fade and, like, to Ozzy's face, and it's just him in the camera. Like, no, I never be that same. It's brilliant. Didn't really work in a lot of the shows, but it killed on this podcast, so. Remember that, people?

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah. That was a face for radio. That was.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I mean, this. I. I really. I was so excited when. Because I didn't. I didn't. Did, like. I'm saying I didn't dislike volunteers, but I wanted. I wanted, like, this is the Jefferson Airplane that I love. This is what I first heard by them. And I think this is what the majority of. Just the passive fans that might have heard of them, even, like, younger kids that are so disconnected to the music of the past, like, this is a song. This in, like, is. Is a song that will be remembered and played forever. It is. It is up there with, you know, anything that Janice did. Like, come on. I mean, it's just a perfect song. And when you said this is psychedelia and counterculture. I know, like, it's in that scene. This is a good rock and roll song.

[Kathy Richardson]

I don't.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I don't think this is. I don't. Look, I. I can see how with the guitar solo and the. That kind of noise, it has a psychedelic effect, but it's. I just think this is. This is pure rock and roll, baby. Just people jamming.

[Morty Coyle]

But, yeah, Motown thump that. A lot of people maybe don't remember about these scenes because when they think of, you know, these bands, they sort of imagine, like, you know, Fillmore and people dancing with, like, the oil thing. But you're like, man, these guys, they came up on the same stuff the Beatles came up with. You know, just the bat. Bat. That four. You know, that just hard four that really, man, this. I. I don't think you can. I mean, if this were the only single they put out, it would be on the Nuggets, which we've had Lenny K. On, too. It would be a nugget, you know, because this was absolutely. Doug. And now we get into some of the pastoral. Unless you have more to talk about that one. Because.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

No, I mean, I think you've. I mean, Morty, if you're not covering it, then it ain't important, bro. You know what I mean?

[Morty Coyle]

But I also want to know what Kathy. Because, you know, she's Scott.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah, I mean, yeah, Kathy. Morty talks a lot, so please feel free to.

[Kathy Richardson]

100 agree. We're still talking about somebody love. Correct.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Good.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, just great. Great rock and roll song. Great balls to the wall, great belting vocal. Just. I mean, that's the stuff that I live and breathe for, you know, like, that's. That's my jam. I, I, you know, that chest voice and, you know, just great singing and, and great message. Very hooky, very, you know, an obvious hit song.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

You know, I have a question for you, being, you know, that you do sing Janice or you've sang Janice and you sing Grace, who's an artist that you also love covering, who's somebody that, you know, you might not even be in your, you know, because I can see how those two ladies fall into your style. But who else? I mean, like, you know, is there. Is there anybody that would even shock us?

[Kathy Richardson]

No, there's no one that would shock you because my ultimate favorite is heart, you know.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, wow.

[Kathy Richardson]

And so that's how I wanted to be them. I. I was like, I want to play guitar like Nancy, I want to sing like Anne, and I want to front the band, and I want to kick ass. And, you know, that was. That was my starting point, you know, and so obviously people would, you know, you are a rock singer, and you should know who Janis Joplin is. And, you know, my dad has this record. So I listened to Janice, and then I start sitting on the piano trying to figure out. I sang get it while you can at my high school variety show my senior year, my junior year, I sang a heart song on the piano, kind of a B side, a sweet darlin, which I don't know. But anyway, yeah, so Hart were my heroes. And then obviously Janice Grace. But I love all. I just love classic rock. I mean, when. When I play a show with my band, I usually do a surprise encore and do four or five songs by one artist. And Neil Young Prince. I'm trying to think of some of the other ones I've done, You know, Pretenders. I love Chrissy Hind. We've Done album Sides of Pretenders, Fleetwood Mac, obviously, Stevie Nicks, you know, and Christine McVie. Just. I do really love the female rock artists. And I don't know. I mean, there. There's obviously, you know, back in the day, they. You could only play one. One female sung song on the radio. That was like a rule, like per hour or something. So there. There weren't that many female artists. But now it's like, obviously completely different.

[Morty Coyle]

I mean, it's especially on white radio because black radio had the Aretha Frankens and the girl groups.

[Kathy Richardson]

Right.

[Morty Coyle]

Really was. White radio seemed to only favor, like, rock and roll FM stations.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

Seem to be in that. Like, we. We. We have our. We have our girl group.

[Kathy Richardson]

Right, right. I think maybe in. It was like the 80s or 90s when that changed, or early 90s, like, when the Lilith Fair kind of thing where you had Melissa Etheridge, Indigo Girls, Michelle Shock, Tracy Chapman. What's the. What's the Little Fair Lady? Yeah, and. And that's then radio and, you know, Cheryl Crow. Just a lot of artists happened at that time that became huge, and I think radio could not ignore them.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

You know, Shania Twain, which people forget. I mean, that really did bridge a lot of gaps. I mean, Mutt was a big part of that, but didn't bridge a lot of gaps with that. I mean, now and then on to Katie Lang and, you know, some of the other, you know, and Linda Perry, who is now an absolute force. Yeah. In the industry, you know, who runs across there. And also you play guitar, which is another thing that is different than a lot of, you know, not with Heart, by the way. Another shout out to Dan Rothschild, who played bass and Heart for a long time.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Also. Also another shout out to Ann Wilson, former guest of the 500. Oh, nice, homie. We follow each other.

[Kathy Richardson]

Nice.

[Morty Coyle]

Yes.

[Kathy Richardson]

Always happy to have any, you know, degree of separation between me and Ann Wilson.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

No, no, say it.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

No, I was gonna say one of the best voices I've ever heard in my life ever. I think, like, her doing. Her doing Stairway to Heaven in front of the band. I mean, watching them cry as huge. I mean, murders it.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah. If.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

If no one's ever seen it. I think it's up there with, like, Prince doing While My Guitar Gently Weeps. Like, it's just chills every time I see it.

[Kathy Richardson]

Totally. Yeah. I cry every time I watch it. I. It's like, if I want to cry, just put that on.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah, for sure.

[Morty Coyle]

So let's jump to my best friend. The reason it's nice to see it up against this song. And then you have Skip Spence, who we talked about was the drummer prior to. It's hard with Spence and Spencer, but with Spencer Dryden, he was already out of the band and they were like, well, we'll still do this song because you wrote it for this record. And then we go from, you know, this very 60s pop song to this very powerful famous to now to like another kind of folky thing. I think few people. The fact that this. We just said this was the first single off the record, which absolutely makes you go, if there's ever a first single that throws you on what the album's gonna be.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah, right.

[Morty Coyle]

It would be this song where you're like, hey, the new rock and roll song by Jefferson Airplane.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, it's got a real Mamas and Papas kind of vibe. It is like a folk rock. It's, you know, it's the. You imagine them dancing with the flowers exploding in the air and, you know. Very groovy, Very groovy song. And it's also the beginning, the drum intro. That's our secret knock, which is.

[Morty Coyle]

Oh, really?

[Kathy Richardson]

Our corporation. Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

Oh, red.

[Kathy Richardson]

So that's the secret knock. Now you all know, and you can all just get into our dressing room.

[Morty Coyle]

But first they have to know this song. Yeah, it's wild because it really does have that sort of. We're all in this together. It almost sounds like everybody's singing all at once.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

Like, as, like a, you know, a congregate, a congregation, a communal aspect for it. And I imagine as a best friend, I mean, you got to know Paul, you know, when he was still, you know, such a viable. I mean, first of all, existing and. And a viable part of the project. Yeah, I'm saying is, you know, and actually still playing. You know, there's a lot of people that have moved on from the band that sort of maybe show up for award shows and stuff, but the band as a. As a project that's still going on when Paul was still a part of it, you know, what was that like to be with. Did he give advice or was it.

[Kathy Richardson]

You know. The only advice I can remember him giving me is, you know, that weird stuff that you do do more.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Wow.

[Kathy Richardson]

Told me to be more weird, you know, and I'm like, okay, what great direction you. No, Paul was. Paul was hilarious, honestly. He was just such a unique character. And, you know, he. I mean, just the first time I saw him, I was like, holy. That's Paul Kittner. He's the Jefferson Airplane guy. I mean he, he still wore his headband, he still had the little wire glasses and he was just. He smoked constantly. I mean I remember like be if I ever had to be in his car driving, you know, I would count how many cigarettes he would smoke just like, and be like posting it on Facebook. He's up to 18 guys, you know. But he, he was so funny, so quotable, really good hearted. Of course he could be a total as well. We call him Cantankerous Cantner but he really was the Jefferson in of all of that. And I remember seeing an interview with Grace said that when he left the band they couldn't call it Jefferson anymore because he was the driving force to keep it going through all those years. And they really did change through the times and try to keep up with the times and change their sound to be relevant. And Grace was very cognizant of the synth and the electronic music and that's, you know, she did her solo album Software that was all electronic and I think that's where Peter Wolf started getting involved in it. But Paul was a folkie. He, his favorite music was the Weavers. He loved Pete Seeger and his vision of Jefferson Airplane in the beginning was that it was like, it was going to be like the Weavers. It was three part harmonies, two male voices and a female voice. And it was very important to him to have that female voice. And so when Signe was gone, they needed to find another female singer to round out sound Paul was looking for. And I think everybody had their own different ideas about what the band, what they wanted it to be. And that's why you get such a weird mix of sounds and vibes because everybody's writing. Jack and Jorma are into blues, you know, and, and Grace is just, you know, really thinking about hits and, but also thinking about being weird. And Paul is folky. He's, you know, he's writing. He's got the 12 string guitar, the acoustic guitar and, and the 12 string electric guitar, the jangly Rickenbacker. I actually have one of his guitars that I play on stage and he, he was the, the folky guy. And even though he ended up going in some really heavy directions later on with like have you seen the Saucers and stuff like that. Like of course, House at Punil Corners. I mean they did, they did get really heavy but they also like My Best Friend is like Flower Power. Like let's put on our mini skirts and dance with the blobs. You know, like you said with the, with the Oil.

[Morty Coyle]

I was gonna say the. The. This one is. Or real. I mean, so it's sort of an ethos with the band. You know, there. There aren't a lot of bands that did get to sort of evolve. You know, speaking of Embryonic Journey, even though it's an instrumental that really did go, this is what it's going to be. And by the way, we have to give it. We know Ozzy just passed away and that's on everyone's mind. But we also just lost Peter Yarrow a couple days ago from Peter, Paul and Mary, which we know Josh has seen more than almost anyone else, which is another one of those vans that. That was based on this, that, you know, that took the folk thing. It was like Two Men and a woman. Yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Not the same live show, dude. Not the same live show. Really wish I could have seen Jefferson Airplane more than I saw Peter, Paul and Mary. You can take. You can take eight of the performances I saw with my parents away and.

[Morty Coyle]

I would have been fine off a cheese stick. I think that was as scary as that. Yeah, we wanna. We want to get to the main songs on this. I would say if. I mean, I know today coming back to me, it. We don't even get a Paul song until we get to today. You know what I mean? Like, that's how, you know, even the leader of the band doesn't really have a song on side one. Except for that one thing as. As a co write. And by the way, in the embryonic in. In the evolution of this band, we have to give a shout out to like Mickey Thomas who comes later. Like the. The reason that they also had so much longevity, I think, is because they kept changing sort of the lineups that all of a sudden you had like a new singer and it gave it a whole new thing. Gracie was there, but Paul. But you had like. All of a sudden there was like this. Miracles has this other sort of sound when Marty's and you know, when people are in different ranges. And then the Mickey on like Nothing Gonna Stop Us now and. And you know, we built this city that it almost. It really was like. Almost like new bands every few years, right?

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

And I think maybe that goes back to your question about why is the Grateful Dead so much bigger than Jefferson Airplane? And I think it was all the changes and all, you know, and then after. After the breakup, I guess nobody. People who still wanted to play couldn't get arrested. So Mickey. Mickey needed the name Starship and he got that. He got the name Starship and He still tours Starship featuring Mickey Thomas. Paul was trying to play. You know, Paul didn't get rich. I mean, maybe he. Maybe when they were touring and stuff, but he didn't write any of the big hits. He was. You know, he needed to work, to live. So in his later years, he. He tried to do Paul Kantner's Acoustic Explorer and stuff like that and couldn't get arrested. So got the name back and reformed Jefferson Starship in. In the 90s. And so you have still to this day, there's two different bands. There's our band and Mickey's band. That, you know, that's a whole confusion for people. And it's a whole. You know, I. I think it doesn't help either. Either band to have the other one out there, but it does keep the catalog on tour forever, you know, and so it's very good for the. For the record sales and things like that. But, I mean, you know, we've been. When I joined the band in 17, almost 18 years ago, you know, it was like skidding on the bottom and, you know, I think me coming in kind of helped to get off the ground again. But for years we were playing songs that, you know, we weren't playing the hits. We weren't playing anything from Starship because Paul hated that. And that's why he quit.

[Morty Coyle]

Those listening. He wasn't in the band at that point.

[Kathy Richardson]

No, no, no. He stole the masters. He was so upset. He stole the masters and put them in the trunk of his car and held them hostage because he's like, this is not us. We didn't write any of these songs. This is all produced. Just doesn't sound like us. And. And you know, that everybody else in the band wanted hits. They wanted to be successful. And Paul still had, you know, his own heart and vision about what the music was, and it just became something completely different. And I talked to Donnie about that a lot because he's like, I don't know why we didn't question anything. Like, there were all these people around us and we'd go to a band meeting and everybody had their own lawyer, and it's like, why don't we just have one being like. And. And all these people are telling us what to do, and we just said, okay. And eventually it just imploded because it was just so far removed from what it. Where it came from. And then when Grace Slick left, you know, the. The label was like, forget this, you know.

[Morty Coyle]

Right.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

And then speaking of Grace, I mean, we. We have to cut to the grace, you know, Cut to the chase if you're gonna talk about one song, man. And by the way, I know Paul didn't make it, but the money she probably made off of this song on her first album with them, White Rabbit.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

She wrote it, right?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I mean, this is. This is probably where I said Somebody to Love is. Is, you know, is. Is, you know, one of the most obviously, like, you know, popular and you hear it so much. But White Rabbit, when you think of that psychedelic era, I mean, this is it. So it's like. Whereas that one I said is. That feels more rock and roll, not this being rock and roll. This is like. This makes me want to take acid. This makes me want to take mushrooms and peyote and everything, which we're gonna do in Ibiza. Jt, I can't wait, buddy. Feed your headboe. Ready? But moral of the story, I mean, I don't think there's a. Is this. Is this the most radio friendly, psychedelic song? I mean, where something like Tomorrow Never Knows by the Beatles or what? Maybe like, what, the Birds eight miles high? Is that. Was that a big hit? But I mean, was there anything bigger than. Than this ads that sums up the psychedelic era?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, maybe like Strawberry Fields.

[Morty Coyle]

I Am the Walrus. Strawberry. Alice in Wonderland. Illusions.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, yeah, no, that. This, actually, I wore. I don't know. You guys can't see. I wore this shirt for this interview because it's got a. Oh, wow. Hookah smoking caterpillar.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

And it's funny because I wore this shirt which is Michael Bolton.

[Kathy Richardson]

Oh, nice.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

For this interview.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, he looks great.

[Kathy Richardson]

While he's a great belting singer.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Why am I doing Michael McDonald? I'm trying to do Michael Bolton singing White Rabbit, but Michael McDonald doing White Rabbit is even better.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

One thing makes you smaller.

[Morty Coyle]

One thing makes you faster than a speeding mullet. Yeah, he. That's the cool thing about this is like, once again we talked about how there was just something in the air all of a sudden. 60s 7. Everyone's like, yeah, I see the connection between surrealism and childlike and drugs and. Because then you have, you know, John Lennon goes back to. And Paul too, go back to the things that they love. Growing up, reading these, you know, these essentially wild things by people that were on sort of drugs of their time. Lewis Carroll and talking about the Walrus, which is a poem in the, you know, through the looking glass. And then you have grace, just basically going, I'm just gonna break down. I mean, get it, man. Like, when you go to Disneyland. And you're on drugs, and you're like, they made this for people on drugs, man.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, that's for people who are on drugs. They just. It's like they're.

[Morty Coyle]

That's when you knock on your mom's door and you go, what are you listening to in there?

[Kathy Richardson]

Mother's Little Helper.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, it's the same thing where it flipped in the other direction. All of a sudden, she's literally just reading you Alice in Wonderland. And you're going, I hadn't. Oh, she takes a pill and she changes size, and then it's eat me, drink me, and then there's somebody smoking, and then there's mushrooms. Oh, my God.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, my God.

[Morty Coyle]

This isn't a childlike poem. This is. You know.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Was this on. Any rate. Did radio stations all play this, or was this something that they were like.

[Morty Coyle]

I think they snuck by. It was early enough in 67. This is the beginning of 67. I think it just sort of went with the bright colors and the. You know, I mean, they have a song, you know, she. She has Funny Cars and Plastic Fantastic Lover. I think they probably just missed. You know, it wasn't like, I turn you on. And really, I mean, if she's gonna say, hey, man, it's Lewis Carroll, like, I'm not doing anything.

[Kathy Richardson]

That's not a story that we all grew up.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

Reading, you know. Yeah. And she was definitely making a comment on. On the legal drugs and. And the parents, you know, being down on the kids doing drugs and then explaining them. Well, you know, you read us this book, and you all drink alcohol and you all take pills, and, you know, you're. It's. There's no. Not a big difference between the drugs we're doing and what you guys were doing. Although, you know, obviously, LSD was. It was not really about getting higher, getting low, tripping, you know, and they sure did a lot of acid. I mean, they used to do it every single day. Grace told me. You know, it's.

[Morty Coyle]

It's insane when you think about the work ethic of the time, because then you go, how many records did they put out, like, in a row where they were at like, that. They. It wasn't like they took five years off.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Morty Coyle]

It was like. There were, like, speed. I get. You could put out nine records and be like. You know, the fact that they were getting so out of their heads.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah. And. And then the records did get weirder and weirder. I mean, this one was probably the most together, I would say, as far as really interesting.

[Morty Coyle]

Well, volunteers. We did volunteers, yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

But volunteers had some grooves on it. You know what I mean? It's, it's, it's. It wasn't. I didn't think it was that out there. Maybe I haven't. I should have listened to it, you know, recently. But there's one where they're just like.

[Kathy Richardson]

Talking and making weird sounds like. And, you know, they said that they played it for the record company. And the looks on their faces, they were just like, they don't get it at all. You know, and they're like, this is the album. There you go. And it was there, you know, because they had their own label, they, they could do whatever they wanted. I mean, it was pretty amazing. And I think a lot of that had to do with Marty's dad, Joe. Joe Buck was short for Buchanan, right? He's.

[Morty Coyle]

No, no, he was. Marty was Jewish, I think his last name was originally.

[Kathy Richardson]

I knew I had that wrong.

[Morty Coyle]

It was something like that where he had changed it. And you went, you know, I'm a Jewish guy. And so we're like, hey, you know, another one of us in the business. Thank God, finally one.

[Kathy Richardson]

Well, so Joe, his dad was looked out for him his whole life. They had, they had incredible. They kept all their own publishing. I mean, they, what they did was really unheard of because that man was watching over their business. And they, and it, starting with the, with the Matrix, I think he helped fund that in. So he was a very supportive dad. And also like an Olympic diver or something weird like that. I don't know, fact check me on that, if I could be wrong. But I think, I think he was, he was like a diver. Like a sport diver.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, Buckwald. Yeah, it was Buckwhoiled. His mom. His mom was Episcopalian, his dad was Jewish. But like, when I heard what, you know, when, when they were like, he has the Matrix, I'm like, like, wait, his dad bought him. Like, that's like a real, that's like a real power move of like, you want to be in a band? I'll buy you a club.

[Kathy Richardson]

In a stage. You know, I'll buy you a club, right?

[Morty Coyle]

Imagine that. You're like, you want to be a stand up comedian? I'll buy you a brick wall and a microphone. You're like, okay, thanks, dad. You know, but yeah, without them, I mean that really, without Marty, you don't get, you know, they don't get a foothold. They don't get to be a house band. Not a lot of people get to say they came up as a house band at their. You know, their singers. You know, their singers club.

[Kathy Richardson]

Right.

[Morty Coyle]

You know, and then, I mean. I mean, we've pretty much hit most of it. I mean, she has funny cars.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I wanted to ask. You know, I want to ask you a question, not talking about the record, but if you could sum up in like, a minute or two, like, what. What happens to the band after this and how do we get to them breaking up? Like, you know, was it all just legal battles over money, or is it just disagreements, or did we already cover it and, you know, and I'm just out of it.

[Kathy Richardson]

But Jack and Yorma started doing Hot Tuna, and everybody was doing all their solo records, and Marty left at the very end, and David Fryberg came in and David. David and Paul were very, very good friends from way in the early 60s, and they were in the folk scene together, you know, and so they. They were always all. All these bands. Quicksilver, the Charlatans, Big Brother, Airplane, and the Dead. They were like the. The scene. And they were all playing on each other's records and getting mixed up with each other and. And Jerry's all over Paul's solo record. And anyway, so it was like. It sort of splintered at that point when Marty left and Jack and Jormur started doing Tuna. And then they were kind of in this limbo, like, are we getting back together? They never made. The only album they made after that was a live record, 30 seconds over Winterland. And so the. The remnants of that, who were Grace, Paul, David, and I think maybe Papa John Creech.

[Morty Coyle]

Did he play violin?

[Josh Adam Meyers]

He became.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah, they had a violin.

[Kathy Richardson]

So they decided, we want to keep going. We want to do a new band. And they created Jefferson Starship. So that. Because it was, like, apparent that Jack and Norma really weren't interested in coming back, and Marty was gone. But then, of course, Marty came into Jefferson Starship after the first album. Huge hits. Yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Interesting.

[Morty Coyle]

For those who don't know, check out. Also check out that era of them, because in the 70s, like, if you grew up like I did with 70s radio, you almost couldn't miss. Before Mickey was in the band, there was that weird 70s time where grace was almost kind of in the back seat, where she would just do the same call and response. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here and there. But those songs, Miracles and what is it? Find your way back.

[Kathy Richardson]

Well, that's.

[Morty Coyle]

That's Nikki. Or Is that me? That is Mickey.

[Kathy Richardson]

There's another one.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

With your love.

[Morty Coyle]

With your love.

[Kathy Richardson]

That's the One Run away.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

Count on.

[Kathy Richardson]

Me Count on my love. Marty, he knew how to write a song for sure.

[Morty Coyle]

Oh, yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

He. He was responsible for so many of their hits in the 70s.

[Morty Coyle]

I love. By the way, Mickey is the voice on Fooled around and Fell in Love by Elvin Bishop.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, no way.

[Kathy Richardson]

Drums on.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah.

[Kathy Richardson]

When they were both like kids, you.

[Morty Coyle]

Know, everybody assumed Elvin's the singer, but.

[Kathy Richardson]

Right.

[Morty Coyle]

Yeah. When you hear that song.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I love that song so much.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

I mean, this is. This was such a fun record. It was suchly. It's also. I loved it to, to do it. I mean, I know I'm doing them out of order because I'm getting ready to leave, but to have this right after Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young, this is a fun listen to. You know what I mean? Yeah, totally. I. I can't thank you enough for coming on, darling. Like, please come back and please let us know when we can see you. And next time you're coming to New York. I wanna, I wanna, I wanna jam with you.

[Kathy Richardson]

New York in a while, but. Yes, please do come. Please promote headlining. We get to play more songs.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Oh, my God, please, before we do the final questions, please promote away. Like, where. Where can they find you? Where is. You know, do you have any upcoming tour dates, anything like that?

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, we're all. We're on tour right now. We have a ton of shows this summer. Go to jeffersonstarship.com and you can find our tour dates and buy tickets there. And I can't. I don't even. We're on this run right now with BTO and Marshall Tucker Band. We're going everywhere all the time. Like, we're on a bus. I don't. Like, we're in Michigan and now we're in Wisconsin. Then Indiana and Ohio and we're. And West coast, east coast, Canada, everywhere. So I can't even tell. I don't even know I'm on a neat show.

[Morty Coyle]

How many shows a year about.

[Kathy Richardson]

I want to say over 70. It seems like we're out a lot. I don't know what it'll end up being this year. I could probably find out, but that's 70, 80 shows.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Go see him, man, and I promise you I will make sure that I come see you. And if. If, you know, if we ever do a jam and you're in la, I would love for you to come up and sing for us. Like, come up and just join the band because, you know, it's just anybody that can. That is as influenced and has the voice of you it's like it's just a true rock star. And what's your living? Just a complete dream. And I just. I can't thank you enough for coming on. So, final questions. We ask everybody this. What's your favorite song on this record?

[Kathy Richardson]

White Rabbit.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

White Rabbit. All right. Is there anything you skip over?

[Kathy Richardson]

I would probably skip over my best friend that songs, you know, it's. To me, that's a throwaway. It's funny that that was the single. I did want to say One thing about DCBA25, I guess it's called. And people used to ask Paul, what's that? What does that stand for? Is it. Is it about drugs or something? And he said, no, it's the chords to the song. And it really is actually this. The chords are dcbna.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

So I love that.

[Kathy Richardson]

I love that you can learn that.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

And this might be odd because you're playing with the people, but can you to this record?

[Kathy Richardson]

Oh, sure. I can flip to anything.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Now you have to do the jam. How would you. How would you give an elevator pitch to get someone to listen to this record? Like, how do you sum this up to get someone to listen?

[Kathy Richardson]

Oh, I mean, it's got some of the most seminal music of the 60s ever. It's. It is like taking a time machine to the 60s. The whole album from top to bottom is very, very 60s. And it's got some of the best songs ever. Somebody to Love, White Rabbit Today coming back to me. Oh, and an embryonic journey. Totally cool guitar thing that Jude plays in our show. And of course, he takes it to space. But, yeah, I would just say it's. It's. If you want to know what the 60s sounded like, listen to this album.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Beautiful. Beautiful. I couldn't have said it better, Morty, do you want to thank anybody or whatever make it.

[Morty Coyle]

I want to give a shout out to China, shout out to Jude. And China shows up, trying to feel better, and I can't. I hope you guys come through LA again when, you know, when I get a chance to see that. And DJ Morty Coyle, Find Me Everywhere. And condolences to the Osbornes and, you know, to everyone else that's going through it right now. And I will say this all the time, sing with your kids. And also, go see everybody. Now.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Now, don't ask yourself, did I go see?

[Morty Coyle]

Don't go see them if you have the money, if you can get the money, wait till the last minute, find a cheap ticket, go see them now. This is it. You don't get Another chance to see these legacy artists as we lost Brian, Sly and Ozzy within like a month and a half. Yeah, you know, go see them now and tell your kids about it because we're witnessing history and the end of it. So, yeah, give yourselves the bragging rights and and go enjoy the music that we're showing you every week.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Couldn't agree with you more, Morty. Kathy, thank you so much for coming on. This is a true pleasure. Thanks, Kathy.

[Kathy Richardson]

Yeah, thank you, guys.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

What did I tell you? What did I tell you? The one and only Kathy Richardson. Follow on Instagram at the Kathy Richardson and YouTube and Facebook. Facebook Athy Richardson. And check out at Jefferson Starship and at official Jefferson Starship. She is on the road with them. Dates and ticket [e-mail] backslash Tor all right, now we just listened to 67 surrealistic pillow by Jefferson Airplane. For new music brought to you in part by Distrokid is what Are We Waiting for by the Jefferson Starship off their latest ep, Mother of the Sun. You can find find links to their music on the website the500podcast.com and if you were in a band or directly influenced by one of these albums or artists and you want your music Featured on the 500 website, send your song to 500podcastgmail.com and put the album and artists and influence you in the subject line. Next week it is Steely Dan week as we go deep into their 1977 record Asia. It's coming in at 145. We got a fun guesty. Do your homework. We'll see you then, guys.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

Shape it's changing Rearranging it's shifting its shape for creation destruction must always begin to tear away, wear away Become new again and for all of the eons will start to shine we're still standing at the start starting life what are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? Money changes like always they live on golden thrones Tap the pyramid Merchants are suffering profiteers and mischief miseries they're selling you cancer Both cure and disease Selling deception disruption distortion division derision Stuck in private prison they're selling lies selling hate but we can't stop buying make it answer what are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? We can do better let's get together yes, we can do better we all can be together we can do better yes, let's get together right now.

[Morty Coyle]

What.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

Are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? What are we waiting for? What are we waiting for the Fleece.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Nation.

[Musical Performer / Interlude Singer]

On the 500, the 500.

[Josh Adam Meyers]

Next Chapter podcast.