Parkland Shooting

Summary

The Antihero Podcast: Parkland Shooting Episode Summary

Introduction

In this poignant episode of The Antihero Podcast, released on June 2, 2025, hosts Tyler and Brenton delve deep into the harrowing experiences surrounding the Parkland School Shooting. Featuring guest Matt Casey, a Navy corpsman-turned-police officer with extensive first responder experience, the episode offers a raw and unfiltered exploration of the incident's impact on law enforcement personnel and the broader community.

Guest Introduction: Matt Casey

[07:11] Brenton: Matt Casey joins us as a Navy corpsman who served 15 years in law enforcement. Notably, he was a first responder during the Marjory Stoneman Douglas School Shooting, also known as the Parkland Shooting, which took place on February 14, 2018.

Transition from Military to Law Enforcement

Matt Casey recounts his journey from aspiring to join the Marines to becoming a Navy corpsman. Despite initial setbacks due to being a high school dropout, Matt secured his position in the Navy, largely influenced by his family's military background.

[08:35] Brenton: "You did this for me," Matt reflects on how leaving the Marines opened pathways that shaped his career.

Matt's dedication led him to undergo rigorous training, including the Field Medical Service School, which honed his skills in emergency medicine—skills that would prove invaluable in his subsequent law enforcement career.

Becoming a Police Officer and SWAT Medic

After his deployment to Iraq and a meaningful experience there, Matt transitioned into police work, joining a patrol unit and eventually becoming a SWAT team medic. His military training and combat experience provided a solid foundation for handling high-stress situations.

[38:18] Brenton: "Road patrol is the best-kept secret in law enforcement," Matt asserts, highlighting the diversity and unpredictability of patrol duties.

The Parkland School Shooting: A Defining Moment

The episode reaches its emotional core as Matt recounts his role during the Parkland Shooting. Arriving on the scene amidst chaos, he describes the adrenaline-fueled moments leading up to his intervention.

[50:44] Matt Casey: "Please let me see your hands," he narrates the critical seconds before the shooter turned towards him, leading to the decisive moment he fired his weapon to neutralize the threat.

The event left a lasting scar on Matt, not just professionally but personally, as he grappled with the immediate aftermath and the broader implications for his department and community.

[52:07] Brenton: "What did you do next?" he asks, prompting Matt to discuss the procedural and emotional fallout from the shooting.

Aftermath and Struggles with PTSD

Following the incident, Matt faced significant challenges within his department. Attempts to seek help for what he recognized as PTSD were met with bureaucratic indifference, exacerbating his mental health struggles. This lack of support led to increased frustration, burnout, and eventually his decision to retire.

[73:15] Matt Casey: "I felt like law enforcement, you know, failed my job," he admits, highlighting systemic issues within the force regarding mental health support.

Matt emphasizes the importance of having robust support systems for first responders, advocating for peer-led initiatives and better mental health resources to prevent similar tragedies.

Reflections on Law Enforcement Practices

Throughout the conversation, Matt and the hosts critique existing law enforcement protocols, especially concerning active shooter scenarios. They discuss the deficiencies in training, communication, and policy implementations that hinder effective responses during such critical incidents.

[75:43] Matt Casey: "There has to be a balance between tactical response and medical preparedness," he argues, stressing the need for integrated training that encompasses both combat and emergency medicine.

The Role of School Resource Officers (SROs)

Matt underscores the vital role of SROs in preventing and responding to school shootings. He shares personal anecdotes that highlight the trust and connection SROs build within school communities, making them essential in safeguarding students.

[87:35] Brenton: "Every day, these officers interact with kids. They are the frontline in protecting them from unimaginable threats," he states, reinforcing the importance of their presence and proactive engagement.

Conclusion: A Call for Change

As the episode draws to a close, Matt shares a lighter moment, recounting a humorous incident from his time in Iraq, reminding listeners of the resilience and camaraderie inherent in first responder communities.

[115:34] Matt Casey: "I pissed on a Ugandan soldier in the middle of the night, and he just walked away. Sometimes, you just have to laugh," he concludes, offering a glimpse into the human side of those who serve on the frontlines.

Key Takeaways

• Importance of Comprehensive Training: Effective response to active shooter situations requires integrated training that balances tactical prowess with medical expertise.

• Mental Health Support: First responders need robust mental health resources and peer support systems to cope with the immense stress and trauma they encounter.

• Value of SROs: School Resource Officers play a crucial role in maintaining safety within educational institutions, fostering trust and readiness to act in emergencies.

• Systemic Challenges: Bureaucratic hurdles and inadequate support structures within law enforcement can impede the well-being and effectiveness of officers on the ground.

Notable Quotes

• Matt Casey: "You don't get to pick your first responder. It's up to you to have your game plan set because you don't know who you're going to get." [41:07]

• Brenton Tucker: "No good deed goes unpunished." [57:21]

• Matt Casey: "You're clear to engage with weapons." [65:38]

• Matt Casey: "Every day is different. You never have the same day twice, and you're for the most part, your own boss." [38:18]

Final Thoughts

This episode of The Antihero Podcast offers a compelling and honest look into the life of a first responder who has faced the brink of tragedy. Matt Casey's experiences underscore the critical need for systemic changes within law enforcement to better support those who dedicate their lives to protecting others. Through his story, listeners gain valuable insights into the complexities of active shooter situations, the psychological toll on first responders, and the unwavering commitment required to serve effectively.

Transcript

[Tyler]

He has to. I have to know. He feels terrible.

[Brenton]

17 people died. I'm not saying that that guy could have saved them all. He, he couldn't have.

[Matt Casey]

But, but he could have changed the trajectory of. Absolutely. You know, and it, it would have.

[Brenton]

Been a very, it would have been a different story with, with some action.

[Tyler]

Hold on, we're not recording.

[Brenton]

Wanna buy a raffle?

[Tyler]

Do you want to buy a shirt to support military dance? People want to see their sausage get made.

[Brenton]

An appropriate level of inappropriateness. Something happens in my family tonight. The del isn't coming to rescue my, my family, my kids. Like it is first responders that are, that are going to save my family.

[Tyler]

They want the culture to be down. They want people to not want to be cops. And the people that do want to be cops are now walking into the job scared to do the job.

[Brenton]

I'm going to try to act like it didn't happen, although we, we all know it did.

[Tyler]

JV team for life.

[Brenton]

Tyler, how many critical incidents do you think we've so far in this podcast, man?

[Tyler]

At least five, six.

[Brenton]

And they're not going to stop, you know, there's, you cannot stop them all. So they're going to happen. And you really have, you know, two charters of that. Obviously one is to stop them from happening, but since you can't stop them all from happening, you owe it to the people that you protect and depend on you to react to those situations in the most effective and efficient manner. And right now, really, whether, you know, you're a fire department, ems, law enforcement, you're stuck with essentially radios.

[Tyler]

And Apollo is the best way to manage resources during these events because it's designed by first responders for first responders.

[Brenton]

It gives first responders a common operating picture which allows them to see where everybody is in real time, overlaid onto a map to see where they are. You can drop pinpoints and let them know where they need to go. And without constant talking on the radio, everybody knows where the incident is, where it's happening and where they need to be.

[Tyler]

Apollo's an app based application. This is just download and go.

[Brenton]

It's an app and so it works with androids, it works with iPhones.

[Tyler]

Apollo makes sure on the back end everything works and you can just plug and go. They handle all the licensing, all the encryption compliance, all the security. It's all handled by Apollo. It's crucial to know where everyone is and what they are doing in order to effectively control chaos in one of these, either natural disasters or shootings or anything like that.

[Brenton]

So if you want to learn more about Apollo, scan the QR code and ensure your department is ready to react to any crisis in its most effective and efficient manner possible.

[Tyler]

JV team for life.

[Brenton]

They keep their nipples in them, but not much else.

[Tyler]

Yeah, nipples and buttholes, I think, are the only thing that.

[Brenton]

That's where YouTube draws a lot. Nipples and buttholes.

[Tyler]

That and Corey Mills. Welcome back to the Anti Hero podcast. Part Delta Force, part Street Cop. All truth. I'm Tyler, owner of Counterculture Inc. Use promo code Anti Hero at Counterculture Inc. Threads.com and. And get 15% off. The best in counterculture graphics. TE's, stickers, flags, hats, ranger panties, hoodies. You name it, we got it. Even team room flags. So go to Counterculture Inc. Threads.com use promo code Anti Hero and get 15% off.

[Brenton]

And I'm Brenton Tucker, owner of First Responder Coffee and Cigar Company. Use promo code FRCC15. That's FRCC15. To get 15% off. The world's best best coffee and cigars.

[Tyler]

And of course, this episode is brought to you by Human performance. Go to hptrt.com use promo code HERO and get 20% off. Not just your initial purchase of testosterone, but every single order after that. And if you've already given blood work within the last six months, whether it be with the VA or your own doctor, you could submit that blood work to hptrt.com and they'll waive the blood fees analysis. So hptrt.com use promo code HERO and get 20% off your testosterone today.

[Brenton]

You know, I just asked them to up my doses. You did, and they did.

[Tyler]

That means you're getting old.

[Brenton]

No, it means I want a higher number.

[Tyler]

It means I want.

[Brenton]

It means. I mean. Yeah, it means it's summertime. That's what it means.

[Tyler]

Some guy named Chavez in the alley. He's adding the supplements to my hptrt.

[Brenton]

And don't forget our Patreon. Please use our Patreon to support us. It helps keep the lights on, pays the bills, and helps support Drew over there. The you get inside information look. Look into episodes, discounts, forums, directs, messaging to us. You name it. There's a list of things that our Patreon allows you. And we still believe it'd be the most affordable Patreon on the market. When with. With two different price points to entry. So please consider supporting us on Patreon. And don't forget our Thursday Night Live squadcast every Thursday night, 8pm to 10pm Eastern. It's for the boys. It's the highlight of our week.

[Tyler]

Yeah. Squad cast is where we give away the Patreon gifts every week. So join us on the squad cast. Join us on the Patreon. Sign up for a weekly straight hooligan giveaway. We give away awesome things from all of our sponsors, so it's a good time.

[Brenton]

And every time we give something away, they get something worth a year or two sometimes of. Of. Of what it costs to be on the Patreon.

[Tyler]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. For the price of Patreon, the get the gifts we give.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

What's a cask?

[Brenton]

A cask is essentially a barrel.

[Tyler]

Okay. Yeah, I've heard you say it three times. I'm. I got to ask. At some point, somebody will be too late.

[Brenton]

Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's. It's a barrel. A cask, wooden barrel.

[Tyler]

Also a question.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

When they drill in, the drill and they pull it out and you do the glass, how do they fill the hole back up?

[Brenton]

It's a little wooden peg and they hammer it back in.

[Tyler]

Okay.

[Brenton]

Yeah, if, if, if. So they'll do that to. To test the barrel of sorts, and they can do that several times throughout, you know, a barrel's aging process. So if you note. But once they hammer that thing in, it looks pretty close. So you. You wouldn't even know it unless you're looking for. But if you're looking for it, you'll. You'll find them on barrels.

[Tyler]

Okay. Yeah. I asked because Brent's opening a bourbon line.

[Brenton]

Yes.

[Tyler]

First responders, cast company.

[Brenton]

Yes.

[Tyler]

And at some point, I gotta ask what a cask is.

[Brenton]

Fair enough. The. This episode, it's. It's been asked for several times. It's. It's near and dear to our hearts because it happened here in Florida. It is not forgotten. With us is Matt Casey right off the bat. He was a Navy corpsman, served 15 years in law enforcement, but he was also a first responder at the Marjory Stoneman Douglas school shooting, sometimes known as what, Parkland School, what they call that as well.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, it was in the. In the city of Parkland.

[Brenton]

Right. And that happened February 14, 2018, and 17 people lost their life that day and 18 wounded. So it's. It's not an event we should ever forget. And like anything else, it's event to talk about and hear the. Hear the great things you guys did, but also hear, you know, a look back and see if there was anything you could have done better. And for the listeners, they can learn from that and move forward. But thanks thanks so much. Making the drive down here and talking to us about what's probably your worst day at work.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, I think I would say so.

[Brenton]

Yeah. So we don't take that lightly. So, so I really appreciate that right off the bat. And you, you responded that as, as a medic.

[Matt Casey]

I was, I was the medic on our SWAT team.

[Brenton]

You're the medic on your SWAT team.

[Matt Casey]

It was a mutual aid response.

[Brenton]

So you, but you already had a background that and a solid background because we're talking about that before the podcast. As a Navy veteran, you were a Navy corpsman.

[Matt Casey]

That's correct, yes, sir.

[Brenton]

So what, what year did you join?

[Matt Casey]

I joined 2001. Well, I, I went into the delayed entry program for one month and not very delayed. No, not very well. I don't know if the, I don't know what the recruiter, I don't know if it was a ploy to get me, but I dropped out of high school. So I, I, I wanted to be a Marine my whole life.

[Brenton]

Good for you.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. School, I dropped out and I, my whole life was Marine. My dad was a Marine. He was an Anglican Marine back in the 80s and my grandfather was a Marine in Vietnam. And that was what I wanted to do. I had no doubt in my mind my whole life. And when I dropped out, I turned 18. Would have been my senior year. I went to the Marine Corps recruiter's office and I felt like a complete piece of shit because they looked at me and they're like, you quit the easiest job you ever had. What makes you think you're not going to quit boot camping or be a shitbag Marine?

[Brenton]

I quit it for you.

[Tyler]

Yeah, right.

[Matt Casey]

I did this for you. And they, I mean, they pretty much knife handed me and said, there's the door. And I, I walked out of there defeated.

[Tyler]

I, I had, what were they supposed to do? What were you supposed to do?

[Matt Casey]

I would have had to have my ged.

[Tyler]

Oh, you, oh, high school.

[Matt Casey]

Okay. And it just, I don't know, I went into a couple months into, because I, I turned 18 in August and so I went into what would have been my senior year just eating, not doing anything.

[Tyler]

And then September hit and they're like, what's that guy's number?

[Matt Casey]

Can we help you? But yeah, I, I, and you know, born and raised in Florida in true Florida man fashion. I was actually reading the newspaper and I, I was, I saw an ad at a Seminole Indian reservation in Hollywood, Florida. They had a, it's, it's not there anymore. The the place, but they had a wildlife farm.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

And they were, they were looking for alligator wrestlers. And I mean, this was a fork in the road, right? Like, go and be an alligator wrestler making $5 an hour or figures. Figure it out. And the, the Navy recruiter called me and I, I went to cut him off. I was like, look, I, I dropped out. I'm not, you know, I can't join. And he's like, oh, wait a minute.

[Tyler]

There'S a waiver for everything, son.

[Matt Casey]

Come on down.

[Brenton]

That's right.

[Matt Casey]

So I, I went down and was speaking to the recruiter and he said that, yeah, we'll take high school dropouts. We'll give you a chance to do it, the GED in boot camp and.

[Brenton]

Oh, you do it. Oh, they'll allow you to do it in boot camp.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, in boot camp, actually. And kind of like a lot of work. Well, it was, it was unique too, because the, the whole, my whole division was high school dropouts, so. So when you, you know, when you.

[Brenton]

Do this story more and more, by.

[Matt Casey]

The way, when you do the math and you got, you got, you know, 80 something kids, you know, you know, the black kids were from the inner city. They were from either New York or Chicago or la. And then, you know, a lot of the Spanish kids were, you know, Puerto Rican from New York or from, you know, southern la. Mexican. And then the white kids were all from West Virginia, Kentucky. And then there's me from South Florida. It was like a, you know, a melting pot. So, yeah, I went in there. It wasn't a problem for me. But the first two weeks in boot camp was. It was like a prison, you know, it was, you know, they clicked up. Yeah, it was.

[Brenton]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And it was, you know, all the kids were from the roughest neighborhoods, but in the Navy. Yeah, well, because we were all high school dropouts, so you know, just.

[Brenton]

That's gotta be the roughest.

[Tyler]

Like the jewelry portion.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, that's right. You know, we were, you know, it was funny, like when we classed up the, you know, they were calling out everybody's name alphabetically to go to their assigned divisions and they, you know, they skip over the C, they go through the Cs and move on to Ds. And I'm still standing there like, you know, you don't want to say anything, but next thing you know, you start looking and there's onesies, twosies in the Alphabet that are waiting to go find a division. And then this, this petty officer walks in that our division commander, and he Just looked like he was taken. Taken responsibility for the Bad news, Bad News Bears, you know, and he's like, all right, you. You fucks are with us. And, you know, so we all you.

[Brenton]

Waterheads, get over here.

[Matt Casey]

It was, you know, it was a. It was a culture shock, but, yeah. But. Yeah. So I was at the recruiter's office, and they. They gave me a list of jobs to choose from. I had no desire to be in the Navy. I didn't want to be. I knew Top Gun and Navy seals, and that was the only thing I knew were Navy, and I didn't want to be on a submarine. I said, I want to. I want to play with guns. And they tried to get me into some other job. Aviation. Aviation ordinance, man. And another recruiter was like, oh, why don't, you know, corpsman, you know? And I. My grandfather drove me down there. I said, here's the jobs they're offering me. And he said, you know, being a Vietnam Marine, he's like, that's the closest you'll ever get to being Marine.

[Tyler]

But were the Marines just doing that because they were being assholes or it was their policy that you have to. Because I thought all policies were DOD wide.

[Brenton]

Right. Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Well, I didn't have the. The GED at the time.

[Brenton]

But do they have a program where you could get a GED in basic as well? They didn't have a Marine Corps program, no.

[Matt Casey]

No.

[Tyler]

So it was a program specifically to.

[Matt Casey]

Get you the ged? Yeah, it was. It was a Navy thing because I talked to the army recruiter, too, and it was like, hey, cool, but get your GED and then come.

[Tyler]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Matt Casey]

But I was. I was having a pity party at 18, and, you know, but, you know, one door opens, one door closes, another one opens. And it was, you know, you know, it just set me up for, you know, the rest of my life down the road.

[Tyler]

I got turned down by the Marines, too.

[Brenton]

Did you?

[Tyler]

Yeah. In. In high school, I got this badass tribal tattoo, and it goes up on your neck. And they were like, your tattoos can't show outside of your pt, so you can't join the Marines. And I was like, this is like 2006 Marine. I was like, I thought you guys were hard.

[Brenton]

Yeah, that little finger of a tattoo.

[Tyler]

And then the army was like, come on over here.

[Brenton]

You know, we were talking before the podcast, and it's. And it's. It's just. It's so true. You know, the. So the Marines don't have medics, and that's why? That's why they need Navy corpsmen. Correct. I mean, they have. The Marines have no medics.

[Matt Casey]

No, the, you know, their department of the Navy, the men's department, but they're the department of the Navy.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

And they rely on all medical through Navy medicine. Yeah.

[Brenton]

And you would think the, like the corpsman being Navy, attached to the Marines would just get a bunch of shit, you know, to have, you know, the Navy guy. And you'd have to. And I'm sure you still had to, you know, earn. Earn your own respect in your own. Right. But there's something that the, the corpsman did before you to set the standard. And the schoolhouse clearly maintains that standard, that Marines love their corpsmen. Yeah, they love their corpsmen. And across the military, Navy corpsmen are regarded as damn good medics.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, they, they take care of us. I mean, it is, you know, it's one of those things that when the bullets start flying, they're, they're, they're glad you're there. And we're kind of, we, we play babysitter, too. I mean, anytime aboard. Aboard Marine is a dangerous Marine. So a lot of times, you know, it's, it's Doc, kind of like, hey, stop. You know, if you, if you're in the field and you see six Marines huddled around something, you better go investigate. They're with something, you know, they're poking a rattlesnake or some. But, but yeah, no, it's, it's, it's really one of those things that you, you get a little bit of that. It's not even hazing, but you get some of that Navy talk. But at the end of the day, you're, I mean, they take that Eagle, Globe, Eagle, Globe and Anchor series. You know, it's like, you know, the seals have their Trident, you know, the, the Marines have their EGA for their whole branch. And. Yeah, we wear their uniform, you know, and we're the only branch that wears the Marine Corps uniform. And the only job that, that we thought about that.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

You train. Do you, do you train with them or do you just deploy with them?

[Matt Casey]

No, we. So you have a, you have a path when you become a corpsman. And you can either be fmf, which is Fleet Marine Force, or you could be big Blue Navy, like the hospitals, hospitals, ships, you know, being a dean attached to anywhere in the Navy. But the green side, when you go with the Marines, you are held to their standard, you know, and they don't, you know, they don't compromise Marine. And that's the one thing Marines with the recruiting standards, they don't, you know, they don't compromise.

[Tyler]

But are you, like, stationed with them?

[Matt Casey]

Yes. Yes.

[Tyler]

Do you have like a, like a corpsman unit?

[Matt Casey]

So it depends. So you have, you have big units like, like med battalion. You could be assigned to med battalion, and there's a bunch of Navy corpsmen there. And. But you're part of the med battalion, but you could be assigned to a rifle company and be a medic embedded with an infantry unit. And you're the only Navy guy there. And you're, you're doing everything that they're doing, and it's 365, 100. Yeah.

[Tyler]

Your paperwork just gets routed to that.

[Matt Casey]

Battalion and it's, you know, and that, and that's where it's at. You know, it's where they, you earn a lot of respect for them because you're chewing the same shit they're chewing. You know, you're going on their humps. You're, you're doing everything to, to their standard. And they, you know, you can wear their. Every uniform they have, but, like the dress blues.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, you can wear their dress greens, their, their alphas, but, you know, the only uniform you can't wear.

[Tyler]

Best thing they have.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, right.

[Brenton]

The. Now in, in your MOS phase. But what does the Navy call it? Your, your rate or your. Yeah, your advanced individual training. What do you want to call it?

[Matt Casey]

So you have your rate. The rate is hospital corpsman.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

And then within that, you have NEC classifications, Naval Enlisted Code classification. So when you graduate boot camp, you go to. Everything's changed now because it used to be all, you know, they streamlined it so everything I think is now in Texas. But you go through Navy boot camp in Chicago, and then across the street is your basic corpsman school.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

Where you go and you. After that, you earn the designation. It's a hospital corpsman. And it's quad. Zero is okay, you know, four zeros. You're just a general duty hospital corpsman. While you're there, depending on your test scores, you get to bid for advanced training. So I, I wanted to go with the Marines, so I took the 8404 route, which is FMF Marine. And they allowed us. This is where my, my career kind of took a. Because it was pre 9 11, and being a high school dropout, I'm like, I need to maximize as much education that I need to suck the Navy dry for everything I can. So I'm like, I'll take a specialty school on top of that. So I went into the pipeline. So it was Basic Corpsman School, fmf, fmss, which is Field Medical Service School, where they changed it now to field Med Training Battalion or something. And then I was like, let me take pharmacy and do inpatient pharmacy, you know, to better myself when I get out.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And that was the nail in my coffin for my career. It was like, why is that purgatory? Because now they're.

[Brenton]

Did you pass?

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

Oh, you got that identifier now.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And now you're pigeonholed.

[Tyler]

We don't want to lace this guy on the line. Yeah, he's special trained.

[Matt Casey]

I'm in. I'm in Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, going through. So I went through the. The field medical training part, and that's like the mini indoc to the Marine Corps.

[Brenton]

No good deed goes unpunished.

[Matt Casey]

Exactly, exactly. So I'm in North Carolina now. It's August 2001. And I got to say, being from Florida, man, North Carolina is like the armpit of America. That is one hot state. Yeah, it's here. We get the breeze there. It's just death. But I'm up there. I'm going through my indoc with the Marine Corps. It's like our. You know, that's where we get our. Issued the Marine Corps uniforms. And we're. We're learning to operate and integrate with Marines. And 911 happens. And that changed the pulse of everything. I was like, hey, I want to drop this pharmacy tech thing, because my next. My next step in the pipeline was Virginia, to go through the school, which is a long school, and the Navy, you know, what school is that? The pharmacy technicians school. And it was. It was a pretty long school. It was like six month additional training course. And the Navy was like, nope, you're going. And I'm like, I got dudes in my. My class with me that are getting orders to go to the mew, getting orders to go with division. And I'm like, fuck, man, I'm gonna miss out on the show, you know, and that. You know, that sucked. And that just segued into the rest of my enlistment, where I was fighting to find a spot to do something that was relevant because everything was. It was just stateside, boring duty. And every opportunity I got to either do a TDY and go out and do training, I. I mean, I was beg, borrowing, and stealing to. To go places. Yeah. And I got to do some cool stuff stateside. And I ultimately ended up in Washington State, north of Fort Lewis. There's a Big Navy base up there, and there's a Marine Corps security force company. I kind of was like, knocking on the door like, hey, I'm a stray cat. Will you take me in? You know, anything. Sub Base Banger, the big submarine base in Washington State. It's north of Fort Lewis on the peninsula. So I. I got to go out and play with them. Anytime they went down to. They went. They use Fort Lewis for the range days. So anytime they needed to, because they didn't have a corpsman assigned to them. So, okay, I went out on my own time, did a med support with them. I would, you know, when they would do shipboard tactics for their HVT stuff, I would be the bad guy and get lit up with SIM rounds just to, you know, get. Yeah, just. Just to get out of the hospital.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

But my good buddy of mine ended up. Ended up getting orders, and he left the hospital and deployed with the Marines in the big push in Fallujah. When the Marines went and did that, and he came back and I'll, you know, self. Admittedly, it was like a little bit of jealousy too, because, you know, he come. He came back and he did some.

[Brenton]

Work there, didn't he?

[Matt Casey]

I mean, he was. He was on the COVID of, I think the Navy Times or the Marine Corps Times, treating a tanker for an injury. And, you know, I'm like, I'm gonna sit here and do my whole enlistment and not do anything. And when it came time to reenlist, they came to me and they're the Navy counselor. Like, the retention recruiter was like, here's where you can go. And everything was just stateside or overseas hospital. And I'm like, I want to go fmf. And it was no needs in the Navy.

[Brenton]

All because of the pharmacy training.

[Matt Casey]

All because of the fucking pharmacy training.

[Tyler]

Yeah, that's smart. I mean, you thought like, JV team for life. Oh, the boys over at Ghostbed did it again. They lowered everything on their website more than half the cost. Now you're going to get even more savings because they took each item, they lowered it more than half, and then they're still given anti hero 10 off. So it used to be 50% off. And then they were like, hey, we're just going to cut our prices down. So now when you go on the website, Anti Hero promo code antihero will give you 10 off. Ridiculously reduced [e-mail]. so go to ghostped.com forward/antihero and get 10% off the extremely reduced prices. These guys are awesome these guys have been. They were our first sponsor. I talk with them all the time. They're big supporters in what we do, what we stand for. Just like all the other podcasts that they, that they help out and they support. If it's, if you got to replace a mattress in the house, if you got to buy new sheets, if you got to buy a new pillow, go with Ghostbed because you're going to save money. And they help us out so much. They're part of the Anti Hero family, just like me and just like you are. Ghostbed.com Anti Hero or use promo code antihero at checkout and get 10% off your order. As you guys know, we drink way too many energy drinks on the Anti Hero podcast. That's why we partnered with Tasty gains in this one container of 30 gummies is over 100 cans of pre workout. This is our new replacement for energy drinks. It's a lot more convenient. Obviously energy drinks you have to keep cold. They taste like shit warm. I keep these in my gym bag and in my, my, my duffel at work with all my meals in it. And it's just, I mean it's bright colors. You see it, you take it right before your workout. It's perfect. These things taste like candy, so be careful. Listen guys, we wouldn't be suggesting things that we don't recommend and take ourselves like the creatine gummies. No one really knows how creatine works. It's the most confusing thing in the world, but yet it's the safest supplement to take and the most effective supplement. Creatine helps your endurance levels and it helps traumatically with recovery. Creatine, though is powdery and tastes like and really annoying to when you're loading it and have to do all this stuff and mix it in your water and then of course, if your water is not warm, then it doesn't mix well. These things are the definition of convenience right there. Bright colors, put them in your gym bag, put them in your lunchbox. Creatine gummies. This one's blue raspberry. I prefer the. My favorite's the strawberry creamsicle. These are a no brainer. Tasty Gains is a no brainer. Pre workout and creatine. The things you need to lift and get big. Go to tastygains.com use promo code anti hero and get 20 off your order. JV team for life. Yeah, you were smart. No one at that age was like, I need to get something for when I get out.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. Because I Mean, this was again, pre 9 11, so there was no wars going on. So I'm thinking, you know, I'm a high school dropout, I need to better myself. And I had no clue where I was going to end up, so I was like, hey, let me, you know, and, and it taught me to also going through these pipelines like basic corpsman school, the field med school, and then the pharmacy technician school. The cutting scores to pass a test are high, 80% is passing. So, you know, I'm used to high school where you can put the bare minimum in what I'm like 65. Yeah. You know, I'm like, I got a 72. That's a C. And the Navy's like, no, no. So it's 80 and above. So that, that taught me to be a better student. And ultimately, you know, I teach now. So that taught me to be, you know, a better student and a better teacher. But when it came time to get out, I couldn't reenlist and do another four years at a hospital.

[Brenton]

I do. And actually I feel like the pendulum really is swinging because just make it up. Five, ten years ago, there was just a huge push for college. Right. Like if you didn't go to college, you're wasting your life, you're wasting opportunity. A bunch of people went to college and a bunch of people got out of college and did not get rewarded for college. And you know, I'm a, I'm a big advocate that schooling does not equal intelligence.

[Tyler]

It just talks about qualifications. Like when they require. Me and you, we kind of debated like the four year degree versus two years experience. Like when you're applying for an agency, like a local law enforcement agency and they require four year college degree or two years experience. And he was saying, correct me if I'm wrong, but like the, the what you get in that two years is so much more.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

Well, college, college equals knowledge, not intelligence.

[Tyler]

You know, but also college equals commitment.

[Matt Casey]

Right.

[Tyler]

And you finish that was my only.

[Brenton]

Argument there is that part of it, and I do agree with that. But, but you got to dig into that a little bit deeper. Right. Like what, what did they really go there for? What did they accomplish? Because there's a lot of people that went to college. Yeah, they, they finished that commitment, but it, they didn't. Yeah. But also parted off. Yeah. What was their gpa? What, what was their major? You know.

[Matt Casey]

Well, you can dig into that a.

[Brenton]

Little bit more and find out.

[Matt Casey]

Even now, though, it's, it's, I would say it's even less because now with chat, BT and AI, Is it cheating? You know? Well, I mean, you know, yeah, it's not cheating if you're. If you're. If you're not getting caught. But. But, you know, it's. I think, you know, there's a less effort into it today, but I would say ex. Personally, I think experience would trump. Would trump that in most cases. But, you know, it's.

[Brenton]

It's a weird topic to talk about. Hop on that for a second. Well, you know, is. Is that. Is it cheating? Well, I. I don't know like it chat. We said I used to have to go to encyclopedias, you know, to get your. Your information and do that research. That's why you had to know it, because things weren't readily available to you. But now that you have chat, that information is readily available to you. Do you really have to go to these places to learn something when you can just whip out your phone and know it when you need it?

[Matt Casey]

No.

[Tyler]

When were you told you're not gonna have a calculator in your pocket? Right now I do.

[Matt Casey]

Well, I mean, it's like, you know, map reading. I mean, I remember going on road trips, having to get a. AAA map and read a map to figure out where I'm going. And now you got it in your phone. So I guess it's not cheating. It's a good argument.

[Brenton]

At the end of the day, things are changing.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

You know, you have to deal with that.

[Matt Casey]

True. Yeah.

[Brenton]

The. When. When you got out, then what did you. Did, you know, you wanted to go to law enforcement when you got out?

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. So, you know, my best friend. So growing up, my best friend, I knew him since kindergarten. Like, we had that bond, that true friendship that went all the way to the end till he passed. And he was a. He's. He went into law enforcement, in my opinion, too early. But, you know, again, how old? 19. You know, we've talked about that on.

[Brenton]

The show before, too.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. So he. He got in like I. After. You know, after my high school adventure, I went in the military. He graduated, and he knew he always wanted to be a cop, and he did the police explorers and everything. So he got in and he was with a different Indian reservation down there. He was with the Miccosukee Indians, and that's kind of cowboys and Indians out there. It's the Wild west, you know, he would work out in alligator alley and no man's land, and I call him towards the end of my enlistment and I, you know, wished him a Merry Christmas. I was working nights at the hospital and I hear his radio in the background and I'm like, oh, that you got stuck working too. He's like, yeah, but it's cool. I'm getting double time. And I'm like, what the is double time? Like, you're getting paid for this. I'm like, what? He goes, oh, yeah, man, I'm making good money. Yeah. You know, yeah, they pay us extra when we work on holidays. I'm like, what?

[Brenton]

So matter how much you work, you get the same paycheck every two weeks.

[Matt Casey]

I'm like, okay. So he's like, hey, come down and do a ride along. So I, I took some leave and went back, went back home and did a ride along with him. And I mean, the most benign, you know, call traffic stop got me hooked instantly. You know, it was that adrenaline rush. It was, it was nothing, you know, it was nothing sexy, nothing glamorous, but it was him, you know, sitting in the median and he got a car on his radar going 113. And to take a Crown Vic. Sorry about that. But take, take a Crown Vic from a sitting position to catch up to a BMW going 100 Millennium. Oh, man, I'm like hooked right. Right then and there was. I was like, this is awesome. So I'm like, I'm done. You know, this is, you know, this is it. I'm not reenlisting. I'm getting out. And being a cop, you know, this was like the coolest in the world.

[Brenton]

We came back home to South Florida to, To do that.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, Yeah. I was born and raised in Broward and I, you know, I want to come home, come back to, you know, back to this area. And this was, you know, I was familiar with it and I wanted to serve down here. Here.

[Brenton]

How was that? What, what year is this that you're looking to get hired?

[Matt Casey]

I got out in 2005 and I started dropping applications to police departments in late 2005.

[Brenton]

How, how difficult was it to get onto a police department at that time?

[Matt Casey]

Not difficult. It was, you know, it was during that still that honeymoon phase with 9 11. So a lot of departments had grant money. A lot of, you know, it was still fresh and a lot.

[Tyler]

It was right before the economic crisis.

[Brenton]

Oh, and that's true too.

[Matt Casey]

Yes. Yeah. Cuz 2006, 2008 is when that, that, that happened and things were getting hard. Yeah, it was, it was a sweet spot. It was, it really, it really was a sweet spot to get in.

[Brenton]

So that was, you said it was what, 2008, 2005.

[Matt Casey]

I got out and started applying. 2006. Early 06. I was in the academy.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

Did. We'll get to 2018 here in just a second. But when you were talking about it, I'm still one. The pharmacy thing was, was that. Did that come to be a benefit to you later or were you like, you know what, it just never worked out.

[Matt Casey]

No, no, no. And that's. And that's the thing, you know, you have so many.

[Brenton]

Because a lot of knowledge that you still got from.

[Matt Casey]

And it still plays into effect right now. You know, I'm a dad. I have two kids. Like, I could sit there and look at, you know, I know dosage calculations. I can look at medicine and, you know, tell you what interacts with this, what interacts with that. It worked on the road as a cop too. You know, we, you know, during that time we had a lot of pill mills. Oxy was a huge problem down in South Florida at that time. So it really helped and it still helps. You know, that's is.

[Brenton]

And that's, that's really. I'm glad, I'm glad to hear that because that's the point I want to make is life is fantastic. Funny like that, you know, and when you're young and you want something so bad it doesn't work out for you, you have no patience, you know. Yeah. But you get to look back as an older person in life and you're like, you know what? Everything does happen for a reason. Like, there is a plan for everything. And we said it before on the podcast, if something in life happens and it wasn't what you wanted it to be, if you handle that correctly, it will be a blessing in the end.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, 100.

[Brenton]

You know, it's all about how you handle those, those bumps in the road, but you end up going to it. You sucked it up for six months. You had to pay the penance for bettering your career. But it did become a benefit at the end. I love to hear that.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

I mean.

[Matt Casey]

And I ultimately got what I wanted. When I got out, I became a police officer. Well, I was in the academy and the phone rang again. It was a Navy recruiter again. And they were like, hey, you want to come back and go in the reserves? And I'm like, no, I'm in the academy. I'm doing my thing. And she was like, well, it's a twenty thousand dollar bonus. And I'm like, say less. I'm listening, I'm listening. So I'm like, look, I'LL be honest with you, I don't want to do this blue shot, the blue side Navy thing. And she's like, well, good for you. Is down in South Florida. The Marines have a base down in Hialeah Reserve Base. It's a tow missile company. And then, you know, there's also a naval construction battalion down there with the CBs. Which I was like, okay, well, I mean, that's better. But yeah, so I was like, okay, cool. And I went in the reserves while I was in the academy. I was doing my one weekend a month while in the academy. I graduate, I did my year on the road, and right before my probation was up, I had the opportunity and I told him I got deployed, but I volunteered and, you know, gave him my orders. And I. Right after my first year, I ended up activating and going with an active duty unit and getting to go to Iraq. And I felt like at that point my military career was fulfilled.

[Tyler]

Yeah, yeah, that's. There's an actual study about guys who join to go to war and don't ever get to see war, but their intention was go to war and they have, you know, like.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, I mean, that was me. I. I'll be honest. I did not want to have grandkids and sit there and, you know, this was nine. Eleven was our Pearl harbor.

[Brenton]

Get it?

[Matt Casey]

And I really didn't want to say, you know, Yeah, I made IVs for pregnant women or chemo patients in, you know, in Washington State. And what I did, you know, I'm proud of what I did, and if that's all I did, great. But I felt like something was missing and I wanted to do more. And, you know, I got my chance and I had a great deployment. And, you know, I don't know what to call it.

[Brenton]

But, yeah, you would not be the first person to have that story. Luckily, you got to scratch that itch. But when someone wants to go so bad because they. They joined and they wanted to do something, there was wars going on. It's almost. Gosh, no. Traumatic stress disorder, you know, that you call. Yeah. Like, it bugs them. It bugs them that they did not get a chance to serve. And I love how you, how you framed it. That's exactly how I framed a lot of my decision making in the military was I don't want to be an old man and look at my grandkids and be like, daddy, what was war like? You were in the military. I don't know. Daddy never. Yeah, Daddy never did anything.

[Matt Casey]

Never went like, that's that was, that was, you know, that would have been a huge regret for me and, and being able to at least, you know, get that opportunity. Now I'm like, there's things that I regret that I was like, I wish I would have done this, but I'm, I'm happy that I was able to, you know, say I, I went there, I got the T shirt, and, you know, I could close that door in my life and I'm happy with it.

[Brenton]

The other, the other reality is enough is never enough. Yeah. You know, you'd have got to do that earlier. And you're always hoping for one more.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, no, you're, you're, you're chasing that.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

You know, you're chasing the tail and, you know, you're never going to catch it.

[Tyler]

So you went to Iraq.

[Matt Casey]

Yes. Yeah.

[Tyler]

And then naturally, just like we're talking about, you're like, I wonder what Afghanistan.

[Matt Casey]

And that, you know, it's like you hear the things, it's two different, you know, you know, most of Iraq is all mountain, you know, urban and, you know, you're hearing the stories about Afghanistan because I, I wasn't, I wasn't worried about ever getting shot in Iraq, you know, it was all IEDs.

[Tyler]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

But, you know, Afghanistan, whole different, you know, whole different ball game, you know, and yeah, you know, so you're sitting there like, yeah, I wonder if I can get, you know, orders to go over there. But yeah, no, Iraq was a, that was an interesting place.

[Brenton]

What, what your, would your cop career look like leading up to 2018? You know, you're on the patrol. Officer. Patrol officer. The. Well, at some point you were a medic for the SWAT team.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

So what that career look like leading up?

[Matt Casey]

When I got back from Iraq, I honestly didn't have a ambition to be on swat. Like, you know, I wanted to learn the job because I left a year. You know, I went to Iraq with only one year law enforcement under my belt. So I, I didn't know about, you know, I was like, I didn't know anything. And when I got back, I was approached to be on the SWAT team and be the medic. There were. We never had a medic. And as far as I know, in the county, that's crazy. All the medics in the county were. All the departments that had medics use fire rescue.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

And yep, there's departments that don't have medics, but, you know, they're like, hey, we kind of got a unique opportunity here. So, yeah, you know, I was asked and I was like, yeah, sure. And so I did that, got on, got onto SWAT early in my career. But for the vast majority of my career, all the way up until the end, I was road patrol. I, I think road patrol is the best kept secret in law enforcement. It's, you know, it's one of those things where every day is different. You know, you, you never have the same day twice and you're for the most part, your own boss. You know, you don't have somebody walking by your desk looking at what you're doing. You're out there and you're, you're, you could be either as proactive or as reactive you want to be. You're having a shitty day. You can be, react. If you were, if you're out there and you're like, I want to go get it. You could be proactive. And it was really the best kept secret. And I did that for pretty much my whole career. So leading up to, leading up to 2018, it was a road patrol officer and I was a field training officer fto. So that was my big passion was teaching. And that's what I was doing all the way up to that.

[Tyler]

And results may vary, huh?

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

You know, I say this as an outsider, you know, looking in to go, you know, train SWAT teams and, you know, going to the street cop conference here, third year in a row. Fact over the past couple years there's been this kind of resurgence of, of, of pride to be a street cop. You know, it used to be like, I'm just a street cop. Like, yeah, I'm, I'm a street cop. There's. They do get to do like, like I said, they're. You say it's the best, you know, kept secret, but I mean, the, the secret's kind of, kind of out. You know, this, especially with all these, you know. Well, of course we're going to talk about msd and you know, SWAT teams reacted to it, but street cops are the first ones on, on scene. They're the ones chasing down bad guys, you know, and in bad places every night.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, they're, I mean, they're. And that's what I try to hammer hone. And when I, when I do my teachings now through my company is you don't get to pick your first responder. You know, it's not the SWAT team that's coming. You know, it's up to you to have your game plan set because you don't know who you're going to get. You know, you can either get that motivator that that. That guy that's. That's hungry for work. Or you could get the dude that is close to retirement and doesn't want to do anything, but, you know, rope patrol is. Is you. Those are the guys that are out there that are going to be the first on scene, and they're the ones that, you know, are.

[Brenton]

Yeah, I say that, and I see Tyler going, maybe. Results may vary. And as always, it seems like the common denominator of whether they're happy with their job and what they're doing or not has to do with the department they work for.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, 100%.

[Tyler]

Yeah. I mean, this is times. Two times. So you retired 20. 20.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

And you had how many years on the road? 15.

[Matt Casey]

15.

[Tyler]

Okay. So just being real, you're not gonna get messed up with from admin as much as a new kid coming through.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, no. 100.

[Tyler]

We have. We have guys that are ftos that are like. They're road dogs. And they're like, he ain't driving my car. And they're like, yeah, that's fine. And I'll be like, yeah, he's training. Ain't driving my car. They're like, shut the up. He's driving the car.

[Matt Casey]

It's just.

[Tyler]

It is what it is. Like, the more. Because they know how valuable of an asset you are. As soon as you go, you know what I want out of this district, I'm going somewhere else.

[Matt Casey]

No.

[Tyler]

So I feel like it's. When spending too much time on the road also depends on your call volume.

[Matt Casey]

So if 100.

[Tyler]

If you're getting maxed out. Toned out. Toned out. And then shift ends about five years is where you start, like, getting the burnout phase, because you start treating people differently. When you call for your burglarized studio, it's the worst day of your year, probably, right. And I show up. It's my third of the day. Maybe. It's definitely. I have. But I know how it's gonna go. I'm like, go ahead, fill out the statement. I have no more compassion for you because I'm just so. We call that jaded.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

I have no compassion.

[Matt Casey]

That you just callous at this point.

[Tyler]

Insurance is going to cover it. Let's just get this process. Oh, you're probably not even gonna press charges. Are you, like, that cynical? And I just don't think you. If you get burnout, you start not being able to help that. You have to, like, really stay centered.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

And tell yourself, yeah, you got to.

[Brenton]

Find a way to take it. Hit that reset Button.

[Matt Casey]

Well, for me, that was. I was able to. Being a training officer, I didn't have. When I had a. When I had a rookie, I couldn't. I couldn't fall back. Like, I couldn't. I couldn't get into that, you know, grouchy officer phase. Like, I had to. To set the example.

[Brenton]

Yeah, well, you could, but you chose not.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. Yeah. It's very easy. Yeah. And I would teach at the academy, too, as an adjunct part time. Okay. You know, so it was. It was one of those things. I looked at it like this, this, you know, kid, you know, young. Young male or woman is going to be an investment. And, you know, good for you. It. You. You try to channel that energy there. But, you know, but I. I know exactly what you're talking about because there's. There. There's times where you're just rolling your eyes and you're like, this is just a waste of time, you know, and. And like you said, it's. It's that person's worst day of their life, but for you, it's just. It's more paperwork.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, it's like, it's the reason.

[Tyler]

Why you're not going to lunch at 12. You're going to lunch at 1pm yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And. And. And that. That kind of segues into when I started realizing, like, about PTSD was on certain calls where it was like, you know, I just had no empathy. You know, I was. I was.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, it was just an obstacle to get to the next thing, you know?

[Brenton]

Yeah. And I mean. And again, it's easier for me to do either one of your jobs, you know, but. But everyone's gonna, I'd imagine, agree that. But it's. It's. I don't know how you find it, but you have to have, you know, you have to find a way to find that empathy, you know, to some degree. And, you know. And you're a public servant. Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

No, you sometimes have to go back to figure out why you did this in the first place. You know, and a lot of it is. You have to have an outlet, too. You know, I talked to a lot of young cops. You know, there's a. You know, when I went through the police academy, each region taught their own thing. Now it's streamlined. Every. You know, what somebody's learning in Ocala is the same book that they're learning down south. And they added things in there. They. They added a chapter with dealing with veterans, you know, because that's a new. That's a new Thing. And they added stress management was one. Like, we didn't have stress management when I went to the academy, you know, but that's like. Talking to these guys is like, you got to find something outside of this, because it becomes an identity. It's some point.

[Tyler]

And it's like the best street cops, the ones running a gun, and that's their identity.

[Brenton]

That's right.

[Tyler]

And then they get frustrated when they get railroaded seven years in, they're like, I've given you everything. I've given you my kids birthdays, I've given you holidays, I've given you injuries. I've given you everything. And you're gonna do this to me? And they're like, you're numbered 347, right?

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

Get out of my office.

[Matt Casey]

Yep.

[Tyler]

Three, four, eight. Come on in.

[Matt Casey]

No. And that's. That's a. That's where my love for law enforcement hit the brick wall. Because the moment that I said that I needed help, they. On me.

[Tyler]

Oh, really?

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. I mean, and it was, you know, after Stoneman Douglas, it was the minute that I was like, hey, man, something's going on and I need help. It was like, no, you. You know, and I'm like, are you kidding me?

[Brenton]

Like, you know, let's get into that.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

I mean, you can talk about, like, the. The. Because, you know, well, chronologically, like, you know, how that. How that affected you.

[Matt Casey]

Well, so, like, my. You know, my story is, you know, in. In that time frame as being a cop, you know, I was on swat. I was a training officer, road patrol. I got into a shooting in 2000 and 2009, 2010, I got into a shooting, clean cut, as perfect shooting as you can. As you can, you know, picture. It was at a. At a casino. So everything's on video and there's no, you know, it was before all this coming out in the news. So it was.

[Brenton]

Paint that picture for us, if you don't mind. You know, what happened on your. On your os.

[Matt Casey]

So I was working off duty detail at a casino.

[Tyler]

Just trying to make extra money.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and this is funny. It's like. And again, I. I try to. What's the word I'm looking for? Self Reflect on everything to break it down, what went right, what went wrong. Things I could have changed. But leading up to that shooting, I. I went from hero, you know, doing the right thing. But it could. I could have easily fucked myself because I left my detail, Some of our street crimes cops got into a foot chase a couple blocks away. And now that detail hires you to. To be there for their security. And I leave to go.

[Brenton]

Be proactive.

[Matt Casey]

To go.

[Tyler]

It's almost like you're lucky there was a shooting.

[Matt Casey]

So I leave, I come back and I put my car in park. And man, I tell you, it was. And again, back to being cynical. This. This gentleman walks up to my car and he's doing the whole like, roll your window down thing. And I'm looking at him with the most inconvenient look that I can. Like, I'm like, what do you want? You know, in my head I'm like, you're gonna tell me that somebody, you know, broke in your car, dented your car? I'm like, what does this guy want? So I'm rolling my window down, and he was so nonchalant. He's like, hey, man, there's a guy over there in the parking lot with a gun robbing somebody. I'm like, oh, give me the urgency, dude. And he was very descriptive. He told me, you know, he gave me a good description and I'm like, shit. I felt like it took a week for my window to roll back up, but I'm like, oh, okay, let's go to work. But I mean, if I was a couple minutes late, you know, playing with the street crimes boys, I would have been, yeah, I would have been written up for leaving my post, you know, and so it's funny how things work out, but, yeah, I. He told me there was a subject in there, he had a gun, he was robbing an elderly couple in the parking lot. And dirt bag it was.

[Brenton]

There's got to be some sort of, like, rule like, you don't mess with the elderly.

[Matt Casey]

And he was out. He was out on probation for armed robbery. He's been out for two weeks prior to that too.

[Tyler]

So my, my great grandfather is a World War II veteran. He was robbed and beaten. My family was. Oh.

[Matt Casey]

So that, that right there was like my career, you know, I was like a defining moment in my career, right, because most cops will go their whole career without, you know, firing their weapon.

[Brenton]

And so he gives you a good description exactly where he's at. You show up and everything's.

[Matt Casey]

What, what, calling it on the radio. And I'm walking through the parking lot. The whole. Now the whole OODA loops in. In effect. I'm looking for extra people. You know, where there's one, there's two. I'm looking, I'm looking around, I don't see anything. I go out into the main drive thru area. It's A huge entrance. It's deep inside the casino, but it's like four lanes.

[Brenton]

And he's giving you a good description of the guy?

[Matt Casey]

Great description. And sure, there he is. He's about 30 yards away. And I'm like, that's him. He's in the open. And his back is kind of, you know, bladed to me, but his arms bit in an L shaped.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

There's an elderly man, elderly woman standing next to a golf cart. They were being escorted by security after, you know, leaving the casino. And he had the gun in the rib cage of the security guard. And I was like, you know, so I'm getting as close as I possibly can get. And I'm noticing because the victim are looking at me. They're facing me.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And the. The male, his eyes are like, you know, and I'm like, man. And I'm in.

[Tyler]

Look down.

[Matt Casey]

I'm in the open. They're in the open. There's no cover. And I got about 25 yards away, and I said the thing that we shouldn't say anymore, but, you know, standard training. I was like, please let me see your hands. And he turned around and showed me his hands. All right. He pointed a CZ9 millimeter at me. And I. In that split second, I fired four rounds from about 25 yards away. It was nighttime and not an easy shot. Well, immediately. Immediately the female hit the deck. But she didn't. It wasn't like, I'm diving. It was like a CNS central nervous system. Lights out.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

I go, I just. I just fucking dinked the.

[Brenton]

Yeah, the elderly woman.

[Matt Casey]

Here it is. My career's done. You know, SWAT officer fucking shoots the. The victim. I know I hit him. I don't know how many times I hit him at that distance, but I could tell because he, you know, his body reacted punched. I sprinted in, fired four more rounds. He's down. I look over and I'm like, are you okay? And the old lady's now, like, propping herself up, and she's like, what took you so long? I'm like, thank God. Are you kidding me? So I'm like, all this is happening all the time, same time. And I'm like, are you hurt? She's like, no.

[Brenton]

I'm like, old people have no filter.

[Tyler]

That's.

[Brenton]

That's one of the benefits of being old. You say whatever you want. That's right.

[Matt Casey]

You can fart whenever you want.

[Brenton]

What took you so long?

[Matt Casey]

I was.

[Brenton]

Took you so long, young man.

[Matt Casey]

I was like, okay, all right, you're good. And, you know, it was just a moment, like so much, you know, you're talking on the radio, you're shooting, you're moving, you're communicating. And, you know, and, and all at the same, within these seconds, you're like, I just shot. Because the way she fell, I'm like, yeah, I, I plugged her, you know, and, you know, you're thinking, and I'm like, thank God, you know, like, now I can go back to, you know, homeostasis and, you know, don't use big words. Two syllables.

[Brenton]

Keep, keep, keep.

[Matt Casey]

Good. I was good.

[Brenton]

Keep with GED vocabulary for the rest of us.

[Matt Casey]

I, I, that was when I could take a deep breath and, you know, and it, like I said, it was, it was a good shoot. It was a, it was a good shoot. I learned a lot, you know, from that shooting. That, again, what went right went wrong, things that I could have done to did.

[Brenton]

And apparently I'm finding out there's a difference between your department saying it was a good shoot and the law saying it was a good shoot. So does everyone agree it was a good shoot? Yeah, okay, sure. We've, we've heard some crazy stories on this podcast.

[Matt Casey]

I'm glad it happened in the time frame that it happened. You know what I mean? Yeah.

[Tyler]

You know what I mean?

[Brenton]

Hey, they'll go, there's something else we found. They'll go back and review it. They'll go back pretty far to find things that they want to look into.

[Matt Casey]

It was, it was right administration, right decade. It was, it was good and it.

[Brenton]

Was a clean and it was, Everything was right about it.

[Matt Casey]

You know, that is a cool, that.

[Tyler]

Is the dream shooting. I mean, I don't want to speak for you, but there's nothing quite bad guy harming innocent people and then look to harm you.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. To me was as, as, as best as it could get, you know, Hobson robbers situation. We looked back, we found, you know, I was immediately, I got introduced to the whole shut the up after you get into a shooting, the whole union standpoint. So I was sequestered. And that kind of felt, you know, you know, you're like, hey, man, I did something great. And you're like, yeah, they, you know, they do the right thing. They.

[Brenton]

That's my next question for you that night. Like, when you get to bed, I mean, there's, and I don't want to sway. Whatever, whatever your answer is, what your answer is, but that will tell you, like, hey, like, give this guy some space. Like, be careful. What treatment do we need? To give him, like he just took someone's life. And they, and they. They will almost make you. Some people, the way they paint it will almost make it feel like it was a bad thing or make you feel bad for it. I mean, did you, did you lay your head down that night? I don't know other way to say it, because it's this how I would feel about it. Feeling good about yourself, like you removed a bad guy, a perpetual bad guy from this earth.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. I'll tell you, it happened. It happened late at night. It was close to midnight. By time I got sent home, it was probably close to like 4 o' clock in the morning. Yeah, I couldn't go to sleep. I was excited. Like, I mean, you know, people, when you say that, the outsiders looking in there, like, you know, that's morbid. But, you know, I didn't have. When I was in Iraq, I didn't have, you know, the chance to get into a firefight, you know, and you want to say that you're going to rise to the occasion, but you don't know until you're, Till you're there. And for me, for me, that was answered. My internal question was, like, all right, I know I could do the right thing when the time comes. And I was, I was proud. I was happy, you know, like I, you know, should be.

[Brenton]

Like I said, like Tyler said, that was. That one was cut and dry.

[Matt Casey]

Well, and what'd you dream about? Yeah, when you look, I. It could have went, you know, I, like, like I said, I. I try to break down every incident and look at the good and the bad and, you know, I, I didn't realize that he had three other suspects with him. They had eyes on me and the shooting when it was happening, and they made the, the decision to. The cowardly decision to beat feet, and they ran and they were taken into custody. You know, they're. After the incident, they were able to backtrack through security and take him into custody. But, you know, looking back on it, hindsight, I'm like, man, maybe I should have grabbed my rifle out of the car. You know, if I grabbed my rifle, maybe it would have been one shot I fired instead of eight. You know, maybe, you know, but we.

[Tyler]

Can'T happen in the 30, 40 seconds, right?

[Matt Casey]

So it's one of those, you know, so I just try to look at it and say, okay, well, maybe next time. Because that was back in the day, we didn't have in car rifle racks. So it was in the trunk, it was zippered encased and, you know, I. I fired eight rounds. And I'm like, well, maybe I should have did, like, an administrative reload and put a. Put a full mag in, because if the other three want to play, I would have been behind the eight ball. But everything that went right, you know, was perfect and aligned in the way it was supposed to be, and nothing really went wrong, you know, the.

[Brenton]

Jumping forward. Just real quick to the. The incident.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

With msd. What. What was that day like? Obviously, when the day started. There's no way this is on your radar. And what. So how'd that ball get rolling? And you were like, this is going to be a very different day in my life.

[Matt Casey]

So what's. What was weird is so, you know, it's called a Code Red, right? That's what they say in Florida. Florida, you know, Code Red. Active shooter at a school. That's, you know, they say it at hospitals. It's one of those unanimous, you know, phrases. Our school and our. In our city had a Code Red earlier that morning. It was a bomb threat. And, you know, of course. So when that came out, it was Valentine's Day. You know, people. You know, kids doing dumb shit, you know, whatever. But so that Code Red came out earlier that day. And then when the stone went. We share a channel with the sheriff's department. The sheriff's department does our dispatching. So when that came out, at first I'm thinking, oh, it's another.

[Tyler]

Worse.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, another call. And then I could hear it in the dispatcher's voice. It. It wasn't like Code Red. It was Code Red. Active shooter, not in custody, multiple casualties. And I'm like, yeah. I get on with my SWAT command commander. I said, hey, listen, I'm. I'm in the city. I'm on duty. This is what's going on. You know, respond for mutual aid, yes or no. And he's like, go. And I'm like, all right. To get there. I had no clue where Stoneman Douglas was. I was born and raised in. In Broward. I had no clue where it was at. So I call a buddy of mine up, and I'm like, hey, there's a school shooter up by you. I need you to give me some sort of way to get there, right? So I'm going, you know, mock Jesus in a Chevy Tahoe. And I, you know, trying to get there, and I almost wreck, you know, probably three times, like, serious, like, bad accidents trying to get there. And I show up. There's a sea of cars between unmarked, marked, and then Parents and bystanders. I mean, it was just chaos.

[Tyler]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

The most common chaotic kids, you know, underneath the underpass of the Sawgrass Expressway and Coral Ridge Drive, underneath that underpass. There was just a ton of kids out there. And right now we still. He's still not in custody, so I'm. I can't drive my car any farther. I'm about a mile away from the school, and somebody that's directing traffic's like, you're with swat? Yeah. They're like, it's that way. And I'm like, that's the worst, too.

[Tyler]

Vehicle parking. The ones who have. Have to do it the most are usually firefighters.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

Because we park our patrol cars and they can't get the rig in.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

But I, you know, something like that. That's got to be the first thing.

[Brenton]

About it, was parking. Yeah. It's what a minuscule thing to think about at the beginning that just dominoes.

[Matt Casey]

Into it to get into that school. Off of that road is just a single lane road back there, and it's about a mile. And so I got, you know, I put my heavy vest on, grabbed my med bag, put my helmet on, grabbed my rifle, and now I'm humping.

[Tyler]

Did you do Mogadisha mile?

[Brenton]

Oh, it had to be the longest mile of your life trying to get there.

[Matt Casey]

The longest mile I'll tell you about that was coming back. But so I'm running and, you know, we were passing people. You're still not in custody. There's a middle school just west of it. So in my head, I'm thinking, worst case, I'm like, did this guy make it to the middle school? As soon as I get to the property, I'm looking on the second, third story. You could see. See impact rounds. It's hurricane glass. So you can see impacts where, you know. So I'm like, is he shooting? You know, is this dude gonna come out and come after first responders as a secondary? You know, so everything's going through your mind. I see. I see a BSO SWAT commander, and I'm like, somebody important for bso. Not, you know, uniform person, but, you know, somebody with swat. And I'm like, hey, I'm a medic. You know, I got a gun. Where do you need me? And he points me in the direction of a hodgepodge team of Coconut Creek, and I think Coral Springs and Margate. But other officers and BSO SWAT at this point had the target building pretty much, you know, under control. The only casualty that was outside was coach Aaron Feis. He was, he was a true hero. That was. He was the one that tried to prevent Cruz from getting into the school. And he was shot and killed and stepped over him and linked up with an element.

[Brenton]

Right. And when he says Cruz, not like, like the guy the shooter's name was was Cruz. Yeah. Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

So at some point we're getting intel, they say that he's on the. Because, you know, so for active shooters, you have direct a threat if it's an actual, you know, if you hear the shooting, you're going to the sound of gunfire and you're bypassing everything, right? And then you have your slow probe, you know, when you don't have anything and you're doing methodical clearing. So right now there's no shooting. And we hear over the radio, he's actively fighting with the teacher on the, I think the third floor. And then they say, shots fired, teachers down. Well, BSO's there in that building is like, there's no shots fired, you know, And. And what they found out was, is that the video was on like a 10 plus minute delay, so. Oh, wow. Yeah, that was one of the hugest, you know, the most setbacks that we had because they, they thought they had live intel. And, you know, imagine if ISR is above and they're like, yeah, the enemy's 10 kilometers away. And next thing you know, they're in your backyard.

[Brenton]

Why would it be on a 10 minute, such a long delay?

[Tyler]

Well, I mean, as it goes to show you the need for stuff like that.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

And that's.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, one thing I, you know, in my.

[Tyler]

It's almost like better to not have it if it's gonna be.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

It is a handicap. Yeah.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and because now there's no.

[Brenton]

Way to know that.

[Matt Casey]

We gotta go back, you know, and talking. Talking to some of the. So deputies that were there, they're, you know, they were like, yeah. You know, they're saying that they don't see us, but we're standing under the camera, you know, and it's like they had to go back and go, oh, shit, this is on a delay. And, you know, I was. The year before that, I think it was the year before that I also deployed to the active shooter at Fort Laurel International Airport. And what I learned from those two active shooters is communication is vital, but communication just sucks during these incidents. And so that was, you know, that was that they were able to backtrack and a Coconut Creek cop, A, found him at a McDonald's down the street and took him into custody. You know, he didn't, he didn't want to put up a fight and he just got taken into custody. And now it became the arduous process of slow probe room clearing every room in this school.

[Brenton]

And if I remember right, he basically just put his weapon down and then eventually kind of melded into the fling students. So that's how he got out.

[Matt Casey]

Took, he had a load bearing vest, took that off and you know, put on, you know, school attire and just blended in with the students and just walked out. I don't know what his game plan was after that. You know, you know, you can't, you know, rationalize evil.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

But yeah, that was that.

[Tyler]

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[Matt Casey]

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[Brenton]

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[Matt Casey]

Putting profit before progress. Anyone pushing back against the medical matrix they carefully crafted was threatened, silenced, censored, financially ruined or worse. They are the problem, we are the solution.

[Brenton]

Initials Mike Juliet Alpha.

[Matt Casey]

You're clear to engage with weapons.

[Brenton]

You're clear to engage with weapons.

[Tyler]

And of course we got to give a shout out to our boys in 09 holsters. Custom built ruggedized duty gear. Made in the USA for cops by cops. A Leo and veteran owned small business. They deal in upgraded solutions for duty gear including cases for portable radios, body cameras, tourniquets and pretty much everything you need to carry on duty. So go to 09holsters.com and use promo code Anti Hero 10 Zulu 9. That's Anti Hero 10 Z9 and get yourself 10% off your order. JV team for life.

[Matt Casey]

And you know that that day continued. It just got, I don't know, it was just like worse and you know that was work that was bad. And then were methodically. At this point I had an element from our team that showed up so like half our SWAT team was there. So I branched off with them and some Coral Springs prior SWAT dudes that were detectives. And now they're assigning tasks, you know, find work, stay busy and they said they tell us to Go to. I think it was building 100, which is the first floor is admin. It's all at the principal's office. That's where they were watching the cameras that was secured. But they're like, yeah, got to go upstairs. And there's classrooms. So we go upstairs, and there's two sheriff's deputies, road patrol deputies, and they're just sitting there. Mind you, this is hour and a half, two hours afterwards. So everybody's now, you know, condition yellow or whatever, you know, kind of chill. And we're like, hey, we got to clear these rooms. And they're like, oh, no, all these doors are clear, and no fault to Fort Lauderdale pd, But, you know, FLPD showed up and. And they're going and knocking on doors, and they don't have keys because it's not a school in their system. And, yeah, you know, they're marking cleared on the doors and moving on. And these two deputies are standing out there. You know, we call back to the sheriff's department, their. Their attack commander, we're like, hey, all the rooms are cleared. And they're like, listen, we're missing students. Like, there's faculty seeing students. We need to find these people. And so finally we ended up getting a key. And that very first fucking door we tried, you know, we knocked, nothing. And we opened the door, we did a breach and hold. We had muzzles pointed in. And you're looking in there, and there's a classroom, like, 30 students and a teacher in there, and you're like, fuck, now it's reset, you know, so now it's like, you know, hands up, teacher out first. Is there anybody in this classroom that's. That's not supposed to be in here? No, Everybody's here. Anybody hurt? No. Okay. The two deputies that were standing outside the door, like, gone. Like a fart in the wind, you know, they've been standing, you know, but everybody did what they were supposed to do. The teachers didn't answer when the cops knocked, because that's the right thing to do.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And the cops didn't have the means to breach it or. Or enter it. So it was just, you know, the fog of war, and that's what happened. But we went from kind of like, now we're coming down from this adrenaline rushing high, and now it's shit, it's right back up. So now we got to go and clear every fucking room on the second floor of this wing. And it's like, no longer. You know, it's like we're looking for more. We didn't find any more. Everybody was out. But that first classroom was like, holy shit, man. Like, are you. How does this happen?

[Brenton]

You know, it reminds me a little bit of the uval Baldi when initial information got. Got passed on, and then that just kind of got perpetuated as. As the truth. And. And it's coming up again. Like, there. There has to be a lot of, like, trust but verify, you know, I suppose, like, just because someone told you that, like, you, You. You have to verify that.

[Matt Casey]

Well, I mean, it's. And that's the thing. Like, you know, so we're talking about. That was the longest mile of my life. But the longest mile of my life was actually walking back to my car. Because I'm. I'm walking back to my car, I'm gassed, you know, mentally, physically exhausted. And at this point, the sun's down, and there's parents out there with pictures of their kids, you know, because they're not releasing anything. So it's like, have you seen my kid? Have you seen my kid? And you're like, what do you. What do you say to that? So I'm like, I just keep walking. I get to my car, and normally I, you know, blast rock me music going home, just, you know, doing. Doing my thing. And the whole. The whole ride home was silence. Quiet.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and the next morning, I. I'm on Facebook talking about that information. My. My. My aunt's a teacher at a school in the area, and, you know, my cousins play football. And Aaron Feist was a football coach, and I guess they knew him. And, you know, she posts something on Facebook that was like, please pray for Coach Vice. He's in the ICU struggling, and I'm like, I call him like, take that down. You know, and she's like, what? I'm like, he's dead. You know, I'm like, I stepped over his body, like, he's dead. I'm like, his family's gonna see that. Take, you know, take that down. And she's like, no, no. And I'm like, I'm telling you, he's dead. You know, And I, I, I, I. That's when the anger started kicking in. And then as the days and the weeks go on, then you start finding out, like, you know, because I was like, where's the fucking SRO at? You know, where's the school resource officer? You know, and after you. Then you start finding out, all this shit starting to come out. And that's when a lot of anger started sitting in. I'm like you're telling me that, you know, you had a guy that was there, his job is to protect that school. And, you know, whatever weapon he had, he, he at least had 46 plus rounds of ammunition. Ammunition and training in a vest that could at least make an impact.

[Tyler]

And an oath.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and that's your job. I mean, these are the, you know, these kids had no. And learning about the casualties, you know, you see them in the hallway. And a lot of these kids died because of. I mean, it's no fault to the teachers, but it's a. You get the code red, shots fired, what do you do? You lock the door. You know, and a lot of these kids were executed in the hallway.

[Tyler]

Oh my God.

[Matt Casey]

Locked out, Locked out of rooms. And it's, you know, it's one of those things like they, they couldn't even get to safety because the doors are locked. And, you know, you're sitting there and it's like these kids had no fighting chance. But you, you had a fighting chance.

[Brenton]

Safety had to come to them. And that's you, buddy.

[Matt Casey]

You. You had the, the opportunity to, I mean, even if you were to pin this dude down in a hallway till the calvary arrives. Something.

[Brenton]

Yeah. Something Announce your presence, do anything to make him look to. At anyone other than easy prey. Yeah. Take his focus to you.

[Matt Casey]

You had that. And I, I had such anger for.

[Brenton]

That because a lot of people did.

[Matt Casey]

You know, I'm like, rightfully so. I, I almost, you know, wrecked several times to get there.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

There's at least hundreds of law enforcement that showed up that were off duty, that came from other agencies. Everybody was there. Like, you know, everybody's going forward in.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And you're, you're the dude there, you know, and you're in like me. It's like, how do you live with yourself on that? You know, people make mistakes, but that's just a failure to. That's hard. You know, and that is, you know, that is self preservation. And it's hard for me to grapple with that.

[Brenton]

Do you know what I know? Ended up going to court over that. Correct. And he ended up having to. Or maybe it didn't go to court. I think there was, there was a.

[Matt Casey]

Civil court maybe, because from what I.

[Brenton]

So what do you know, what he, what he did then or just. Just. Or didn't do well? We know what he didn't do well.

[Matt Casey]

He didn't do anything.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, it was, you know, at.

[Brenton]

The time about the court ruling here in a second, which is Kind of crazy, but we'll, we'll get to that.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, at the, at the time, a lot of agencies policies for active shooter were direct to threat or, you know.

[Tyler]

I didn't know there was any other one.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, but there's, you know, there was trainings that were out there where it's like, oh, you wait till the first three officers get in and then you go in as a team. You know, I think he was working off of some information that was, you know, some old school training and justified it in his head that, you know, I'm gonna wait. You know.

[Tyler]

How.

[Brenton]

Yeah, if you're looking for reasons to wait, you'll find it. But if you're looking for reasons to go save kids, it was there.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, no, you, you that. Look, I mean, we get paid for what we might have to do, you know, not what we do, what we might have to do. And that was the time that you might have to do something. That was your time.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

And you know, one oops can ruin a thousand atta boys. You know, I don't, I don't care how good of a career it was, you know, he could have been, you know, but that was a moment that he, you know, like, how do you live with yourself? I don't know.

[Tyler]

He has to, I have to know. He feels terrible.

[Brenton]

17 people died. I'm not saying that that guy could have saved them all. He, he couldn't have.

[Matt Casey]

But, but he could have changed the trajectory of. Absolutely. You know, and it, it would have.

[Brenton]

Been a very, it would have been a different story with, with some action.

[Matt Casey]

And it's, you know, and it's not, you know, there's a lot of people that want to, you know, I'm not a part of the sheriff's department, but there's a lot of people that, you know, were like, oh, the Broward Sheriff's partner, let me tell you something. The Broward Sheriff's Department's a, a great organization. Like they, they hammer training like their SWAT team, some really good dudes, heavy hitters, and they work some tough areas in South Florida, their road patrol. And you know, the sheriff's department, a whole is, is a good sheriff's department. It just happens to be a systemic problem in law enforcement where you take these officers who are close to retiring or already retired and you, you put them in school and that's a fair point.

[Tyler]

I've never, I. If you would have said, Tyler, what do you want to do with the old ones? I'd be like, put them in schools. But Then, now, right now I'm like, that's a horrible idea.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. You know, and, and that's, you know, that's an issue. You know, you got your proactive cops that don't want to go to school. Right. But then you have, you put these, you know, old fuds that are ready to retire and they, you know, it's a cake gig. And that department, that same city and that area is an affluent area too. It's not like a rough neighborhood. So, you know, they. Parkland has a lot of money and so it looks like a sweet retirement gig. But, you know, you know, you know, lightning's gonna strike and it's, it's not discriminatory. It's gonna, you know, hit where it hits.

[Brenton]

So I, I know there was an outcry about that and whatever the, the investigation results that came from that cleared him of his inactivity and basically said that he is under no legal requirement to be proactive. Essentially.

[Matt Casey]

Yes. So that's the way the policies were back, back then. Because training was like, hey, if this is an active shooter, we every, we didn't train even in my agency, we didn't train solo response. We trained going in a wedge or a diamond formation. And you know, that's how it was presented now. Now that, I mean, almost immediately after Stoneman Douglas, our agency was like, no, we're going to start and every agency now. So now we have solo response and then we have team response. And then we were even doing RTF rescue task force, where now we're integrating fire rescue in the element. And so it, you know, that tragedy changed everything. But it was the unwritten rule that we would always talk about, hey man, if it's kids, I'm, I'm going in guns blazing. You know, we're, we're, we're gonna, you know, I'm not gonna let a freaking this happen and stand by, you know, but if, like you said, if, if you need to find an excuse, you're gonna find an excuse. And that I believe was his excuses, like, well, I'm gonna wait, you know, and I don't know the ins and outs of what happened. You know, there's, there was talks that there was a commander that was given a stand down, you know, talking, wait for backup or whatever. Even if I'm given that, you know that that order is going to be disregarded. Yes, that's going to be. I can't hear you.

[Tyler]

You know, if it's an order that's going to cost human life.

[Matt Casey]

Right. And, and, and I don't know the, The. The details if that truly happened. But, you know, the fact of the matter is, is he had an opportunity to change the trajectory of that incident. And because look at it like the kid. The kid left. You know, who. Who's to say that he didn't left. He didn't leave armed and then wanted to cause harm at, you know, the McDonald's that he was at, you know, cause a secondary scene. You know, the thing is, is, you know, you can't rationalize evil. You have to go in there and take care of it, which you can.

[Tyler]

Well, and like, just like you said it before, like, it's. The, the man in you is like, whatever that guy was thinking. I don't know, because I wouldn't. I would disregard all orders and like. Yeah, think like you're in the car with your kids. It goes down at Publix. I have that thing all the time. Do I. Do I take my kids to safety and say sheep or sheep you should be carrying, or do I tell. Take the car, go down there and go handle business because it's your obligation. You. You're capable of doing it. Just like we talked about. Swat.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

When you should. When should you try out for swat? Should you. Because you are the best, but you don't want to. Well, you're the one that can. So it's almost like you're obligated.

[Brenton]

The. It's. It's an odd question, but I'll ask it. I know it took you a while to get there, and being a mile away didn't. Didn't help. But, you know, obviously the. The coach was still there. You know, when you got, when you got into the hallways, were people still working on kids and moving and moving bodies or. They pretty much, you know, had started.

[Matt Casey]

When I started getting there, there was. There was some extraction going on, but for the, you know, a lot of it was walking wounded.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

Most. And when you break down a lot of statistics on the active shooters, a lot. A lot of them are, you know, either walking wounded or. Or drt. You know, they're just. And he executed a lot of people. Drt dead right there. Yeah. Doa, you know.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. You know, because he was going down the hallway and you have these. So a lot of schools in the hallway, the classrooms are recessed in.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

So they're, you know, there were students that died huddling each other, you know, because they couldn't. There was nowhere to. For him to go. And he's just walking and just dumping point blank you know, so there was some walking wounded that were being tended to. But out of those injuries though, those officers that showed up prior to my arrival were square away officers. You know, they were putting chest seals on people, putting tourniquets on, on people and getting them to the casualty receiving point and then being trapped, transported there. You know, there are survivors that were treated pre hospital on scene by law enforcement who sustained, you know, thoracic freaking hits with the 223. And yeah, and they're, they're alive because those officers got there fast. Yeah. Did a proper patient turnover to fire rescue and got them to the hospital. And. And those are the ones that, that's the, that gets overlooked for sure. Hell yeah.

[Brenton]

Oh man.

[Matt Casey]

You know, it, it again like they want to hammer the whole, the whole entity, you know, but it was really one or two people who just dropped the ball and you know, you know.

[Tyler]

You know like we talk about like the, the fixing of law enforcement, the fixing of the culture and we are like in an ideal world, but it can never happen. But I mean when you show something like that, like heroism and as a sheriff or a chief, you're my new captain, you're my new major. You're over, you're over upd because I don't want shit bags. I want people like you to promote.

[Matt Casey]

Like a battlefield promotion.

[Tyler]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, you know, but the politics always get in the way though.

[Tyler]

Yeah, I'm very pro union. But the union would not be okay with that.

[Matt Casey]

No, no, no, they wouldn't be. You know, because it's like, well, you're skipping, you know, these three people because of their time in the service or.

[Tyler]

They scored better on the test.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. Or they interviewed better. But you know, they did two years on the road and they've been working, you know, community affairs for the last, you know, 10 years.

[Tyler]

Yeah, but the first chief or sheriff that does that, he's going to have the baddest agency to work.

[Brenton]

Oh, 100 the. I'm sure, you know, probably talking about. You probably go as early as that night. But I'll jump to the next day. I mean it just has, has to be just a black cloud over the city, over the department. And not because of what the department did or didn't do. Just because something of that magnitude just, you know, happened in your backyard. It was, I mean it was immediately, you know, national news. Yeah, it was just a tragic, tragic day. And the whole city just has to.

[Matt Casey]

Feel that, you know, it's, you know, it was one of those things, you know, when you. You talk about ptsd, I mean, there's so many layers to that, to that, you know, onion, you know, to quote Shrek. But, you know, you could have. You could have that. That. That. That one moment where something happened to you and it was a unique situation, or you could have, you know, combat, working, patrol, where it's, you know, you're in a constant cycle of it. But with Stoneman Douglas, it was weird because it's in your face every day.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

It's in your social media. You know, you're walking, and I'm taking the kids into cold stone. And there's a little, you know, jar that's saying, you know, you know, it. There. The magnets were on the cars because it was there, you know, and. And it was in your face.

[Brenton]

Like, it's a constant reminder.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And it was. Yeah, it was. It was a dark day, you know, and you don't. You don't think that it's like, well, it's gonna happen here, you know, so it's not.

[Tyler]

If it's when.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, yeah. You know, and it's. It was one of those things where it was. It was, like, constantly in your face. You know, everywhere you went, it was there, you know, it wasn't.

[Brenton]

And it's tough because you don't. You don't want the city to forget about it. You know, it's a. There's no right answer to it. You can't. You can't just go live life like, oh, that happened. Let's just, you know, move on. Like.

[Tyler]

Well, there's, like.

[Brenton]

You have to remember it, you know, you have to, you know, respect. You know, respect the dead. I don't know. You know, what better way to say that you have to.

[Tyler]

Gone through trauma with, like, me, and you experienced a traumatic event, and you're a constant reminder of that. But we were survivors together, so it's that weird conundrum of, like, tons of therapy.

[Matt Casey]

Well, and. And, you know, and then you had the. The. The political side of it, too, because then you had kids that were there that now, you know, David Hogg, you know, is one.

[Brenton]

Right. Yeah. Now it turns into a political, you know. You know, he.

[Matt Casey]

You know, not to take anything away from him being. I almost forgot about that guy.

[Tyler]

I did. Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

He, you know, I believe he was a senior at the time. He wasn't even in that wing. He. You know, it's. You know, and, you know, again, like, he was there, but, you know, he. He's using that as a. As a platform. Platform. You Know, like Democrats always say, there's never waste a good tragedy, you know, and, you know, you have that aspect of it, and it's. It's. It just goes down, you know, spiders into all these little avenues. You know, fast forward a second. Like, when I. I taught my very first class through my company, I got a phone call, and I didn't have the website up. It was just word of mouth. And I had a young girl, she calls me. She's like, yeah, my brother died in Stillman Douglas. I want to be an emt, and I want to learn how to, you know, protect myself. So I'm like, oh, yeah. You know, And I said, I was there. You know, I was like, yeah. I go, email me your information. I'll register you. I get the email, and my heart dropped. Joanna Feis, the sister of Coach Feist. So I'm like, you know, it's like, I can't escape this thing. I. I call her up, and I'm like, first of all, you're not paying for the class. Second, you know. You know, I just want to let you know, like, I was there. I saw you. I saw your brother. You know, your brother was a true hero. And anything that I could do for you, never hesitate. And, you know, when I've met her finally for the first time at the class, it was a. It was like, man, it's like reliving some shit over again, because you.

[Brenton]

Right.

[Matt Casey]

You know, these victims are in the community. They're. They're there, and it's, you know, it's one of those things. It's like, I felt. I felt like law enforcement, you know, failed. My job failed. And, you know, there's a lot of us that went there to do good work, but, you know, that one or two that could have done something.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, ruined it for, you know, a lot of us. And, you know, I think a lot of people would have been not wanting to be in that officer's position, a deputy position, but I think a lot of people would have been like, you know, I'm. I'm gonna go and, you know, whatever the outcome is, the outcome is, but I'm not going to sit by.

[Tyler]

I wish I was. If you were working that day, everybody should. I wish I was there.

[Matt Casey]

Like, everybody wants to be the one, you know, again, like, I'm driving to get there. You know, you had this guy, had all these officers coming, risking their lives to get there. You're just.

[Tyler]

I mean, I just can't. Like, you put the badge on, you strap the Gun on your hip. Not to sound cheesy, but to combat evil, that should be like, this is my chance.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And this was your moment to, to, you know, and this is, this is.

[Brenton]

If you zoom out a little bit. You know, speaking of SROs, I mean, every day this guy is interacting with these kids, you know, every. He knows.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, yeah, yeah. It's not like an empty face. Yeah, yeah.

[Brenton]

He knows them, they know him. They walk by to some degree going, that's. That's the guy that's supposed to protect us.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

I mean, as small as. And as they walk by you, somewhere in the back of your SRO mind, you have to think, if anything bad happens, I will protect these kids.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. I mean, it goes, I mean, something as small as, you know, like I'm getting bullied by another kid. I know that, you know, this kid's not going to jump me in front of this SRO because that guy's going to have my.

[Brenton]

That's right.

[Matt Casey]

You know, all the way up to, you know, this incident and it lost a lot of faith in people. And, you know, how, how do you.

[Brenton]

Think the, I mean, you gave, you know, high praise to the department, but I don't, but no one's prepared for this. How do you think, and I don't even know, to be honest with you, what the department should do, but, you know, how do you feel like the department's response was to you guys.

[Matt Casey]

A.

[Brenton]

Week, a month, two months later about you guys having to deal with this tragedy?

[Matt Casey]

Well, that's, that's the big thing. So I work for a municipality, a city, so I wasn't, you know, my, my department isn't associated with that city or the sheriff's department. But this is the biggest problem in law enforcement for mental health, for first responders, is there really is no checks and balances. There's no internal customer service. You know, I don't know how it is up here, but if, like in our area, if fire rescue responded to a traumatic incident like a death of a co worker or death of a child, they get taken off the line, you know, and they bring in another, another rig and they have time to decompress, we just go on to the next call.

[Tyler]

Yep. You know, and someone's stupid ass burglary.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

And it's not stupid, but in your.

[Brenton]

Head you're like, yeah, it comes full circle. Right.

[Matt Casey]

You know, so you get taken, you don't get taken off the line. You, you go right back into, you know, show me, you know, show me 10, 8, for calls for service and you don't have that time to decompress. And at no point did the department say, hey, you okay? You need anything? And on the contrary, it's, it took, you know, that was, that was February 2018. In October of 2018, I did a, a class on PTSD, an in house class and a buddy of mine who shot and killed somebody recently in that time frame was sitting next to me in the class and the, the, the lady teaching the class was going over signs and symptoms and you know, all the, you know, all the, and we're looking at each other like, hey, I got that, I got that. Oh yeah, I'm super irritable. I got that. And I made the decision and it was a tough one to ask for help, but I didn't, I didn't, you know, start banging the war drums and you know, saying I, to play devil's.

[Brenton]

Advocate on it and you would know better. That's just a question I have. And you're right, you know, they put you right back on the road and right back to do your, you know, your irritating job to some degree. Yeah. But I mean if, but we still have to have, you know, police officers in their sector.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, 100%.

[Brenton]

So. And most departments that I can only speak of today, I don't know how it was, you know, seven years ago are already short staffed.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

And so to pull you off for your benefit. And I'm, I don't, this is why I don't know the right answer. They should, right. They should take care of their own. But by taking care of you, that removes police officers from the street to take care of, of the job you signed up for or have. And I don't know, that's why you're like, I don't know the right answer.

[Tyler]

Implementation plan. Have a very, very stacked reserve unit. You know, hey, have a, a plan with a mutual aid agency. You know, have something where they can come in. It doesn't have to be forever. Just 72 hours.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

And let everything come down.

[Brenton]

Yeah. But it's answers. They just, they just have to want to find the answers.

[Matt Casey]

Well, and it's, it's not a one size fits all approach either. You know, so it's not always going to be this, you know, it has to be this way, but it's, to have something, an infrastructure in place, you know, and that's where my problem started coming was I was like, you know what? I, I, I'm like, man, I am having some of these issues and I was getting Irritable. I mean, I was getting to the point where I was on calls where I wanted somebody to do something, you know, like, I would. I would purposely antagonize, you know, hoping to start an engagement, because I was so angry, and I asked for help, and, you know, coming out and asking for help, you know, in that world, you know, in the alpha male world, and, you know, it's. It's hard. And I sent an email, and it was very short. I was like, hey, I took the class. I think I have ptsd. I think I want to talk to somebody, but I don't know how to persuade seed. That was it. You know, that was it. And two weeks go by, no response. So I'm like, oh, no, it gets better. But wait, there's more.

[Brenton]

More.

[Matt Casey]

So I'm like, okay. So I send another email, and I'm like, hey, just following up on that one I sent, you know, two weeks ago. I just. All I want to know is, do I, you know, do I go through, like, eap? Do I go through my health insurance? Like, I'm just trying to figure out. Figure, you know, the way to proceed. No response. It took about a month later, something happened. I don't even know the. The story, but something happened with an officer in the department, and he had a mental breakdown. And somebody said. Somebody must have got the email, because somebody said, well, what about Casey? He was. He was asking for help, and I was working the road that day. Yep. Yeah.

[Tyler]

Hey, what's up, man?

[Matt Casey]

I hear over the radio, and they're like, whatever my call sign was that.

[Brenton]

You haven't shot yourself yet.

[Matt Casey]

They call me in, and they're like, we need you to come to the station. And I walk in, and it's the. The row patrol captain and the major. And I'm like, oh, what did I do this time?

[Tyler]

Yeah, right.

[Brenton]

Going over your week's worth of calls. What I do, what I do, what I do.

[Matt Casey]

So I'm like, what's up, guys? And they're like, hey, we need your gun. And I'm like, oh, my. First of all, it's my gun. I'm like, you know, I paid for this. This is mine. But they're like, yeah, we saw your email, and worst way to handle it. Oh, 100, right? So they're like, we're gonna give you a ride home. And I wouldn't give him my gun, but I. I had to give him the bullets in the gun. And I'm like, guys, I just want to talk to somebody, you know? And right they're treating me now like I'm radioactive. So, gosh, I'm like, this is, this.

[Brenton]

Is, you know, no good deed goes unpunished, right?

[Matt Casey]

So I go. And now I'm out of work for a month. I'm on paid administrative leave. And so now I'm just sitting there, right. You know, I have a couple buddies call me, but for the most part, it's like, nobody, you know, I'm like, what's going on?

[Brenton]

Right. I'm having problems. So isolate me to myself.

[Matt Casey]

Right.

[Brenton]

And give me nothing but time to me. And idle hands and idle minds are never go to the positive.

[Matt Casey]

Right.

[Brenton]

It's just the. Absolutely.

[Tyler]

Here's a discount coupon to the liquor store too. Might as well.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, that's, that's how it was. And I, I got lined up. They, they put it through workers comp and started talking. I gotta say that, you know, typically.

[Brenton]

Workers comp is let me take away your overtime.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, well, see, that, that was. It got into the point where they're like, well, you can't work the road and we're not gonna keep you on paid leave. So I went six months without pay and exhausted all my.

[Tyler]

There's no lawsuit here.

[Matt Casey]

I don't, no, no, no. I, I never went down that, so I never went down that route. I, I, I lost all my, all my vacation. I used all my pto, you know, all my, my comp time. And, you know, it finally got to a point. So the workers comp doctors are usually not on your side, right? They're usually not.

[Tyler]

No, they're not. It's actually, it's not even a, it's not even a conspiracy. They are literally trying to get.

[Matt Casey]

They're for the city.

[Tyler]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And I gotta say, the therapist for workers comp that they signed me to was a really good dude. And he's like, listen, you know, you teach at the academy. You're one of the department trainers. He's like, I think they should, like, just give you time and, you know, we sign you to the academy or put you in training and till we start working through. Because it's not a. You don't cure something like this immediately, you know. So I went to training for a couple months. I was upstairs in training for a couple months, and I started, you know, things. I started feeling better and I'm like, I got my feet in the shallow end of the pool now, and shift bids come out and I bid for training in the academy. And they were like, road patrol.

[Tyler]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

I'm like, God. I'm like, I'm not ready. And they go, well, you're either gonna go back to road patrol or you're gonna retire. You know, And I'm like, well, this sucks. You know, And I'm like, I, I honestly didn't know what to do. And at this point, I was married, and, you know, the marriage is falling apart. You know, everything is. Everything's falling apart. So I was like, all right, well, I'll. I'll retire. I tried to get a medical pension through it, and we have a pension board. And they were like, yeah, you know, so I'm like, okay, cool.

[Brenton]

Which is crazy because they offered you the road. You know, what the city really doesn't.

[Tyler]

Want on the road is somebody that's.

[Brenton]

Oh, yeah. Someone on. Someone on edge. And then turn that into a bad encounter and a multi million dollar civil. And they'll pay that out.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And they'll wash their hands of it. And, and that was my, my biggest. Like, I realized that thin blue line is really thin. You know, it's super. It's, it's, it's like fishing line.

[Brenton]

Tyler says it's non. Existent.

[Tyler]

Yeah, it's a microscope.

[Matt Casey]

It's there when they want it to be there, you know. Yeah. Right there.

[Brenton]

It's not.

[Matt Casey]

No.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And it's, you know, they, they could have sat back and said, hey, and again, this is the workers comp doctor. And it's like, this is what I'm suggesting. They could have sat back and, you know, made an accommodation and said, all right, man, you, you did 15 years on the road as a road patrol officer. And, and mind you, I mean, SWAT fto, I, you know, been in a shooting, been to two active shooters.

[Tyler]

It's such a valuable asset, such a valuable.

[Brenton]

So much experience.

[Tyler]

Yes.

[Matt Casey]

Keep, you know, we'll keep you here and we'll, we'll put you, you know, and then we'll, we'll keep evaluating. But it was one of those things where they were like, no, we're done.

[Brenton]

With that much experience. That's exactly where you should be as a trainer, training the future law enforcement people of the city and getting to tell them your experiences and what, and what you've learned.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, I mean, what happens to, like, the perfect job when you don't, when you can't play football anymore as a pro, what do you do? You go coach.

[Brenton]

That's right.

[Matt Casey]

And yeah, that's the way, you know, I looked at it. It made sense to me. But.

[Tyler]

Well, I will say that credit where credit's Due and I can only say my agency because I don't work for any other one. But they've. It's kind of like the injury thing or like, let's say your. Your knees a little injured, right? But you're not, you're still mission capable, but you still have to work through this injury. So they do the same thing with mental. They have, they created an entire, an entire salary position for someone for you while you're at work to go check. 10, 6. And no one has to know. And you can go talk to her.

[Brenton]

While, while you wait for your. While you wait for your negro to grow, while you wait for your knee to grow.

[Tyler]

You gotta watch the lives, guys.

[Brenton]

I love that idea. And. But here's something else that, you know, that someone I can't take credit for, but it's absolutely true. The other problem, the hardest thing with trying to help people with PTSD is actually this and one, I like to call it ptsi, which is not disorder. It's an injury like anything else. It's the worst when it first happens, but it has to get better. I refuse to believe, and I know this with my own experience, that something that happens in your life and you will be that messed up for the rest of your life, because that's what a disorder is. A disorder doesn't get better, you know, so, you know, I love the idea of calling more like PTSI and having that mindset to it, like, okay, well, we're going to work with you on this and it's going to get better.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

But the problem is, and this is the military's problem, as soon as you start incentivizing ptsd, every. The people who, who don't need it or shouldn't get it are gonna find their way to it and reap the benefits of it. And the people who are out there working every day and just coping with it and really need to be taking part of that program won't. And that's just the way it happens.

[Tyler]

Because they don't want to be associated with those people.

[Brenton]

I don't know a way to fix it. I don't think there is a way to fix it, to be honest with you. It's. It's just one of those.

[Tyler]

Because they try, they try, they try to filter, like, they try to say, you, you don't really qualify. They're just gonna go and go and go until somebody goes, okay, just give it to them.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Tyler]

I mean, people do it with the VA all the time, right? Go different avenues until you get 100%.

[Brenton]

Until they get what they want.

[Matt Casey]

You know, it's. It's. It's one of those, you know, if, you know, you're like, hey, man, I. My backup on. On a. On a. On an op or on a, you know, a landing or something, you know, and, you know, MRI X rays showing there's nothing wrong with you. You. You know, it's definitive. Right. It's hard to get in somebody's head and say, well, you know, because they're gonna say, well, you don't know how I feel.

[Brenton]

That's right. And they always know the words to say, oh, yeah. And yeah, yeah.

[Matt Casey]

No, it's. It's, you know, they.

[Brenton]

Which is. Which is why I'm. I'm actually a huge proponent for the best people to get you through those situations are the people who've been in those situations. Your brothers, your teammates, the people who are close to you. The guy, and I hate to say maybe he doesn't, but the guy who went through the same shit you did and still has it all together and you can know when he has all to get his. His marriage is still together. You know, his. His finances are together. He's like, he. That's hard to fake for a long time. Go to that guy and be like, hey, and you might find that he's not as. Yeah, he's not doing as well, you know, as. As you think. And you might find a common. A common bond, but like, those, Those are the people who are going to get you through this.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. And. And, and that's. That's this. The support structure that needs to be there. You know, it needs to, one not, you know, punish or demonize somebody for needing help. And then it's the worst thing you could do is remove that person from that environment.

[Brenton]

That's right. Then you remove them from that environment. The one thing that you really have, you know, going for you, that's.

[Matt Casey]

You lived and breathed that every damn day, you know, and that was, you know, and then you're no longer there, and you're like, man, like, what's my purpose? You know, And. And like you said, I like that. It's. It's. It's. It's something that can be fixed and it can be regulated. And you just gotta. Like, for me, it was. I didn't know what the. I had. You know, I. You know, there was a lot of incidents, you know, before that that were traumatic, you know, but I didn't know what, you know, I. I didn't know why I was acting this way. And you know, it took me a while to figure it out and then it was okay, well, this is what I have to do, you know, and it, you know, it's hard, but there's, there's. You can either self destruct or you can, you can, you know, find work.

[Brenton]

You only got two options.

[Tyler]

Life.

[Brenton]

Six feet under, six feet forward. It's the only two options you got.

[Matt Casey]

Exactly.

[Brenton]

You know, and it's. Yeah. And you, you had, you know, several of these instances in your career, some traumatic instances. And I don't, I don't know why, but you know, just relating it, you know, in my world, like, but not every traumatic instance is, is the same either. Like there's some that just, you brush off and just don't affect you. And sometimes you even feel weird that it doesn't affect you.

[Tyler]

That's the ones you least expect.

[Brenton]

Yeah, sometimes it's. And others do. And I don't know why some do and why some don't. Yeah, I don't know why the brain does what it, what it does.

[Matt Casey]

Well, it's, it's funny like before I had kids, nothing bothered me with kids, you know, and I tell the story to people. I'm like, we were, you know, we had a 12 year old girl in Iraq, she got shot in the head by, by us. But it was, know, it was a, an unfortunate accident. It was, you know, chaos of war. Yeah. I mean her car, you know, her car, her dad's driving is coming up on, on a convoy and totally disregarding.

[Brenton]

Every, every warning sign.

[Matt Casey]

Every warning sign to the point.

[Tyler]

Written in Arabic.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, written in Arabic. Yeah. And, and 500ft is 500ft in any language. But you know, they're popping pyro, they're popping everything and, and the turret gunner, you know, goes and takes out the engine block and one, one round, you know, pointy bullet hitting an curved bullet, pointy object hitting a curved object. That round went. One hit the radiator, just, you know, perfect shot. But one skipped up and went right through the windshield. And she was sitting in the back and dinked right in the head. And they, they brought her to us, the Air Force medics, the flight medics brought her. We were working surgical shock trauma platoon, like an army mass unit. Yeah. Navy calls it a SSTP and brought it to us, the next level of care. And we're doing our thing. The surgeon comes out, they did the mri, no brain activity. And they're like, you know, we don't have the infrastructure. There is no life support. You know, they don't have that. So it's like the family jumped on another helicopter and they're waiting to take her body and they want to bury her before sunset, Right. But we can't give them a live body, so they extubated her, you know, and took her off the respirator and we had to sit there and wait for her to expire. And it's not like in the movies where you pull the plug and it's flatlined, you know, her body was still fighting.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And you know, me and a buddy, another corpsman, we're sitting there playing cards on the table next to her, waiting for, you know, no pulse, no nothing. And, and you know that that's not normal, right? That's not normal. And then, you know, didn't affect me. And then you fast forward, you know, and I have kids now, and then I see my first pediatric death and like everything comes back. You know, I think about every kid that got hit by the IED over there. You know, we had, you know, seeing what a 762 would do to a 3 year old's arm, you know, it's like pretty fucking gnarly. And all that shit, you know, comes back. So it's weird how certain things trigger that and then, you know, and then knowing like, okay, that's my weakness. Kids are my weakness. You know, I know I, I, this is, I, I avoid, you know, certain things with that. But, but yeah, it's, it's one of those, it's, it's one of those things that it's, you know, you don't need to just pump meds in somebody and, you know, and turn them into a zombie for them to be better. You know, there's, you know, for me, teaching was like exposure therapy, you know, going out there and, you know, now teaching people how to save lives is, you know, the best medicine in the world right there. And I still surround myself with cops and corpsmen and other, you know, other people that are like minded.

[Brenton]

Well, you said earlier when they, when they, when they pulled you off the road, you're like, I lost my purpose. And I'm, you know, I'm a big advocate. The same thing with idle hands, idle mind. You retire from law enforcement, you retire from the military, and all those people have a common denominator where they feel like they had a purpose, it's their identity. And now they have no purpose. What, what, what do you do now?

[Matt Casey]

So I started my, I started my business while all this was going on.

[Brenton]

And what's it called?

[Matt Casey]

Triad Medical Training. It started with active shooter response. And my philosophy on it is everybody prepares for the fight, but nobody prepares for the aftermath. You know, you'll go to the range and spend a thousand, you know, shoot a thousand rounds at the range, but nobody's preparing for that. Okay, now if I get shot or my loved one or my partner gets shot, now what? You know, so I'm a big advocate on, you know, the fight is not linear. It's 360 and you know, if you are useless, if you cannot do emergency medicine, you know, on the X when, when shit happens, you know, you could.

[Brenton]

You can very much.

[Matt Casey]

You know, you could carry, you know, three spare mags, two knives and everything. But you know that's going to do you no good if you're, if you're bleeding out and learning from, and Stoneman Douglas was the pinnacle that made me think is like you don't know who the first responder is that's going to be there. You know those kids that were in that classroom that we found two hours after the incident, you know, like if somebody was injured in there, they would have been fucked. And so my, my whole mission now is just introducing people and cops, you know, cops, you know, if I could teach marines, I could teach anybody. And but cops, cops were the worst when it comes to, in service training that you don't want to go to. So yeah, I'm like, how can I make medical fun? You know, so I was like, you know what, let's go out to the range and let's, let's put these guys in full kit. Let's, you know, there's a lot of pet peeves I have when it comes to tourniquets that I see, you know, the academy teach it wrong. There's a lot of in house instructors that teach it wrong. And you know, before we deployed we actually had a live tissue lab in North Carolina and There were some 18 Deltas that were out there that ran us through that live tissue lab. You know, nice. I, you know, I went pre 9, 11. I don't, you know, we had to hand make our tourniquets and you know, when, when I first deployed, they handed us the first generations of cats and I'm like, what the is this thing? You know, but now it's so mainstream, right? So, but what I'm trying to do is change the culture in that too because I challenge you to go to YouTube and just Google Cop applies Tourniquet. There are so many videos out there where cops are putting tourniquets on their partners. And their partners are more than capable of putting their own fucking tourniquet.

[Brenton]

Self aid. First thing, self aid.

[Matt Casey]

I fucking hammer that in my classes because I'm like, we have to change this. It's self aid. Buddy aid than medics.

[Brenton]

Yep.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and why am I going to take two eyes and two hands out of the fight that are more than you know, that are holding lethal cover to fix somebody who, who is trained and equipped. But we have this stigma now where it's like, oh, I gotta tourniquet everything, you know, and we just saw it.

[Brenton]

In the video, in the live. Just this last Thursday night where, you know, two, two officers were shot. Both, both expecting the third officer, you know, to, to save them, you know, and it's, it's traumatic, but you know, one's like, don't let me die, don't let me die. And my lack of empathy, my first thought was, don't let yourself die. No, don't let yourself die.

[Matt Casey]

Like, it's a training scar.

[Brenton]

You can do almost everything to yourself. Almost.

[Matt Casey]

It's, you know, I get it. You know, there's certain things, you know, I would never expect somebody to put a chest seal on themselves or, you know, wound pack themselves. But look, if you, if everything's on up here, you know, you should be able to self apply tourniquet. And if you don't have it on you, shame on you. But, you know, it's a, it's a, it's a tactical nightmare. We don't want to sacrifice medicine for tactics and.

[Brenton]

Correct.

[Matt Casey]

I see it so much and I'm trying to, you know, my whole thing is I'm trying to bring real world, you know, medicine to, to these officers and to, to individuals. I get way more civilians that come to the class than officers.

[Brenton]

I had a buddy that once said, all bleeding stops eventually.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah.

[Brenton]

And it's true. So it, either you stop it or, or it'll stop itself.

[Matt Casey]

Well, and so you, that's the one thing.

[Brenton]

Much rather you stop the bleed, push.

[Matt Casey]

Too, because I'll ask that question. I'm like, hey, how long does it take to bleed to death? And I get people, you know, like three minutes. I'm like, okay, cool. Yeah, yeah. That's how much time it takes for you to lose enough blood to die. But I'm like, what is your part time? What should be your, your, your, your part time to get that turn right?

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

And I'll show them a video. I'm like, once you suffer an arterial bleed and you're about the 42nd mark, dude, you lost so much blood that you're starting to. You're gonna become combat ineffective and you're not gonna be able to take care of yourself. So if it's in your car, it might as well be on the fucking moon because you're not gonna get to it. You know, I break it down big purple, dinosaur style, but I'm like, what's your resting heart rate? He's like, oh, 70 beats a minute. I'm like, cool. That's sitting here. Now just imagine you just got, you just got toned, alerted you, you know, you're going to an armed robbery. That liquor store has been hit three times this week. Your arrested heart rate is no longer 70 beats a minute. You're going there and you're pumping triple digits now. Now you get out and the dude points a gun at you and shoots you. I go. My resting heart rate after my shooting, fire rescue just per policy came out and checked. It was like 160 beats a minute. And it was like 10 minutes after my shooting because I was, I was up there.

[Brenton]

Yeah.

[Matt Casey]

You know, and I'm like, dude, that your heart's pumping that fast, you, you ain't got no three minutes, man. You got about 40 seconds and then the walls are going to close in on you and you're going to be. You're not going to be able to save yourself at that point.

[Brenton]

And the first time, taking that tourniquet out and figuring it out how to, you know, is not the time.

[Matt Casey]

And that's, and that's the other thing. Like I. There's some good videos out there. There's. There's a good video out there from, from Vegas. And they, they take a tourniquet out and they, they turn it into a Rubik's Cube under stress. And you know, it's like, you know, again, it's, it's like anything, you know, reloading your weapon, it's muscle memory. You know, grabbing your, grabbing your tourniquet, it's muscle memory. And it's, you know, or, or having.

[Brenton]

Just like you, you do it to a point where you can reload your weapon at night when you can barely see anything. Same thing with your tourniquet. Now turn the lights off. Can you still get that tourniquet off your kit? And can you still get it on any of your appendages? Well, that's the correctly.

[Matt Casey]

The kit thing is, is great because especially in Florida, we get a lot of, you know, like, hey, man, it's hot. I'm running a class next Month and it's going to be hot as balls. And you know, cops like, dude, do I have to wear my vest? I'm like, hey man, you paid me. Like, I don't care what you wear, but I suggest you train you. You know, I seen a lot of cops go and you know, yeah, I'm not telling you what hand's going to be injured, but, but you may not be able to reach that with, you.

[Brenton]

Know, you gotta reach with both hands.

[Matt Casey]

You know, I'm like, you know, you, it's up to you, brother, but I suggest you because you're gonna sit there and go, okay, this doesn't work where I have it placed. And I get a lot of people, you know, after class start stripping off their vest and they're like, okay, I need to, you know, reposition this there. And I love it. Yeah. And there's, there's like a lot of training scars that pet peeves of mine that I, I, I'm trying to bust.

[Brenton]

Matt, it's been a, it's been a heavy episode as, as we expected. I can't thank you enough for, for coming out and talking about all the hardships. But we'll end this episode the way we always do and we'll, we'll need one for this one. Oh, give us a funny story.

[Matt Casey]

Oh, all right, this one going to get me canceled.

[Brenton]

You already retired. You're good. Names and locations can change.

[Matt Casey]

All right, so in Iraq, I was at TQ Alticatum. Big Big air base was one of Saddam's big air bases.

[Brenton]

Okay.

[Matt Casey]

We're my hooch. Uh, I was a lucky individual. I had my own little wooden shack. Like it was just my own little hooch. So.

[Brenton]

Perks of being a medic.

[Matt Casey]

Perks of being perks of being a medic.

[Brenton]

All right.

[Matt Casey]

And E5, I made E5 country too. So that was nice too. But we were getting a lot of from our preventive med techs for piston and bottles. Like so they'll do health and comfort inspections. And so our, yeah, when your air.

[Tyler]

Conditioned chew is one second away from the bathroom.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah. Yeah. And his soap is I gotta, I gotta battle the scorpions and you know, 200 yards of Iraq sand just to go take a piss. So it's probably like 3:00 o'clock in the morning. And our, our base had an internal security that was done by Uganda. Yeah. You know, jumbo, right? Yeah. And let me tell you something. These dudes are, you know, blacker than black. I mean, they're dark and I, I wake up in the middle of the night, and I'm like, I gotta piss. I'm not walking. So my. My hooch was like three steps up, and right outside of it is just hesco barriers, okay? So I'm eyes closed. It's pitch black in the desert, and I'm just. I got a good stream going. I'm hearing it hit the hesco berries, and I hear my stream change cadence, right? I pissed right on a Ugandan soldier as he was walking through my little alleyway. And, you know, I'm like, oh. I grabbed my little Pez light and I just see there, and he has this tan boony cap, and it's just. The piss is just dripping off the rim, and he's jumbo, and the guy.

[Brenton]

Just my walks away.

[Matt Casey]

And I'm like, you know, something tells.

[Brenton]

Me he pulled a little less security for the next week. You know, these guys.

[Matt Casey]

I'll be lying if I told you I could tell them different. They all looked exactly the same, you know, but. You know, but yeah, you're gonna get demonetized because I pissed on African.

[Brenton]

It happens. I hate to say it.

[Matt Casey]

It happens.

[Brenton]

Well, it happened to you.

[Matt Casey]

Yeah, sure. Should happen to me, but.