The Athletic FC Podcast

Episode: Liverpool win the Isak derby – but do they need more signings?
Date: August 26, 2025
Host: Ayo Akinwolere
Guests: George Caulkin, Ollie Kay, David Ornstein

Episode Overview

This episode recaps Liverpool’s dramatic last-minute victory over Newcastle at St. James’s Park in the so-called "Isak derby". Discussion centers around the ferocious atmosphere, the future of Newcastle’s squad amid the Alexander Isak transfer saga, Liverpool’s emerging vulnerabilities, and lingering transfer market questions as the window closes.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Atmosphere and Dramatic Moments at St. James's Park

• George Caulkin describes a pulsating, emotionally charged night, with Newcastle supporters making a powerful statement of unity amid the Isak transfer storm.
  • “It was always going to be a big game. Alexander Isak was the undertone. It was the overtone. It was all the tones the game.” (03:01)
  • Newcastle’s fan group ‘Wor Flags’ set a message: “A club is about more than one person.”
  • The match’s symbolism was palpable, with Ekitike scoring (a Newcastle target who got away) and Newcastle’s false nine replacement sent off.

2. Rio Ngomoa's Teenage Dream

• Liverpool’s 16-year-old Rio Ngomoa became the club’s youngest ever scorer with a last-minute winner.
  • Ollie Kay: “What a moment for him. My 16-year-old daughter's just done her GCSEs ... The idea of her or any other 16 year old being put into that enormous, high pressure situation and just doing something that just breaks... amazing.” (04:54)
  • George Caulkin (joking): “Do Newcastle have a case to get that goal chalked off simply because it was beyond his bedtime?” (05:36)
  • Ollie Kay: "It was one of the great Premier League moments… a huge moment and a really, really dramatic ending." (06:53)

3. Newcastle’s Performance and Resilience

• Despite missing key players (Gordon sent off, Tonali, Joelinton, and Schär all out), Newcastle dominated large parts of the game.
  • Caulkin: "They lost the game, they lost Gordon ... but you don't watch them and think of them as losers. You watch them and think this is actually, you know, the mentality of winners." (08:40)
  • Concerns persist, though, about needing to “start translating that into victories” and the urgent need for more recruitment.

4. Liverpool’s Vulnerabilities and Transfer Needs

• Ayo Akinwolere and Ollie Kay debate Liverpool’s lack of control, vulnerability in defense, and whether their “spirit” can make up for structural problems.
  • Kay: “The big thing is control that Liverpool haven't had in the first two games… They've won those two games in pretty. I don't know. Would you call it resilient or would you call it heroic? I don't know. They didn't look very resilient.” (10:00–11:59)
  • Caulkin: Cites fans chanting “champions” and notes that “if you’re not at your best… find a way of grinding through it. And they did.” (12:01)

5. Transfer Window Grind: The Alexander Isak Saga

• The Isak transfer saga looms over Newcastle and Liverpool.
  • David Ornstein's Update: “Newcastle have been very firm in their stance they don’t intend to sell him this summer … but he has made clear his desire to go and pretty forcefully … He’s not training with the first team…there is no indicator that his stance...is going to alter.” (17:09)
  • Only one formal Liverpool bid (£110m) has been tabled, and with a week to go, Ornstein says, “all eventualities remain open.” (17:09–19:56)
  • The situation could impact Newcastle’s ability to sign replacements and manage FFP/PSR compliance.
  • Caulkin: “Selling has always been part of the plan at Newcastle ... But the idea of selling their best player at precisely this moment is kind of anathema to them.” (22:47)
  • Kay: Raises the risk of a ‘toxic’ scenario if Isak is kept against his will, versus the challenge of letting a prize asset go. (24:27–25:45)

6. Squad Building, Spirit, and the Human Side

• Caulkin: Reflects on the emotional toll for both Eddie Howe and fans, noting the shadow cast over what should be a celebratory period for the club after historic cup success:
  • “This was supposed to be the summer ... they're going into the Champions League ... and they've had this sort of sourness around.” (29:00)
• Newcastle’s lack of a CEO and sporting director compounds the sense of drift and instability. (29:35)

7. Liverpool’s Remaining Transfer Business

• Ornstein: Liverpool are targeting Isak for a specific, not a generic, forward need — they won’t “settle” for a lesser alternative.
  • On defense: Mark Guehi of Crystal Palace is an option, but a deal is not near. (35:00)
  • Liverpool unlikely to “sign for the sake of it”: “...they just won’t make signings just for the sake of it… if they're not right, they'll keep their powder dry and wait for the right opportunity in the future.” (37:14)
  • On outgoings: Harvey Elliott may leave — many clubs are interested, but squad depth might be an issue. (38:26)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “It was always going to be a big game. Alexander Isak was the undertone. It was the overtone. It was all the tones the game.”
  – George Caulkin (03:01)

• “It was the stop of teenage dreams. Three days short of his 17th birthday.”
  – George Caulkin on Rio Ngomoa (04:43)

• “Even a half committed Alexander Isak is probably better than anything out there.”
  – George Caulkin (25:45)

• “Selling has always been part of the plan at Newcastle… but the idea of selling their best player at precisely this moment is kind of anathema to them.”
  – George Caulkin (22:47)

• “The fact that they've started the season with two wins from those sub-optimal conditions … is impressive in its own right... That is what champions do.”
  – George Caulkin (11:59)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 02:22 — Show starts, immediate reaction to the atmosphere at St James’s Park
• 03:01–04:54 — Newcastle perspective and Ngomoa's debut heroics
• 04:54–06:53 — Ollie Kay reflects on Ngomoa’s impact
• 07:12–09:17 — Newcastle's resilience and sense of injustice
• 09:30–11:59 — Liverpool’s defensive frailties and the impact of off-field pressures
• 12:45–13:05 — Newcastle’s transfer window dilemmas
• 15:53–19:56 — David Ornstein: In-depth on Isak transfer saga
• 22:47–25:45 — Newcastle’s strategy, FFP pressures, and the psychological cost of selling
• 27:42–29:35 — The human and emotional cost of the Isak saga
• 34:47–39:03 — Ornstein: Will Liverpool sign more? Harvey Elliott’s future addressed

Closing Thoughts

The episode masterfully captures the emotional turbulence at both clubs: a triumphant but vulnerable Liverpool, and a Newcastle side forced to navigate glory, adversity, and a club-defining transfer saga all at once. Both sides face a decisive final week in the transfer window.