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- [00:00]
Adrian
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- [00:33]
Ben
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- [00:45]
Adrian
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- [01:17]
Ben
The Athletic FC Podcast Network.
- [01:22]
Chris
Welcome to the Athletic FC Podcast with me, Ayo Akimwaleere. Alexander Isak is one of Europe's most prolific strikers. Into Isak in the area.
- [01:31]
Ben
Isak is there.
- [01:35]
Chris
This is ridiculous. The Swedes goals have helped Newcastle book a place at Wembley and they're also in the mix to secure Champions League qualification. But the question is, can they deliver the success needed to keep him at St. James Park? Here with us today we have our Newcastle United writer Chris Woff as well as Jacob Whitehead as well. Right Chris, Alexander Isak has lit up the Premier League this season. It's been brilliant to watch. You know he's gone against Brighton last weekend, means he has 17 goals in his last 17 games since early December. I mean is it possible to outline just how important he is for Newcastle and Eddie Howe this season, but also what they're hoping to achieve in the future?
- [02:20]
Ben
Well, it's impossible to overstate how important he is to Newcastle. He hasn't played in three Premier League games this season and across those three Newcastle have won none and only scored one goal. He is pivotal to them in an attacking sense. I mean actually at the start of the season, very early on, he only got one goal in the first couple of months of the season and he looked a bit isolated and Newcastle themselves were struggling in their build up play. But then once they got him involved in the game, once he sort of ignited, he's been an absolutely phenomenal form and I think that you'd struggle to find a striker across Europe who is performing better than him. He still has some games when he is peripheral and. And when he is peripheral you basically don't even notice he's on the pitch. But when he is involved in the game it's not only the fact that he's so lethal in front of goal. It's his all round ability. It's the fact that he can come deep, he can go wide, he can run him behind. He's improved his heading, he's improved his finishing in terms of six yard box finishing. He has a bit of everything. And Newcastle United fans absolutely love him. They know he's going to be critical to their chances in the Carabao Cup Final. Even more so given the bruising week that Newcastle have had suspensions and injury wise and. And who will or won't be available. Thankfully Alexander Isak, even though he's had. He's been managing sort of a bit of muscle fatigue, he is all right. And Newcastle believe he will be fine and hopefully basically fully fit by the final because he is absolutely critical to them from an attacking point of view.
- [03:41]
Chris
Yeah, Jacob. I want to dissect his style in just a bit but you know there's something really interesting and I quite like about his demeanor. The way he carries himself. Now you wrote a piece and you compared him to a boxer recently after the win over Southampton. These words are lovely. You said his hands were deep in his burgundy jacket with a large hood draped low over his eyes. He moved with a swagger as he crossed the touchline. He reached up and removed the hood with both hands. It was reminiscent of a boxer walked towards the ring filled with confidence and an awareness of their own aura. It got me really thinking actually. Is he the excuse the phrase. Is he the coldest player in the Premier League? You see Cole Palmer, you see how van Dijk carries themselves. But Isak just carries himself with this inner confidence and ease and then he gets the job done on the field as well.
- [04:30]
Daniel
He's never too high, he's never too low. He knows how good he is. I think maybe yeah, some of that sort of boxiness. I mean lots of it was because of his hood. But he does have this sort of big cat predatorial aspect to him I think where he's sort of. Yeah, I guess a kind of coldness in executing sort of a reason why I think people like him so much and he resonates. I was trying to think about this on the way in and sort of strikes me that as a strike he blends those aesthetics everyone knows about with these real results and I guess kind of in the way of the strikers we see now. It's a relatively rare thing. You have to have a big bruising strikers who run through and you know Haaland's a brilliant player but is he a beautiful player? I don't know. Or you have the sort of strikers who drop back player false9 which isn't that sort of strike which people's sort of grown up with. And I think he's one of a few players who blends the two together. And when people really like him there's also an element of sort of nostalgia which they really appreciate as well.
- [05:26]
Chris
Yeah, I can imagine whether or not he's earning sort of court like status. Chris. You know it's a beautiful song rocking around social media. Gimme gimme, gimme A striker from Sweden he's our number 14 and he plays in attack. I'm not going to sing the rest of it but I like it. I like the imagination connecting it with another song. I mean that is beautiful. You see that in clubs in Newcastle just before or after the match. Come on man. They are loving him. He has definitely got that aura about him, hasn't he?
- [05:55]
Ben
He does. I mean that the. The chance started basically as soon as he arrived. I mean he was a club record signing in the summer of 2022 and Newcastle spent around 60 million pounds on him which was, which was a huge fee for them at the time. Now you'd say it probably looks like a relative bargain but it was a gamble because other clubs had looked at him and hadn't spent that money on him. But he came in first game goes to Liverpool scores, has another goal disallowed. Was, was brilliant and, and there was that excitement from that stage and he does have that cult like status. I mean he's absolutely adored and that's not only because of, of. Of what he has actually achieved in terms of his finishing and his goals over the last two seasons. More than 20 goals in each of the last two seasons. Which is not something many Newcastle strikers have done over the last 15 to 20 years really in the post Anshira era. But I do think when, when Jacob talks about the way that he handles himself. I was present last year, at the start of last year when Alan Shearer interviewed Alexander Isak for the Athletic and you speak to people in and around Newcastle and they ask them and it's sort of like he's a very laid back character but at the same time he's also massively driven. He's sort of hard to define And I think that comes across and sort of there is that very cold and calculated way he can finish on the pitch. But at the same time he doesn't take things too seriously necessarily. He isn't someone who, as Jacob says, gets too high or low. He isn't overly emotional, but he is extremely driven and he wants to be the best. He believes he can be the best. And Newcastle fans adore the fact that he is delivering in black and white in their shape shirt and is sort of following that lineage of. Of wonderful strikers that Newcastle have had throughout the history.
- [07:32]
Chris
Yeah, that's a really interesting point and I definitely want to talk about that later. He definitely is. And Newcastle do have a knack of finding explosive, brilliant strikers, actually. Funny you should say that. But also, talking of strikers, I mean, Jacob, so many comparisons already with Zlatan Ibrahimovic, obviously, because they're both Swedish, but Antierry Henry in that fact. But I wonder if we just give him his own. His own space to be Isak. Right. There's not many players like that. I mean, culturally Swedish, Eritrean, I don't know many of that comb that I've ever seen in the Premier League, for sure. But I mean, Isak is a bit of an anomaly on his own. And actually, maybe we should stop the comparisons and just celebrate what's in front of us.
- [08:09]
Daniel
Yeah, I agree. I mean, it's clearly not doing him too much harm. I mean, usually these sorts of things act as sort of a sword over someone's neck. He's just like running with it. The Zlatan won, of course. I mean, they just don't play anything alike. That's just purely. They're playing yellow and blue. Henry. I get it, especially the fact that he's so good at coming in off the left, that fluidity. But yeah, I'm actually really pleased that he brought up his background. I mean, there's already chat about him being one of the best footballers from East Africa ever as well, in a sort of region which doesn't necessarily produce loads of top forwards. And what he's doing there and for Sauna and for Sweden Air in Stockholm, where he grew up, is absolutely massive. I mean, I suppose on a comparison basis, you can't think of too many other players in the Premier League. I mean, the fact that we're going all the way back to Thierry Henry 20 years ago for comparison, I guess just shows the elements of uniqueness which he does have.
- [09:01]
Ben
Just on the Ibrahimovic point. I went to Sweden last June and sort of. It was for the sort of farewell game for Zlatan Ibrahimovic. So it was sort of. It was two reasons why I went. One was that. And the other one was to find out about Alexander Isak because he was obviously one of the informed strikers in the Premier League last season. But the adoration of Swedish fans at that point, it hadn't quite. It hadn't quite happened from on a national team level in terms of he'd come in as a really young player, really exciting prospect. And partly because Sweden. Sweden have not had wonderful. Really a wonderful Swedish side over the last five or so years when Isak's been in the team. And those comparisons to Ibrahimovic and. And it's sort of in the interim, in the time since, he has really ignited on the national stage as well. And obviously he's got Victor Gerkez who plays in his position and Sweden actually have quite a lot of. Of sort of strikers. But there has. He is inevitably always going to become paired with Zlatan Ibrahimovic. But I don't think it's a fair comparison in the sense that they are very different personalities. They both have a swagger, but Ibrahimovic is more about. It's all about. Ibrahimovic is not quite like that and he's a very different sort of player. And I think that it has taken him certainly and maybe in the Swedish consciousness a bit longer to sort of break out of that. Those comparisons, even Mitch, and realize that it's not fair to sort of match the two legacies because A, they're playing in very different eras for the Swedish national side and also they are just very different players. So I think it has. Maybe the way that he's viewed in Sweden, it has sort of had that maybe lingering effect that it hasn't necessarily had probably here in the Premier League.
- [10:29]
Chris
Yeah, there's something going on on social media in terms of him picking up the local lingo. I mean, come trying to do a Geordie accent with a hybrid of Swedish English.
- [10:37]
Ben
I didn't walk in.
- [10:38]
Daniel
That is not a local accent. That is West London.
- [10:44]
Chris
I get you. I get you.
- [10:45]
Ben
The Newcastle players do actually have been trying to teach him Geordie dialect. It is something that they do regularly and he is trying to pick it up. Dan Byrne and the like have been trying to get him and I think he enjoys it. I think he. I think he really embraces that sort of side of things.
- [10:57]
Chris
What do we make of his celebration? I've been trying to actually decipher what it actually means, the whole sort of thumbs gesture. I mean, what. What do we think it connect? Is there any real explanation to that? Do either of you know?
- [11:08]
Ben
I don't think he's ever explained exactly the full reasons behind it, but I think it almost sums him up as a character. As I was saying before, he's just quite a complicated character, but it's almost sort of like that. Yeah, I am capable of doing this. That, that sort of. That's sort of just. Just me and it. But not. I was gonna say not in an arrogant way. I suppose there is an arrogance about it, but not intuitively.
- [11:26]
Chris
A good striker has to have a certain amount of arrogance and self confidence in themselves, surely.
- [11:31]
Ben
Yeah. And just almost that. I think it's in a certain sort of way, it's almost like, yeah, I have just done that sort of arrogant way, but also in a. Maybe I am capable of doing things like that. So yeah, I think. And it's just become part of him and I think, yeah, I think the celebration almost sums up him as a character and as a striker.
- [11:48]
Daniel
It's quite done next as well, isn't it? It's very much sort of an on to the next thing. So it fits in with that coldness.
- [11:54]
Chris
Yeah. And also, I don't know, it's just. It just for me raises the profile of him being a really prolific striker. I think there's no doubt that Alexander Isak, in his head and also from his performances, thinks he should be one of the top strikers in the world. But let's move on. Next we'll explore more of Ale Alexander Isak the player and what it is that makes him so good.
- [12:15]
Ben
You're listening to the Athletic FC podcast with IO Accumulere.
- [12:20]
Adrian
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- [13:18]
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- [13:51]
Ben
In behind.
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Chris
For Isak Great ball Isak. Onto his right in the penalty area still going.
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Ben
What a finish.
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Chris
Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant from a top class centre forward. Alexander Isak Chris, you've watched him now what for three seasons at St. James's Park. Can you just summarize the impact he's had in those three seasons at Newcastle? We spoke at the top about what he means to them moving forward, but just what that growth looks like for him.
- [14:18]
Ben
Well, when he first came in, as I say his debut was suddenly a little wow, Newcastle have signed an absolutely top talent here and he seemed immediately like he justified the price tag. But then he had quite a muscle injury which put him out for a few months. It was either side of the the Qatar World cup and that affected his sort of first season really and he didn't play as often as he would have necessarily liked. But then the last sort of two months of the season he came in the side and he was actually dovetailing well with Callum Wilson often playing alongside him and that was the point where Newcastle went to Everton and he produced the assist of the century which wasn't actually an assist for Jacob Murphy where he did basically eight Everton players down the left wing and then and then put the ball into the box.
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Daniel
What a run.
- [14:59]
Chris
Alexander Isak it's gonna go in. It's Jacob Mur Murphy has scored but Isak gets all the congratulations. After some absolutely incredible skill he took.
- [15:13]
Ben
On half the Everton team and that showed you that he was more than just this wasn't just a striker Newcastle sign in terms of a pure finisher this was an all round sort of modern center forward for for one of a of a better term. But then last season again he grew into the campaign. He had a few niggling injuries across the course of it, but really started to find his form at the sort of turn of the year and was the one who propelled Newcastle back into the conversation for European football. They didn't quite get there in the end but he was the one who kept them really within that. And then this year I think that he stepped it up another level. Now you expect him to deliver whenever he goes on the pitch. Last season I think there was certainly the first half of the season it was. He might turn it on but we're not quite sure. And everything needs to sort of be right for him. Whereas now he has that authority of. I am one of the best players in the Premier League. I am someone who really elevates in Newcastle side. When you have Alexander Isaac in the team. Newcastle are capable of beating anyone. They have some very good players in other positions as well. But he is the difference maker. And I think that he would slot into probably just about any other side in Europe because he is that good now. And that is something which Newcastle recognize. And they feel that they were right to have taken the calculated gamble and signing them a couple of seasons ago. And it's paying dividends for that very reason. And that's why regardless of how many hits they've got going into the Carabine Cup Final. Regardless of the fact that Anthony Gordon suspended. Regardless of the fact that Lewis hall and Sven Botman are injured. If you have Alexander Isak in the side Newcastle do have at least a puncher's chance of winning that game.
- [16:45]
Daniel
We've got to think that large parts of this is he didn't arrive at Newcastle the finished product by any means. Eddie Howes. I've always said his biggest strength as a coach is his development of players on the training pitch. We've seen him develop this real. I mean out of possession is the real thing which we probably won't talk about much on this podcast. It's not the most sexy part of his game. But he's now really trusted by Eddie. How in every game. Where sometimes he might have actually preferred. Like it's only at the start of last season where sometimes Callum Wilson was an option in the box as well. I mean he's scored so many goals from within the six yard box this season. We've talked about comparison to Zlatan Ibrahimovic. How about another Swedish striker? He's getting more Henrik Larsson at various points. Just sort of various prods and improvised finishes. He's made so many strides in these areas over the last 18 months. And like Chris said it was a calculated gamble and it's one which has paid off because of that development which has happened on the Sort of on the training pitch as well.
- [17:34]
Chris
Yeah. I want to delve into his importance for this team. Jacob, you know his double against Nottingham Forest in the Premier League recently made it 50 goals in just 76 games. Those are good numbers. Now that makes him the seventh quickest to half a century in the competition's history. Not bad when you consider he signed for a team that was at the bottom half of the table. And also you know the selection of players. He's quicker than Sergio Aguero, Thierry Henry, Wayne Rooney, Didier Drogba. I mean that is absolutely huge for Isak. And we were talking about talisman on a recent podcast. Has he earned the right to be a talisman for Newcastle considering what he can offer that team?
- [18:11]
Daniel
It's interesting because as a player he's not one of those strikers massively involved in build up play. The whole time his role comes right at the end. He's signing it off, putting the icing on it kind of talisman. I'd still sort of almost in a way argue that Bruno Guimaries is Newcastle's talisman. He's the player who sort of. I'd say that identity most reflects. He's at the best of it. But I mean he's a pretty sharp end to Newcastle attack, isn't he? I mean like he's not as good a word as talisman. It's really pointy.
- [18:42]
Chris
What do you reckon in terms of that Chris? You know, I guess yeah. Jake, in terms of the buildup, Guimaraes is that guy. But also I mean in execution though, he's almost at a point where you put it in front of him. You're. It's almost destined to be at the back of the net.
- [18:56]
Ben
Yeah. And I think one touch finishing. I'm not sure there have been many strikers over the last 10 years who are as clinical and as quick in terms of the way that he does finish when he's put through. And that's something which I think over the last 18 months confidence has really built from. And that's what he. What he's added to his game. But the you speak to people at Newcastle and they say when they had him on the train field to begin with that was. You almost noticed that instantly in training that he just has that extra split second the way he finishes when he's played through on goal and he just has that additional quality about him. So. Yeah, I see. I agree where Jacob's come from. I think in terms of a lot of the way that Newcastle build up the field, he isn't necessarily integral to that. But I actually think that what has developed over the last 12, 18 months is that because his movement I think is massively underrated in terms of when you talk about him. And I think his movement is what really makes Newcastle tick. When Alexander Isak is coming deep and dragging defenders out of position as they as you saw by two legs against Arsenal in the Carabao cup semi final. He can terrorize and make the very best central defenders in the world who very rarely look ruffled. He just makes them look all at sea. And he does that regularly. He's done that with Virgil van Dijk. And that's another reason going in the Carabao cup final you think there are very few players who are able to do that. And he is one of them. Because he has a little bit of everything and he's so unpredictable in that sense. And he has now now made sure these added the ability to certainly finish those chances off as well.
- [20:20]
Chris
Where do you think he sits in the pantheon of great Newcastle forwards? Obviously Arlen Shearer, Andy Cole. I mean he's a very different player to those kind of players. But also it's a very different kind of football we're watching now in the Premier League. But I mean he definitely sits up there surely.
- [20:35]
Ben
Yeah. I think. I mean obviously Alan Shearer is the very top. He's the Premier League's record goal scorer. He's Newcastle's record goal scorer at 206. But I think that you have to argue he's probably second or just about second already. Andy Cole. His goal scoring record was phenomenal for Newcastle. And that was obviously the start of the entertainers era. Newcastle are coming in the Premier League and sort of the upstart. And he was an absolutely phenomenal finisher. But I just think in terms of everything that Isak brings. The aura that he has. What he represents in terms of where Newcastle are trying to get to and being that sort of world class player that really is now. I do think he's just about up there. And this is the club who you just wheel off a few more just in the Premier League era. Les Ferdinand. Andy Carroll at the very start of his sort of career. Callum Wilson and even for. For a period. And Newcastle have had so many strikers who have done extremely well and have really would have graced a lot of other Premier League shirts. But I think that yeah beyond Alan Shearer I think there are a few you can say are above Alexander Isak and now. And I think that he will by the end of the season have probably cemented that position even further.
- [21:39]
Chris
Now, Jacob, we already mentioned your piece and actually in that piece you. You spoke about his two goals at Southampton, but also as Chris mentioned earlier, you know, you looked at his movement and his different approaches in being able to hu opponents. Now you picked out seven, which I thought was quite interesting. It just shows you the versatility of him as a player, including pulling wide, dropping deep off the shoulder, take ons the pick and roll, which is more of a basketball term really, you know, chaos theory, nonchalant. I mean, just give me two, that pick and roll and chaos theory. What do you mean by that? Because that's a really fascinating insight.
- [22:13]
Daniel
Pick and roll is probably my misuse of basketball terminology. It's basically using, using probably more setting up screens, I guess, but using it using a player playing a 1, 2 and then using that player to almost, I guess, rub off the covering defender and create a little pocket of space around the edge of a box. He's this wonderful ability of his ball striking where it seems like he can take shots when played through from one step earlier than everyone else. He's just got the accuracy from an extra sort of five yards away from goal, which is great because the goalkeeper can't come into play and it means that any fast coverage defenders can't get back to. To him, chaos theory is just something I think he's developed quite a lot in the last season or two, which is just everyone knows you need to keep an eye on Alexander Isaac, right? Like all defenders are like, this is a guy, this guy who's going to score, but they don't. Like, they somehow miss him. I went to Sweden a couple of years ago and spoke to a couple of players who came through the system with. And one of them was his sort of first, I guess his mentor when he broke into the AIK first team, who's another Swedish Eritrean guy called Henok Goytem. And Henok said that was what we really noticed when he came into the first team was that he was sneaky. I don't mean this in a bad way. He was a sneaky guy. Like, he was smart. He knew even with these wizened old Swedish professionals, he knew how to make space form it for himself, how to. He was a pretty slender guy coming in as well. He knew how to not get hurt as well. Which isn't. That's not a shirking thing. That's how you get through, how you get through a 38 game season or whatever it is. And yeah, I'D say all of those feed into his sort of chaos theory, his movement. It really isn't much. I think most strikers have two or three techniques for Isaac has seven which you can go to of such regularity. I mean, it also massively affects the way that Newcastle can play. They can build up, they can set up because they have a striker who's sort of can fit into three or four different techniques.
- [23:56]
Chris
Yeah, very good. Well on that point, next we'll look at the noise building over interest in Newcastle's number 14. We'll look at how difficult it will be for them to keep hold of him this summer.
- [24:13]
Emily
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- [24:33]
Ben
Mm.
- [24:33]
Emily
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- [25:14]
Ben
This is the Athletic FC podcast with IO Akamalera.
- [25:21]
Chris
Well earlier this week, in a call with local journalist, Newcastle United CEO Darren Eales explained how it would be crazy for the club to consider selling their best players. Christian, you were part of that group of journalists who spoke to Eels via video call. Can you just tell us a little bit more about the context of what he was talking talking about?
- [25:38]
Ben
For this you have to rewind to January last year when Darren Eels did a similar video call basically around the release of Newcastle's account and at that point it wasn't explicitly clear how difficult Newcastle were in a PSR situation and he was asked whether every single player in a PSR world had a price and he said yes. And it felt like Newcastle were almost ready and willing to accept potential Offers. And obviously what happened last June when Newcastle had to scramble around to make the best part of £70 million before the June 30 deadline. That was clear that they had to consider just about all options. And Alexander Rezak was just about the one player that wanted to avoid losing. But there was a fear at one stage that they might have to. Now fast forward 13 months and it's a. It's a different situation. Newcastle have sorted out their PSR situation to a certain degree. They still have limitations as all clubs do. But now Newcastle feel are in a far stronger position. And Alexander Isak is three years. We were three years remaining on his contract. Come the summer Newcastle in 10 to open contract negotiations with them about potentially extending and obviously improving that deal moving forward. But when you speak to people high up in Newcastle they say that how would you replace Alexander Isak? If someone comes and makes an offer for him. It's like he is the one player who you may as well give up and go home if you're going to consider losing him this summer. He is integral to everything Newcastle want to do. They took the gamble on him in the first place. His value was appreciated significantly during that time. And when Newcastle look at it they feel they are in a strong position because he still has three years left. There isn't a release clause in that contract. And then you just think about it. Who is going to come and really make Newcastle an offer they feel they will be unable to refuse. Now the obviously the caveat to that is it depends how Alexander Isak feels. And getting in the Champions League feels vital for keeping him happy and for making sure that Newcastle can show their ambition going forward. But at the same time if Newcastle really do hold for firm you'd be very much be looking at a price well in excess of £100 million. And in a PSR world and in a European UEFA financial fair play world, can clubs really afford to invest that much? Very very few can. And so therefore I think Newcastle do feel emboldened by being in that position.
- [27:48]
Chris
Yeah, with a few that can. I mean Jacob, you can understand why. I mean your article basically gives seven reasons why it's worth maybe taking a look at Alexander Isak. But you know the likes of Arsenal we've spoken about have been interested in in this player. I mean with his skill set. It's not unsur. There will be people potentially sniffing if they can afford it.
- [28:07]
Daniel
My stock will be through the floor with Newcastle fans. If you're suggesting that I've sold him to Arsenal in That article, I'd like it to clarify it was a purely complimentary piece about a player and his tactical insight.
- [28:17]
Chris
I'm just putting it in the universe man. Put it in the universe.
- [28:21]
Daniel
Yeah. I think the final few months of Newcastle season is going to be important. Alexander Isak is a player who would start for pretty much every team in the world at this point. I don't think it's too much of an over exaggeration to say I. And if Newcastle don't make the Champions League this season it'll be two years in a row without the Champions League. He's a player who is at that quality. It's just knowing. I mean he's a smart guy. He knows there's only a few clubs who are able to afford it. That in this PSR world there's actually means that sort of clubs are able to hold on to their player more because of the outlay needed. I'm sure he'll be aware of that. Of course Arsenal are going to be interested. I mean we've seen that Arteta likes player Havertz. You can drop deep and then play. I mean Isak can do that like it's one of his movements. But whether Arsenal have. It's going to take a huge fee and it really is very limited teams.
- [29:14]
Ben
I think from a Newcastle fans perspective and even from Newcastle internally perspective there's a frustration that it's almost like oh Alexander Isak's done well for Newcastle but that means he has to move elsewhere. And it's a. Darren Eels described it as being seen as. Newcastle are almost seen as the next category down. Obviously we know that theoretically this ownership they've said on the record they want to be number one now PSR and for various other reasons that that that trajectory is going to take longer than anticipated to get there. But I think that the. The Newcastle fans do feel it's disparaging at certain times to say to and this is no disrespect to Arsenal but it's like why. Why would he go to Arsenal? Now I know Arsenal Arsenal theoretically being competing to the Premier League this season. But it's like is he. If he goes there is that suddenly going to guarantee him that he would have a chance of say winning the Ballon d'or something like that. Now yes, it's not likely to be in the Champions League every season and Newcastle aren't quite at that stage of the journey. But. But I think that that is where there's a lot of frustration. And so many Castle fans feel that Certain elements of the media and I realize we are. We are the media. I'm just. I'm just using that as a wider catch all term. There's almost like this campaign that he has to. To leave Newcastle. And this isn't just. This isn't just a Newcastle Nisak sort of move. I'm sure this happens with other clubs when they have players who are considered elite that it feels like there's almost this campaign to move them out. And I'm sure that's not actually the motivation behind it. But that's where I think a lot of the frustration comes behind. And it's up to Newcastle as a club really to prove that they do have that ambition to match Alexander Isaks. And one way of doing that would certainly be to get back into the Champions League this season because that's where he wants to be playing. That also financially gives them a. A better opportunity to really reimburse him in the way that he really should be. Now given that he is among the very best strikers in the world.
- [30:54]
Chris
And also financially with the sales of people like Lloyd Kelly. Amaron Minte for instance. Chris. And the fact that Newcastle really haven't been that busy in a couple of transfer windows. Now you're hoping that there are healthy enough coffers there to keep hold of the existing lot. But also potentially help Eddie Howe bolster the this team.
- [31:16]
Ben
Yeah. And this summer is absolutely massive for Newcastle. Those. Those dreaded three letters psr. It has been the issue for Newcastle. They haven't materially strengthened the first 11 for three successive windows. And that is another reason why you may have the likes of. Of. Of Alexander Isak and other star players looking and thinking hang on a second here. This isn't the project I was sold. This. Eddie Howe himself introduced the word stagnate a few weeks ago into a press conference as if talking about the fact that the squad hasn't been refreshed and that they haven't been able to really add quality in certain areas. And Alexander Isak has to have those ambitions fulfilled himself. The training ground. Newcastle haven't yet started a new training ground. That's been said. That's going to be something they're going to do. Same with the stadium. Now these projects are in the line and will happen eventually. But at some point that sort of. It can't just be the theory that this is where Newcastle are going to go. They have to actually put into action some of. Some of what they've promised to these players and sold them as the vision for the club. And so this summer is massive for Newcastle. There. There are many areas of the squad which have needed strengthened for a long while. They need to do a heck of a business and I think that that making sure that they do enough to if they get into the Champions League be able to really go into that competition and fare better than they did two seasons ago when they were knocked out in the group stage. And b confirm to the likes of Alexander Isak and others that they are on the upward trajectory. I think that that's massive for them this summer.
- [32:37]
Chris
Jacob. Let's say Newcastle don't qualify for the Champions League but you know in another universe they end up winning the League cup. Right. ASAK has recently said on Sky Sports that he, you know for him is a big motivation is an ambition is to is silverware. Do you think that's enough for this season for a player like that?
- [32:54]
Daniel
Don't want to be categorical about it in the sense that I don't think you can call anything on this summer based on whether Newcastle win it or not. My reading would be that Champions League is a much more important factor than the League Cup. And also I guess for winning that trophy it means far more probably ultimately to the city, to the club than it does to Isak. I mean it's been 60 years since a major trophy with respect to the interferes Toto cup which I probably wouldn't count. And you look at his career and he's not won a huge amount of silver when he was at Sociedad when he's at Brussia Dortmund. I think he did win some in Sweden but yeah like clearly it will matter to him. But I think the Champions League having that platform and the echelon player that that will be perceived to move him into. Even if that's unfair, I think there is a shift which takes place. There will be a more compelling factor.
- [33:43]
Chris
Yeah Chris, on on that point, you know and I think about the kind of players that Eddie Howe might want this summer and also the ambitions for the club that really where they are right now. You know I remember the takeover and I was thinking right here we go. Newcastle throw all the money at it. PSR comes in. But can that also be a show of this is where we're going. This is the plan. Alexander, look who we're bringing in. If it doesn't happen this season, maybe next season. Stay with us. Because as you said also you know he deserves to show some sort of loyalty. They have stuck by him and took a chance on him.
- [34:15]
Ben
I Think so. And I mean I've been of the opinion for the last couple of years. I realize all of the benefits of being in the Champions League. And I do think that if you pushed Alexander Isaki to answer are one or the other. I think he would say be in the Champions League. But I also think Newcastle as a club to win something, to win a trophy would actually be a big stepping stone for them. It's. It is very much the sort of thing that everyone talks about this long long wait that Newcastle have 70 years since a major domestic trophy. And I think that it could almost be a stepping stone to get to that next stage. But being in the Champions League as I say financially it'll be potentially a game changer. And that allow that will give them greater breathing space from a PSR perspective to give Alexander reak better players to have around him and potentially to give him a better contract. But I also think the contract talks that will happen this summer. If Newcastle can't reach an agreement this summer with him next season is massive. Because then by the end of next season he'll only have two years left in his deal. And then really it is almost like stick or twist. So Newcastle have to be able to show him something next year. And if that's been in the Champions League and showing that they are progressing on that stage. Because if you look at. If you really. If we are now seeing that that is peers in terms of the best strikers in Europe are probably Erling Haaland and Killian Mbappe. Well they're of a similar age and yet they are have been in the Champions League season after season after season. Alexander Isak has not had that luxury. He's only had a handful of appearances in the competition and he's now reaching his peak. He needs to know that over the course of the next three or four years he's going to be regularly competing in the very elite in Europe. So I think that if Newcastle can get back in the Champions League for next season. If fifth place as it looks like it's going to be an extra position in the Premier League that is so transformative for Newcastle and hopefully they hope hopes of. Of keeping hold of Alexander Isak going forward.
- [35:59]
Chris
Yeah. I'm just thinking you know there's a. There's a beautiful fairy tale here that Isaac stays on and you know he. He pays you know back. You know the. The. The chance that Newcastle took on him. But you know if someone comes in with a hundred odd million Jacob. I mean Newcastle resolve will be tested. I mean if he's that prolific there's a lot of teams out there that would love a striker of that caliber.
- [36:20]
Daniel
You're doing it again. You're trying to get me to sell him.
- [36:24]
Chris
I'm just thinking football's a business. I know you know that There's a sentiment aspects of things but sometimes let's say someone brings in 120 million. Can Newcastle say no to that?
- [36:34]
Daniel
Yeah, they can say no. And a point with PSR that like you know at some point Newcastle have said that they have to get better at trading selling players. And that's something which has been reiterated in. In recent months. And the accounts. I mean they're going to have to continue to make sales. But Isaac is one of the players who you least want to. There's other saleable assets in that squad towards like.
- [36:56]
Chris
Sure.
- [36:57]
Daniel
Like if someone comes in, offers them the moon and mars then maybe I'll think about it. But it's not going to be a deal I think which is simple enough where people just go I'll put 100 million, 120 million on the table and boosh. That's done.
- [37:09]
Chris
Yeah. Chris.
- [37:10]
Ben
I generally think that it would be well beyond 100 million that Newcastle would need. Because without getting too technical if you just look at it from a PSR perspective you'd be halfway through a six year contract. And if you you amortized so you spread the cost of his transfer over that period Newcastle would need £30 million to be wiped out. In terms of that's already Newcastle still owe that in terms of their account for bookable value. So that's if it was 100 million that's only 70 million Newcastle going to get for him. And you think about trying to replace him. Newcastle took a calculated gamble paying £60 million on him. And it's worked out. But that's not to say that the next player you do that on it will work out in the same way. Because there aren't many Alexander Isak like strikers around. Newcastle tried to sign Benjamin Chesko a couple of years ago. Now everyone else wants him as well. So they probably wouldn't be front of the queue to sign him either. And so I think that you what I think there's also potentially a sell on clause where real sociedad would reduce some money. So given his value to Newcastle in terms of what he brings and I mean more than a monetary value in terms of everything that he symbolizes the importance Eddie Howe places on him and basically he's like the one. He's the one player we can't lose. I think that you are talking well beyond 100 million before Newcastle would even really countenance it. The big caveat, as I said before, is it depends how Alexander. Because if Alexander Isaac suddenly turns around and goes no, I want to go, then the player probably does have some. Some strength of argument here. But as things stand, Newcastle have had no indication that's going to be the case. He hasn't said he wants to go. They don't believe and hope he won't do that. But that is obviously the big caveat there. So I do think Newcastle are actually in a strong position, but it would be significantly stronger if they are in the Champions League.
- [38:41]
Chris
Okay, fantastic gents. Thank you so much for your time. Chris and Jacob. And a quick disclaimer that Jacob does not want Alexander Isak to leave Newcastle. This is all on me wanting him to go to Arsenal.
- [38:51]
Daniel
Thank you guys. Everton.
- [38:55]
Chris
Now that would be the deal of the season.
- [38:57]
Daniel
We'll take him.
- [38:59]
Chris
Come on. You've got a star striker already. Less of that. All right, thank you so much for listening. Adam Leventhal will be with you tomorrow to look ahead at Manchester United versus Arsenal this weekend in the Premier League.
- [39:09]
Ben
You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroot and Jay Beal. The executive producer was Aidy Moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free, search for the Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. The Athletic FC podcast is an athletic media company production. The Athletic FC Podcast Network.