How are Man United still spending?

Summary

The Athletic FC Podcast: "How are Man United Still Spending?"
Release Date: June 6, 2025

In this compelling episode of The Athletic FC Podcast, host Adam Leventhal delves deep into Manchester United's surprising transfer activities despite the club's recent struggles and lack of European football participation. Joined by esteemed Manchester United writers Karl Anker and Mark Critchley, the discussion unpacks the financial maneuvers, strategic signings, and internal changes shaping the Red Devils' future.

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1. Manchester United's Transfer Spending Amid Financial Constraints

Adam Leventhal opens the episode by addressing the perplexing scenario of Manchester United continuing significant player acquisitions despite not qualifying for European competitions and finishing near the bottom of the Premier League last season.

Adam Leventhal [02:11]:
"After signing Wolves' Matthias Cunha for £62.5 million, Manchester United have made an opening bid of £55 million to sign Brian Mbumo from Brentford. So with no European football, how are United still drawing the big names? And are they at risk of breaching PSR after their lowest top division finish since 1974?"

2. Financial Rules and PSR Calculations

Karl Anker provides insight into Manchester United's financial standing, highlighting discrepancies in loss calculations between the PLC and Red Football Limited. He emphasizes that excluding certain costs provides United with more financial leeway than previously perceived.

Karl Anker [03:56]:
"We found out that the accounts which serve the basis of their PSR calculation with the Premier League are from a company called Red Football Limited. While the PLC company shows a loss of around £130 million, Red Football Limited reports a much smaller loss of approximately £36 million."

3. Cash Flow and Transfer Strategy

Mark Critchley discusses the critical importance of cash flow in Manchester United's transfer strategy. He explains how the club is attempting to balance financial rules with actual cash availability, leading to staggered spending and installment payments for new signings.

Mark Critchley [04:27]:
"They have got a write a check for £89 million this summer for Anthony Sancho, Casemiro, Hojlund, Onana—players who are already at the club. It's that cash pressure which has been the limiting factor on United's transfer business."

4. Player Signings and Potential Sales

The conversation shifts to the specifics of recent and potential signings. Karl Anker highlights the strategic acquisitions of Matthias Cunha and the interest in Brian Mbumo, noting the challenges United faces in affording these players without significant sales.

Adam Leventhal [08:15]:
"Beyond Cunha and likely Mbumo, players like Rashford, Jadon Sancho, and Alejandro Garnacho might need to be sold to facilitate further signings. However, United's history of poor selling strategies complicates this approach."

5. Impact on Manager Ruben Amarin and Staff Changes

Mark Critchley addresses the departure of Dave Brailsford, Manchester United's Director of Sport, and the promotion of Jason Wilcox to Director of Football. He questions the implications of these changes on the club's strategic direction and transfer dealings.

Mark Critchley [32:13]:
"Dave Brailsford was pivotal in building an elite performance environment at United. His stepping back signals a new phase, but with his departure, the executive team must prove its effectiveness in steering the club towards success."

6. Fan Sentiment and Club Messaging

Karl Anker examines how Manchester United's fanbase is reacting to the club's ambitious transfer activities amidst ongoing financial and performance issues. He suggests that initial signings are intended to restore hope and demonstrate a clear plan to return to European competitions.

Karl Anker [10:28]:
"The quick signing of Cunha and interest in Mbumo suggests that United have some sort of plan to begin sorting things out, offering tentative excitement amidst understandable fan frustration."

7. Statistical Analysis of Player Performance

Conor O'Neill, Data and Tactics writer for The Athletic, joins the discussion to analyze the performance metrics of key signings. He cautions against overreliance on overperformance statistics, emphasizing the importance of sustainable metrics.

Conor O'Neill [19:35]:
"Brian Mbumo has scored 15 non-penalty goals from an xG of 7.6, which is double what was expected. This level of overperformance typically has only a 1% chance of being sustained."

Karl Anker [20:53]:
"When you see a gap of xG and goal scores that's this big, where do you look next? It's vital to ensure that the underlying metrics are solid before building strategies around them."

8. Reshuffling in the Boardroom and Future Outlook

The episode concludes with a critical look at the recent boardroom changes and their potential impact on Manchester United's future. Adam Leventhal poses tough questions about the viability of the new leadership structure and Manager Ruben Amarin's ability to turn the club around.

Karl Anker [36:22]:
"If you are telling me that he was responsible for bringing a footballing structure in a footballing group, I am going to ask you who is the technical director of Manchester United right now?"

Adam Leventhal [42:10]:
"What makes you think that Ruben Amarin is going to make things right next season? Have you got confidence in him, Karl?"

Karl Anker [42:39]:
"Amarin is asking me to believe in him, even though all the previous evidence suggests this might not work out. So is it good me with the person who fixes Manchester United? Well, you have to be, because if you're not, you're not going to be here past Christmas."

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Conclusion

This episode of The Athletic FC Podcast provides an in-depth examination of Manchester United's financial strategies, transfer decisions, and internal restructuring amidst challenging circumstances. With expert analysis from Karl Anker, Mark Critchley, and Conor O'Neill, listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of the complexities facing one of football's most storied clubs. The discussion underscores the delicate balance between ambition and financial prudence, the critical role of effective management, and the ever-present scrutiny from passionate fans.

Notable Quotes:

• Adam Leventhal [02:11]:
  "With no European football, how are United still drawing the big names?"

• Karl Anker [10:28]:
  "The quick signing of Cunha and interest in Mbumo suggests that United have some sort of plan to begin sorting things out."

• Conor O'Neill [19:35]:
  "It's unlikely that they'd be able to sustain that level of finishing."

• Mark Critchley [32:13]:
  "Dave Brailsford was pivotal in building an elite performance environment at United."

• Karl Anker [42:39]:
  "So is it good me with the person who fixes Manchester United? Well, you have to be, because if you're not, you're not going to be here past Christmas."

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This detailed summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, providing valuable information for those who have not listened to the full podcast.

Transcript

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[Podcast Host]

The Athletic FC Podcast Network.

Hi there.

[Adam Leventhal]

Welcome to the Athletic FC Podcast. I'm Adam Leventhal. After signing Wolves matthias cunha for 62.5 million pounds. Manchester United have made an opening bid of 55 million to sign Brian Mbumo from Brentford. So with no European football, how are United still drawing the big names? And are they at risk of breaching PSR after their lowest top division finish since 1974? Well, joining me today we have the Athletics Manchester United writers Karl Anker and Mark Critchley. It is great to see you both. Carl, let me start with you. We'll come on to how this spending is possible financially. But first, Manchester United. No European football. Really poor side last season. How are Manchester United still attracting these players? I'm confused.

[Karl Anker]

I am confused as well. It seems like this is Manchester United we're talking about. Still has a degree of cachet on talk of the Devils earlier this week. And last week I said Manchester United ideally want players with a bit of ego and a little bit delusional. And part of the pitch is a bit similar to the pitch the New York Knicks make to players of. Yes, okay, we've not won a title in however many years. Look at all these athletes who failed. Look how revered and legendary you'd become if you were the one to fix things. And it seems that that pitch is working. Or the talk of the fabled Manchester United project seems to have some sort of appeal. I'm not sure if I was a 24 year old football player with both my knees still working and good hamstrings. It worked for me. But hey, if it's working for certain individuals, why not?

[Adam Leventhal]

Chris, let me come on to you. Many clubs do this. United are going to stagger their transfer spending in installments over the years. They have still on a tab £300 million worth of money that they owe for players that are on their books. Didn't Sir Jim Radcliffe say something about going bust by Christmas if there weren't cost cutting measures? And now they're scheduled to spend £100 million on two players. Make this make sense.

[Podcast Host]

I'll try my best. I've been trying to make sense of this all week and I think I've just about managed it. So what I always come back to with this is I was talking to somebody in football once and I was like, how, how do clubs work this? When you're a club in the transfer window, I was told you're essentially trying to ride two horses at one time. It sounds quite painful. I would probably tear something if I tried that myself. But essentially one horse is called financial rules and the other horse is called cash, which is a much nicer name for a horse than financial rules. But I want to focus on financial rules for a minute. That's psr, ffp, all these things we talk about on a daily basis with not just United, but all clubs now. Right? So you have these financial rules and you often hear now, well, this club has. They can spend 100 million on PSR and they'll be fine. They've got this much headroom, 100 million headroom. It's all well and good having 100 million headroom. You need to have 100 million cash or the ability to pay out transfer fees in 100 million cash over instalments in order to spend 100 million still. Right, there's the two things at the same time. And to come back to United, we did a story this week about United's PSR situation, myself and my colleague Chris Weatherspoon, where we'd found out that the accounts which serve the basis of their PSR calculation with the Premier League are from a company called Red Football Limited. Now, people will be aware that United have lost a lot of money over the last five years, something like 300 odd million. But that figure comes from the PLC company, which is listed in New York on the New York Stock Exchange. If you look at Red Football Limited, which is listed in the uk, then it's a much, much smaller loss, essentially, especially last season. I think you're talking 130 million at the PLC level and it's more like 36 million for Red Football Limited. That's because essentially one of the main things was the costs that were associated with Sir Jim Ratcliffe's transaction last year, his minority investment. They weren't included in Red Football Limited, so they were essentially left out of United's PSR calculation. That means they have a lot more room than a lot of us thought beforehand, than a lot of us have been talking about for the last year, 18 months. Right. But the other thing is cash. Cash is really critical. And that is what Ratcliffe was talking about in that interview when he said we could have gone bust by Christmas if, hypothetically, if we hadn't taken action and gone through the cost measures that we put through. It's also, you might remember in that interview as well, he said, as you mentioned there, we've got a write a check for £89 million this summer for Anthony Sancho, Casemiro, Hojlund, Onana players who are already at the club. It's that cash pressure which has been the reason, the limiting factor, if you like, on United's Transfer business. And you even see that in these moves. Right. I know everybody's looked at Cunha this week. They've looked at the Mbumo interest, they've said, how are United affording this? We know from the Cunha negotiation that United wanted to pay that, in fact, installments and spread that out because they want to spread the cash out this summer and do as much business as they can now rather than spending it immediately. Wolff said, no, you have to meet the clause in Kunyu's contract and they're paying it over three instalments, over two years instead. But I think that shows that of these two horses that they're trying to ride at one time, sure, one's going okay, but they're a little bit stretched out on the other. And that's the problem that they have.

[Adam Leventhal]

Essentially, and presumably the. They need to sell and they have assets. I mean, you listed a few of them there. Some people might argue whether Antony is an asset or something else, but they have got players that they can sell, but there's pressure to sell them and that is going to be difficult, isn't it? Rashford, for example.

[Podcast Host]

Exactly, yeah. So I think going into this window there was the sense that United will be able to do Cunha, certainly. They're obviously interested in Liam the Lapp as well. Those are two players with fixed release clauses totaling about 90 million. They were able to get those over the line without sales if necessary. Beyond that, I think it becomes a little bit of a stretch and clearly Brian and Boomer's a bit. The asking price is a bit higher than Liam Delap, so I think they'll be able to get that far. Once you get to that point, I think they need to start looking at sales in order to do more business. You mentioned Rashford there. There was that 40 million release clause, well, sort of clause within the loan to Aston Villa. I think United would be looking for a similar price. Jadon Sancho, he's going to be coming back to the club now. They've got 5 million Chelsea as a loan fee, essentially, but they'd still be looking for, I don't know, 25, 30 million there. Alejandro Garnacho is somebody that we haven't mentioned and has been effectively told to go and find a new club and is somebody that might be able to attract a slightly higher fee, who's probably got a higher market value than some of the players who've been on the fringes. I think we're not quite at that stage yet in terms of the Kunjured and Boomob deals. But once we get to the point beyond that, and United do have a lot of work to do in this window, they're going to need to try and scrimp around and sell better because traditionally this is the club that really hasn't sold that well at all. I think last summer was the most that they've recouped in transfer fees since they sold Cristiano Ronaldo to Real Madrid for a world record fee in 2009. And even then it was only about, you're talking about 36 million, really not that much. So they need to get better at selling players and that's going to be critical this summer.

[Adam Leventhal]

We'll talk about how they're reshuffling things once again in the boardroom in the director's box a little bit later on and how that might impact the transfer dealings and stuff. But Carl, let me just come to you on how the supporters are feeling about this. Obviously, yeah, United are seemingly being ambitious in the transfer market, but at the same time, I don't want to go to Critch's two horse analogy, but yes, you have ambition, but you also now have, you know, you've got redundancies, which is a very serious matter. You've got ticket prices going up as well. Are you confused in terms of the messaging that the priority at the club.

[Karl Anker]

That's a good question. I think the early moves in the transfer market and particularly to address situations in number 10 position and the profiles of the players United seem to be interested in so trying to get players that already have Premier League experience. So there's a reduced onboarding process for any new signing, that suggests to me that whatever United want to do this summer, it's about getting back into Europe as soon as possible. So if you are one of the Manchester United fans that took planes, trains and automobiles to get to Bilbao and was heartbroken and disappointed and thought, oh my goodness, it could be a long time in the wilderness. The current nine days of business at Manchester United feels like a message from the club trying to reissue you, saying don't worry that the 2526 season is just going to be one blip without European football and we will be straight back in there. I think when David Onstein reported that Brian Mbumo from Brentford was open to going to Manchester United, that shifted the needle from despair into excitement just a little bit, because I think In Bumo is a fantastic football player and he could be quite transformative to Manchester United's attack as well. So I suppose this is tentative excitement. There are very, very good reasons for Manchester United fans to be annoyed and saddened and wondering what on earth is going on. But the very quick signing of Cunha and interest in Bumo suggests that United have some sort of a plan as to go about beginning to sort this out.

[Adam Leventhal]

Mark, from the view of people outside of the club, when you see a club spending big on players, it's almost a reinforcement of the fact that they're backing their manager to get the goodness out of these players as well. So what you're hearing, everyone's fully, fully behind Ruben Amarim and it's not going to turn sour as it did with erik10hag, you know what, five months into the season or whatever it was.

[Podcast Host]

Well, look, that's been the consistent message before the Europa League final. After the Europa League final, that's been the line that Reuben Ammon is the person to lead the club forward and the hierarchy. Still absolutely believe in that. I think everybody would agree that he needs to be given the opportunity to actually have a transfer window and be able to adapt the squad to his methods, because this is quite a gear shift that United are doing right that mid season they brought in a manager who plays a very different system with very specialist and specific roles that aren't totally tailored to the squad as it is right now. I think despite the fact that it was a horrendous six months or so and resulted in United's lowest ever Premier League finish, he still needs to be given the opportunity and the support in the transfer market in order to turn things around. And I think most people would agree with that. I think the concern you might have, I guess, is that is one transfer window going to be enough to do the necessary work if we're going to arrive at a point again at the start of next season where the pressure is going to be on from the first kick on a United manager as we were last season with Erik Ten Hag, as you rightly referenced. Is that really fair on Amarim, given the scale of the task that is needed here, given the financial restraints that we're talking about as well? I know we're all assuming that there's none this week just because they're moving early and making signings. But United, the last three windows, have spent £200 million, right? Cunha and Mbuomo takes you up to about 120 and we're saying they need sales to go further than that. So it's not absolutely guaranteed that he's going to receive. Amarim is going to receive the same level of support that 10HAG has before that, even Sochio before that. Right. So are we going to get to a point where the pressure is going to be on, as Amren's admitted it will be after the way this season ended and we're still not quite at the point where you can truly say that it's his squad. I think looking forward into next season, I can already see that being a talking point in September, October, November if United don't start.

[Karl Anker]

Well, I think this is just. This is just part of the course for every post Ferguson manager. It's very hard to make the argument that any post Ferguson manager managed to get their squad due to various snafus in the transfer market and missing some of their preferred targets. We know Ole Gunnar Solskjaer wanted Declan Rice and was interested in Jack Grealish and may have whispered something in Nathan Ake's ear when Ake was at Bournemouth. We know very well that Erik Ten Hag didn't want to sell Scott McTominay and did want to bring in Harry Kane. However, you couldn't afford Harry Kane because you spent 60 million on Casimiro in the previous summer. So I do not think we are going to get into August and say this is Ruben Amarin's squad and this is built to Ruben Amren's needs. However, I don't think that's a proper barometer for any Manchester United manager because every single Manchester United manager has to have pressure. That's part of the job title. You can't be a Manchester United manager not to be under pressure because Manchester United are one of the biggest football clubs in the world. And when you go, as long as this club is going without winning the Premier League or a Champions League, you will eventually run into at least two press conferences next season where a journalist goes how long do you think it's going to take for the 21st Premier League title to be deluded because the clock is always ticking?

[Adam Leventhal]

You almost said this is Manchester United football club in the wild there. Very, very close to saying it, which I was going to enjoy. But you just turned away at the end after the break as we just turn away briefly, we are going to be joined by Data and Tactics writer Conor o' Neill to discuss how Kunya and Mbumo will fit into Amarim system.

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[Adam Leventhal]

Just a quick reminder before we kick on that we want to be hearing from you. There is a link in the podcast description and we want your feedback on this very show. What content have you enjoyed the most? What would you like us to be doing differently for next season? So do get involved help shape the future of of the Athletic FC podcast. That podcast description is there for you now. We have been joined on board by the Athletics Data and Tactics writer Conor o' Neill. Thanks very much for coming on Conor. So you've got a new piece out on the Athletic and you've written about Kunha and Mbumo as players who have statistically overperformed in recent seasons. That's a great sign.

[Conor O'Neill]

Well, yes, obviously scoring more goals is always a good thing, but there is a caveat with how unlikely that is, how you will over form by the levels that they have. Particularly in Bumo, who has scored 15 non penalty goals from an XG of 7.6, which is essentially double what he should have been expected to score. From those quality of chances, the models would give that level of overperformance just a 1% chance of happening repeatedly so into the future. It's unlikely that he'd be able to sustain that level of finishing. So while obviously it's good how clinical he's been, it should be taken with a pinch of salt how much they've overperformed their underlying statistics. And I think it leans into, you know, a concern that United's data departments are looking at purple patches rather than sound underlying metrics.

[Karl Anker]

Connor, I know when we often do the big number crunching and pull the big lever before we get our results, there's certain ingredients we try to look into before we make our secret sauce. So traditionally the big one they talk about in XG over performance is that Messi is pretty much the only one who season on, season on, season on, season on season outstrips his xg, whereas everyone else eventually reverts to the mean. So when you see a gap of XG and goal scores that that's this big, where do you want to look next?

[Conor O'Neill]

I think it's important to recognize that goals themselves do have value. The expected models cannot include every possible aspect of the goal. Like, you know, shooting depends on body positioning, distance where the goalkeeper is ball speed, ball height, and no model can perfectly encapsulate that exact shot. So there is value in looking at the goals themselves. But I think in the case of these two players, the underlying metrics are good. So I think there's been a lot of noise about the over performance, but that detracts from, well, it's from a high base, it's not overperforming from an XG of 2. Their underlying numbers are very good. Acuna's created around 9XG this season, which is higher than any United player. And it's important to note that XG itself is not the only thing that scouts or data departments would look at.

[Adam Leventhal]

Now Carl, I saw you on another podcast this week with a little tactics board out. I'm not necessarily expecting you to fold one out of your top pocket right now and do the same, but can you just explain exactly how Kunya and Mbumo are going to fit into Ruben Amarim's style? And there may well be more signings obviously, but are these the right jigsaw pieces for his 343 that everyone's been banging on about and everyone's been giving him so much slack because he hasn't had the right players etc.

[Podcast Host]

Etc.

[Karl Anker]

Well, it seems like Kunha is going to go straight into the left hand position while Garnacho Rashford and sometimes Joshua Zerksy have been used in that position. They don't necessarily have the, shall we call it, trickery when they're carrying the ball that Kunha has Oren has had throughout all of last season and carry the ball over long distances, which is something Amarant likes from his left side at 10. He's also fond of shooting from outside the box. There was a point where Man United had a lot of players who were good at shooting from outside the box and then that dropped off. So that's what he's going to bring. If I think it's really important here to say if because this Mbumo conversation is right at the start this we're we're nowhere near white smoke at this point in time. This is the opening talks and it appears to be some lowballing in terms of offers and there's loads of talk about contracts here. But if Brian nboom arrives, his best position will be as the right sided 10. I asked Amarin after United got past Athletic Club in the Europa League what sort of characteristics he wanted to strengthen and he specifically mentioned the right side of 10 and he specifically said it's for a right sided turn. It's important if you have a left foot Mburma is naturally left footed, he said, because it's really useful if you can go inside and you can go outside. Now the interesting wrinkle there is one of your options for right sided turn already is Ahmad who is left footed as well there. So he's maybe Amren is looking to go double lefty on that side of the field. We shall see if you are getting Kunya and Mbumo. That means Bruno Fernandes will move from one of the number 10 positions into Central midfield which then will have a knock on effect onto the other central midfield who's playing next to Bruno Fernandes which also have a knock on effect to your wing backs and etc, and etc and etc. They don't have the unlimited money glitch and they're trying to ride two horses at the same time and I don't know if they have another horse called negotiating with De Laurentiis. So they're going to have to get really creative there. There are a number of errors that Manchester United need to implement prove on in this transfer window. The difficulty is those areas are all of them. All of them.

[Adam Leventhal]

But that's interesting Karl, because look, I think a lot of people will see these two signings, Kunya and Mbumo, you know, coming over the hill. They'll go. If there are other Premier League supporters of other teams, they go yeah, yeah, I'd have them in my team. I think they would probably make most teams better or at least have a positive impact on. On most teams. And that has Critch sort of been a bit of a rarity in terms of Manchester United's recent business.

[Podcast Host]

Well, I think the jury's probably still out on the last window last summer. I think if you looked at the summer before now, certainly Rasmus Hojlund's had incredibly difficult year this second season syndrome, sort of. You could probably say the same in parts for Andre Onana. Mason Mount picked up towards the end, started to get game time. I think that could be. He could be. I don't want to say like a new signing but you know what I mean when, when I'm going down that road here next season given that given his injury problems but that summer in particular again you're talking upwards of about. I think that was towards 180 million spend on three players and two of them, you know, at the moment you wouldn't say that they've got long term futures at the moment. And then the summer before that was obviously Erik Ten Hag's first a lot of money spent on the likes of Casemiro, Anth, Lisandro, Martinez. Look, you could probably make an argument now that certainly Martinez and even maybe Casemiro, given the way he came on towards the end of the season, not, not disastrous signings, but in all of those windows, the level of spend has been so far beyond what the returns that United have got from those players that there's an argument that they just haven't really been that successful. You see a sort of shift in focus certainly at the start of this window you just mentioned there. Right. Premier League players only mount, really, of the ones that I previously mentioned had had Premier League experience and was playing in the Premier League at that time. It's kind of a double sided coin that. Right. I think managers, executives, they like Premier League experience plays because they've seen them do it and they know that they're up to the standard of the league. You can certainly say that about MBMO and Kunya. I'm reading Ian Graham's book How to Win the Premier League at the moment and there was a section in there where he talks about this specifically and says, yeah, managers and executives love that, but they come with the premium, they come with a price tag. And maybe United, I mean Kunya had the release clause like we mentioned and so it was a relatively simple deal to do in those terms. Bumo doesn't. And everything that we were talking about earlier in the show about how not just the fee but how United structure these payments, that could be a bit of an obstacle and a bit of a roadblock. Like Kyle says, we're nowhere near white smoke at the minute yet. So let's not get too far ahead of ourselves. The two players who performed, performed brilliantly in the Premier League last year. Maybe slightly over overperformed as we've been saying, but I agree with Conor, absolutely. The underlying numbers were very good for the teams that they were playing for. These are two of the better attackers in the league last season. That's going to come with a premium. It's not like Liverpool did shopping for your Andy Robertsons or your Genie White albums or players who are relegated and were therefore unappreciated. It's players who everybody knows are very good and are going to cost a bit of money. And so I think that is the slight caveat to this business. Getting Premier League experience is going to cost you.

[Adam Leventhal]

Connor, from your point of view, how do you think that they are going to potentially have to change the way in which they play? Because they were big fish in, in smaller ponds and, and Mbumo's career, if you look at it over the last couple of years in particular, he was playing, you know, best supporter actor role to Ivan Tony year after year and people were thinking, oh, when they lose Tony, is he going to be able to step up? And he, he more than achieved that. So they're going to probably want to come in and go, no, no, I'm the, I can be the main guy again. But are they going to have to sort of adapt their approaches a little bit?

[Conor O'Neill]

Yeah, I think so to a degree. As the saying goes, there is only one ball and they can't all be the guy to end moves, create moves. So there is going to be a little scale back of that. But I don't think it's necessarily a problem for a team as creatively bereft as United in the first place. I think it's more about growing the chance creation pie rather than how it's divided. Bruno Fernandes contributes a huge amount of United's chance creation, but that's because they create so little and that's a similar story to a degree with Cunha Wolves. So I think adding those three players is only going to make them better overall and probably will reduce each individual's proportional impact. I think a similar example would be Jack Grealish to Man City, Obviously the main man, Talisman and Aston Villa. But when he went City, when you actually look at his underlying numbers, they didn't actually change much. He wasn't the only contributor anymore. He was in a team of lots of good creative assets and I think that's what United want to head towards. Rather than worrying about who specifically is creating the chances more that they are.

[Adam Leventhal]

Being created, we're going to say thank you and wave goodbye to Conor. Thank you very much for your insight on the show. And next we're going to be talking about that reshuffle in the boardroom once again at the theater of dreams.

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[Adam Leventhal]

So Mark and Karl are still with me. So Dave Brailsford. He's not really with Manchester United anymore because he's going to be relinquishing his day to day role at the club, returning to act as Director of Sport for ineos what does that mean, Mark? What has he been doing? And does it matter that he's now stepping back?

[Podcast Host]

Well, look, I think whenever you want to know what someone's been doing all day, you better ask their boss. Right. And if you asked Jim Ratcliffe, then he would say that Dave Brailsford had been building an elite performance environment. This is what he said the role was about. What does that mean? We always. High performance, elite performance. I don't think it's just getting up at 5am and drinking a barocca and writing a to do list. I think especially at Manchester United, there's a lot more involved in that and we can joke about marginal gains and things like that. And it's often. It's become a bit of a cliche to talk about that with Brailles, with plumper pillows, et cetera. I think that sort of misunderstands the position that United were in when Ratcliffe came in. And when Brailsford came in, he was very prominent, more prominent in the initial period, in the early months under Ratcliffe, even before the actual investment had been finalised, he was in shaking people's hands at Carrington, trying to understand how the club works, how the club ticks. And it was bigger picture stuff than these marginal gains. Right. The focus very much was on putting together the structure, the executive process that people have long said United lacked. And to be fair. Right, okay. We can, we can say that whether it's worked or not, there's a debate there absolutely whether it's been successful. But him and Ratcliffe hired Berarda very quickly, within, within a month, even before, like I say, the, the, the investment was finalized. Brailford was leading on. Ashworth's appointment didn't work out in the end. Maybe that's another stick to beat him with. But hey, Ashworth as well and Jason Wilcox. And so that there was, that there was the investment that we've seen at Carrington. £50 million, a new men's training building that's set to open this summer. It was. His role was overlooking bigger picture stuff. But I think even Dave Brails being the guy who's. With his track record, he was, from what you hear, he was also perhaps involving himself in a little too much, perhaps trying to do too much and therefore not achieving as much as he'd like. That is sort of noise that you sometimes get back as well. If you ask about what led to this decision this week, what you'll hear is that now that executive team is in place, it's been 18 months it's time for Dave to step away and return to the wider portfolio in EOS Sport. Look, you can take that as red if you like, and take them at the word. I think also people would have to admit that this past 18 months, it hasn't been plain sailing, has it? And I think now, with him slightly removed from the picture, his legacy essentially will be decided by how this executive team that he's put in place fares and how it performs. You also saw that simultaneously, Jason Wilcox has been given a new role as Director of Football, which is slightly different from his slightly different previous one as Technical director, although he has been fulfilling many of those responsibilities with him and Omar Berarda now sort of leading forward and going forward in terms of the football operations. I think this is. You know, I feel like we've said this before, but this is where the INEOS era, if you like, starts in earnest. Now it's their appointments in the building at the top of the football structure, and we're going to have to see how it performs.

[Adam Leventhal]

What's your take on this, Cole? Because it seems sort of a constant stream of changes, but you have to give them their credit. And if you sort of dig into what Mark has said there, that Sir Dave Brailsford's initial role was looking at bigger picture, get this project done, maybe oversee the training ground stuff and then step back. So it's not. It's not that big a deal that he's gone and now Jason Wilcox is the Director of Football and maybe this is going to be the solid footing that they need.

[Karl Anker]

Mark Critchley, you are a nicer man than me. You are a better man than me, Adam Leventhal, I do not have to give them credit for that. I just have to point at the Premier League table and go 15th.

[Adam Leventhal]

That is on the pitch. We know clearly. And I'm not. Look, it matters not to me whether Manchester United finish 15th or come and join my team, Watford, in the championship. I could not give a jot. However, if you are coming into a club which is seemingly, and we've seen the very symbolic emblem of a club that is in turmoil with that leaky roof. If you're going into a club whose infrastructure needs a rethink, and Sir Dave Brailsworth came in and helped with that, then that's more sort of future proofing rather than making sure that they've got a better team on the pitch.

[Karl Anker]

Okay, then I'm putting this previous season's Premier League table in front of you and going eighth. And then putting the 15th there and going, huh? If you are telling me that he was responsible for bringing a footballing structure in a footballing group, I am going to ask you who is the technical director of Manchester United right now?

[Podcast Host]

There isn't one now because Jason Wilcox has become director of football.

[Karl Anker]

Okay, great structure, great structure.

[Podcast Host]

But there wasn't a sporting director before that as well.

[Karl Anker]

Look, so Dave Brailsford had a very prominent role at Manchester United and he never had a job title, never an official job title. He was a board member at Manchester United and we're talking about. He's stepping aside from his day to day duties. He did not have a job title. He was said to wield a large, seemingly free form influence at one of the world's biggest football clubs. And the degree of accountability there is again nebulous.

[Adam Leventhal]

But did he not simply have an greater sporting expertise than Sir Jim Radcliffe?

[Karl Anker]

Is that the criteria? Is that the criteria to be to have that much power, one of the biggest football clubs?

[Adam Leventhal]

Well, if he's the guy that works for Sir Jim Radcliffe, then I guess so.

[Karl Anker]

That is not a good enough criteria to wield that much power, that much stretchy power at a football club that has designs upon winning a Premier League and winning a Champions League eventually.

[Adam Leventhal]

It's a very interesting debate and I just want to put on record I'm playing devil's advocate here. I have no Sir Dave Brailsford skin in the game. Look, as we said before, and I think what has become very apparent to Sir Jim Radcliffe and his team of whoever it is, is that unpicking the saw, the scab that is Manchester United is going to mean that there's a lot of blood shed and it's going to take a lot of time to mop that up and get that wound back in control once again. Anyway, let's talk about a brighter future. Let's hope that Jason Wilcox and Omar Berarda have lots of band aids at hand. They're going to be leading football operations. Are you feeling confident in any way, shape or form about that, Mark? I'll let Carl simmer down.

[Podcast Host]

No, I think. I think Carl's passion is a good thing.

[Adam Leventhal]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And look, I think Carl Mason. Perfectly acceptable point, like good points. I agree with a lot of them. Right. I don't think you'd look at what has happened over the last 18 months and necessarily have a lot of confidence that it's going to improve. Right. But I think you're right as well, Adam, in the fact that it's a scab. That's going to bleed a lot. Right. And we've known that. And the bleeding would last longer than 18 months and there's potential for it to last quite a long time and for only the work that's being done over the last 18 months to bear fruit later on. Berarda and Wilcox, look, I think both of them know each other very well. They have a strong relationship because they've obviously got that shared history at Manchester City. Jason Wilcox was academy director there. Berarda was the coo. He was also heading up football operations for a time as well. So they've got that relationship. Wilcox, very strong relationship with Amarim. In his technical director role, he was a bit more of a sort of bridge between the executives and the coaches. Director of football, it's different. Right. It's going to be more focused on recruitment. But then that has already been a big element of his work already. Both before Ashworth came in because they needed somebody to do that, and then after Ashworth went, those gaps needed to be filled and he was doing a lot of the work there. It's not a role that he's done, I guess, since he was at Southampton. Right. As Kyle will know. Well, having covered them in the past as well, his track record there, I mean, they were a championship side.

[Adam Leventhal]

Yep.

[Podcast Host]

Got relegated from the Premier League, parachute payments, etc, came up through the playoffs. They've gone straight back down the following season. Look, it's not, it's. It's not the sort of CV that would make you a shoe in at one of the biggest clubs in the world for this, for such an important role. So I think it's going to be a real test of his credentials and his responsibilities this, this summer. But he's made an impression and that's clearly why he's been given this heightened role. If you like, you could call it even a promotion over the last 18 months. He's made, he, he's made an impression. Berarda, he's somebody who, yeah, like I said, he was on. He's, he's, he's the CEO, but he has that experience of working on the football side as well. At City, he was doing, he was, you know, across negotiations, logistics over contracts and transfers. I think if you remember watching that Amazon documentary when they signed, hey, Rick Laporte, he's the guy room with him, making sure that it all goes well. So he's a chief executive that can contribute to the football side. He was the driving force behind Amarim's appointment. So he's got that influence he's got that sway with the higher ups with Ratcliffe. I think we should also mention Christopher Vivelle as well, actually. Director of recruitment. He was interim last summer again to sort of fill some of the gaps that were while Ashworth was on gardening leave, etc. He's made a real impression. He's been made permanent. He's going to be one of those that's sort of heading up negotiations and contract stuff over the summer, alongside, of course, Matt Hargreaves. He's the director of football negotiations as well. So that's the kind of core four recruitment team. Ideally, from United's perspective, it's such an important summer that you wouldn't be going in with a fresh leadership structure again. But that's the spot that they're in and we're going to have to see how it shakes out.

[Adam Leventhal]

Now, I'm going to give Carl the final word on this and I'm not going to say that we have to end on a positive step, but let's just talk about the guy who is going to have the biggest influence on getting Manchester United playing better, and that's Ruben Amarim. His record has been poor for Manchester United. What makes you think that he is going to make things right next season? Have you got confidence in him, Karl?

[Karl Anker]

It took me 14 hours to get from Manchester Bilbao for the Europa League final. And after that dismal performance, Amren said to fans, I have nothing to show right now that I am the person he asked for. Faith. I already used white smoke, so I'm going to go all in on my Catholic mentions here. So there's that lovely bit in conclave where Ralph Fine's character says, faith requires uncertainty to believe even though you're not. Not truly certain. Amren's asking me to believe in him, even though all the previous evidence suggests this might not work out. So is it good me with the person who fixes Manchester United? Well, you have to be, because if you're not, you're not going to be here past Christmas. So here we go.

[Adam Leventhal]

Yeah. Okay. I thought you might end positively, but it didn't happen.

[Podcast Host]

No chance.

[Adam Leventhal]

Carl, thank you very much indeed.

[Karl Anker]

Sorry.

[Adam Leventhal]

And Mark, thank you very much to you.

[Podcast Host]

Thank you guys. Loved it. Thanks.

[Adam Leventhal]

Yeah, that was good fun. Thanks to Carl, thanks to Mark, thanks to Connor as well earlier on. Thank you very much for listening and we will be back on Monday. We'll see you then.

[Podcast Host]

You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroo and Jay Beal. The executive producer was Aiden Moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free. Search for the Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. The Athletic FC podcast is an athletic media company production.

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