Podcast Summary: The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode: How much time will Ange get at Forest?
Date: October 9, 2025
Host: Ayo Akinwolere
Guests: Paul Taylor (Nottingham Forest writer), Charlie Eccleshare (Ange Postecoglou/Spurs reporter)

Episode Overview

This episode explores the troubled start of Ange Postecoglou’s tenure as Nottingham Forest manager, analyzing why things went awry so quickly, what's different from his previous stints, and how long he should be given to turn things around. The conversation touches on fan expectations, boardroom dynamics, squad adaptation, and the practicalities of managing high ambitions with limited time.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ange’s Dismal Start at Forest

Statistical Low: Ange Postecoglou has had the worst start of any Forest manager in a century, with seven games yielding five defeats and two draws. (02:04)
Not Just Bad Luck: Paul Taylor notes things could've gone differently in close matches (e.g., Real Betis), but overall “there have been some small moments where things might have been different,” while not discounting the seriousness of the poor start. (03:02)

2. Patterns from Previous Jobs

Historically Slow Starters: Charlie Eccleshare points out Ange’s habit of starting slowly at new clubs, with Spurs being the only notable exception. “Spurs was actually a big outlier because he started really well... but that's the exception rather than the rule.” (04:04)
Recurring Criticisms: Defensive frailties and set-piece weakness—issues at Spurs—have immediately resurfaced at Forest. Paul Taylor: "All the fears that Forest fans had about Ange Postecoglou and his football are all evident straight away." (05:24)

3. The Problem of Context: Successor to a Beloved Figure

Replacing Nuno Espirito Santo: Unlike typical appointments following failure, Ange replaced a “hugely popular and very successful manager at Nottingham Forest” (Nuno), making the transition doubly hard for players and fans. (05:24, 08:20)
Style Change: Forest’s identity as a defensively robust, counterattacking side has been lost, replaced by a more open, risky approach that hasn’t yet produced results. (05:24)

4. The Players and Dressing Room Dynamics

No ‘Anti-Ange,’ But Still ‘Pro-Nuno’: Transition has been difficult as Nuno was seen as a “father figure” for many. Adjustment is less about opposition to Ange and more about losing a deep bond with the previous manager. (08:20)
Huge Adaption Required: Players are asked to shift styles rapidly with very little runway—a “massive” jump, especially without the benefit of a full preseason. (10:06, 10:57)

5. Ownership, Recruitment, and Hierarchy Tension

Boardroom Drama: Edu’s arrival as head of football led to tension with Nuno, mainly over the pace of recruitment and a missed opportunity for squad cohesion in preseason.
Nuno’s Outspokenness: Nuno’s public criticism of ownership was essentially a “him or me” ploy—one that backfired. (12:14)
Ambitions and Disconnect: Owner Marinakis’ lofty aims—setting a Europa League win as the bar—have added pressure and may have contributed to instability. (11:58, 26:27)

6. Press Conference Persona & Media Perception

Ange’s Bullishness: Ange’s combative tone at press conferences reflects both his nature and his conviction, but can make it “harder to warm to” for Forest fans, especially when results aren’t there. (17:52)
Quote Machine vs Substance: “As Charlie mentioned, from a media point of view, from a selfish journalist's point of view, he's great at handing out lines... But just gets back to the same point, doesn't it? It’d be nice to be talking about a win.” (20:54)
Media Darling to Caricature: Early in his Spurs stint, media lauded Ange’s attacking football. That quickly shifted when results faded, making him susceptible to caricature in defeat. (22:14)

7. How Much Time Should He Get?

Too Soon to Judge? Discussion draws parallels to managers like Ruben Amorim being given three years at Sporting: Why not take the longer view?
Social Media Discontent: Despite only four Premier League games, “social media is dark when it comes to Ange Postecoglou. There's fans just calling for him to go already.” (24:24)
High Expectations Post-Nuno: Marinakis wants trophies, and that ambition is now the bar by which Ange is being judged. (26:27)

8. Can Forest Afford a Slow Burn?

Danger of Sacrificing League for Europe: At Spurs, Ange succeeded in Europe but at the cost of domestic results. Can Forest live with that tradeoff if it means league underperformance? (27:59, 29:19)
Financial and PSR Pressures: Sacking managers is expensive, and multiple changes could have off-field ramifications as well. (36:13)
Replacement Lined Up First: Marinakis prefers to have new managers ready before sacking the old—expect speculation to precede any managerial decision. (40:19)

9. Fan Disconnection and Tipping Point

Biggest Blow: European Home Defeat: Heavy fan frustration greeted the home loss to Midtjylland—“the worst of the lot” and a symbol of how far vibes have fallen since Nuno. (32:24)
Recent Record: Postecoglou has lost 18 of his last 26 Premier League games, raising legitimate doubts about his capacity to get results in England. (33:57)
Short-Term vs Long-Term: Ultimately, Ange needs wins now just for survival—he can't afford to play a long game. (36:13)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Paul Taylor on the fine margins:
“There have been moments where things might have gone differently and he might have got that first win just to settle the nerves... It has been bad, it has been a situation that's left him in peril and fighting to keep his job. But there have been small moments where things might have been different.” (03:02)
Charlie Eccleshare on Ange’s pattern:
“Typically, if you look at a club like Celtic, his job performance before Spurs was similar to what's happening at Forest now. And that Ended up being a big success, but started really slowly.” (04:04)
Paul Taylor on legacy pressure:
“The same problems that hung over him at Spurs, the good football not bringing results, the defensive fragility, the weakness from set pieces, they're all there for people to see. All the fears that Forest fans had about Ange Postecoglou and his football are all evident straight away.” (05:24)
Paul Taylor on player adaption:
“He wasn't just a manager to a lot of these players. He was like a father figure to some of them...the biggest adaption they've got is losing that he's gone.” (08:20)
Ayo Akinwolere on the scale of change:
“It’s all very strange to be saying, well, you know that system that worked really well for you last season? Well, now we're going to do the opposite of that. And you need to get on board with that. And in no time at all, with very few training sessions.” (10:06)
Paul Taylor on Forest’s ambition:
“When Postecoglou was appointed, he made it clear that he had been bought here to win the Europa League. He wasn't just bought here to take Forest on a little bit. He wanted them to win silverware.” (26:27)
Ange’s own words after a tough defeat:
(Clip) “What's wrong with something being hard? Seriously, what's wrong with it? ... It seems to be these days that as soon as something goes wrong, well that's, well that's it. It's wrong. It's. Change it. Break it up.”_ (17:04)
Paul Taylor on hype and fan patience:
“He's had four Premier League games. When you put it in those terms ... it feels daft that we're sat here talking about a manager potentially getting the sack.” (24:24)
Paul Taylor on the cost of change:
“You could find yourself getting into a tricky area with PSR straight away just by changing your manager. So there's all these other things to take into account when you're thinking about making a change.” (36:13)

Timeline of Important Segments

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------| | 02:04 | Opening: Ange’s stats and bad start contextualized | | 03:02 | “Fine margins” in key early games—missed chances | | 04:04 | Ange’s pattern: Historically slow starts at clubs | | 05:24 | Defensive chaos compared to Nuno, fan unease | | 08:20 | Dressing room: No anti-Ange sentiment, but missing Nuno| | 10:06 | The massive transition in style; lack of preseason | | 11:58 | Marinakis’ ambition and the boardroom backstory | | 17:04 | Press conference clip—Ange’s bullish, defensive tone | | 17:52 | Media/journalist perspective on Ange’s persona | | 22:14 | From media darling to caricature at Spurs | | 24:24 | Debate: How much time is enough? Social media/fan unrest| | 26:27 | The “Europa League or bust” expectation | | 29:19 | The gamble of prioritizing Europe | | 32:24 | Fan revolt after Europa League home defeat | | 33:57 | Ange’s English record—balance of Europe vs Premier League| | 36:13 | Financial/PSR issues with sacking Ange | | 40:19 | Marinakis’ approach: Successor always lined up ahead of decisions| | 41:08 | Ending thoughts—hopes for a turnaround |

Conclusion & Takeaways

The episode paints a tense, complex picture—Ange Postecoglou is up against not just the usual challenges of new management but also a legacy he can’t reproduce, a style overhaul under time pressure, sky-high ambitions from the board, injuries, fan skepticism, and little room for error.

The consensus among the panel is that while there are reasons for patience—adjustment time, tough fixtures, and the risk of frequent instability—Forest’s volatile context and high ownership expectations mean Ange’s fate will be dictated by immediate results. All admit it’s early days, but in modern football, patience is in short supply.

“If you’re appointing a manager, and four games are enough to change your opinion, then you shouldn’t have appointed him in the first place. No manager should be judged after that few games.”

— Charlie Eccleshare (25:23)

Podcast Summary: The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ange’s Dismal Start at Forest

Statistical Low: Ange Postecoglou has had the worst start of any Forest manager in a century, with seven games yielding five defeats and two draws. (02:04)
Not Just Bad Luck: Paul Taylor notes things could've gone differently in close matches (e.g., Real Betis), but overall “there have been some small moments where things might have been different,” while not discounting the seriousness of the poor start. (03:02)

2. Patterns from Previous Jobs

Historically Slow Starters: Charlie Eccleshare points out Ange’s habit of starting slowly at new clubs, with Spurs being the only notable exception. “Spurs was actually a big outlier because he started really well... but that's the exception rather than the rule.” (04:04)
Recurring Criticisms: Defensive frailties and set-piece weakness—issues at Spurs—have immediately resurfaced at Forest. Paul Taylor: "All the fears that Forest fans had about Ange Postecoglou and his football are all evident straight away." (05:24)

3. The Problem of Context: Successor to a Beloved Figure

Replacing Nuno Espirito Santo: Unlike typical appointments following failure, Ange replaced a “hugely popular and very successful manager at Nottingham Forest” (Nuno), making the transition doubly hard for players and fans. (05:24, 08:20)
Style Change: Forest’s identity as a defensively robust, counterattacking side has been lost, replaced by a more open, risky approach that hasn’t yet produced results. (05:24)

4. The Players and Dressing Room Dynamics

No ‘Anti-Ange,’ But Still ‘Pro-Nuno’: Transition has been difficult as Nuno was seen as a “father figure” for many. Adjustment is less about opposition to Ange and more about losing a deep bond with the previous manager. (08:20)
Huge Adaption Required: Players are asked to shift styles rapidly with very little runway—a “massive” jump, especially without the benefit of a full preseason. (10:06, 10:57)

5. Ownership, Recruitment, and Hierarchy Tension

Boardroom Drama: Edu’s arrival as head of football led to tension with Nuno, mainly over the pace of recruitment and a missed opportunity for squad cohesion in preseason.
Nuno’s Outspokenness: Nuno’s public criticism of ownership was essentially a “him or me” ploy—one that backfired. (12:14)
Ambitions and Disconnect: Owner Marinakis’ lofty aims—setting a Europa League win as the bar—have added pressure and may have contributed to instability. (11:58, 26:27)

6. Press Conference Persona & Media Perception

Ange’s Bullishness: Ange’s combative tone at press conferences reflects both his nature and his conviction, but can make it “harder to warm to” for Forest fans, especially when results aren’t there. (17:52)
Quote Machine vs Substance: “As Charlie mentioned, from a media point of view, from a selfish journalist's point of view, he's great at handing out lines... But just gets back to the same point, doesn't it? It’d be nice to be talking about a win.” (20:54)
Media Darling to Caricature: Early in his Spurs stint, media lauded Ange’s attacking football. That quickly shifted when results faded, making him susceptible to caricature in defeat. (22:14)

7. How Much Time Should He Get?

Too Soon to Judge? Discussion draws parallels to managers like Ruben Amorim being given three years at Sporting: Why not take the longer view?
Social Media Discontent: Despite only four Premier League games, “social media is dark when it comes to Ange Postecoglou. There's fans just calling for him to go already.” (24:24)
High Expectations Post-Nuno: Marinakis wants trophies, and that ambition is now the bar by which Ange is being judged. (26:27)

8. Can Forest Afford a Slow Burn?

Danger of Sacrificing League for Europe: At Spurs, Ange succeeded in Europe but at the cost of domestic results. Can Forest live with that tradeoff if it means league underperformance? (27:59, 29:19)
Financial and PSR Pressures: Sacking managers is expensive, and multiple changes could have off-field ramifications as well. (36:13)
Replacement Lined Up First: Marinakis prefers to have new managers ready before sacking the old—expect speculation to precede any managerial decision. (40:19)

9. Fan Disconnection and Tipping Point

Biggest Blow: European Home Defeat: Heavy fan frustration greeted the home loss to Midtjylland—“the worst of the lot” and a symbol of how far vibes have fallen since Nuno. (32:24)
Recent Record: Postecoglou has lost 18 of his last 26 Premier League games, raising legitimate doubts about his capacity to get results in England. (33:57)
Short-Term vs Long-Term: Ultimately, Ange needs wins now just for survival—he can't afford to play a long game. (36:13)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Paul Taylor on the fine margins:
“There have been moments where things might have gone differently and he might have got that first win just to settle the nerves... It has been bad, it has been a situation that's left him in peril and fighting to keep his job. But there have been small moments where things might have been different.” (03:02)
Charlie Eccleshare on Ange’s pattern:
“Typically, if you look at a club like Celtic, his job performance before Spurs was similar to what's happening at Forest now. And that Ended up being a big success, but started really slowly.” (04:04)
Paul Taylor on legacy pressure:
“The same problems that hung over him at Spurs, the good football not bringing results, the defensive fragility, the weakness from set pieces, they're all there for people to see. All the fears that Forest fans had about Ange Postecoglou and his football are all evident straight away.” (05:24)
Paul Taylor on player adaption:
“He wasn't just a manager to a lot of these players. He was like a father figure to some of them...the biggest adaption they've got is losing that he's gone.” (08:20)
Ayo Akinwolere on the scale of change:
“It’s all very strange to be saying, well, you know that system that worked really well for you last season? Well, now we're going to do the opposite of that. And you need to get on board with that. And in no time at all, with very few training sessions.” (10:06)
Paul Taylor on Forest’s ambition:
“When Postecoglou was appointed, he made it clear that he had been bought here to win the Europa League. He wasn't just bought here to take Forest on a little bit. He wanted them to win silverware.” (26:27)
Ange’s own words after a tough defeat:
(Clip) “What's wrong with something being hard? Seriously, what's wrong with it? ... It seems to be these days that as soon as something goes wrong, well that's, well that's it. It's wrong. It's. Change it. Break it up.”_ (17:04)
Paul Taylor on hype and fan patience:
“He's had four Premier League games. When you put it in those terms ... it feels daft that we're sat here talking about a manager potentially getting the sack.” (24:24)
Paul Taylor on the cost of change:
“You could find yourself getting into a tricky area with PSR straight away just by changing your manager. So there's all these other things to take into account when you're thinking about making a change.” (36:13)

Timeline of Important Segments

Conclusion & Takeaways

“If you’re appointing a manager, and four games are enough to change your opinion, then you shouldn’t have appointed him in the first place. No manager should be judged after that few games.”

— Charlie Eccleshare (25:23)

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Summary

Podcast Summary: The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ange’s Dismal Start at Forest

2. Patterns from Previous Jobs

3. The Problem of Context: Successor to a Beloved Figure

4. The Players and Dressing Room Dynamics

5. Ownership, Recruitment, and Hierarchy Tension

6. Press Conference Persona & Media Perception

7. How Much Time Should He Get?

8. Can Forest Afford a Slow Burn?

9. Fan Disconnection and Tipping Point

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Timeline of Important Segments

Conclusion & Takeaways

“If you’re appointing a manager, and four games are enough to change your opinion, then you shouldn’t have appointed him in the first place. No manager should be judged after that few games.”

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode Overview

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ange’s Dismal Start at Forest

2. Patterns from Previous Jobs

3. The Problem of Context: Successor to a Beloved Figure

4. The Players and Dressing Room Dynamics

5. Ownership, Recruitment, and Hierarchy Tension

6. Press Conference Persona & Media Perception

7. How Much Time Should He Get?

8. Can Forest Afford a Slow Burn?

9. Fan Disconnection and Tipping Point

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Timeline of Important Segments

Conclusion & Takeaways

“If you’re appointing a manager, and four games are enough to change your opinion, then you shouldn’t have appointed him in the first place. No manager should be judged after that few games.”