All Over The Map: Why America Voted, From Actual Voters

Summary

Podcast Summary: CNN Presents | All Over The Map: Why America Voted, From Actual Voters

Date: November 11, 2024
Host: John King (with producer Claire Duffy)
Main Theme:
A deeply reported, nationwide, post-election reflection capturing the diverse, candid voices of American voters across battleground states. The episode seeks to understand why Americans voted the way they did in the 2024 Presidential election, which was decisively won by Donald Trump, and how voters themselves are processing the outcome.

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Episode Overview

John King and his team spent over a year and a half interviewing 86 voters from pivotal swing states like Iowa, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania, Virginia, Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona, and Nevada. In this episode, listeners hear directly from a range of Americans—Trump supporters, Harris supporters, those who voted third party, and others processing feelings of hope, betrayal, or despair. King and producer Claire Duffy also reflect on what the project reveals about the forces shaping American politics.

Tone: Respectful, empathetic, honest, and illuminating, letting voters’ words drive the story.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Scale and Meaning of Trump’s Victory

• Historic Win: Trump swept all seven battlegrounds and, for the first time in 20 years, a GOP nominee won the national popular vote ([00:00]).
• Significance: Trump improved with Black and Latino voters and made gains in suburbs and rural America.
• Voter Power: The perspectives of battleground voters are central—they wield outsized influence on the electoral outcome.

Notable Quote:

“Trump, in the end, pulled off a huge win, especially from an Electoral college perspective. He took all seven of the key battlegrounds and he won the popular vote… made inroads everywhere… more Black votes, higher percentage of Latino votes, improved his standing in suburbs.”
— John King ([00:00])

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2. Trump Supporters—Motivation and Hopes

Economic Anxiety & Desire for Change

• Andy Konchak (NH, fisherman): Valued Trump's business approach, perceived independence from corporate money, and smiles at Trump’s win ([03:20]).
• Joseph Knowles (MI): Switched from Democrat (supported Obama/Biden) to Trump, citing stagnation: “nothing has changed” and frustration with inflation, immigration, and crime ([03:40]).
• Rachel (VA): “Everything costs more. People don’t feel as safe. The education system has failed… our country is slipping away from us” ([04:22]).

Calls for Unity and Strong Leadership

• Many hope Trump can “bring us whole again” and unite a fractured country.
• Rachel: Expressed hope that people would overcome their fears and recognize that Trump’s policies could benefit all ([08:43]).

Notable Quotes:

“What he's done in the past and what he says he's going to do in the future, it gives me hope... I want to be successful in my country. I want my children to be successful.”
— Rachel ([04:22])

“I feel like people made a statement. There's no way anybody can say voter fraud, anything like that, because he won with a landslide.”
— Joseph Knowles ([05:34])

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3. Those Voting Against Trump, Third Party, or for Harris

Dilemmas, Defections, and Third Party Voting

• Cynthia Sabatini (PA): Waited until late on Election Day before opting for a protest vote (Lisa Murkowski) due to doubts about Harris’ authenticity ([10:14]).
• Joan Lunden (PA): Lifelong Republican, voted for Harris for the first time due to Trump’s Ukraine stance during debate, feeling it was a surrender to Russia ([10:58]).

Notable Quote:

“Even six weeks ago, I couldn’t visualize… What changed my mind and my vote was… when President Trump said that the war in Ukraine had to be settled by negotiation… That was, in my way of thinking, a given to the former head of the KGB, which was not an acceptable answer for this 1980s vintage college Republican... for the first time in my life I voted for a Democrat for president.”
— Joan Lunden ([10:58])

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4. Post-Election Reflections: Disappointment, Alienation, Polarization

Harris & Progressive Voters’ Disillusionment

• Christine Nguyen (GA): Voted Harris for representation and justice, now feels “disappointed, sad, and stressed” ([15:31]). Criticizes Democratic centrism and lack of boldness, feels many voters were “in the closet” about supporting Trump, suspects party failed to offer a compelling alternative ([16:07]).
• Soila Sanchez (NV): “Donald Trump is a disgrace… by sowing division. He never stopped insulting immigrants… What hurts me the most is to find out the amount of Latinos that voted for him” ([18:07]).

Desire for Responsive, Progressive Politics

• Calls for the Democratic Party to listen to and empower marginalized communities and take bolder stances.

Notable Quotes:

“The election results reflect the ongoing divisions in our society. It’s so evident that the Democratic Party’s centrist approach has alienated many progressive voices.”
— Christine Nguyen ([16:07])

“He never stopped saying how immigrants were poisoning the blood of this country. What hurts me the most is the amount of Latinos that voted for him.”
— Soila Sanchez ([18:07])

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5. King and Duffy Debrief: What Did They Learn?

Surprise and the Predictable

• King expresses mild surprise at the quick, decisive outcome, but not at the direction: Trump always held an edge in real conversations, reflecting genuine economic frustration ([20:07], [23:04]).
• Economic urgency outweighs many abstractions (democracy, rights) for most working-class voters.

Notable Quotes:

“People vote their lives… My biggest takeaway from this election is that more politicians should shop for their groceries, and more people in our business should go to the grocery store, go in person.”
— John King ([23:04])

“The most important thing is feeding your family and having a job, democracy, Donald Trump’s character, even abortion rights, move down your list.”
— John King ([24:07])

Understanding Voter Shifts

• Trump’s gains among Black and Latino voters explained by economic anxiety, not identity.
• “If you make $50,000–$70,000 a year and you have a family, things are tough… you want something different. Donald Trump to them is something they can block out that part of him they think they can.”
  — John King ([25:43])

The Core Lesson: The Power of Listening

• The project reinforced the need for relentless engagement with “real people” between and beyond election cycles, not just elites and candidates ([27:06]).

Notable Quote:

“You only learn when you’re listening.”
— John King, quoting his mother ([28:42])

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Memorable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• "I interviewed some of them three or four times. We talked about their lives, their work, their struggles, their fears and their hopes." — John King ([00:00])
• "I was taken aback by some of the responses to his win... The calls on social media to kill Trump, I—it's kind of disgusting." — Rachel ([06:05])
• "I'm feeling disappointed, sad and stressed about the future… I was just shocked at how final and conclusive the election results turned out to be." — Christine Nguyen ([16:07])
• "We met 86 people with such different opinions about everything… but not one person is not a good person... they all cared about America." — Claire Duffy ([29:03])

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Key Timestamps

• 00:00–02:59 – John King sets the stage, contextualizing the Trump victory and the scope of the reporting project.
• 03:00–08:43 – Voters who supported Trump explain their decisions and hopes; themes: economic stress, law and order, desire for unity.
• 10:00–13:57 – Voters who struggled with their choice or supported Harris describe their reasoning, disappointments, and what they want next.
• 15:16–19:29 – Harris/progressive voters express heartbreak, analyze Dems’ strategic errors, warn of challenges ahead.
• 20:00–24:25 – King and Duffy’s post-election analysis: the quick Trump win, missed signals among Dems, economic pain’s centrality.
• 25:19–28:42 – Reflecting on new political coalitions, Black/Latino shifts, the lesson: “listen, always.”

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Takeaways

• The Power of Listening: Only by conducting repeated, open-ended interviews did the complexity of voter motivations fully emerge.
• The Primacy of Economic Anxiety: For the pivotal bloc of voters, immediate economic security trumped other considerations, including Trump’s scandals or legacy concerns.
• Calls for Healing: Both Trump and Harris voters hope, though with differing confidence, that the country can unify and move forward—though polarization is deeply felt.
• Partisan Realignment: Old assumptions about party coalitions have been upended; both parties have soul-searching ahead.

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Final Reflection

“All such great humans and they all cared about America… I wish that as a country, we could take that as a person, I will take that with us from this project.”
— Claire Duffy ([29:03])

This episode offers a portrait of America at a moment of reckoning—divided but full of care for country. The deep pessimism, immense hope, and raw honesty captured reveal a society searching both for change and for each other.

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For listeners: This episode is not an analysis from punditry but a vehicle for hearing Americans wrestle with the stakes of their choices, in their own voices. For those seeking understanding of 2024’s outcome—and what comes next—these stories offer unmatched insight.

Transcript

[John King]

John. I'm John King and this is all over the map. For the last year and a half, my team and I have been traveling all over the country, visiting and revisiting the same states, repeatedly interviewing the voters who, because they lived in Iowa, New Hampshire, that's early on. Then Pennsylvania, Virginia, Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona, Nevada. Well, they lived in the battlegrounds, so they wielded a lot of power in this election. We really got to know a lot of these voters and we're grateful, so grateful for their time, their hospitality. I interviewed some of them three or four times. We talked about their lives, their work, their struggles, their fears and their hopes. We talked about their vote. Of course, some of them from the beginning were certain they were going to vote for one candidate or one party. A lot of them, though, were ambivalent, didn't like their choices. Back when it was Biden Trump, and even when it was Harris Trump, we shared a lot of these conversations right here on the podcast. Though those were just a fraction of the 86 people I talked to as part of this project. The election, of course, is behind us now, and in some ways it was a stunner of an outcome. After months of polls showing the former President Donald Trump and the Vice President Kamala Harris were in a dead heat in all of the swing states, Trump, in the end, pulled off a huge win, especially from an Electoral college perspective. He took all seven of the key battlegrounds and he won the popular vote. For him, that's the first time in three campaigns for Republicans. That's the first time their nominee has carried the popular vote in 20 years. And Trump made inroads everywhere. He got more black votes, he got a higher percentage of Latino votes. He improved his standing in the suburbs. He improved his standing even where he was already strong in rural and small town America. So we're going to return today to the voices of the people we've gotten to know in the last year and a half. We've tried to understand how they think, tried to understand how this election was playing in their community, tried to understand just what they would do in this unprecedented American political moment.

[Soila Sanchez]

What hurts me the most is the amount of Latinos that voted for him.

[Joseph Knowles]

I think a lot of people that's hurting right now, especially women, but I think the best choice is Trump in office.

[Christine Nguyen]

I think that I was duped. I think a lot of people around me were in the closet about how they were going to vote.

[Rachel]

I have so much hope, so much hope.

[John King]

Some of these folks you've heard from before, if you've been following and listening to this podcast. Others you might recognize if you saw are pieces in this series on TV or read [e-mail] you'll hear first from some who supported Donald Trump, some who felt they voted not for a candidate, but against Trump, and some who were excited to vote for Vice President Harris. We're going to let them speak for themselves. Yeah.

[Andy Konchak]

My name is Andy Konchak and I live in Dover, New Hampshire. I'm going to try to speak a little louder and clearer because on a commercial fishing vessel right now and there really is no quiet place to go to while you're out at sea.

[Joseph Knowles]

So my name is Joseph Knowles. I live in Macomb County, Michigan.

[Rachel]

My name is Rachel. I live in Glen Allen, Virginia.

[Andy Konchak]

I voted for Donald Trump because when he was in office, he ran for this country like a business. He wasn't paid off from other large corporations. So there was no, like, quid pro quo. I'm feeling pretty good about the outcome. I'm not gonna lie. When I woke up on the boat and found out who won, it's not like I'm gonna say I didn't smile.

[Joseph Knowles]

I voted for Donald Trump for this election, 2024. I think that he would be able to save what's left of the country. We got immigration issue. We have inflation and we have crime, we have cost of living rights getting violated. There's a lot of things. And I just feel like Trump that's going to say what left of our country. And I just felt like we needed a new direction. I voted Democrat both times, vote Obama and then I vote Democrat, vote Joe Biden. And I just felt like nothing has changed. And I just got tired of doing the same thing, same thing, and then expecting a different result. So I decided to try something different.

[Rachel]

I voted for Donald Trump because what he's done in the past and what he says he's going to do in the future, it gives me hope. You know, we're coming off of four years under Biden and Harris administration. Everything costs more. People don't feel as safe. The education system has failed our children. We feel like there's not law and order. We feel like as Americans, our country is slipping away from us. And Donald Trump comes in and and tells us we're going to make America great and it's going to be America first policies. And as much as I love all people, this is the country I live in. I want to be successful in my country. I want my children to be successful.

[Andy Konchak]

I think he won because people are tired of the borders and letting illegal immigrants in, funding them instead of our own homeless people and our veterans. And also because he was running against Conway Harris, who's been VP for four years and has done absolutely nothing in my eyes, except why.

[Joseph Knowles]

I feel like people made a statement that no way that somebody gonna be able to say they was theft or voter fraud, anything like that, because he won with a landslide. You can't even question it because you want a popular vote. He won the swing states, so I'm glad that's out the way now. I think a lot of people that's hurting right now and it's, you know, people are really upset, especially women, but I think the best choice is Trump in office.

[Rachel]

I was taken aback by some of the responses to his win. I know people would feel disappointment, but the calls on social media to kill Trump, I. It's kind of disgusting. I don't recall seeing all of that after the Biden Harris win. And I hope that that gets remedied quickly because that's no way to speak about an incoming president and it's no way to speak about anybody on social media.

[Joseph Knowles]

I think the only thing that surprised me about all this is how disrespectful people are to each other. What surprised me it was people who looked like me. It was the most disrespectful. I stuck to people to relate to me, and I didn't realize how many people that did not relate to me or they related to me, but they was voting for her because she's a black woman, or they was voting for her not because of policies, but because it didn't like Trump. That surprised me because I know a lot of people who lost jobs or people who didn't lose jobs, knew somebody who did lose jobs, and I expected them to relate to my pain. We wanted him to be the change, and I think that's what it is. He give us hope that we can be something because a lot of us feel like we losing everything and no one cares. And Trump is saying he promised that he's going to do the things to bring us whole again is the reason why people vote for Trump. That's mainly the reason why I vote for Trump.

[Andy Konchak]

I'd like to see the country come together as one because it's so divided, blue or red, there has to be a way to solve it. I mean, not everything can be solved because people on both sides are salty when it comes to certain issues. I'd also like to see a little bit morality on both sides. If you know what I mean?

[Joseph Knowles]

Now that Trump won, I expect Trump to work on bringing us all together right now because there's so much division, there's so much hate, there's so much anger, there's so much anxiety, so much things that's going on. I'm expecting Trump to bring peace and bring hope again, but I'm also expecting Trump to fix what hurting us right now. We need help right now with immigration, with crime, with inflation, with jobs. So I expect Trump to come in the door and make that happen asap. I expect unity at this moment, and that's it.

[Rachel]

My hope is that as some time goes by and people see that he's not coming to take away any of your rights, that, you know, abortion rights or. I don't even know what they're fearful of. LGBTQ rights. Look, abortion is a state, right? So I find that odd that it's even an issue in the presidential election. But he's gonna make it so that our children have hope, so that we have hope, so that future of America holds hope. This nation is. It's beautiful, it's amazing, and it's imperfect. We need somebody who's gonna be a strong leader and who's going to be a president who's going to enfor order, who's going to be a president to put our country first, who's going to consider the people who are here. And I hope that it's unified. I hope people lose their fear, and I hope that people see that he's going to make this country better. We're all going to come together and it's going to be better. I have so much hope. So much hope.

[Cynthia Sabatini]

My name is Cynthia Sabatini. I live in Media, Pennsylvania, which is suburban Philadelphia.

[Joan Lunden]

I'm Joan Lunden. I live in Berks County, Pennsylvania, about 50 miles west of Philadelphia.

[Cynthia Sabatini]

I waited until 5:00, clock, Tuesday, November 5th, because I really could not make up my mind as to whether I truly wanted to cast a vote for Kama Harris. I ended up voting for Lisa Murkowski, Senator from Alaska. I could not vote for Harris because I questioned her authenticity with respect to her views. They've changed radically, and I really thought she was running more towards the middle merely to get elected.

[Joan Lunden]

I voted for Vice President Harris. That was a vote that even six weeks ago, I couldn't visualize. I'm a former Republican, had been since registering to vote in 1985. What changed my mind and my vote was the second presidential debate when President Trump said that the war in Ukraine had to be settled by negotiation, meaning territorial concessions because President Putin had nuclear weapons and we'd be in World War three. That was, in my way of thinking, a given to the former head of the KGB, which was not an acceptable answer for this 1980s vintage college Republican. I had other differences with former President Trump. The Ukraine answer was the last straw, and for the first time in my life, I voted for a Democrat for president. I felt that it was better to have a leader in office with whom I disagreed on many policies and argue over those and have a president who understands America's obligations to come to the aid of a sovereign democracy that was invaded.

[Cynthia Sabatini]

With respect to my feelings about the election results, I'm not in the least bit surprised. I really thought that Trump would win. I'm not even surprised that he won the popular vote. I think he and his campaign made a concerted effort to go into states that are blue states and speak to the population who had predispositions to voting for Trump. I think what I'm surprised about is his margin of victory and that the election could be called as quickly as it was. I really thought we would be waiting days for this.

[Joan Lunden]

The Donald Trump victory did not surprise me. What did surprise me, though, was that Donald Trump won all of the blue wall states. I was expecting them to be far more competitive. In my opinion. Trump won another term mainly on the economy. He paid attention to people in rural communities and small towns who believed that both parties forgot them. I can't argue with that. President Biden, by staying in the race as long as he did, probably bears some responsibility for this result. But regardless, what needs to happen now is healing and reconciliation. People have spoken.

[Cynthia Sabatini]

What I'd like to happen next is to have him start addressing who he'd like to put in various cabinet positions, and I would like to see him choose people who have solid records in the respective areas for which they will serve in the administration.

[Joan Lunden]

We should start focusing on where there's agreement and work from there to resolve disagreement. And we need to stop vilifying the other side. No, you're not automatically a bigot because you voted for Donald Trump. Nor are you automatically a socialist because you voted for Kamala Harris. I wish we'd stop the you're either with me or against me thinking. What I hope will happen is the parties will recognize that most of the country is more centrist. I believe that we're a center right country. We need candidates who stop playing to the extremes.

[John King]

When we come back, the voters who came out of Tuesday disappointed or worse I'm Dr. Sanjay Gupta, host of the Chasing Life podcast.

[Claire Duffy]

If you think about your devices that can integrate vocal biomarkers to help understand.

[Joan Lunden]

Your health, that's really where the future.

[Claire Duffy]

Is going, in my opinion.

[John King]

Dr. Yael Bunsusan is a laryngologist. She is director of the University of South Florida's Health Voice Center. She is co leading research there on using AI to try and detect diseases and perhaps even treat them. Listen to Chasing Life streaming now wherever.

[Joseph Knowles]

You get your podcasts.

[Christine Nguyen]

My name is Christine Nguyen and I'm from Atlanta, Georgia. My name is Melissa Cordero and I live here in Tucson, Arizona.

[Soila Sanchez]

I am Soila Sanchez and I live in Las Vegas, Nevada.

[Christine Nguyen]

I voted for Kamala Harris because I believed our shared values, our principles and desired future just mattered so much more than whatever Trump brought to the table. I voted for Kamala Harris because I believed in her commitment to justice and equality as a bipoc queer person and a veteran. Representation matters deeply to me.

[Soila Sanchez]

Of course I voted for Kamala Harris. She was going to fight for the rights of our children and grandchildren and of course for women rights.

[Christine Nguyen]

I'm feeling disappointed, sad and stressed about the future. My entire neighborhood felt subdued on Wednesday morning, and more than anything, I was just shocked at how final and conclusive the election results turned out to be. I think people were so impatient and anxious for change that they felt any change was better than none, and I think that's why Trump won the race. I'm feeling disappointed, but not entirely shocked. I will say I had no idea they had that kind of momentum behind them. I think that I was duped. I think a lot of people around me were in the closet about how they were going to vote. And it certainly showed on social media after the fact that the election results reflect the ongoing divisions in our society. And it's so evident that the Democratic Party's centrist approach has alienated many progressive voices. The events of the last few days have shown just how polarized we are, and it's so frustrating to see how many people feel unheard, including myself. I believe Trump won because he effectively mobilized his base and tapped into the frustrations of his followers and other Americans. Apparently, the Democratic Party's move towards centrism, as I've already mentioned, may have left some voters feeling like there wasn't a clear, bold alternative, which I think many of us truly want better candidates, although I thought Kamala would have been perfect. Many people prioritize issues like the economy and immigration. Immigration especially living here in Tucson, Arizona and seeing that Directly, it's heartbreaking, but, you know, Trump addressed those directly, and the Democrats seem to be hesitant to take stronger stances like what exactly she was going to do. I would have liked to see a clap back to Project 2025.

[Soila Sanchez]

I feel that Donald Trump is a disgrace for our country by sowing division. He never stopped insulting immigrants, forgetting that this country was built by immigrants for immigrants. He never stopped saying how immigrants were poisoning the blood of this country. What hurts me the most is to find out the amount of Latinos that voted for him without really realizing the damage he can cause us.

[Christine Nguyen]

I want Democrats to hopefully control the House, and my fingers are crossed that there will be enough smart and courageous people working in the White House, in the courts and the government to keep things in check, at least until the next presidential election. I want to see a shift within the Democratic Party towards embracing more progressive policies and actually being true to them, rather than catering to centrists or right leaning agendas. I think it's crucial for leaders to listen to and uplift the voices of BIPOC and LGBT communities as we are going to be suffering greatly. I hope that I am exaggerating what I think the next few years are going to be like. I am devastated, I am angry. But I will remain hopeful and I will continue to do the work.

[Soila Sanchez]

All I can do for now is to hope that he doesn't come through or his project 2025 does not come to fruition. Hopefully those were all just words and they don't become actions. All we have to do now is pray for our country.

[John King]

I'm here in the studio one last time with Allie Molloy, producer extraordinaire, the maestro of the all over the map team.

[Claire Duffy]

John, what a week. You spent most of it at the wall showing Americans the results in real time, 12 hours straight. You had a lot of info to process, but what surprised you most?

[John King]

Now, looking back, the number one surprise was how quickly we knew, in part because the states counted faster and in part because Trump was running up such big early margins in the states that matter. In the end, those margins did come back to a more competitive place. So that tells you what Harris actually had. A path that doesn't look like that when you look at the map. And it's all filled in red, all seven battleground states. Now, that should not be a surprise. Elections do tend to break late and we live in a nationalized climate. So when they break, they tend to break one way. And they broke for Trump. We came back from our last trip thinking Maybe there was a little bit of Harris momentum. The question was, was it enough? Well, we know the answer now. The answer is no. Donald Trump made gains in his foundational areas, rural America and small town America. He made marginal gains in the suburbs. And we know from the exit polls. And again, this will be scrubbed a little bit. And what we know today won't be exactly what we actually know a year or two from now when we scrub it a little better. But he definitely made some gains among black voters and Latino voters. So he made gains everywhere. And Harris lost from the Biden coalition. We talked about this the last time he if you're going to have some subtraction from your coalition or the last person's coalition, then where's your addition? And so the Democrats have a lot of soul searching to do to figure out what happened. But it's clear two things happened in places where people make $75,000 a year or less. Donald Trump won resoundingly. That's about the cost of living. That's about we want change. That's about we remember when he was president. Yeah, it was crazy. It was chaotic. But my mortgage rate, my food was cheaper. I got to take my kids on a vacation, I bought a car. Back then, they wanted that pre Covid thing when life was good and Trump was president. It's almost not about him, not about the name. It's about how it was. Harris was Biden. Harris was the incumbent. Harris was the status quo. People wanted change. The other surprise on the map were the margins in North Carolina and Georgia, states that the Democrats think are trending their ways. And yet look at the margins again, culturally, more conservative. The Trump campaign, he may have been meandering as a candidate. Their advertising was very specific. She's a San Francisco liberal. She hangs out with the squad. She supports spending your tax dollars on transgender rights and your tax dollars on undocumented migrants at a time when you can't pay for your groceries. Very smart. Very smart. Trump campaign. They pushed her left and they made it seem like she cares about other people more than she cares about you. So you see those margins there and it tells you, okay, Democrats, you thought those things were coming your way again. Time to go back to school, right?

[Claire Duffy]

I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this question, but are you surprised with the results after spending the last 15 months on the road?

[John King]

No, we didn't talk about this publicly because it's not our job to do this. But when we came back from just about every trip, we would have a little Check in. Right. Who would you rather be today? And on every one of those early trips, it was Trump, everyone. Every one of those early trips, people would ask us, in this building, who do you think's gonna win? And I always say, that's not my job. But if the election were today, Trump would win. We said that after every trip. And some people in the building didn't believe us. They just. They were like, What? That's impossible. January 6th. Twice impeached, you know, criminal charges, fraud. It was like, you know, people vote their lives. My biggest takeaway from this election is that more politicians should shop for their groceries and more people in our business should go to the grocery store, go in person.

[Claire Duffy]

That's a very good point. And I've heard a lot of people say, so it's just about money. But I think a lot of people don't have the luxury of thinking outside of just money. And so many Americans, you either get that or you don't.

[John King]

Right? All things being equal, yeah, sure. People will think about democracy, right?

[Claire Duffy]

And it's not that. It's not important, right?

[John King]

Of course it's important. But the most important thing is feeding your family and having a job, democracy, Donald Trump's character, even abortion rights moves down your list. When it's your way of life, it's your family morale, it's your pride. I mean, you know, Trump's. Trump didn't say anything specific about bringing costs down. He just said he would. But he also said when he was president, they were lower. That happens to be true. Donald Trump tells a lot of lies. That's a fact. Donald Trump tells a lot of lies. It is not a lie for Donald Trump to say, when I was president, gas was cheaper, food was cheaper, your rent was lower, you had more money in the bank. That's a fact. Another point is that Donald Trump is the luckiest politician in my lifetime. He inherited a gangbusters economy from Barack Obama, and he's about to inherit the strongest economy in the world from the guy he calls Sleepy Joe Biden. Because, you know, the Fed just cut interest rates again. That's going to help Donald Trump. Our economy has potholes and dents in it, without a doubt, but look around the world. The American economy is stronger by far than any of the other Western industrialized nations.

[Claire Duffy]

John, straight from our first trip, even, we heard voters say, I don't like his personality, but I'm okay with him because of all the other things. And that was something we kept hearing over and over again. But what was interesting was when it got to the Hispanic community and to black voters and how do you square that with how that vote came out for him?

[John King]

People were voting their pocketbooks. It has nothing to do with the color of their skin. His inroads were among working class people. He grew among his traditional white working class base that he had in 2016 and expanded in 2020. A lot of people thought, you can't expand that anymore. Well, he did look at the map. In predominantly white, rural and small town America, Donald Trump got more higher percentages. And whether you're white or black or Latino, if you make 50, 60, $70,000 a year and you have a family, things are tough. Things have been tough. Again, you came out of COVID and then you got hit with a two by four cost of living increases. And so you want something different. Donald Trump to them is something they can block out that part of him they think they can. They've just dealt with chaos and they've dealt with stress and strain. And so now they get the Trump version of that. Okay, what's more important, punishing Donald Trump for something that happened a few years ago or taking a chance that the economy's gonna get better again? And I get to go back to pre Covid America where I was doing better then than I am now. It's a pretty basic proposition.

[Claire Duffy]

John, what has this project and these voters and interviewing them taught you most.

[John King]

Of all to listen 24, 7, 365, even in the odd numbered years. Don't just do this in election cycles. I think that we had a very early sense of what was going on in the country. The people are way out ahead of this town, the people are way out ahead of the politicians. And so keep in touch with them, understand when their lives are getting better, getting worse, or, you know, kind of the same. I always say that we're in the curiosity business and to get paid to learn as a gift. It was such a gift, breathtaking gift to do it this way, to see the country, to see it struggles, to meet these remarkable people who, some of whom are profoundly struggling and have giant questions, crossroads questions about the future of the country and the future of the community and the future of their family. At this point in my career, I want to listen to people, I want to listen to voters. I wanted to experience it through them, not through sitting at a table in the back of a room trying to poke my head around the press riser to get a look at the candidate.

[Claire Duffy]

It gives a whole picture like that's kind of how I felt I covered three presidents and getting to do this, I felt like I actually saw the impact of everything you just described. All of the policy, all of the talking, all of the rallies. How does it reach actual human beings?

[John King]

There's nothing like being there and listening. I said this in one of the first episodes. You know, I think it was just to get me to shut up. But my mother told me at a very young age, you only learn when you're listening.

[Claire Duffy]

I'm sure she was, but that's also true.

[John King]

Well, she was trying to get me to shut up, but I took it to heart anyway.

[Claire Duffy]

We met 86 people with such different opinions about everything and such different lifestyles and backgrounds, and you name it, but not one person is not a good person. I mean, I don't mean for that to sound like an unusual thing. My point by saying that there were all such great humans and they all cared about America and that was the bottom line. They, not one of them didn't care about America. And I wish that as a country, we could take that as a person, I will take that with us from this project.

[John King]

This podcast version of all over the Map is a CNN Audio production. Our show producers are Grace Walker, Jesse Ramidios and Ally Molloy. Our editor is Graylin Brashear, and our senior producers are Dan Bloom and Haley Thomas. Dan Dezulla is our technical director and Steve Lichti as executive producer of CNN Audio. Support from Nikki Robertson, Jacqueline Kahlil, Alex Manassari, Robert Mathers, John Dianora, Laney Steinhart, Jamis Andress, Nicole Pessarou, and Lisa Namaro. Special thanks to Wendy Brundage and Katie Hinman. I'm John King. Thanks for listening.

[Claire Duffy]

I'm CNN tech reporter Claire Duffy. This week on the podcast Terms of Service, when you're texting with someone, it can feel like it's just you, your screen, and the person on the other end. But it's not always that simple. There are scenarios where third parties might be able to access your messages, whether it's your employer or law enforcement. So how can you make sure your private conversations actually remain private? To answer this question, I have Rhianna Pfefferkorn here with me. Rhianna is a policy fellow at the Stanford Institute for Human Centered Artificial Intelligence. My hope is that as the use of end to end encryption has become.

[Joan Lunden]

More and more normalized, that we all.

[Claire Duffy]

Understand better that privacy is a fundamental human right. Listen to CNN's terms of service with me, Claire Duffy. Wherever you get your podcasts.