The Archers Truth and Lies

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Archers Omnibus – "Truth and Lies"

Date: January 4, 2026
Podcast: The Archers Omnibus, BBC Radio 4
Episode Title: Truth and Lies

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Overview

This episode of The Archers Omnibus, "Truth and Lies," centers on the aftermath of a brutal attack on George Grundy. The story unfolds through a series of police interviews conducted by Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths. As suspicion falls on multiple villagers, hidden animosities, painful histories, and long-standing grievances are revealed, painting a complex, sometimes tragic portrait of the Ambridge community. The episode focuses on unraveling the truth behind George's assault, challenging notions of family, loyalty, and justice.

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Key Discussion Points & Interviews

1. Emma Grundy's Interview ([01:11] – [03:47], [36:58] – [40:21])

• Intense Emotional Turmoil: Emma is questioned while her son George is in critical condition.
  • Emma blames Marky Wainfleet, but DCI Griffiths says he is already imprisoned.
  • Emma wrestles with guilt over a recent family row where she told George to leave and confessed to having slapped him “ages ago.” ([03:09])
• Notable Quote at [03:38]:

  “He’s my boy. You know I would never hurt him.” – Emma Grundy

• Closing Emotional Breakdown: Emma recalls George as a happy boy and blames herself. DCI Griffiths presses about potential suspects within her family, leading Emma to deny any involvement but display deep pain and self-doubt.
  • “If the apple’s rotten, then it’s the tree that needs to be chopped down.” – Emma Grundy ([38:43])

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2. Brad Horribin’s Interview ([04:00] – [09:55])

• Family Dynamics: Brad, a cousin and former close friend of George, describes a childhood rivalry and his perception of George as more confident and successful.
  • Insights into Brad’s anxiety and tendency to expect “bad things,” likening his life to a perpetual horror film:

    “Sometimes the killer or monster is hiding behind the door... That’s how you feel?”
    “Not all the time, but a lot of the time, I suppose.” ([05:41])

• Conflict over Past Lies: DCI Griffiths highlights Brad’s history of lying to the police to protect George ([06:44]), casting doubt on Brad’s current testimony.
• Love Triangle with Amber Gordon: Brad confesses to being in love with Amber, George’s fiancée.
  • He denies attacking George, but admits, painfully:

    “I am in love with her. With Amber. I guess that makes me the monster.” – Brad ([09:47])

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3. Hannah Riley’s Interview ([10:09] – [14:29])

• Describes George as a Misogynist:

  “His lack of respect for women generally... He got involved in a situation with a friend of mine, Helen Archer... tried to put it online.” ([10:13])

• Personal Vindication: Hannah reveals George had her evicted and enjoyed telling her about it ([11:27]).
• Sense of Isolation: She comments on her own invisibility in Ambridge and her struggles with her mother’s dementia.
• Deflection and Insight: When pressed, Hannah doesn’t confess but hints she knows someone who hates George more than she does.

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4. Lillian Bellamy’s Interview ([14:48] – [19:45])

• Community Dislike for George: Lillian describes banning George from The Bull pub, calling him “a dangerous thug with a penchant for framing innocent people,” particularly referencing her niece, Alice Carter ([16:02]).
• Confrontation by DCI Griffiths: The interview turns to Lillian’s tumultuous life, past associates (like Matt Crawford and Paul), and her history of being drawn to “dangerous” men.
  • “I drink too much, I smoke too much. I’ve cheated in the past, I’ve lied, I’ve hurt people. But I’m not a killer or a would-be killer.” ([19:45])
• Moment of Vulnerability: Lillian shares insights about her father and personal flaws.

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5. Sergeant Harrison Burns’ Confrontation ([20:25] – [25:34])

• Complicated Relations with George: Harrison admits being affected by George, given George’s responsibility in a car accident that caused Harrison’s wife to miscarry ([21:16]).
• Policeman’s Dilemma: Harrison pleads with DCI Griffiths to go easy on his wife, Fallon, and her family.
• Personal Confession: He discusses feeling emotionally vulnerable, hinting at temptations post-tragedy but reaffirming love for his wife, Fallon.

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6. Brian Aldridge’s Interview ([26:17] – [32:22])

• Angry, Defensive: Brian is indignant, refusing to be held or have his family questioned.
• History Uncovered: DCI Griffiths brings up the criminal history within the family (illegal chemical dumping, personal and familial dishonesty), painting Brian as a man who’s struggled with truth and loyalty.
  • “George Grundy is a parasite and has created untold misery that has spread through this community like a poisoned river.” – Brian ([28:04])
• Grief and Resentment: Despite the pain, Brian can’t summon sympathy for George and finally breaks down recalling loved ones lost.

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7. Clive Horribin’s Interview ([32:22] – [36:54])

• Stonewalling and Deflection: Clive repeatedly answers “no comment” and then launches into family accusations.
• Finger-Pointing: Blames his sister Susan Carter, husband Neil Carter, and Chris for the attack, presenting himself as a misunderstood family outsider.
• Black Humor and Paranoia: Clive discusses his “surveillance” on family members, feigning help to the investigation.
  • “My family are dangerous people, Detective. I’ve basically been doing your job for you.” – Clive ([35:24])
• Accusations Turned Back: DCI Griffiths implies Clive himself, given his grievances, could be responsible.

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Key Themes & Insights

• Distrust, Secrets, and Generational Conflict: Long-standing family resentment and village feuds come to the surface.
• Justice vs. Loyalty: Many interviewees struggle with past moments of covering for loved ones, calling into question notions of honesty and community.
• Challenging the Surface: DCI Griffiths systematically challenges each character’s declarations of innocence, showing that “the apple that looks the nicest is sometimes the most rotten” ([40:21]).
• Pain of Isolation and Guilt: Both Hannah and Emma share painful stories of loneliness, guilt, and the difficulty of belonging.

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• [03:09] Emma Grundy: “He’s my boy, you know I would never hurt him.”
• [05:41] Brad Horribin: “Sometimes the killer or monster... is hiding behind the door... That’s how you feel?” “Not all the time, but a lot of the time, I suppose.”
• [09:47] Brad Horribin: “I am in love with her. With Amber. I guess that makes me the monster.”
• [11:27] Hannah Riley: “He took it away from me just because... he actively enjoyed telling me.”
• [16:02] Lillian Bellamy: “He is a dangerous thug with a penchant for framing innocent people.”
• [19:45] Lillian Bellamy: “I drink too much, I smoke too much... But I’m not a killer or a would-be killer.”
• [28:04] Brian Aldridge: “George Grundy is a parasite and has created untold misery that has spread through this community like a poisoned river.”
• [35:24] Clive Horribin: “My family are dangerous people, Detective. I’ve basically been doing your job for you.”
• [38:43] Emma Grundy: “If the apple’s rotten, then it’s the tree that needs to be chopped down.”
• [40:21] DCI Griffiths: “[Most attacks] are carried out by someone the victim knows... Sometimes the apple that looks the nicest is actually the most rotten.”

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Important Timestamps & Segments

• [01:11] — Start of Emma Grundy’s police interview
• [04:00] — Brad Horribin’s interview
• [10:09] — Hannah Riley’s interview
• [14:48] — Lillian Bellamy’s interview
• [20:25] — Sgt. Harrison Burns’ confession
• [26:17] — Brian Aldridge’s interview
• [32:22] — Clive Horribin’s interview
• [36:58] — Emma Grundy’s emotional return
• [40:21] — DCI Griffiths reflects on the dark heart of family secrets

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Tone & Style

The episode is somber, tense, and confessional, dominated by DCI Griffiths’ incisive, sometimes relentless, questioning. The community’s surface respectability is stripped away, revealing deep divisions and emotional wounds. Moments of gallows humor (especially from Clive and Lillian) contrast with raw grief, resentment, and vulnerability.

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Conclusion

This installment drives home that truth in Ambridge is elusive; nearly every villager has motive, means, or a hidden grudge. As DCI Griffiths methodically works through the web of relationships, "Truth and Lies" highlights that in a small community, no secret stays hidden – and the greatest threats may come from within. The question of who attacked George remains unresolved, but the emotional and social fallout is powerfully exposed.

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Transcript

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[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Georgie, it's Mum. George. Emma. Emma.

[Hannah Riley]

George.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Emma. Emma.

[Emma Grundy]

Sorry, I was.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Are you ready?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Yeah.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Interview with Emma Grundy. Present is Detective Chief Inspector Griffiths. 1st of January 2026, Borchester Police Station. This interview is being digitally recorded.

[Emma Grundy]

Do we really have to do this now?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mrs. Grundy, please.

[Emma Grundy]

My son, he could be dying.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mrs. Grundy, I genuinely understand how distressing this must be for you.

[Emma Grundy]

Do you do really?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

The medical team are looking after George. The best thing you can do now, listen to me is to help me find out who did this to him. I'll be as quick as I can and then we'll get you back to your son.

[Emma Grundy]

Just do what you need to do.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Great.

[Emma Grundy]

I know who did this anyway.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You do?

[Emma Grundy]

Mark A. I can't remember his other name.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

This is the man.

[Emma Grundy]

He's a psychopath. He or someone he knows planted that knife thing in George's cell. And my son KN got extra time because of that animal and now he's. You need to go out and arrest him.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Marky Wainfleet is already behind bars, Mrs. Grundy.

[Emma Grundy]

Yeah, but his mates aren't, are they? They could be anywhere. Oh, my God. You need to let me out. I need to go to him.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mrs. Grundy.

[Emma Grundy]

Let me out. Let me out.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

No. Mrs. Grundy. Nobody will be allowed near George while the team are treating him. You have my word. Now, can you take a deep breath for me?

[Lillian Bellamy]

That's it.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Now sit down for me. Emma.

[Emma Grundy]

I'm sorry. This is all my fault.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why do you say that?

[Emma Grundy]

We. We had a row, George and the family.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Here.

[Emma Grundy]

Thank you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

There. What did you say to him?

[Emma Grundy]

I wanted him to. To leave and never come back. I didn't mean it. He's just.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I.

[Emma Grundy]

He's my boy, you know I would never hurt him.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Apart from the time you.

[Emma Grundy]

Yeah, I slapped him. But that was. It was ages ago and it was just once.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So. When you said you would never hurt him.

[Emma Grundy]

No, I'm not like that. It was in the heat of the moment. He provoked you?

[Brad Horribin]

No.

[Emma Grundy]

I just lashed out and that's.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why Georgie is where he is. Because someone lashed out.

[Emma Grundy]

You're twisting it. I just. You were supposed to be finding out who attacked my son.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I am. Why don't we get you some more tissues? Emma? Interview with Brad Horribin. Frog in your throat, Mr. Horribin?

[Brad Horribin]

It's so. It's quite warm in here.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I can adjust the temperature of the room.

[Brad Horribin]

Well, I don't want to put you to any trouble.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Sure?

[Brad Horribin]

Yes. I mean, no, it's fine.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Okay. Why don't you have some water? So, just to establish, you and George are best mates.

[Brad Horribin]

Cousins. But, like, I don't know if we're second cousins or once removed. I've never really known what that means.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So you're not best mates?

[Brad Horribin]

No, we were.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Were?

[Brad Horribin]

Ah, well, sorry, I'm just.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

But you and George are close?

[Brad Horribin]

Yeah. When we were kids and stuff, I used to go over to Grange Farm and he'd. We used to play over the fields and George always liked to collect the pig. Sorry?

[Clive Horribin]

Feces.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You don't have to lean into the recorder, Mr. Horobin. It'll pick you up just fine from there.

[Brad Horribin]

Oh, right. Sorry.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Carry on.

[Brad Horribin]

Oh, I've forgotten what I was saying.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Big feces.

[Clive Horribin]

Yeah.

[Brad Horribin]

We used to put it in, like, a line and then see who could jump over it.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

A long jump.

[Brad Horribin]

Yeah. George was really good at it. It was fast, you know, strong. You always seem to find things easier than I did.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Such as?

[Brad Horribin]

I don't know.

[Clive Horribin]

Life.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You don't find life easy?

[Hannah Riley]

Not really.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why is that?

[Brad Horribin]

I don't know.

[Emma Grundy]

It's like.

[Brad Horribin]

Do you watch horror films?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Well, it depends what it is.

[Brad Horribin]

Well, you know, sometimes the killer or monster or whatever is hiding behind the door and they're gonna jump out any minute, and you just really frightened, waiting to be.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That's how you feel?

[Brad Horribin]

Not all the time, but a lot of the time, I suppose.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And why do you think that is?

[Brad Horribin]

I guess maybe I'll feel more prepared for when the bad stuff arrives to get me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

But what if the bad stuff doesn't come?

[Brad Horribin]

It will eventually.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Certainly has for George. So how often did you fall in there?

[Brad Horribin]

Most times, to be fair.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

But George didn't. Out loud, please, Mr. Horribin.

[Brad Horribin]

Sorry. No, he never seemed to ever.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

A bit like the incident with the bench at the Grey Gables Hotel. Right up to your neck in it, then, weren't you? Well, seems you have form for lying to the police.

[Brad Horribin]

No. Can I just.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Help yourself.

[Brad Horribin]

That was. George told me to. It wasn't my idea.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

He coerced you.

[Brad Horribin]

Coerced is probably a bit strong.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

George told you to lie about who broke the hotel's memorial bench, but then admitted the truth himself. Well, yeah.

[Clive Horribin]

Yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Not a very nice thing to do to his best mate. Slash some kind of cousin.

[Brad Horribin]

I shouldn't have gone along with it.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You understand my point, Mr. Horribin. When someone has lied to the police before, it's difficult to believe them. Even if they're telling you the truth.

[Brad Horribin]

I am. I am telling the truth.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You covered for George over the bench. You could be covering for someone now.

[Clive Horribin]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your sister, for example.

[Brad Horribin]

Chelsea.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Not a big fan of George, by all accounts.

[Hannah Riley]

Well, she's not a big fan of.

[Brad Horribin]

Anyone, really, but she.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Or your stepfather. Jazza. Is that his real name?

[Hannah Riley]

No. No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Made no secret of his dislike for George. No stranger to a scrap, from what I've heard.

[Brad Horribin]

Well, maybe when he was younger.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Or your mum. Tracy.

[Brad Horribin]

Please don't bring my mum into this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

She can handle herself, can't she?

[Brad Horribin]

I don't want to answer any more questions, thank you. No comment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

What about Amber Gordon? Brad, you seem like a nice lad to me. You're bright, you're sensitive. I mean that as a compliment. But you also strike me as the sort of person that holds everything in. That gives and gives and gives until there's nothing left for yourself. Is that fair to say? People would understand if you lashed out, Brad. I would understand. How do you feel about Amber?

[Brad Horribin]

We went to school together. We're friends.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Anything ever happen between you?

[Brad Horribin]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Seems your well has run dry, Brad.

[Brad Horribin]

Nothing's ever happened but you'd like it to. She's marrying George.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How does she feel about you?

[Brad Horribin]

I. I don't know.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Does she like you two?

[Clive Horribin]

She loves George.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And does George treat her well?

[Brad Horribin]

He's mad about her.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And what about you? Are you in love with her? Brad?

[Brad Horribin]

I've never seen him like that about anyone.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Does George make you anxious? Is he the monster in your horror film? Is that why you smashed a bottle over his head?

[Brad Horribin]

No, I didn't.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Did Amber?

[Brad Horribin]

No, she wouldn't do that.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Listen, Brad, this isn't a film, okay? There is a real monster out there and my job is to find them. And anything you can tell me, even if you think it's irrelevant or intrusive or fake, frightening might just be the difference between catching them or not. Would you like some more water?

[Brad Horribin]

Yes, please.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Coming right up.

[Hannah Riley]

I am sorry.

[Brad Horribin]

I am in love with her. With Amber. I guess that makes me the monster.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Thank you, Brad. Let me get you that drink and then we can Carry on. Interview with Hannah Riley. So you believe George Grundy is a misogynist?

[Hannah Riley]

He is a misogynist.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And why do you say that?

[Hannah Riley]

Well, his lack of respect for women generally. His refusal to accept instructions or guidance from a woman in the work environment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

This was you at Barrow Farm?

[Hannah Riley]

Yeah. And he. He got involved in a situation with a friend of mine, Helen Archer. Basically supporting her son, Henry, to meet up with his former stepdad, who's. Well, he was an abuser, a gaslighter, a rapist. And when Helen discovered what he was doing and was understandably, well, furious, George recorded her without her consent and tried to put it online.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

The same Helen Archer who stabbed her husband.

[Hannah Riley]

Good honour, I say.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You used to live at number one, the Green, Ambridge. Where George lives now, with his father, sister, fiance.

[Brad Horribin]

Yeah.

[Hannah Riley]

More fool her.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Do you know Amber Gordon? I've seen her about, but never spoken to her.

[Hannah Riley]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Would you like to?

[Hannah Riley]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You don't think you should warn her of Mr. Grundy's tendencies?

[Hannah Riley]

Well, she'll see them for herself, seeing as she's able to look past the biceps in the six pack.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

When did you move out of number one, the Green?

[Hannah Riley]

When George had me evicted.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

He evicted you personally?

[Hannah Riley]

Well, his dad did, but it was George's idea.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

He told you that, did he?

[Hannah Riley]

He did, actually, yeah. He made it his business to tell me. He actively enjoyed telling me. I really loved that little house. He took it away from me just because.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And you still work at Barrow Farm? Yes. Where George was employed. Until he was fired.

[Clive Horribin]

That's right.

[Hannah Riley]

He didn't like rules. Or some of the folk that enforced them.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

His grandfather fired him.

[Hannah Riley]

Neil? Yeah.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That must have been Hart. His own grandson.

[Hannah Riley]

Rules are rules. You should know. You can't bend them just because you don't like them.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You caused a division between them.

[Hannah Riley]

George caused the division. He doesn't like women like me. Women who fight back.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And is that what you do, Miss Riley? Fight back?

[Hannah Riley]

If necessary, yeah.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Supported by Neil Carter, who you also didn't like initially. Do you have a problem with men, Ms. Riley?

[Hannah Riley]

You can't gel with everyone. Me and Neil just had teething trouble, but he is one of the good guys. Okay? I've got a lot of time for.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Neil and his son. Why is that funny?

[Hannah Riley]

Well, because it's Chris, George's uncle.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You can't seem to get away from Mr. Grundy.

[Hannah Riley]

Yeah, you're telling me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Did you and Chris gel.

[Hannah Riley]

We're just mates. He helped me through some tough times.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Such as?

[Hannah Riley]

My. Well, my Mum has dementia, if you must know.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That must be difficult.

[Hannah Riley]

It is what it is.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And when was the last time you saw Mr. Grundy?

[Hannah Riley]

Boxing Day. Late Christmas present.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Did you speak?

[Hannah Riley]

Unfortunately, yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

What did he say? Typical.

[Hannah Riley]

George really crowed about what a brilliant Christmas he'd had with his family. His fiance assumed that I'd have no one special around me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And what did you say?

[Hannah Riley]

What could I say? He's right.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Is he?

[Hannah Riley]

When I was between houses a couple of years ago, I went to stay with my mum for a month. Do you know how many people, apart from my work colleagues, even noticed I'd gone?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You don't feel that you belong in Ambridge?

[Hannah Riley]

I don't feel I belong anywhere. I never have, really. Even my own mum doesn't recognise me. She keeps calling me Tina.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Who's Tina?

[Hannah Riley]

I've no idea. But whoever it is, she needs to feed the cat.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your mum has a cat?

[Hannah Riley]

No. Sometimes it's just easier to take her hand and go there. Some of our best chats recently have been about Tina and her non existent cat. I like Mum's fantasyland. It's nicer than the real world.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And nobody noticed you were feeling like this?

[Hannah Riley]

Nope.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Is that what you want, Hannah? To be noticed? George clearly noticed you.

[Hannah Riley]

Yeah, I guess he did.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Did you hit him?

[Hannah Riley]

It'd be ironic, wouldn't it? The invisible woman. Who would have a no, eh?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Was it you, Miss Riley?

[Hannah Riley]

Risk prison for that vile little scrote. I wouldn't give him the satisfaction.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I see. Well, thank you.

[Hannah Riley]

I know who I'd put my money on, though.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Really?

[Hannah Riley]

Definitely. What's the benefit of not being noticed? You tend to see things and hear em. Well, I know someone who hates George Grundy more than I do.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I'm listening. Interview with Lillian Bellamy.

[Lillian Bellamy]

It's all so dreadful. Ambridge of all places.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, it's such a quiet haven, I suppose.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You know what they say, it's always the quiet ones.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, that's me out, then.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You out.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, I'm not one of the quiet ones. Historically.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Yes, so I've heard.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Oh, well, may I ask who has? Well, I don't suppose you're allowed to reveal your sources?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That's right. But these sources, if you want to call them that, have been rather forthcoming.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Oh, wow.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That's progress about you.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Have they in. In what way?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

They reckon you were involved. Me?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, they honestly think that. Look, I'm sorry, Detective, but somebody's been wasting your very valuable.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So they were lying when they talked about your dislike of George Grundy?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, I mean, look, let me level with you, darling. Detective George Grundy and I had a couple of, well, I suppose you could.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Call them, run ins banning him from the Bull Pub in Ambridge. Why did you do that?

[Lillian Bellamy]

He is a dangerous thug with a penchant for framing innocent people.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your niece, Alice Carter.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You disliked Mr. Grundy because he allowed your niece to face charges for a crime she didn't commit.

[Lillian Bellamy]

What he did to that girl was. Well, he was evil.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And that's why you barred him?

[Hannah Riley]

Yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Even though he served a prison sentence for that offence?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, not enough, if you ask me. Hardly fair.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And do you think it's fair that someone hit Mr. Grundy with a bottle?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Now look here.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Assault, attempted murder. And if he doesn't make it, then we're looking at actual murder.

[Lillian Bellamy]

You can't possibly. I mean, do I really look like the sort of woman who would attack a man barely out of his teenage years?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Well, it pays in my role, Mrs. Bellamy, to be open minded about what people are capable of.

[Lillian Bellamy]

I suppose a cigarette break is out of the question?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mr. Grundy's actions towards your niece also had severe consequences for your stables business. Am I right?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Yes, you are.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That you run with your partner, Justin Elliot.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Indeed.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Are his opinions of Mr. Grundy as forthright as yours?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Look, if you're suggesting that Justin smashed a bottle over George's head, then you don't know him very well. A man wouldn't waste a good claret.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How do you know it was a good claret?

[Lillian Bellamy]

I don't. It was obviously a joke.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You think a serious assault on a young man is a laughing matter?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Of course not. Look, I've known the Grundys for a very long time and I feel desperately sorry for all of them. Even George? To a degree. Look, I apologize, Detective. I'm not used to this sort of thing. I run a housing company. I ride horses. I'm not part of the criminal underclasses.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Aren't you?

[Lillian Bellamy]

What do you mean? Aren't you?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Matt Crawford.

[Lillian Bellamy]

He's nothing to do with any of this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your ex partner?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Very ex.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

A member of the criminal underclasses? Yes.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Well, I mean, hindsight's a wonderful thing.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Matt Crawford was hit by a car and left for dead in a lane near the Grey Gables Hotel in October 2017.

[Lillian Bellamy]

It was?

[Narrator / Closing credits]

Yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

The driver was never caught.

[Lillian Bellamy]

I don't believe this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why do these things keep happening to you, Mrs. Bellamy?

[Lillian Bellamy]

They don't keep happening to me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And what about Matt's brother, Paul? Was it who you had an affair with?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Paul was a good man. He was all of the best bits of math without any of the rubbish.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Paul died?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Yeah, in 2013.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

As did both of your husbands.

[Lillian Bellamy]

For heaven's sake. I thought Linda Snell had a vivid imagination.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How do you get yourself involved in these sorts of dramas, Mrs. Bellamy?

[Lillian Bellamy]

I ask myself the same question.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Are you attracted to the danger? No. Does part of you enjoy it? You were a lady of a certain age.

[Lillian Bellamy]

How dare you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So what's the alternative? Knitting circles? Jam? Making a sensible cardigan? You love the drama, don't you, Lillian? You wouldn't know what to do with yourself otherwise. It's all you've ever known since you were a little girl. Why is that? Your parents, perhaps?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Lillian, I love my father. He was the life and soul of the party. A twinkle in his eye and the living definition of charm. But he had a darkness to him. Don't have to be a qualified therapist to work out why. I'm drawn to a certain type. Perhaps I think I can fix them. I don't know. I couldn't fix him. Nobody could. Not even my mother. And she could do most things if she put her mind to it.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Do you think you're similar to him?

[Lillian Bellamy]

Probably. I drink too much, I smoke too much. I've cheated in the past, I've lied, I've hurt people. But I'm not a killer or a would be killer. I would never hurt anyone, not deliberately. And I would certainly never cover up a serious crime.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So how did Matt Crawford manage to evade us, Mrs. Bellamy? Who was it? Who gave him that all important head start?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Excuse me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mum. I'm sorry.

[Hannah Riley]

Sorry.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mouth not big enough, if you can believe that.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Sorry to interrupt your dinner.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I'm not sure that's an accurate description. Really.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

That's Borchester Police canteen for you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I'm sorry, did you want me?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Oh, Burns. Sergeant Burns. Mum. Harrison.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

Can I?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Of course. You don't mind if I carry on attacking this lasagna, do you? Long day?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Yeah. No.

[Lillian Bellamy]

Yeah.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Are you here on the George Grundy case?

[Clive Horribin]

Man.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How can I help you, Sergeant?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

It's a bit delicate.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

My middle name. Actually, it's Hillary, but I'll deny it in court.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Well, me and George are. Well, we're sort of neighbours.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Ah, of course.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

And before Mr. Common? I had some time off. My wife had a miscarriage.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Yes, I'm sorry.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

In the Hayden Bridge crash. Mr. Grundy were driving the other.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I'm aware.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Right.

[Clive Horribin]

And?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Well, now I hear he's since Been?

[Brad Horribin]

Well, you know.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And you're worried that you have motive, means and I'm guessing opportunity as well as form. Of course.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Pardon?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Threatening Mr. Grundy in his own front garden, grabbing him by the throat, etc.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

How did you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Chip?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

No, no. Oh, thanks. I didn't realize that anyone. Mom, I'll be up front with you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Always. Best if you don't want to look like you've got something to hide. Especially seeing as you and I both know you're on a final warning. Well, remind me what that was for.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I. I brought confidentiality.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Mum.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Harry Chilcott. So it's a bit of a long story.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Bleak House.

[Clive Horribin]

Pardon?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

That's a long story.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Cards on the table, Mom, I. I know you've been interviewing some folk and you'll want witness statements or what have you, but I. I just wanted to ask if you please go easy on me wife. Mom.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Even if she's guilty.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

She's not.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You sure?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I'm not just saying this cuz she's me wife, but however much she might have been pushed.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

She was pushed, was she?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

No, not in the.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Chuck me that brown sauce, will you?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Fallon has never hurt someone like that. She doesn't have it in her. None of them do. I swear on my life.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

None of who?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Sorry?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Who else are you referring to? Who else wouldn't have done this?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Well, me in laws, Jolene and Kenton Archer.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And what's their connection to Mr. Grundy? Oh, come on, sergeant. You know I'll find out eventually.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

George made intimidating comments to them and this was particularly upsetting in light of the threats they received from Marky Waemfleet and his associates. I believe that is a line of inquiry you should follow your in laws.

[Clive Horribin]

No.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Wormfleet. Jolene and Kenton are honest, decent people. People, Mom.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And as we know, Sergeant, honest, decent people can do all sorts of things if the circumstances arise. You must still have complicated feelings yourself. Mr. Grundy's actions obviously impacted your relationship with your wife.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I'll be honest with you, Mom. I am.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Sorry.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

It almost destroyed us. Destroy me.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So what about the other woman? What woman? Your colleague.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Sorry, Mum, I'm not sure what you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Oh, come on, Sergeant Burns. What goes on up north, stays in Huddersfield and all that. No judgment here. A law enforces law is a lonely one. No, mind my crumble, Sergeant.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

We're mates. Millies.

[Clive Horribin]

We're. We got on.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How did it start?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I gave her a lift on once. And I met her kids. Six and three, boy and a girl.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Their dad back it off somewhere.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

His Loss. And we did not have an affair. I, I, I saw him at socials and family days over at Summer. We were mates, like all of us. And then one day, one day the little lad, he looked at me through his. His massive glasses and he said, will you be our new dad? And I didn't know where to put myself. And I said they didn't need a new dad and pointed out the brilliant mum, But.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And she propositioned you?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

It weren't like that. I had no idea. She, I mean, she knew I were married, but.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Ready made family must have been tempting.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

That's just it.

[Clive Horribin]

Moment.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I wasn't tempted at all. I love Fallon. I love her more than anything. And I'm sorry. I shouldn't have come over.

[Clive Horribin]

Mom.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

I'm sorry. Your custard will get cold.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I prefer it that way.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Anyway, I've probably said too much.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Where are you going?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Well, I were only really supposed to be collecting my stuff from my desk.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

On New Year's Day. Well, listen, when you're done, why don't you pop downstairs? Interview room nine.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

What for?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

No rush. But I think we need to make this a bit more official, don't you, Sergeant?

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Official?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Grab yourself a pastry. I've got a feeling you might need it. Interview with Sergeant Harrison Burns. Present is Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griff. Interview with Brian Aldridge. Mr. Aldridge, I must ask you again to please calm down and take a seat.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, you have absolutely no right to hold me here, asking me please damn fool questions. No right whatsoever.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Mr. Aldrich, as you are aware, a very serious crime has been committed and all I'm trying to do is ascertain.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I am under no obligation to remain here.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Very well, sir. If that's how you feel, then enjoy the rest of your day. Really, much as I might like to, I can't force people to stay unless I arrest them.

[Sergeant Harrison Burns]

Well, good.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Yes, quite right. Thank you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Oh, do you know if your daughter is available to today?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I'm sorry?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Alice. She gave a witness statement. But maybe I should call her in for an interview.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Oh, surely there's no.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

I dare say she will find it quite difficult being back in a police station after everything that happened last year. Well, year before now, I suppose. Technically. Happy New Year, by the way.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

She doesn't know anything more.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You sure about that? Are you? I mean, she was probably the last person to see Mr. Grundy before you know. It's a coincidence, don't you think?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I advise you to think very carefully, Chief Inspector, before you start making lurid insinuations about my daughter.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And if anyone has a good reason.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I order you to stop this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Merely sent to prison for something she didn't do. Denied access to her daughter, her business, suffered some alcoholics, might easily have drunk themselves to death. Shall I go on?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Or would you prefer to talk to me instead?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Haven't you people done enough damage to Alice already?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Us?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, you and your.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You don't like George Grundy very much, do you, Mr. Aldridge? May I call you Brian?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

No, you may not. And would you, if he put your daughter through months of hell?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

He did his time.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

A year. That's hardly a punishment. Boy deserved a life sentence.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Well, depending on the extent of his injuries, maybe he got one.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, I'm sorry, but I. I can't bring myself to sympathize. Not after everything he's done to my family. George Grundy is a parasite and has created untold misery that has spread through.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

This community like a poisoned river.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

That's too far, Chief Inspector. That is too far.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You very nearly went to prison yourself a few years ago, didn't you, Mr. Aldrich? Illegally dumping gallons of chemicals into the local river. Destruction of wildlife. Huge risk to the general public.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

That was an accident. He lied about that crash for months purely to save his own miserable skin.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You've never done that. Told lies to protect yourself. You're not doing it now.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, I don't profess to be a saint, Chief Inspector.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

What a good job, really. You have a history of deceit, Mr. Aldrich. Years of dishonesty. Professional, legal, personal. Have you ever lied to your children, Mr. Aldrich? Or your wife? Tell me about your son.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Now, you listen here. Adam is probably the best man I know. His superb father and husband. And as honest as they come, he takes after his mother.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your late wife, Jennifer.

[Clive Horribin]

Yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

My sympathy's for your loss.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Thank you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Though, technically, he's your stepson.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, he is, yes.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And then there are Kate and Debbie.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, if you insist on being technical about it.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Please.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Debbie is also my stepchild.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Who was also in Ambridge over the Christmas period. Any propensity for violence?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

No, none.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

What about Kate?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, have you met her?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Maybe I will.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, Kate's different.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

How so?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, she has an alternative view of the world. It's a view I don't always understand or share, but it's a rather lovely one.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Also forgiven George, then, has she?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

What?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Well, sounds like she's the sort to want to rid herself of negative energies.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Yes, she is.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Or does Kate's dislike of George still run deep like that poisoned river.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Are we nearly done?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Just one more. Who's Rory?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

You leave him out of this. Now, that boy. That boy's been through enough in his life.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

It was actually him I was referring to when I asked about your son earlier.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Yes, well, he is my son.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And he presumably doesn't like George very much either.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

You're sailing very close to the wind here, young lady.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

He and Adam both had to deal with a fallout from Alice's drinking after the Hayden Bridge crash. Very protective of their sister, I would imagine.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Well, that's natural, don't you think?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

The circumstances of Rory's birth weren't natural, though, were they, Mr. Aldridge? He was born as the result of an affair you had with your mistress, Siobhan Hathaway.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Don't you dare bring her into this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

More lies. More lies.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I want the name of your superior.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Story. Look like her, Mr. Aldridge. When you look at him, do you see Siobhan staring back at you? Are you all right, Mr. Aldrich?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

I'm fine. Just need my angina spray.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Do you want a doctor?

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

No.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Why don't you have a seat? Just take a minute.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

My Jenny was the most wonderful woman. She was kind and gentle and forgiving. She had class. You could probably learn a few things from her.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

But she didn't make you feel young, did she? Alive. Do you still keep Siobhan hidden away, Mr. Aldridge? Wouldn't it be nice to be able to talk about her? To say her name? Or I could always get Alice in here. Or Rory or one of the others.

[Unidentified minor speaker / Interviewer assistant]

Everyone thought it was a midlife crisis. And I thought it was, too. I mean, she was. She was fun and funny. I never quite knew what she was going to say or do. She reminded me of my mother. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I've lost a lot of important people in my life, Chief Inspector. Some of whom I miss every day. But I'm sorry. George Grundy wouldn't be one of them.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Interview with Clive Horribin.

[Clive Horribin]

No comment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

When was the last time you saw Mr. Grundy?

[Clive Horribin]

No comment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Where were you last night?

[Clive Horribin]

No comment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Okay, let's. Let's cut to the chase, shall we? You're in a position to give me some valuable insight into who may have attacked George Grundy. And in return, I may be able to help you with your bit of bother. What do you think, Mr. Horrobin?

[Clive Horribin]

Call me Cloyd.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Great. Let's start again. You say you know the family.

[Clive Horribin]

I am the family.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Okay.

[Clive Horribin]

Not a decent one. Among them stab you in the back as soon as look at you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And who are we talking about specifically?

[Clive Horribin]

My sister, Susan Carter. Write her name down all on the recording. She's clever. Set herself up as this pillar of the community. Good old Susan. Always rely on her not to crease your fishing magazine. And undone that last tin of corn beef.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Pardon?

[Clive Horribin]

She works in the Ambridge Village shop.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Ah, yes. The one you robbed at gunpoint.

[Clive Horribin]

See, this is what she wants you to think. That I'm the bad guy. I've made mistakes in my life, Sarge.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Detective Chief Inspector.

[Clive Horribin]

I ain't denying that. But I've turned myself around. I'm a better person. An honest person. I do Reiki, you know. It were her that squealed on George in the first place. What sort of woman does that to her own family, eh? You want to know who bottled o George. I wouldn't put nothing past her.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Okay.

[Clive Horribin]

And Neil? Her husband. Works with pigs. No offence, Lloyd.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

None taken.

[Clive Horribin]

Cut from the same cloth as his missus. Him and George don't get on. All kicked off recently over a ring. Me mum's ring. Mine by rights.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So, Susan and Neil Carter. Any others?

[Clive Horribin]

Son, Chris. She calls him. Christopher, of course, because she's a snob and thinks she's better than anybody else. He's one of them blacksmiths. So he's strong enough, you know, to whack someone.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Motive?

[Clive Horribin]

He were married to Alice. The woman what George framed. Pretty little thing likes a drink. Apparently she dropped their little girl at a christening or summit. Wish I'd been there. Could have filmed it. Used to get 200 quid for them sort of things on telly back in the day.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And how have you come by all this information? Information?

[Clive Horribin]

Oh, dad told me that they all think he's daft, but no, gets past him.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

So nothing to do with what we found on your phone? For the benefit of the recording, I'm showing Mr. Horabin, Clive copies of some of the photographs recently discovered on his mobile phone during the course of a separate investigation. Most of these are of your sister, Susan?

[Clive Horribin]

No comment.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Taken over the course the of the last year or so. There's quite a few. Same with your other sister, Tracy and their families. Is that a mobile sauna in her garden?

[Clive Horribin]

Surveillance. I've been gathering intel.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Oh, I see. You're undercover.

[Clive Horribin]

I knew something like this would happen. And I were right. My family are dangerous people, Detective. I've basically been doing your job for you.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Well, you've been very thorough, Clive.

[Clive Horribin]

You're welcome. So we're Done, then. Is that enough insight to, you know.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Just before we get onto that, I'm going through everyone in George's immediate circle and there's someone we seem to have missed.

[Clive Horribin]

Oh, yeah? Who's that then?

[Brad Horribin]

You, Eh?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

History of violence. A vendetta against the family that you believe wronged you.

[Clive Horribin]

You can't do this.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Did George stay in touch with you when you left Ambridge last time? Did he thank you for your hospitality? Or did he just try and forget about you like your other relatives?

[Clive Horribin]

I know what you're trying to do.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Here's an alternative scenario for you, Clive.

[Clive Horribin]

Oh, here come the big words.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You follow your family for months, lurking in the shadow, studying them, waiting for the perfect opportunity to exact your revenge. Then you attack your great nephew and frame them.

[Clive Horribin]

You're clutching at straws, Detective. I couldn't care less if most of Ambridge dropped dead tomorrow. In fact, I'd quite happily set the whole village on fire and watch it burn to the ground. If I were going to make anyone suffer, Detective, it wouldn't be O George. I'd start with his gobby mare of a mother.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Resuming interview with Emma Grundy.

[Emma Grundy]

It was an accident, you know. George. When I was pregnant with him, I was just so scared. Scared of hurting my husband, my parents. Scared of hurting the man I really loved.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Your brother in law?

[Emma Grundy]

Yeah, go on, judge me. I've heard it all before. Mainly from George.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

No judgment here.

[Emma Grundy]

But there was this little baby inside me and he kept me warm all through that really cold winter. I felt like he was. Oh, sounds silly. Like he was hugging my heart. And I thought, finally, here's someone I can love. And it just feels natural and right and uncomplicated. But it is complicated. The things you imagine when you're having a baby, they're just so naive. First words, first steps. George's first word was woof. He was copying the dog, bless him. He loved animals. He was such a happy little boy. He just wanted to watch SpongeBob and wear his wellies to bed. And he. It went so fast and I just. I was living in a dream world. Are we all so clueless?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Tissue?

[Emma Grundy]

I would die for my son, Detective. I'd jump in front of a train for him. Or sometimes cause of him. Please don't think badly of George. Think badly of me. If the apple's rotten, then it's the tree that needs to be chopped down.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Do you love your son, Emma?

[Emma Grundy]

I've never wanted to love anything more.

[Brad Horribin]

He.

[Emma Grundy]

He doesn't make it easy. Oh, I'm sorry. When I saw him lying there hurt, I. I didn't see a big strapping lad with a foul mouth who sometimes frightens me. I just saw my little Georgie who just wanted to wear his wellies to bed.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

What about his dad?

[Emma Grundy]

We are idolizes, George. He was adamant we should protect him. When the whole truth about the crash came out, I couldn't bear all the lion.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

You understand I have to ask about relatives. Sure. And your current husband, Ed?

[Emma Grundy]

He had some issues a long time ago.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And are we talking about the pesticides or the drugs?

[Emma Grundy]

Look, please, I need to see my son.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

And what about Kira?

[Emma Grundy]

What about her?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Does she not make it easy to be loved either? What's she capable of, Emma? Do you know? Is she the sort of girl to lash out? No. Emma, if you did this, or you know who did, we will help you, okay? I promise.

[Emma Grundy]

I didn't. I would never. I've had some pretty awful days in my life, Detective, but this is absolutely the worst. I suppose that means I must love him after all. Can I go to him now? Please?

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Interview terminated. Believe it or not, I'm really sorry I've had to do this. It's not a part of the job I enjoy. But in 25 years and counting, the vast majority of attacks like this that I've come across are carried out by someone the victim knows. You have to face facts, Emma. Sometimes the apple that looks the nicest is actually the most rotten. And it might just be sitting on your family tree.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

The archers truth and lies was written by david payne and featured claire skinner as dci sally griffiths. Emma grundy was played by emerald waldo hanrahan, brad horowin by taylor utley, hannah riley by helen longworth and lillian bellamy by sunny ormond. Harrison burns was james cartwright, brian aldrich, charles collingwood and clive horribin. Alex jones. The director was toby swift and the editor, jeremy howe. It was a BBC audio birmingham production. Do the wonder products that you see on your social media and supermarket shelves really deliver on their bold claims?

[Clive Horribin]

Dehumidifiers, standing discs, nail polish from supplements.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

Claiming to boost your mind and body.

[Clive Horribin]

I've seen so many claims about creatine.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

To fake tans promising a safe streak free glow.

[Lillian Bellamy]

I really like it.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

I'm Greg foot and my BBC Radio 4 show sliced bread is back to separate more science fact from marketing fiction.

[BBC Announcer]

I would tend to lean towards it being a positive.

[Narrator / Closing credits]

All our suggestions come from your emails or voice notes. Even if you're a bit under the weather.

[Detective Chief Inspector Sally Griffiths]

Hello, Greg. I want to know about cough mixture?

[Narrator / Closing credits]

I'm finding out the answers in my new series of sliced bread, available first on BBC Sounds.

[BBC Announcer]

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