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- [00:00]
Kristen
When I started podcasting, it felt like I had to figure everything out myself. Booking guests, figuring out rundowns, editing the show and publishing it. It seemed like the list of to do's got bigger and bigger and when you're starting off with something new, it seems like that just happens. Finding the right tool that not only helps you out, but simplifies everything can be such a game changer. And for millions of businesses, that tool is Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform but behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Mattel and Gymshark to brands just getting started. Get started with your own design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store to match your brand style, accelerate your content creation. Shopify is packed with helpful AI tools that write product descriptions, page headlines, and even enhance your product photography. Get the word out like you have a marketing team behind you. Easily create email and social media media campaigns wherever your customers are scrolling or strolling. And best yet, Shopify is your commerce expert with world class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond. If you're ready to sell, you're ready for Shopify. Turn your big business idea into a With Shopify on your side, sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com TheAthletic Go to shopify.com TheAthLetic shopify.com TheAthLETic.
- [01:33]
Nick Miller
Hey Kristen.
- [01:34]
Tim Spears
How'S it tracking with Carvana Value Tracker?
- [01:37]
Nick Miller
What else?
- [01:38]
Tim Spears
Oh, it's tracking in fact. Value surge alert. Trucks up 2.5%, vans down 1.7.
- [01:46]
Nick Miller
Just as predicted. So we going to.
- [01:50]
Tim Spears
I don't know. Could sell.
- [01:51]
Nick Miller
Could hold the power to always know our car's worth.
- [01:55]
Tim Spears
Exhilarating, isn't it?
- [01:59]
Nick Miller
Tracking?
- [02:00]
Tim Spears
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- [02:38]
Adam Leventhal
The Athletic FC Podcast Network.
- [02:49]
Hi there, I'm Adam Levanthal. Welcome to the preview on the Athletic fc setting you up for the biggest game of the weekend, which is Aston Villa against Manchester United and also getting you ready for all of the Premier League action. With me this week is Nick Miller. How are you, Nick?
- [03:14]
Nick Miller
I'm very well. How are you?
- [03:15]
Adam Leventhal
I'm very good. Big holder. We're heading towards the winter. I like it. It's good.
- [03:20]
Nick Miller
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [03:21]
Adam Leventhal
Tim Spears is also here. How are you?
- [03:23]
Nick Miller
What's up?
- [03:25]
Adam Leventhal
Right, okay. So you're going for a full range of weird welcomes every week.
- [03:29]
Nick Miller
Yeah, yeah. Different one every week.
- [03:32]
Adam Leventhal
Cool. Okay. I'm good with that. Let's concentrate on the football. It is match day seven, as some people call it. It is a seven three Saturday Sunday split. Let's go through the games. Saturday's early game is winless. An 18th place Crystal Palace. They're up against the leaders Liverpool. Eight wins in nine in all competitions this season. For Arneslot, who's doing a great job having taken over from Jurgen Klopp. That's 12:30 UK 07:30 Eastern Time. We have 5, 3 o'clocks or 10ams. Arsenal in third against second. Bottom Southampton who have just one point still. Brentford against rock bottom Wolverhampton Wanderers. Tim still just one point for them. Second place Manchester City take on Fulham who are in sixth and very much under the radar I think Struggling West Ham against Ipswich who are unbeaten in their last four. Becoming the draw specialists. 17th place Leicester take on Bournemouth in 11th. The 5:30 this week or 12:30 Eastern is Everton got their first win last weekend. They're up against Newcastle in seventh. Then on Sunday at 2:00 or 9:00am it's fourth place Chelsea against very much mid table Nottingham Forest, which is actually good news for Nottingham Forest and Aston Villa against Manchester United before Brighton in ninth against spurs in eighth at 4:30 or 11:30. Lots to come on this weekend's games. The last one again. We've got an international break coming up, so enjoy. So we start with our focus on aston Villa in fifth, up against Manchester United in 13th. Contrasting fortunes for both of these clubs this week in Europe. Let's start with the home side and reflect on that brilliant win against Bayern Munich with our Villa writer, Jakob Tanzwa.
- [05:26]
Jakob Tanzwa
I thought Aston Villa were well deserving of the victory. A memorable gigantic night against Bayern Munich. They had a structured game plan, were concise, well drilled. It was a deviation away from the norm. They did have a lot of possession, but they knew that they would have chances on the counter attack that they'd have to sit in a compact Shape. Ultimately, it crystallized in Duran's audacious dink finish. I spoke to Morgan Rogers afterwards and he said Unai Emery held two separate meetings on that day alone, plus hours of footage analyzing every single player of Bayern Munich in the days before. And one of those players was Manuel Neuer. And Emery, identified as is well known by now, that he likes to come off his line. And Jon Juran, perhaps subconsciously, even without looking up, he knew Neue would be off his line and decided to attempt the knob.
- [06:12]
Adam Leventhal
Here's John Duran takes the shot.
- [06:13]
Nick Miller
Duran.
- [06:14]
Oh, brilliant.
- [06:16]
Adam Leventhal
Oh my word. The 20 year old kid from Colombia has just lit up Villa park with a world class finish against Bayern Munich. And just like 42 years ago, I'll say it again, Villa Lee, Bayern.
- [06:34]
Jakob Tanzwa
As we know, Unai Emery's preparations are extensive. It's really shown in the big games at Villa park, the two victories inside four days last year in December against Man City and then Arsenal and then this time against Bayern Munich. It was a fantastic, memorable evening, arguably their greatest night since 1982. And that famous European cup victory against Bayern Munich with the same scoreline, so tactically mature.
- [06:59]
Adam Leventhal
That magic moment from John Duran as well. Brilliant goalkeeping performance. Nick, what was your take on it? Were you able to enjoy it as a, as a moment, a footballing moment, especially with the history involved?
- [07:12]
Nick Miller
Yeah, I mean the obvious thing is the goal, but it was the thing that impressed me is how for the first 15, 20 minutes it really looked like Bayern were suffocating Villa. It looked that they were so dominant, didn't look like Villa could get out of not even their own half, but even 30 yards, 40 yards from their own goal. And at that point you thinking, ah, this is, this isn't going to go well. This is going to be a pretty long night. But then they, they kind of broke out from that and Bayern had a lot of the ball but didn't create a massive amount of chances that I, that I can remember certainly in the first half. And then, then obviously the, the, the, the goal, which is a sensational moment, not just for the finish, but it's sort, it sort of came out of nowhere. Obviously it was kind of long pass through from Paltores and then suddenly drans through and producing this incredible lobbed finish. And as I often am with these things, very jealous of people who are actually in the stadium that night.
- [08:09]
Adam Leventhal
It did look like to be a fantastic atmosphere. A lot of people that were there were saying it was the loudest that they'd heard Villa park for a Very, very long time, Tim. Now Aston Villa switch from, you know, having to be dogged defensively and organized and disciplined and take your opportunity when you get it to Manchester United. So it's. It's a completely different sort of occasion for them. Obviously it's still a big game, it's Manchester United, but they should, they should enjoy this one and have a lot more, A lot more time to breathe, I suppose.
- [08:41]
Nick Miller
Yeah, potentially. Although United did the double over over the last year. I remember the 3:2 Old Trafford when Villa was sort of tunnel up but, but stayed quite open thereafter. And it really sort of suited United on the, on the counter and then United 1, 2, 1 at Villa in February. I mean, the biggest problem for Villa in this game will be either underestimating United, who are obviously, you know, shambolic, and 13th in the early table, only three points ahead of Ipswich, or I guess what the inevitable come down really from. From one of the greatest nights in the. In. In the club's modern history. I mean, you know, as Nick is saying, pretty astonishing match to watch. There's always something quite special when a club other than the usual suspects does something special in Europe. You know, we sort of had it a bit with Newcastle last season or, or. Or in the past. You know, you go back to a spree of Barcelona and Fulham in the Europa League and, you know, stuff like that. It's always, it's always for me anyway, they're sort of, you know, they become your second team on the night because you, you want them to do well, you want their fans to enjoy something special while it lasts. And yeah, Villa certainly did that on Wednesday. So I guess, I guess to refocus after that, you know, all the emotional energy, let alone physical energy that they exerted will not be easy. But Emery's done that a lot in his career in the past with Sevilla.
- [09:56]
Adam Leventhal
Now, Nick, obviously, Unai Emery knows what he's doing, clearly. But what happens with John Duran if he just keeps on scoring every time he comes on? He scored six this season. Does it get to a point where he deserves to start? Or is it just modern football? An impact player, you come on, you do your job. It's all part of the offering of Aston Villa. Equally like with Emi Martinez in goal. He did his job. He made the SA when he needed to make them. So what do you do with John Duran? Because he's presumably going to get frustrated if he's only getting 20 minutes here and there all the time.
- [10:29]
Nick Miller
Yeah, I guess so. But then again, he's in those 20 minutes, he's scoring goals and getting huge amounts of glory. So he's kind of getting. He's getting the same money, he's getting the same kind of adulation for, you know, 20, you know, 30% of the work or whatever. I went to Villa's game against Wolves a couple of weeks ago and I wrote a piece from that advocating Duran and Watkins playing up front together purely on the basis that it would just be enormous fun and so ignoring the tactical implications of it because they haven't played together very often. I think they've only started together twice since Duran arrived at Villa a couple of years ago. Emery clearly doesn't really think it works because more often than not it's one comes on for the other. But it's very difficult to drop Ollie Watkins. I know he wasn't kind of particularly effective on Tuesday, but the idea of both together is enormous fun from the sort of neutral, chaotic point of view. But that would involve kind of either dropping or moving Morgan Rodgers away from a position that he's been playing really well in. So that's tricky from a kind of tactical perspective, but I don't know, it just seems to be. It's just working at the moment. They're kind of loosely speaking, Watkins for 70 minutes, Duran for 20 minutes. It's all working out pretty nicely. And, you know, while it is very tempting to throw Duran in there from the start as well, it's difficult to see why they should change that.
- [11:55]
Adam Leventhal
If it ain't broke, don't fix it is basically, you know, the situation. And let's be fair on Ollie Watkins. He could have probably had a couple of goals against Bayern Munich if Upper Meccano didn't keep on landing on top of him on the halfway line when he was trying to. Trying to break away. You mentioned about the tactical side of things. Let's get our tactics writer Liam Tharmes expectations on what Unai Emery is going to do this weekend.
- [12:20]
Liam Tharme
Looking at Unai Emery against Manchester United will be a really, really interesting one. It was his first win, first game as Villa coach back almost a couple of years ago now in November 2022. But the past four meetings, United have won all of them. Three of those have been by a marginal goal and there's a Cup game in there too. I think the fear for United probably at the moment going up against Villa is how good they are and how solid they are defensively for a United team that have struggled to pick lock well, structured defenses. Against Bayern Munich, we saw Villa dropping into a bit more of a back five by dropping a number 10 down to really defend those sort of wide combinations and really force Bayern into crosses an awful lot. Villa of course, are equally as good on transition going the other way. And that's something that I think will be a really big problem, especially with how open United have been in, in recent games. Thinking back to the Mickey Van de Ven assist in the spurs game, it's definitely going to be a big game in terms of transition. I think on, on both sides. It's not often we get a game where I think the focus isn't on build up and possession play. But both teams have got real quality counter attacking players and systems in place. Villa are executing that better this season so far than Manchester United. But there's quality on both sides which makes it for a really exciting game. But after the performance from Villa in midweek against Bayern Munich, I think I'd put a lot of confidence in Villa getting a result this weekend.
- [13:31]
Adam Leventhal
So that's Liam's take. Tim, just a quick one from you. Obviously there are a few doubts over a few players for Aston villa, obviously John McGinn' Ramsey and Nana as well for them. Do you still think that even, you know, if, if all are missing, they've still got the, the depth and the, the tactical mouse to, to do what they need to do?
- [13:52]
Nick Miller
That was the key question going into the season with Villa and I guess we're really going to see see that now over the Next sort of two months. I think they've got 10 games before the end of November. They've got Bologna, Club Bruges and Juventus in the Champions League in that time. Some big league games in that time. So yeah, we're going to see now if the squad is up to it. I, I think they would have liked to have done more business in the summer on that front, but you know, there were PSR issues that seemed to hold them back. So I guess, you know, Emery has done this very successfully, you know, during his career with, with Sevilla. But now we're going to see whether they can cope with, you know, eight extra Champions League games. And what do they prioritize and you know, can they stay in the mix for the top four again? I mean, in terms of the squad, obviously, you know, Duran is probably the best substitute in the, in the world, but you know, the likes of like Barkley and Philogine and Buendia, you know, can they, can they come in and keep to the standards that, that have been set by others? So yeah, we'll see. I mean, but you know, for this game in particular, the one guy that they do want fit is Morgan Rogers, because the gaps that United offer up in that midfield are absolutely vacuous. So yeah, he's the one. I definitely want fit for this.
- [15:09]
Adam Leventhal
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- [16:31]
Tim Spears
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- [17:01]
Chris Woff
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- [17:28]
Adam Leventhal
JP Morgan Chase bank and a member FDIC subject to credit approval. Let's switch our attention now to Manchester United. I mentioned about contrasting fortunes in Europe. They still got a point, but it was a bit of a crazy game against Porto 33 on Thursday night. Here's Ahmed Walid on his tactical analysis of a rather crazy game.
- [17:54]
Ahmed Walid
Manchester United's performance in the 33 draw away to Porto in the Europa League shouldn't come as a surprise. They've been playing the same disjointed performance since the beginning of last season. Despite United going ahead 20 through Marcus Rashford and Rasmus Hojlund. Porto's defensive organization was really poor and it meant that United could access Rashford in dangerous situations down the left side, which led to both goals. But the same problems recurring for United in terms of poor organization without the ball and the structure without the ball, which meant that they ceded territory and it put the defensive players under pressure, especially the back four, in terms of multiple crosses into the penalty area. And eventually from this pressure, Porto scored twice. Then in the second half, United tried to push forward. And because of the rushed nature on the ball and inability to find solutions in the final third against a deeper Porto defense, this time they were vulnerable on the counter attack. They conceded the 3:2 when Pepi found Porto striker inside the penalty area. And then United, as usual, were in a rush. And it wasn't until very late in the game that Eriksen's corner found Harry Maguire to make it 3:3. But from this performance you can see the same issues. The poor structure without the ball, vulnerability to counter attacks, especially in the second half, and Onana saving the day yet again despite conceding three goals.
- [19:20]
Adam Leventhal
So it's a pretty damning assessment from Ahmed there, basically saying that Manchester United once again are disorganized. Yes, there were moments and you know, Marcus Rashford, who we'll talk about a little bit more in a moment, look good and bright and they got into that 2 nil lead, but just disorganized. Why do they keep on turning out performances where they're disorganized, Nick?
- [19:40]
Nick Miller
I mean, I think it's partly because of Erik Ten Hag's stubbornness. And I suppose he would argue he will. And he has argued. You know, he's won trophies playing this way, so why should he change? Etc. Etc. But I think it was interesting, the interview that he gave to sky after the Tottenham game. He talked about, you know, we made many. We made many mistakes in possession, we couldn't find the right man. And then he blamed the defence for or the midfield for letting Micky Van De Ven through for that run. He said, I made very clear before the game how we should defend this. We need to defend better. It was like he was kind of, he was saying, well, it's not my fault. I can't do anything if these guys just don't, don't follow my very important and very correct instructions. And this is a kind of theme with what he says generally. Doesn't seem to be any kind of reflection that maybe the instructions aren't right. There was another kind of odd moment where the sky interviewer sort of made the observation that the same things seem to be happening all the time. You seem to be making the same mistakes most weeks. And 10 Hag either didn't recognize this or just pretended that he didn't know what the guy was talking about, which is a little bit troubling because it's quite. Even I, as a confirmed tactical dunce, can, could tell you that the same things keep happening, the same mistakes keep happening. These kind of enormous gaping holes in midfield that people just kind of stroll through and you know, you would like to think that if someone like me can see it, then 10 Hag should be able to see it as well and kind of fix things. I would imagine that John McGinn would be particularly sad that he's not playing in this game because he would have against those kind of that wide open midfield, he would have an absolute fielder. It is slightly difficult to have sympathy with Manchester United fans because of, you know, their historical success and those of us of a particular age will have lived through that success. So, you know, world's smallest violin here. But if I was a Manchester United fan, I'd be particularly worried that 10 Hag just doesn't really seem to recognize what the problems are and therefore is not going to fix it.
- [21:54]
Jakob Tanzwa
Eriksen to deliver the corner. Time running out on Manchester United.
- [21:59]
Nick Miller
They beat equalized.
- [22:02]
Jakob Tanzwa
Yet more drama at the drag out.
- [22:06]
Nick Miller
Harry Maguire up from the back scores.
- [22:10]
Jakob Tanzwa
What could prove to be for Eric Ten Haag a priceless goal.
- [22:14]
Adam Leventhal
A word about Harry Maguire and his and his goal. Obviously that made it three, three in midweek. Tim, do you feel that, that it's as simple as, as that goal buying Eric 10 Hag more time or do you feel that it's just that this is just gradually heading in one direction? And I wanted to say this because there's been a lot of comments from Manchester United fans about, you know, being critical of Manchester United and being over critical of.of erik10hag everyone's saying it. Everyone's seeing the same thing. As Nick said, I don't think that we're being overly critical of Manchester United. Do you feel that we are? I know that you're, they're not your favorite team, but you know, do you think that we're being overly critical?
- [22:57]
Nick Miller
I feel like, I mean, I hold back to be honest. There's worse things I could say every week about this team. They're 13th in the league and they were 8th last year. Spent 600 million under 10 hog. That's pretty bad. There's not got much going for him and you know, you say is it inevitable that he's going to get sacked? I mean, who knows? Who knows? The majority, I think the majority of, of elite clubs in world football would, would have sacked him at some point in the past sort of what, six to eight months. So honestly don't know. Can't, can't read them. You know that Ineos, they're, they're the ones that gave him a new contract and, and spent a lot of money on players that he. It's just crazy. We're just, we're seeing the same things over and over and over again. Not just in, in games, but also, you know, the results of games. The, the Spurs 3 nil echoed the sort of Liverpool 3 nil which echoed the 3 nil at home to Bournemouth last year or the, or the four nil at palace at the end of last season and, and Europe's exactly the same as last year. You know, they're these crazy 5 to 10 minute capitulations in the Champions League games last season and now it's happening in the Europa League. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know what, I don't know where the low, the low bar is here. What, what is the point where they say enough is enough? Absolutely no relegation zone. Maybe, maybe they'd have to be relegated. I honestly don't know. Don't know.
- [24:15]
They've kind of backed themselves into this position where they can now that they could have. They had the opportunity to make change in the summer but they're now put themselves in a position where they should make a change but now possibly can't afford it or it would look very particularly bad for them to pay. I have no idea how much it would cost but I'm gonna, I'm guessing it would be a fair amount of money to get rid of 10 hag and all or most of his staff at the same time as they're kind of, you know, Making people redundant in the backroom staff and they're, you know, cutting corners here and there with all these kind of seemingly quite small and, and petty things to just save a few quid so that they can spend millions on correcting mistake that they could made the decision for much cheaper just a few months ago. So for all that they are, there's this kind of brains trust who kind of lined up in the director's box and the adults in the room now kind of thing. They just seem to have mishandled this.
- [25:15]
Enormously badly that they can't afford not to sack him. Nick. That's what I'd counter. Do you know what? It gets to the point I feel sorry for 10 hog now you say you feel, you feel might feel sorry for United fans. I feel sorry for 10 Hog because he's just getting relentlessly, metaphorically beaten week after week after week. It must be, must be a horrible place for him to be in and it's. So you need to put him out of his misery now. That's, that's where we're at. He's a three legged horse.
- [25:39]
Adam Leventhal
Okay, good. You have. I haven't held back. You have gone to the next level. I like it. Okay. And that is the views of Tim Spears. Let's get the take of the guys on Talk of the Devils who recorded their latest dedicated Manchester United podcast after that draw against Porto. Searching for positives unlike us ahead of Aston Villa.
- [26:01]
Nick Miller
Maybe they're on some massive Champions League.
- [26:03]
Liam Tharme
Hangover after the Lord Mayor show the muka. Yeah and we go back to, you know, they do defend with the high line. So playing like he was tonight.
- [26:13]
Nick Miller
Bruno's back, got a point to prove.
- [26:15]
Rashford hopefully won't get sent off again. I mean that would be something.
- [26:18]
And one thing we can. Well at least to my eyes watching that Portugal players haven't down tools, they're still scrapping. So all this talk about oh it's the end, oh it's the dark clouds, oh, is this. Well, no, you've just seen Manchester. Yeah, okay. That they threw away a 2 nil lead. They also scrapped and fought and clawed 10 men and got a last minute equalizer. There is something there. What that is is still really annoying and we should really know more after two and a bit seasons. But hey, there is something.
- [26:47]
Adam Leventhal
There is something. Or is there? I don't know. I thought that, that that goal and the celebrations Even after the 33 look very much like that was Harry Maguire going look I'm still doing what I do and potentially he should be, he should be starting. I thought that delict coming in was, was actually going to be. Not quite. But in the realms of the missing piece of the jigsaw at the back foot for Manchester United or one of them.
- [27:15]
Nick Miller
Hey, you weren't, you weren't the only one. Me and Nick, an argument in an article about whether United had won the transfer window. That's how, that's how highly we thought of their business in the summer. Looks, looks. Looks pretty stupid now, Nick.
- [27:29]
Adam Leventhal
Was that a serious. Was that. No, but was that a serious debate that I've missed? It was. And who was. On what side were either of you?
- [27:36]
Nick Miller
Well, Nick sort of favored saying Brighton had had the best window. And I said, I quantified it massively. I said, look, United on paper have had a great window. You look at each of these additions, that's kind of problems that, that potentially solves problems that they've got. However, I did kind of say, look, this means nothing because this is a bit of a graveyard for, for players, you know, Old Trafford these days where they seem to get worse. But I think, I think Nick, you sort of agree to me, yes, they have had a good window. Wasn't. Wasn't just me saying it.
- [28:03]
Actually. I'm gonna completely ignore this. I'm gonna absorb all responsibility for this article and just blame you completely. I don't remember doing this at all. Anyone finds it on the Internet then they're. They're lying. No, I mean, yeah, in theory they signed some good players, but just feels like at the moment you could stick anyone in that sort of structure in the system that 10HAG is playing and they still wouldn't have much luck. It's bleak.
- [28:30]
I think that's it. If you look at, you look at Casemiro, Amrabat and Agarte are all pretty good DMs or they've had good careers and had a lot of success elsewhere and they've all looked terrible. Agarte being the latest. They've all been horribly exposed. You know, maybe, maybe it's the manager. You know, I think that's the conclusion you have to draw from that.
- [28:49]
Adam Leventhal
So it's the, it's the structure rather than the, the individuals and that is the blueprint that erik10hag is putting out on. Onto the pitch. A quick word on, on Bruno Fernandes obviously sent off in back to back games that the red was overturned against Tottenham. I mean a quick straw poll. Was that, was that the right decision?
- [29:11]
Nick Miller
No, I don't think so.
- [29:12]
Adam Leventhal
You think that that red should have stood.
- [29:14]
Nick Miller
Yeah, I think in the. It's a completely defensible decision kind of on the pit. He did slip, but then he also, after he slipped, stuck his leg out and put it halfway up Madison's shin, which, you know, it doesn't matter if he doesn't break his leg or not. That's. That's. You still can't do that. But I was, I was pretty surprised that it was then subsequently overturned.
- [29:34]
I think in the, you know, in the era of Var, there's got to be a really high bar to overTurn a decision two days later after Var's already had a good look at it during the game. So, yeah, this got nowhere near the bar for me, that one.
- [29:47]
The other thing is that we have the delicious prospect of the same player being sent off in three games in a row, which you don't often. You don't often get. And of course, the international break coming up. So it could be four games in a row. So four or five. Well, yeah. Who knows?
- [30:02]
Adam Leventhal
Oh, no, he wouldn't be able to play in the second one. Yeah, you're right.
- [30:05]
Nick Miller
They could appeal it and it gets overturned again. So, you know, this could just go infinite loop of sending offs and appeals and he just, he gets sent off on every game, but there's never suspended that.
- [30:16]
Adam Leventhal
I mean, it's. By the by, he will play against Aston Villa. I don't know if that's a good thing or. Or a bad thing for. For Manchester United. I mean, it's obviously not going to plan for. For Bruno Fernandes. What would you do ahead of this game, having seen sort of Harry Maguire turn up and, you know, do his sort of Harry Maguire things. Ish. And you have Bruno Fernandes getting sent off every game. What would you do in terms of that captain's armband? Do you think that they need to change something, Tim, Quickly.
- [30:44]
Nick Miller
Hey, do they need to change any. Something, anything? I mean, I guess with the Maguire thing, he sort of epitomizes, I think, what they. The approach that they need right now, which, which is completely back to basics. Just strip it all back, just, just defend for a, you know, a nil. Nil at Villa park, you know, with some 90 minutes of s. Hausery and, you know, ball in play for 40 minutes, just something, a clean sheet, a point, show that they can do something. You know, it's not going to happen. But this, this whole approach, you know, I think Gary Neville said it during the. During the game last week, you know, they don't Press well, they're very open. They're not particularly counter attacking very well. They don't dominate with the ball. You know, what do they, what do they do basically?
- [31:29]
Sorry, it's just what, what are Manchester United for? Raw Spears?
- [31:35]
I don't know. Like I said. Yeah, I think some kind of back to basics approach with Maguire as you epitomizing that as your captain is what they sort of need right now. But it's not what they're going to do.
- [31:45]
Adam Leventhal
Well, we'll see what happens. Let's get our predictions. Nick Villa, three one, three one, Tim.
- [31:51]
Nick Miller
I think one all.
- [31:53]
Adam Leventhal
Oh, they're going to do their back to basics best.
- [31:58]
Nick Miller
I feel like. Yeah, post Bayern, it's going to be a really tough one for Villa and United seem to have something over them from last season. So yeah, for all this, you know, apocalyptic sort of predictions about United, they do have it in them to get a result somewhere. You know, they beat Barsley so they can do something.
- [32:14]
Adam Leventhal
Excellent.
- [32:21]
Tim Spears
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- [32:57]
Adam Leventhal
Right, let's focus on some of the other games this weekend. Chelsea against Forest. That's the other 2:00 or 10:00am Eastern, Nick. Now, the last time that you were on the podcast was ahead of Liverpool against Nottingham Forest and you correctly predicted that Callum Hudson Odoi was going to cause Liverpool problems. Obviously he scored the winning goal, set up this game, Chelsea against Forest and how Forest are going to cause Chelsea problems.
- [33:27]
Nick Miller
What kind of. In theory, same again. I mean after that podcast when I carefully outlined how the wingers were going to cause Liverpool problems and then neither of them actually started, I did feel like a bit of a chump. And then, you know, obviously Hudson Odoi came on, scored a brilliant goal set up by the other winger, Alanga it and felt slightly better about myself. But last game, Forest lost 1 nil to Fulham. They didn't have Morgan Gibbs White, which is the kind of. This isn't particularly blaming Nuno, but anyone would kind of slightly panic and think, well, oh Christ, what are we going to do here? Because he's so sort of central to everything that Forest do. Gibbs White will be back for this one, so that's a headache taken care of. I suspect it'll probably be something similar to how they started against Liverpool. The kind of the idea being to really pack midfield and try and stop Cole Palmer as much as you possibly can at the moment. And then if that all goes to plan, then bring on again, bring on Hudson, Odoi and Alanga later on in the game.
- [34:27]
Adam Leventhal
Having seen how Chelsea played Tim against Brighton and in particular Cole Palmer, it's difficult to imagine that Forest are going to be able to keep them at bay throughout the game as they did at Anfield. A word about Cole Palmer. Six goals, four assists. Is he the, is he the best player in the Premier League at the moment?
- [34:48]
Nick Miller
I disagree with your initial statement because surely Forest won't come and defend on the halfway line.
- [34:54]
Adam Leventhal
Absolutely.
- [34:55]
Nick Miller
With you know, Lewis dunk sort of running at 0.5 speed and you know, Fernandez just chipping those, chipping those passes like, like he's chipping a golf ball over the, over the bright defensive place to run onto. It was just, it was insane. But yeah, no Palmer, I mean, yeah, probably the form player in the, in the Premier League right now. It's just ridiculous. Like it wasn't just, wasn't even just the goals last week. I think he also hit the post. He had an offside goal. Mr. One on One could have scored seven.
- [35:22]
He also played two absolutely outrageous passes.
- [35:25]
Like over the first time. Lob scoop passed.
- [35:29]
Unbelievable.
- [35:30]
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Crazy. I just, you know, he's a revelation. He's just, he's just so incredibly unassuming. Not phased whatsoever. Unaffected by his own brilliance was how I saw it put on Twitter this week. Which is. Which I think sums it up pretty nicely. I think it was asked afterwards, you know, has he been practicing free kicks? After his literally perfect 30 yard free kick he was like, nah. It's like I've, you know, done a bit of messing around, but I wouldn't say practicing. Sort of running out of superlatives for him really. There's a lot of comparisons or there's an eagerness to compare him to someone we've seen in the Premier League era before. I saw comparisons with Berkamp last week and Ozil van Persie, but I'm not sure we've seen anyone like him really. He's, he's a pretty unique player and just seems to be on a different level to, to all of his teammates. The decision to let him go by pep for what, £40 million a year ago is just increasingly bizarre.
- [36:21]
The extraordinary thing about him is he's, he was brilliant last season. Chelsea's best, I mean not just Chelsea's best player but Chelsea's only decent player for most of the season and now he's, he seems to have got even better this season and in a, in a different position. I mean it's not like, it's not like we're asking a right back to play up front but you know, that kind of move has flummoxed more high profile players than him before and he just keeps doing things, doing new things brilliantly. Like as you said, the free kick. I didn't know he could do that. I wonder whether he knew he could do that. But he just kind of lolloped up and casually pinged one into the top corner from 25 yards out and yeah, just extraordinary.
- [37:12]
Adam Leventhal
A word about Brighton against Spurs. Tim obviously, you know, mentioned Brighton up against Chelsea last week and it was a little bit, I don't know, self sabotage at times for Brighton at Stamford Bridge and now they go up against Spurs. Spurs had a good win away from home on Thursday in Hungary, beat Ferencvaros 2 1. They've got Brennan Johnson in fine form. Dominic Solanke is now scoring goals. Brighton are conceding a lot of goals which is in contrast to the, an impressive start to the season. It seems as if Fabian Herzler is just sort of getting to grips a little bit more with, with the Premier League. Presumably this is just going to be a high scoring game and two high lines. It's going to be, it's going to be quite tight.
- [37:54]
Nick Miller
Yeah, definitely one of the standout games of the weekend for sure. I mean spurs are the last team you want to play right now. I think they've won five in a row in all comps. Brendan Johnson scored in each of those games, which is remarkable really. As soon as you know where he was before that. I would absolutely not advocate abusing people on social media but it's been this weird instigator for this remarkable run of form where he was, you know, so affronted by that, rightly by the sticker that he was getting and he's, he's channeled, channeled that rage into goals, into football goals.
- [38:26]
Adam Leventhal
But he spoke, I thought he spoke really well about that actually. The fact that, that you know, he's listening to people that he cares about, the support network that he's got around him that he loves and you know, his dad was in the crowd. I don't think he was in the last game but the game before just, you know, smiling from ear to ear. Former player himself. It's a good thing to see, isn't it?
- [38:46]
Nick Miller
It really is. And he had, you know, a tough transition last year, obviously going to a massive club and I think he probably played more than Ange Postecogli would have wanted him to last year. But spurs of course had some, you know, horrific injury problems which meant that Johnson was sort of starting every week. I remember he started like 20 games in a row at one point and you could see he was, he wasn't struggling but he wasn't standing out either. And also that that transition from playing in a, in a sort of a counter attacking team at Forest to more of a high possession, you know, dominating the opposition, final third kind of kind of team. So he's had a lot, he's having to make a lot more decisions during the game and I think he maybe struggled with that last year but his decision making and his composure has really come on now and yeah, it's becoming a bit of a sort of almost a complete wide forward. So yeah, this should be a really high scoring one. It was, yeah. Four two to Brighton at home last year and two one to spurs at home last year. So expecting more of the same.
- [39:38]
Adam Leventhal
Everton take on Newcastle. Happy that they've got their first win of the season, that comeback victory against Crystal palace last weekend. Newcastle though, let's get Chris Woff's take on things because they're looking to get back on track away from home. This was him on Pod on the Tyne.
- [39:56]
Nick Miller
They had started the season decent form away from home, points wise, but then they've basically. They basically fell off a cliff at Fulham and it's about responding to that. Manchester City, that performance has to be replicated. And Newcastle can and almost always do put in performances like that at St. James's Park. It's away from home where too often over the course of the last 18 months they haven't reached those intensity levels. This will be very much a test of have Newcastle actually got over that hurdle, that mental hurdle that they have away from St. James's Park? Can they put in that intensity when they don't have the St. James's park crowd behind them?
- [40:33]
Adam Leventhal
Let's switch to another of our podcasts, Handbrake off, which concentrates on Arsenal because they take on Southampton this weekend. And Art D'Rocher has been speaking about the tactical approach of Russell Martin and how it might pan out if he does the same at the Emirates.
- [40:54]
Jakob Tanzwa
Yeah. If you leave it that expansive, I.
- [40:56]
Nick Miller
Think it's a recipe for disaster. I'm not sure if he will change things because as you mentioned, he's been very intent on playing that way. So it'll be interesting to see because.
- [41:07]
Jakob Tanzwa
I think if they try to play out and be expansive, especially with the way that Arsenal press teams, I think they could be in for a very long afternoon.
- [41:18]
Adam Leventhal
You do fear for Southampton going to the Emirates, don't you, Nick?
- [41:21]
Nick Miller
Yeah. Russell Martin gave an interview in. I think it was the Telegraph at the start of the season or before the start of the season where he, he basically made the point. Well, it's this style of play has kind of worked for me so far. So it would be a bit stupid to change from here. And there is a sort of line of logic to this. But I know the Burnley comparison has been brought up a lot, but they are doing the similar thing in as much as they are trying to, to use the same approach, using slightly better, only slightly better players against much higher standard opposition. And that's. It just isn't going to work. Or if it, if it does work, then it'll probably work, you know, too late in the season. If they do manage to kind of improve playing this way, then by the time it kind of clicks and it starts working again, then it might already be too late. They might be too far adrift and they're going down. I think if I was a Southampton fan, I'd be pretty annoyed that they keep on playing this way when it's not working and for seemingly no other reason to sort of satisfy Russell Martin's muse. If you're a struggling team at the bottom of the league, you kind of accept that you're going to lose quite a few games. But the least you want to do is make it hard for the opposition. And Southampton haven't really done that very much so far this season.
- [42:44]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah. And when you contrast it to the sort of the savviness of, of another newly promoted side in, in Ipswich and they're not, they're not going great guns. But you compare their results, picking up draws against Aston Villa against Southampton, who they probably should have beaten, having said what we said, Brighton and also Fulham having had Manchester City and Liverpool in their opening two games, you've got to pick up points, got to go back to sort of back to basics like Tim was saying with, with Manchester United. So yeah, you hope that, that Southampton can sort of maybe evolve a Little bit. Maybe use this international break with Russell Martin. You don't want to see a manager getting sacked or anything like that. And maybe come up with a different plan that's going to see them pick up some points because at the moment it's not looking good for them. Just a quick word on Fulham. I mentioned there, didn't I? They're up against Manchester City. I like what Marco Silva's doing at the moment, Tim. They're sitting sixth. They seem to be steadily improving. They've. They've made some good acquisitions as well. Could you see them doing one at the Etihad?
- [43:51]
Nick Miller
Could they do one? Good question.
- [43:55]
Adam Leventhal
It's not really a good question, was it? Could they turn up a shock at the Etihad?
- [43:59]
Nick Miller
Turn up a shark? Good question. Yeah, I like what Fulham have done for a few years, to be honest. I mean, they've all. They've always played good football, football, you know, with Andres Pereira and, and Will Ian and, and others. But I guess, you know, a couple of issues they've always had. One has been they tended to have a weak defense, but they've brought in Joaquim Anderson this summer who's already made a big difference. And then the other thing with Fulham is the squad's always been slightly weaker. You know, the bench hasn't been great. But I looked at their bench last weekend for their easy win at Forest and they had sort of Harry Wilson, Reese Nelson, Tom Kearney, Sanderberg, Rodrigo Muniz. You know, these are all sort of proven players at this level who can come on and make a difference from the bench. So it might be a step too far this weekend. But yeah, they look pretty good for sort of top half finish this season.
- [44:44]
Adam Leventhal
Tim, thanks for your time today.
- [44:46]
Nick Miller
Thanks, Adam.
- [44:47]
Adam Leventhal
Thank you for saying something rather than just putting two thumbs up. Works on YouTube but not so on an audio platform. And Nick, thank you very much to you. You can do both if you wish.
- [44:56]
Nick Miller
Thanks, Adam.
- [44:57]
Adam Leventhal
Brilliant. That's the way to do it. Thank you very much everyone for listening watching on YouTube. Keep your comments coming in. We do read them all so do keep them coming in. Ladies and gents, I will be back on Monday. Enjoy your weekend.
- [45:12]
Nick Miller
You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavrou and Jay Beal. The executive producer was Ailee Moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free. Search for the Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. The Athletic FC podcast is an athletic media company production.
- [45:37]
Tim Spears
This Mother's Day show the moms in your life just how much they mean to you with a stunning bouquet from 1-800-flowers.com for almost 50 years, 1-800-flowers has set the standard for high quality bouquets. Right now, order early from 1-800-FLOWERS and save up to 40% on gorgeous bouquets and one of a kind arrangements guaranteed to make her day. Save up to 40% today at 1-800-flowers.com acast that's 1-800flowers.com acast, the official florist of Mother's Day.
- [46:07]
Chris Woff
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- [46:34]
Adam Leventhal
JP Morgan, Chase bank and a member FDIC subject to credit approval.
- [46:39]
Nick Miller
Acast powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend.
- [46:46]
Tim Spears
Hey guys. Welcome to Giggly Squad, a place where we make fun of everything but most.
- [46:51]
Nick Miller
Importantly our I'm Paige desorbo. I'm Hannah Burner.
- [46:54]
Tim Spears
Welcome to the Squad.
- [46:55]
Nick Miller
Giggly Squad started on Summer House when we were giggling during an inappropriate time.
- [46:59]
Tim Spears
But of course we can't be managed.
- [47:02]
Nick Miller
So we decided to start this podcast to continue giggling.
- [47:04]
Tim Spears
We will make fun of pop culture news. We're watching fashion trends pep talks where we give advice, mental health moments and games and guests.
- [47:13]
Nick Miller
Listen to Giggly Squad on ACAST or wherever you get your podcasts. ACAST helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcast everywhere. Acast. Com.