The Al Franken Podcast: BBC's The Global Story

Episode: “Nukes for Nothing: The Deal That Broke Ukraine's Trust”
Date: September 23, 2025

Episode Overview

Al Franken introduces an excerpt from the BBC’s podcast, The Global Story. This particular episode, hosted by Tristan Redman in London (with contributions from former NPR White House correspondent Asma Khalid in DC), explores Ukraine’s historical decision to surrender its nuclear arsenal in 1994, the security assurances it received in exchange, and the resonance of that decision during the ongoing conflict with Russia. The episode's core theme is Ukraine’s faded trust in Western guarantees, as highlighted by recent diplomatic conversations about "security guarantees" for Ukraine amid ongoing war.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introduction and Context (00:00–01:32)

• Al Franken discusses his admiration for the BBC and introduces The Global Story, summarizing its purpose:

  "The Global Story focuses on this intersection where the world and America meet."
  (A, 00:16)

• The episode excerpt is titled “Nukes for Nothing: the deal that broke Ukraine’s trust” and focuses on parallels between past and present as President Zelensky revisits themes of security in global meetings.

Security Guarantees—History’s Shadow (01:32–03:15)

• Tristan Redman emphasizes a recurring phrase in diplomatic circles about Ukraine: "security guarantees".
  • The need for reliable security guarantees is now at the forefront, as the west works to support Ukraine.
  • The question lingers:

    "If Russia attacks again, who will actually show up to help Ukraine? It’s one of the biggest things standing in the way of peace right now."
    (B/Tristan Redman, 02:12)

• Zelensky himself directly references past Western promises standing next to the French President:
  • "We don’t want a repeat of the Budapest Memorandum.” (02:23)

The Nuclear Arsenal Nobody Wanted (03:15–04:59)

• Retrospective: In the 1990s, after the USSR collapsed, Ukraine suddenly possessed the world’s third-largest nuclear arsenal.
• Andrew Harding (BBC correspondent), joining from his experience in 1990s Russia, describes the profound economic and social collapse during that period:

  “Everything else was collapsing—the ruble, the currency was collapsing, the economy, everybody’s sense of what a state was, what capitalism was, everything was in utter chaos.”
  (C/Andrew Harding, 03:45)

  • Vivid depiction of everyday life: pensioners selling heirlooms in the snow, nuclear physicists working as taxi drivers to earn hard currency.
  • Reminder that the West was slow to grasp the scale of the crisis outside Moscow, especially as it related to nuclear weapons in Ukraine.

Ukraine’s Even Deeper Collapse (05:01–05:42)

• Andrew Harding compares Russia’s turmoil to Ukraine’s, noting Ukraine fared even worse economically:

  “Ukraine’s economic collapse was far more spectacular. Their GDP, their economic output was halved in the early 90s. That’s far more than the Great Depression.”
  (C, 05:13)

  • Collapse of Soviet-era heavy industry, massive demographic shifts, widespread hardship.
  • Emigration surges as people seek survival.

Nuclear Risk and Western Reaction (05:42–End)

• The global community, especially Western powers, suddenly realizes Ukraine has “overnight” become the world’s third largest nuclear power:

  “Suddenly they wake up to the fact… that there’s this massive country, Ukraine, that overnight is the world’s third largest nuclear power, and, wow, what are we gonna do about that?”
  (C, 05:55)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Zelensky on security guarantees:

  “We don’t want a repeat of the Budapest Memorandum.”
  (Referenced by Tristan Redman, 02:23)

• Andrew Harding on post-Soviet chaos:

  “Everything was in utter chaos… Everybody had become a taxi driver overnight. Anyone with a car was out there… you’d get a ride in some nuclear physicist’s car because he was trying to earn a buck, literally a buck.”
  (03:45–04:40)

• On Ukraine’s economic collapse:

  “Ukraine’s economic collapse was far more spectacular… Their GDP, their economic output was halved in the early 90s. That’s far more than the Great Depression.”
  (C, 05:13)

Timestamps: Major Segments

• 00:00–01:32: Al Franken intro and show background
• 01:32–03:15: Security guarantees and present-day context
• 03:15–04:59: Soviet collapse, nuclear inheritance, Russian crisis
• 05:01–05:42: Hardships in Ukraine in the 1990s
• 05:42–end: Awakening to Ukraine's nuclear potential

Tone and Style

Throughout the excerpt, the tone is both analytical and evocative, blending historical context with on-the-ground observations. The hosts and correspondents maintain a factual but empathetic style, using vivid anecdotal evidence and direct quotes from world leaders to make historical parallels relevant to current geopolitics.

Summary

This episode excerpt from The Global Story immerses listeners in the roots of Ukraine’s mistrust toward Western security assurances. By revisiting the 1990s’ post-Soviet chaos and the historic nuclear deal (the Budapest Memorandum), the hosts show how echoes from the past shape diplomatic struggles today—particularly the urgent question: What do “security guarantees” really mean for Ukraine? Not just history, but a pressing question for the present.