THE CANADIAN TRANS SHOOTER (02/12/2026)

Summary

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The Antihero Broadcast

Episode: THE CANADIAN TRANS SHOOTER
Date: February 12, 2026
Host: The Antihero Podcast
Duration: ~2 hrs

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Episode Overview

This episode of The Antihero Broadcast centers on recent news of a mass shooting in Canada involving a transgender shooter. The hosts tackle wide-ranging topics including the intersection of mental health, hormone therapy, youth gender transition, policing and mental health, critiques of capitalism, and military/veteran perspectives. The conversation is candid, controversial, and sometimes confrontational—typical of the show’s rough-around-the-edges, blue-collar, veteran-first tone.

Note: Ads and non-content segments have been excluded.

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Key Discussion Points

1. The Canadian Trans Shooter: Initial Reactions & Framing

(Starts: 02:55)

• Canada experiences a high-profile mass shooting by an individual identified as transgender.
• Hosts express concern over the intersection of mental health and hormone therapy.
  • “What causes you to rage is the hormone imbalance.” – B (03:07)
• Critical of youth access to hormone therapy and gender transition.
  • “There’s no way you should be able to get behind that as a parent and support that behavior because their brain hasn’t developed…” – B (04:14)

Notable Quotes:

• “A lot of that rage and this anger you’re seeing might be mental health, but it could also be imbalance in hormones…” – B (03:22)

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2. Youth Transition, Gender Dysphoria & Parenting

(04:39–10:17)

• Concerns about societal encouragement of gender transition for children and teens.
  • Hosts argue children are too young to make such decisions emotionally and neurologically.
• Criticism of parents who enable transitioning in youth.
  • “It should be illegal, because the child is not old enough to know.” – B (05:52)
• Discussion of drag shows and exposure of children to adult content.
  • “How do they have to even ban that? Where are they doing drag shows at schools?” – C (05:34)
• Growing attention-seeking in youth potentially tied to identity crises.

Notable Quotes:

• “We put an age on drinking… We don’t put an age on transitioning, we don’t put an age on hormones.” – B (09:06)
• “Probably the most dangerous thing on earth is a liberal white female.” – B (09:42)

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3. Details on the Canadian Shooting & Patterns

(10:17–16:43)

• The attacker had a documented mental health history; guns were seized, but later returned to the home.
  • “Guns removed… family petitioned to get the guns back… There’s gotta be anger and hate.” – B (10:21)
• Discussion of family structure’s role; many shooters grew up in single-parent households.
  • “It’s always never a dad… it’s typically a mom household.” – C (15:15)
• Outrage that mental illness is insufficiently addressed by social/social safety nets.

Notable Quotes:

• “Not taking a young kid and manipulating their brain… is that not… up there close to [pedophilia], man?” – B (13:03)
• “...Hormones for life. Make the shirt.” – B (14:19)

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4. Broader Systemic Discussions—Guns, Laws, and Political Polarization

(23:41–25:50)

• Gun control is debated; Canada has strict laws but still experienced tragedy.
  • “Canada has some very, very strict gun laws?” – E (23:41)
  • “So that’s funny if you say that… gun laws don’t work.” – C (23:56)
• Both right and left politicize events instead of seeking pragmatic solutions.
  • “The right is going to jump on the transgender train, the left is going to jump on the gun train, and the middle is going to continue to suffer.” – B (24:05)

Notable Quotes:

• “Somewhere in the middle is the regular people going, ‘You two keep battling it out. How do we survive?’” – B (24:52)

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5. Parenting, The Nuclear Family, and Societal Trends

(31:04–41:24)

• Extended dialogue over the decline of the nuclear family and economic pressures.
• One listener (Ryan, guest) attributes much familial breakdown to “late-stage capitalism” and housing insecurity.
  • “I think the nuclear family is under attack by late-stage capitalism…” – D (38:41)
• Debate over whether modern parents (and especially single mothers) can provide adequate support.
• Acknowledgement that classic family models were not perfect—domestic violence, abuse, and infidelity were rampant.

Notable Quotes:

• “There is not a single person I know where the husband goes to work and the wife can stay home and live… unless they’re rich, rich.” – B (39:55)

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6. War, Veterans, and Culture of Violence

(42:20–56:03)

• Deep discussion with guest (Ryan, a left-leaning Marine veteran):
  • Veterans’ guilt, the “hero” narrative, and disillusionment with U.S. interventions.
  • Questioning whether killing in war makes one happier or more troubled.
    • “Let’s just think about that for a second… isn’t that question… a bit unhinged?” – D (42:49)
  • “If I had killed people, would I be a happier person?”—Reflective, not literal, question (42:20)
  • Reflection on the deception in patriotic narratives (“ra-ra,” “American exceptionalism”), historical context for anti-war veterans, and the military-industrial complex.

Notable Quotes:

• “We just agree on football teams, we should just go to war and kill each other…?” – B (44:31)
• “We dodged an immoral bullet.” – D (49:08)

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7. Inclusion, LGBTQ+ Veterans, and Mental Health

(51:08–56:03)

• Ryan: Large, under-acknowledged LGBTQ+ presence in veteran communities; need for inclusive veteran support.
  • “There’s a whole LGBTQ portion of our veteran community that is basically ignored.” – D (53:14)
  • “Transgender veterans self-harm at greater rates than any of us do. So when we’re making, cracking all these jokes and things, it has a real impact.” – D (54:45)
• Hosts agree every veteran, regardless of personal politics, deserves support.
  • “Why wouldn’t I want [a veteran] to go to you?” – B (50:28)
• Invitation for broader empathy and the importance of dialogue.

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8. War, Heroism, and U.S. History

(56:03–61:46)

• Is U.S. military action genuinely heroic or has it become more horrific than heroic since WWII?
• Critique of hero worship and propaganda in modern American military culture.
  • “When was the last time the US military did anything heroic? Isn’t it true… it’s horrific, not heroic?” – D (59:14)
• The plan to discuss communism, anti-communist rhetoric, and societal myths about leftist politics in future episodes.

Notable Quotes:

• “World War II, greatest generation mythology… has perpetuated these morally bankrupt wars ever since.” – D (60:16)

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9. Policing, Mental Health, and The Role of Social Workers

(90:15–119:47)

• Veteran guest Nick Prawl joins to discuss police response to mental health crises, especially involving veterans.
  • Criticism: Cops lack specific mental health training and their presence can escalate situations.
  • Is a hybrid police–social worker approach viable? Should social workers be sent into potentially dangerous situations at all?
• Realistic limitations: Too few resources, insufficiently trained personnel, fear of liability.
• Hosts provide an insider’s view on the practicalities and tragedies of real-life crisis response, both as veterans and former police.

Notable Quotes:

• “If you need shields, it’s already too late. If we’re bringing shields out, I don’t think… [it’s] the social worker point.” – C (101:33)
• “The majority just wants to go to school, to work, to church, to the mall. And they don’t want to get robbed, and they don’t want to have a shooting in front of them.” – B (106:57)

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10. Broader Reflections: Cops, Veterans, and Societal Responsibility

(121:04–End)

• Ongoing issues with support for veterans and law enforcement suffering trauma or sustaining life-altering injuries.
  • Critique of lack of a “VA” equivalent for police officers.
• General frustration with societal expectation for first responders and veterans to “suck it up,” masking deep trauma.
• Shared hope: Even small improvements (e.g., 10 fewer veteran suicides per year) are worth pursuing.

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Selected Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Hormones & Transitioning:
  • “There’s a lot of these people… going mentally ill, that are getting on hormones… a lot of that rage… could also be imbalance in hormones.” – B (03:22)
• On Children & Transitioning:
  • “You start mutilating minds. You start mutilating genitals. You start mutilating… adding chemicals into the equation.” – B (07:45)
• On Parenting & Society:
  • “Probably the most dangerous thing on earth is a liberal white female.” – B (09:42)
• On Political Division After a Shooting:
  • “The right is going to jump on the transgender train, the left is going to jump on the gun train, and the middle is going to continue to suffer…” – B (24:05)
• On Mental Health & Policing:
  • “I don’t think that veterans in crises particularly respond well to law enforcement.” – C (98:53)
• On Empathy Within the Veteran Community:
  • “Why wouldn’t I want [a veteran] to go to you?” – B (50:28)
• On Critiquing US Wars and Heroism:
  • “Isn’t it true that the US Military, if we’re going to use more precise language, is horrific, not heroic?” – D (59:14)
• On American Society’s Problems:
  • “The majority just wants to go to school, to work, to church, to the mall… they just want to go exist.” – B (106:57)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

| Time | Segment/Topic | |-------------|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 02:55 | Introduction to "the Canadian trans shooter" topic | | 03:05–05:52 | Hormones, mental illness, and influence on violence/trans rage | | 05:52–10:17 | Youth transition, parenting, drag shows controversy, and societal confusion | | 10:17–16:43 | Specifics of the Canadian attack, family structure debates | | 23:41–25:50 | Guns, law, and political polarization after shootings | | 31:04–41:24 | Parenting, nuclear family, capitalism, and breakdown of traditional structures | | 42:20–56:03 | Interview with Ryan (Marine veteran): war, hero narratives, veterans’ identities | | 51:08–56:03 | LGBTQ+ veterans, mental health, veteran solidarity | | 56:03–61:46 | War, heroism, mythmaking, and future communism debate tease | | 90:15–119:47| Policing and mental health: social workers’ role, responses to vet crises (with Nick Prawl)| | 121:04–End | Conversation shifts to systemic support for cops and veterans, closing reflections |

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Tone & Style

• Direct, irreverent, and at times offensive.
• Conversational and unscripted, openly debating hot-button topics.
• Host dynamic: Critical, sometimes reactionary, but allows for diverse and dissenting opinions among guests.
• Humor: Crude, dark, in line with veteran/law enforcement subcultures.

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Summary Takeaways

• The show’s hosts are highly concerned with the confluence of youth, mental health, hormone therapy, and cultural messaging about gender—especially when it comes to the risk of violence or life-altering consequences for young people.
• There is a recurring critique of both the right and left for exploiting tragedies for political gain without addressing root causes.
• Policing mental health crises—particularly among veterans—remains a no-win situation due to practical, legal, and liability constraints.
• The episode features a unique level of openness to dialogue: regulars and guests disagree sharply but are united by a “veteran-first” ethic, and share a sense of systemic neglect.
• The program leans heavily anti-communist, but values understanding the “other side”—even inviting a self-identified communist/leftist Marine to share his views, though these remain contentious for much of the core audience.

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For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In:
This episode will give you a window into the raw, unapologetic conversations occurring in veteran and blue-collar spaces. The hosts are not afraid to tread controversial ground, sometimes crossing into territory that will be jarring or offensive to more mainstream audiences, but the episode also demonstrates that sharp disagreement does not preclude honest dialogue or a shared desire to help those in crisis.

Transcript

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[C]

All right, so topic of the day, the trans Canadian shooter.

[B]

Bad news.

[C]

Well, Canada's getting a taste of it now.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Oh, Canada.

[B]

Here's my. Before we dive all the way, here's an interesting thing. This is what I was thinking on the way here. What do we talk about? We talk about roid rage, right? Steroids. Steroid. Roid rage. And it's hormones. People that don't know. Know a little bit about steroids is steroids doesn't cause you to rage. What causes you to rage is the hormone imbalance.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So men will take testosterone in high levels. It will cause their estrogen to go up. So now they have male and female emotional. They're emotional. They're estrogen and their testosterone are levels where they're a man and a woman at the same time. So a lot of these people that I think are going mentally ill, that are getting on hormones and doing things, a lot of that rage and this anger you're seeing might be mental health, but it could also be imbalance in hormones or how they're taking them or what they're doing. But now, yeah, you're seeing a complete imbalance of people's brains. And I have no problem. I was gonna do the phone call thing. Caitlyn Jenner transitioned, right? Caitlyn Jenner, Bruce Jenner, at what, like 60, 65?

[C]

You know what?

[B]

I have no, no care in the world. You're 50, 67 years old and you lived your whole life. But I'm saying you lived your whole life, right? Your brain is developed. You've all the experiences in the world and you decided to switch gender.

[C]

Great.

[B]

You're 16 year old, 15 year old, 14 will tell you the first person that says I love you to them is their soulmate. Their brain doesn't know the world. So when they tell you they want to be a man or a woman and they're opposite of what they are, there's no way you should be able to get behind that as a parent and support that behavior because their brain hasn't developed to the point they even understand all the consequences. And then you introduce drugs and hormones into their young system. It's a disaster. Yeah, it's a disaster.

[C]

Look at all of. Not all of them. A lot of the recent mass shootings are transgender.

[B]

Yes, yes, yes. It's a combination of, I'm sure mental health. Because is it, I'm not going to call it.

[D]

Is it.

[B]

When I say normal, I'll put normal quotes. Is it normal to transition? I would say no. Do we see a lot of it because it's shoved in our face. Yes, but it's not normal to wake up and go, you know what? Today's the day.

[C]

So they're already starting off in a.

[B]

Just different. Yeah, mentally it's different.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. Just like we call other conditions that people do that are unacceptable, this one is acceptable enough. And I think in an adult you can do whatever you want. I agree with an adult. But when you got 6 year olds, 7 year olds, I think it's in Arizona, they're fighting the, the, the, they're, the drag people are fighting to be able to continue to do drag shows in front of juveniles. They banned it.

[C]

That's insane.

[B]

They banned it like 6 year olds.

[C]

How do they have to even ban that? Where are they doing drag shows at schools?

[B]

Yeah, all over. This, this cross dressers up at the podium with makeup and all this stuff on going, I should have the right to dance in front of these children. I've been dancing. And it's like, what, what?

[C]

You shouldn't even have to ban something like that. That's not even something to ban.

[B]

Let the child develop and even the parents, we see it all the time. Parents are transitioning their children. All you. It should be illegal because the child is not old enough to know if the boy in fourth grade that passed him a note really loves him or not. Of course not. We're undeveloped at that point. So how do you allow them to make a conscious decision that they want to change their sex at 7, 8, 9, 10? It's, it's insane that we have to have. Talk about it. Yeah, it's insane we have to talk about it. But that's where we're at. That's what's going on and that's, that's leading, I believe, to these situations where there's mental illness maybe already. Then you introduce the, the transition and then the, the outside world and the making fun and all the other things that go with it. And do you think that, do you.

[C]

Think that kids out, if they're not influenced by the outside world would even think about transitioning? No, I don't think that. I think kids have behavior problems. I think kids have lots of different problems that get diagnosed, but I don't think gender confusion is one of them. I think that's an exterior issue that's being forced on them. And they're like, oh, I. I do. That is me. Well, think about, let's say, gender dysphoria.

[B]

Yeah. Like, let's. I mean, I guess it goes down. There's a whole rabbit hole. Like, you want to be a football player? You're like, well, I'm never gonna be a football player. I'm tiny. I'm five two, 120. I'm a male, and I'm never gonna be. I put a wig on and start dancing around. I'm gonna get attention. Like, people are gonna be like, whoa, look at this. And maybe it's some type of illness where they go, I need attention. Some of it. And then, you know, we went through the whole. Obviously, when I was a kid, to say you were gay was a huge deal. Like, that was. That. That was bad. Like, it was. There was a whole.

[C]

It never happened.

[B]

Yeah, we went through that whole thing, and obviously, there's a lot of gay people that had to be very quiet, not talk about it. But then it became accepted. I had no problem with that part of it. That part of it, to me is that's. That's your choice. When you start mutilating minds. Mutilating.

[C]

Mutilating minds.

[B]

Mutilating minds. You start mutilating genitals. You start mutil. You start adding chemicals into the equation that were maybe on. Like I said, testosterone was a taboo. Couldn't do it 10 years ago. It was bad.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Now you're gonna go, here, girl, you want to be a boy? Just start jamming away.

[C]

Men can't get testosterone by their doctors, by their primary care doctor. That's why you have to go to places like human performance. But children can get it administered by a doctor.

[B]

Correct. To transition as a girl and go, oh, by the way, guess what? When you finally develop in five years and you're 20 and you're like, man, I changed my. Guess what. That hair doesn't stop growing on your beard.

[C]

No, that.

[B]

That. That doesn't stop. That doesn't stop. It's there for the rest of your life. You've altered your body permanently. And now you have hair, beard, mustache. You're never going to get rid of it. And you might go, damn, that was a bad. And then maybe you go crazy. So it's.

[C]

Yeah. You get mad.

[B]

Yeah, I would. Yeah.

[C]

All society told me I should do.

[B]

Damn, I change. You know, I get one shot, right? And then you changed, and now you have a beard the rest of your life. And you're like, man, I really like to go back to being a girl.

[C]

You can't. I think that it's, it's important for parents to be present. So that's the first one. And to really shield children when they hear stuff like this and the children get like, I, I think that like, no, it's not you, dude. It's not you at all. This, this is all mumbo jumbo.

[B]

That's why it sounds silly, but we put an age on drinking, we put an age on tobacco, we put an age on all these things that we consider bad your body. But we don't put an age on transitioning, we don't put an age on hormones. You should have to develop as a human to a certain point in your life and go, okay, I'm 25 and I still want to be a girl. Enjoy. Do it up.

[C]

But that becomes the prettiest girl you can ever be. The age old thing is, well, we have to decide as a society when it, when it's appropriate. Yeah.

[B]

And you have half the United States that thinks it's like four years old. Yeah.

[C]

Do you think it's mostly people that would say, well, not my kids, but other kids.

[B]

Now they're, I think now we're to the point like these Seattle people and, and Karens and, and liberal white females. Probably the most dangerous thing on earth is a liberal white female. They're content, they're loud and they're convincing people it's okay to have these wild thoughts. I mean, you wouldn't do it to a dog. You wouldn't buy a dog at the vet or the shelter and go, I want this dog to be a boy instead of a girl and go get it operated on. You wouldn't do that to a dog. You did do it to a kid. Like it doesn't even make sense. Like what? Like you wouldn't do that to an animal. It's, it's bizarre, bizarre, bizarre.

[C]

What do we know about this Canadian thing? I know there's not much.

[B]

Jesse Van Rootsling. There's a video I have obviously mental health history. Guns removed from the house and then petitioned to be bought back in the house. Multiple family members said it's a family member petition to get the guns back. There's got to be anger and hate. Like I said, you start out by killing your mother and your 11 year old stepbrother before you leave the house.

[C]

And then go, that's, that's the, the, oh my God, that's, that's mental illness right there on top of hormones on top, like, sprinkled in some hormone imbalance. Kill your mother to kill your. We talked about that, didn't we? Just recently. Like the ability to.

[B]

Yeah, one of the guy. I talked about the story of the.

[C]

Guy killing his mom to kill your mother to.

[B]

How about killing your mother and your brother, not having any remorse and still being able to go carry out six more shootings. Like, when you leave the house, you're like, just killed mom and brother.

[C]

You don't.

[B]

Like halfway to the school. You don't think that was a really up thing. You're just gone. You're down the road. You're to the school, and you kill six more people and then kill yourself.

[C]

And it's. Have they ever interviewed somebody like this before?

[B]

I mean, most of them kill themselves. Yeah, I think that Stoneman Douglas guy's still alive. Most of these.

[C]

He wasn't trans, though.

[B]

No, but I mean, most of them kill themselves.

[C]

The church. The Nashville church. One was a trans. That the cop went in. Yeah, they killed Smoke. That dude or that chick or whatever she was.

[E]

It's.

[B]

It's bizarre. And the behavior is there. You see it? I mean, I got a video of the behavior. You want to play that video one. This is. This is the shooter. I mean, there's obviously some problems.

[C]

What the was that?

[B]

There's obviously some problems there.

[C]

I don't know. Oh, my God. I just. I feel for kids that don't have parents, dude.

[B]

Well, mom. Mom, we all know. Again, we don't know.

[C]

Mom. Maybe dads that your dad should walk in and beat that laugh right out of you. I'm sorry, dude. I get. I would. I would beat it out of him, and then I would take him to a doctor, and we would. And I would. I. If my son was like that, I would quit my job to make sure that he gets healthy, like, you know what I'm saying?

[B]

And this is just one of. This is another country, obviously. Canada.

[C]

But why does the laugh sound like Jimmy? We'll get Jimmy I. In just a second.

[B]

Yeah, just. It's a slippery slope, man. We have to protect our. We say it over and over again. We have to protect our children.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And obviously, pedophilia is horrible, but man is not taking a young kid and manipulating their brain and having them change their sex and not letting them develop and then dealing with the world in that altered condition. Is that not. Man, that's got to be up there, close to it, man. You're just destroying a kid that has no ability to tell you the same reason we have no ability. A kid has no ability to consent to anything. Allegedly drinking, gambling, sex at a young age. But you're gonna let them transition to another sex and give them hormones and completely change their DNA, essentially without any. Just do it. Doesn't seem very logical to me. That seems bizarre. Bizarre that we even allow it. And then it's talked about.

[C]

November Flag said, I brought. I bought goon tape. Your code didn't work. When did you buy it? Because there was issues with the code back in the day, but they fixed it. So send another message. Don't. Don't pay for it. We'll find it. Yeah, Clint said. Clint brought up a good point. Trans is 1 million in profit. Meds for life. No reproduction behavior. Health for life. Great customer.

[B]

Right up there with the big pharma. There you go. Big pharma. Pain pills are gone. So let's transition, everybody.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

Let's make money.

[C]

Hormones for life.

[B]

Make the shirt. I'm gonna make a shirt. I'll make that a shirt.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Hormones for life.

[C]

All right. Bring old Jim Bob on.

[E]

Yo, what's up, dude?

[C]

What's your take on this whole Canadian? I know you didn't get much. We. None of us got much. I kind of woke up to the news, so. Canadian. Yeah, Yesterday.

[E]

Well, there seems to be a growing trend and that mental health issues seem to create mass shooters and.

[C]

I'm sorry, with some hormones sprinkled in on it.

[E]

Well, I mean, that, that was a fantastic point that Mike made about, you know, just like, what are we doing here? Like, we're literally putting hormones into people's heads while they're, While their bodies, while their brains are still developing. Do we not expect that there might be some adverse reactions? And on top of that, your point, which is where's the parents? You know, when they're. Where are they in this whole equation?

[C]

It's always. There's always never a dad. You notice that. It's always like a single mom scenario with the trans shooter. Or really, any shooters. I don't know of many shooters. I don't know of any. I'm not saying there isn't, but it's typically a mom household who was like, I had no idea he had his guns. I had no idea he was. He was planning on doing this. And, man, you walk in and you see that laugh. Dude, what do you do, man? It's like, it's heartbreaking.

[E]

Oh, my God.

[B]

I, I.

[E]

At what point do you just check out on your kids? I mean, like, I'm pretty involved in what goes on here in this house. And I mean, for the record, like, the Discord. One of the ideas for the Discord was having a place for the kids of people in the Discord to put, you know, their kids can go play with other kids. You know, we called it the daycare.

[C]

Right.

[E]

And it's got very limited access. There's not a lot of people in there, you know.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

And, you know, I mean, that's just, you know, a good thing to do in this day and age. So how do you just check out, man, and just watch your kid disintegrate and go, yeah, it. You know, they'll figure it out. Like, no, man, that's your job. Your job is to make them good adults. And clearly, you're not doing a very good job.

[C]

No, I mean, well, we got soft, man.

[B]

The bottom line, bottom, bottom line, at the root of all these problems we discuss weekly, we got soft.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

It got unpopular to say, hey, you're up. Like mental hospitals, like state institutions, like, hey, bro, this. That person laughing in that video should not be walking around. No, they should not. It's unfortunate, but.

[C]

It is unfortunate.

[B]

However it got there. However it got there, it happened. It's just like your kid gets. It happens. When your kid goes and commits a crime. You raise them, they did something wrong, they go to jail. Something happened along the way of you raising your child chemically or behaviorally. Something happened where you allowed. Maybe not all the time. Maybe it's a. It's a. An issue. Mental health issue. That's different. But something allowed this to happen. So at some point, society has to step in and go, that one can't walk around. Sorry. Like that one can't walk around. We see it all the time. The New York stabbing, mental health case. Like they're happening over and over. Then school shootings. We're all about the training, right? We're training. Uvalde, we're training. We're buying shields like yesterday's episode. We're getting all these tools together to handle the problem when it's active.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

What are we doing for the years or weeks or months before the person actually gets the gun, shoots mom and brother and walks into the school? What are we doing to prevent that?

[C]

Where's. I'll tell you what. We got the public school. We're mandatory, right? Mandatory. Send our sk. Mandatory that kids have to get education, right. Homeschooling is taking. Is taking a front seat in this. Now, I know that Jimmy stated that they're going to look into that But Right, right, but we have to send our kids to school. So if we can't homeschool, they got to go to state school. Right. They got to go to some kind of state funded school. Where are the counselors at? How has that kid not been identified by anybody?

[B]

They have, dude, there was. They said they were Baker acting and putting institutions over and over. But how long do you keep them? Where do you keep them? How long you know what a Baker Act? 72 hours, they're right back out. You see him at the same gas station three days later. How do you. It's a mass problem that we just keep. I just like.

[C]

You think there was bullying in there? Like, dude, when I was. How old Was that kid?

[B]

18.

[C]

18. When I was 18 I was borderline and I was. Yeah, I know but I, I never once thought about anything like that. I didn't really like, like never cross my mind to hurt somebody like that like at school or hurt myself like it just blows my mind that an 18 year old's already there.

[B]

I got mad like I raised my room and wanted to kill my mom and dad for not let me had.

[C]

Those draft like the joker.

[B]

Yeah. My mom didn't let me have ice cream at dinner. I hope she dies tonight. But yeah. What point do you actually start taking you taking this to that level where you're comfortable like it. I don't know, man. We've failed massively and.

[E]

Yeah, but, but who are going to be the ones that are going to have to deal with this out in public? It's the cops. And then, and then they're going to question the cops on who they shoot and why. Well, he was having a mental health crisis. Yeah, well he's been having one for the last 15 years and that's not my FAU. I'm just a poor bastard that ended up in a bad position where I had to shoot him.

[C]

Yeah, whatever. They calling themselves parents all the time, man. They want to call us when that kid's raging out, you know, hormoning out and then all of a sudden when you have to go. I. But that. See, that's the type of kid that wouldn't go hands on with you. He would comply immediately.

[B]

Yeah, for the most part.

[C]

Hey, that's why they kill themselves. They want to take out as many soft targets as possible before opposition comes and then they kill themselves. They haven't no inkling at all to fight it out with the police.

[B]

But we, we've glazed over like this is on the stand on this point. We glazed over all the issues that lead to it. And we as law enforcement spend thousands and millions probably of dollars dealing with equipment and active shooter drills to protect the school. Inevitably going to happen. We do nothing, it seems to prevent birth to that point in their lives of dealing with all those problems. And how do we stop those kids from being to the point of shooting up a school? Like we see that kid, you go to that kid's house, you've been there, dude, how many calls have you walked in? You have to. I equate it to animals too. I'm bet. You know I am with dogs. You go drive by a house just like you have the way you ended up with your dog. You drive by house, you go handle a call and you see a dog in the backyard tied up. He's been out there for years. His bowl's too far away. He's wrapped around the. You know, like, I gotta, I can't think about. I gotta leave. I can't think about. Because if I drive around then I'll think about that the rest of the day. Maybe the next year.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

How many times have you been in a house, you walked in, saw the kids and go, these kids are.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

You're like, there is no. I remember the one that sticks out the most in my head. I know I hate talking about my career was. I remember going to this DCF call where they were coming to investigate the kids and the little girl pulled on my short. My, my gumbelt. She's like, can you look at this? And I'm like, yeah, what is it? You know, we're trying to play. She has my report card. She's like, look, I got A's and B. She's like five, six years old. Like, that's good. She's like, yeah, mommy and daddy don't care. I'm like, I remember. I remember standing there and this is a day to day hotel rental in like the middle of the hood. I'm like, yeah, you know they will. And I'm looking, everything's in buckets. Everything's in like shits everywhere. And they're not going to take the kids away. They're gonna bounce in their plate. I remember, I've never forget that was. That was probably 15 years ago. And I've never forgot that look on that girl's face where she was just like, somebody look at this report card. Yeah, I got good grades and that stuck with me forever. And if we. I'll go mentally ill. Like if I had to sit there and try not to forget that Stuff because it's like, I can't save every dog, can't save every kid. How many times have you seen the beginning of that at a call? Yeah. And you're like, this kid's gonna end up like, crazy.

[C]

Like. Or you go to a really nice house, right? Like upper, upper, middle, upper class, upper, upper class. And they've got that type of teen. And it's the parents downstairs drinking a drink at 8pm going, I can't deal with them. Deal with them. They're upstairs with their headphones on, playing video games or whatever. And like, hey, man, what's up? And I'm able to talk to this person somewhat normal. And I go back downstairs, I'm like, have you tried, like, talking to them? And it's always a tit for tat. It's always. I'm like, dude, if your relationship with your kid is so in such shambles, you have to start from the drawing board. And I'm like, you have to. Like, when they're destroying the house because you took their phone. I was like, so unless you want to deal with this every day, you lost that battle disciplining your kids. Now they're as tall as you. I was like, we need to give him some kind of, some kind of system to earn it back. Earn it back. Nope, not getting it back. I'm done. Like, okay, so you're choosing this. And I get it, they're frustrated. But at the end of the day, don't put your penis in somebody and ejaculate and have a kid.

[B]

Those rich houses you'll see normally is like, they're not willing to give up the country club lunch. They're not willing to give up the trip to Bali. They're not giving, you know, we're going out of town. That kid's probably with a babysitter since they were like five. So it's not just porpoise. I'm not saying it's just like people going house to house. It's. You're right. It happens in Richmond rich neighborhoods too, where the kids completely ignored for years and then they develop this shitty behavior and it's the same thing. So it's, it's, it's across the board. But we can't continue to train active shooter and how to stop it if we're not going to address before it happens. And in this, I mean, area, are.

[E]

We not going to address the elephant in the room that Canada has some very, very strict gun laws?

[C]

Oh, yeah, it was a rifle, right? I don't know it had to have.

[B]

Been a rifle, but they took the guns when it got them back. Multiple times. As strict as Canada.

[C]

Yeah. So that's funny if you say that. It's like the. You know the old saying, gun laws don't work.

[B]

No.

[D]

No, they don't.

[B]

It's not the gun's fault.

[C]

And.

[B]

And that's where the whole, like, I agree with Dom on some of this stuff is like, the right is going to jump on the transgender train, the left is going to jump on the gun train, and the middle is going to continue to suffer because those people that died had. Have no dog in that. No. No fight. No dog in that fight. They're just people at school trying to go to school, educate, learn, and they get in the middle of this transgender gun battle. That ultimately is what happens. Soon as there's a shooting. What is it? Rifle from the left. What is the other side? It must be a transgender. And it goes both sides. Dig in immediately.

[C]

Training.

[B]

Yep. Without the facts, it's like, stand on it. Stand, stand, stand. And somewhere in the middle is the regular people going. You two keep battling out. How do we survive? How do I go to school tomorrow without getting killed?

[C]

For those of you that just join us. Hey, Lewis, play that video again. We're gonna watch. This was a video of the shooter. That's a cry for help. Yeah. Okay.

[B]

That's me after the Giants lose every week.

[C]

I'm not gonna lie. I'm not gonna lie. So this is in no way comparing, but the lap is a little similar to when Jimmy's dying. Laughing. It's just a little similar.

[E]

I mean, I'm not.

[C]

But I cough.

[E]

I'm coughing.

[C]

Yeah. Oh, man. But, yeah, I mean, that, like you said, you. That's a cry for help. To videotape yourself doing that is you're hoping somebody finds that you really are.

[E]

I mean, but, I mean, if you look at her face, it looks like she's about to cry. He. She. Whatever it is.

[C]

Wait, hold on. Is it a biological male?

[B]

Yeah. Transitioning to a female.

[C]

Okay. She looks like she's about to cry.

[E]

Like.

[C]

Like.

[E]

Like, you know, there's a difference between, like, cry, laughing, you know, and there's. And there's something else. When, you know, like, somebody is so overwhelmed and incapable of dealing with their emotions that they're laughing and. And crying almost at the same time. And. And it looks like, you know, look to me like I'm looking at her face or his face, whatever it is. It's like trying to, like. Like a stifle. A sniffle, you know, and then laughing again like that looks like somebody who's lost, man.

[B]

Levels of this mental health, there's different level. There's this extreme level, but I'm gonna tie it in. These cops that are on tick tock that are doing it for the same. They're doing it for some type of attention. They're not going to go maybe shoot anything up, but they're having some mental illness where they need attention and they're crying out for attention. So I'll get it any way I can. And that might be through videos that might be through saying wild on social media, a hot take on something. But I mean, it all results back revolves back to mental illness.

[C]

And you guys are both right. It's there. It's there that if. If somebody was able to find that video of him laughing, that means it was up. And at least a handful of people had seen that.

[B]

Well, that goes back to your parenting thing. If you saw your kid today make that video, you'd go home and be like, you probably stop the show. Okay, I gotta go. I gotta go. Like, my kid just posted this video.

[C]

Yeah. You wouldn't see me for.

[B]

That's what I'm saying. You're like, I gotta go deal with this.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

The fact that it's. They're so removed and that's going on, it's just, you know. And you know, what do you mean? Drill the mom now? Mom lost her kid or kid's a criminal and killed six people. Well, no, mom's dead. Never mind. I was still alive. Some of these moms still alive. I forgot her mom was dead, but a family member. So let's say mom lives like. But what do you do? Like, there's other ones where mom's alive. Like, how do you go. Like, imagine that being your child. And then it's like, where did I go wrong? And they know where they went.

[E]

Exactly.

[C]

Right.

[B]

It's like now. Well, that didn't work out. Being absent and not ever going in their room one time and never holding them accountable, never disciplining them. That didn't work. That was a bad idea. It's too late.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Maybe I shouldn't let them start taking hormones to be a girl. Maybe I should have made a better decision. I don't know if they were taking hormones. I'm just like throwing that out there. But.

[C]

Well, I mean. Oh. So.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

Because you can switch your gender without you just. You can identify as a different.

[B]

Yeah. To actually transition, you have to take hormones.

[C]

Yeah. It should be noted. We have no evidence whatsoever that this kid was getting hormones. We were just talking about in general, when they give hormones to children. Speaking of controversial topics, we have Ryan. Gonna join us? Jimmy, we'll hit you back in a couple minutes. All right, bro. Later, dude. I'll go ahead and bring on Ryan. Is he here? No, he's not here. Oh, I thought he was. I can't see it on my glass.

[B]

That's the video back of the video. Did you send it to him?

[C]

Yeah, he's got it. So.

[E]

You.

[C]

You.

[B]

You know what. What is. What if you had a magic wand? What's the answer?

[C]

Parenting.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

I mean, like. But I say that, but Jeffrey Dahmer's dad wrote a book about being, like, the father of a monster and a love for your son. I didn't read it, so let's clarify. I did not read this book that was making it sound like I read a book. But he got in the book. He talks about how there's, like, he doesn't know what he could have done. He was always there for his son.

[B]

Okay, so that.

[C]

That.

[B]

I. I'm glad you say that, because that is. There are psychopaths. Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy. Those are different people. A lot of them come. You. Ted Bunny was a. Like, a great dude. Yeah, Everybody loved him. Like, great personality, very charming. That's different. That's a different setup than a human being who is transitioning or having all. But, like, most of these don't come from that. Like, mom and dad are just like, whoa, what happened? Like, that's usually never a. What would happen.

[C]

They're.

[B]

There's so many years of, like, disasters, but, you know, what do you do, you know, if you. To fix it? You're right. I think it starts. And here's where that whole. I hate to say this, but the whole LGBTQ thing. I'm not saying it's not okay to do that, but when you start removing what science and God intended. Take either side. Pick either side. I don't care which one you pick. Science and God had two, and they're both the same. Mother, father. You know, even in the pride, in the. In the jungle lions, there's a fatherly figure that protects and over watches the females raise your young. Let's get. Get them. Keep the same thing with God. There's the same thing. When you alter those and remove that critical part of what we were intended to do to moms, to dads, whatever it may be, it just seems to. It's kind of you're seeing the results of all that. And I'm not on people not allowed to have be gay or what I'm not saying that but it's obviously they're showing well they're always going to be psychopath. But think of back we didn't have school shooting 30 years ago now.

[C]

Right.

[B]

We had psychopaths since the beginning time Jack the Ripper, you go all the way back. We had psychopaths that were just an anomaly like that is a unique one time. One time. How many, how many schools we have to 50, 100, 200. We didn't have that because there was more structured home science based God based whatever one you pick families and when you separated that now you're seeing a what I believe is a result of it is just a smorgasbord of nonsense that's just here we are. How do we fix it?

[D]

Cops.

[B]

Cops need more training. Yeah, cops need more training. Better be better with mental health. Be better be nice de escalate like that's that seems to be the catch all for everybody and that it doesn't seem to be working.

[C]

All right, we have Ryan now.

[D]

Good morning. Hey I'm just curious about like what you think the role of just the easy access of weapons like late stage capitalism and just this like landless peasants and blackrock outbidding families on starter homes. This sort of climate chaos. Right. How there's not a lot of hope I think in the youth and so I'm wondering how that fits into this whole school shooting sort of.

[B]

I'll start with the gun. I mean kids brought guns to school as kids when you know, 30, 40 years ago. It's common for all the kids to have guns.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

There was, there was actually classes in school where you shot during school.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So I don't think the gun per se is the problem.

[C]

Well I mean. Well this last one just happened in Canada with the strictest gun laws. Correct. I mean not the strictest in the world, but stricter than ours.

[B]

Yeah. Cops can't leave their house with a gun in Canada.

[C]

Canada gun laws and this happened in Canada. So that's I, I, I would take the gun my, me personally, I would remove the gun from the situation because I don't think like Mike said guns have, they've been around forever. It's, it's something else in my opinion.

[D]

Take the guns off the table. Dude does like the economic and the environmental reality.

[C]

What did you mean by Black Rock buying out the family? I, I, I, I caught that but I don't know what you mean by that.

[D]

Do you know who Black Rock is?

[C]

I did and I, me and you could agree for days on Black Rock. I promise you we will both agree on everything that you say. But I just was curious. When you say they bought out the family, I forgot what you said.

[D]

Starter homes, right? Outbidding like families, actual humans on starter homes, right?

[C]

Really?

[D]

The BlackRock residential portfolio, you will own nothing and you will be happy.

[C]

Okay, so you're saying that they, through conglomerates, they buy up all the starter homes.

[D]

I'll tell you this. So in San Francisco, for every single unhoused citizen living on the street, there are six vacant empty housing units nationwide. It's greater than 20 to 1. I was at Stanford University and there was this mental health conference and one of the breakout rooms was about homelessness. I raised this statistic and I was curious when we might add wealth and property hoarding as available diagnoses. Because until we look at landlords, the greedy landlord and the corporate venture capitalist residential speculator, we're always going to be aiming at the wrong target. And I, and I, and I won the innovation competition by the way.

[B]

I agree, I agree with all that. But I, I want to bring us back to this topic like I, I. Because here's my easy way to justify that. In my mind, a hotel Tonight will have 90 vacancy in that hotel room. But they will not lower the price of the room because of brand awareness. They're not going to go Hilton, the room's 300 a night. But we, we have 900 open rooms. We'll give it to you for 30 bucks a night.

[C]

Day.

[B]

They'd rather have it unfilled and keep that money and that level. So everything you're saying about that, the banking industry, that's all a sham. They'd rather have a whole neighborhood of houses unsold than to lower the price of the house down where somebody can afford it thousand percent. Like I said, that is absolutely 100. But what do you like in this situation here where you're seeing this, this shooting and this breakdown of the home with a mother, a child in this transition phase and then acts out in this way. What do you think about this?

[D]

Well, the breakdown of the home is curious such that, you know, the United States, Canada, I don't have a lot of familiarity with, but it's really hard to be a parent. You know, you're overworked, you're underpaid, you got to do doordash on the side just to keep your cell phone bill on so this whole, like, breakdown of the home is, you know, a curious one. And I think, again, it's late stage capitalism that leads to, you know, I was a latchkey kid myself, ranked, you know, raised in a single parent family. So there's a lot of factors, and I don't know if it's simplified and. Excuse me, I came in late. What were you saying was, like, the cause? Was this, like, LGBTQ stuff?

[B]

No, no, no. I was saying. Yes, yes, yes. No, what I was saying was, is I. I believe in science and religion, and in science, there is a father. Even in the jungle with lion, there's a fatherly figure that protects the. The den. Right. I mean, I watched it on. I watched it the other night. I think Morgan Freeman was advertising, so I think I was saying that maybe the breakdown. And I have no problem with anybody being what they are. And I'm sure there's plenty of great homes of equal parent, father, father, mother.

[C]

Mother, but overall, probably not.

[B]

Do you think that there's any. There's nothing to that. That the house, the home, the jungle. The. The breakdown of science was mother raises kids. And I'm not saying mom in the kitchen cooking. Don't get. Don't. Don't clip me there. But there is a. There's a lion, a male lion that roams that area and protects all them from danger. Do you think there's any issue with the. That we've separated that, like, part of the house?

[C]

Nuclear home.

[B]

The nuclear home, yeah. Do you think there's any breakdown in society but do that whatsoever? Is it completely not. I'm. I'm crazy.

[D]

I think the burden of parenting is unfathomable, you know, And I think, you know our culture, right? Some families are deciding to, like, not work so that they don't, because they can't afford the daycare. You know, like, so there's.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And. And I heard that you're a fan of, like, science and religion, which are often, like, in tension with one another.

[C]

Right?

[D]

Like, what is your, like, science training background? Biology, chemistry?

[B]

You're not paying me that. I watched National Geographic. I watched the animals protect their home. That's my breakdown of it. I watched the male. The male Species of a. Of a. Yeah. On tv. Protect the young and the females from danger.

[C]

Okay, well, let me ask you something, Ryan. The. The attack on the nuclear family. I'm gonna ask you. I believe that there's an attack on the nuclear family. Okay. And the woman. I. I don't believe that two lesbians or two gay men can run a family the way a man, a woman, can run a family under God. That's my opinion. That's why you're here, to give yours or to correct me if I'm wrong. But do you think that the attack on the nuclear family being that it's, you know, toxicity and males are toxic and this and that, and women need to go out and get their own jobs and be equal to men? Splitting hairs I know we can break. You can go, well, what do you mean by equal? And I understand that, but just the, the overall argument that like all those things. Do you think that the nuclear family being under attack could have anything to do with stuff like this?

[D]

I think the nuclear family is under attack by late stage capitalism right there. If we look at the homemaker in the 50s, right? Dad was this guy that, you know, could, on a single salary, right. Buy a home, buy a new car every three years, take his family on a vacation once a year, right. He's probably also a raging alcoholic that was engaged in domestic violence.

[B]

But cheating on his wife.

[C]

Can't leave that part out.

[E]

That's true.

[B]

Cheating on his wife and playing poker Friday nights.

[C]

And because, because the toxicity did get unchecked, and I do believe that when. Let's. Let's just use. Let's just use vague dates, right? 30s, 40s were a World War II era. Men are men, men are honorable. And then we hit the 50s and 60s and men go unchecked. And I believe this is where men failed women in our society. We failed them by becoming the cheaters, the abusers. We forced women as men, all of us sitting right here, we're all included in this because we are biological males. I'm not assuming you, but I'm. You said you have he in there, so. But we failed women. We forced women to start thinking for themselves, to start looking out for themselves.

[B]

I think I can go back to him with capitalism caused it, right? I'm kind of on board with this. This part of you I agree with. Because right now there is not a single person I know where the husband goes to work and the wife can stay home and live. Unless they're rich. Rich, lest they're rich. Rich on the beach side or in the. And they have generation, or they have generational wealth or they. Yeah, they have a podcast, right? But other than that, you're right, the woman has to work. Damn. Some of the kids have to work these days to keep the family rolling and pay for their own phone bill. So I think I agree with you a hundred percent that we have out priced ourselves to run the nuclear family the way it was originally being run 40, 50 years ago. So I agree with you on that part.

[D]

Well, you got to also know that the state is invested in reproduction. That's where this kind of whole nuclear family propaganda comes from. Two kids and a dog type shit. Where we need this population, right. As labor, as war fighters, things like this. Right. So it's in the state to incentivize reproduction because population and population decline is one of the biggest risks in a state. So that's where we get all this like and friend. The term is CIS male, cisgendered male. Because all males are male. Biology is biology, gender is social science. And so these are a couple different things. Glad I can help with that.

[C]

I knew I wasn't going to get away with that one. So we'll wrap up this topic. I know I talked to you yesterday off record, and we kind of wanted to jump in where the clip. Clip left off. Now, I hope that my clip didn't do anybody a disservice. I clipped them to be kind of like a movie trailer. There's a lot of aws and ohms taken out of it and you know, but at the end of the day, I like people to be happy with the clip and be like, man, you took me out of context. Because that does happen a lot when I'm in charge of the social media. A lot of people be like, man, you took what I said way out of context. I'm getting a lot of hate for it. My man Mike right here has fallen victim to that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I hope you at least understood what I was doing. The clip left it on a cliffhanger like you said, and then we can move right into it, which was you were ending it with kind of like the whole. All the mental health resources are going to combat arms and special forces guys. And it's really. Would you say it's fratricide? Fratricide.

[D]

It is a form of fratricide. And yes, veterans guilt is a form of PTSD that is also not eligible for like disability ratings and. And that sort of thing. So that's a real issue. But the clip portion that I was really curious about is this idea that if I had killed people, would I be a happier person?

[C]

Yeah, I did. That's where I left it. You're right. You're right. I left it on that.

[D]

Like, let's just think about that for a second. Let's sit in that. Like, isn't that question like not to be judgy, just a bit unhinged.

[C]

It is, but that's why I said it.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So, I mean, at the end of the day, that's that. But people ask that question. That's a question I ask people. Would it really make some guys happier that missed out on war? There's a lot of dudes that they missed out on war. How they handle it or how they cope with it or how they realize it, that it's not that bad of a thing is different. But there's a lot of men that missed the opportunity to go to war when they were expecting to. Right. They were. Their mind was there for years. I'm going. I'm totally. I'm not going. So the mind is there. But what I was asking is, do a lot of these guys, if you ask them that question I asked you, if you sat down with a guy who was, like, really struggling, that he wanted to go serve his country, and he get a chance to be like, would killing another man make you happier? Do you think you'd be happier if you took another life and more? And I'd just be curious to hear what they have to say. Yeah.

[D]

And I think that's what, you know, chasing these combat action ribbons and combat infantrymen badges is a toxic part of our culture because, like, who are we really killing?

[B]

Just killing another person.

[C]

Yeah. Who.

[D]

What is the other person? Tell me about these other people in this podcast.

[C]

I have learned so much doing this in years. I learned more talking to people than I've ever learned in my entire life from any type of education. And what I've learned is that I can't find a war that I can 100 justify outside of really any war. Every war, there's questionable. Questionable intentions from the. The entities that be.

[B]

Yeah, I guess what I know, kind of where I feel you're going with this is we just agree on football teams, we should just go to war and kill each other. Right. Because we don't. We don't agree on the team we support. So I see what you're saying. Who are they? They're people that are living. They're doing. They have their own society. They're. They're. They're doing their own economic breakdown, and we happen to disagree over something, and then we're killing them.

[D]

What are we disagreeing on?

[B]

We don't know yet. Sometimes we don't know.

[D]

Let's be clear, my friend. We're disagreeing on if they should possess their national resources or if our corporations should go in and Extract, Distract them. This is the disagreement, the name of safety.

[B]

Right.

[D]

In the name of the greatest democracy in the world, nation building. You know, let's liberate Afghan women by bombing them.

[C]

Brian, real quick, before. I don't want to forget. We're not done, but your organization, your non profit. What is that called?

[D]

It's called Compassionate Veterans.

[C]

Oh.

[D]

Promoting peace from within. But. And I know we're gonna, like, chop up this and edit it and things like that, and so I do want to answer your question.

[C]

Yes, go ahead.

[D]

I might.

[C]

Oh, whoa.

[B]

You cut out. Say it again. Over again.

[D]

I said I might be happier if I killed people because then I would live in this fantasy world and I would manufacture these convenient justification narratives that this poor, innocent farming peasant that was defending his homeland somehow deserved to die. Because I have this red, white, and blue patch on my shoulder, and I have this American exceptionalism. Rah rah, Manifest destiny that justified what I did. And I would probably have, you know, scotch and cigar in my hand, too.

[C]

You'd be a toxic male. Welcome to the club, bro. No, I mean, so. But it's interesting. You. You are not. You are not a. What is the word I'm looking for? You will actually look at yourself and go, it's possible that I would have fallen into something that I don't want to be. I can see myself right now. I can see what could have been. At the. At the slightest drop of a hat, I could be a totally different person. You could be on the other side of the protest. Yo.

[D]

And when I first got out of the military, I was a patriot conservative. Rah rah, dude. Like, y', all, you know, and then I took a sociology class on the GI Bill at community college and learned that, you know, having empathy for other human beings is actually a virtuous thing. So, yeah, I've been y', all. You know what I'm saying? And I've come along. I was. Before I was a leftist, I was a liberal. Before I was a liberal. I was a conservative before I joined the Marine Corps. I hung out with folks that were probably on the far right side.

[C]

Really?

[D]

Defense. Oh, absolutely.

[B]

And so I was like, Let me. Let me say this, though, because you can say y', all.

[C]

I did.

[B]

I didn't want to kill anybody. I joined pre 9 11, when before it was we're all going to kill people. I just joined because it was like I knew I had a job coming back. The guy goes, hey, join the military. I'll hire you as a cop. I never dreamed of being a cop either, which. What a wonderful 23 years that was. But I never wanted to kill anybody. And I'll be honest with you, I thank God every day I didn't have to kill anybody. I'm grateful I didn't have to kill anybody in combat because I didn't go. I'm. I'm like you. I didn't even go over to Iwo Jima or Japan. Where'd you go? You went all those places that Jimmy made fun of you. I. I didn't even go there. I went to Fort Polk, Louisiana, for three years and came back. So I didn't go anywhere even. I didn't even deploy overseas at any point in my career. And then I was a cop. And I am grateful every day because I have a. I have my own demons, and I don't. One of them. I don't have to worry about fighting is that I killed somebody because I.

[C]

Don'T know how I feel. Yeah.

[B]

Honestly, I would have done it. I would have done it in those law enforcement scenarios, but I don't know how it felt afterwards. So I'm glad I didn't have to do it.

[D]

I love that. You know, and thank you for that. Really honest and vulnerable reflection. It is a curious hat that you're wearing in the context of. Of all this.

[B]

I'm glad you said myself. I'm glad you say that. I'm glad you say that because I get that a lot. The. The. In the war hat or. Or the warhead. So it's not war. It's not. I want to go to war, and I have a red one back here, and I sell them. It's a war within. I fight the war at the gym. I fight the war with. Every day. And if you look at it, Dustin Poirier wears it in ufc, and Marvin Hagler wore it before that in boxing. So it has nothing to do with the act of war. It has to do with the internal war that I fight myself. Honestly.

[D]

Thank you. Well, and this idea like that, a lot of us, like, missed out on war. Right. Because that's what we trained for. That's what the indoctrination pipeline kind of readiness readied us for. That's what, like, the GI Joes as kids sort of indoctrinated us to, you know. So what I will say to those of us that did not directly participate in these morally bankrupt interventions and occupations is that we dodged an immoral bullet. And this is something we need to arrive at gratitude for that we did not stain the lineage of our ancestors with, you know, immoral, unjust state violence for the investors of the military industrial complex.

[C]

Hold on, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pin this website. Compassionate veterans. I will have like a. Well, I'll make a thing put on the screen, but for now, we're gonna pin the comment. So that way, if anybody is curious, obviously our mission right now, us talking is to. Is to bring awareness and help to veterans at no matter.

[B]

Yeah. And here's what I'll say. Here's what I'll say for people that may not like you.

[C]

Right.

[B]

I'm sure some of our followers don't like you, but if there are veterans out there that only want to talk to you, why wouldn't I want them to go to you?

[C]

Right?

[B]

They don't align with me. They might not align with the way I think, but they're a vet and they see this show and they go, well, I can get. I can align with him better. And I'm not going to have that mental health crisis I was going to have. I'm going to reach out to Ryan and talk to him.

[C]

Right?

[B]

So why wouldn't I want to generate that conversation? We can disagree.

[C]

We do.

[B]

We disagree on almost everything. But I will agree with you that if a veteran is in need and they don't want to talk to the guy in the war hat, maybe they want to talk to the guy from San Francisco that has pronouns. And that's great because he's going to get the help. As a fellow vet, we're brothers, right? We're all brothers. We're brothers in arms, all that stuff. I would rather him reach out to you and say, I'm more comfortable talking to him than reach out to nobody. So that's why we have you on. That's why we totally.

[D]

No, thank you so much. And you know what? I am from San Francisco and there are veterans that come from all over the country to San Francisco to be safe. And yeah, these are our LGBTQ veterans that have always existed.

[C]

How many are there? I know you can't give a number, but, like, is there more LBGTQ left leaning veterans out there than we would anticipate, than we would even think exists? Because I honestly, I can't think of any. You were the first one that ever popped and you. The reason why is you stood out so much in our, in our community and in our. In the people that follow us is because no one's seen a Marine that does this. And so I would be blown away if there's actually a Huge community of veterans that are like you totally.

[D]

And there's a huge heritage of this, like in California cannabis. Dennis Perrone was a gay Vietnam veteran that smuggled two pounds of cannabis back from Vietnam and turned that into a 40 year career here in San Francisco giving away free cannabis to gay AIDS patients throughout the AIDS crisis in the 80s. So that's the roots of a lot of my work, is this individual and what they did. And, you know, I would kind of just disentangle one thing. You said LGBTQ left wingers, right. And these are kind of not necessarily the same, you know, because there are some LGBTQ right wingers.

[B]

Right?

[C]

Look at. You're right. Yep.

[D]

Look at Peter Thiel, for example, right?

[C]

So.

[D]

And that guy's a fascist. But yeah, there's a whole heritage of anti war left wing veterans going back to, like the bonus army right after World War I. So there is this under discussed heritage. Like, we are not all bootlickers. And if I need to, like, come out and say, hey, you know, all this right wing bro vet toxicity is a problem. It gives folks, like, some safety because it's like, this is kind of scary, guys. I'll be honest with you.

[B]

Right.

[D]

It gives others, like, the signal that it's safe for them to do so also. So, yeah, there's. There's a whole LGBTQ portion of our veteran community that is basically ignored. And. And how many times is the F word thrown around on this podcast or in the comment sections?

[C]

Right.

[D]

I want to say hello, everybody, in the comment section.

[B]

Not the good one, not the fu One. Right? The other one, Right?

[D]

Yeah, exactly. You know what I'm talking about. It's a slur, right? How many. And. And if you just watch the jarhead movie, right. How much homoerotic grabass happens in the infantry and Special Forces? Can we. Yeah, you want to go?

[B]

This is what I was saying. I'll spin it back to. This is when we're over there, right? They're over there fighting their wars. They don't care what that guy next to him does in his free time, right?

[C]

If you're.

[B]

If you got a gun pointed at the same target as me and you're performing, I don't care what you do in your free time. And when we come back, if that same guy goes, you know what? I'm a homosexual and I don't really like the government anymore, but I did my time, should I say, well, you. You're not part of me anymore. You're not one of us. No, go talk to Ryan if you need help, go to that crew because you're still a vet. Right. For all vet bros, at one point, we all went through the same training, we all went to the same wars and did the same thing. If your mind changes and you have a different version of what you are, you still served your country. You still put the uniform on, you still put the flag patch on. You still raised your hand and said, I'm going to protect the constitution.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

You just have a different version of yourself now. I don't want you to go die. I want you to go, go be with your people. Right. You're still a vet.

[D]

Thank you. And I like this die part.

[E]

Right.

[D]

Because transgender veterans self harm at greater rates than any of us do. So when we're making, cracking all these jokes and things, it has a real impact. Okay.

[B]

So.

[D]

And I appreciate this referral. Like, hey, send these people to Ryan. Right? And yeah, it's all good. Come through. And my gentle invitation is to actually, like, not need to delegate or outsource that. Just have your own, have your own warm heart that is open to accepting folks.

[C]

I agree.

[D]

That'll get us all a long way.

[C]

Well, so I have a question. Are you totally, 100% trying to understand the other side here? Are you 100%. Any act of war or. If you could reject. If you or Ryan and we were tribal, right. We. You can either go forward in time at the world's end or go way back in the beginning and you had a tribe of 20 people and you were the head of that tribe and another tribe was coming in and they were going to do wrong by your tribe, which again, we can't. I look back at all these wars and I. It's really hard to justify most of them. Are you. Are you just against violence and war or would you go to war with that tribe based off of. Well, I have to protect mine against wrongdoers.

[D]

This is a fantastic question. And I think we have to disentangle. You mentioned tribe. Right. We have to disentangle this archetypical or indigenous warriorhood from foot soldiering for empire. Okay. These are two different things. Indigenous warriorhood, archetypical warriorhood was to protect elders, women, children.

[C]

Right.

[D]

And these portions of the population were untouchable in terms of warfare.

[C]

Right.

[D]

Which is totally different than what foot soldiering for empire does. Counterinsurgency strategy targets life sustaining resources like the buffalo here in the United States. Right. That disproportionately harms elders, women and children.

[B]

Right.

[D]

And so, yes, war is this curious Part of humanity. There is a book called Strong Minds, Wounded Hearts about the Native American Vietnam experience, Vietnam veteran experience, that talks about how in a tribal situation, war was considered this weird sort of mystery about the human experience. And they would introduce things like ritual warfare, less than lethal warfare. This is where counting coup comes from, Right. Where's this. Sneaking up on your enemy and tapping on the head is counting coup.

[B]

Silent kill.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Except, no, you're sparing their life. Oh, yeah. And then they. And then they owe you. They owe you your life.

[C]

Like an honorable thing, like an honor thing. Yeah.

[D]

And is foot soldiering for empire honorable, or do we get honorable discharges for dishonorable duties?

[C]

Oh, man, if I clip anything, that's going to be the end. Ryan, so great to have you.

[D]

One more question, One question.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

What can the GWOT veteran learn from the Vietnam veterans that threw their medals back.

[C]

A lot? I guess. I think the country did a lot of. I think the government did a lot of damage control post Vietnam. And they said, we can't have that retaliation again when we go do these proxy wars. So the next time we went into the global war on terror, we were like, hey, we've got to honor the veterans. Right? And I'm using quotes because we've got to make them feel. We got to give them the VA. We got to always, like, Right. Like Vietnam, they were looked at the way cops are looked at now. Soldiers and. And, sorry, military personnel are. Are still heroes to the everyday person, the common society. They're heroes. Right? But back then, they weren't. They were spit on. They were. They weren't giving any benefits. They. They weren't respected at all. So I think that our elite government was like, when we do this again in another generation, we have to make sure we cover our ass on this end and we keep them proud.

[B]

We.

[C]

When they come home, they're proud. They're on podcast now. They're talking about what they did for our country. Right.

[D]

Am I right? Like, hero worship is something that might be something to pick up on on the next call, Right? Because there is a propaganda sort of orientation to this, like, the language of the empire, right? The US Troop is the hero, but this brown peasant on the opposite side of the world is a terrorist, is an insurgent, is a military aged male, or all this other racist dehumanization language that we use, right? And so if. When was the last time the US Military did anything heroic? Isn't it true that the US Military, if we're going to use more precise language Is horrific. Not.

[C]

I was good. I always said World War II is our last real war. And then all of a sudden I found out a bunch of other numbers of things that. Things that don't make any sense anymore. And now I'm like looking back and that was a hard one for me to swallow when World War II might not have been the triumph over evil story that it was.

[D]

Yes. There's a great book by West Point English professor Elizabeth Samit called Looking for the Good War, American Amnesia in the Violent Pursuit of Happiness. And she talks about how World War II greatest generation mythology, because most troops were indifferent to fascism and racist, they didn't really care about Hawaiians getting bombed in Pearl Harbor. So all this mythology that we created around the Greatest Generation has perpetuated these morally bankrupt wars afterwards ever since.

[C]

All right, next time we're going to also talk about. We're going to define next Thursday when you come on. We're going to define communism and what a communist is and what a communist is to you. And if there's any actual documentation that defines communist. Because a lot of our people are saying you are the enemy. You are communists want to kill all non communists. I don't know if that's right. I don't know if that's true. I kind of wanted to talk with you about it and let you kind of. Obviously I'll go redo my own research, but I wanted to explain to you and I wanted you to explain communism to us and we will save that. And then the other topic you talked about for next Thursday.

[B]

Awesome.

[D]

Sounds great. You know, there is a whole lot of McCarthyist Red scare propaganda that misinforms us towards communism. And my favorite thing to do is to argue with landless peasants that are working class that somehow love billionaires, that, you know, communism is not the boogeyman.

[C]

That we've been calling them cucks.

[B]

I would never do that if, if.

[D]

That'S people's kink, you know, I don't kink shame people, you know, so hey, just like, ah, I won't say this. Never mind. Maybe next time.

[B]

All right. All right, Ryan, we'll see you next week, bud. Thanks for joining us.

[C]

We'll see you next week. All right, guys, we're gonna take a quick commercial break. We will be right back.

[D]

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Foreign.

[B]

We are back. And don't forget to check out my website www.copvilleog.com use code ANTI HERO15 for 15 off the best merchandise in the network. Copbil OG.com get your war hat that Ryan hates and everything else. The Copville shirts and I appreciate it. Anti Hero 15 for 15 off it's not on there.

[C]

It's on there. Cool. And Counterculture ink threads the OG T shirt company of the network. Go to counterculture inkthreads.com use promo code antihero save 15 on like this baller Ass Puff stitch hat shirts like Death or Glory Hand done. We paid. We paid humans to draw these. Natalie drew this one. And then we paid humans to ship the shirts. And we paid humans to put print on shirts. Not China. Robots anyways. And also American financing. Let's be honest, the math isn't adding up lately. Between the grocery store and those skyrocketing insurance premiums, even with a steady job, more families are being forced to rely on high interest credit cards to cover expenses. I was there. Ask Heather. It sucked if you're a homeowner, right? Caught in that cycle carrying balances with interest rates in the 20s or even 30s. It sucks. Time to get some relief. Right now mortgage rates are at a three year low and my friends at American Financing are helping homeowners pay off that high interest debt at rates in the low fives. They're salary based mortgage consultants, not commission based. So it doesn't matter how long they talk to you. Don't push loans. They build exit strategies from debt. On average, they're saving their customers $800 a month. That's. On average it could be more than $800 a month. Get yourself out of debt. Plus if you start today, you may even delay the next two mortgage payments. There are no Upfront fees or obligations to find out how much you can save America's home for home loans is American Financing. Call 866-890-8585 for more details or go to american financing.net forward/antihero to learn more.

[B]

Good job.

[C]

Thanks, dude.

[B]

Very nice.

[C]

Nailed it.

[B]

Don't forget Copville, og dot com.

[C]

Don't forget counterculture and threads dot com.

[B]

Go there.

[C]

Hey, where's Jim?

[B]

That was good. See what Lewis did? Wait, that's on the ball, Lewis. See what he clicked back. He was not zoned out.

[C]

He knew.

[B]

He flashed them both real quick.

[C]

All right, good job, Lewis.

[B]

Lewis, proud of you. All right, proud moment.

[C]

Bring old Jimmy back home. Did you watch the interview with your best friend?

[E]

Yeah, I did.

[B]

We have to keep.

[C]

Any ability to listen to a communist.

[E]

No, yeah, I can listen to him. But at the end of the day, it's all. I mean, we agree on some things about the war, but what I, what I don't really agree on is that like, you know, war was not never about for me. I mean like, yeah, we have to kill people in the war, but war was about, hey, I'm serving my country. The fact that the old men and women in charge used me is not my fault.

[C]

Yeah, and that's where I agree with you in the sense that he kind of want. It seems like he wants 18 and 19 year old kids to be thinking as we're saying, they can't have hormones because they're too young, they're not developed yet. You expect 18 kids to understand geopolitical economics and politics like, it's not going to happen. Dude, I barely understand that. I'm 40. Mike doesn't understand any of it. And he's 50.

[B]

Yeah, almost none of that.

[E]

Sorry, Mike.

[C]

Go ahead now. You're good. He was defending himself. I called him old.

[E]

Oh. None of that has anything to do with, you know, why did we go do this war? Okay, well, you know why I'm okay with killing people? Because the old men and women that were in charge of my country sent me and my friends there. And those people were trying to kill my friends. So for them. Do you want me to tell you what those people were like? I could tell you what those people were like. You may not agree with why we were there. I don't. But a lot of those people that were shooting at us were very happy with female genital mutilation. They were happy to freaking, you know, treat the, the girls in their family like, like slaves. They farmed out little boys for Rape parties. They, I mean, they were savages.

[C]

I mean, we're doing that here, apparently.

[B]

Do you think that's still going on today over there?

[E]

Oh, yeah, it's cultural, man. It's been.

[B]

But you've never gone there. They wouldn't be able to shoot at you.

[E]

And whose fault is that? I didn't decide.

[B]

I'm just, I'm just saying, like, I get. But that's never going to stop. So if we didn't go completely eliminate it, it's going to continue. So if we never went there, my.

[E]

Point was that, you know, I wasn't over there fighting people who I mostly agreed with.

[B]

No, I know.

[C]

And, and to me you're saying you were fighting for the, your, your buddies to your left and your right. Yeah. 20 years. You're not fighting for something Ryan is.

[B]

Saying is evil people are the ones who sent you there to do it.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

His argument is we come back and have tattoos and wear war hats and we're rah, rah, rah. When he's trying to say, you guys know they sent you there for the wrong reasons. Why aren't you so mad at them? That's what I think he's trying to say.

[E]

I'm fine with that. I can absolutely say that. I mean, term limits win, you know, I mean, he wants to sit here and talk about BlackRock and the infiltration of, of, of, of late stage capitalism, as he calls it, into the current political, you know, body politic. Fine. I'll tell you what capitalism has done. Capitalism has saved more people than it has killed. Communism has killed more people and hasn't produced anything of value. Okay, the communist. True.

[B]

I, I think him and Jimmy need to go at it on Shadow Cast.

[C]

I, I did. I, it's hard, Jimmy, because when, when you're the host, you have to be. I mean, I know you, you have to sit there and listen to it.

[B]

Yeah.

[E]

I mean, like you, you'd have to.

[C]

Would you do it? Because we're catching Flack right now. Not so much from the, the supporters that watch us live, but in, in Instagram St. Like, oh, you give this guy a platform. Like, so there is, there's already. We catch Flack for just listening to the other side. And you say, well, I'm listening to their side. And somebody might say, would you listen to Satan? Well, no, I wouldn't. Oh, so that's where you draw the line. You draw the line of Satan. I would not listen to what Satan has to say. I wouldn't listen to what a demon has to say. But you'll listen to what a communist had to say. And then people are like, but that's, that's kind of like what you're saying is like, there's nothing good that's going to come from a communist.

[E]

The conversation. I mean, fine, we can have the, you know, you can sit here and talk about, like, oh, the. Let's. Let's debate this in the public forum and let the best idea rise to the top. Guess what? We did that for the last 150 years. Communism doesn't work. It doesn't work in China. It doesn't. Didn't work in the Soviet Union. It hasn't worked anywhere that it's been implemented. All it has done is killed people and enslaved them and told them that they're free by having nothing. He said it himself, you. You'll own nothing and you'll be happy. That's something that got. Communists would say. I don't own anything in communism.

[C]

I think what he's trying to say is, as middle class people, we own no homes. And you know what I'm saying? I think maybe, but.

[E]

Yeah, but, but here's the thing. You can't say that and go. Which is true that BlackRock and all these other companies are making it hard for. Impossible for the American dream, and then go, but communism is the answer because we already have that. I mean, we already have that idea that we own nothing. We can't own anything. I can't go buy a home right now.

[B]

Yeah. And where. I can't. I can't get all the way with him on the. I can't get all the way with him on the, the sex thing. Like, I just can't with the, the gender. Yeah.

[E]

You guys missed a layup. You missed a layup. And I was screaming at the screen. Screen. Because he was like, he, he said, you know, you, you got to be careful because these, you know, transgender people, they kill themselves at a higher rate. Okay, well, maybe it's because they have a mental health issue.

[B]

That was. I mean, that was implied. We said that before we started that.

[E]

I just.

[B]

He's on our show. Like, that's why he got.

[C]

I mean, what I want to do, I want to give props to. Props to Jimmy, props to Clint. Props to a lot of these guys that said that. I know. I'm not. I know. I guess I'm just. Everybody's different. I know. And I'm. We're talking with Jimmy, so I'm using Jimmy publicly. But there's a lot of people in the chats that do not like or feel uncomfortable that there's a self proclaimed communist that we're engaging with. And I appreciate everybody giving us patience. It's something that we're trying, trying not to be a think tank. We're trying to also provide entertainment. It will get to the point where we are debating at volumes loud. I guarantee that will happen. But there has to be a comfort stage first where he feels, I want him to feel like he's welcome. And so once he gets him out.

[B]

It'S like, what would be your incentive to come back?

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

And you know there's a difference between entertainment. Right. Because this is entertainment.

[C]

Right.

[E]

And we need, we need to have that guy on, but we can't just make him a verbal punching bag every time he comes on and make him the butt of every joke. You know, if, if somebody.

[B]

I know he didn't like that.

[C]

You said.

[B]

Yeah, I said, I called myself a though. Yeah, I know, I know it drove him crazy. I know it drove him crazy.

[E]

Have some thicker skin, man. I'm sorry. Like, you know, right. If, if good with words can hurt you that bad, if they can hurt you that bad, maybe war was definitely not something you should have been doing.

[B]

No, I agree because I, I agree there has to be some level. Because here's the thing, like you said, you spend comedy. You throw the word comedy in front of your name. You can say whatever the you want.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I believe white people are saying the N word now in comedy skits and stuff. It's okay. There was a time when it was. You couldn't even get close.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

So when you throw the word comedy in front, you get a pass on everything. But like I say, and it's like the F word. He called F word. You saw me and I'd already said it. I knew what he's, what he was getting at. But I look at it like there's really nothing you can call me that's going to upset you. I'm not going to get upset. Now are the people that do get upset. I guess we're supposed to feel good for everybody, but this is a comedy show. You're right. It's entertainment. I'm gonna say whatever I want to say anyway, but I'm not going to go so crazy as to just go, all right, the guest was on and he's gone through 27 seconds and he's gone. So there's some level of interacting. I know if I say those words over and over again, he's going to disconnect at some point or not. So I have to like throttle him in there.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, same here.

[B]

I like to hear this virgin because people should maybe hear what I think is wrong.

[C]

I don't agree with them and I failed. I brought him on. I meant to go and the co. The, the Marine communist. What's up? You like, I meant to do that, but I was so. I'm so used to bringing on guests that, you know, are really the other side that I forgot to do that because I do want to know. He is the other side.

[E]

Every Marine that I've talked to that has seen him talk like wants a, wants a crack at him. Like, you know, our good friend Kevin wants a crack at him. Obviously Matt wants a crack at him. Brady wants a crack at him, you know, like.

[B]

Yeah, but we don't bring them on. They don't get a crack at him. And that's okay. Next week we'll have peach on with him or next week we'll have Brady, you know, whoever I know, pizza, talk to him, let them go at it. And then we just, you know, it was kind of like the Crenshaw episode where everybody's like, yeah, sh.

[C]

A cross cust.

[B]

I'm not gonna cuss out a congressman on the show. He's gonna hang up and what he's gonna do. Even on Fox News when they got the opposition or cnn, they still maintain some level of.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, you can't just go crazy.

[C]

Yeah. You, you, you have.

[E]

One of the things that you really need to delineate about this show is. And, and this is, this is going to shut down all the arguments. Why would you listen to that guy? Because this isn't actually the court of, of public opinion. This is not the forum. We're not going and having a debate about how we're going to run the country. What we're actually doing is having a conversation that's entertaining so you guys can listen to it and we could throw zingers at each other. That's what it is.

[B]

And also if we're, if we all, we all three agree he's 100 wrong.

[C]

Right?

[B]

We all agree. Would we not want to bring a guy on to show our listeners this is what you don't want to be. And I'm sure he would want to have us on if his. And say, look at the, this guy, this guy's a, he's a God loving American War vet who thinks the country did everything right. You're not going to want to, you know, you don't Want to separate yourself. So we believe he's wrong, which I do on mostly everything. But I'd like to have him talk about it.

[C]

It's just, it's fascinating to me also that, I mean, even getting Ryan and Jenny there, there's a. You guys can agree on like, as you guys say, violent agreement.

[B]

Yeah, put that last comment up, the bottom one there. Put that comment up.

[C]

A ton of poetry.

[B]

Brian has an eye patcher's butthole. Clint's level of comedy is insane, dude. All right, dude.

[E]

Clint.

[B]

I don't.

[E]

You know, you know what would be really upsetting to find out if that Clint is actually funnier in comments than he is in real life.

[C]

Yeah, he's funny.

[E]

I mean, oh, my God. Because he has some good ones. And it's like, damn, why didn't I.

[C]

Think of that comment?

[E]

You know? But, you know, the bottom line to me is, is that communism. Communism?

[C]

Oh, yeah. It's not on YouTube.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

What?

[B]

YouTube probably kicked it points comment. We can see it because it's in stream yard. But if you say something like the F word or I guess butthole is one of those words. It says right there, Ryan has an eye patch over his butthole because we brought crunch all up. Oh, you got to click all comments. Your wife talks about that all the time. That's why you don't see it.

[C]

What?

[B]

Go to. Go to YouTube. Let me, let me fix him, Heather.

[C]

But yeah, I mean, just, I listen to you. Just the fact that Jimmy and Ryan can agree on something like black rock being the, the financial demon that it is. I mean, like they're. But you wouldn't think that because Instagram posts, you would think these guys could never agree on something. And then that's why, I mean, at the end of the day, it's like Mike said, dude, we gotta, we gotta have opposition on here.

[E]

Well, well, you know, I mean, there are universal truth out there, right? There's. I mean, we can. We know what else we agree on. That the sky's blue.

[C]

But like, look at, you know those memes that they show where it's like the blood and the. In the holding hands and saying they can't stop us now. Or, or the hillbilly. The hillbilly Confederate flag guy with the black dude. And they're holding. They say this is. They don't want this. Like, if, if you could get everybody on the same page, that's weakens the elite. And so podcast like this or broadcast like this kind of doing that I, I think is the right answer.

[E]

Yeah. You know, for me. Yeah, we, we do need to understand that there are some. That they're fellow travelers in some respects. But let's, let's be real clear. The moment that you start saying you want communism, I'm out. Like, I'm out.

[C]

And like, dude, the, the first time he came out, I don't think he caught it, but I said, are you, are you broadcasting with us from your evil com or. Evil? Like that never made sense to me. How are you going to sit here and use things and say it's evil? I mean, I guess we do, but you got to use the tools of war. Yeah, we don't like guns, but we're gonna shoot guns. That, that don't put me. That I was quoting him.

[E]

There's. There is nothing redeemable about communism. All communism really is. And this is why he, he espouses it is because he thinks it's a panacea for all of the woes that he looks at.

[C]

Yeah. What's a panacea?

[E]

It's a. It's a cure all.

[B]

There was another one before that. There was another word before that you said too. I don't know. There was another one. That was two in one sentence. That was good.

[E]

Oh, well. Well, I'm glad I could go ahead and do it, but, you know, I mean, I've been off my game for a while now, so I really need to.

[C]

Oh, I love the hair, dude. Who's the Tampa Bay Ray player that was like, Jack? He wears the sunglasses.

[B]

Alex Rodriguez. No, Tampa Bay Rays.

[C]

The guy that wears the sunglasses and he's like, dude, all the memes are like, just going like, oh, Canseco.

[B]

Yeah, that's what you look like right now, dude.

[C]

Put a pair of old school 80s sports glasses on. Yeah.

[E]

Jose Canseco. I'll take that. I mean, Jose Canseco was playing ball when I was nine, so he's on the sauce too.

[C]

Yeah, dude. Yeah. Driving around in a T top Camaro.

[E]

Blasting like White Snake.

[C]

Yeah. But yeah. Oh, we got a comment. Cutter Pritchett. His side is no different than Blackrock. His side is 100 on the side of government owned housing and no private ownership. Ask him about social credit.

[B]

We'll go out next week. We gotta go out.

[C]

That's it. But that's a good point. So do you want everything to be Section 8 housing? You want it to be communist government owned housing? That's a great point. In fact, if you guys super chat while we're talking to them, we'll read your Questions? Yeah, some kind of capitalism, baby.

[E]

People who espouse communism while living the. And, and getting the benefits of, of the capitalist societies that they hate are the most disingenuous sticks I could possibly imagine. It. It literally. You, you're literally ignoring the evidence right in front of your face. It's like I'm over here hitting you in the head with a wiffle ball bat going, hey, dude, this is the good parts about it. Are there bad parts? Absolutely. Until Christ returns, we're not going to have a perfect government. Get that one through your head. But we could pick some good ones and you know, at least try to make it work.

[C]

Work.

[E]

What have we tried? Well, we've tried fascism. That didn't work. We tried communism over and over and over again. More than fascism, by the way. And it, it is responsible for the biggest mass murder in human history in two different countries. The two biggest countries on the planet, Russia and China. I mean, let's talk about the, the one child policy in China.

[C]

Let's talk about China have a thriving government or economy. You said they're capital. You're a communist, Right? I'm gonna sound like a idiot. I get it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But China is a communist state, right?

[B]

Yes, yes.

[E]

Let's. Let's look at why that They're. Let's take a look at the economics behind China.

[B]

Sweatshops. Kids are in getting beat inside factories. That's why their economy is so good.

[E]

Yeah. They have, they have literal slaves. They have literal slaves. They, they purge those that they find on. Look at the Christian Uyghurs in China. They get rid of them. What, the Uyghurs? Not wiggers.

[B]

We're too immature for that word. You gotta go somewhere else with that word. Okay.

[C]

As I've heard stories that you can't find it on the Internet, Jimmy. About mass genocide in China. Like mass dude.

[E]

I mean, one of the biggest things that people don't talk about is the harvesting of organs for the elites around the world. You need an organization, go to China, they'll get you one. Don't ask where it came from because they take it. I mean, let's look at their, their technology.

[B]

Why.

[E]

Why do they have what they have? Well, they stole it. They stole the technology and incorporated it. I'm gonna blow your mind on this one. And I had a conversation with one of my sources last night. This is what I think actually happened on the bin Laden raid. I don't think that helicopter crashed on accident. I think it crashed on purpose. And if you were going to blow Up a helicopter that was supposedly stealth. There's two places you would really want blow up. That would be the tail rotor and the avionics. Guess what survived the tail rotor. And guess who bought that tail rotor? China. China got that tail rotor, and then they started making stealth aircraft that we can still see. I think it was absolutely.

[C]

Okay, so it is. So you're saying China got a hold of that tail rotor?

[E]

Yeah, they did. 100. They did.

[C]

Is that fact or is that just like.

[E]

That is a fact. That is a fact.

[C]

They went into. Would they buy it from Pakistan? Did they go in and take it?

[B]

They bought it.

[C]

They bought it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I did not know that. So you're saying we purposely left it for them?

[E]

That's what I think. Yeah. I think that one of the reasons.

[C]

Why you don't sound. I think.

[E]

I think one of the reasons why there's so much contrivancy around the bin Laden raid is that there was a mission within a mission.

[B]

You said three greeks. Do not redeem.

[E]

Do not redeem.

[C]

Oh, because they said Indian.

[B]

Yeah, they're selling it.

[C]

Oh, hello. Would you like to buy a u. S. Military tail rotor?

[B]

Oh, yeah, I would very much, sir. I like a toyota. Yeah, not a toyota. I want to.

[C]

Oh, you want Toyota? No, we don't sell toyotas. We sell American torotas. I want toy rota. Oh, toy rota.

[E]

Hilux.

[B]

Hilux.

[E]

I want the hilux.

[C]

Back to America, dude.

[E]

So, I mean, you know, people will sit there and say all this stuff about China, and it's like, dude, you're. You're. You want to talk about propaganda? That is a propaganda machine. They propaganda eyes everybody. So you want to sit here and go, oh, America's bad, because they propaganda propagandize our kids to go into the military. Okay, what does China do? Hey, you can only have so many kids. One of the biggest problems that they had recently was that they. They got ri. They killed most of the girls that were born, and so they had a bunch of dudes.

[C]

It was like genocide.

[E]

That's communism, bro.

[C]

Do you want that?

[E]

The answer is no.

[C]

Why is it hidden so much from the world?

[E]

Well, first of all, China has money and an influence, all right? So the money doesn't come from money. Realistically, let's. Let's use the economics of the world. You are a. You have a TV show, right? You want to reach the biggest audience you possibly can, right? Well, guess who's got the most people? China. China has the most people, which means you got the most kids. Yeah, they have people in tow Rotor. So you go, hey, I'll wait.

[C]

He's on one. He's on one.

[B]

Go ahead.

[E]

So we. They have the biggest amount of people. You want to go put your show in China where you have the most opportunity to get people watching your show and they. You talk about something that they don't like, you're not going there. I'll give you a great example. You remember and Top Gun, the first Top Gun Maverick had a leather jacket with all of his patches from all of his deployments. One of them was the flag of Taiwan. When they released Top Gun Maverick, they changed that jacket and took that flag off. Otherwise it would have never been allowed in China, period.

[C]

Old Tom Cruise doing this little Scientology politics.

[E]

So look, I mean, the, the Chinese Communist Party has absolute influence on its own people and it influences the. The rest of the world by. Because of capitalism.

[C]

Right?

[E]

So you want to sit here and talk about how communism is good. Communist states don't exist without capitalist states to trade with. And, and a great example is what's happening to Cuba right now. We stopped trading oil with them. They don't got oil anymore. They're collapsing. You're done.

[C]

Yeah, it's over. I heard that they, I heard that they, they have no more jet fuel.

[E]

Yeah, they're out. People have to. You can't, you can't land in Cuba anymore. You're never getting out.

[C]

Haha.

[E]

You wanna, you want to hear one that's even worse? Venezuela just sold its first batch of oil. And guess what country they sold it to?

[C]

Venezuela. Oh, wait, no, they sold it. They sold it to us. Israel. Israel first.

[E]

The first batch of oil that they could sell. Yeah, like, like. So I can agree with Ryan and go, yeah, we're, we really are fighting for the, the investments of certain people. But which ones are they? Are they the evil capitalists here in the United States or is it the evil Israeli government? Or is it a conglomeration and it's all bad? Maybe we're in the tribulation right now and Christ has not returned yet. I don't know.

[C]

I want to ask Ryan so many questions, like, what are your thoughts on the Jews? But I don't think I'm ever gonna get there because it's, it's kind of fascinating talking to somebody on the other side. It's like talk to a alien. Yeah, tell me what's on your mind, dude. I don't, you know what?

[E]

I, I don't, I don't have any issues with having a conversation with that guy. But I definitely won't just sit here and let him spouse his. That doesn't mean that I want him dead.

[C]

Oh, man. I'm a. I'm an. I'm an empathy guy, bro. I start. I talk to somebody for 20 minutes. I start, like, looking around. Like, I need people like you to go. Communism is bad, Tyler. Bad news. Bad news bears, bro. All right, Jimmy, we'll bring you on. Just a sec. We're gonna bring in Nick. Nick. Your last name is Prawl, right? That's how you say it. Oh, yeah. Yep. Okay, so you'll recognize Nick Prawl from the comment section in YouTube. I'm gonna let Mike introduce him. Yeah.

[B]

Introduce yourself because I don't know what you want me to say or not say. I know you have a mention you want to talk about. So tell us your. Tell us the background you want to tell us about and what you wanted to talk about here today on the show.

[C]

Sure.

[A]

My name is Nick, Nick Prawl. I'm a vet. I really just would like to focus on a lot of these mental health crisis with the police they're dealing with. There's a lot of bad that I'm seeing online. It's got me pretty pissed off. Thanks for having me on. I've got a couple notes here that we can talk about. I want to get your takes on social workers dealing with some of these critical incidents because there's some serious issues with it.

[B]

Yeah, that's how we started talking was about the social worker stuff and your take on that. I know that's what you're. You're going to school for, that feel, correct? Yeah. Okay, go ahead, hit us with your notes and any questions you have for us and we'll definitely interact with you. Sure.

[A]

Yeah. So my first comment that I made on a video last week. Week, I want to say it was like Thursday or maybe Wednesday. Probably Thursday, I want to say. But how can law enforcement in good conscience take on a lot of these mental health cases and they don't have any experience dealing with people with mental health. Like, they'll have maybe a little bit of psych background going through the academy, maybe from whether whatever jobs or their own personal mental health and stuff like that. But there's a lot of these issues where cops show up hot and heavy. You get a call, come in like, oh, there's a vet in a parking lot. He's got a gun in his mouth. Six cops show up. Or they show up at their house. Six cops with body armor and vest, guns out Everybody's got their gun out, lights and sirens, everything like that. You're just gonna naturally raise the stress in the situation. Like, what good does that do anyone? I guess I'm trying to find, is there a middle ground between having six officers show up for a mental health call or one on our social worker without law enforcement? Because I don't know that I would ever want.

[B]

Yeah, I don't. I don't know that I'd ever want. Because how fast it can change. So the social worker, worker by themselves, seems maybe initial phone contact to go, you remember, the liability is going to fall on law enforcement at the end of the day. If I respond and I say, yep, go ahead, send the civilian in, that civilian gets taken hostage or murdered. The agency buys that. So there still has to be some level in law enforcement response. But I agree with you. I had an, an entity come in years ago and I was still at the sheriff's office that had this same, same exact idea. And it was have them call us. So if there's a critical incident, you forward that call from dispatch, still being monitored, but to the veteran health counselor. That starts to create a dialogue. Because you're right. There's a lot of vets that don't like cops. And a vet in crisis, the last thing they probably want to see is guns and military style uniforms. So there should be a liaison, I believe, between us, just specifically veteran and police and some liaison. But I don't know that I would send them completely there.

[C]

Why does it got to be on the cops, Mike? Why, why do the cops still have to. At the end of the day, if society is going to rely on law enforcement to be the end all. Be all to catch all, all the repercussions, to catch all of everything. Why do cops have to be there? Society handles.

[B]

They don't have to.

[C]

But it's not. You can't send me with a civilian.

[B]

No.

[C]

Because I don't want a civilian when this guy whacks out, starts fighting with a knife. I don't want a civilian next to me that's already running that way. I want six.

[B]

But you're talking about like a guy like this. This guy's has background in the military. So it's not just a civilian. It's not this kid that came out at his college from a social worker program.

[A]

Why can't we have both?

[C]

I don't want that. Yeah, the problem, the type. And here's a bit we'll be real. We were both cops for years. The type of guy that's going to go work with a social worker is also not a real cop. And that's just my opinion. It's my opinion. I'm being cynical. At the end of the day, those are the guys that want to do very little work and want to get out of the crime area and want to stop fighting. They're. They're going to. So what they do is. Where I came from, there was a two man team. One's a social worker, one's a cop. They all work in the same little office together. First off, they only work 9 to 5 Monday through Friday. I'm sorry, People that go through crises don't just stick to the nine to five rule. They. So at night it's back to road units responding like we always did. So it was more of a political ploy for our agency to be able to say they did it. They started off with a couple teams, nine to five alive. It did us no good whatsoever in the long run.

[B]

I think the video we were talking about was the. The knife, right? The shooting with the knife in NYPD where the guy.

[A]

That one.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Not the hospital one. The one in the house.

[A]

The one in the house, yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So imagine, maybe imagine that. No, no cop goes in that. Social worker encounters that. What did they do? When that guy charges with a knife, you're dead.

[A]

There's no.

[B]

That's my point.

[A]

We're both in agreement. I just, I wish that there was a little bit more of a buffer in between rather than, oh yeah, we'll take a 4 foot 4 female who's 100 pounds soaking wet, send her to a possible violent call or send a whole SWAT team, kick the dude's door in.

[C]

Wait, wait, so are you advocating for the 4 foot 4 female?

[B]

No, he's saying that it's bad idea. No, it's a horrible.

[C]

But you're saying the SWAT team's also a bad idea too. Like two extremes. Yeah.

[B]

So in a perfect.

[A]

I mean, I mean it's not a perfect world, but wouldn't it be a good idea to have some, some sort of mix hybrid? Like have a social worker and a.

[C]

Couple other cops show up. They're trying that. They are, they are trying that, but I mean at the end of the day it.

[B]

So I guess what you're saying here, let's go back, let's, let's micro. Let's Monday morning quarterback that, that one we're talking about instead of the cops walking through the door, maybe a. I don't know, like a good statured sized social Worker responds that some somebody has a background and tries to initiate conversations.

[C]

Size have to do with anything?

[B]

Well, you have to be.

[C]

No, at that point. At that point we are done. If we have to have an intimidating social worker, we're bringing the cops because we're not worried about compliance because of size of the person. We're sending in a civilian. If we're at what we think that, we think that there's going to be no pushback, we think there's going to be no violence, we're going to send in a civilian, it doesn't matter. That's like saying, well, I only want 6 foot tall cops to come to my house. House they'd send me of course, but.

[B]

Blonde hair, blue eyes.

[C]

But that's what. Well, we don't have six foot tall cops. We've got short four foot females. That's the one that's coming.

[B]

So what? Yeah, so what is the answer?

[C]

Well, here's the one thing that I'll say that I know I have experience in both worlds. I'm a combat veteran and I was a law enforcement officer. I've responded to a lot of veterans in crises and they do like veteran, you know, so maybe finding the niche. Cops come from a lot of different places in life. Finding the. Someone working on shift. Get on the radio. Has anybody got background in this? Yeah, why? Okay. Hey, give me a phone call real quick. All right. The commander. Hey dude, I don't know what your name's Deputy Smith. And he's like, yeah, he's like hey man, I got a guy who says he did this in his life. Someone tells me that you also have the same experience because what also. All right, I'll be there. All right. So also what they're doing now is they're training every cop in cit. Training. They are giving every cop as much training as they possibly can. So now your law enforcement are certified in. They're almost like a value a dollar menu social worker. They get a quick crash course, 40 hour week course to be almost like a temporary social worker until they get so they can go there and like kind of establish what's going on and. But at the end of the day I will say this. Veterans in crises do not like police officers coming into their house. That is one thing. So if we're going to actually talk about just kind of, kind of like pigeonhole it real quick with veterans as a niche, they do not like law enforcement coming in their house. I don't know what it is. I don't know if it's kind of like a, I, I, I don't want to be oppressed. If I oppress people, I'm against the war. Kind of like we were talking about Ryan. Or if it's like an insecurity thing. Like now we're the guys with the guns, and you used to be the guy with the gun. There's all kinds of crazy. Or it's, I don't like the government. Why is the government in my house? I'm, you know, I didn't call for the cops. I called for, you know, and I, and I've done this before. I went to Iraq, and now there I, the people are in my house invading, and there's all kinds of crazy. But at the end of the day, I don't think that veterans in crises particularly respond well to law enforcement.

[A]

I would agree with you. I mean, I know, personally, I know a lot of other vets that are very anti government. You get out of the military, they screwed me over. And it's more common than most people would think. At the same time, I don't think that I know a lot of people like this. You stick six dudes on a stairwell coming into their house, it's gonna be a bloodbath. Like, a lot of times, that's gonna be the answer. I don't want that. So I guess I'm wondering, is there a way that we can navigate this better? Because I want the kind of cops that are vets to show up to these calls with them.

[C]

You're someone that's kind of spearheading this idea and getting it in the open. Right. Would you be okay with social worker goes up there, there's cops downstairs, one cop on the stairwell, not, not trying to stack stick. I know. I'm just kind of sticking with your example. I get what you're saying. Just generality.

[A]

Exactly what I'm talking about. That's exactly what I mean.

[C]

Would you be okay if that social worker was stabbed to death and that cop was stabbed, then the cop shot him and law enforcement was downstairs the entire time? Would you at any point blame the police for that? Or would you say that's just a tragic, unfortunate world we live in with mental illness, illness?

[A]

I would pinhole that. And if we can change that a little bit, there are a lot of states that are currently doing this with law enforcement on standby. I have a list here somewhere.

[B]

But.

[C]

No, no, no, but I'm asking for that particular scenario, would you blame law enforcement, or would you say, hey, that's just a shitty world of mental health. It's just. It is what it is. You can't stop it all. Would you per. Would you play? Because at the end of the day, a lot of people will say, well, no, I'm gonna blame law enforcement. And that's why law enforcement goes, then step the aside. We're going to handle it because we're not going to be blamed for it. Just like pursuits. People want to say, I want the cops to chase the bad guys till the wheels fall off. And I go, would you be okay if they careened and killed your entire family while you were at work? And they go, well, no, I would blame the cops. I'm like, okay, then, so stop saying that. You. You want them to go chase people in this perfect world you live in. But if it happens to you. Now, if some. Somebody wanted to get real and goes, no, I would not blame the cops. That's just. The fucking shitty world we live in is cowboys and Indians, kittens, bad guys. Yeah, I listen to it all day. But that's kind of why I asked that scenario.

[A]

Well, I mean, stuff like that's gonna continue to happen. There's a lot of issues that can be controlled, like keeping social workers away from the door. Like, if you get the door open and you can talk through a door, create a space, have the officer there to shield the social worker. If whatever happens goes south. There's a lot.

[C]

At the end of the day, if we need shields, what the do we need a social worker for? I mean, at the end of the day, if we're bringing shields out, I don't think. I think we surpass the social worker point. Am I wrong?

[B]

No, here's the. Here's the problem. Your. Your theory works. And where do you see most social workers? Large agencies that can afford to the manpower. Here's what's going to happen. Even in an agency my size, how can we go. And it's. I hate to say it like this, but we go to that one crisis call and you're going to tie up all these resources and we're going to have cops down the hallway and cops waiting. What do you do with all the other calls for service? Because we don't have enough people.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

At some point somebody goes, go, get this fucking guy out of the house. Or just leave. Yeah, like there's. There's a point where if it's not a crime, we're going to leave.

[C]

I've done that a million times. And because, yeah, you care about mental health until you're sitting on a Burglary for eight hours and your, your shit's gone. And the cops show up and you're like, yeah, sorry, sorry, sir. There was somebody in mental health crisis. We were trying to give him everything. And he's like, I'm gonna. Dude, this is the worst day of my life.

[B]

Yeah, my, my lawnmower is gone.

[C]

Yourself and your mental health.

[B]

So I guess the social worker thing works in, in maybe phone call conversation. I just don't feel safe sending a social worker up to that corner.

[C]

If you need shields, it's already too late. Yeah, that's too late.

[B]

It's just a slippery slope of.

[C]

Because the way they're training law enforcement now, in theory, if it works, which it won't because it's the government. But in a perfect world, if their theory works, they were going to have law enforcement, let's just say in 10 years, trained as social workers. They want almost cops to be just like, they're good at firing their guns. They want them to be good at social working.

[A]

But, well, most cops can't shoot for anyway, so.

[C]

Yeah, that's very true. That's also a good point. So that goes to my point that this won't work. But that's their theory is that, well, we're just going to put the social worker into cop world and it's going to take time. It's going to take years to make sure every cop.

[B]

And the other problem is blended personalities. You and I could go to the same call and it's going to end completely different just based on our personality. And that's. You have to factor that into what cop shows up. We could all be trained in the same level of mental health. Yeah, but if I'm starving across the board. Yeah, you're starving. You just left that burglary. All right, buddy, come on, man. Like, come out of the house. I know you're having a problem. Let's go. Versus. Hey, man, I understand. I'm a vet as well. Like, let's get to it. Just there's so many infinite factors that go into this that it's hard to pinpoint this is the way it's going to work because yeah, it's, it's not textbook. And that social worker may handle 9 out of 10 perfect. When it doesn't go well, the only social worker is dead. That's a problem.

[C]

And I just, I'm a. Just being a cop for so long. I'm just a realist in the sense that there's just some parts of this life in this world that are just nasty and ugly. And it's a. It's. I think even social workers, after about five years in the job, just a cop, they're like, there's just some things you can't control. And one of them. We decided as a society that mental health asylums were not good. They're not humane. We just. As a society, we closed them all down. We're like, this isn't right to just house crazy people. But now we're seeing what it's like with them on our streets, and we're having to live with that. Families disowning people. People go out and go, how could you disown. I used to be a cop. And go, how do we. How do families disown their adult children and leave them out here? They leave them out here disowned. And then somebody in my family went nuts and he lives out on the street. And I go, oh, I can see that now. I can see how it happens. I don't advocate for it, but I can see if it happened to my extended family, it could happen.

[B]

What. What are you like. So what is your. You're learning about this and you're in school for what is. When you see this come to fruition, what is it? What is it you want to see? What would you. What would be your perfect scenario?

[A]

If I can see the veteran suicide rates go down, at least 10 people a year, I'd be absolutely happy.

[B]

So how do you. I want to win.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

I want to win a million dollars tonight. Casino. How do I get there, though? How do I get to that point of how do we knock 10 down? How do we keep that number? How we bring it down?

[C]

10 and no social workers dead. Yeah. That's unacceptable. A civilian dying for. For. This is unacceptable.

[A]

The dialogue. And that's. That's kind of what I want to do today. And let me be clear, like, I saw some of the comments. I don't have a specific agenda. I wanted to come on and talk about this because I don't think it's being talked about enough. Mad, too. Like, I don't want to see anyone die. Like, the whole. If Preddy, whatever his name is in Minneapolis and the chick.

[C]

Yeah. I don't agree with what they do.

[A]

But people dying is not great.

[B]

No.

[A]

And we shouldn't be so bipolar about it. Oh, he was a scumbag. He should die. Nobody deserves that. But if we can actively work towards a better resolution, obviously something has to change. And we can talk making those changes, Nick.

[C]

And it's Amazing that you came on here because you are literally the voice of like 98 of our country. That's like, there's gotta be a middle ground. It's the loud minorities on each side saying them they shouldn't have been there. They made a stupid decision, let them rot. And then, no, you can do whatever you want to. Police officers when you want to do it. It's my right. Like those. Those people right there, all of us are in the middle somewhere trying to figure out a solution to live amongst each other.

[B]

I constantly say that the majority just wants to go. Just the majority wants to go to school, to work, to church, to the mall. And they don't want to get robbed, and they don't want to have a shooting in front of them. They just want to go exist. That's where we all stand. The problem is, how do we. How do we. How do we get that? How do we get there? That's always the problem.

[A]

And I guess that's something that we. We continue or we need to continue talking about just to work towards that. It's the dialogue, it's the conversation, it's the questions. We shouldn't have to feel antsy about asking questions. I'm a regular. Dude, I'm not a cop. I'm a vet. I got out. I'm working a regular job. I'm on my lunch break right now. But the fact that all these people keep killing themselves and keep dying in critical incidents. I sent you the video of the. Can't remember her name.

[B]

The.

[A]

The lady that came out of her apartment and got shot in the chest. She was carrying a water jug.

[C]

Where'd you send that?

[A]

I sent it to Mike in the email.

[C]

There you go. That makes sense. That's why it's not up here.

[B]

Yeah, okay.

[A]

It is. Fort Lee. Fort Lee, New Jersey. Victoria Lee. She was shot and killed holding a water jug. This is from a few years ago, but I was just trying to find some examples of, like, there needs to be some corrective action here. And you guys say it all the time. Cops don't shoot. Cops are fat. What the. Is the answer? Because obviously nobody's being held accountable.

[C]

It's like when you're in the military, when that. With that particular topic, they're. We're lowering the standards in law enforcement because nobody wants to be protectors of society. Society anymore. That's just it.

[A]

They're alienated who would be.

[C]

You know what I mean? And so now we're getting people that are. Are not meant for the job, that are now showing up to calls and shooting civilians in the chest with a water bottle.

[B]

No, they're not ready for the job. And the leaders have come from a generation already. The first generation of promotions has already happened where command is in that same realm. And now we're hiring based on command having that mindset. Now we're bringing these kids in. So you're right. No.

[C]

What about somebody made a joke sending C3PO, but honestly, what about a robot with telecommunication to a social worker? Would.

[A]

I mean.

[B]

I mean, here's the thing. To send a robot into a vet in crisis. Yeah, they're here. I mean, you can call 988 and you have 20 seconds to comply because.

[A]

You can call 988 and talk to like telehealth. Like with the VA, you get the cards.

[C]

So you think the human. Human interaction is. Is probably preferred if the vet is alone.

[B]

If the vet is alone, though, I'm. I'm warming up to this. The vet is alone by themselves in the house. We would leave anyway with any crisis. So what is the. You're right. Why press it? Throw a phone through his window. Like, hey buddy, here's your telephone. Like, this person's gonna help you. Because at the end of the day, if they're calling for help, they're not to the point of, in my opinion, not to the point of suicide yet. They're not there yet. They're reaching out. Reaching out. But can something that transpires in that moment lead to that last few minutes of somebody gets shot and killed cop 1 of suicide 1 of these.

[C]

A lot of people don't know this, Nick, but you might, since you're kind of like really interested in this field, is that we Learned about what 5 or 10 years ago. We don't force. We're not going to be the guys that pull the trigger. So if someone's in crisis and not complying, we will spend hours out there. At the end of the day, when a commander goes wrap it up. We wrap it up.

[B]

Now it's 45 minutes. In our. The standard is 45 minutes. We don't.

[C]

We. Because what happens is if we force entry to help you, we end up killing you. And we don't want to be the guys that kill you. And it is what it is. Police agencies have realized it's better that you kill yourself than us kill you. It's bad pr.

[B]

Well, most people that. Like I just said it all goes back to most people that are saying they're going to kill themselves on a call. Are Going to, you're going to find them dead. That's how you're going to know. But when they call, that's not the majority and that's what the statistics have shown. That's why we don't go in anymore and don't press it is they're calling in crisis to not kill themselves. But they're going to have a gun, they're going to threaten it, they're in crisis. But when you leave, the statistics show they don't go outside and like commit a mass murder or do anything crazy. They may kill themselves when you leave. But that again, what you just said is that's. Well, unfortunately that's the result of we didn't do it and we tried to make contact, we tried to negotiate, but it didn't work. Versus they don't usually run outside and start shooting the neighbors houses up and acting, acting crazy. They just eventually come out of the crisis. But once they're out of it, this is where a guy like you comes in, is like, how do we now let's follow up. How do we have that conversation to get them the help they need?

[C]

Yeah. Oh, go ahead, Go ahead, Nick.

[A]

The one other thing I will say is in a hostage situation, I'm. This is not a practice for hot situation. That kind of situation, you got to be dynamic. You have to.

[B]

Vet in crisis. This is a individual by themselves in a parking lot in a house in crisis.

[C]

Well, and I will say this too, Mike brought up a great point. So the behavior health unit, they, you know, they crisis team, whatever they, whatever police department calls this, everyone's building something because at the end of the day you don't want to be the agency that doesn't have this team. So now it's a race to see who to build their behavioral health teams. Right? Because if you're a podunk, Grady Judd, Fort Polk guy, and you're like, oh, I just killed this mentally ill guy and somebody goes, well where was your behavioral health unit? He goes, we don't have one. There are. That's like saying I don't have body cams anymore. You can't say that if every other police agency is building it, you got to build it too. So but when they do their follow ups, like I'm a, I'm a patrolman, I go and I talk to you and I say, hey buddy, I'm gonna take you in to get seen, okay? And you comply and I, you know, I, I take you there, release you, you get your, your health that you need your mental health Evaluation that you need. I do a report and I send it to these people, right? These people are supposed to check on you. They're supposed to monitor your. Your hospital stay as quick as they can. They're supposed to see when you get out, and they're supposed to meet you at your residence in a very informal conversation. You're. They knock on the door and they ask to talk to you, and they ask how you're doing. In theory, that's how it works. But there's so many people claiming mental health these days that they just get swamped. And now it's like. It's like the va who needs it? Everybody needs it. Okay, well, if everybody needs it now, we got to start sifting through the people that are bullshitting to actually get the people that need help, because they're. They're standing in a crowd of people going, I need help. So the mental health units are getting sworn because now in society, me and Mike can't show up to your house and go, you're full of. You're not gonna kill yourself. Have a good day. Because if you kill yourself, we're going to prison.

[B]

Yeah. And you'll have a homeless guy at the corner that's hungry and cold. Yeah, I'm hungry and cold.

[E]

I'm gonna go get my three days.

[B]

In the mental health war. So I'm gonna say I'm gonna do it, and then we gotta take you. And then there's a guy down there that's having a crisis. We go, the beds are full, man. Like, sorry. What do we do? Yeah, it's a real.

[C]

We're too. We're too. What would you call that? Cover our ass type thing. Everything's so cya now in cop work that if you. You really shouldn't. As a cop, I would highly advise just take somebody. If they say, don't try to sit there and get out of it. Don't go. I mean, are you really gonna do it? Because if they go.

[B]

Yeah, but be careful. Don't press it, though.

[C]

Oh, take them. You can never get in trouble. Don't take them.

[B]

No, but I'm saying, if they're in a house or something, you gotta remember now what they're. What they're saying is there's this. I'm not gonna drop it all the way because I like the guy who was involved, but I know a person who killed somebody in a mental health call. They would be in prison today in that same call. They're not a bad cop. They're not a bad person.

[C]

They did they killed somebody?

[B]

Yeah, because they went in. What we don't do anymore. They pressed into the house to go to the person on the second floor that had a knife and killed them. Do you do that today? You're gone, you're gone.

[C]

If they have a boiling pot of water, you're gone.

[B]

So when you say take them. Yes. If you're standing on the side of the road and the guy says, I'm gonna kill myself, he's got to go.

[C]

You can't hold that liability.

[B]

But why are we changing the response to a home we? You're right. The cops just have that same leeway and go, you're not gonna kill yourself, dude, whatever. I'm not gonna tie up.

[C]

Are you gonna come outside? Nope. All right, have a good day.

[B]

But in the house, you're okay with that. But when you're standing in a parking lot, you just said it. You got to take them. Well, do we? Do we? Because now what are you gonna do? Go hands on? Now he fights.

[C]

You can't get.

[B]

Now you.

[C]

I've always said that we tap. We'll chase mental health people down. Someone said, I'm gonna kill myself, and they take off running. We got the chopper up. We broke every unit. Everybody's racing and chasing him and chasing them. What happens when you get him? Are you gonna beat him up? But I. I remember I was sitting. When I always say. I always say this. I was a guy in briefing that would ask questions, and people would go. I go, there was a guy, they were like, hey, Dacious, out with this guy. They're looking for him right now. Dacious wrapping up. We're gonna go out there, we're gonna deploy, we're going to replace them. And. And this hunt for this guy, they know he's running around, He's. He's got. He's gonna kill himself, but he's on foot. And I go, okay, so he's running from us. Yeah. They get. They got the bird up, and I go, so what happens if we get him? Do we beat him up? Do we fight him? And everybody was like, no. I'm like, why are we chasing him, though? Because he's not going to comply. He's not in the right state of mind. And I was like, I don't have the answer. I'm just stating that if I start taking. Chasing somebody and I spear him in the back, he's gonna fight me, and then I'm gonna fight him. Am I doing him any good?

[B]

Correct. Now, we've determined in a house, we Leave. We drive away and leave.

[C]

So we should do that in the open. Yeah. Yep. Bye. Don't hurt anybody else. Boom.

[B]

You just missed that opportunity. The car just went by. You just missed another opportunity.

[C]

Do it.

[B]

You haven't jumped yet. So. Yeah, I'm being funny there.

[C]

Sorry.

[B]

But it's a, it's a problem and there's really no answers. But I think for your specific veteran answer, you're on the right track. We should put a little bit more and there should be organizations that, and people that are, hey, I'll help with vets. I can't help with everybody. But your concern is vets. And that's good because you are one. So in our veteran community, you are correct that we should, if VA is going to pay for all these benefits and pay for everything else, we should have some type of veteran organization and the law enforcement officers, agencies to listen and say, let's call them and get them in touch quickly. So maybe a vet to vet, non law enforcement, non suited, kitted up looking soldier can maybe interact with this guy. So I do agree with what you're saying.

[A]

And there's a lot of veteran organizations out there. There's a lot that don't do they just take money because the federal government or the state Department, they give them a shitload of money. Where do you see that money go? Like Wounded Warrior Project, got in trouble.

[D]

A few years ago.

[A]

A lot of these companies you see, oh, we're here for veterans. When all the veterans are outside going, where the is my help? Yeah, that's a conversation. And I thank you guys for having me on. I just, like I said I wanted to talk about this because it gets brushed over a lot and people don't really look at it and go, that's kind of weird. All right, next topic.

[B]

Like, no, stay, stay in touch. Keep, keep pushing it. And as we get it, maybe we can. The same way we're trying to get these other topics in law enforcement administrations, this is an important one to also start getting in because if there are people volunteering their time or being paid by a veteran organization that's legit, that are willing to go to agencies, we can't, obviously you can't save everybody, unfortunately. But if there are veteran organizations that are funded to go help with at least veterans, let's start there. And I agree with that mindset and that topic. And, and we appreciate you coming on. We appreciate, we're doing, we appreciate going to school to actually learn about this so we can try to bring this awareness and like, you said 10 is better than none. If we can get 10 down a year, we got to start somewhere. Yeah.

[A]

But I mean, thank you guys for having me on. Mike, I'm still waiting on my war hat.

[B]

It's coming, right? It's not.

[C]

It's coming from China.

[B]

I can tell you where it's at right now if you want.

[A]

No, no, no, no, no, no, that's all right. No, I got that. Thank you guys for having me on. Like I said, I've been watching this show since like 2023. It's awesome to see what you guys are doing. The other guy with the beard and the cigars.

[B]

I didn't say.

[A]

Yeah, I love what you guys are doing, man. And then Rob o', Neal, if you want to sue me, I know who killed bin Laden. It was Jimmy Watson.

[C]

All right, stay in touch.

[A]

Yep. Bye.

[C]

All right, bring on Jimbo. What up, brother?

[B]

What a.

[E]

What a fantastic guy that is. What a fantastic human. What a fantastic.

[C]

He wants to help, man.

[B]

And estimated delivery. February 14th, Valentine's Day.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, and at the end of the day, I was. I was clapping back pretty hard, and then I realized I have all that inner experience of like, that frustrating.

[B]

But you're just an.

[C]

He was. He's out here trying. He's asking questions that all of us, the 98 of people not on either side, are like, why can't this just work? Like, why, you know, not to.

[B]

Confused with the 99, which is voice boys.

[C]

Yeah, the boy.

[E]

Well, I mean, dude, I mean, is it just veterans? I mean, I think there's a lot of people going through a lot of crises right now. I mean, he. We're specific. Yeah, that's.

[C]

And that's what I was trying to tell him is that I. I respect the fact that he. Life experience in a niche and he's going to help that niche. He's not going to be able to help any other type of person, but he can help vets, you know, and if you're. I don't really know, you know, problem.

[E]

The question I would have asked him is, you know, what. What actual help do. Do veterans get?

[C]

Right?

[B]

What.

[E]

What actual help can we go to the va? What is the VA going to do? The VA is going to throw pills at us. That's what they do.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

A little bit better with the mental, at least Counsel. I know they're throwing counseling at people. They're getting in the md, they're getting an emdr, the light counseling. They're getting into one on one counseling. If that works for you. We talked with Reagan before, like, yeah, talking counseling doesn't always work, but they're getting into, you know, psychedelics. They're getting into emdr. But you're right. But just to say it, Jimmy, like, I get, we all, Everybody needs help. This guy happens to be in that veteran, veteran lane. So being a veteran police show, it's like, I get where he's at. But yeah, we all, the whole world needs help. So, I mean, he can at least help one area is what I think he's trying to get.

[E]

And I'm, I, I'm totally cool with that because like I was saying, veterans need a lot of, I mean, veterans and cops, dude. If we could just help the people that we put into traumatic situation situations by, by the course of a, I mean through a societal contract, we have said, hey, this group of people over here gonna suffer the biggest amount of trauma of just what they see, what they deal with, what they have to do, these guys. And you know, what did we give them? Nothing. Here, here's, here's the culture. The culture is alcoholism. The culture is suck it the up. The culture is you're gonna be him on board until one day you're not and then you're a little alone. And what are you going to do? You're gonna go off and die. That's what you're gonna do.

[B]

You're right. And I'm gonna get my soapbox though, because that's all for bets. The police have.

[E]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like I put the, I put the cops in there.

[B]

At least the vets have VA and rated disability. And that's where I go with this heroes act I'm trying to draft is cops have nothing. There is no VA for cops. There is. I know. I told you. I know a guy, Jack. Jack got fired for having cancer. He got fired. He had to resign. A guy work with double shoulder injury, he got to the point where they said, sorry bud, you're out, you're done. Good luck. Go get a job. Well, my shoulders are broke from on duty injury.

[C]

Civilian jobs they do, but dude, but you'd be the first one to say if he's not fit for duty, he shouldn't be a cop. What else are they supposed to do?

[B]

That's where the heroes act comes in, is to. He should be paid. Okay, here's your civilian job you made. You were making 110 grand as a cop plus overtime. You're making 150 good working records for 40 grand.

[C]

No, no, no, I'm not. So. So it's a money thing.

[B]

Yeah. You shouldn't.

[C]

Because if you're not trying to say he should be out.

[B]

No, he's not. To not be on the street. He should be home and paid in full because he did his job.

[C]

Like VA disability.

[B]

Correct. Because if you get. He did get offers. A records job. Cop made a top down deputy make at our agency makes 85 grand. A record starts at 40. So hey man, you lost half your money. Good luck with the truck payment, good luck with your mortgage. But go over there and shuffle those papers all day for me.

[C]

You piece of.

[E]

You're a piece of.

[B]

Why'd you get hurt arresting somebody? So it's like, what does he do? He should. That's where the. There should be a version of VA for law enforcement. And we can learn from the VA mistakes where maybe they missed a boat on it. And it would. The system didn't go well diagnosing people. But there should be something for cops in the same form of VA that says, hey bro, sorry you broke your leg to the point you can never be a cop again. We're not going to take half your salary from you because. And penalize you. We're going to give you the whole thing for life.

[E]

Yeah. And it should. I don't think it should be federal because. Federal.

[C]

Oh. Do you think everybody's retirement's going to be with you?

[B]

How much money FRS has the number. It's like the most successful retirement in this world.

[C]

Oh, damn.

[B]

How about this? How about if I told you this right now? We contribute as cops, we contribute 3% of our salary. What if I told you I'm gonna give you. I'm gonna make you contribute 4%. 1 extra percent. But if you get injured in the line of duty, you're gonna live good the rest of your life. Every cop should.

[C]

Would opt in. Every cop would be trying to get injured in the line of duty.

[B]

That's where we have to have some checks about.

[C]

I would fall off every roof.

[B]

Absolutely. I would. First pro pursuit, I'd be like, oh my God, I saw Tyler throw up his Chipotle today. I am mentally ill and I need ptsd.

[E]

Yes.

[B]

They're going to be people that abuse it. So we got to learn from all that. But somewhere in that world of. In that middle is we got to protect our cops.

[C]

All right, guys, that's it for the show. Went a little bit over today. That's totally fine. Make sure you tuning tonight. Counterculture Inc. YouTube only. Only for the night shift, we will see you then. And if you don't see a night shift, we will see you tomorrow for casual Friday 11am thanks guys. Jv team for life.