Podcast Summary: The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode: Is Ousmane Dembele really the best player in the world?

Date: September 24, 2025
Host: Ayo Akimolere
Contributors: Tom Williams, Seb Stafford-Bloor, Paul Balous, James Pearce

Episode Overview

This episode explores the meteoric rise of Ousmane Dembélé, newly crowned Ballon d'Or winner after leading PSG to their first-ever Champions League triumph with 35 goals. The panel dissects Dembélé's journey from his Rennes debut to his pinnacle season at PSG, questions the evolution of his game, discusses whether he truly is the world’s best, and debates the broader meaning and bias of the Ballon d’Or award.

Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dembélé’s Early Years and Rise at Rennes and Dortmund

[01:34 - 03:35]

• Dembélé made an instant impact at Rennes:

  “He ticked every box: super fast, insanely skillful, impossibly two‑footed and just seemed to emerge fully formed from the Rennes academy.”
  (Tom Williams, 02:27)

• Notoriously ambidextrous, sparking early media attention and national headlines.

• His senior season at Rennes earned him the Ligue 1 Young Player of the Year award and national team attention.

• At Borussia Dortmund:

  • Joined at just 19, thriving under Thomas Tuchel in a fast, transition-heavy system perfectly suited to his game.
  • Recorded 12 assists in a season—"more than Ribery, more than Robben, tied with Müller," highlighting his immediate impact.
  • Departure for Barcelona marred by a training boycott, leaving a “bitter taste” at Dortmund:

    “...he was very much a young kid who had the footballing world at his feet … some raw nerves at Borussia Dortmund in response to how that ... ended, unfortunately.”
    (Seb Stafford-Bloor, 05:36)

• Key Reflection:
  Panel agrees Dembélé likely could have benefitted from one more development year at Dortmund:

  “Given what we know about what happened at Barcelona and whether he was truly ready… I think probably. The value of Dortmund as a development club … is definitely to the betterment of players who stay for a little bit longer.”
  (Seb Stafford-Bloor, 06:44)

2. Barcelona Experience: Struggles and Maturity

[07:44 - 09:20]

• Arrived at Barcelona as a “Neymar successor” at just 20 and for a huge fee.

• Early years plagued by:

  • Lateness and issues with professionalism.
  • Serious injuries, which he’d previously avoided.
  • Difficulty integrating in a star-studded, demanding dressing room:

    “Dembele was seen as a bit of an introvert…he got married without several of his teammates even knowing.”
    (Paul Balous, 08:13)

• Turned around after several seasons:

  • Improved professionalism, training habits, and injury prevention.
  • Xavi’s faith helped; viewed by coach as "the best winger in the world".
  • Contract frustrations and a desire for a new environment led to PSG move.

3. Revival at PSG: The Making of a Star

[09:20 - 15:11]

• Dembélé’s signing received acclaimed optimism in France—now returning as a matured professional:

  “They weren’t signing the injury-prone, undisciplined, problematic youngster…they were signing the guy who...was a regular starter, wasn’t getting injured all the time, seemed to be respected…”
  (Tom Williams, 09:20)

• PSG also transitioned strategically: moving away from the “superstar era” of Messi and Neymar, Dembélé personified a new, hard-working, humble PSG vision.

• His homegrown ties (Evreux, Normandy) only furthered his status as the face of this new PSG era.

4. The Tactical Transformation: From Winger to Ballon d'Or-winning Forward

[15:11 - 20:58]

• Under Luis Enrique, Dembélé moved centrally, evolving into PSG's main man after Mbappé’s departure:

  “You’re going to be the main man now. Kylian Mbappé has gone. We’re not signing a replacement center forward. We think you can be the attacking player who makes a difference in this team.”
  (Tom Williams, 17:30)

• Technical improvements:

  • Became calmer and more effective as a finisher—no longer merely going for spectacular goals, but consistently scoring “centre-forward” tap-ins.
  • Supported by a dedicated video analyst, refined end-product.

• Leadership role:

  • Expected to set the tone for PSG’s young, hungry squad.
  • Decisive contributions throughout Champions League run (goals, assists, work-rate).

• Memorable Moment:

  “That image of him from the final…loitering on the edge of the Inter penalty area, eyes fixed on Jan Sommer, waiting for the ball to move... summed up the hunger in that PSG team.”
  (Tom Williams, 19:55)

5. Ballon d’Or Significance & Legacy for French Football and PSG

[20:58 - 23:25]

• First Ballon d’Or given to a “local” since Michael Owen (Liverpool, 2001); first French player to win it for a French club since Jean-Pierre Papin (Marseille, 1991):

  “French football fans have got used to seeing their superstar players leave...to have a French guy playing for a French club winning the Ballon d’Or…is a hugely positive thing.”
  (Tom Williams, 21:19)

• Marks PSG’s arrival at football’s “top table”; Ballon d’Or seen as a final legitimizing milestone after finally winning the Champions League.

6. Who Else Could Have Won? The Ballon d’Or Debate

[25:02 - 36:33]

Salah & Yamal’s Cases [25:02 - 27:11]

• James Pearce on Mohamed Salah:

  • “29 league goals, 18 assists…he shattered the record for most goal involvements in a 38 game Premier League season. Even he called the record of 47 goal involvement set by Shira and Cole over a 42 match campaign as well.”
    (James Pearce, 25:57)
  • But: The Premier League’s higher difficulty versus Ligue 1; panel suggests he was “harshly overlooked”—Salah’s attacking output and achievements worthy of winner status.

• Paul Balous on Lamine Yamal:

  • Hails Yamal’s completeness and game-changing ability, but concedes collective trophy success remains decisive:

    “No player can be considered the best in business if he’s not accompanied by some sort of collective success.”
    (Paul Balous, 27:00)

Is the Champions League Everything? [28:25 - 31:35]

• Champions League bias: Ballon d’Or’s historic tendency to reward standout players from UCL-winning teams, sometimes at the expense of equally (or more) individually brilliant players elsewhere.

  “The Ballon d’Or’s become like a bonus prize for winning the Champions League…Winning the Premier League is a more significant achievement. I think it’s disingenuous…But, that’s the convention,”
  (Seb Stafford-Bloor, 28:58)

• Debate about under-recognized tournaments (AFCON, Copa Libertadores) and club contexts; points out world-class achievers like Salah, Mane, and Touré often snubbed in favor of UCL victors.

Attacking Bias & The Forgotten Roles [34:02 - 37:52]

• Attackers dominate Ballon d’Or history; defenders and goalkeepers rarely recognized:

  "Only three defenders ever won the Ballon d’Or: Beckenbauer, Sammer, Cannavaro. Only one goalkeeper—Lev Yashin."
  (Ayo Akimolere, 36:14)

• Seb’s frustration:

  “You do not win the competition without outstanding players in those positions…yet we’re filtering out the important aspects of that achievement to make way for an attacking player…I’m going to die on this hill. I’m fine with it.”
  (Seb Stafford-Bloor, 37:24)

• Tom Williams contextualizes: Historically, Ballon d’Or goes to “standout player in the standout team":

  “Was Michael Owen the best player in the world in 2001? No…Zidane in 1998 won on the back of two goals in the World Cup final…Historically, [the award] has always been a trophy that has gone to the outstanding player on the outstanding team.”
  (Tom Williams, 31:35)

7. Fun Finale: Ballon d’Or Knowledge Quiz

[38:38 - 39:17]

• France and Argentina jointly top Ballon d'Or wins (eight each).
• Panel names Portugal, Italy, Germany, and Netherlands as other frequent winning nations, with Brazil and England also noted.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Dembélé’s evolution:

  “He was a superstar who wasn’t a superstar. He was a superstar in terms of his footballing ability…but he wasn’t a superstar…in terms of his ego.”
  (Tom Williams, 12:09)

• On attacking bias:

  “If you were to create a ranking of players by position…Hakimi is the best right back in the world. I’m not sure who number two is…yet he doesn’t really have a serious candidacy [for Ballon d’Or]…”
  (Seb Stafford-Bloor, 34:02)

• On what the Ballon d’Or measures:

  “Is he a better footballer than Lamine Yamal? …Probably not. I think Yamal is a generational talent…But if you win [the top trophy] and you are the go-to guy in that team, you win the Ballon d’Or.”
  (Tom Williams, 33:05)

Episode Structure & Timestamps

• [01:34] – Introduction: Dembélé’s Ballon d’Or & journey starts
• [02:27] – Rennes and early career
• [03:59] – Borussia Dortmund years
• [07:44] – Barcelona struggles, injuries, and maturity
• [09:20] – PSG move and transformation
• [15:11] – Luis Enrique’s tactical influence & role at PSG
• [20:58] – What Dembélé’s win means for French football and PSG
• [25:02] – Arguments for Salah/Yamal; Ballon d’Or debate
• [28:58] – Champions League bias and individual brilliance
• [34:02] – Attacking bias, defenders and keepers undervalued
• [38:38] – Ballon d’Or quiz & knowledge wrap-up

Takeaways for Listeners

• Dembélé’s Ballon d’Or marks both a personal and national milestone—the culmination of maturation, reinvention, and seizing the spotlight as PSG’s focal point.
• Despite his transformation, the episode challenges the very criteria that awarded him: Does winning as part of the “outstanding team” trump individual brilliance in tougher contexts? Is the Ballon d’Or narrative fair to defensive players or those outside elite Champions League clubs?
• The Ballon d’Or remains football’s most prestigious individual award, but its process and biases—toward attackers, Champions League glory, and European-centric narratives—spark continuing debate.

For further listening: The panel hints at future deep-dives on the next generation of Ballon d’Or contenders, and the ever-evolving meaning of “best in the world” in modern football.