Podcast Summary: The Air Show

Episode: What's Wrong with American Airlines – Part 2/x

Date: September 26, 2025
Hosts: Jon Ostrower, Brett Snyder, Brian Sumers

Overview

In the second installment of their series examining American Airlines, Jon Ostrower, Brett Snyder, and Brian Sumers dive into the airline’s persistent struggles—and recent improvements—in the realms of brand and product. Moving beyond the fleet and network topics of episode one, the trio explore why American’s image, customer experience, and internal identity lag behind competitors like Delta and United, despite some positive momentum.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Brand vs. Product: Distinct But Intertwined

• Brand is Intangible:

  • Jon: "You really can't find the type of intangible you're looking for in an Excel spreadsheet. That's what brand is. It is the thing you kind of feel rather than can put a number to." [02:35]
  • Brett: Acknowledges the importance of brand, but wants tangible numbers and revenue impact, which is hard to measure compared to operational changes like fleet or network [01:57].

• Product Is the Experience:

  • Brian: Notes contemporaneous product improvements at American, but questions whether these changes convey a coherent brand identity that resonates with customers [03:17].

Notable Quote:

“Airline seat is kind of a commodity... So the question is, how do you get people to pay more money for your seat, which is still mostly the same as their seat. You invest in brand, you make people think your chair is better than their chair.”
– Brian Sumers [03:43]

2. The Power—and Limits—of Brand Campaigns

• American’s Highs and Lows:
  • Jon and Brett recall how American benefited from United’s "summer of hell" in 2000, gaining a lasting reputation in Chicago [05:16].
  • Jon reminiscences about American’s "Up in the Air" era with George Clooney as a brand high point, giving the airline a premium glow [04:09].
  • Brand mishaps: The “World’s Greatest Flyers” campaign backfired, being interpreted as scolding passengers rather than inspiring them [16:42].

Notable Quotes:

“It took a lot of heat for effectively telling people that if they would just be better, they too could be a great flyer and then the experience would be better… It was just a miscalculation by an ad team that didn’t think things through…”
– Brett Snyder [17:15]

3. Competitor Comparisons: Lessons from Delta and United

• Delta's Culture of Branding:

  • Brian praises Delta for a meticulous and expensive approach to branding—advertising with Viola Davis, culturally diverse ads, premium seat details, elaborately branded bulkheads, and a design agency tasked with positioning Delta as a "cultural pioneer" [09:15].
  • Jon, amused and skeptical: "That is cringe, actually, as the kids say. I mean, look, that is a double mega stuff of marketing." [10:55]

• Consistency and Authenticity:

  • Delta and United are credited for cohesive branding strategies and continuous, if incremental, investment in premium experiences—at all levels, not just business class [18:16], [26:59].
  • American’s branding is described as “disjointed,” with sporadic investments and lack of a unified identity.

4. American’s Centennial Campaign: "Forever Forward"

• Backwards-Looking, Not Forward:
  • Brett critiques the campaign: “The campaign so far has been entirely backwards... The messaging here is pretty much looking one way so far and that’s not going to help the brand.” [15:31]
  • The centennial video relies heavily on nostalgia, referencing "firsts" from decades past but unable to name any meaningful modern innovations or positive industry-shaping moves in the 21st century [14:38].

Memorable Exchange:

Brian: "Does more room throughout coach not count?"
Jon: "First with bag fees?"
Brett: "First in bag fees. Oh God."
– [15:33]

5. Brand Lessons from Livery Changes and Product Upgrades

• Disjointed Decision-Making:

  • Post-merger, Doug Parker let employees choose the tail design, creating potential brand confusion—“From a branding and design part, it was insane... you need a cohesive look.” [18:31]
  • JetBlue’s recent livery update to a struggling airline is cited as a cautionary tale: “You don't just get to change the livery, you gotta change everything.” [20:25]

• Positive Direction:

  • American is reversing some penny-pinching practices: restoring headphones on international flights, investing in new lounges, upgrading coffee, introducing premium-heavy aircraft, new amenity kits, and even better champagne [21:47].
  • However, these changes are often not part of a well-coordinated strategy, resulting in missed opportunities to move the revenue and reputation needle compared to United’s more holistic premium service approach [24:38].

Notable Quote:

“You can't just change the brand, you can't just advertise. You have to change the airline with it or people won’t buy what you’re selling.”
– Brian Sumers [20:25]

6. Operational Challenges and the Internal Brand

• Operational Reliability as Table Stakes:
  • Having a branded, premium product is moot if the operation isn’t reliable: “Nothing will wreck your brand quicker than not getting someone to their destination…” – Jon Ostrower [23:27]
  • Summer operational troubles highlight issues with exhausted frontline employees and the difficulty of presenting a premium brand when basics falter [27:27].

Notable Quote:

"The frontline employees are exhausted... that's your brand in action."
– Jon Ostrower [27:27]

• Leadership Void:
  • Unlike Delta and United, who had “caretaker CEOs” like Jerry Grinstein and Oscar Munoz to heal internal rifts and rejuvenate culture, American hasn’t yet found a leader to foster an internal brand renaissance [29:52].

7. Listener Feedback and Final Takeaway

• Customer Disconnect:
  • Jon reads feedback from a top-tier frequent flyer who, after achieving Executive Platinum, received a generic, impersonal email from American—no real gratitude for loyalty, exposing a tone-deaf approach to customer appreciation [30:09].

Notable Quote:

"What was missing? It was a simple thank you for flying with us… Tone deaf is how they described it. That’s the brand. This airline can be great, but they have to start listening."
– Jon Ostrower [30:09]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:57] – Brand vs Product discussion kick-off
• [04:09] – Reflection on “Up in the Air” and American’s past brand highs
• [09:15] – How Delta approaches branding differently
• [14:38] – Critique of American’s “Forever Forward” centennial campaign
• [18:31] – Branding errors post-merger and lessons from livery changes
• [21:47] – Recent product improvements at American
• [23:27] – The link between operational reliability and brand trust
• [27:27] – The impact of frontline employee exhaustion on brand
• [30:09] – Listener feedback highlights customer care shortfall

Tone, Style & Memorable Moments

• Tone: Witty, sometimes irreverent, but always insightful; hosts routinely challenge each other but share mutual respect for the complexities of airline management.
• Memorable Banter:
  • On campaign taglines: “Forever Forward... Maybe that would have been a better tagline for this actually, because... the campaign so far has been entirely backwards...” [14:49]
  • On branding lags: “I just go back to the word disjointed again... it's doing some specific projects in specific cases... it forgot to check half the boxes.” – Brett Snyder [26:26]

Conclusion

The hosts agree: American Airlines’ incremental product improvements are welcome, but until the brand finds focus internally and externally, and until operational reliability is restored, it risks permanent mediocrity. Future episodes will explore American’s leadership—look out for a discussion on what kind of CEO (maybe from Southwest?) could revive both the internal and external brand.

For listeners: If you care about airline strategy, branding, and culture, this episode delivers sharp insights and a healthy dose of industry humor. The next episode promises an equally frank dive into American’s leadership and culture—don't miss it!