The Psychology of Selling More — Without Feeling Salesy

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Amazing Authorities Podcast

Episode: The Psychology of Selling More — Without Feeling Salesy
Host: Mitch Carson
Guest: Jake Stahl
Date: February 24, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, Mitch Carson brings on Jake Stahl, sales expert and author of Own the Room: How to Communicate to be Seen, Heard and Respected. Together, they dig into the psychology behind effective selling—moving beyond feeling "salesy" to fostering genuine influence, trust, and authority. From the science of first impressions to specific tips you can use to become more persuasive (without pushiness), this episode is packed with actionable insights for anyone looking to sell more—whether onstage, online, or one-on-one.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Shift from One-to-One to One-to-Many Selling

Timestamps: [01:19]–[04:20]

• Jake's Sales Evolution: Started in pharmaceutical sales (classic one-to-one setting), but his career took off when he embraced one-to-many sales—especially through speaking and establishing authority in e-learning.
• Quote:
  “When you can sell yourself to all those people, then the contacts that come in... just force multiply, which is just fantastic.” – Jake Stahl [03:42]
• Leveraging Group Settings: Establishing brand and authority in front of larger audiences dramatically increased opportunities and pre-sold many future one-on-one prospects.

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2. Presence and First Impressions: The Power of "Thin Slicing"

Timestamps: [04:47]–[09:06]

• Presence Trumps Words:
  “Presence beats anything you can say any day of the week. So the way you show up matters more than what you say. That to me was the biggest lesson learned.” – Jake Stahl [04:47]
• Thin Slicing Study: Jake describes a study where students judged professors’ personalities based on silent 2-10 second video clips, leading to the same conclusions as students who spent months in their classes.
• Implication: First impressions are formed instantly and are incredibly persistent—buyers often decide within seconds whether they trust, like, or will buy from you.
• Memorable Quote:
  “People are judged before your message even starts. Many have made their decision... if they're going to buy from you before you speak—it's staggering.” – Jake Stahl [06:54]

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3. The Science of Approachability: Controllable First Impressions

Timestamps: [12:00]–[14:30]

• Controllable Nonverbal Cues for Trust:
  • Big Smile: Involving crow’s feet, shows genuine warmth.
  • Strong/Leaning-Forward Posture: Signals engagement and energy.
  • Slight Head Tilt: Shows vulnerability, exposing the jugular, signaling trust.
• Quote:
  “If you have those three things in a headshot, you are far more likely to have someone trust you before they even get to meet you.” – Jake Stahl [13:05]
• Host Verification: Mitch confirms these principles worked for his own online presence and podcast headshot.

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4. Biases, Acceptance, and Tailoring Your Presentation

Timestamps: [15:10]–[18:45]

• Adapting Appearance for Audience: Jake keeps his tattoos covered in professional settings, understanding that visual cues can trigger others’ past associations and biases.
• Quote:
  “You can... put anything you want on. But don't judge other people for judging you based on that, because they're going to.” – Jake Stahl [18:12]
• Context Matters: Choices like revealing tattoos or personal style should fit the audience and their likely perceptions.

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5. The Power of “Because”—Cause and Effect in Persuasion

Timestamps: [19:53]–[25:57]

• Classic Xerox/Copy Machine Experiment: Even nonsensical “because” statements drastically increased compliance. People are wired to respond to cause-and-effect logic.
• Quote:
  “When you give a because, it almost doesn’t matter what the reason is. But you’re helping establish that cause and effect in that person’s brain.” – Jake Stahl [21:22]
• Actionable Tip: Always give your audience a “because,” especially when asking for a commitment—e.g., “You should start a podcast because...”
• Anticipate and Elevate Ownership: Using “because” helps bridge the gap from intention to action.

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6. Solidifying the Sale: Identity, Ownership, and Transfer

Timestamps: [26:24]–[29:53]

• Transfer of Ownership: Make your offer the audience’s own idea—get prospects to visualize their future with your solution before they even buy.
• Quote:
  “...Get them to start to take ownership... if you don't they're going to hear it as an idea, but it's not going to be defensible to others.” – Jake Stahl [27:14]
• Stick Strategies: Directly after they say “yes,” reinforce benefits and future actions:
  “Because you’ve signed up, you’ll...” or
  “What will you name your podcast? Who’s your first guest?”
• Why? Making the buyer rehearse their decision makes it ‘impenetrable’ to buyer’s remorse.

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7. Nouns vs. Verbs: Creating Identity for Lasting Motivation

Timestamps: [30:12]–[34:02]

• Identity Language in Sales:
  • “I have a podcast” (verb) vs. “I’m a podcaster” or “I’m a podcast host” (noun).
  • “You don’t pick up after yourself” vs. “You’re a slob.”
• Quote:
  “Our ability in a sales process to make people part of a group by using a noun instead of a verb has literally substantial repercussions for them mentally as well as becoming part of their identity.” – Jake Stahl [31:48]
• Powerful Framing: Use noun-based language to help prospects see themselves as members of a desirable group (e.g., “podcasters,” “hosts,” “authors”).

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8. The "Close" Is Just the Natural Conclusion

Timestamps: [34:02]–[34:59]

• Jake’s Contrarian View:
  “I hate the word close... the person buying your product should just be a foregone conclusion... Clothes should be a natural ending, not something we do.” – Jake Stahl [34:02]
• Implication: When the conversation is structured well, “closing” is not a separate event—it’s a seamless and logical outcome of genuine connection, transfer of ownership, and identity alignment.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Thin Slicing:
  “People do what is called thin slicing. They make assumptions and judgments based on what they see, not hear... and they are astoundingly accurate.” – Jake Stahl [05:22]

• On Visual Cues:
  “Big smile... strong posture... slight tilt to the head. Shows you trust them with that soft spot, so they should trust you.” – Jake Stahl [13:04]

• On Being Judged:
  “It can be... absolutely [as granular as facial hair, etc.]... Some conditions, it can absolutely be.” – Jake Stahl [15:35]

• On Inclusion:
  “It's not that I have a podcast. It's I'm a podcaster... you’re creating that group, that noun for them to be a part of, and that is really powerful.” – Jake Stahl [31:48]

• On the Danger of Ignoring First Impressions:
  “I don't think it's that we never knew about thin slicing. I think it's that we never took it as seriously as we do today. And honestly, I think we ignore it at our own peril.” – Jake Stahl [15:35]

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Actionable Takeaways

• Prep your visual presence: Smile wide (show teeth if you have them), sit/stand with interest, and slightly tilt your head in your headshots and on stage.
• Leverage “because”: Always offer reasons, even simple ones, when asking for commitments or suggesting actions.
• Paint prospects inside your solution: Before closing, get them to claim their next steps (“What will you call your podcast?”).
• Use noun language: Help people adopt a new identity aligned with what you’re offering (podcaster, author, host).
• Let “the close” happen naturally: If you’ve built rapport, established authority, and transferred ownership, the sale is the logical conclusion.

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 01:19 — The transition from one-to-one to one-to-many selling
• 04:47 — Psychological principle of thin slicing in first impressions
• 12:00 — The three key elements of trust-building headshots
• 19:53 — The “Because” study & the Copy Machine experiment
• 26:24 — Ownership transfer and stick strategy post-sale
• 30:12 — Noun vs. verb in imprinting customer identity
• 34:02 — The “close” as a natural, logical endpoint

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Overall Tone:
Conversational, energetic, and packed with practical wisdom. Mitch keeps things lively with humor and personal anecdotes, while Jake brings research-backed, real-world advice with a teacher’s enthusiasm.

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Want more on sales psychology and authority-building? Jake Stahl’s book “Own the Room: How to Communicate to be Seen, Heard and Respected” is available on Amazon. For more insights, find his podcast—also called Own the Room.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the Amazing Authorities podcast, where game changers, visionaries and category leaders share how they built their brands, platforms and global influence. Your host is Mitch Carson, international speaker, media strategist, and creator of the Instant Authority system. If you're ready to learn from those who've done it and want to become the go to expert in your space, you're in the right place.

[B]

Jake Stahl is in the house, all the way from Virginia. I'm your host, Mitch Carson from the Amazing Authorities podcast and I only have Amazing Authorities on this show and Jake is a student first and a teacher second, because the best teachers I have found in my years on the platform and speaking all around the world, the best students or the best teachers have been students and they still embrace learning. Jake, welcome to the show.

[C]

Oh, Mitch, thanks for having me. This is quite an honor.

[B]

And let's jump right in. Own the room. Let's see your book.

[C]

My book is Own the Room. How to Communicate, to be Seen, Heard and Respected.

[B]

We briefly chatted about one to one selling, which is where most of us start out. I mean, my background. I sold siding door to door, knocked on doors when I was 15 years old. So that's how I cut my teeth on selling.

[C]

That's real sales work, right?

[B]

Real direct sales. I mean, I could have sold vacuums. I could have sold whatever. You just. I was programmed for rejection. And then once in a while, people felt sorry for me and let me in. Or maybe Mrs. Smith wanted to give me some cookies and milk. But the truth is, when I learned the power of leverage and one to many selling, my world changed and so did my pocketbook. When did that transition or epiphany go off with you?

[C]

For me, it was when I was in pharmaceutical sales. Okay, that was kind of where I cut my teeth, was in pharma sales. And that's typically the. The one to one. You're in individual offices, you're promoting product. But as I grew older and when I started my own business, the one to many was really a huge. To your point, it's a huge factor and it makes a big, big difference in overall income.

[B]

It's leverage. It's like if you've got 20 prospects in a room, let's just even start small. And, you know, it was epiphany for me as a speaker. I sold one too many and one day I made 60 grand. I thought, whoa, horses. And what happened with you? I mean, I understand the routine of a pharma salesperson. You're going doctor up. Maybe you get lucky With a clinic and you know, you get a bunch of doctors as, as an audience at, during their lunchtime and they're busy people. But it's usually one to one, isn't it when you're going around?

[C]

It is. And for me, the one to many happened. When I got out of the field and I get into home office. I started off in the elearning arena when elearning was like, you know, you buy a C and you CD guides you through, you know, you don't have CDs much, if at all anymore. But I became quite an authority in the elearning arena. As a matter of fact, I have seven patents in field force technology. And when I got into elearning, I found that audiences really wanted to hear about that because it was brand new. Learning management systems were brand new. So I got in front of a lot of audiences. And it's funny because my group selling wasn't so much as selling a product, it was selling me. When you can sell yourself to all those people, then the contacts that come in and the people who want to talk to you just force multiply, which is just fantastic. And then people want to write, you know, quotes from you in books and then they want to have you on social media and your presence expands dramatically. And when you do that and then you're back in a one on one sale, people know you before you even walk in the room and the sale's halfway made.

[B]

You're selling your, your personal brand or your perceived marketplace value is what it boils down to. You're selling information and. Yeah, and, and, or a brand. The Jake Stahl brand. And what did, what are some of the lessons you learned along the way? I mean, it's funny, you age yourself with the CDs. I'm a bit older than you and I, I went back to cassette tapes.

[C]

Oh, me too.

[B]

My first info product was cassettes.

[C]

Yeah. Yep, I remember those. The first thing that hit me, Mitch, and I wish I would have known this from day one, is that presence beats anything you can say any day of the week. So the way you show up matters more than what you say. That to me was the biggest lesson learned. And you know, in psychology they call this thin slicing. So how quickly people get an impression of you. And Mitch, there was a really cool study done. Is it okay if I share the results?

[B]

Absolutely.

[C]

Really cool. So what they did was they took two groups of college students and to group A, they showed them clips of college professors giving their classes, but they only showed them 2 to 10 second clips and the audio was off. So all they could do was see these professors talking. Then group B was a group of students who had those exact professors for a full semester and had listened to them and seen them and gotten to know them. They gave both groups of students a questionnaire and the questionnaire just had a list of personality traits that they had to check off. So group A could only base it on 2 to 10 seconds of no sound. Group B could base it on six months of experience. What they found was the responses from both groups were nearly identical. And the thing that that tells you is that people do what is called thin slicing. They make assumptions and judgments based on what they see. Not here. And they are astoundingly accurate. And not only that, but once people form that judgment, they work really hard to substantiate it. So if I like Mitch to start, even if Mitch does something mad, my brain's going, no, no, you liked Mitch. What he did bad wasn't bad for you. So you like Mitch. And the opposite's true. If I don't like somebody to start, my brain's going to continue to fight for that. And if they do something great, my brain says no, no, you hated that person. You should really continue to dislike them. And if you think about the impact of that study and what it says about us as humans, it means that you are judged before your message even starts. And many people have made their decision. If they're going to buy from you before you speak, it's staggering.

[B]

Simply based on your physicality or your non verbal communication, I would love to impact that more. This is fascinating to me. We talked about Robert Cialdini and I so into learning about what makes the mind tick. There's neuroscience and there we're not even there yet. That's possibly another topic. You're talking about non verbal communication or non verbal cues or what was deeper in that state. I know you can't go through all of it, we don't have all day, but I am fascinated.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. So the way I sum it up in, in the book I wrote, it's the first step of really forming a great sales message. And it, I call it signals. So it's a signal somebody's sending off. It's their posture, it's their speed, it's gesticulation by their hands, it's the way they carry themselves. Our brain forms a remarkably vast number of assumptions based on what we see initially. And we tend to stick by that and then we fight for it. You know, think of the last person that you looked at and, and they didn't even talk to you and you thought, no, that's not going to work with them. Your brain went through a million calculations and came to the point that they're probably not going to be the best person for you to, to talk to.

[B]

It's a yes or no. That fast?

[C]

Yeah. And, and so now think about as a speaker or think about somebody selling a book or, or selling something to an audience. The implication is that those people have probably already made their decision before you said your first word. That to me is staggering simply by.

[B]

Is it bod, is it body type, is it eye color, is it race? I mean, all these things factor or what. What is it specifically? I mean, is there a.

[C]

And think about it. It's. And, and I don't know all the deep answers, but my assumption is it's probably how it associates to past memories you had. Okay, so that person walks like my dad. I didn't get along with my dad, so therefore, you know, so. And I oversimplified it, but it, it's based on how your brain processes and how it's associated with past memories and how well that's going to click with you or your biases or your assumptions. So, you know, the million calculations your brain goes through, I don't know if anybody's any of us could quantify that. You know, why is it that one person is excessively likable to some people and there's a small group that think that person's not for me, who knows what's going on in their brain? Yeah.

[B]

Well, here's an example, and I'm, I'm gonna talk about you. You have a beard. Some people might have biases based on people with beards versus not, oh, my professor gave me a C when I deserve to be. And he had a. He had a beard. Because a lot of.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

Is it some as granular as that?

[C]

It can be. Absolutely. You know, we think about this all the time. When somebody comes up with an objection or has an argument to us, it's rarely about us. And you know, Shieldini even talks about this a little bit. It's, you know, they're making decisions based on similarities to past experiences they had. And if you look at the psychologist B.F. skinner.

[B]

Oh, sure.

[C]

No, Skinner said we have no free will. We are simply one big ball of preconditioned motions and decisions based on stuff that's happened in the past. So you may not believe that, and I have my doubts about it too, but I can't help but think there's a grain of truth to that.

[B]

Yeah, he was the dog, wasn't he? The salivating dog, I think, was bfc. That was.

[C]

That was Pavlov.

[B]

Pavlov. Okay. Excuse me. All right. Yes. But I remember B.F. skinner going back to college, which is umpteen years ago. Yes.

[C]

The argument that there is no such thing as free will. That was. All right.

[B]

Okay. And of course, Pavlov was the. The drooling dog. Yes. With the bell. I think it was the bell.

[C]

Yes, you're right. Yep.

[B]

All right. The bell. All right. So when I hear a bell, I start salivating just like a dog, too. So I think food. It's like, all right, dinner time. Yeah, we're there. What. What are some of the traits we have we're in control of? This is probably where you come in as a coach and as a teacher and as a mentor. What traits are controllable so we could possibly persuade or shift outcomes for ourself as salespeople?

[C]

Yes. There's. So there's a couple of things you can do, and the first thing we're taught or the first thing that psychologists talk about is. Is how you look and. And your presence. So let's talk about this in the form of a headshot. You know, many authors, when we put our picture on the book, or many people, when they have social media, they take a professional headshot. Do you know psychologists actually showed three things in a headshot that actually help people trust you before you ever even speak to them? Those three things, and all perfectly controllable, are big smile. So get crow's feet involved if you have them. Big bonus for teeth if you're smiling. Nice. If you have them right. If you have them. Second is your posture. So either straight up or you're leaning forward a little bit. So it's showing the pictures, showing that you're paying attention. But the third is the one that's really cool to me. In a headshot, they say a slight tilt to the head.

[B]

Bingo. Bingo.

[C]

Exposes the jugular.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Shows you trust them with that soft spot on you, so they should trust you. And these studies have shown that if you have those three things in a headshot, you are far more likely to have someone trust you before they even get to meet you.

[B]

All right, so let me repeat that because this is so worthwhile. And it's exactly. Those are the conclusions I found through my own studies when I. My headshot on my podcast meets that criteria you just laid out.

[C]

It does.

[B]

I looked at it okay, big smile. I brush my teeth. Make sure I have no remnant dental floss. And leaning forward with interest. Strong posture. And then the slight tilt. I use that for my Facebook profile because it makes me approachable. This is what I had read. Absolutely consistent with your findings. What you share. 100% agree? 100%. And anything else? So slightly leaning forward. The. This is what I had learned. I knew about the smile versus non smile. That's even for dating profiles. It's like, can I Is this person approachable? Because we're all dating in sales anyway, right? Intimacy is a different discussion, but we're still. Do I want to do business with this person? Is that what the quick assessment is? Do I want to give them money? Do I want to commerce with this individual?

[C]

Exactly right. And in the book, I actually document some cases of people that I have coached where they haven't even said the first word. And you can tell they lost the sale. The people zoned out right away because of their approach or their stature or the way they first entered the room. So that thin slicing applies to the pictures as well, which is really, really huge and again, almost frightening. So if somebody looks at my headshot and they've already made a hundred assumptions about me, I may never get to even talk to them because they look at my headshot and go, yeah, I don't think so. Right.

[B]

You can't change that. Well, I guess you could. There are assessments. For example, the FBI won't hire people with. With facial hair. And at least initially, maybe if they go out in the field, what have you, there are those assess. Certain religions have that issue. I know that there are, you know, hair length. Is that a factor?

[C]

Some of these conditions, it can absolutely be. And you know, Disney World, it wasn't too long ago where you can get hired at Disney with facial hair or tattoos or long hair. It wasn't that long ago where that was a restriction to work in the happiest place on earth. So I don't think it's that we never knew about thin slicing. I think it's that we never took it as seriously as we do today. And honestly, I think we ignore it at our own peril.

[B]

Okay, well, I'm a baby boomer, so I have judgments. Prejudgments that have softened with tattoos, because when I grew up, if you had two tattoos, it was one of two conditions. You'd either been to prison or the second, you were in the Navy and it was only on the bicep area that you had tattoo nothing on the Sleeves today?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I would be really limited. I think we would all be limited if we judge somebody harshly, especially somebody under 30, if they have tattoos on their hands or forearms. Because it seems to be omnipresent.

[C]

Yeah. And so just because we do this doesn't mean there isn't levels of acceptance that we eventually come to. And you and I, being older gentlemen, we realize that as we've changed over the years, we become either harder lined on certain things or. Or even softer, like on the tattoos, you know?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I've softened a number of tattoos myself, so I'm very soft line on those because I have them. But I have colleagues that are very unforgiving when it comes to a tattoo.

[B]

And they probably skew older, don't they?

[C]

Yes, they do skew older, without a doubt.

[B]

And it's because of the generation. I think if you're over 60 and you have tattoos there, there might be a higher likelihood of some off behavior that might have existed early in life. Possibly. It's not always Possibly. Yeah. It's not always true. There are people of my age group that have tattoos, have never seen a prison and. Or were in the Navy, and it's just something that. Okay, got later. That's kind of cool. I'm going to get a dragon.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Or whatever it is. And so. So there are those biases. So in a selling environment, I don't know where your tattoos are, but would you expose them or not?

[C]

Or.

[B]

It depends on the audience you're speaking to.

[C]

No. Mine are all undercover. And it's still that I have that little thing in my head that I don't want to skew anybody in the wrong direction because here's a fact. And you can send all the hate mail to me on this one. That's okay. But the fact is, we all say I want to be accepted for who I am, and I should be able to wear anything I want and put anything I want on. You can. Nobody's arguing with that. But then don't judge other people for judging you based on that, because they're going to. So I agree with freedom of expression. If you want to put tattoos on your face, man, more power to you. But don't expect the entire world to accept you for that, because it's just not going to happen.

[B]

Yeah, we're all not Mike Tyson, Right?

[C]

Exactly. Yeah. I wouldn't tell Iron Mike they look crappy. I would just let you know.

[B]

But he can get away with it. Most of us can't.

[C]

True. Yes. There is something about his presence that allows for

[B]

certain extreme behaviors. Yes.

[C]

Be more politically correct.

[B]

Yeah. Well, yeah, he's. He's not your. I think we might have some pushback if he was representing us in court or he was our cpa, but given that he's not. And he was a boxing champ. All right, He. That's probably a lot more acceptable or condoned in his. What else does someone have?

[C]

So you.

[B]

The smile is important.

[C]

Right.

[B]

And this matters on stage presence, too. You talked about headshot.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

Let's talk about speaking, because that's my passions, and a lot of people listening are interested in that or authors. What are the shoulds and shouldn'ts, according to your book and background? What you've. What have you noticed?

[C]

So some of the shoulds are people are geared biologically for cause and effect. And if we think about this from the time we're kids, why don't fish drown? Why is the sky blue? You know, why do trees grow up and not down? So you're always looking for that cause and effect. And social psychologists have found that when we're speaking, we can use that to our advantage. So there was a study done in a New York public library. It was called the Copy Machine, the Xerox experiment. And what happened was they took interns, and they said, in this New York library, we want you to. But in line at the copier. As you may guess, New Yorkers are not real happy with you budding in line. So the compliance rate of being able to jump in line, the copier, was zero. So they tried something new. They said, give them a because and then give them a great reason. So interns were told to say, I need to jump in line to make copies because my child's in the car, because I'm late for a meeting, because my wife is expecting me. And what they found was there was a 60% compliance rate. Now, Mitch, that doesn't impress me one bit. To me, that's humanity. And if you give a good reason, some nice person's going to let you in. It was the third piece of the study that blew me away. So they took a third group of interns, and they said, we want you to jump in line to make copies, and then tell them, I need to jump in line to make copies because I need to make copies. Completely nonsensical, even dumb reasoning. And yet they found compliance stuck at around 60%. So what they're deducing is that when you give it because, it almost doesn't matter what the reason is. But you're helping establish that Cause and effect in that person's brain. So when you're on the stage speaking, when you're selling your book and you're in a selling environment and you're not saying why people should do what you're talking about, you're missing a huge, huge play. So you should do what I'm talking about, because you should buy my product, because you should read my book. Because if you. Compliance.

[B]

Okay, so it's just using that one sentence.

[C]

You sh.

[B]

So you should. On them, which sometimes I talk about. All right. If you should. On people that could be sticky and smelly.

[C]

Love that.

[B]

But yes, you should. Because. You should. Because. Or could you say, you may want to consider. I mean, I'm curious about the wording. Because the words matter.

[C]

They do matter.

[B]

So is. Is. Should the operative word because you're pushing or is. I. I like the because part that I. I grabbed. But before. Because. What is the best way to frame it?

[C]

You can use a bunch of different ways. So if I'm giving a talk and I want people to buy into the lecture, I can say, today I'm talking about this, and it's a problem. Because. And at the end, listen, you should buy my book because you should take my course. Because. What comes before the because is not. At least what I found is not nearly as important as using the word itself. Because you always want to give that precursor to say, I asked you to do this. This is why now you have permission to go ahead and do it.

[B]

Okay, I'm a student now, pretending I'm your student. I have an event in three weeks where I'm going to be selling my course on podcast Business Mastery. It's for authors, people who want to be experts in their field. I've done this before. I'm now going to test your hypothesis here in real time. It's a small group, about 80 people in a. In a room. And my conversion rates are skew higher than most of the other speakers.

[C]

Because.

[B]

And I'm giving my because. Because I've been doing this a very long time, and I teach it. So if I see you're doing it already. Yes. And if I can shift another two people that were already on, who were on the fence because of this, how do I. How do I implement this from the stage? What would be some of the language that I would use per your.

[C]

If it were me?

[B]

Yes.

[C]

So if it were me and I was doing podcasting, I would tell them why they want to do podcasting.

[B]

Okay. Cover that.

[C]

Of those reasons why you want to do this instead of something else. So if you have a group in your audience that's like, well, I was thinking of podcasting or I was thinking of, you know, YouTube channel, my social media YouTube channel. Let's just, okay, so you should do this because or you should do this instead of that because. And then when you want them to buy your product or your course, you always want to put in the because and give a good reason applies to the audience. And I'm going to give you another hint on how to do a really good after the because. But let's, let's cover that first. So just always put in a because for everything that you're doing. And what's funny is I hear people say to me when I talk about this, oh, I'd notice that if you said it too often, I'd catch it. And yet I can use the word because 90 times in a sales presentation. And I have never ever had somebody come back to me and say, well, you give an awful lot of reasons. Boy, you say because an awful lot. We're so used to hearing it from growing up that it's just part of our acceptance of the reason you're giving us to take action.

[B]

I love it. I love it. So after they've signed up because you signed up, let's think that, let's do the assumption. Let's go to the next level assumptive sale. You've already signed up. And because you've signed up, you can expect. Because you've signed up, you can see yourself because you signed up. What are some of the fill ins after the fact to solidify the sale? To use a stick strategy.

[C]

So first of all, always paint your customer inside it and have them take ownership. In my book, I call this transfer. So you make your idea their idea. So it's not that you said it, Mitch, it's they came up with it on their own. Because I'm a firm believer that we never convince anybody of anything. People just eventually decide that it was their idea to begin with. So here's an example. Because you did this, you're on the road to podcasting. So let me ask you real quick, what are you going to name your podcast? How many episodes are you going to do? How often are you going to do it? Who are you going to interview first? What does your audience member look like? Get them to start to take ownership

[B]

of it before I even close them.

[C]

Correct. Get them to start to take ownership. Because if you don't, there's my because again, if you don't they're going to hear it as an idea, but it's not going to be defensible to others. Because remember, whenever we make a purchase, we're going to talk to somebody about the purchase. And the longevity of your message, Mitch, isn't in the fact that you said it should be. It's. Is that person going to defend their decision to someone else? Because if they can't, buyer's remorse comes in. They use the three day rule. You know, I have three days to

[B]

back out of this cooling off.

[C]

Right. But if you transfer it well and I walk out of that building, I'm going to name my podcast Own the Room, and I'm going to do it twice a week. And I already have a list of the first three people I'm going to interview. I own that. And as I tell people about it and they say, you don't want to do that, I say, sure I do. I've already named it. I already know what I'm going to do. When you made the idea there's. It becomes impenetrable.

[B]

All right, you two are a podcast host. I'm the host today. You're the guest today. Who knows, in the future, maybe the roles will be reversed because people will want to listen to what I have to share. What caused you to say, yes, I'm going to become a podcast host? I'm curious from you, and it's a real question. What, where, what defining moment came to where? All right, I'm going to look into the equipment and all of those elements, what's my show going to be about, and etc.

[C]

Being in sales for as long as I have, I have loved learning about what other people do. And I currently run a consulting business where my job is to learn somebody's topic and then train it well. So learning has already been a big part of me. And I had a friend say to me, you've got a good voice, you're naturally inquisitive, you'd make a good podcast. And I thought, let's give it a shot. So I will say my podcast name has changed, my audience has changed, and I've evolved it as we've moved on, but I took ownership of it in my head that, okay, this is what I'm gonna do. And to make sure I did it, I told five or six other people so that if I started to back out, they'd ask me about it and I'd have to hold you accountable. Right? Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly right. So, yeah, that was. That was the Road I took.

[B]

So your podcast is called Own the Room. It's similar to the title of your book, Own the Room. Is that available on Amazon?

[C]

It is, yep.

[B]

It's available podcasting now.

[C]

It's been a year. We just dropped our 68th episode, I think.

[B]

Congratulations.

[C]

It's been great. And I would love to say this, Mitch, on your pitch that you were talking about earlier to your audience, this was another thing that can help your audience want to purchase your product is the use of a noun versus a verb. And I'll tell you the difference. It's not that I have a podcast. It's I'm a podcaster, right? It's a noun. I have a podcast is a verb. And the power of that cannot be overstated. Oh, they took children in a kindergarten class, and they said, pick up your toys. Very little response. But when they said, wouldn't you like to be the teacher's helper? A Noun. Pick up your toys verb. The kids became part of a group. Now they got an identity, so they were a helper, and they brought it home to their parents, saying, mommy, I'm the teacher's helper. So became part of who they were. So instead of, don't you want to start a podcast? Verb. Don't you want to be a podcaster? The select group of people that talk on the air and interview who they want and control their destiny. So you're creating that group. You're creating that noun for them to be a part of, and that is really powerful. If you're at home and somebody's slovenly, there's a big difference between you don't pick up after yourself and you're a slob, right? Verb, noun. And this is so well known that lawyers use this constantly. My client's not a criminal. Noun. They just made a few bad decisions. Verb. So our ability in a sales process to make people part of a group by using a noun instead of a verb has literally substantial repercussions for them mentally as well as becoming part of their identity.

[B]

So am I a podcaster or am I a podcast host?

[C]

Either one's a noun. You can pick one.

[B]

I like the word podcast. I like podcaster. I think host is greater because what I'm already doing in my mind is I'm pitching three weeks from now based on what you're sharing with me. David, who's the host of the event, he's the authority figure. I'm going to tie myself to him. You are a host, just like David is a host here today, there you go, he's a host. You too will be a host. There's power in becoming a podcast host. The host is where you have parasites connecting to the host. Your guests will parasite and piggyback on your authority. Who likes that idea? Tie down. All right. I'm going through all these mental thoughts right now. I'm on stage. I mean, who loves that idea of being the host in charge, creating and causing your own destiny? That's what a host.

[C]

Right?

[B]

That's what a podcaster is. Okay, Right.

[C]

And a person who writes a book. It's not I wrote a book, it's I'm an author. Correct, Right. So all of those things paint a completely different picture and make you part of a select group. And we all want that. Right? That's why there's Rotary clubs and bridge clubs and you name it. We all want to be part of a group.

[B]

How important are trial closes in the sales process? Are you seeing this? Is this making sense?

[C]

So I will say this. And, and I firmly support this in my book. I hate the word close. And here's the reason I say that. I think that if you construct your conversation in the right way and if you use. And I'm going to be very self centered here. If you use the process I go through in my book on how to have a conversation and how to make a sale, the close or the person buying your product should just be a foregone conclusion. It should be an absolute logical ending to the conversation. And after doing this across six countries and with over 12,000 people, I hate the fact that as salespeople, we broken clothes into its own separate thing. Clothes should be a natural ending, not something we do. Does that make sense?

[B]

Yes, it does. You just tied me down. Yes.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I love it. I love it. And that's great. And I see you're a super dad. I see the paddle on the wall. Is that from your fraternity?

[C]

Yeah, the super dad my daughters came up with. I am a huge Superman fan. So they got a thing that has me with a Superman cape called Super Dad. And. And the paddle is for my fraternity. Yes. I'm a proud Syracuse grad and I was a Lambda Chi Alpha brother.

[B]

Okay. I was not a fraternity guy. I went to university, the University of Southern California. And the Greek world is very strong there. So I recognize the paddle because people used to buy those for the. Yeah, the newbies, or what was the word? The. Not the recruits. What are the. The pledges. The pledges. Yes, the pledges.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Got their, Got their behinds paddled as part of the process of initiation.

[C]

Yeah, well. And there you go again. You're part of a group. You're, you're fraternity brother. You don't belong to a fraternity. So it's, you know, that's again, funny. Mitch, is the audience after hearing this now, it's all you can hear. You're not going to be able to unhear this when you're out in the real world.

[B]

Jake, show us your book one more time. Yeah, it's Jake Stall.

[C]

How to Communicate to be Seen, Heard and respected.

[B]

Got it. And that's on Amazon.

[C]

It is, Yep.

[B]

Great. You've been a fantastic guest man. Great gems. Tremendous.

[C]

Thank you.

[B]

Tremendous.

[C]

Thanks for having me.

[B]

And we'll have you back again because I think there's a lot more in the psychology of selling and connecting to individuals. It's really the power of connection and how to connect with them. But those three tips, Smile, posture and slight bend of the neck, exposing the jugular. Being vulnerable. And it's even as primal as animals. If they show their neck and curl over to. That allows people to, to be approachable.

[C]

It's funny you say that because a lot of people think that when dogs lay on their back, they want their, their belly scratched. And in some cases they do. But a lot of times that's showing their vulnerability. I'm, I'm trusting you with the most vulnerable piece of my anatomy. So, yeah, it's all about vulnerability. You're right.

[B]

Great. Thank you so much for your time today, Jake. We'll have you back again.

[C]

Thanks, Mitch. Very nice to be on your show. I appreciate it.

[A]

Thanks for tuning in to the Amazing Authorities podcast. If today's episode inspired you, take a moment to subscribe, rate and leave a review. It helps more experts like you rise to the top for behind the scenes access and free resources to boost your authority. Head to MitchCarson. Until next time, stay amazing.