James Horncastle (2:43)

Yeah, I think it was up there. Probably surpassed last year's quarterfinal against Real Madrid. You know, you could see that the club and the fans put a lot into it. Even, you know, hours before kickoff. You know, it felt to me walking down the Holloway Road into the Emirates like the end of Notting Hill Carnival. And it was actually a really good kind of amuse bouche if you like, for what would happen later because outside the media entrance on the sort of main concourse with the. There's the roundabout, just a mass of people just hoofing a loose football around, which was kind of like the last 10 or 15 minutes of the game sort of everyone's sort of trying to get rid of that nervous tension that they were having by just oh, there's a ball, kick it. Rather than have any sort of control. But yeah, it did feel like a big European night that you would usually experience on the continent. And the choreography that the, the club and the fans put on, I thought met the moment really well. The flamethrowers on the sidelines did create this kind of low hanging smoke which was, which was a great atmosphere in which to play the game in. And it felt to me, and I've often gone to the Emirates this season, I was there for the Man City game. I was there for the Newcastle game 10 years ago, 10 days ago. I often feel like the anxiety in the fan base comes across on the pitch. And instead I think from as soon as the stands started to populate, there was a positivity, there was a willingness there from the fans for their players to do it. And even when, and to be honest, there weren't that many moments in the game that Atletico gave Arsenal fans cause to be nervous. But even in those moments the fans I think tried to lift the team. And certainly afterwards Mikel Arteta was very complimentary of the role the fans played in that win. So no, it was a definite improvement on the semi final against Real Madrid and the floppy Cannon a year ago.

Ayo Akimolere (5:05)

You can understand that sort of trepidation and the nerves from the fans, can't you? Amy Lawrence after the match wrote a beautiful piece on the Athletic. In regards to the Champions League in particular, Arsenal's relationship with this competition has kept the highest rungs of the ladder at arm's length for years. They got in the lift but didn't have the key to the top floor. They are the ghosts of European past in this stadium for sure. You can understand the disappointment in this competition, the lack of participation in this competition. And here is a team at a point where it could be making history going into the final.

Guest Analyst (5:40)

Yeah, I think the big thing from, I guess A holistic perspective is we, when you look at their progress year on year, you get back into the Champions League for the first time in seven years and you get to the quarter final, you play Bayern. Bayern were better. I also feel, if we're looking at the mood in terms of what James is talking about, about the fans inside the stadium. I remember being at that Bayern game and when Harry Kane scored a penalty, it almost felt like the stadium just. The noise just died. It was so silent you could hear a pin drop. But then when you are more used to being in those situations, I guess you know how to deal with them, both players and fans. And for me, being at the Fulham game at the weekend, there was a moment at halftime where I actually couldn't hear the halftime whistle go because of the noise that was going on in the stadium. And I feel like it's no coincidence that Mikel Arteta went with the exact same team because he could feel the energy from that first half against Fulham. And you probably really want to use that and take that into, you know, last night's game against Atletico Madrid. So, yeah, from, I guess those two perspectives, it feels like there has been a real kind of journey and sometimes you need something a bit unexpected, like, I don't know, a home game against Fulham to really be the catalyst. But I also feel like the stages Arsenal have gone through, quarter final, semi final last year and now final this year, you've been able to see the progress in real time. It's been quite a nice journey. Even though it's been quite stressful and nervous at times, it's been nice to see that chronological progress. Yeah.

Ayo Akimolere (7:22)

James, we'll talk about Michael Arteta a little later on. I just want to sort of touch on something that Arts just said. You know, he did something unexpected to a certain degree here, including players like Marcus, Luis Kelly in midfield in such a big match. And we'll talk about Atletico just after this. But was that surprising to you because you talk about the cacophony of the crowd and you talk about how up for it they were after the Fulham game, I felt the crowd felt that way to keep the things the same instead of changing it. That can only help with the uplift.

James Horncastle (7:49)

Yeah, I think there has obviously been a mood shift in the last four or five days, which might not only be really important in Arsenal's season, but their history as well. Because, you know, as much as people made out, this Fulham team, you know, they've eaten something bad, a virus has run through the team to win that Game three, nil. And to win for the first time in a while, quite easily, I think was important for the message it sent to the players and the message it sent to the fans. And then obviously the city result in Liverpool on Monday night, I think just gave everybody connected with Arsenal even more reason to believe. I think it still was surprising to see the lineup remain the same from the weekend, because the assumption there was everyone thought Arteta was resting players for the or calculating his rotation for the second leg against Atletico. And instead, Yeah, I mean, he himself admitted in the press conference afterwards where he was saying, like, you have not seen my ipod, my iPad, and the many changes I've been making over the last few days. But it was really interesting to see Califuri and Louis Skelly in the same team because I think at the beginning of the season it was felt that Calafury had come back from pre season determined to sort of make that role his own, and sort of did. And then they signed Hinckapier and it meant there was not really much space for Louis Skelly. And here they are in arguably the biggest game of the season, at least in their Champions League season, and Arteta finds a way to play them together. And I think for all of those people who thought he'd lost some confidence in Luis Skelly to play a kid his age in midfield in a game like that, really, you could not have more confidence in a player if you are going to do that. So, you know, credit to the player, credit for Arteta for getting it right, because you can imagine if they'd gone out last night, people would have said, what was he thinking with his lineup? He's overthought this, you know, why did he think a team that could beat Fulham at the weekend could be athletico and instead he's been vindicated.

Ayo Akimolere (10:05)

Yeah, look, much we made of Arsenal celebrations after the game and you kind of understand it because it seemed for some fans, maybe a little too much and maybe a little too much too early. But, you know, I was listening to Declan Rice after the match. I think he was speaking to Amazon prime and he said, you know, I don't think. And you can underestimate what we've done in this competition up until this point, and they had every right to celebrate, you know, that match in itself. He said, it's such a big moment. Champions League final is a proud moment for the boys and also for the club and that they are trying to soak it all in, like, regardless of the fact that they haven't won it. We still don't know who they'll meet in the final. What they're looking to achieve this season has to be applauded to a certain degree. And you can understand that relief when something actually looks like it's coming through.

Guest Analyst (10:51)

Yeah, I think relief is the big word, because so much of this season has been stressful for Arsenal fans watching, whether it's on TV or in the stadium. And the last four days, as James mentioned, has kind of just been a release of that. Last night, it felt like even in those tricky moments, they were kind of in control of things. It didn't feel like there was anxiety in the team at all. And I think when you're looking at the celebrations, I mean, how do people want. How do people want the club, the fans, to react, to get into a Champions League final for the first time in 20 years? I think you're entitled to do what you want. And a big thing as well is the second leg being at the Emirates. I think when you look at last year, it was the first leg of the semifinals against psg, and that just makes it so different because you genuinely don't know what you're going into in that first leg. You don't know what to expect. And you kind of felt the difference, I guess, last night with the team bus coming in. I mean, Bukayo Saka said he's never seen anything like that in his career and he's been playing for seven years now. So, yeah, I think around the celebrations, I think people just need to understand where Arsenal are coming from. I mean, five years ago, not even being in Europe, and now they're in a Champions League final. And I also just want to say to James, earlier point on Califiori and Miles, Louis Scali, we actually spoke to California after the Fulham game, a few of us, and he himself said the opportunity has probably come a bit late for four Miles. So I think, not that he's guilty or feels guilty in any way, but I think the players as well probably really kind of have been waiting for a moment for Miles to, you know, show what he can do in his actual position, because they probably see it every day and it was really nice to see them in that team together, because as you say, I guess last year we wouldn't have imagined it. Earlier this season, we probably wouldn't either. So, yeah, to have them get that moment was really cool, especially because there was a chance for Louis Scali to start in midfield earlier in the season, in February in the FA Cup. But Califuri got injured in the warm up, so he couldn't. For him to get that opportunity finally and for him to take it so well was great to see.

Ayo Akimolere (13:14)

Okay, I don't know if this is the right thing to say, but I'm going to say it anyway. Do many of us need to eat some humble pie when it comes to Victor Jocheris at Arsenal? I would say that as a commentator of the game, perhaps I do. 21 goals so far this season for Arsenal in all competitions. And it's his debut season. Stu James wrote in his piece on the Athletic and he basically said, forget the modern trend of strikers rarely straying beyond the width of the penalty area. Gilkeris spent the evening running the channels, dragging the Athletic co defenders out of position, bullying them with his physicality and generally making a nuisance of himself. Add to that the penalty he scored in the previous leg. Add to that his performance at Fulham. Add to that a beautiful cross in this leg of the two leg of the semi final.

James Horncastle (14:00)

We expect too much too soon from players these days and maybe it's because price tags are higher. So players are expected to deliver from day one. I think there's also like a Haaland precedent there where Haaland comes into our league and just like rips up goal scoring records and everyone thinks the competition needs someone who can rival Haaland. You look at the other strikers who joined the league this year, you know, a lot of them have struggled, you know, either for goals or because of injuries or whatnot. You mentioned Gyokerez, his goal record, I mean, 21 goals in his first season across all competitions. I mean, that's a lot of goals for a flop.

Ayo Akimolere (14:46)

Yeah, it's true. I think it's the style of the goals that maybe people question.

James Horncastle (14:51)

Yeah, it's this style. And like, look, even last night he has the chance to kill the game. You know, Hincapia comes on cross across the box, he's all alone and he puts it over the bar. But Stu said in his piece he did a lot of things to help the team get up the pitch. People say the ball doesn't stick to him. And there were moments last night where it didn't stick to him, but there were more moments when it did. And you know, again, what I would say is people always make this case sort of against him. Well, he's a flat track bully. He can only do it against teams in the bottom half the table. You know, sort of the equivalent that he would come up against in, in Portugal Deluxe. If you like? Well, you know, I have news for you. There are only a very small number of big games in a League season. The rest against the teams that Gyokeres scores against. And there are more points available against those teams than there are in the big games. So if he's scoring in those, he is contributing to Arsenal potentially winning the League also. You know, Art will know this better than me, but if you look at some of the games in which he scored in Carabao cup semi final against Chelsea, okay, fourth tier competition if you like, for Arsenal, but still contributed to them getting to a final, scored in the North London Derby, scored away in Madrid in a Champions League semi final. I mean, are those not big games that fans care about that can take you to winning trophies? So I think under that umbrella, I think Arsenal fans, not only Arsenal fans, but should give the guy a break in his first year because he's also had to deal with all of the pressure and expectation that comes with years and years of people saying, gosh, need a striker, don't they? It's not just adding another striker. It's like the guy who Arsenal signed to fill that role has to do that job. And I think he's dealt with it okay, you know, considering that Kai Havertz was out for a lot of the early part of the season and he's sort of thrust in at the deep end with all of that pressure and expectation, as I say. So, yeah, I do think we have to eat humble pie about him. Just like give him a break and give more players in their first year in the League a break. Because as we keep telling everyone, it's the hardest league to play in the world.

Guest Analyst (17:23)

For me it's about balance. So I obviously people know, maybe Arsenal fans who are watching or listening. I wrote something when Havertz got injured against Newcastle and I didn't feel at that time that Jocherz would be the guy for Arsenal to start the next few games and really make a difference. Because in that game and in the games before that, he wasn't really offering much. As you said, the ball wasn't sticking to him. He wasn't really making Arsenal a better team when he was on the pitch. So for me I was looking at and saying if Arsenal play must win games, they need someone who is going to offer more than just goals. And I think what the past 10 days or so has shown is a real improvement on his side because I'd say last night was his best performance in an Arsenal shirt and he didn't score And I think that's what, I guess a lot of fans and people just watching need to take into account. It's not just about, okay, he scored 21 goals. It's more about how are you impacting the team and the players around you. I think from just a form perspective and looking at last night, looking at the goal he scored against Fulham, the first one, what was really encouraging was he was making runs and movements that he wasn't earlier in the season. And there's a reason why maybe people were on his back is because they could see maybe things he was doing in Portugal that he wasn't doing yet in North London. So the goal he scores, he makes that dart into the six yard box because Saka's, you know, flashed it into that area. It's a tap in. But earlier in the season, he wasn't making that dart. So I think him finally, I could. I don't know, I don't know what would have changed in the last, you know, week or so, but whether it's a mental thing or just, you know, conversations with players, him finally making those movements and, you know, being imposing with the ball when he has it, I think is a really major, you know, benefit for not just him, but the Arsenal team in general. That I guess people need to respect. I need to respect, but I don't think that illegitimizes the opinions people would have had beforehand when he wasn't doing those things. I think we all need to, you know, still realize that there are two sides to this. And I would say it's really good that he is proving people wrong, me included. And hopefully he's able to do that for the rest of the season as well.

James Horncastle (19:52)

Can I just mention the person who signed him, Don Berta, because it was a big night for Don Berta yesterday as well. Big tie, because obviously he came from, from Atletico Madrid and we talked about the atmosphere at the end. I mean, he's, he's a big part in even further adding a catalyst onto that atmosphere by mysteriously showing up.

Ayo Akimolere (20:17)

Could you see us?

James Horncastle (20:19)

Simeone, right? This is a big story back in Spain, you know, so if he's on the sideline, sort of telling the referee to blow his final whistle, Simeone sees him, goes over to him, pushes him back, says, you have to show some respect. And I think it's moments like that where, you know, I mean, I don't think fans need to think he's one of ours, you know, because all fans care about is like, are the players he signs Good. But I did think it showed how everyone at the club at Arsenal were bought into that moment. Even a guy who's been at Atletico Madrid for the last decade and you would think would have some maybe emotional conflict in that tie, instead is down the sidelines annoying his former coach because he wants Arsenal to get over the line. And so I think it just goes to show, I think that Arsenal seem to really have come as one from top to bottom when they needed to most in that game.

Podcast Host (21:22)

This is the Athletic FC Podcast with Ayo Akimolere this episode of the Athletic FC Podcast is sponsored by BetterHelp. May is mental Health Awareness Month and it's a reminder that whatever you're going through, you don't have to go through it alone. Because life is a journey. Some days you feel good, but others you can feel overwhelmed. Whatever's keeping you up at night, it's easy to feel like you have to figure it out all on your own. But the truth is, no one has all the answers and no journey should be made by yourself. Having someone with you to listen, to understand and to support you can make all the difference. So this May, why not check in with yourself and understand where you are right now and that if you're feeling stuck, anxious or unsure, it's okay to not be okay. BetterHelp is one of the world's largest online therapy providers, serving over 6 million people globally. Just fill in a short questionnaire and they'll pair you up with a therapist based on your preferences, needs and goals. And if you aren't happy with your match, you can switch to a different therapist at any time. Safe in the knowledge that BetterHelp therapists work according to a strict code of conduct and are fully licensed in the us. You don't have to be on this journey alone, find support and have someone with you in therapy. Sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com fcpodcast that's better. H E L p.com fcpodcast. This is an advert for Mint Mobile. Now if you're anything like me, you'll like keeping your money right where you can see it. Unfortunately, traditional big wireless carriers also seem to like keeping your money. So if you're overpaying for wireless and fed up with sky high wireless bills, bogus fees, and free perks that actually cost more in the long run, it's time you switched to Mint Mobile. Mint Mobile is here to rescue you with premium wireless plans starting at just 15 bucks a month. All plans come with high speed data and unlimited talking text delivered on the nation's largest 5G network. You can bring your own phone and number with you. Activate an ESIM in minutes and you'll start saving immediately. No long term contracts, no hassle. What's not to love? I switched at the start of the year and I'm saving money every month and I can spend that on my kids and I get really fantastic all round wireless service on top. So if you like your money, Mint Mobile is for you. Shop plans@mintmobile.com athleticfc that's mintmobile.com athleticfc upfront payment of $45 for a 3 month 5GB plan required it equivalent to 15 per month new customer offer for first 3 months only then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details. Lately I've been more intentional about what I wear day to day. Leaning into pieces that feel easy, comfortable and still put together just makes getting dressed simpler. And Quint has been my go to. The fabrics feel elevated, the fits are clean and everything just works without needing to overthink it. Quince has all the wardrobe staples for spring. Think 100% European linen shorts and shirts from $34. Lightweight, breathable and comfortable but still look put together and clean. 100% Pima cotton tees with a softness that has to be felt. Their pants also hit that same balance. Relaxed and comfortable but still polished enough to wear pretty much anytime. And everything is priced 50 to 80% less than you'd find at similar brands right now. I am loving The Comfort Stretch Traveler 5 Pocket Pant in Dark charcoal. It's laid back and refined and good for the working day and the post work cocktail. And at just £49.90 and available in 10 different colors, I might just treat myself to another pair because I'm worth it. So refresh your everyday with luxury. You'll actually use head to quince.com athleticfc for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com FC for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quint.com Athletic FC.

Ayo Akimolere (25:19)

While we're on Atleti, we need to talk about them. Firstly, ending the season trophyless. This would have been potentially their fourth ever Champions League final in their history. Probably the last one for Koke, a lieutenant of Simeone, but also one for Antoine Griezmann. You know in your match piece you it was almost like a farewell to Antoine Griezmann who I mean I Love him as a player, his World cup antics, but also just as a European player. You've. You've kind of seen him as a what you'd class as a. A Champions League icon. James.

James Horncastle (25:50)

Yeah, I think Atletifans and Neutrals saw romance in the idea of them reaching the final and, you know, writing that final chapter that they haven't been able to write so far in the Diego Simeone era. And having come so close to maybe do it, when I think some people thought, you know, it's over for Simeone. Will he get a team back to a final? It's definitely over for Griezmann because he's leaving in the summer for mls, I think it would have been. And it's strange to say this, because if we're using the kind of fairy tale analogy, they've always been the kind of villains or the kind of. The brutish, kind of ugly characters in all this. And instead, I think there was a lot of warmth towards both. Look, you have to give Simeone and Griezmann credit for that, for almost creating it, you know, before the quarterfinal against Barcelona, where Simeone, unprompted, basically pays tribute to Griegsman right next to him and wants everyone to sort of recognize what a great person he's been to Atletico, a great player, and also what a great friend he seems to have been to Simeone. He's one of those players I wrote in my column. He's just one of those players that if you could turn back time, you wish you'd paid a lot more attention to, you'd watched and appreciated him more. And it's only when you get this kind of. It's true, I think of, yeah, we've seen Liverpool, for example, announce that, yeah, this is Mo Salah's final season a month or six weeks ago. And, you know, it's. It's. I know Liverpool have got a lot of problems at the moment. They don't seem to enjoy going to watch their games much, because when you have that end point, you. You do go to a stadium wanting to savor every touch, every flick, every move that a player like Grisman makes, because I do think he's been one of the generation, the last generation, sort of entertainers and just a totally accomplished footballer. You think of all the things he's done, you know, playing in midfield for France sort of as well as playing as a striker. You know, he seems to be able to play every role in midfield and attack, and I will miss him. Not only because, yeah, he's been such a choice to watch, but I'd have loved him to be at the World cup this summer. And instead, you know, sort of, he's. He's retired from international duty. He's 35. He has won.

Podcast Host (28:35)

He's done a lot.

Ayo Akimolere (28:36)

He's won a lot, James. So.

James Horncastle (28:38)

But yeah, I would just love to have had an extra game or an extra game to watch him in the Champions League and some more games at the World cup in which to save him as well.

Ayo Akimolere (28:48)

There was a documentary on him years ago and it was talking about how hard he found it, breaking through because he was so small and the disappointments. But also, I think something that's always conveyed with Antoine Griezmann is his joy of playing football. He always plays with a smile on his face, his little celebration that he does. I absolutely love it. Anyway, let's carry on, let's move on because Arsenal are four matches now from making history, Art. They haven't won the league since 2004. They haven't.

James Horncastle (29:12)

Have they not?

Ayo Akimolere (29:14)

You never heard that they've never won the Champions League, one trophy or two trophies this season. What you think

James Horncastle (29:22)

or not?

Guest Analyst (29:25)

You can't be greedy. You can't be greedy. You'll take one. You'll take one. Yeah. Looking at the two, I think at the minute, obviously after Manchester City, Everton, the Premier League looks more likely with the Champions League. I think with that, it's just about enjoying the moment and being really present in what an opportunity is. Obviously, we don't know at the minute whether it'll be PSG or Bayern. I think, personally, I feel like if I was in Mikel Arteta's shoes, I'd rather play Bayern. And the reason for that is when you look at psg, their attack in depth is a lot deeper, I feel. But also they're so intense when they're defending. Similar to Arsenal in a way where their forwards will really make a really big effort to unsettle the opposition defenders as well. So, yeah, I think for me, if it was the Champions League final, I'd maybe rather play Bayern. But if you are asking me how many, I'll say one. And I won't be greedy with it.

Podcast Host (30:29)

I'm just joking.

Ayo Akimolere (30:31)

Who knows how the season is going to end up? James, you know, let's look at the. The other tie. Paris are a slender one goal lead against Bayern Munich and we slender after

James Horncastle (30:41)

nine goals

Ayo Akimolere (30:45)

based on what we saw. Look, we put a poll up on YouTube and 64 of the audience think Bayern Munich will go through tonight. Do you agree?

James Horncastle (30:53)

Honestly, I think this is really difficult to call IO and I'm not sitting on the fence saying that I haven't seen PSG in the flesh this season. I have seen Bayern in the flesh this season. They were the best team I've seen. They were better than Arsenal, from what I saw, because I think these two teams have the best front threes in world football. And, you know, I think it's going to be really difficult to assign the Ballon d' or later this year because you can make cases. I think you can maybe make more cases for Bayern's players, particularly Harry Kane and Michael Lise, than you can at this moment for, you know, Usman Dembele, Kavisha Kavadaskele, no matter how good Kavanatskalia was a week ago, but also against Chelsea. What I think is a week ago we saw arguably the best game in the last 10 or 15 years, but I think we need to see a repeat of that for it to be on the level with last year's semi final, which was declared on the basis that it was carried over 180 minutes, the best semi final we've ever seen in the Champions League. So I hope we get another five, four. You know, I'm really curious to see whoever reaches the final, you know, how Arsenal's balance and control, which has led them to be consistently over three years competitive in the Champions League. I don't think it's any surprise, even from where they came from, that this team has gone quarter final, semifinal final, and it's. It's a way that gets you far in the Champions League. But I'm curious to see how that methodology matches up against guys who love Nothing more than 1v1 situations. Taking, taking players on, you know, how aside from the Fulham game, more or less, every Arsenal game has felt like it's. It's on the edge. These teams don't. These teams go over the edge. They're happy to go over the edge. And so I, yeah, I think it will make for quite a contrast in styles, but, yeah, I can't. I honestly can't call it. I can't.

Ayo Akimolere (33:05)

It's a tough one to call. Just before we move on, I want to talk very quickly about how hard it is to win those two trophies, Premier League and Champions League, in a season. Art seems to think Arsenal are taking one, but, you know, I think only Manchester United and maybe Manchester City have done it in the Premier League. Can you just put into context how hard it is to operate on those two fronts? Winning Your, you know, domestic league but also winning the greatest prize in Europe at the same time.

James Horncastle (33:30)

Yeah, I think even though we've seen more trebles, for example, over the last 10 or 15 years, it is still the pinnacle. I think it's still harder for teams to do than people give credit for. And by which I mean the teams that do it on the continent, you know, when Bayern do it or when PSG do it, the default setting of your casual fan is, well, of course it's easier for them because they can rest and rotate players in their domestic championships. They still have to do the running, they still have to, they still have to deliver and that's not necessarily easy. But certainly for, for the Premier League teams, there is the extra competition, the carabao and there is the bump and grind of, of playing the Premier League. So, you know, I saw it in 2023 in Istanbul when City played against Inter and it was that kind of last Hillary Steps was scaling hill, scaling Everest and you could see that they were so close to history that it was sort of almost it was burdening them. And then also just they played 60, more than 60 games. And yeah, they, they ultimately found a way, but it's is very hard. It's the ultimate. I think what I think if Arsenal win either one of these trophies this season, you know, it will be massive for them. The fans will be thrilled with either one of them, I think because if they win the Premier League, Arsenal, I think consider themselves to be one of the, well, not just the Premier League, but English football. One of English football's greatest ever teams in terms of their standing in English football with Man United and Liverpool. So it is an awful long time that they've gone without winning the Premier League. So winning that would be huge for generations of fans that didn't see the Invincibles or you know, Wenger's great teams equally. If they don't win the Premier League, but they win the Champions League, you know, they can do what. You know, I remember when AC Milan won the Champions League in 2007 and into their rivals won the League, there's a banner on the open top bus saying you can shove your league title up your ass. We're European Champions. And like that's. That is exactly something that, that Arsenal could do if they weren't to win equally. They could win both equally.

Guest Analyst (35:54)

They could win none.

James Horncastle (35:55)

They could win none. But I, I do think the mood shift at Arsenal over the last four days is important because I think we seem to have stewed for six, eight weeks of like, oh my God. You know, I always remember, you know, Declan Rice's face at the end of the Man City.

Ayo Akimolere (36:12)

Oh, you remember.

Podcast Host (36:13)

Yeah.

Ayo Akimolere (36:13)

And that's been brought up several times actually.

James Horncastle (36:15)

Yeah. Because yeah, initially he looked like he was kind of seeing ghosts. And then you saw him saying, this is not done. This is not done. And credit to them, they've shown it's not done. Yeah, they can still. They can still make history.

Podcast Host (36:35)

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Podcast Host (40:00)

You're listening to the Athletic FC podcast with Ayo Akamolere.

Ayo Akimolere (40:05)

Something I'd love to get both your opinions on is that you know our colleague James McNicholas has made the argument on the Athletic that Mikel Arteta deserves a new Arsenal contract regardless of how this season finishes. His current deal runs out in 2027. I wonder how difficult this one is to answer because if Arsenal leave this season yet again trophyless, firstly, I wonder how much energy Arteta has got to keep going and secondly, I wonder how much of a buy in the players will have if once again they are the bridesmaids and not the bride.

Guest Analyst (40:39)

Yeah, I think when you're looking at how each year has gone this year and again to come to the last four days is really important in how I guess everyone views it when we're looking at the contract situation. For me it's almost something that has to come from Arteta more than the club because I feel like whatever happens, Arsenal will back him. They've showed that for the past seven years. When there's been tricky situations. They will back him. So I think it does come to what Mikel Arteta wants in his own heart, and I think that will be to carry on from a player perspective. I do feel like when you have a night like you had last night, that probably reignites the flame a little bit to really not just believe in him, but believe in yourself. Because at the end of the day, I think it is obviously a major part about what Arsenal can do is down to the manager, but they will also look at themselves and see what they're doing wrong or mistakes they've made in previous years. So I don't think it'd be one where players would almost, you know, point fingers and just blame it. Blame it at the manager, which can happen maybe at other clubs. So, yeah, for me, I think James is probably right in what he's written, but it would be a decision that really has to come from Arteta. He has to really own it.

James Horncastle (41:58)

I think most coaches who've been in this kind of job for as long as he has now, they have gray hair. Yeah. Not. Not Mikel.

Guest Analyst (42:10)

Yeah.

James Horncastle (42:12)

I will know better than me because I don't follow Arsenal every day, but, like, I don't know what his emotional state is, you know, after all this time being at Arsenal, you know, would winning something be fulfillment? I mean, obviously it would be fulfillment in terms of, like, I have restored this club to where the fans think it deserves to be. Do you then walk away at that moment? Do you think we can continue to build? We can go again and equally like, you know, if you do it, end up empty handed? Do you look back on this season and still see progress? We've gone that extra step in the Champions League? Or do you think I've taken this team as far as I have? Yeah. Those are the only questions he has the answer to. So, yeah, we will have to. We will have to see. It's an emotional business.

Guest Analyst (43:02)

I do think the progress in the Champions League is probably a really big, I guess, indicator because they have made progress year on year on year. Whereas obviously in the Premier League, it doesn't seem like that because they finished second three times in a row. When you can see, I guess, the tangible progress of a quarter final. Then last season, I think his big thing was becoming more consistent home in a way, because in the first season they were back, they blew teams away at home, but they really struggled away. And then this season there's just been complete dominance. So I think when you're looking at it from that lens, he would definitely see, okay, this team can still go somewhere else because they've shown him that they've been able to do that in Europe. And a big thing whenever people have brought up, let's say, the style of play in the Premier League and how it's been quite boring and stuff like that, his almost his default go to response that is people all around Europe tell him the complete opposite, that they love the way Arsenal play and stuff like that. So I do feel like how Arsenal conduct themselves in Europe under him does really, you know, play a big part for him and how he sees what he's doing because he's spoken as well about how quickly the Premier League evolved in the last two years, last two, three years, from their first title race in the 2020, 23 season to then everything becoming man marking and just restricting space and not allowing Arsenal to play football. And that's why I think how, I guess dominant they've been able to be in Europe and still being able to play some good stuff really does hold a real big importance for him going forward and how he views himself and the team.

Ayo Akimolere (44:53)

Yeah, well, Arsenal still unbeaten in the Champions League. Let's see if they end the season with two trophies, one trophy or none. All right, cheers, gents. Appreciate your time, James, and also thank you guys for joining us too. We'll catch you soon.

Podcast Host (45:07)

You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroo and Jay Beal, with editing by Paul Iliff and Nick Thompson. The executive producer is A.D. moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free, including our dedicated club shows. Search for the Athletic wherever you get your podcast. You'll also find us on YouTube at the Athletic FC Podcast, so make sure you subscribe. The Athletic FC Podcast is an athletic media company production.

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