The AI Podcast

Episode: Elon Musk Seeks $134B from OpenAI and Microsoft

Host: Jaden Schaefer
Date: January 19, 2026

Overview

In this episode, Jaden Schaefer delves into Elon Musk’s landmark lawsuit against OpenAI and Microsoft, where Musk is seeking between $79 billion and $134 billion in damages. The episode explores the origins of the dispute, the justifications behind Musk’s claims, and the wider industry implications. Jaden unpacks newly unsealed internal documents, diary entries, emails, and text messages that reveal candid conversations among OpenAI’s founders and stakeholders.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Background of the Lawsuit

• Musk’s Claims: Elon Musk is suing OpenAI and Microsoft for what he called "wrongful gains," alleging they profited from his early investments and contributions, despite OpenAI's original nonprofit mission.

• Amount Sought: The lawsuit seeks between $79B–$134B.

  • "[Musk] just filed the lawsuit which is seeking between 79 billion and 134 billion dollars in damages. This is an astronomical amount of money from OpenAI, but also Microsoft." — Jaden Schaefer [03:46]

• Microsoft’s Involvement: Musk argues that Microsoft’s investment and influence accelerated the profit-driven shift at OpenAI.

• Details of Musk’s Early Role: Musk claims:

  • He donated about $38M (≈60% of early funding).
  • He recruited key staff and provided technical, business, and reputational support.
  • "His financial and technical and reputation all contributed to OpenAI's early development." — Jaden Schaefer [04:43]

• Legal & Economic Valuation: The damages are based on calculations by economist C. Paul Wasan, estimating wrongful gains for both OpenAI ($65.5B–$109B) and Microsoft ($13.3B–$25.1B).

  • OpenAI and Microsoft contest the validity of Wasan’s assessment.
  • "Both of them have asked the court to just limit or exclude Wasan's testimony ... arguing that his valuation method is speculative and that it could mislead a jury." — Jaden Schaefer [06:28]

2. Revelations from Unsealed Documents

• Volume and Content: Over 100 internal documents, including emails, late-night texts, and diary entries, were made public as part of the court’s discovery process.

Internal Dynamics & Governance

• Greg Brockman's Diary:

  • Diary entries reveal Brockman's deep reflections on leadership, OpenAI’s future, and his ambivalent stance on breaking away from Musk.
    • Quote: "Some chance that rejecting Elon will actually lose us Sam. We'll find out tomorrow if doing an override all the way through is palatable. This is the only chance we have to get out from Elon. Is he the glorious leader that I would pick?" — Greg Brockman's diary, read by Jaden [10:51]
  • He also wrote about balancing mission versus financial incentives.
    • "His primary motivation was on the mission and the financial reward was a secondary consideration. And then we have a bunch of these things he wrote in his journal, which is kind of crazy." — Jaden Schaefer [10:23]

• Funding Sources and Partnerships:

  • Musk strongly advocated for Microsoft over Amazon as a partner for OpenAI.

    • Quote: "I think Jeff is a bit of a tool and Satya is not. So I slightly prefer Microsoft, but I hate their marketing department." — Elon Musk (email), quoted by Jaden [12:08]

  • OpenAI’s eventual deal with Microsoft in July 2019 was foreshadowed in these discussions.

Personal Communications

• Satya Nadella’s Perspective:

  • Testimony and notes from the Microsoft CEO reveal respect for Musk’s approach and document the nuances of the Microsoft-OpenAI relationship.
  • Unpublished snippets from Nadella’s co-authored book, “An Inflection Point: Mission Transformation and the Dawn of the Next Generation of AI,” were included as evidence.
    • "This unpublished book was like all part of the discovery, which was also pretty crazy." — Jaden Schaefer [11:49]

• Hardware Access:

  • Musk’s emails to Jensen Huang (Nvidia CEO) show him facilitating early hardware access for OpenAI.
    • Musk: “Can OpenAI buy one of the early units? The team is asking me.”
    • Huang: “I’ve not forgotten. I’ll make sure OpenAI gets one of the first ones.” [12:04]

3. Industry and Interpersonal Drama

• Musk’s Internal Warnings:

  • Elon repeatedly warned OpenAI leadership that Google could surpass them if they stagnated.

• Relationship Tensions:

  • Greg Brockman’s diary shows open anxieties about what would happen if OpenAI cut ties with Musk.

  • Jaden contextualizes Musk’s 2018 OpenAI board departure as a mix of real conflict-of-interest concerns (with Tesla) and personal tensions among co-founders.

  • "I think, like, there's also a lot of beef and kind of fighting that he was having with the leadership team at the time. I think probably that was maybe a good excuse." — Jaden Schaefer [08:59]

• Notable Text Exchange:

  • Sam Altman to Elon Musk:
    • “I remember seeing you in a TV interview a long time ago, maybe 60 Minutes,... Well, you’re my hero and that’s what it feels like when you attack OpenAI.”
      — Altman, February 2023 [13:06]
  • Elon Musk's Reply:
    • “I hear you and it is certainly not my intention to be hurtful, for which I apologize, but the fate of civilization is at stake.”
      — Musk, February 2023 [13:18]

4. Case Progress & Broader Implications

• Current Status:

  • A federal judge ruled that Musk’s claims are plausible enough for a jury trial, set for spring 2026 (unless settled).

  • Both OpenAI and Microsoft have stated they will vigorously contest the claims.

  • "It's going to be interesting to see... if Elon Musk is able to get $134 billion from OpenAI, Microsoft, or if this is kind of a big show." — Jaden Schaefer [13:47]

• Industry Impacts:

  • The case exposes the fragile alliances, personal drama, and high-stakes capital at play in the cutting-edge world of AI.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "There's a lot of juicy stuff that just came out in this story and I think a lot of implications for the AI industry overall." — Jaden Schaefer [01:05]
• Elon Musk on partners: "I think Jeff is a bit of a tool and Satya is not. So I slightly prefer Microsoft, but I hate their marketing department." [12:08]
• Sam Altman to Musk: "You’re my hero and that’s what it feels like when you attack OpenAI." [13:06]
• Musk’s reply: "...it is certainly not my intention to be hurtful, for which I apologize, but the fate of civilization is at stake." [13:18]
• On Musk’s departure: "OpenAI then transitioned into a hybrid structure that included a for profit subsidiary. Elon Musk has since of course founded xai, which is a competing artificial intelligence company." — Jaden Schaefer [09:22]

Important Timestamps

• [03:46] Legal claim overview: Musk seeks $79B–$134B
• [04:43] Musk’s early role and contributions to OpenAI
• [06:28] Court contestations: OpenAI, Microsoft, and valuation disputes
• [09:22] Musk's board exit; OpenAI's for-profit transition; rise of xAI
• [10:23] Revelations from Greg Brockman’s diary
• [10:51] Brockman weighs breaking with Musk
• [11:49] Satya Nadella’s unpublished book and testimony
• [12:04] Musk–Huang (Nvidia) email exchange
• [12:08] Musk’s colorful take on Amazon vs. Microsoft
• [13:06] Sam Altman’s heartfelt text to Elon Musk
• [13:18] Musk’s philosophical response
• [13:47] Future of the lawsuit: Jury trial and possible implications

Tone and Language

Jaden brings an accessible yet incisive tone, mixing factual reporting with light, sometimes wry commentary—especially when highlighting the “drama” and colorful personalities in play.

Summary

This episode offers a rare look into the tangled web of personal ambitions, strategic decisions, and massive financial stakes underpinning the AI revolution. Through legal filings and unsealed behind-the-scenes communication, listeners get an insider’s view of how the world’s most prominent AI researchers, entrepreneurs, and investors navigated—and sometimes clashed over—the future of artificial intelligence.

The trial’s outcome could set precedents for how intellectual contributions and early vision are valued in the age of AI, with major ramifications for tech partnerships, startup governance, and the commercialization of advanced technologies.

This summary omits advertisements and non-content sections, focusing purely on the substantive discussion and revelations from the episode.