Have Aston Villa's transfer plans been derailed?

Summary

Summary of "Have Aston Villa's Transfer Plans Been Derailed?" – The Athletic FC Podcast

Release Date: May 26, 2025
Hosts: Ayo Akinwolere, Dan Bardell, Jacob Tanswell
Guests: Jacob Tanswell (Aston Villa writer), Dan Bardell (Aston Villa fan and podcaster)

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1. Introduction to Aston Villa's Season and Key Controversy

The Athletic FC Podcast delves into Aston Villa's recent failure to secure a top-five finish in the Premier League, a crucial outcome that impacts their Champions League aspirations. The discussion centers around a pivotal moment during the match against Manchester United that significantly influenced the final standings.

Key Incident:

• Disallowed Goal: The controversy arose when Morgan Rogers scored a goal that was subsequently disallowed due to a refereeing decision involving a potential foul.

Notable Quote:
Dan Bardell highlights the impact of the refereeing mistake:
“Those three minutes from the referee blowing his whistle to Ahmad Dialo Scoring has defined Aston Villa season...” ([02:30])

2. Refereeing Controversy and Its Impact

The hosts and guests analyze the referee’s decision-making during the match, questioning the experience level of the official, Thomas Brammell, and the implications of such errors on Villa's season.

Points Discussed:

• Referee's Inexperience: Jacob Tanswell criticizes the appointment of an inexperienced referee for a high-stakes Premier League game.

• VAR Limitations: The inability of VAR to intervene in real-time decisions due to procedural rules exacerbated the situation.

Notable Quotes:
Jacob Tanswell critiques the referee:
“He hasn't got the CV to be refereeing the game of that magnitude.” ([03:30])
Ayo Akinwolere expresses frustration:
“It's like a 99.9 versus 0.0.1. There's no foul there.” ([04:20])

3. Team Performance: Champions League vs. Premier League

A significant portion of the discussion contrasts Aston Villa's strong performances in the Champions League with their inconsistent results in the Premier League.

Insights:

• Champions League Success: Villa reached the semi-finals, showcasing their capability on European nights.

• Premier League Struggles: Despite a late-season surge, early-season drop points and inconsistent performances hindered their league campaign.

Notable Quote:
Dan Bardell reflects on the dual nature of Villa’s performances:
“They were, Villa were Vick... they haven't turned up because exactly the same thing happened... now it's a bit of a worry that when the big occasion comes round Villa mentally don't seem to be there.” ([03:50])

4. Managerial Perspectives: Unai Emery’s Role

The podcast emphasizes Unai Emery's influence on the team’s tactics and morale, especially following a pivotal loss that dashed their Champions League hopes.

Key Points:

• Emery’s Frustration: Visible signs of agitation were noted from Emery during and after key matches.

• Rebuilding Efforts: January signings and squad reinforcements initially showed promise but were not sufficient to secure the desired league position.

Notable Quotes:
Ayo Akinwolere praises Emery:
“He's the most important man at this football club... as long as he's here, there's a chance.” ([32:37])
Jacob Tanswell discusses Emery’s tactical adjustments:
“Emery wants the squad to improve every single season... he bought multifunctional players to cover certain positions.” ([32:37])

5. Emi Martinez’s Red Card and Future at Villa

A critical moment in the match was Emi Martinez's red card, raising questions about his future with the club and the broader implications for Aston Villa’s squad.

Discussion Points:

• Red Card Incident: Martinez's aggressive play led to a sending-off, forcing Villa to play with 10 men during a crucial game.

• Potential Departure: Given Villa's financial constraints and UEFA's Financial Fair Play (FFP) regulations, Martinez is a likely candidate for transfer to reduce the wage bill.

Notable Quotes:
Ayo Akinwolere laments Martinez’s departure:
“If it is, it's a really sad thing because for five, six years he's been absolutely brilliant.” ([16:07])
Jacob Tanswell explains the financial necessity:
“Emi Martinez is the highest earner of any permanent member in that squad... his sale would solve both issues.” ([20:14])

6. Financial Implications and Transfer Market Strategies

Missing out on the Champions League has severe financial repercussions for Aston Villa, necessitating adjustments in their transfer strategies to comply with FFP and manage the wage bill.

Key Points:

• Revenue Loss: Villa anticipated generating around £100 million from Champions League participation but falls short, creating a budget deficit.

• Player Sales: To balance finances, Villa is compelled to sell high-earning players like Luca Dean, Leon Bailey, Jacob Ramsey, and Ollie Watkins.

• Transfer Challenges: Balancing the need to sell high-profile players while attempting to reinvest in the squad proves challenging under FFP restrictions.

Notable Quotes:
Ayo Akinwolere addresses the financial strain:
“The rules are pretty harsh on an upwardly mobile team like Villa... it's going to be a really difficult summer.” ([28:27])
Jacob Tanswell outlines the transfer necessities:
“Villa have already lost 200 million in the last two end of year accounts... it's going to be a very, very busy window again.” ([25:46])

7. Future Outlook and Managerial Confidence

Despite the setbacks, there is a sense of optimism regarding the continuity of Unai Emery and the potential for future success, particularly in the Europa League.

Insights:

• Europa League Prospects: Villa may have a better chance to compete for a trophy in the Europa League, providing another avenue for success.

• Managerial Stability: Maintaining Emery at the helm is seen as crucial for sustained competitiveness and potential future achievements.

Notable Quotes:
Ayo Akinwolere remains hopeful:
“As long as he's here, there's a chance... to have some more money and... another way for a trophy.” ([32:37])
Dan Bardell expresses continued support:
“He’s a genius... as long as he’s here, there's a chance.” ([34:19])

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Conclusion

The Athletic FC Podcast episode "Have Aston Villa's Transfer Plans Been Derailed?" provides an in-depth analysis of Aston Villa's tumultuous season. From pivotal refereeing decisions and managerial challenges to significant financial constraints affecting transfer strategies, the discussion paints a comprehensive picture of the club's current state. While the missed Champions League qualification poses substantial hurdles, the continued leadership of Unai Emery offers a glimmer of hope for future endeavors, particularly within the Europa League.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• “Those three minutes from the referee blowing his whistle to Ahmad Dialo Scoring has defined Aston Villa season...” — Dan Bardell ([02:30])

• “He hasn't got the CV to be refereeing the game of that magnitude.” — Jacob Tanswell ([03:30])

• “It's like a 99.9 versus 0.0.1. There's no foul there.” — Ayo Akinwolere ([04:20])

• “He's the most important man at this football club... as long as he's here, there's a chance.” — Ayo Akinwolere ([32:37])

• “If it is, it's a really sad thing because for five, six years he's been absolutely brilliant.” — Ayo Akinwolere ([16:07])

• “Villa have already lost 200 million in the last two end of year accounts... it's going to be a very, very busy window again.” — Jacob Tanswell ([25:46])

• “As long as he's here, there's a chance... to have some more money and... another way for a trophy.” — Ayo Akinwolere ([32:37])

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Note: This summary excludes advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections as per the provided guidelines.

Transcript

[Raj Panjabi]

Hi, I'm Raj Panjabi from HuffPost.

[Noah Michaelson]

And I'm Noah Michaelson, also from HuffPost.

[Raj Panjabi]

And we're the hosts of Am I Doing It Wrong? A new podcast that explores the all too human anxieties we have about trying to get our lives right.

[Noah Michaelson]

Each week on the podcast, Raj and I pick a new topic that we want to understand better and bring a guest expert on to talk us through how to get it right.

[Raj Panjabi]

And we're talking like legit credible experts.

[Noah Michaelson]

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[Ayo Akimulere]

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[Jacob Tanswell]

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[Ayo Akimulere]

The Athletic FC Podcast Network.

[Dan Bardell]

Welcome to the Athletic FC Podcast with me, Ayo Akimulere. Aston Villa missed out on a crucial top five spot in the Premier League after a moment of controversy at Manchester United.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Here's Rodgers. Oh, and outside has put it in. And Aston Villa have scored.

[Noah Michaelson]

Or have they?

[Dan Bardell]

So why couldn't Emery get his side over the line this season? And what will failing to qualify for the Champions League mean for Villa's summer transfer plans? Right here with us today, we have the Athletics Aston Villa writer Jacob Tanswell, who was at Old Trafford yesterday, plus Aston Villa fan and podcaster Dan Bardell as well. Jacob, let's start the big news, the big flashpoint in the game. You know, I'm so interested to hear the Villa camp's perspective of the Morgan Rogers's disallowed goal. Because I watched that back and I'm thinking, well, the keeper doesn't have full hold of the ball, but I think probably more the controversy is when the whistle was blown, surely.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Yeah, it was. I think first of all, Villa and that they acknowledged that they weren't great on the day. I think they know they didn't deserve to win the game. But those three minutes from the referee blowing his Whistle to Ahmad Dialo Scoring has defined Aston Villa season and you know, in real time. I heard the whistle and although he went to Var, we saw Var on the screen. There was no way that they could intervene because it just went against the rules. And Villa had a similar incident with Henry Lansbury six years ago. So you know this roundabout way of, of those type of incidents coming back to haunt Villa. The ref made a human error, he made a mistake. Thomas Brammell and Villa's complaints were not such due to the mistake but the, you know, could they have prevented this mistake from happening in terms of. Could they have got more experienced referee and you know, Michael Oliver was being the Var another game, could he have potentially been in charge of the game rather than a referee who's refereed 11 or 12 games both in the championship and Premier League this season, who's still, you know, only 35.

[Dan Bardell]

Dan, you know, we're clutching at straws here because as Jacobs just said, Villa weren't really at the races and their record at Old Trafford isn't that great, let's be honest. But you know, the goal or the, that the result hang on that moment of, of madness from the referee or the disallowed goal or was it. Was there much more at hand here in that match?

[Ayo Akimulere]

Look, Villa were absolutely appalling yesterday.

[Dan Bardell]

I was trying to skate around.

[Ayo Akimulere]

They were, Villa were Vick. It's the second time in a month there's been a really, really big occasion, kind of a season defining game and they've not turned up because exactly the same thing happened at Crystal palace against Crystal palace at Wembley a month or so ago that was now. So that it's a bit of a worry that when the big occasion comes round Villa mentally don't, don't seem to be there. I think, look, the Martinez sending off is completely correct. I think the penalty is completely correct. So I'm not sat here as, as someone who's completely biased and can't criticize my own team. Look, we, we didn't deserve anything yesterday, but the fact of the matter is, is with the game nil, nil at the time and by the end of the game, Villa only need a point to get Champions League football. However badly you've played, however many times, Manchester United have hit the woodwork and it felt like they hit the woodwork an awful lot yesterday. You've got away with it up until that point and you have scored a legitimate goal to put yourself 1n up and at that point the whole game completely changes. You know, Newcastle didn't get back into their game anyway. But you know St. James's park here. Oh, villa have gone one nil up. Old Trafford, Chelsea and Forest fans here. The villa have gone 1 nil up at old. It completely changes everything. And it's not even like a 50 50, is it? The referee's blowing whistle too early and it's a 50 50. It's like a 99.9 versus 0.0.1. There's no foul there. I can't work out why Thomas Brammell has felt the need to blow his whistle however far away he is. And the fact that he's far away from it makes it worse that he's blowing the whistle and he's just completely got rid of any opportunity for Vir to do what he's there, what he's there for, what it's supposed to do. And like Jacob says, really Jacob is a lot more kind about it than I'm going to be. He's got no right to be refereeing a game of that magnitude, really. He hasn't got the CV to be refereeing the game of that magnitude. Anthony Taylor's ref in Liverpool Crystal Palace a nothing game. I think Villa have been let. They've let themselves down, but they've certainly been let down by, by the refereeing and the officials as well.

[Jacob Tanswell]

What I will say is I think it might be difficult for Thomas Brownhill in mitigation to go from the championship game where you're supposed to blow up. There's no var, you know, if you see a foul, you give it strai way to now. You know, in a Premier League where they tell you to. To delay, to allow the move to unfold. So he's been basically alternating between Championship and Premier League all season. So, you know, it's just in that quick split second he's got to remember, oh wait, I've got to let this carry on. It was just simply a fault. And that comes again back to Villa's point in terms of could a more experienced referee who has been refereeing in the Premier League all season took charge of that game and they probably would have avoided making us quick snap judgment.

[Dan Bardell]

I was listening to, you know, Emery's post match Dan and he was, it was very diplomatic the saying, everyone makes mistakes. You know, referees makes mistakes, managers make mistakes, players make mistakes. But he would have been disappointed with the way his team turned out against Manchester United in a game where they feel like they should have got something out of him.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Yeah, probably in the first half of the season, I Think Emery was visibly frustrated almost nearly every game. He just looked really aggravated and agitated on the sidelines. I remember a game, Villa conceded a goal and he's. Or Mr. Chance and he's punching the dugout, you know, things we haven't seen from him really in his time there. But then Villa kind of reshaped and reinvented the squad in January and have gone on this run recently and he seemed kind of back to his. His normal self. But at the game yesterday with the way we played and obviously the goal getting disallowed, he was back to that. That visible frustration and it's all. It was almost like yesterday. What, what's the point? I. I felt to finish outside the Champions League places on goal difference is going to really, really hurt. It's the worst way not to get something, isn't it? Got goal difference. And I think Villa have had a brilliant season. Champions League. They were a really good addition to the Champions League. Ran PSG really close. It counts for nothing. But we were the only English team to beat psg and they played, I think they play every English team or all but one English team through the tournament this year. They've got to a semi final, not turned up. Lost three zero to Crystal palace. Albeit palace went on and won it and beat Manchester City and then they finished outside the Champions League places on goal difference. So even though they've had a really good season, it's a nearly season and we know that Emery's a winner. He. What he wants to win things. He has won things. It's a great achievement to have Europe three years in a row, but he wants more and with just anything a little bit extra. It could have been what we all dreamed of this season, but yet again it wasn't to be. And Jacob's kind of outside the Villa fair, so I don't know whether he feels this as much as me, but people talk about Spursy and Spurs and you know, they finally won a trophy after. After however many years it was 17, 18 years without a trophy. Villa haven't won anything since 1996. I'm starting to think a Villa spurs should he play Spurs? Should it be ah, we. We Villa to this. I'm starting to think that it should be Villa, not Spurs.

[Dan Bardell]

But what do you say that? Because, you know, I think it's. It's a really interesting one beats one being from. From Birmingham, watching Villa with the financial might they have over a team like Birmingham. They actually haven't brought much silverware in for a very, very long time. And Jacob, I'm just wondering, you know, that, that three minute spell, we spoke about it at the top there, where obviously Rodgers doesn't score and then United go on, Manchester United go on to score. How much does this play into the context of Aston Villa season? Because, you know, Dan does say, look, let's look at it holistically. It's a great season. Villa are back in Europe once again. But you know, I, I looked at a moment where Villa were doing really, really well in the Champions League and just couldn't sustain it in the league. I know they sort of turned it around at the back end, but it was always going to be that jostle, wasn't it? Doing well at the elite competition. But the league position will always suffer.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Yeah, definitely. And I actually asked Emery on his Friday's press conference whether he actually wanted the season to end because most matches at this stage of season quite beleaguered. He was like, ideally we'd have a few more weeks because we felt, you know, up until United game that Villa were peaking at the right time. They had the best league form since the start of March. Defense markedly improved. You know, you're talking about ballads and Chavez league. They kept three clean sheets in the first 28 games. Then after that it was six and eight. They, they improved, you know, measurably. Everything seemed to be clicking. The spoilers back to full fitness bar Marcus Rashford's. So really the Manchester United game was a bit of an anomaly. Apart from the Crystal palace semi final, I think at the start of the season, Villa won six games in, in 21 between September and February. So it's very frustrating. They couldn't quite click into gear in the Premier League. They're having these great nights in the Champions League. They were, you know, fast, they were up tempo, they had these brilliant nights at Villa park, but yet in the league they were limping. And ultimately we can talk about Ahmad's goal, we could talk about Morgan Rodgers, but the drop points, both games against Ipswich, a late equalizer for Bournemouth Brighton. These games early in the season have ultimately cost Villa Champions League place. And yesterday was probably the harshest way to find out.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, for sure. And with that sort of referee decision as well, you know, based on the fact that Villa would have thought they were able to get back into that game. What's this about Villa lodging a complaint in response to that decision? I mean, this is not Real Madrid here. Jacob, you know what's going on here?

[Jacob Tanswell]

Yeah, they've written to the PG Mol asking like, I say queering almost why the referee of his experience was put in charge. Like Emery said, after, when vill afterwards, they accept the referee mistake, but they feel it could have been prevented. There's little reason why they feel in a game of such high stakes that, you know, in their words, the second most inexperienced referee selected on on the weekend was picked to be in charge of that game. So that's why they put the complaint in. I'm, you know, they've spoken to Howard Webb. I'm sure he expresses sympathy. But ultimately it's done, isn't it? Now there's nothing they can achieve.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, for sure. Right? Let's move on because next we'll look at the other flashpoint yesterday, Emi Martinez's red card, and ask could they really part ways with their World cup winning goalkeeper this summer?

[Jacob Tanswell]

You're listening to the Athletic FC Podcast with IO Akinwaleere.

[Unknown]

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[Ayo Akimulere]

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[Raj Panjabi]

Hi, I'm Raj Panjabi from HuffPost.

[Noah Michaelson]

And I'm Noah Michaelson, also from HuffPost.

[Raj Panjabi]

And we're the hosts of Am I Doing It Wrong? A new podcast that explores the all too human anxieties we have about trying to get our lives right.

[Noah Michaelson]

Each week on the podcast, Raj and I pick a new topic that we want to understand better and bring a guest expert on to talk us through how to get it right.

[Raj Panjabi]

And we're talking like legit credible experts.

[Noah Michaelson]

Doctors, PhDs all around superheroes from HuffPost and Acast Studios. Check out Am I Doing it Wrong? Wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Oh, and Hojlund's gonna get there first. Martinez is stranded here and that's a very big moment on this final. And off goes the Aston Villa goalkeeper.

[Jacob Tanswell]

And maybe with him goes the Champions League hopes.

[Dan Bardell]

I mean, look, what was Martinus thinking? Let's be honest. I mean, we. We talk about the disallowed goal, but I mean, that was a key moment in the game. Personally, I probably wouldn't have backed Hoand to score on current form, but, I mean, it's absolute madness.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Jacob is. And you know, the first thing was Matty Cash's poor back path blind passed it backwards. And it kind of summed up Villa in our first half loose and. And pretty terrible in and out of possession. Then Martinez, who you know will keep a high start position, had a choice then. Does he stand there and try and block? Does he retreat quickly? In the end, he, in a typical, you know, brash manner, he just charges out and shoulder barges hland and at that point, you think could a. A keeper of his experience, what he's won, really, you'd hope that he take the. Probably the more mature decision and let him go round and say, okay, try and score. If even if you score, it's 1 nil, you still got 11v11. Second half, Villa would still bat themselves. So it's a rush of blood. Martinez has done it previously his career, but he's been such a brilliant figure at Villa. ESPN has been a model of consistency and what he's always been able to do is find a balance between his charisma, that madness that he has about brilliance as well, and it never having a detrimental impact where this season, especially in the last couple of months, he's just started to tail off slightly and that's coincided with. With uncertainty about his future.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah. Dan, what were you thinking when you. You saw him rush out there? Because he does have a rush of blood from time to time, but I'm just thinking there was no way he thought he would get away with that, surely.

[Ayo Akimulere]

No, look, it's a Stonewall red card, as I've seen. I think it's in the stoppage time at the end of the first half as well. You've got. You've got to use your brain and like Jacob says, I think it is just a complete rush of blood. I don't know how easy this is to do. I'm Not a prime athlete, as people probably know. I just talk about football, but I, I imagine you've got to try and treat Hoyland as if you're a center back and just try and show him outside, jockey him even if you're going to bring him down, at least make it look like you're attempting to play the ball, to just charge at him the way he has. No other decision can be made other, other than a red card and he, he's had to walk. And then Villa have got to completely regroup and play the game with 10 men. It could be the last time, last action ever in a villager. And if it is, it's a, it's a really sad thing because for five, six years he's been absolutely brilliant. And the way I've watched his career grow at Villa, things he's gone on to achieve, he is a club legend. He's the best goalkeeper I've ever seen Villa have. You know, it's always been Mark Bosnic for me, but it is now Emmy Martinez and I think that's going to be the last thing he ever does in a Villa shirt. And if so, that's really, really sad.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, I'll talk about that in a second, Jacob, because I know you've written on this in particular, but you know, from your perspective, Dan, you know, Villa have not got a great record at Old Trafford. So you've got a game that is so key potentially for Champions League football next season. You'd be looking to your senior players there, especially work at winning players, to have a bit of calm, you know, that sets the tone of the game. When your goalkeeper sent off at such a pivotal time in the game, is that disappointing from your perspective as a Villa fan?

[Ayo Akimulere]

I think he's genuinely Villa's only world class player. I don't mean that to be disrespectful to the other players because there's some fantastic players at Villa. But I think Emi Martinez, what he's done, he's the only one you would label as properly world class. And he is a leader in the dressing room and elite leader at the club. You know, he's a big voice at Villa both on and off the pitch. And to see a senior player do that in such a defining game, it's hugely disappointing. But I've come used to seeing strange things at Old Trafford. We can't do anything there. We've never been able to really do anything there in my life. I was working for a different outlet yesterday and was saying that I wasn't confident because it was Old Trafford and people were looking at me like I was genuinely mad and saying what it is. Manchester United. It's the worst Manchester United team ever. But honestly, it doesn't matter. Villa cannot play at Old Trafford. I don't know what the reasoning is. You saw yesterday Manchester United suddenly popping the ball around like 70s Brazil against Villa. They haven't done that all season. At one point they had 79 possession. I was thinking they haven't had 79 possession since the treble year in 1999. Yet Villa are playing against them and they've got it. If we never go there again. I would not. I'd rather we just forfeited the game and not bother traveling every 3 nil. Let's move on. I. I hate the place.

[Dan Bardell]

Oh, man. Okay. Should have asked that question. But, Jacob, let's talk about it. You know, is this the last we see of Emmy Martinez in an Aston Villa shirt?

[Jacob Tanswell]

Potentially, yes. That certainly seems to be a direction of travel. I think you can't rule anything out. And Villa have still got a lot of unknowns into this, heading into this window because of psr, because they've missed out on the Champions League. So you expect the next couple weeks before the June 30 deadline for the picture to become a bit more clearer. But right now it's like Emilio Martinez is one player that Villa, you know, would allow to go for the right price. I think what he does is he solves Villa's two main issues really in terms of psr, where they'll get a good fee for him, and UEFA psr, where they have to reduce the wage bill. Right now it stands at 91%. Next year has to fall below 80. The year after has to fall below 70%. Emi Martinez is the highest earner of any permanent member in that squad. So, you know, he would. His sale would solve both issues. The question is, like Dan said, but Martinez is a world class goalkeeper. Can they replace him? They'll have to go for someone cheaper, less salary. Someone that's probably a little bit more unknown. But there's just a feeling that Martinez would probably want to go as well, especially to Europe. I know there's interest from Saudi from last year, but there's interest in Europe. And maybe at this stage of his career, he's 32. Probably one more big move left in him. Playing in the Champions League consistently for a big club is something that would appeal for him. And I think, in fairness to Emory, I think he would allow that too.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, it's quite disappointing, the potential of losing someone so great for the club. Dan, you know, we talk about what he characterizes and even I as an Arsenal fan, quite salty that he left it because he's gone on to do incredible stuff since leaving Arsenal. You know, his showmanship, his presence, his big saves. You know, he won us an FA cup because he was outstanding in that match. In fact, you know if he leaves, how hard it would be be to find someone at a good price because that's also really important and offer you that level of quality.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Yeah, I think a club like Villa, generally my rule would be you don't sell players that you can't upgrade on. And I don't think Villa will be able to upgrade on Emmy Martinez straight away. They might be able to buy someone that grows into being as good as him, but they're certainly not going to get the finished article and get someone that gives you what Emmy Martinez gives you immediately this summer. I think they're hamstrung a little bit by psr. You know, the rules aren't there to help teams like Villa. It doesn't fail. And you know, last summer they had to sell Douglas Luiz and again this summer they're going to have to sell a big player. There's good goalkeepers out there. I've been looking at Juan Garcia an awful lot Espanol and he looks like he's going to be a top goalkeeper. Every metric you look at for a goalkeeper, he comes out really, really high in the stats and you know, Villenego, for someone like him, he's got room to grow into being a world class goalkeeper. The difficulty is, is that Emi Martinez was walked into Villa when the goalkeeping department had been in flux for five, six years. Really. Villa hadn't had a, a standout number one. He came in, he made it his own, he grew into the role and went on to achieve all the things that he's achieved. The next person coming in, you've got to fill Emmy Martinez's gloves and that's not easy. You know, if we sign a continental goalkeeper, which I think we will, you look at when David De Gea first came to Manchester United, for example, he struggled with the physical change from being in La Liga to being in the Premier League. Despite the fact he was an excellent goalkeeper, Martinez had that experience as well of top level Premier League football, albeit it was at the back end of that, that Covid year for Arsenal. It's going to be really, really hard for anyone to come in and hit the heights that Emmy Martinez has straight away. And goalkeeper is the hardest position to get right. And I think it's the most important position as well because it transmits through the rest. The rest of the team. It's. He's a horrible player to have to try and replace. He really, really is. Because he's that good.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, for sure, right? Next, we'll look at how Villa failing to qualify for the Champions League will impact their summer recruitment plans.

[Unknown]

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[Raj Panjabi]

Hi, I'm Raj Panjabi from HuffPost.

[Noah Michaelson]

And I'm Noah Michaelson, also from HuffPost.

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[Jacob Tanswell]

Brad, you're on mute.

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[Jacob Tanswell]

This is the Athletic FC podcast with IO Akama.

[Dan Bardell]

We are trying to be consistent and demanding in our process and being in Champions League is better because we can have some more money. But being in Europa League, I think we can feel happy and comfortable. We can add for the next season another way for a trophy, another way to share with our supporters. Good moments. Yeah. Jacob, how big is this A sliding doors moment? You know, missing out on Champions League for Villa, especially when it. When it comes to summer plans. You know, it's so interesting when you're making a pitch to sign a player, Champions League football does make it a lot sweeter to come play for you.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Yeah, absolutely. It's massive, really. And just for context, Villa managed to total £100 million from this season's Champions League participation in terms of getting also to the quarterfinals as well. So not having that is going to have a hole in the budget. And Villa have already lost 200 million in the last two end of year accounts. The only way that Villac until revenue catches up with other teams around them can cover for the deficit is through player sales. And they know that they would have to sell regardless of Champions League. But the caliber and the bracket of player they have to sell now is probably a little bit more great. And probably through gritted teeth, they'll have to sell a couple of players. What's good for Villa said they've got a lot of assets, they've got a lot of players that other clubs are interested in. Bukamar. He still hasn't signed a new contract. They've been talks about his contract for a good while. Al progressing. He's been a player that's been waiting to see if Villa got into the Champions League. Luca Dean Ideally, Vida would love to keep two left backs, Lucadine and Ian Matson. Great competition. But from the conversation I've heard is that Villa feel quite unfairly compared to Man United, for example, that they can't stock pile in certain areas. They can't have two quality players competing for the same position because they simply haven't got the finances for it. So Luca Dean, although he's been a really good servant, he's on pretty high salary. He'll have to go. Leon Bailey, Saudi Arabia interest. Jacob Ramsey, Ollie Watkins, all these guys, you know, they might not go, but all their futures are uncertain. So Villa are heading into a summer not really knowing their squad. Emery said that if, if he could and he could have the same squad next year. He would sleep far better. He would love that. But Villa know they have to rejig, they have to revamp and it's going to be a very, very busy window again, like it was in January, like it was in the previous window where they have to navigate psr, they lower the UEFA squad cost rules. They've got to bring and cover the deficit, otherwise they'll get potential point sanctions from the Premier League. So you've got all these things going on whilst trying to follow Emery in terms of. Emery wants the squad to improve every single season. But given that you'll lose, you could potentially be losing Martinez, you could potentially believe in Kamara Rogers, Watkins, one of those guys improving a score when such massive players has to go. It's going to be very difficult.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, Dan, Dan just laid it out there. Some of the potential exits at Villa this summer and you'd think of even Douglas. Louise, you think about Diarbi not too long ago as well. Top, top, top world class players. Does, does it worry you that that's the tightrope you walk as an Aston Villa fan or as a club in that it's so imperative that you get to the top level, otherwise there we then again we have to sell to move to the next level. Surely that, that lack of consistency in and out of every season must be quite tricky to take.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Yeah, it makes life very difficult. And I think the rules are pretty harsh on an upwardly mobile team like Villa that are trying to build and trying to do things properly to challenge the elite and also that have owners that really want to put money in but are hamstrung by the rules themselves. Missed out John Duran there on that list of players. Villa, it's not like they haven't sold anyone. They've sold so many good players for really big money. And I think that was maybe part of the problem in the first half of the season was they'd had to sell players and rejig and they're almost trying to build on, build on the fly and it took time for things to come together and then ultimately it didn't really work and I had to get other players in in January. I'm the same as Emery. If I was told, look, you're going to keep this squad that you've got now, but you're not going to buy anyone. I'd be quite happy with that because I think villa have won eight, eight in their last 10 or something. I'd be really confident with this group of players having a whole season and having a pre season that they'd be able to challenge towards the top. But that's not going to happen now and it might be even worse because they've not got Champions League football. You know, hearing Jacob say there about Kama to say what competition they're in, he's a huge, huge asset, a really underrated player, genuinely one of the best number sixes in, in Europe and such a pivotal part of of how we play. We might lose him now. So I think you can't underestimate how, how big not qualifying for the Champions League is for Villa because there was going to be flux anyway and now as Jacob says, I think there's going to be even more and it's going to be a really difficult summer. And then does that then affect the start of the next season? You know, on the face of it, it two avenues into the Champions League next season might not be a bad thing. You know, the Europa League, you'd have a good chance of winning that. And the Premier League, that would be an exciting season next season. But if you've had to revamp your whole squad again in the summer, it makes the start very, very difficult and to balance everything and to manage everything that comes with that.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, for sure. Rashford and CIO Jacob, you know, coming in, that was a big gamble, wasn't it? And in fairness, it seemed to have paid dividends in the Champions League run because this was a very good run for Villa being back in the Champions League. It was phenomenal. You know, we were all hopeful that Villa could make it into the semi finals or a bit later on, but like they are still big players and there has to be a decision made on whether or not Aston Villa keep them on or just let them go. Is one of those two players likely to stay or do we know what the situation might be? Because there's a huge expense that comes with a player like Marcus Rashford for instance.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Definitely. I think Marco Santo is the more likely to stay. He wants to join. I think Paris St Germain are willing to let him go. It's around £50 million that Aston Villa have to to pay to sign him. And although he's on a big salary, over 200,000, 15 million, they can kind of count as that. And Emery's always been a big admirer and Ascensio has, you know, he's been more influential than Marcus Rushford. He scored more goals, more assists. Although he's kind of tailed off towards the end of the season. He started very well, gave Villa that much needed lift after January and kind of almost sparked this turnaround in form for Rashford. He's is. Wages are astronomical. They blow every other player out the water. And given that Villa are trying to cut the wage bill, it would be quite a paradox. I know everyone is willing to be back into form and there's a lot of goodwill from supporters. He's not been great. He's had moments. Fifteen minutes against Paris Saint Germain in the second leg, a couple of goals, a penalty he's not warranted. Villa spending 40 million pounds on him plus taking on his wage as well. So I don't think that will happen unless there's a huge turnaround in May, like, say that. And Rashford says half the set wage as well, so I think a sensor is more likely. But they've both in different ways, almost their presence has helped Villa in the second half of the season.

[Dan Bardell]

Yeah, I'm going to bring this full circle down and sort of let's finish on this and, and, and do an UNAI Emery as it did yesterday post match and sort of be a bit more diplomatic about things. Villa back in Europe again. Let's, let's not deny that. And you've also got a manager there who is the most successful manager in this competition, surely, regardless of who might be coming in, in or out, Aston VI to take some sort of pride that they've consistently operated at a level which does show a level of progression, some might say, and a competition that they're going in next season where there's a big chance that they can perform really well in.

[Ayo Akimulere]

Yeah, and that's what Villa fans want. They want a trophy. And realistically, Villa have got more chance of winning the Europa League than they have the Champions League. As great as it would have been to be back in that competition, and that is what I still would have wanted. The Europa League with him is a genuine chance at a trophy. Although saying that Crystal palace are going to be in the Europa League and they're another bogey team. So if we play them at any point in the Europa League, but I think there's lots to be proud of. If you just spoke to me yesterday, my head was on mars. It would have been very difficult for me to do a podcast, but I'm a bit more reasoned this morning than I was yesterday. And Europe three years in a row is a really, really good achievement. To be top six is a good achievement. Bearing in mind Villa had to juggle Champions League football for the first time. And, you know, we didn't have the greatest first half of the season with the six wins in 21. I think it was that. That. That Jacob said earlier. Earlier. Emery is the most important man at this football club. You know, I'm talking about not wanting to lose players and players perhaps leaving still unai Emery and all that comes with him is the most important thing at Aston Villa. As long as he's there, I believe they'll be genuinely competitive in. In everything they do. Even with the rules. He's shown that he's a good enough manager to improve players that are there, work out solutions, buy multifunctional players to cover certain positions so that the squad's not too big. You know, he's. He's a genius. And yesterday was not a good day for Aston Villa. But it's important not to lose sight of how lucky we are to have this manager, because I genuinely believe the minute he leaves the football club is when we go back to being what we were before. That's how integral he is to everything that we do. But as long as he's here, there's a chance. And I suppose that's what you want as a football fan, a chance at being the best, at trying to win things and competing towards the top.

[Dan Bardell]

Well, look, spurs finally got a trophy this season and it was the Europa League. So I tell, well, I do fancy Villa next season. And also, Jacob, I know you're off to Villa park to play some football. They've got financial issues. There's a free transfer here waiting to happen. That's all I'm saying, Emory. That's all I'm saying.

[Jacob Tanswell]

They need a center back as well, that's all. He might be there. Who knows?

[Dan Bardell]

He might be watching. All right, gents, thank you so much for your time. Dan, Jacob, and also thank you guys for listening. We'll be back tomorrow.

[Ayo Akimulere]

The Athletic FC podcast network.

[Raj Panjabi]

When the Moore family ditched cable Internet and switched to Zigly Fiber, they got so much more. Mr. Moore got more upload speed for next level gaming and live streaming to the masses. With reliable service, Mrs. Moore is no longer her family's IT guru, leaving her more time to stream games into overtime. Let's go. And young Mason Moore got more done quickly uploading HD product demos and video conferencing. Without freesight, the numbers look good.

[Jacob Tanswell]

Brad, you're on mute.

[Raj Panjabi]

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