Are Newcastle's Saudi owners losing interest?

Summary

The Athletic FC Podcast – Detailed Episode Summary

Episode Title: Are Newcastle's Saudi Owners Losing Interest?
Host: Ayo Akimwolere
Guests: Chris Waugh (Newcastle United correspondent), Matt Slater (Business of Football writer), Rob Harris (Football journalist)
Date: April 30, 2026
Duration (main content): 00:48:00

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Episode Overview

This episode examines the growing uncertainty surrounding Newcastle United's Saudi Arabian owners (PIF) and their ongoing commitment to the football club. Against the backdrop of PIF's reported withdrawal from other major sports investments—most notably LIV Golf—the hosts and guests discuss shifting Saudi priorities, the implications for Newcastle's on-pitch performance and finances, and how the club is positioned within both the Saudi Vision 2030 strategy and the competitive landscape of English football. The episode dives deep into management decisions, transfer strategies, fan expectations, and the potential for significant player turnover.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. State of Newcastle United and Timing of Owner Visits

• Context: Newcastle are 14th in the Premier League (16 points off 5th), on a losing streak, and the owners are in town.
  Chris Waugh [02:23]:
  • Annual "off-site" ownership meetings are not unusual, but this year’s comes at a crisis point for manager Eddie Howe and the team’s form (9 losses in last 12).
  • “It is good for Howe that he has the chance to sit in front of the ownership and explain that, but not great ... because this is very much the toughest time of his Newcastle United tenure so far.”

2. Are the Saudi Owners Losing Interest (LIV Golf Parallel, Vision 2030)?

• PIF’s Sports Investment Shift
  Matt Slater & Rob Harris [03:32-07:17]:

  • PIF invested heavily in LIV Golf, aiming to disrupt the global golf landscape, spending $5B+ mostly on players—but are now reportedly pulling funding.
  • Saudi Arabia is reassessing its massive outward bets on sports/entertainment, refocusing on domestic initiatives under Vision 2030: “...the big strategic plan the Crown Prince MBS has to develop Saudi Arabia to move away from oil and gas.” [Rob Harris, 05:00]
  • Vision 2030 ties sports investment to economic diversification, tourism, and youth engagement, not just ‘sportswashing’—a narrative that can miss internal Saudi pressures.

• Where Does Newcastle Fit?
  Chris Waugh [07:24]:

  • Newcastle is classified within PIF’s “strategic pot”—not financially huge but symbolically important (Premier League global reach).
  • Current assurances are that PIF remain committed to Newcastle. However, “decisions can just happen and these things could change and move forward... it’s a very difficult organization to get to the very heart...”
  • A sale is possible but only at a premium (bought for £300M, now valued £800M+)—unlikely to be offloaded cheaply or hastily.

3. Newcastle vs Other Saudi-Owned Sports & Football’s Unique Spot

• Other Sports Investments
  Rob Harris [09:56]:

  • PIF is stepping back from boxing, snooker, women’s tennis, while the Saudi Pro League continues but hasn't moved the international needle.
  • Premier League and football remain unique due to deeper roots and greater popular appeal, particularly within Saudi society: “People care about football. The issue is, does PIF... care about football in Newcastle or just Saudi football?”

• Why the Newcastle Investment Still Makes Sense
  Rob Harris [09:56-13:45]:

  • Football—and Newcastle—is arguably a sounder, more stable investment than the “built-from-scratch” sports projects.
  • Newcastle was “bought low,” is “famously a one-club city,” with fanbase and infrastructure. The PIF has invested near £500M, mostly on players; doubled revenues; reached Champions League twice and won a trophy—so not stagnating, but not “the next Man City” either.
  • “It just maybe isn't as much as many people expected.” [Rob Harris, 14:12]

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4. Financial Constraints and Management Challenges

• Move from Heavy Investment to Financial Restraints
  Chris Waugh [18:30]:

  • Early post-takeover windows saw big spending, but FFP (PSR) headroom faded—Newcastle had to sell unexpectedly (e.g., Isak, Anderson), which marred their squad-building.
  • Recent signings haven’t all paid off. A disastrous window, overpaying for less effective signings, and older squad members underperforming have compounded issues.
  • Infrastructure promises (new stadium/training ground) remain unfulfilled—hurting both player recruitment and fan optimism.
  • “The business they didn't do last summer was almost as damaging as the business they did do.”

• On PSR/FFP and Commercial Strategy
  Rob Harris [22:01]:

  • Newcastle was supposed to have FFP headroom, thanks to previous frugality, but didn't sell assets well enough and didn’t capitalize aggressively on commercial deals, particularly related-party sponsorships.
  • “Where has been the pushing as hard as you can commercially? ...they didn't take on the Premier League on associated party transactions... I think money's been left on the table.”

• Infrastructure Critique
  Rob Harris [24:26]:

  • Upgrades have been modest: “This is not like sovereign wealth fund type behavior.”
  • CEO David Hopkinson acknowledges the club needs to “help themselves.” Until Newcastle exploits all commercial avenues (sponsorships, partnerships), they can't fully blame external rules for their stalling.

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5. Summer Transfer Window: Player Exodus and Strategy

• Players Likely To Leave
  Chris Waugh [30:35]:

  • Anticipates “big players will leave this summer possibly in the multiple... significant ins and outs volume-wise, double figures easily combined.”
  • Anthony Gordon seems likeliest to go; Tonali and others (Livermento/Gimraj) are less certain but under discussion.
    “They want to change the perception... that it’s always a negative when Newcastle sells a crown jewel... sometimes you have to sell your best players.”

• Leicester Comparison
  Rob Harris [33:23]:

  • Cautions that refusing to sell a key player every summer, as Leicester did, can backfire.
  • Newcastle’s wage bill remains controlled, but until revenues rise, they can’t pay competitive wages—so star players may always want to move on.

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6. Fan Sentiment & The Eddie Howe Dilemma

• Poll Results on “Biggest Loss”
  [35:57]:

  • 62% of fans polled chose Sandro Tonali as the biggest potential loss, followed by Eddie Howe, then Anthony Gordon.
  • Discussion reflects fan ambivalence: Some see Howe as the architect of progress; others think he’s plateaued (“Does he have the energy to do that? Does he have the tactical ideas... Or do they need a new voice?”).

• Recent Atmosphere
  Chris Waugh [36:14]:

  • The unity post-takeover is fading—there are now “increasing question marks about does [Howe] have the ideas and the energy... or has this reached a natural conclusion.”
  • Describes the atmosphere at St. James’s Park as on the verge of turning, especially when results go poorly.

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7. Missed Transfer Opportunities (Isak, Whissa, Voldemort)

• Last Summer’s Transfer Failures
  Chris Waugh [40:37]:

  • The delayed sale of Isak triggered a scramble for replacements. Deals for preferred targets (e.g., Jorgen Strand Larsen) fell through, leading to expensive, less effective signings like Whissa and Valdemar.
  • “Both the players are basically byproducts of the mess of last summer... It was just, it felt wrong from the start.”

• Resulting On-field Struggles
  Chris Waugh [42:45]:

  • Newcastle’s struggles are “as basic as it is: they can’t put the ball in the back of the net at one end and they’ve made far too many errors at the other.”

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• On PIF’s Reassessment:

  “We’re going to stop investing so much outside, we’re going to invest more internally. Because the Saudi economy... hasn’t really worked. So it’s a reassessment of the Saudi project in almost every way.”
  — Rob Harris, [06:30]

• On Newcastle’s Status For PIF:

  “The idea is Newcastle is separate, they’re different... You would have thought they’re not just going to allow someone to just take it off their hands for very little money.”
  — Chris Waugh, [08:10]

• On Missed Commercial Growth:

  “I don’t think the Premier League would have had a leg to stand on... There’s definitely a feeling in the industry that money’s been left on the table there.”
  — Rob Harris, [23:32]

• On Newcastle’s Internal View:

  “Until they maximize all of those avenues, only then can you maybe turn around and say, ‘it’s the rules that are stopping us.’”
  — Chris Waugh, [25:13]

• On Selling Stars:

  “They want to change the perception that it’s always a negative when Newcastle sells a crown jewel... sometimes you have to sell your best players because you can make a substantial profit on them and because it’s maybe better for all parties.”
  — Chris Waugh, [31:30]

• On Howe’s Tenure:

  “I do wonder... if Newcastle United were going to be this insurgent, shake-things-up club... Would it be Eddie Howe they chose?”
  — Rob Harris, [39:12]

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Key Timestamps

• 02:23 — Discussion opens on the timing and purpose of PIF’s owner visit, annual review traditions.
• 03:53 — The LIV Golf pullout and parallels to Newcastle, broader Saudi investment shift.
• 07:24 — Newcastle’s position in PIF’s portfolio, discussion on potential sale.
• 09:56 — Football’s unique place among Saudi investments, Newcastle as a buy-low, fan-rich asset.
• 18:30 — Newcastle’s finances: PSR constraints, failed summer window, recruitment mishaps.
• 22:01 — Critique of Newcastle’s conservative commercial approach.
• 24:43 — Infrastructure gaps and commentary on commercial and strategic “under-achievement.”
• 30:35 — Summer transfer window: who stays, who goes, the logic behind expected player sales.
• 35:57 — Fan poll about the “biggest loss;” split opinions on Eddie Howe and player departures.
• 40:37 — Dissection of failed transfer strategy and its impact on-field.

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Summary

The episode finds Newcastle at a crossroads—on and off the pitch. PIF’s shifting priorities (less outward sports investment, more domestic focus due to Vision 2030 amid economic realities) cast a shadow of uncertainty, but the club is not in imminent danger of abandonment. Instead, Newcastle faces a period of transition: tough financial restrictions, leadership questions around Eddie Howe, missed commercial opportunities, and the likelihood of major squad refresh via player sales. Football remains uniquely valued both in Saudi Arabia and to the PIF’s global ambitions, but the club’s next phase will depend more than ever on smart, self-driven growth and the ability to sustain progress against rising expectations and tougher financial rules.

Transcript

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[Chris Waugh]

Well, probably not from Eddie Howe's point of view. That's it sort of stage. If you're going to be if, if you just take those statistics and look at Newcastle's travail so far in 2026. Certainly in the Premier League they just seem to be regressing and continuing to to regress. It's nine defeats in the last 12 in the league but this meeting should not be conflated some ideas if it's some something that's just pulled together all about Eddie Howe's future. That's that's not the case. Newcastle do do these annual offsighting as they refer to them every year they've done them and Matthew and Hall as this one is in Northumberland previously they've done it at Anna Castle. That was on the Amazon prime documentary in 2023. But Eddie Howe's future will be one of the points of discussion because he is usually there usually presents they present on a what he thinks has gone wrong this season, why he thinks it's gone wrong, why he thinks he's the right man to change things and how he believes that things can progress moving forward with him still at the helm certainly when it comes to transfers and the like going in this summer. So it is good for how that he has the chance to sit in front of the ownership and explain that but not great in terms of you just look at the actual statistics and what he can point to in that regard because this is very much the toughest time of his Newcastle United tenure so far.

[Matt Slater]

Yeah, people forget this is the kind of stuff managers have to do as well as actually trying to coach their teams. Matt but you know, this is an annual meeting. But I think what's fascinating about this, and I said it at the top is is the timing of this, especially with Piff so set to pull out of their other sporting project, Liv Golf as well. Could this have an impact on what they do with Newcastle?

[Rob Harris]

This is the big topic of conversation for the last few weeks, isn't it? I mean we're recording this Thursday lunchtime and I think we could get confirmation anytime now of something that we have been reporting. We and other outlets have been reporting for a few weeks and that is that the Saudi sovereign wealth fund PIF is out in terms of golf. They massively invested in that project around the same time that they bought Newcastle. It was 2021 huge play really trying to disrupt almost buy a global sport, set up this rival league take on the PGA. They've spent $5 billion on it. I mean huge, huge investment, nearly all of that on players. So there are kind of very clear football analogies there and it hasn't worked. I think it'll be studied by business schools for years to come as a kind of wonderful example of disruption, stroke hubris. But we're not going to talk about golf at the same time or similar timescale. We've seen lots of signs over the last couple of years that Saudi Arabia is starting to reconsider the huge external bets they were placing on sport entertainment. Just some straightforward investments in overseas companies. And this is all tied to Vision 2030. So this is the big strategic plan that the Crown Prince MBS has to develop Saudi Arabia to move away from oil and gas. It's a big country, Saudi Arabia, it's very young country, it has been a one trick pony for most of its history and it has to diversify its economy. So we've again, these are things we've discussed in the past. People often talk about sports washing, which is fine. Everyone have their own opinions on sports washing. I always think that we are underestimating if we only focus on sports washing and there are clear issues around Saudi Arabia, human rights, etc. Etc. But if we only concentrate on that, we do, I think ignore the real internal issues that anyone who is running Saudi Arabia has to grapple with. And that is you must have us for your economy, you must find work for your people. So Vision 2030 is all about that. The sports stuff has been wrapped up in that definitely has. It's been about growing tourism, it's about attracting people, encouraging people to stay in Saudi Arabia, making Saudi Arabia just more attractive to external investment. Where does Newcastle sit in that? Well, that. That is the great imponderable. It's always been a bit unclear. Is it just another kind of flag out there, another investment, strategic investment? Is it sports washing? Is it a learning exercise? What's to sort of going to grow their own football league? Is it a little bit of all of that? What we do know is they are making a strategic shift. We're going to stop investing so much outside, we're going to invest more internally. I think because the Saudi economy, even coming into the Iran war, there's been issues. Some of the projects that they've had around, these huge GIGA projects to build cities in the desert to massively increase the size of everything, haven't really worked or they are. They're massively, you know, over budget. So it's a reassessment of the Saudi project in almost every way. So where did Newcastle this rel. This small, small investment for them in terms of priority but also terms in sort of financial amount. Where does it sit in this big complicated picture?

[Matt Slater]

Any words from them, Chris, from where you're sitting as to where Newcastle sits in their sort of list of investment portfolio?

[Chris Waugh]

Well, in this sort of restructuring or vision that they've got moving forward, Newcastle fit into strategic is the part that there's three different parts they. They describe as Newcastle being in the strategic pot and that basically yes it's monetary value wise one of the lower investments. Newcastle aren't as worth anywhere near as much as many of the companies are. They argue that they have an overinflated importance relative to to that profile wise being in the Premier League and the like. And all the assurances subsequently after all of the speculation about live over the course of last week was that the assurances are that they are still intending to keep Newcastle. That they still see growth for the investment and that people at Newcastle say the same and that they believe what they're being told. Now all of that has to be taken with a pinch of salt because decisions can just happen and these things could change and move forward. And this is not actually coming directly from officials at pif. You have to speak to people in around PF because very difficult to get to. It's a very difficult organization to get to the very heart certainly the decision makers at the top. But the idea is the only castle separate. They're different. They will continue as they are. And I also think the slight difference between the castle is rather than live he can pull out just financing it. I think when you castle they would probably want to see a return on some of the money they've got. So it may be that they decide to sell at some stage. But you would have thought they're not just going to allow someone to just take it off their hands for. For. For very little money that they spend more than 300 million buying the club. It's more than 800 million now all in. So you'd expect that want something like that before they were to move out. And they still see that potentially growing in value over the course of the next few years. And then I'm getting even greater return on their money. But yeah, for Newcastle fans I think for them what they want to see is there's been progress on the pitch up until this season but off it they would like to see a lot more development. And that's when they'll really start to believe that. That the platitude you get from those in and around PIF that they are committed actually are. That will give them affirmation of that. I suppose.

[Matt Slater]

Yeah Matt. I mean none of us are billionaires and none of us have a wealth fund that stems as far off as you know the Saudi Arabian one. But I do look at other sports they're sort of stepping away from and we've spoken about this before perhaps boxing. Saudi pro league is also in contention. Snooker, you talked about the women's tennis. But football, especially the Premier League is fascinating for me because all the other things we've spoken about, I guess they've had to sort of create from the ground up in many respects. Whereas they're buying into Newcastle and the Premier League which is already pre existing and it's a. An echo chamber of its own. You know, is it easy just to say actually we just stick with Newcastle and see how much money we can put into that and forget all the other ones because they require so much more because we're starting them from the ground up.

[Rob Harris]

Yeah, look, maybe I think there are a few ways to think about this. I mean, LIV golf is just the most remarkable story on its own. You know, this attempt to shift shake up a pretty well established global sport that is particularly strong in the States. That's the home of golf. It's where the most. That's where the most golfers are. It's where the most tournaments are. It's where the most money is broadcast money, ticketing money, et cetera, et cetera. And to sort of aggressively go after that sport. And just to sort of put in context the LIV investment versus the Newcastle United investment. For example, PIF have invested as much in John rahm and Bryson DeChambeau as they have in Newcastle United. And one of the reasons the LIV situation has come to a head there, there are several, is that Bryson DeChambeau, particularly him, his contract's up for renewal. They just lost a couple of golfers in Brooks Cupca and Patrick Reed. The loss is just a staggering sort of on an annual basis. DeChambeau has so much leverage over them he'd almost want half a billion to stay. So that decision, it gets crystallized pretty fast. What are we doing? Newcastle is different. Different for a lot of reasons. One, Saudi Arabians care about football. They love football. I've been to a golf tournament in Saudi Arabia. There was no one there. Apart from expats wandering around, no Saudis were there. Two, they got Newcastle United for a great price from just a purely investment. If it was just. If it was like the sovereign wealth fund buying stocks and shares, they bought low, you know, Mike Ashley was fed up, he was tired. Maybe he thought he was going to have a wonderful, beautiful relationship with PIF going forward, I don't know. But he sold for a pretty good price for the buyer. £305 million. And he sold Newcastle. Yes, they weren't doing very well on the pitch but they'd been running. They'd been washing his own face for years. You know. He hadn't put money in since about the first year of his ownership. So unlike so many clubs, football clubs that are sold, it wasn't distressed asset. I mean it was distressing people. But the actual club itself was ticking over. And there was loads of like kind of obvious upside. You know, a little bit of love and attention could make this thing worth more pretty fast. So it was a very good investment. You know. Newcastle's famously a one club. City, big fan base. They're in there in the Premier League. They just had lots going for it. So big difference from Liv. Okay. They're pulling away from snooker at the moment again, you know, a cheap sport. So just don't care about snooker. They've been hosting the WTA, the women's tour finals again. You know, part of this bigger project to kind of make Saudi Arabia tourism make it some more of attractive place. But it hasn't really moved the needle in Saudi Arabia. I don't know if any more people are playing tennis. I keep coming back to it. People care about football. The issue is does pif, the sovereign wealth fund, do the Saudi state care about football in Newcastle or care about football in Saudi Arabia? That's the issue for Newcastle right now. Where does Newcastle United sit in this portfolio? It's not a flashing light at all. I don't think it flashes much. I don't think PIF think that much about Newcastle, I'm afraid to say. Because it's been a pretty steady, pretty good investment. They're in no hurry to do anything. That would be my overriding assessment of the last. What is it now coming up for five years? Yeah, they've achieved plenty. Because Newcastle were so ready for some attention. And they put money in. They have put money in. It's best part of 500 million. Most of that on players. Nearly all of it on players. And there were three windows in a row of big hundred million pound net spends. So they've only had one summer. Summer 24 where they got into PSR issue. And it was the infamous summer where they had to sell Elliot Anderson. Apart from that it has been net spends. So their wage bill's gone up. Yeah. They've doubled the revenue. They've doubled the revenue. They've made the Champions League twice. They've won a trophy. First major trophy for 70 years. They've achieved plenty. Have they achieved as much as Newcastle United fans hoped in 21? As many of us sort of wondered, oh right. Is this the next man City? No, but expectation, Reality. They have achieved stuff. It just maybe isn't as much as many people expected.

[Ayo Akimolere]

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[Matt Slater]

Let's talk about the finances then shall we? Chris Sorry to bring it up again but you know, yes there has been Champions League qualifications and also a league cup win, but this season really hasn't gone to plan. Is there pressure on Eddie Howell?

[Chris Waugh]

Yeah, so as Matt says straight after the takeover the first few windows Newcastle do spend aggressively but because the revenue at that stage wasn't as high as it is now and still it's still dwarfed by by the bigger clubs with the financial restrictions that are there within football. Basically Newcastle then had to sell and didn't sell well so instead they had the really fraught end to June 2024 when basically everyone just about was for sale. Anthony Gordon Florida to Liverpool in the end. Elliot Anderson Jan Cooper Minto leave. But even since then for a few windows Newcastle were very restricted in what they could do. They didn't materially improve the first 11 they for for a good 5 windows. Because they were still restricted PSR wise because you had the lag of over 3 years. It was a 3 year ruling period. And the wage pressure Newcastle had as well because they were paying trying to pay higher wages but still couldn't really afford to do that. And then last summer they did have what at the minute has looked like a fairly disastrous window. Certainly not just beyond ESAC. Yes they got 125 million pounds. A British record transfer fee for ESAC. But they could have had 110, 115 million from four or five weeks before. Instead they didn't engage with Liverpool and basically torpedoed their own window in the process. They overspent on the players they did sign. Some of whom haven't worked out. And they're going to have a financial cost of that moving forward. So undoubtedly the financial restrictions that are there have affected Newcastle. They have an aging squad in so many ways. The business they didn't do last summer was almost as damaging as a business they did do. Because they've just had players who clearly in the course of the last few weeks and months haven't been able to deliver what they did previously. That they're aging or players are thinking about their own futures. Isak situation was damaging beyond just what it meant for Newcastle striker situation. You've had other players looking at it. And what Isac really symbolized was when Newcastle were able to sign the like of Sandro Tonali and Anthony Gordon early on was they were presented with this idea of we're going to have a new stadium. We're going to have a new training ground. We're going to be this club. We're going to be challenging for all these honors. And three years on. The infrastructure projects haven't yet materialized, haven't been announced yet. And Newcastle have had to sell their best player last summer. They it's unclear if and when they will actually challenge at the very top of the Premier League. And so it does feel at the moment like this entire project for want of a better term. Is it a critical juncture if Newcastle are going to kick on? It's almost like 2.0 of it. This is where Newcastle need to rebuild. They need aside which is going to progress and build. But it's probably going to be a younger side. They're going to have to. They can't afford to go out and spend on ready made players. They're going to be signing younger players, which means that it probably will be a bit more of a transitional year or two moving forward. And so it does feel like for Eddie Howe it's a difficult job to sort of turn that around from where they were before. He's built it once, he's going to have to build it again if he stays. And does he have the energy to do that? Does he have the tactical ideas to be able to mold a new side? Other players who are going to remain, do they still want to hear from him? Do they need a new voice? All of these questions are sort of hanging over Newcastle right now, particularly given the fact that their, their on field form is chronic. It's not just that they've lost the last couple of Games basically in 2026. So far they've regressed massively. But even during the first half of the season in the league they were picking up results but their performances were just not there to match it.

[Matt Slater]

I do think if you're an investor, Matt, you know, you've got these big ideas. I hope they did anyway. The fans have big ideas and then you're hit with these restrictions. So actually those ideas don't ever really see full fruition or at least they're curbed for, for the time being. Is that what we're seeing reflected on the field as well? That actually Newcastle haven't been able to go all guns blazing and catch up with all those other teams they want to be part of?

[Rob Harris]

I don't know. I know this is the narrative around the club, right. I, I, I totally understand that. And you know, Chris has talked about, you know, the signings they made, signings they haven't made. You know, I'm looking at the people they bought. They've bought young players, you know, livermen. So Hall, Fulton, they bought, they bought plenty of young players. Yeah, they bought some older players too. There's been a bit of a mix. It's been hard maybe to sort of discern an overriding strategy at times, but they've bought a range of players, a range of ages. Look, if we just address this idea that they've been massively hamstrung by PSR yet no doubt in 24 they were, they got themselves into a PSR bind. But I go back to one of the things that was supposed to be really attractive about Newcastle Back in 21, that was that they had PSR headroom that was, you know, it was sort of like another string in the bow. You know, why PAF would. It would. Would be interested in Newcastle as opposed to, you know, any of the other clubs that are almost permanently for sale. And that was the. You know, Ashley actually had been running a really tight ship. So, you know, you've got a bit of a run of it here and that's what they did. But they didn't sell that well. And yeah, PSR catches up with you in the end. Unless you are massively pushing on the revenue front all the time and that. That is on the pitch. So your prize money's good. European competitions, latter stages of European competitions really being aggressive on commercial. My problem with the narrative that PSR is the story, right? And that Newcastle have been massively held back. But where has been the. The pushing as hard as you can commercially? You know, they didn't take on the Premier League on associated party transactions. They very much played the kind of we'll be good citizens, we'll let Man City do that. But they could have been more aggressive. They absolutely could have. Yes, there's been, I don't know, it's about £50 million worth, maybe a bit less of Saudi related PIF related companies that have sponsored Newcastle. But they could have done more. They could have. I speak to lots of people in the game who think, oh, you know what, Newcastle have actually been pretty mellow on that front. We were expecting a lot more of that and I don't think the Premier League would have had a leg to stand on. Yeah, they might have trimmed some of it and pushed back on a tiny bit of it. But there was definitely. There's a feeling in the industry that money's been left on the table there. And I think the other thing that's really, really big is the infrastructure stuff. They've spent about 30 odd million. I think most of that is on tarting up the existing training ground, which was a bit of a dump, I'm told. Chris, you go there it was.

[Chris Waugh]

Yeah, it was.

[Rob Harris]

They've gone to sort of kind of like, you know, Premier League average and the other projects like the. The new site doing something really interesting at the stadium. The existing one or a new one? There's been lots of talk. Loads and loads of talk. They did the fan zone thing, didn't they? Around. Is it around Strawberry Place is what it's called.

[Chris Waugh]

Yeah. Sell us taxon.

[Rob Harris]

Yeah. Small stuff. This is. This is what. This is what EFL clubs do. This is what my team south of the United to. This is not like sovereign wealth fund type behavior. So I just feel for the narrative to. To Stack up for me. I would expect to see this for momentum, this, this chomping at the leash. We're being held back. Look what we're spending on the training ground. Look. Look what. Look at our stadium plans. Look at our commercial department. Look at, you know, the tours we're doing. It's all been a bit, you know, okay, I'm not seeing this. We're challenging the Red cartel or whatever it is, whatever. Choose your bogeyman. We're challenging them everywhere, aggressively, every day. I'm just not saying that just to

[Chris Waugh]

pick up on that. What's been interesting since David Hopkinson arrived as CEO in September, he's come up with this. Well, it's basically Yasser Ramain that the chairman, the governor of PF have previously said Newcastle, the idea is to be number one. He's given this sort of Vision 2030 piggybacking off Saudi Arabia's own Vision 2030 that Newcastle will be challenging by the end of the year of the decade. And so he's been asked regularly about the fact of oh well, are you being held back? Will the rules stop that? And his argument is we can't push back against that until we do the things that Matt says we haven't helped ourselves enough. So we haven't maximized commercial yet. They've got going to have their first ever training ground sponsor for next year. Knox have come in and Knox hydration. So that's. That's a commercial opportunity. He spoke just on Wednesday at an event in London talking about how many Castle haven't got a car partner, they haven't got a partnership with an insurance company and that all of these other areas they need to help themselves. They need to sell better to bring in money in that regard. And so until they maximize all of those avenues, only then can you maybe turn around. If they still being prevented and still can't get to the top, can you maybe turn around and say it's the rules that are stopping us? His argument is we haven't even maximized what we can be within those rules yet, never mind beyond.

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[Ayo Akimolere]

You're listening to the Athletic FC podcast

[Rob Harris]

with Ayo Akimolere promising this that's a good ball.

[Matt Slater]

Oh they're back in it. Anthony Gordon at the Gallagher let's talk about last summer and Alexander Isak who Newcastle obviously lost and this summer noise is already building up around players like Anthony Gordon. Chris look are similar whispers around Sandro Tonali. Is there a fear that Newcastle could have a massive summer exodus this coming summer transfer window?

[Chris Waugh]

Well, I think there is among some fans and I think given that the media reports continue ramble about around several players, that's understandable. I do think big players will leave this summer possibly in the multiple there. I don't think all of them will go and I also think that Newcastle are going into it with a far better mindset than they did last summer when the idea was they were adamant from the very top that Alexander Isak was not going anywhere and they ended up with the worst of all worlds because they held out until the very last. And yes they've got a club record fee but as I said earlier the torpedo their own window and he did end up going and so they buckled at the last. And that's the problem that nobody now believes that they will hold firm on these sort of players and what they would like to ideally do this summer is with Anthony Gordon it seems increasingly likely he probably will leave. I think partly because it's almost accepted on all sides. Maybe his time in Newcastle has come to an end. The 2024 saga with Liverpool when he was briefly floated when he castle new PSR shoes basically since then it hasn't quite been the same for him. He was brilliant during the 202324 season, really struggled last season has been better certainly in the Champions League this year, but he sort of flitted in and out and maybe that just for both parties it's better for him to go and Newcastle think they could get a decent amount of money for him, meaning they can reinvest. I don't think Newcastle's hierarchy are frightened of that now. I think that they're more. They almost want to change the perception that maybe there is a negative. There's this horrible hangover. Newcastle which been there since the 80s really when Gascoigne left and Biozi left. That Newcastle sell their crown jewels. And they've had this basically ever since that it seems the big players leave. Johan Goodbye 1012 years ago. Similar sort of situation. And that actually we do need to trade inwards and outwards. And sometimes that means that you have to sell one of your best players because you can make a substantial profit on them and because it's maybe better for all parties to do that. They want to. To be more sober. I suppose about this. That's a long answer for me to say. Yes. I do think some of these players will leave. I don't think it will be all of them. I think it'll be significant ins and outs volume wise. Double figures easily combined because there are so many. So many players that Newcastle needs to. To sort of move on. There's got a lot of players who are out of contract. CU and Trippier is already leaving. Fabian Cher will probably follow at the end of his contract. And so they're going to have to replace some of these players. But I think it'll almost be sort of one in one out. So I think. I think Gordon probably goes to Ali. I'd say I'm 50, 50 at this stage as people are thinking Newcastle think he will go. I'm still not sure if anyone will meet the financial requirements it will take to extract him. Because Newcastle haven't tied down till 2030 essentially. Tino Liver Mendoz had injury problems heavily linked away. But I think those injury problems may prevent him from. From going right now. And I think Bruno Gimraj will stay. So of those big players maybe two will go. The rest I think will stay and then Newcastle rebuild around them. So I don't think it'll be an exodus. But I do think Newcastle squad will look significantly different come the start next season.

[Rob Harris]

I'm also reminded of a pod we did only last week where we were talking about Leicester. You know for five, six, seven years ago Leicester were the disruptors. They were the ones who had their noses pressed up against the window going do you know what? We're the next. If there's a big six we're number seven. Maybe we can pick spurs off. Maybe we can get into that Champions League group. Was it back to back Fifth places they went obviously they've famously won the title, won the FA cup. You know, they went to a Champions League quarterfinal. They went to a Europa League semi final. You know. Yeah, yeah. It, it was starting to. You start to believe right. You know, big time money. And then of course we saw they kind of grasping for it and they didn't quite get it. And then they've fallen away. You know they make some bad decisions. And I think we were talking that one of the key decisions that they got wrong was they'd stopped selling the big player every year. That was very much part of the business model we will make. We'll be, we'll be honest with where we are in the pecking order. We're going to have to sell one of our good players every summer. And they didn't do it crucially and they messed up. Now I don't think Newcastle are quite as vulnerable. I mean first of all, you know they, they do have PIF behind them. I think also Newcastle have been just a bit more conservative. They're not running as hot as Leicester were, you know, in terms of wage turnover ratio. So I don't, I'm not saying that you know Newcastle are vulnerable but Newcastle are having a bad year, right? They're having a quantifiably, objectively bad year. So you know let's. If we were doing this in a year's time it might be well, you know what did Newcastle do with the warning that Leicester ignored? So I think that's interesting and I completely agree that they messed up the ESAC situation and really it was in terms of the time they gave themselves to replace him.

[Chris Waugh]

I actually agree with what Newcastle have done because they have avoided the Leicester situation as Matt said of having high wages to turnover. But the problem is until a turnover is significantly more they can't match the wages that the players. So if Liverpool do come in for Alexander Isak beyond the cache of moving to Liverpool and then being defending champions at the time is he can basically double his wages going there. And it's the same with a lot of other players. And Newcastle have that, that problem that they have tried to keep the wage structure fairly tight. It has expanded postmagashi but it's still not the equivalent of most of the so called big six clubs. And until their revenue is at a place where it can be they can't sustain that. So that, that's. That's part of the problem as well. And that's why they will have to continue to sell players over the course of the next few years. Because when a player reaches elite status or believes there should be elite status then they're going to want to go and get that. That. That elite wage structure which Newcastle haven't got yet.

[Matt Slater]

Chris, this is interesting. Ahead of recording we put a poll out on YouTube actually asking who would be the biggest loss for Newcastle United heading into next season. Anthony Gordon, Eddie Howe or Sandro Tonali. 62% voted for Tonali. How do you feel about that?

[Rob Harris]

That's a.

[Chris Waugh]

That's interesting response. I mean I suppose we're going to always question were they only Newcastle fans who responded as well. But it doesn't surprise me. I don't think that Gordon would be bottom of that. Despite mean he got 10 Champions League goals this year. He's got 17 in all competitions. But in the Premier League he hasn't. He hasn't hit the height as Newcastle haven't. He's really performed on the big nights. But the fact he can play way out come striker means he is difficult replace in that sense. But. But I also think that a lot of Newcastle fans would argue that. That he hasn't consistently offered enough. Sandro Tonali is the player who Newcastle think profile wise will be most difficult to replace and probably won't be replaced like for. Like. Because he is if not unique very difficult profile to have someone similar to what he can actually offer. Exactly. To what he brings for Newcastle. His engine. His ability on the ball and the like. Eddie Howe. I think the 25% voted for how shows that there's a split at the moment. And I think it is. There is a split among the fan base. Some who. Although I think almost universally everyone reluctantly would see the back of how he was to go because of what he has brought to the club. But there's some who I think are now set in their ways that he cannot take Newcastle any further forward. There's others who are far more sympathetic to the situation. There's been to the difficulties there's been over the last couple. Yeah executive churn PSR issues. The. The fact he hasn't been able to refresh the squad. And I do think that. That we're seeing at the moment that split play out in the stands that in Newcastle's home matches. Whereas for. For a good few years post takeover under how it was. Everyone was united. Everyone was together. Now it. It isn't that the sort of all out booing. But it just feels like certainly against Bournemouth Newcastle's last home game which are lost the one nil down. There was a Chance which Bournemouth should have had to go 2 nil down and it held at that point the reaction of the crowd if. If Bournemouth had scored again it did feel like the crowd at least a significant portion will maybe be there ready to turn and that'll be fascinating to see when the Castle horse Brighton on Saturday. If they ought to struggle do the crowds. Do the majority of the crowds deal with how. Because I think there are increasing question marks about does he have the ideas and the energy and the wherewithal to turn this around or has this just reached maybe a natural conclusion after what had been four magnificent years.

[Matt Slater]

Yeah that poll was interesting Matt. Because Eddie Howe for me has been really instrumental to what this modern day Newcastle represent. And you think about the jubilation and the joy of winning a cup in so many years. And also you know even with Isaac and obviously he's had to see oversee a lot it. I think he'll be such a loss to Newcastle because much of this club now is in his DNA.

[Rob Harris]

Well dear, you're asking me to comment on football matters which. Which you know I have opinions on football.

[Ayo Akimolere]

Course you do.

[Matt Slater]

That's what I want to hear.

[Rob Harris]

But I am normally reluctant because they are sort of things to be shared over a pint. What I will say I. I went to both their Caribou cup finals and I thought the first time they somewhat froze and didn't sort of give off their best right. They were. They didn't look like Newcastle. They didn't like the Newcastle I've been watching on tv. The second time they absolutely destroyed Liverpool and that was sort of peak. Eddie Howe Newcastle what I've seen of them this season they just were hit and miss right. They had some good moments pre Christmas and it's sort of. It's got. It's been more miss hasn't it? That's the thing. I mean there have been injuries of course. You know some of the new signings just haven't worked and inevitably it's any club you would start to sort of think well you know is he still getting a tune out of them? Is it time for something else? And like. And I. And I do wonder and I've got nothing against the guy at all. I'm just sort of thinking if Newcastle United were going to be this insurgent shake things up. You know like kind of that man City thing even psg. Would it be Eddie Howe they chose? Eddie Howe is a good guy. Would we have moved on from Eddie Howe by now? I have a horrible feeling that we would if they were being that aggressive and then we'd be having a conversation about how unfair that was to Eddie Howe. I think Eddie Howe is sort of. He's there, right? That if he doesn't feel that conversation he should. Because I do wonder if he is slightly run out of steam. I don't know.

[Matt Slater]

Well, if we're talking hit or miss, out goes Isaac. In comes Voltamada and Johannesa. Chris, this week you've reported that there's a possibility of offloading Visa. It's a real shame because he had such a great few seasons at Brentford, I should say. But I thought he was supposed to be that sort of Premier League ready sort of signing that just kind of helped Newcastle push on.

[Chris Waugh]

Well, he was supposed to be. But at the same time he also wasn't the player who necessarily Newcastle wanted. And both the players are basically byproducts of the mess of last summer. As we said of the ESAC situation, Newcastle left it too late. They actually wanted to striker before Isak was leaving. Because Callum Wilson had left on a free transfer. They'd tried for several players over the course of the summer. Liam De Lapp, Hugo Ekatike, Zhao, Pedro. If they had come in sooner then maybe the situation wouldn't unfold. If they did. Benjamin Shesco was slightly different at that point. Newcastle were exploring could they sign Chesko and then let Isako to Liverpool. That didn't happen either. And Voldemort was a very different profile to what they had before. He scored goals when he first came in. Scored each of his first six shots on target. But stylistically clearly very different. And Newcastle didn't evolve around him. He didn't manage to accommodate himself fully and hasn't been in the team. Jan Whistler signs on deadline day. Newcastle initially bid 25 million for him early in the summer. Ended up paying 55 million pounds because Brentford basically said take it or leave it. He like Isak, had a situation where he hadn't trained with the team throughout the entire summer to try and push through the move. How much that's affected him is up for debate. But he also before he'd even kicked a ball in training for Newcastle went away with Dr. Congo, got a serious knee injury. Probably came back slightly too soon. Actually scores three goals across three competitions early on. But basically has barely been seen as a starter since. Hasn't reached the levels. And yeah, Newcastle are exploring the possibility of whether they could move him on. Because they do want at least one striker ahead of next season. And that probably means that one of Voldemort or Wissa goes for a significant loss for either, certainly for Whissa, but it's just it felt wrong from the start. Despite what he could bring into sort of proven Premier League player, it wasn't Whissel wasn't the player that really went all out for all of last summer. They made bids early on, but it wasn't he was never actually really top of the evening. Going into the last two weeks of the window they were trying to get Jorgen Strand Larson from from Wolves and would have happily I think paid 10 million more than they paid for Whisa to get Strand Larson if they could have done. They were more sold on him than Whissa and it just has not worked out yet. It's a shame for everyone because the idea was he was meant to take some of the pressure off Valdemar as well. With the injury, Voldemort had to play a lot and yeah, that's really the story of Newcastle season. The story of Newcastle season, as basic as it is is they can't put the ball in the bag of the net one end and they've made far too many errors at the other end and that that's what's combined to have them where they are on the table.

[Matt Slater]

Newcastle finished fifth last season, currently 14th in the Premier League. Let's see how it all ends up gents. Appreciate your time, Matt, Chris, and also thank you guys for joining us as well. We'll catch you soon.

[Ayo Akimolere]

You've been listening to the Athletic FC Podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroo and Jay Beale with editing by Paul Iliff and Nick Thompson. The executive producer is Adie Moorhead. To listen to other great affects Athletic Podcast for free, including our dedicated club shows. Search for the Athletic wherever you get your podcasts. You'll also find us on YouTube at the Athletic FC Podcast so make sure you subscribe. The Athletic FC Podcast is an Athletic media company production.

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