Podcast Summary
Podcast: The Athletic FC Podcast
Episode: Is women's football still growing?
Date: September 4, 2025
Host: Ayo Akinwolere
Guests: Charlotte Harper, Megan Feringer, Niki Doucet (WSL Chief Executive)
Overview
This episode of The Athletic FC Podcast examines whether women's football—particularly in England and Europe—is sustaining its recent surge in popularity and investment. Host Ayo Akinwolere is joined by The Athletic’s Charlotte Harper and Megan Feringer, and later by WSL chief executive Niki Doucet, to dissect the state of the game, the implications of transfer record-breakers, fan growth, challenges in attendance, commercial dynamics, and the future of league structure.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Transfer Market Explodes—A ‘Watershed’ Moment
[01:51–04:54]
- Record transfer: Olivia Smith’s £1 million move from Liverpool to Arsenal marks a historic milestone in women’s football, signifying the market has reached a new level.
- “When Olivia Smith went for a million pounds...that was where you saw the watershed.” – Megan Feringer [02:37]
- Follow-on signings: The pace of record-breaking deals is accelerating—signifiers of increased competition and rising valuations, although top clubs like Arsenal and Chelsea are leading the way.
- Notably, Everton broke their own club record signing Ruby Mace from Leicester.
- Explanation for higher fees:
- More players now have multi-year contracts, which increases potential transfer value and underlines the long-term investment ethos of clubs.
- “The higher the transfer fee goes, the more it demonstrates like, well, women’s football is here to stay.” – Charlotte Harper [04:09]
Revenue: Where is the Money Coming From?
[04:54–06:38]
- Investment models differ:
- Some clubs, like Chelsea, combine internal and external investments; others are exploring independent investment and even self-ownership models to ensure funding is dedicated to the women's side.
- “You’ve got NWSL clubs that do not have to rely on a men’s side.” – Megan Feringer [05:08]
- Broadcast and commercial growth:
- New WSL broadcast deal: 5 years, £13 million per year (up from £7–8 million).
- Arsenal are leaders in matchday revenue; commercial partnerships are up.
The ‘Lionesses Effect’ and Fan Conversion
[08:52–11:32]
- Star signings drive attendance: Clubs especially in mid- to lower-table positions capitalize on Lionesses’ name value to fill seats and sell season tickets.
- “After Euro 2022, Aston Villa’s strategy was ‘Look, come and see Rachel Daly.’” – Charlotte Harper [09:08]
- Marketability and recruitment: While having a Lioness or an England star helps commercially, the most successful clubs (e.g., Chelsea) take a longer-term succession and global approach.
- Premium for Lionesses: Clubs face a higher cost to recruit current national team stars, often targeting up-and-coming talent to hedge against expenses.
International Success & Its Ripple Effects
[13:28–18:40]
- Back-to-back Euros wins for England: Boosts visibility but, as Harper and Feringer point out, translating major tournament hype into sustained league attendance is challenging.
- “There’s a direct link to Lioness success, to getting fans into the turnstiles…But clubs have to capitalize.” – Megan Feringer [14:48]
- Spotlight on emerging talent: International tournaments showcase lesser-known players and can drive big club moves (e.g., Linda Caicedo to Real Madrid, Michelle Ackemang’s rise).
- Off-pitch impact: Endorsements and commercial deals from non-traditional football brands are increasingly common.
Are Players Now Bigger than Clubs?
[18:40–21:09]
- Personal brands matter: In the women’s game, fans often follow individual stars rather than teams. Social media amplifies this effect.
- “You have a lot of fans who follow individual players more than they maybe would follow a club.” – Megan Feringer [18:53]
- Younger fanbase, less club loyalty: Limited historic legacy compared to men’s clubs; Arsenal are noted as an exception with established fan culture.
Converting Casual Tournament Fans to Regulars
[20:47–24:59]
- Clubs’ marketing challenge: Success means little without effective strategies to turn one-off fans into regulars. Arsenal set the standard post-2022 by collecting fan data and targeting broader demographics.
- “You want to be reaching as many people as possible, perhaps who have never watched women’s football.” – Charlotte Harper [21:17]
- Avoiding spectacle over substance: Clubs must balance entertainment value with respect for the game’s competitive substance.
Scheduling & Accessibility
[24:04–24:59]
- Broadcast saturation complicates slotting: The league has removed unpopular Sunday night matches in favour of more accessible Friday evenings and midday Sunday games. No quick fix: experimentation required.
Interview: Niki Doucet (WSL CEO)
Ignition Moment and Sustaining Growth
[26:54–28:14]
- Echoes Billie Jean King: "Pressure is a privilege."
- Fan interest is strong. With expansion (promotion/relegation playoff, more clubs), the upcoming season is touted as the most competitive ever.
Tackling Attendance Challenges
[27:18–28:14]
- Despite international wins, last season's WSL attendances dropped.
- Doucet is optimistic: improved competitiveness, changes in the league structure, active transfer windows forecast a bounce back.
Fan Experience Innovations
[28:14–29:32]
- New alcohol sale pilots in stadiums are underway, tailored to each club's fanbase.
- Doucet emphasizes giving clubs autonomy to test what works—be it alcohol, food, or unique merchandise.
Why Only Arsenal and Chelsea Thrive at the Gates?
[29:32–31:09]
- Transition from amateur to professional is uneven. Key: embedding the women’s team as “a must-have for the community.” Logistics (venue, tickets, marketing) are all factors; every club is on a unique journey.
League Support & Marketing
[31:09–32:44]
- League acts as a “lighthouse,” supporting clubs with ticketing strategies, out-of-home partnerships (e.g., Ocean Outdoor), centralized marketing, and new digital tools (WSLfootball.com).
- Doucet praises knowledge-sharing (best practices), but stresses each club must localize their approach.
Investment, Patience, and Sustainable Growth
[32:44–34:25]
- It’s a “10-year investment horizon at a minimum," with a 2035 Home World Cup as a medium-term anchor.
- Clubs should expect gradual, not immediate, returns. More and more clubs are buying in as investment and competition grow.
On Competitiveness and League Structure
[35:31–37:46]
- WSL is actually more competitive than the “same few winners” narrative suggests. Expanding the league and promotion/relegation structures should increase balance and “jeopardy.”
- When addressing the potential of a closed league: Doucet says all growth scenarios have been considered, with substantial stakeholder consultation. Ultimately, investment was fostered, and competitive excitement is up.
Future Models & Multi-Club Ownership
[38:08–41:09]
- The league sees value in a plurality of models—independent clubs (e.g., London City Lionesses, Durham) and traditional ones.
- Currently, no women’s-specific multi-club ownership regulation; the league is observing how investment flows and will adapt policies as needed, learning from (and not necessarily repeating) the men’s game’s mistakes.
Purpose-driven Partnerships, Not ‘Investment at All Costs’
[41:23–42:12]
- Investment must solve specific problems—recent Nike partnership is an example (addressing athletes’ need for proper kit, notably boots and gloves).
Players and Trends for 2025–26
[43:30–44:54]
- Players to watch: Megan Ajiman at Brighton, Jade Rose (Manchester City, via Harvard), Ruby Mace (Everton), a notable influx of technical Japanese players (Everton, Brighton).
- “Technically speaking, the Japanese players are some of the best they’ve ever worked with.” – Megan Feringer [44:16]
- Alyssa Thompson’s possible transfer is closely watched as a bellwether for market and fan excitement.
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “When Olivia Smith went for a million pounds...that was where you saw the watershed.” – Megan Feringer [02:37]
- “The higher the transfer fee goes, the more it demonstrates...women’s football is here to stay.” – Charlotte Harper [04:09]
- “You have a lot of fans who follow individual players more than...a club.” – Megan Feringer [18:53]
- “Pressure is a privilege.” – Niki Doucet [26:54], quoting Billie Jean King
- “It’s a 10-year investment horizon at a minimum and you’re looking at a 2035 potential Home World Cup.” – Niki Doucet [32:58]
- “We have to have more investment come into the game more broadly and finding the right structures…” – Niki Doucet [40:41]
- “There is no point having these transfer fees...if ownership groups just see these teams as add-ons and don’t make them a priority.” – Charlotte Harper [43:17]
Timestamps for Important Segments
- Record-breaking transfer fees & market dynamics: [01:51–04:54]
- Investment & revenue evolution: [04:54–06:38]
- Lioness signings and commercial value: [08:52–11:32]
- Link between international success and league growth: [13:28–18:40]
- Player vs club identity: [18:40–21:09]
- Converting casual fans & marketing strategies: [20:47–24:59]
- Scheduling & access: [24:04–24:59]
- CEO Niki Doucet on league structure, competitiveness, and investment: [26:54–42:12]
- Players/trends to watch in 2025/26: [43:30–44:54]
Summary Takeaways
- Women’s football, especially in England, continues to grow—but the path isn’t linear. Transfer fees are hitting new highs, but only a select group of clubs are leading investment and attendance.
- International success brings profile—but clubs can’t take fan engagement for granted. Sustained growth requires savvy marketing, improved scheduling, and a family-friendly, inclusive matchday experience.
- League administrators are experimenting with new models—fan experience, investment incentives, and league structures—to attract and keep fans, clubs, and capital.
- There is a cultural shift happening—players’ personal brands are driving new types of fandom, which is both an opportunity and a challenge for clubs.
- The future of women’s football will depend on balancing competitiveness, sustainable financial models, and growing beyond “big club” domination. The next decade is set as a pivotal period, with a home World Cup on the horizon and more innovative approaches being trialled in the WSL.