David Hogg on Electing Young Progressive Dems

Summary

The Al Franken Podcast: David Hogg on Electing Young Progressive Dems

Episode Date: October 12, 2025

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Overview:

Al Franken welcomes David Hogg, prominent activist and co-founder of March for Our Lives, to discuss the progress in gun violence prevention, the evolution of youth-led political activism, his PAC ("Leaders We Deserve"), and strategies to elect young, progressive Democrats—sometimes against entrenched party incumbents. The episode explores the challenges of energizing young voters, Democratic Party dynamics, anti-corruption efforts, and key electoral strategies going into the 2026 midterms.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. David Hogg’s Origins: March for Our Lives

• Background: Survived the 2018 Parkland, FL shooting; helped organize massive protests demanding gun reform.
  • "At the time, I think it was either the second or third largest protest in American history... 800,000 in D.C. and 800 marches around the world, on every continent, except the one with penguins." (David Hogg, 05:44)
• Organization's Focus:
  • Professionalized over time; supports survivors and rapid response after shootings.
  • Impact: Passage of red flag laws in Florida, helping save lives.
  • "We professionalized the organization, hired full time staff and stuff. And, some of those students have now come back..." (07:00)
  • "That law has since been used over 20,000 times since the shooting in Parkland, predominantly by Republican sheriffs." (13:09)

2. Legislative Progress on Gun Reform

• Post-Uvalde Legislation:
  • The Safer Communities Act led to the two largest single-year reductions in gun homicides in U.S. history.
  • Quote: "We've had about a 25% reduction in gun homicides around the country since Uvalde, which is great. It's obviously nowhere near enough though." (David Hogg, 10:26)
• Massachusetts Model:
  • Hogg suggests federalizing MA's gun laws due to its remarkably low gun death rate.
  • "I think that we should do the same thing with Massachusetts state gun laws... they have a gun death rate 70% lower than the national average." (11:12)

3. Launching "Leaders We Deserve" PAC

• Inspiration & Structure:
  • Created after helping Maxwell Frost win his Congressional seat.
  • Intention: Support young progressives, invest significant resources (hundreds of thousands to over a million per campaign), and not just symbolic support.
  • "What we wanted to do was find the best of the best of our generation and get them elected by spending several hundred thousand dollars to a million plus dollars on their races..." (19:01)
• Challenging Incumbents:
  • Willing to primary Democrats in deep blue (safe) districts if they are "asleep at the wheel" or corrupt, but avoids swing/purple districts to protect the chance of holding or gaining seats.
  • "We only challenge incumbents who are in blue areas... Seats that went to Kamala Harris by roughly 9% or more that are almost certainly going to remain Democratic." (24:47)
  • "We're also working... to defeat Republicans... supporting young people running in competitive seats..." (26:06)

4. Conflict with the DNC and Role of Party Structures

• Vice Chair Controversy:
  • Hogg elected DNC vice-chair but pressured to resign due to PAC activities.
  • Precedent existed with others (Duckworth, Whitmer) running PACs while serving as vice-chairs.
  • "I was given the choice of... this voluntary, unpaid position that is largely ceremonial... or keep your job at Leaders We Deserve." (23:42)
  • Chose PAC to focus on actual change and recruiting new voices into the party.
• On Party Messaging and Renewal:
  • Need to show voters that Democrats deliver, not just that Republicans are worse.
  • "We are good at our jobs and we hold ourselves to a higher standard than they do." (24:16)

5. 2026 Midterm Strategy and Democratic Messaging

• Redistricting:
  • Both parties gain districts; hopes for a detente.
• Democratic Party Weaknesses:
  • "What I worry about is a situation where we gain back the House and we don't really show how we're using that power to hold Republicans accountable." (30:24)
• Policy Priorities:
  • Emphasize anti-corruption (stock trading ban, campaign finance reform).
  • Focus on specifics, not abstractions.
  • "The American people want specifics... What is your plan to lower those costs?" (33:26)
  • Lean on healthcare as the top issue where Democrats hold an advantage.
  • "The only thing... in the top five... that we are trusted as a party most on was healthcare." (42:13)

6. Energizing Young Voters and the Messaging Challenge

• Problems:
  • Young people feel abandoned—"10ft underwater" and not interested in incremental change.
  • Disconnection on issues like student debt—those with under 30 weren't helped by forgiveness aimed at older borrowers.
  • "What young people feel like right now is that they are effectively 10ft underwater, and they're hearing from Democrats...what if you were nine feet underwater? And then Republicans want to put you at 11ft underwater. And it's like, I don't want to be underwater at all." (34:14)
• Model Example: Zoran’s NYC campaign
  • Massive turnout among young people, clear communication of direct benefits, specifics (e.g., free buses, childcare).
  • Hogg's PAC was a major financial backer: "We were his largest financial supporter...$300,000..." (36:29)
  • "We need to decide: do we want young sycophants or do we actually want young people?" (36:53)

7. Using New Media, Listening, and Expanding the Electorate

• Campaign Tools:
  • Harnessing TikTok/social media.
  • Expanding the electorate, especially among those young people who don’t usually vote in Democratic primaries.
  • "A good message... you don't need to pay to advertise it because people will naturally want to advertise it for you." (39:46)
• Formula for Purple Areas:
  • Prioritize listening, ask constituents what they want, and deliver a clear, actionable platform.

8. On Running Against Autocracy and Trumpism

• Hogg: Running against autocracy is essential, but most important is demonstrating government’s ability to deliver for people.
• Young people less mobilized now; Trump normalized among newer voters.
• "Rights are like a muscle. You have to practice them to make sure that you keep them and use them when they're under threat." (44:08)
• "We have to figure out how to get more younger candidates out there that represent young people and their values and show how we're fighting back." (46:06)

9. Immigration and Social Justice

• Immigration System:
  • Critique: Current system incentivizes exploitation and privatized detention.
  • Hogg underscores need for reform that is both humane and functional.
  • "Our immigration system... is working the exact way that it ended up being incentivized and designed to, where if you can take a group of people, millions...in constant fear of deportation, you can pay them extremely low wages..." (46:54)
  • Shared sympathy: Most Americans personally know someone undocumented (48:18).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On youth-led change in gun policy:

  "If our government doesn't change its gun laws, we'll just change who's in government by taking those young people who've survived school shootings, who've survived instances of gun violence, and bring them into power."
  — David Hogg (08:41)

• On Democratic underperformance post-Sandy Hook:

  "I was in the Senate after Sandy Hook and we got nothing, absolutely nothing out of that... We had even Democrats voting against... trying to ban semi-automatic weapons and that didn't happen."
  — Al Franken (09:02)

• On the need for clear messaging:

  "What the American people want is specifics. What is your plan to lower those costs?"
  — David Hogg (33:26)

• On energizing young voters:

  "What young people feel like right now is that they are effectively 10ft underwater, and they're hearing from Democrats... what if you were nine feet underwater? And then what they're hearing is like... Republicans want to put you at 11ft underwater. And it's like, I don't want to be underwater at all. I want to be at the surface."
  — David Hogg (34:14)

• On party renewal:

  "Do we want young sycophants or do we actually want young people?"
  — David Hogg (36:53)

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Key Timestamps

• March for Our Lives history & organizational growth: 05:28 – 08:36
• Florida red flag law & legislative wins: 12:04 – 13:38
• Formation and mission of Leaders We Deserve: 15:45 – 21:00
• DNC vice chair controversy: 21:22 – 24:02
• Challenging party incumbents; how targets are chosen: 24:26 – 26:06
• 2026 midterm outlook & strategy: 29:19 – 33:09
• Young voter disillusionment & messaging gaps: 33:12 – 37:38
• Social media strategy & campaign innovation: 39:41 – 40:52
• Healthcare as core issue for Democrats: 41:26 – 42:33
• Countering autocratic trends: 44:02 – 46:06
• Immigration system critique: 46:47 – 49:08

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Final Thoughts

This episode paints a portrait of a new generation of progressive organizers seeking systemic change within and against the Democratic Party itself. David Hogg highlights the shortcomings and opportunities in Democratic messaging and organization, especially regarding young voters. The explicit strategy of challenging "asleep at the wheel" incumbents only in safe blue seats, the emphasis on real anti-corruption and healthcare policies, and the insistence on candidate authenticity and constituent listening are central takeaways. Hogg's remarks and the Zoran NYC example illustrate that when young people are respected, listened to, and offered clarity and action—not just platitudes—they show up and can change outcomes.

For listeners curious about youth activism, Democratic Party direction, and the urgent issues for 2026, this episode offers practical insight, candor, and a surgically clear call for generational renewal.

For more on Hogg’s work: leaderswedeserve.com

Transcript

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[Al Franken]

Hey everybody, we got a great one today. You know, for a change, David Hogg is with us. You probably remember David from the March for Our Lives, which he helped organize after the horrific school shooting that he survived at Marjorie Stoneman Douglas High school in Parkland, Florida. Back in 2018, over 800,000 people gathered in Washington to demand action on gun violence. And there are demonstrations all over the world. And March for Our Lives continues its work. It passed red flag law in Florida, which has saved lives and continues to do so. And David has become a formidable political force, forming a political action committee. Leaders we deserve working to elect young progressive Democrats and at times challenging Democratic incumbents who are, as he puts it, asleep at the wheel, meaning challenging older Democrats who are just staying in office to have a job. We'll talk about that and what Democrats can do to flip the Congress during a week where a lot of crazy shit is is happening. The the Comey trial started with an absolutely pathetic performance by the prosecution, which presented a page and a half case against the former US Attorney General. My prediction is that the judge will throw this one out before it goes to trial. And New York Attorney General Letitia James was just indicted on one count of bank fraud. Oh, and Trump wants to prosecute Adam Schiff, who was the lead impeachment manager in Trump's first impeachment trial, and Jack Smith, who led the prosecutions against Trump. As he told his supporters before the election, I am your retribution. And Trump wants to jail Illinois Governor J.B. pritzker and Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson for defying Trump's National Guard deployment, which Attorney General Pam Bondi will no doubt facilitate. Bondi appeared before the Senate Judiciary Committee last week and refused to answer questions from Democratic senators, including one of many from Sheldon Whitehouse, who said, quote, there is a witness who said Jeffrey Epstein showed people pictures of Trump holding pictures of half naked young women. Could the AG confirm that? And she didn't answer. Trump continues to order the bombing of Venezuelan speedboats, killing at least 21 crew members who may or may not be smuggling drugs. The US has offered no proof, and it appears that Hamas and Israel have a tentative peace deal which will lead to the release of the living Israeli hostages. Well, that is good news. Let's hope this all works out. Will Trump get the Nobel Peace Prize that he's been lobbying for? Oh, why not? Henry Kissinger won the Nobel Prize and Mahatma Gandhi did not.

[Al Franken (Ad Segment)]

Well, David Hogg joins us today.

[Al Franken]

It's a great one, you know, for a change. I'm very pleased to welcome David Hogg to the podcast. Thank you for joining me, David.

[David Hogg]

Of course.

Thanks for having me, Al.

[Al Franken]

I wanted to start by discussing your background. In March for Our Lives, you survived, of course, the horrific shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland that was back in 2018, killing 17 people and injuring 18 others. And that's what got you into the world of activism. You and some of your classmates launched March for Our Lives, right?

[David Hogg]

Yep.

[Al Franken]

How many people showed up in Washington for that and how many around the country?

[David Hogg]

I think the count that we ended up having was close to 800,000 in Washington, D.C. my God, at the time, I think it was either the second.

Or third largest protest in American history that ever happened.

Just, I think, was after the Women's March, which was the first biggest at the time. And we had 800 marches around the.

World, on every continent, except the one with penguins.

And we, we had people marching outside of US Embassies. We had people marching in tons of different countries around the world to demand.

Action on, on gun violence.

[Al Franken]

So all over the world?

[David Hogg]

Yeah, yeah. We had marches in Belgium, we had marches in Italy.

We had marches in, I think, Japan, maybe even just all over the place.

[Al Franken]

And is March for Our Lives still an organization? And, and what, what is it? What does it do now?

[David Hogg]

Yeah, I mean, a lot of the work that we do is directly with survivors. So we, as you can imagine, when you take a group of 25 young people and give them $20 million and say, like, okay, solve gun violence, and all of them are under the age.

Of 18, pretty much.

There's sometimes things get built a little.

Bit backwards and it's.

Some things are not built as sustainably.

As you want them to be.

So a lot of the, a lot of the students went on to college and some of that, as we did that, we professionalized the organization, hired full time staff and stuff.

And then some of those students have now come back, including one of my.

Co founders, Jackie Coren, who just graduated from Harvard and then went to Oxford and now is back as the executive.

Director of the organization. And the organization has historically punched way above its weight in terms of its funding. We typically run on about three and a half million dollars a year, which.

Isn'T nothing, but it's, it's a lot.

Less than most other major gun violence prevention organizations.

What we really specialize in is kind.

Of rapid response after there are instances of gun violence or school shootings and.

Helping support survivors in terms of working with young people from Uvalde, for example.

When we did our second March for.

Our Lives, which had about 100,000 people.

In Washington D.C. just two weeks after the Uvalde and Buffalo massacres, and we.

Went and marched around senators offices, the 10 senators offices that were Republicans that.

We knew we would need to get in order to get through the filibuster.

To apply as much pressure to them as possible.

[Al Franken]

After Uvalde, they finally got some legislation done.

[David Hogg]

They did. It wasn't nearly enough, but it has had a pretty remarkable impact we've seen in the two years after the passage of that law, the Safer Communities act that was passed after Uvalde, we saw the two largest one year reductions in.

Gun homicide in American history.

And to answer your question of what if March for Our Lives is still around?

Yes, we are, we're still doing the work.

And what we're doing now is figuring out what are the best needs that.

We can meet of the movement in terms of young people and younger survivors and how can we best support them in terms of training them up so.

That they know how to go and lobby, so that they know how to.

Go and talk to the media, so.

That they know how to go out there and eventually, you know, be prepared.

To do anything from running for office to running a campaign to doing anything else like that.

And that's part of the reason why.

I created my organization Leaders. We deserve to take a lot of the young people that marched with us, that have protested with us and bring them into office, with the idea being that if our government doesn't change its gun laws, we'll just change who's in government by taking those young people who've survived school shootings, who've survived instances of gun violence and been active participants in the gun safety movement and bring them into power.

[Al Franken]

Yeah, I remember after of all I was in the Senate after Sandy Hook and we got nothing, absolutely nothing out of that.

[David Hogg]

Why do you think that is, Al? Like, I, obviously, I was in middle school when that happened. But you were on the inside. Like, what are those conversations like?

[Al Franken]

Well, the conversations were unbelievable. I mean, to me we had some of the families come, you know, Republicans didn't show up. I couldn't believe it. I thought that certainly we would get some kind of, you know, registering guns and that kind of thing, the easiest stuff. And that just didn't happen. And we had even Democrats voting against, you know, we're trying to ban semi automatic weapons and that that didn't happen and it just didn't. But Volley finally got something done. But what, you know, what do you think realistically it will take to get something done in terms of, in terms of that and, and what should be done?

[David Hogg]

Well, I think that there's really two paths that could happen here, one of which is the kind of gradual approach where these things continue happening and there's.

A tiny bit of progress made, you know, every, every couple of years on.

It, where, you know, since Uvalde happened, even though it doesn't feel like it, we've had about a 25% reduction in.

Gun homicides around the country, which is great. It's obviously nowhere near enough though. And I think one of two things.

Is going to happen.

Either we're going to get to a place where after every one of these major shootings that happens at least every couple of years, members of Congress come.

Together in a bipartisan way and figure.

Out what they can agree on and.

Make progress on that and pass that.

Legislation, even if it's small, so that we're saving a couple hundred more lives each time, just annually after new legislation is passed.

[Al Franken]

What is the gold standard here is universal registration. What, what are you looking for?

[David Hogg]

What I look at is what we did with Obamacare where we didn't invent.

A brand new health care system. We looked at what Massachusetts did and basically federalized it from my understanding.

[Al Franken]

Right.

[David Hogg]

And I think that we should do the same thing with Massachusetts state gun laws. They have some of the strongest gun.

Laws in the country and they have a gun death rate 70% lower than the national average.

And that's not because they live in.

A state that is extremely rural, necessarily, where people just live super far from each other. Massachusetts is a pretty urban state, and.

Despite that, they have a gun death.

Rate 70% lower than the national average. That's nowhere near perfect.

But if we did that, there would.

Be a hell of a lot more progress than where we currently are right now. And the thing is, in Massachusetts, you.

Can still get a firearm, but it's.

Just a similar process of having a car. You got to have it registered.

You got to basically have a license for it.

You need to be trained with it. You need to store it safely.

And there's basic limitations on the size.

Of a magazine and the type of firearm that you can own.

[Al Franken]

Sure. So following your activism in March for Eliza, you moved into politics, and you did achieve some stuff in Florida, did you?

[David Hogg]

We did.

My classmates, myself, the parents, thousands of people showed up after the shooting in Parkland, and we managed to actually get something done, despite being in a Republican.

Trifecta state where we raised the age.

Divided on to 21 in our state.

Because the shooter at my high school.

He was not able to legally purchase a handgun because he was not 21 yet, but he was legally able to.

Purchase an AR15 at the age of 19 years old.

And what we did is we raised the age to buy gun in Florida. And then we also looked back at, you know, what happened before the shooting.

What warning signs there were. And what we saw was that the.

Police were called to his house. I think it was nearly a dozen.

Times after the shooting, if not more than that. He was reported to the FBI for.

Making threats to shoot up our high school.

Multiple times it was reported to local law enforcement.

There were so many different warning signs.

But we didn't have the legal infrastructure in place to remove his firearm.

So what we did is we passed a red flag law in Florida, right?

So that if somebody threatens to harm themselves or somebody else, they can have their guns taken away from them through a court order.

And that law has since been used.

Over 20,000 times since the shooting in Parkland, predominantly by Republican sheriffs.

And despite Ron DeSantis having an even.

Larger majority in the House and Senate in the Florida state legislature, even he.

Has not repealed these laws because they.

Are popular and they work, and law enforcement really like to use them.

So despite all the naysayers and what the pollsters and pundits and talking heads love to say about how, like, nothing's ever going to change, Republicans are never.

Going to vote for this. They'll never come in.

We did change that in Florida, we got them to change the gun laws.

And they haven't revealed it since and it saved lives.

[Al Franken]

We're going to take a quick break. We'll be right back with David.

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[Al Franken]

That we sent you. When did you form your political action committee leaders we deserve. Tell us about that.

[David Hogg]

I started that back in 2023 after I helped elect my friend Maxwell Frost.

[Al Franken]

To Congress who is a great congressman.

[David Hogg]

He's awesome.

[Al Franken]

I will say he's awesome.

[David Hogg]

So Maxwell I actually hired at March.

For Our Lives when I was a freshman in college.

And I got to know him through that process cause he led a lot of our organizing efforts to lobby state legislatures like the Virginia state legislature, to.

Change gun laws, to do protests, to register voters and all these other things.

Maxwell called me up two years later.

Said he wanted to run for Congress.

When he was 24. And I said, Maxwell, you know you have to be 25 to be running for Congress, right?

[Al Franken]

Right.

[David Hogg]

And he Was aware of that at the time. Yeah, thankfully.

[Al Franken]

Yeah.

[David Hogg]

And I'm like, I just wanted to check that you're actually going to be.

Old enough to be elected.

[Al Franken]

Right.

[David Hogg]

Maxwell was running in that race and he had the odds stacked against him. Like many young people, but especially in.

His case, he didn't go to a super fancy college.

He's adopted. His parents aren't extremely wealthy or anything like that.

And he had to Uber drive every night from 9pm to 2am while running for Congress.

And he was running against two former.

Members of Congress, one of whom had committed tax fraud while they were in Congress. The other was a hedge fund manager while they were in Congress, both of whom were Democrats, by the way.

The reason why Maxwell was the best.

Person in that race was not because of his age.

It was because of his experience. What I saw was somebody who had a decade of experience in the gun.

Safety movement, where he had been lobbying to change gun laws since he was 15 years old. After he saw Sandy Hook on the news and decided to get involved in the movement then.

Not because he was directly affected.

He was just a young person that was obviously scared in school.

[Al Franken]

So this is before the incident at your school?

[David Hogg]

Yeah, way before. So he had been working since he was 15 years old on that. And then he went on to work at the ACLU to hold Biden accountable.

On the Hyde Amendment as well and.

Helped to change his stance on that.

[Al Franken]

The Hyde Amendment is about abortion.

[David Hogg]

Yes. Yeah.

That President Biden had kind of not. Yeah, he had not had the best stance on. And Maxwell actually bird dogged him at an event, I think it was in.

South Carolina during the primary, saying, like, are you going to change your stance on this? And then he said yes. And it forced the campaign to, you know, say like, yes, Biden is not going to stand by this anymore.

[Al Franken]

So you can't spend federal money on abortions. That's what the Hyde Amendment. It still is.

[David Hogg]

Right, Exactly.

And in Maxwell's race, he had to raise millions of dollars to get elected. I helped him raise a couple hundred thousand dollars and I saw how hard.

It was between him having to Uber.

Drive to him having to couch surf while running for office because his grandma.

Was living with his parents at the time. And yet it was Covid, so he couldn't risk getting her sick as he campaigned.

After he was elected, I talked to his campaign manager and I said, this.

Is great, but we need way more.

People like Maxwell to get elected. And what we saw was there's so many groups that are like, oh, we, you know, that, you know the type of group, Al, where they're like, oh, you know, we support X, Y, Z.

Type of person running for office or whatever.

And then they'll cut you a check at best for like $1,000, or they'll max out to you for like 5,000 and you're thankful.

But it's like, what real difference is that really making in your race? And what we wanted to do was.

Find the best of the best of.

Our generation and get them elected by spending several hundred thousand dollars to a million plus dollars on their races for state legislatures and, and congressional elections so.

That we could build essentially like Emily's.

List, but for young Democrats running for state legislature and Congress who don't take corporate money and support gun safety.

[Al Franken]

So that's leaders we deserve.

[David Hogg]

And we started that in 2023, to be clear.

[Al Franken]

Right. And then it got complicated. In February, you were elected vice chair of the, of the dnc, of the Democratic National Committee. Of course, you'd been challenging the powers that be, but now you became part of the power structure. You were vice chair. A vice chair. Right. Of the dnc. Before we get into that, this really brought in some light, the inner workings of the DNC that many people don't always follow. What does a vice chair do? A vice chair.

[David Hogg]

So it's largely a ceremonial role, to be honest with you, although, um, I'm sure the other vice chairs would not say that, but that. That is really what it is. Your job is to kind of be a spokesperson for the party. It's to help raise as much money.

As possible for the dnc to help the Democratic Party infrastructure.

And what I mean by that is for people who may not understand this.

We have this thing called the voter.

File, obviously, that basically is the giant.

Data set of all the information about voters around the country that the Democratic Party collects to say, okay, we know that Al Franken lives at this address.

And he's voted Democratic this many times.

And has this propensity and all this other stuff.

[Al Franken]

Sure.

[David Hogg]

And that's part of what they maintain.

Along with, obviously, the primary calendar, along with the debate schedule, along with the party platform and managing the convention. That's. That's really it.

And I think the vice chair role is essentially kind of like being a spokesperson.

You're also. You show up at the regular meetings to the DNC to talk about what.

The party's doing, things about the platform.

Things about the primary schedule, everything like that.

But ultimately, it's. Even though it's an elected position, you're.

Really just serving at the. At the pleasure of the chair.

[Al Franken]

Okay. At the pleasure of the chair.

[David Hogg]

It never has really made sense to me why you would have an elected.

Position when basically you have to just do whatever the chair wants you to do.

[Al Franken]

Well, anyway, the shit hit the fan, right?

[David Hogg]

Yes, it did.

[Al Franken]

Yeah. Yeah. And basically Ken Martin, who was the chair, said that you couldn't have your organization and be a vice chair.

[David Hogg]

Yeah. And there's another important thing I need to add here, Al, which is that I think a lot of people hear vice chair, and they assume vice president kind of because they think that there's only one.

There are multiple vice chairs.

I was.

I think one of. I think there are five of them, technically.

On top of that, it is a volunteer position.

And to give you the long. Short of what happened with the DNC.

Is as I was running for this position to be a vice chair, I repeatedly told people that I run an organization that spends money in primaries, that.

Spends money in general elections as well, to help elect young Democrats.

So it's not like I became a.

Vice chair and then started Leaders We Deserve.

[Al Franken]

Right.

[David Hogg]

I had been running this organization for well over a year prior to my.

Run for vice chair, and I actively.

Talked about my job, that this is my job.

And essentially what happened is, as I.

Was running, I read the bylaws, and it said there was nothing in there that said that you couldn't be involved in primaries other than the presidential.

[Al Franken]

So basically, your organization is running in primaries against incumbent Democrats who've been asleep.

[David Hogg]

At the wheel or are just corrupt as hell and are really failing to meet the moment.

And I'll get into that in a second, Al.

[Al Franken]

Okay, sure.

[David Hogg]

The bottom line that I'm getting at.

Is when you run for a position.

Like this, you read the bylaws to.

Understand the rules, and I read the.

Bylaws, and what I was doing was.

Not against the rules.

Then I looked at the precedent of.

Who'D been a vice chair before. I saw people like Tammy Duckworth and Gretchen Whitmer had been vice chairs, both of whom have PACs, both of which give and spend money in primaries.

So I thought what I was doing.

Is fine, because that is effectively what we're doing here at Leaders We Deserve.

However, Chair Martin had a different vision.

For the dnc, which is that officers should not be involved in any primaries whatsoever at all.

And that obviously was in contention with my literal job.

[Al Franken]

Now, had they. Had Tammy or the others had been involved in primaries challenging incumbents. Is that the distinction that Martin made or not.

[David Hogg]

The.

The distinction that he made is he didn't care if they had been involved.

In them or not. The fact of the matter is he.

Didn'T think that anybody should be doing.

That going forward, even though the DNC doesn't really have a role in primaries other than other than the presidential, because he believed that the DNC needs to be completely neutral with its officers in every way.

Ultimately, I was put in a position where I was given the choice of.

You can either stay in this voluntary.

Unpaid position that is largely ceremonial as.

A vice chair of the dnc, or.

You can leave and keep your job at Leaders.

We deserve and continue doing that work.

And ultimately, I'm going to have to stick by my principles and what I think needs to be done to help win back young people in our party.

Which is to bring in some fresh blood and change some of our messengers in the party and show how that.

How we are holding ourselves to a higher standard, not just by saying, oh.

The reason you should vote for us is because of how terrible Republicans are.

But because we are good at our jobs and we hold ourselves to a.

Higher standard than they do. If that makes sense.

[Al Franken]

It makes a lot of sense. You challenge incumbents who you feel aren't doing the job.

[David Hogg]

I'll get into that, too. Alan?

Yeah.

[Al Franken]

How do you pick which fights? I mean, for example, in purple areas.

[David Hogg]

Where we are not playing, we don't want to lose the House because we.

Challenged somebody in a primary.

[Al Franken]

Right.

[David Hogg]

We're trying to be very selective about this.

So.

[Al Franken]

So you only challenge incumbents who are in blue areas.

[David Hogg]

Safe seats.

[Al Franken]

Yes, safe seats.

[David Hogg]

So what we define that as is, you know, seats that. Seats that went to Kamala Harris by.

Roughly 9% or more that are almost certainly going to remain Democratic.

A good example of that is in.

Michigan's 13th congressional district, where there's a Democrat representing that seat right now named.

Shri Thanadar, who has been so bad.

For example, at constituent services, that he.

Has other Democratic members of Congress calling.

Him out, posting online, saying, you need.

To get your act together because your.

Constituents are calling me and asking me to help them because your constituent services are so bad. How.

[Al Franken]

How long has he been there?

[David Hogg]

I think it's. I think it's like two or three terms at this point.

[Al Franken]

And. Okay. And is he the first one that you've gone after this. This cycle?

[David Hogg]

So we made our second announcement yesterday.

We just endorsed Justin Pierson, who's running for Congress as well, against Steve Cohen.

And personally, I don't have really anything against Steve Cohen. I think the biggest thing that I look at in that race is that.

Justin Pearson is a generational leader. And I think that we need some fresh blood in our party right now.

[Al Franken]

And what state. Where is this? What district is this?

[David Hogg]

That's in Tennessee, in Memphis.

[Al Franken]

Right. And that's a very blue area, right?

[David Hogg]

Yeah.

All the seats where we're challenging people.

Out are safe congressional seats that do not risk us losing the House at all.

And then we're also working, obviously, to.

Defeat Republicans because we're not just challenging Democratic incumbents. We also are working in open blue seats where the Democratic incumbent is retiring and supporting young people running in competitive seats. Like, for example, in California's 22nd congressional district, we just endorsed Randy Villegas, who's a community organizer and college professor that grew up in the district. It's one of the districts that relies most on Medicare and Medicaid and snap. SNAP benefits that are under attack by the Trump administration.

And it's a seat that we have.

To take back from Republicans.

[Al Franken]

Where is this in California?

[David Hogg]

It's like Bakersfield.

[Al Franken]

That was a very close race last time, right?

[David Hogg]

Exactly.

[Al Franken]

That's an opportunity for a pickup.

[David Hogg]

Yeah.

[Al Franken]

And that's a lot of what you do, right?

[David Hogg]

Absolutely.

[Al Franken]

And we are going to take a quick break. We'll be right back with David Hahn. Hey, everybody, I'd like to get an.

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[Al Franken (Ad Segment)]

And how long has Nelly been eating Ollie?

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I imagine that happens a lot.

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[Al Franken (Ad Segment)]

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[Al Franken]

What are the meals like?

[Peter Ogburn]

So what you do is when you sign up for Ollie, you give them some information about your dog. You can give them a photo, but you tell them how old the dog is, how much they weigh, and they sort of cater a menu based on what your dog needs to be eating. And so then they send these packets of things like pork with blueberries and chicken with carrots and really delicious sounding meals.

[Al Franken (Ad Segment)]

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[Al Franken]

Well, we're human. Some of that sounds pretty good.

[Peter Ogburn]

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And she's been enjoying all this and she's on her third month of this.

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[Al Franken]

Well, thanks, Peter.

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[Al Franken]

When you subscribe today. And we are back with David Hogg. We got a midterm coming up in 26 and so far the redistricting is going to be Texas has done five and California is on the ballot to do five. But the Republicans have more opportunities to do this, is that right?

[David Hogg]

They do, theoretically. But I do think that we're seeing some movement. I think there was something about Indiana that I saw earlier today about them.

Slowing their process or not doing redistricting anymore.

So I think that hopefully we're able to get to a kind of detente.

With Republicans to say, look, if you.

Keep going down this road, we will too. But hopefully by us gaining five and.

Them gaining five, we're able to negate that and stop them from continuing down the path.

But the option of just letting this.

Happen is unacceptable, obviously.

[Al Franken]

And it's a long way till 76 as we got. I mean, till 76, what did I say, 76, 26. Well, I'm old, so I remember 76 actually. I voted then. So over a year ahead. How does it look? I mean, how do you think? I mean, the president is underwater, but so are Democrats, right?

[David Hogg]

Luckily, we just need to gain a few more seats back in Congress, obviously. But what I worry about is a situation where we gain back the House and we don't really show how we're.

Using that power to hold Republicans accountable.

I want to see what kind of subpoenas we're going to issue and how we're going to bring people in front.

Of Congress from ICE and other agencies that are clearly abusing their power and terrorizing the American people.

[Al Franken]

Well, if you look at Bondi's committee hearing, they really are in a whole new world of where they will not respond to Democrats in Congress.

[David Hogg]

Well, the good news is if the Department of Justice doesn't want to actually.

Enforce the subpoenas that are issued by Congress. There's another route that they can use, which is using the sergeant at arms to go and haul those people in front of Congress.

Which has been done before. Not in a long time, but it has been done.

[Al Franken]

Okay, so what do Democrats need to do to win in 26? I mean, what do you think?

[David Hogg]

I think the first thing that we really need to charge on is a huge anti corruption effort and clearly making it clear that we are the party.

That wants to ban Congressional stock trading.

That we are the party that wants.

Campaign finance reform, that we are the party that wants to make it so that what the President is doing right now with his massive cryptogrift, with his granddaughter selling her new merchandise and clothing.

Line on the lawn of the White.

House is not legal. And that we're pushing for transparency in government, that we're pushing for the release of the Epstein files, and that we're pushing to make sure that we're fighting.

Back against corruption as much as possible. And I think what's happened is there's far too many people in our country that look at Democrats and Republicans and like, yeah, Republicans are crazy and they're.

Corrupt, but Democrats have their own corruption too. Look at the stock trading, or look at this, you know, the, the places.

That they take money from. And I think what we need to do is really hold ourselves to a.

Higher standard and say, look, we, we are the party that doesn't want members of Congress to be able to own and trade stocks, especially on legislation that.

They have oversight on. And I think with that too, what we gotta show people is not just say, you know, we want to lower costs, but talk about specifically what we're doing.

And I'll give credit where credit is due.

The first time that I feel like we've really shown that in a fight.

For something specific of how we're fighting to ensure that your costs don't go up is around the shutdown fight right now where we've repeatedly reiterated over and.

Over and over again that if this.

Current bill, the CR passes, that it's.

Going to have health care premiums rise.

At least 75% or more.

[Al Franken]

This is for the ACA, the subsidies. Subsidies. And also, you know, the bill they passed is also cutting Medicaid by a trillion, what is it, a trillion dollars.

[David Hogg]

I'm sure it's some insane amount like that, but it goes to show you, right, like what we have to reiterate over and over again is that we are the Ones that are actively fighting.

To lower your costs. We are the ones that are in.

Showing people how are we doing that. I think one of the things that.

Kills me the most is hearing Democrats.

Talk about we want to fight special.

Interests, we want to fight for lower costs.

How are you doing that? That's what I want to know how.

Right.

All these things sound great.

What the American people want is specifics.

What is your plan to lower those costs?

What is your plan to make it.

So that rent is not so damn high, especially for young people who are.

Struggling not only with higher rent, but also a huge unemployment rate right now, enabled in part by the growth of artificial intelligence that's made it so that the unemployment rate for recent college grads is something crazy, like 10 or 12% right now.

And it's affecting millions of young people.

Around the country, and they're looking for somebody to offer them a solution.

[Al Franken]

We did lose young men by but like 6 or 7% from the previous presidential.

[David Hogg]

I think they shifted pretty substantially.

I think it might.

It was probably even more than that.

But I think what's happening is that what young people feel like right now is that they are effectively 10ft underwater, and they're hearing from Democrats generally like.

What if you were nine feet underwater?

And then what they're hearing is like. And then Republicans want to put you at 11ft underwater. And it's like, I don't want to be underwater at all. I want to be at the surface. I don't want to hear about incrementalism when I feel like I can't even breathe right now. And what happens is when you're underwater like that, you're going to be reaching out for any hand that you see.

On the left or right side that you think could bring you to the surface as quickly as possible.

And that's why I think that we shouldn't just write off our young people.

As, like, being lost to the right or something. They did shift to the right, but.

We haven't completely lost them. I think what's happening is they're desperately.

Looking for anybody who says they can have an answer to actually help them and make their lives easier.

And what Democrats have to do a better job of is not just delivering.

On making their lives easier so that.

Their rent is not as high, so.

That they're able to be at least.

As well off as their parents were.

If not better, but also communicating what we're doing for them.

I think one of the things that's.

Killed me most that I think is.

Representative Too of our failure to communicate.

As a party with young people is.

I had so many people, predominantly of.

Older generations, come up to me in the lead up to the election saying.

David, I don't, I don't understand why young people are so upset right now.

Or why they aren't polling well for the Democrats when we canceled their student debt.

And it's, it's, I want people to remember that the people who had their.

Student debt canceled predominantly were people with.

10, I think, I think it was.

10 years of repayment history that they had to have.

That is almost only people that are.

Going to be over the age of 30 years old. If you go to somebody under the age of 30 and say you need to effectively, if you say to them.

You should be happy all of your student debt has been canceled and that's why you should vote for us. And then they look at their bank account and they still see the fact that they aren't even able to pay.

Off the principal on their loan and it's just the interest still because they.

Still have six figures in debt. How would you feel, right, if you were told by somebody like, you don't understand, you shouldn't feel this way because you don't have six figures in debt.

Anymore when you still do.

And by the time that we have to start explaining, well, actually, you know.

That'S because of Donald Trump's appointed Supreme Court members that then struck down. You lose them, you completely lose them.

And we have to do a much.

Better job of communicating with them, I.

Think in some ways, like Zoran did.

In New York City.

[Al Franken]

And you've endorsed him, right? You endorse him before the primary?

[David Hogg]

Yeah, we were his largest financial supporter.

He gave him $300,000 or the Independent expenditure effort.

[Al Franken]

And he will be the mayor.

[David Hogg]

Most likely.

Most likely. Most likely.

[Al Franken]

Okay.

[David Hogg]

What I, I've never taken anything for granted, but right. What I'll, what I'll say in that race that's remarkable that we have to learn from is in our party, we need to decide do we want young.

Sycophants or do we actually want young people?

Because increasingly, from my experience in the.

DNC and talking to, you know, the most insidery of the insidery of the inside of the establishment, you know, which are DNC members and talking to them.

And then seeing the experience of how many young people came up to Zuron when we were, and I was with.

Him in New York City, we went.

To Washington Square park together to film a video and there were hundreds of young people coming up to him who.

Not only knew his name but could even teenagers who not only knew his name but could recite his own platform back to him about free buses, about.

Free childcare, about, you know, city owned.

Grocery stores and stuff like that. And what we saw was for all.

Those young people that were said to have been turned off and turned away.

From Kamala Harris and Democrats generally, what we saw was three times the 18.

To 24 year old turnout for Zoran.

In that primary in New York City.

Than for then Kamala Harris had in the actual presidential election that there is.

A lot to be learned from that. He's even winning a slim majority of younger conservatives right now in that race, which is crazy.

But it speaks to the power of telling people what you're actually going to.

Do instead of just saying we're going to lower your prices, explaining how you're going to do it and sticking to your values.

Because obviously there are many people who did not and do not agree with Zoharan.

But to his credit he expanded the.

Electorate and actually used democracy the way.

That it's supposed to be used which.

Is to sell people on what you.

Truly believe in and get them to actually turn out and vote for you.

[Al Franken]

Now obviously he's got a constituency in New York City that's very, you know, that's far more liberal than in some of the other purple areas that you're definitely going to be that you're supporting candidates in. So what should those candidates be talking about?

[David Hogg]

Well, I think it's a similar formula as Zuron frankly because even though the issues that Xeron is talking about are focused on certainly are more specific to New York City, I think that listening is not liberal. I don't think it's conservative.

I think it's just good strategy right. Of actually listening. And in his case what he did, he literally went out there and asked people what do you.

It was one of the few times.

I've seen in my life a politician.

Go out there and ask people what.

Do you want from your mayor of New York City? Or what do you want from this elected position?

And I think if it's somebody running.

In a more purple area, you can go out and do the same thing and be similarly rewarded by asking people.

What do you want to see?

What do you need?

How can I serve you? And then communicating what your values are.

And what your plan is to actually execute on those values, immaterially improve people's.

Lives and then having a clear enough message that inspires people to actually believe maybe this change is possible that they go out and knock doors for you and then they spread that message and.

They become your best advertisers. Because a good message in its truth form, you don't need to pay to.

Advertise it because people will naturally want.

To advertise it for you a lot of the time. Right.

And I think one of the things.

That he did very successfully Too was.

Using TikTok and social media with that new set of values to outmaneuver his.

Opponents and expand the electorate with people.

That traditionally have been written off as.

Just not voting in Democratic primaries, which are younger people that historically don't vote in Democratic primaries.

[Al Franken]

And Democrats have learned how to use those social media tools or are.

[David Hogg]

I think some of us have. I think some of us have. I think even Chuck Schumer, to his credit, and I'm kind of amazed I'm even saying this because I've been so critical of him, to his credit, put out a pretty great video yesterday about why we're fighting to ensure that Republicans.

Are not cutting healthcare for millions of people.

And it was actually really good. I think seeing Jeffries go out there get just yesterday and get in an argument with.

Who was it? It was Mike Lawler.

I think it was over health care and like publicly arguing with him and saying this is why how you're trying.

To screw over millions of Americans and.

Why we are fighting back. That is what we need more of.

We need to be a party of fighters and not folders.

[Al Franken]

And it seems like health care. Marjorie Taylor Greene switched on, on health care too. She basically said that repealing the subsidies for the ACA are going to cost like double her kids. She talked about her adult children will be doubling their, their premiums for their ACA health care. And she said that about also in fairness to her, about people in her district, not just, it wasn't just about her adult children.

[David Hogg]

Right.

[Al Franken]

But I think people, I think that is really the issue that the shutdown is about as that and Medicaid cuts in the big beautiful bill. And I think we win on that.

[David Hogg]

We do.

I mean what we. I think the, the important thing here.

Is that for Democrats there's a lot.

Of data that came out after the election and research about like what are the top most important issues for voting.

For, for the American people and what are the issues that we are most that the American people trust Democrats the most on. The only thing that was like basically that was in the top five of the most important things and also was in the top five things that we are trusted as a party most on was healthcare.

I think that is one of our.

Strongest, if not our strongest position to really lean into because it is one thing that matters a hell of a lot to voters and one of the.

Only things that both matters a lot.

To voters and that we are trusted significantly more on than Republicans are. And we absolutely need to be leaning into that. And it's, it's where we can get a lot of our strength from.

[Al Franken]

And I think that's what we've basically made this shutdown about. I mean that's.

[David Hogg]

Yeah.

[Al Franken]

You know, and that's smart. That's it, that's. It's on, on health care.

[David Hogg]

Yeah.

And it's, it's, it's very smart because the bottom line is too like if Republicans wanted to reopen the government, they could, I mean they could, they could.

Go through lifting the filibuster and keeping it open, but they're not going to do that because they also don't want to keep the government open.

They want to help pass this bill.

So that it can be the largest increase for health care premiums for Americans.

Basically, I would say ever. So that they can help fund one of the largest tax cuts for billionaires.

And wealthy people in this country's history, which is just insane.

[Al Franken]

And I think that's a loser for them and we'll see how long this goes on. But I think I feel a shift, I feel a shift in the last week or so on, on this issue and I. But this could go on for a long time.

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[Al Franken]

How much, how much should Democrats be running against autocracy?

[David Hogg]

I think it's certainly an important component. I think the no Kings protests are.

Really important just simply for us.

I think rights are like a muscle. You have to practice them to make.

Sure that you keep them and use them when they're under threat. Obviously from. In an environment like we're in right now.

I think the best way to fight against autocracy though is to prove why.

Government can work for you and why Democrats are the party that stand against special interests, stand with everyday people, the 99%, the middle class, and clearly are fighting for them and not just passing policies that help them, but clearly communicating.

To them why, you know, the reason.

Why your kid is able to still.

Be on your health care until they're 26 years old is because of Democrats communicating to them. The reason why, if you have a.

Preexisting condition that you're still able to get health care is because of Democrats communicating to them that when Social Security.

Is threatened, we're here to fight for that because we're the party that pioneered Social Security, we're the party that pioneered.

Medicare and Medicaid and so many of the most lifesaving and essential programs that Americans rely on.

[Al Franken]

But by autocracy, I mean, you know, I'm talking about what's going on in terms of Trump sending in National Guard to Illinois and trying to do it in Oregon. And does that play with young people?

[David Hogg]

I think some of them. But honestly, what really concerns me right.

Now compared to 2018, compared to 2016.

Is that young people used to be really, really involved in a lot of.

These movements like March for Our Lives, where it was high schoolers and even middle schoolers and college students that were participating in it.

And now at, you know, if you.

Look at the no Kings Day protests, there are very few young people.

And I, that really bothers me. I think part of it is because Trump has been so normalized to young.

People now because he was, you know.

For, for somebody who's 20 right now or somebody who's, you know, 18 or 16. Trump to them effectively was Obama for.

Me, in terms of like the life stages that they were going through as he was president.

And I think we have to figure out how to get more younger candidates.

Out there that represent young people and.

Their values and show how we're fighting back against it. Where we're seeing people like Kat Abzug in Chicago literally getting thrown to the.

Ground as a candidate for Congress at.

[Al Franken]

The age of 25, brutally thrown to the ground, brutally.

[David Hogg]

Horrible, right?

And there are other people out there too, like Bushra, who's running in the.

Same district, who's 27 years old, getting tear gassed and repeatedly still showing up.

Day and day and day, over and.

Over again, even as ICE continues to tear gas them and everything like that, fighting for their constituents.

And I think part of what we have to do is talk about the.

Corruption that, that about why this is.

Happening and talk about the fact that.

Our immigration system, people like to say that it's broken.

I actually would argue it's working the exact way that it ended up being.

Incentivized and designed to, where if you can take a group of people, millions of them, that are in constant fear of deportation, you can pay them extremely low wages, you can ensure that they don't advocate for their, their workers rights.

You can ensure that they are constantly.

Living in a state of fear so that they aren't able to advocate for themselves. And then even if they do end up getting deported, you put them in a private prison, because that is what, who runs most of these detention facilities that ICE is prison putting people in are groups like GEO Group and other private prisons that are literally making billions of dollars off of the immigration system that we currently have.

[Al Franken]

You know, they advertise, you want to join ICE to go after the worst of the worst. And what we're seeing is, and I think American people are changing on this, and I hope young people are part of that, that they're saying that.

[Al Franken (Ad Segment)]

These.

[Al Franken]

Are people who've been in this country for, you know, 30 years and haven't violated a law other than not being documented. And I think people thought that what they were doing was throwing criminals out of the country. And I think that's changing people's minds on Trump and on the Republicans and on immigration.

[David Hogg]

Yeah. Because everybody, I, I feel like everybody in this country knows somebody who is undocumented. And if they, if they think that they didn't, a lot of the time they are getting rudely woken up realizing.

That a friend of theirs, a co.

Worker of theirs, a, you know, somebody.

In their community, somebody who they get.

Their coffee from, somebody that they, that they know is undocumented and now is living in hiding or has been deported by these ICE agents, even though these.

People have lived here peacefully for decades, have done nothing wrong, have paid taxes.

And the only thing wrong that they.

Have done is overstay their visa, for example, and been undocumented here. And what we need, clearly we need a system of immigration and laws that are enforced, but we need to ensure that that system is not so messed up that people just end up being.

Incentivized to overstay here because we've made it harder for them, for example, to.

Go back and forth across the border to come and work in America and then go back to Mexico or go back to their country because the system is so much more strict than it used to be.

[Al Franken]

You know, let's Hope that the 26 is, lets us take the majority at least in the House and maybe do some investigations and stuff.

[David Hogg]

Fingers crossed.

And if people want to support our work to help win back the House and also to just light a fire under the Democratic Party to get our.

Act together and bring in some fresh.

Blood, they can go to leaderswedeserve.com to.

[Al Franken]

Support our work leaders. We deserve.com that's the place to go.

[David Hogg]

Awesome.

[Al Franken]

Thanks aid.

[David Hogg]

Thanks Al.

[Al Franken]

Well, I. I hope you enjoyed listening. That beautiful music is by Leo Kotke. The great Leo Kotke. I want to thank Peter Ogburn for producing this podcast. We'll talk again next week.

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