Karl Anka (2:31)

Seems like. It seems like they're getting two or three members of personnel better capable of playing 90 minutes at a top level. I watched the semi final against Atletico Madrid and that's probably the best I've seen. Victor Joker as at bullying centre backs, he was enjoying throwing himself about in a way that I've not seen enough of in the Premier League. I think it's a fantastic story of Saka getting the goal to send them to the final and the post match celebrations where people were saying it's been 20 years since their last Champions League final and you're okay, fine. And then you start talking to younger Arsenal fans and they perhaps don't really remember 2006 and going, oh, it is quite unusual that a club of Arsenal size hasn't been to the pinnacle of European football for that long. So a great story. Number of players coming back. Things seem to be getting better. The final third rotations and movement seem to be a lot more fluid than where they were, say start of February. So I, I reckon they get it done.

Matt Davis Adams (3:29)

It's interesting, isn't it, Jay? Because it feels like before the first leg against Atletico, a lot of the talk was, well, this is the last thing that they need ahead of a, a title. Running a grueling double header against the Spanish side. But, but now it feels like Tuesday's win could actually add to their momentum and confidence for the, the Premier League title hopes. Or that's how it's being perceived rather than, oh, this is going to drain them and leave the players knackered.

Jay Harris (3:52)

Yeah, definitely. I think Carl alluded to it. But that outburst of emotion everybody saw at the Emirates Stadium on, on Tuesday evening is something that they should, should carry with them over the final few weeks of the season. You know, our colleague Duncan Alexander was there and said it's probably the best atmosphere he's ever seen at the Emirate Stadium. Mikhail Arteta was celebrating in a way I don't think any of us knew he was, he was even capable of doing. I think the only thing that would make me hesitate slightly is that remember when, you know, Man City got knocked out of the, the Champions League to Real Madrid and everyone thought they'd be crestfallen and then actually that ended up giving them a lot of momentum over the last few weeks. And then when Arsenal had beaten Everton and Max Dalman scored that incredible goal, we saw very similar scenes. And then they played badly for the next few weeks. So sometimes it's hard to predict this stuff. I do think the return of Saka and Miles, Louis Kelly in midfield, which I'm sure we'll get into a bit, has made a huge difference and it will be intriguing to see if, if Arteta sticks with Louis Skelly in midfield for the, for the final few games.

Matt Davis Adams (4:51)

Yeah, we'll get onto that later. But West Ham wise defeat at Brentford combined with spurs win at Villa park saw them fall back into the relegation zone. Teams around them. Karl Forest unbeaten in seven and won their last three in the league. Leeds are beaten in six, won their last three. So is this an either or situation vis a vis Spurs, West Ham and the remaining relegation spot?

Karl Anka (5:12)

It feels that way. Certainly the manner in which Nottingham Forest beat Chelsea really created a swing in the relegation battle and yeah, and now it seems to be a tussle between the East London teams. West Ham really, really strange season trajectory. You know, start the campaign. You're watching them on the ground pot and going, this could be a historically bad campaign. They looked old, they look slow, they look very, very quiet in how they defended. You were hearing talk about how much money they're going to spend, the January transfer window before Halloween even. And I think someone said they were going to spend 150 million, maybe 200 million in the January transfer window. You're going, that's going to get weird. You know, lobbing that much money in one windows. You're going to get a bunch of strange players who won't fit together. And yet it has. Right. Axel Dzasi. I think if you look at the amount of clean sheets West Ham have got since the Zasi's arrived compared to the clean sheets Chelsea have got season long. It doesn't look well on Chelsea. Getting some strikers and allowing Bowen and Somerville to play as actual wingers has been useful. So they've got some pieces, but they do every now and again just trip up over their own shoelaces at the worst possible moment. That was not a defeat you wanted to have against Brentford and it's just handed momentum immediately over to Tottenham and to a Forest team that now just seems to be getting better and better and better, provided Gibbs White can play maybe one more game.

Matt Davis Adams (6:34)

It's a big maybe spurs wise Jayce you'll beat. They didn't win a league game in the first four months of this year. Now under Roberto de Zerbi, they've had two in a row and that's put them in the driving seat to stay up. Right. And even looking at their running. People thought that that was nasty a while ago. You might argue that it's got a bit nicer, you know, at home to Leeds on Monday they're pretty much safe. And then a trip to three point Stamford Bridge.

Jay Harris (6:59)

Yes, I do think there's been a sense in the last week of people just assuming spurs are going to stay up now. And I think we need to be careful of not falling into that trap for a couple of different reasons. Firstly, as you joked, there is the Stamford Bridge game and spurs have only won once at Stamford Bridge. I think in 36 years. You all know about the intensity of the rivalry. Yes, Chelsea are playing badly. But last weekend was the 10 year anniversary of a Chelsea team doing pretty badly in the league and ruining a Spurs party when they were trying to win the title against Leicester City. So I don't think that game is cut and dried as some people are assuming it to be at the moment. And then secondly, yes spurs have won in the last couple of weeks but both of those games were away. Spurs were still not one at home in the Premier League since they've been beat Brentford 20 on December 6th. And that was only their second home win. I know that was only their second home win of the season. So the, the expectation, the pressure when they play at home has, has been a difficulty not just this season, last season. It's actually something I'm. I'm writing about at the moment. They've got the joint lowest tally of home points this season with Burnley. So actually saying to them you need to pick up points against Leeds and Chelsea where you historically play badly to avoid a nasty final day of the season where the tension would just be unbearable is actually a little bit more difficult than I think some people have realised.

Matt Davis Adams (8:18)

All right, so not cut and dried in the fight for survival. We'll get back to spurs later but let's switch to the title race. Manchester City limp at the dick on Monday night. Dropped two points against Everton. Means Arsenal's lead at the top stands at 5. Pep's peeps do have a game in hand, Carl. It looked like the citizens were going to bludgeon their way to another title after they beat Arsenal last month. Did you see them dropping points in the way that they did at Everton or did they actually gain one in the end?

Karl Anka (8:46)

I think this was the Everton game when you look at the remaining fixtures was oh that might. If there is going to be a banana skin that was going to be the one to do it. I speak to my friend Mao and he Described it a bit like Arteta's losing the fight. So he's asked his dad for, for a helping hand. And here comes David Moyes. Bop Man City on the nose. Everyone were brilliant for the better part of an hour in this game, I think when it got to three one you're going, oh my goodness, this is it, it's going to happen. And yet Doku provided that tremendous little bit of skill to make it 3:3. And yeah, they've salvaged the point which from what could have been an almighty disaster. Doku's a fascinating player for me in that he spoke. He's done a couple of interviews this year where he says his intention is to become the best winger in the world. And it sounded peculiar when he first said it, like, oh, hang on, you're not that good. And then you sort of look at his body of work and you go, oh, you are. You're not too far away from getting into that top five conversation. Your end product, if you can improve it by maybe 10%, I think you can immediately jump into that conversation of being one of the best, most damaging effective wingers in the world. He's very two footed, he can go beat you inside, outside, he's got that, as we now know, that nice little cut inside and shoot maneuver, it bends into the far post. So the feeling I get with this City team as a non City fan and reporter is get your licks in now because this is the weakest they're going to be for a little bit if they don't win the title. Arsenal going to be like, good, fine, but now they need to, they'll have to go, how do we get another 10, 15% because this city team isn't going to go away anytime soon.

Matt Davis Adams (10:19)

Arsenal wise on Wednesday's fc the question was asked as to whether they're finally embracing the pressure. Joe, do you think that that defeat at the Etihad has allowed them to play with a bit less fear, a bit more freedom and they put Ezra in midfield. That's probably helped as well. Do we just start accepting Declan Rice his word when he says it's not done, rather than just thinking, oh, that's memeable

Jay Harris (10:41)

in terms of embracing the pressure. Definitely losing to Man City at the Etihad, you could see it from even the way some of our colleagues wrote about that performance, as if, okay, Man City now have the advantage even though it was only on goals scored. And I think they were just so glad to get through April because under Arteta, Arsenal always have historically bad Aprils and it was like, let's just move on from that. And now we're sort of embracing the role of underdog again. So I'm just intrigued to see if it's now going to flip back in the other direction with people saying, well, man City have dropped points. You're now in the final of the Champions League. If you don't win any of these trophies, then we are just going to mock you for the rest of time, basically. So yes, I think it's helped, but now it's flipped back the other way and Arsenal hold the advantage again. Like everyone will be expecting them to beat West Ham at the weekend and I'm very intrigued to see how how they handle that because as we've mentioned, West Ham desperately need the points as well. So it's not going to be a

Matt Davis Adams (11:35)

fun game and Manchester City could close the gap to two points. They play Brentford on Saturday and next we'll get into where the Gunners and the Hammers will look to hurt each other on Sunday. I mean, Guns and Hammers would be actually pretty effective at that, but of course they are prohibited.

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Karl Anka (11:59)

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Matt Davis Adams (13:51)

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Jay Harris (15:59)

Foreign

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Matt Davis Adams (16:09)

West Ham need a response then, after their three nil defeat at the gtech last weekend. That was harsh, wasn't it, Carl? I mean, they hit the woodwork three times, had a goal, disallow, disallow for the tightest of offsides. Do you think they got enough to take the game to Arsenal on Sunday or are they better off trying to play for a draw and frustrate them?

Karl Anka (16:27)

I don't think it's wise to try and take the game to Arsenal, regardless of who you are, because this is a team. To my opinion, Arsenal have some of the best out of possession defensive maneuvers in the Premier League, if not in Europe. Gabriel and William Saliba are phenomenal in their defensive work. What they do on the ball, what they do off the ball, how they make sure you cannot chase for those loose balls and whether that falls in the lines of legality or not. Even the thing Mikel Arteta does where he comes out of his touchline area and stands really, really close to the side of the field. So if you're a fullback, you might be like, hang on, he's just like, you know, he looks like he might put a tackle in. Which the Athletico Madrid players got very annoyed at, by the way.

Jay Harris (17:02)

On that note, I'm surprised when more players don't turn around and just say, like, obviously I'm not going to swear, but like, just get, get out of my way. I'm really surprised because if I was in that position, I'd just be like, what are you doing? Like, get off this pitch or I'm going to accidentally barge my shoulder into you next time I take a throw in.

Karl Anka (17:19)

It's fascinating. I didn't realize it until maybe March. Arteta's been doing this all season long of just tiptoe, tiptoe, tiptoe. Which again is the Sometimes great teams are very good at pushing the rules to their absolute limit. Do you want to win in a morally grey area or do you want to lose? Fairly late stage, Wenger. The interpretation was Arsenal was small and weak and nice boys that you can bully. And now this Arsenal team are very, very tall, rugged, have at least six players that can play centre back, and they are pushing everything to their very Limit. And I think if you're an Arsenal fan, you're probably enjoying that shift, you know, from the bullied to the bully. But to go back to the point, I don't think West Ham have the tools to go toe to toe. And also, I think this is. This is also the sort of game that Nuno is very good at prepping his teams for. Not just at West Ham, but we've seen it at Nottingham Forest, we've seen this at Wolverhampton Wanderers. It is that sort of very, very stubborn four, five, one, you know, snowplow of a team that goes, whatever happens, you're not going to get any joy in the middle. You're going to have to beat us out wide and then we've got a couple of players in the box who can head the ball away. And I think West Ham do need wins, but I think this is going to be a Nuno special where they're trying to. They're going to try and win either by a 1 nil in a very, very boring game to watch, or it might end up in a 10 draw.

Matt Davis Adams (18:38)

All right, so if we were looking at individuals, Jay, for West Ham, I guess it's Boeing and Somerville and that's about it in terms of causing Arsenal problems. But based on what Carl's saying, is it more likely to be sling some crosses in, win some corners and look for Thomas Sochek?

Jay Harris (18:53)

I think so. We should point out that West Ham's record at home against Arsenal in the last couple of years has been abysmal. I think it's a five, two defeat and a six nil defeat. But then, strangely, they've not got a bad record at the the Emirates. And Jared Bowen did score on a victory for West Ham at the Emirates a couple of years ago. So Bowen's definitely going to be central to everything they do completely agree that the way for West Ham to sort of win this game is to sort of sit deep, hit Arsenal on the counter. And I just think the slight difficulty that they have, and I remember having this conversation from a Spurs perspective over the last couple of weeks, is that there, there are three games left, including this one. Like, time is limited. At some point, let's say it's the 70th minute and it's nil nil. West Ham have to make a decision as to whether are we happy with a point which puts us level with spurs, they'd have a game in hand and West Ham's got a far more inferior goal difference to spurs, or do we actually need to try and win a game because there are just not enough chances left for them to win games and pick up points. So yes, I'd expect them to sit deep, but I do think there'll be a point in the game where they have to decide whether they open up a little bit more. And that's where it could become quite

Matt Davis Adams (20:01)

interesting in terms of the Arsenal team midfield, the area that we're going to focus on. Jay, you mentioned Miles Lewis Skelly earlier. He started twice in a row in midfield. Do you think he's going to stay there on Sunday?

Jay Harris (20:14)

I think he should stay there. It's certainly been more enjoyable to watch Arsenal in the last couple of games and I think from like an England perspective, you know, Miles lewiskelly, he broke into the team under Thomas Tuchel last year and then his. I don't want to say his development flatlined, but it's been very stop start this season. You could maybe draw a parallel with Kobbie Mainoo, for example. You know, these bright lights that, that burst into existence and then they disappear for a little bit and it's just a reminder that teenage talent in particular, you know, you need to look after them and it takes time, but the way that he progresses the ball with driving runs, with passes, it's really fun to watch and I think I'd like to see over the final few games of the season him make a claim to get back into the to the England squad because to have someone who's versatile enough to play left back and centre mid is a real positive and a bonus for a competition of that nature. So I think the impetus that he's given them is great. But I do also think, and maybe this is just me being a little bit boring, that he's played two intense games back to back after barely featuring at all in the last few months. So there is a, a worry there that if you play him too often in a short period of time that he might become fatigued, he might get injured and you also don't want that to happen. But a Rice Lewis Skelly pairing in midfield I think is quite exciting from an Arsenal fan perspective to watch.

Karl Anka (21:31)

It's real nice. Get him on the plane already. He's, he's in my England World cup squad and he has been since the new year, to which loads of athletic commenters went, why he's barely played football and I went, well, England need left footers, an abundance of leftovers to my mind and the spot next to Declan Rice is going to be one that you're going to need multiple options when you. Particularly when you're playing a North American heap. So Elliot Anderson's going to be number one option, as we've seen. Mainoo has played himself back into consideration, in my opinion. I'm sure Conor Gallagher might have something to say there too. And yeah, Lewis Skelly, absolutely. The difference he gives to Zubamende is just a little bit more aggression. Maybe that's down to youth, maybe that's down to just temperament. And one of the common criticisms of Zubamendi when he was in Spain was he had this reputation for being a little bit soft, particularly if he was up against the bigger Spanish teams. One of the reasons why Arsenal had some difficult results in April is because he just looked knackered. I really want to know what Norgaard is thinking about how his Arsenal season's gone because he's. He's barely played and he should have.

Jay Harris (22:32)

Right. This is.

Karl Anka (22:33)

If there is one thing that I'm still yet to be truly convinced about Arteta, is his ability to rotate his team so it properly starts to peak in April time instead of having that weird, funny 15 minutes. I think he could have avoided some of this, some of these problems if he had played Louis Skelly, Norgaard a little bit more earlier in the season, thereby allowance of Mendy, more time. I'm a big fan of Luis Kelly. I genuinely got quite scared when he got subbed off against Athletico Madrid because I thought, oh God, please don't get injured now, like you're finally getting some minutes. So I think it might be some Mendy just to freshen things up. But this, that shirt and that position. I think Miles Du Eschelli should be playing 20, 30 minutes routinely now. Not just between now and the end of the season, but also next season as well, because this. He's such a. He's such a great player.

Matt Davis Adams (23:25)

All right, we'll wait and see if MLS is a permanent part of the crew if Arteta's into it, if it's evolution, not New England Revolution, if he can be their midfield, Houston Dynamo, if it mitigates the absence of Durian, Portland Timbers, all of that kind of stuff in Arsenal. Yeah, it took me a long time to. To think of all of those. Declan Rice, he's quite punnable as well. Jay. He's also pretty good at football. Broke the deadlock against West Ham when these two met back in October. Man of the midweek. Is he going to be the difference maker for Arsenal yet again? Feels like he's got his mojo Back a little bit in the last few weeks.

Jay Harris (24:00)

Yeah, well, I think Louis Skelly has obviously enabled Declan Rice to play in a slightly different way and they can interchange positions a little bit more. And Louis Kelly's probably a bit more comfortable receiving the ball between the lines under pressure than Zubi Mendy is and sort of using his body quite cleverly to get out of it. We've obviously spoken a little bit about the way we expect West Ham to set up and sit deep, etc. So actually, depending on whether Odegaard can start the game or not, he might be the person to make the difference because that Odegaard Saka, Ben White trio down the right hand side, especially a couple of seasons ago. We know how effective they were at picking holes in opposition teams. And I think E and Odegaard are both attacking midfielders, but they play the game in a very different way. And I think when you're coming up against a team who are going to sit deep and try to hit you on the counter, you sort of need Odegaard slightly better vision and passing range and creativity in that final third on the edge of the box to sort of get Joes and Martinelli or Trossard or Saka, whoever it is, into good shooting positions. So I'd actually say if Odegaard can start, then he might be the difference maker.

Matt Davis Adams (25:03)

Okay, well, Arsenal three wins away from their first Premier League title in 22 years. West Ham fighting for their lives to survive gives a prediction then.

Karl Anka (25:11)

Karl, I'm going to go maximum chaos. 1 1.

Matt Davis Adams (25:16)

Jay. Point shared. Or is somebody going to walk away with all of them?

Jay Harris (25:19)

No, I'm going to go a nervy two on Arsenal win.

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This is the Athletic FC podcast, proudly sponsored by Betfair.

Matt Davis Adams (25:27)

Right, this is the part of the show where with the help of our partners, Betfair, we show you how you can play in a different league this season. James Mackie's back with us. James, we had a winner of sorts last week.

James Mackie (25:38)

Yeah, we had a winner, Matt. And look, there was a few things that went right for us, a few stipulations. Isaac was voided, he's part of the sel. But Bruno Fernandes did get his assist under Betfair's rules of paying out, under the fantasy rules of paying out on the assist. And Luke Shaw got carded. So a 7 to 2 winner last week, Matt.

Matt Davis Adams (25:57)

Excellent. Well, let's see if we can repeat the trick today. We'll start with the match odds though. West Ham, the Arsenal is the game that we're looking at. Huge one for both of these sides. How do you see it going?

James Mackie (26:07)

Yeah. The Betfair Sportsman has the home side west ham as the 72 outsiders in what is a huge game for them when it comes to relegation this season. Unfortunately though, the stats are against the Irons as They have lost 38 Premier League games against Arsenal. They've only lost more against Liverpool with 39. So Arsenal are the big bogey team for West Ham. Arsenal, off the back of that are the one to two favorites to take all three points and on paper puts them on the cusp of lifting their first Premier League title in over 20 years. And Arsenal have won their last two away league games against West Ham, winning 60 in the 2023, 24 season and 52 in the last season. The draw mat is priced at 5 to 2 and probably a result that West Ham would take but not be so good for Arsenal, which would let City back into the title race. We'll have to wait and see.

Matt Davis Adams (26:55)

All right, bet builder wise then we've got two players who want to be a part of Thomas Tuchel's World cup squad and a striker who's found his form involved this week.

Jay Harris (27:04)

Yeah, let's try.

James Mackie (27:05)

Let's try and get another winner across the board and a bit, a bit more simpler this time in hopefully all the selections are runners, but this week's bet builder very player heavy. Center around the info players for both Arsenal and West Ham. We'll start with West Ham's Jared Bowen, who has seven assists across his last six home Premier League appearances for West Ham. He's 15 to 8 to either score or assist on on Sunday, which I thought was actually quite a value prize for that run. Next we'll focus on Arsenal's players and firstly be Kaya Saka, who's been involved in more Premier League goals against West Ham than any other opponent. Five goals and four assists with these nine involvements coming in his last eight appearances against them. He's five to six to either score or assist in the game on Sunday. And finally, Victor Gokarez has scored nine goals in his last 12 Premier League appearances. He's really hit a nice run of form for the Gunners. That's the most of any player in this time frame as well. He's 13 to 10 to score any time at the weekend. So Overall, Matt, those three selections come together around a 9 to 1 bet builder. And the beauty of the markets discussed in the bet is that they all have say sub attached to them, meaning that leg of the bet hasn't won and the player comes off that player that comes on replaces that leg of the bet.

Matt Davis Adams (28:14)

Brilliant. Sounds good to me James. Appreciate your time. We'll catch up with you soon.

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Matt Davis Adams (28:22)

We touched on spurs earlier. They got a surprise win at Villa park last weekend. Surprising. Before the team sheets dropped at least it saw them climb out of the bottom three. Their host leads on Monday night. Jay, you were saying earlier that it's not done by any means in terms of their survival but how's the mood around the club changed in the last few weeks from your reporting thereon?

Jay Harris (28:42)

Yeah, it's been transformed and I think some of the messaging Roberto de Zerbi said publicly and privately has has had a huge impact. The the one I remember is after they drew to all with with Brighton and Obian and Georgina Ruta scored late on. You know, de Zerbi said anybody who comes to the the training ground on Monday and is not smiling I'm going to send them straight back. He just has tried to to sort of cut out the external noise. You know I, I don't want to go too doom and gloom because I've done doom and gloom all season covering spurs and I know I mentioned their home record earlier but the, the fact remains they are still missing Xavi Siemens Dominic Solanke is likely to miss leads but be available against Chelsea Mohamed Kudos Caviar is Carl it's not looking good that he's going to play again this season even if he's going to make it to the, to the World Cup. So there's a lot of attacking talent that's unavailable for Spurs. Leeds are in great form and so I do think it will be tricky but I think someone who's gone slightly under the radar in the last couple of weeks is Rodrigo Benton Kerr. I don't think it's a coincidence that since he's come back spurs have taken seven points for the three games he started. So he's the one I'd look to to sort of dictate the tempo, get spurs moving and then they sort of need to rely on maybe Matisse tell Richarlison Conor Gallagher producing something up front again to get the three points.

Karl Anka (30:00)

I've been intrigued by De Zerbi's use of Conor Gallagher particularly last week it was a little bit more aggressive, a little more of a classic number 10. I mean to my mind Colin Gallagher's a box crashing ape. Sort of Frank Lampard's third nephew once removed. You know that sort of thing. So this more. This more of an on ball creator for Gallagher in these last two games in particular I'm like okay, this is the very. It's not quite deserving football as you know. But he's definitely being pragmatic and looking at his squad and going I've got no Simmons, I've got no Madison, I've got no Kudus. How do I get some form of creative ability? And he's entrusted a football player with four lungs and eight legs and can get up and down the field over and over and over again. So yeah, yeah, I like that. Richarlison all the memes about relegation. Rishi He's a player who doesn't blink when it gets quite difficult. He might not always score but he's a player I like a lot. Can you tell me a little bit more about the fullback situation now because who's does Zerby beginning to lean towards at fullback for Spurs?

Jay Harris (31:04)

Yeah. So Pedro Porro at right back and destiny a doggy when he's available at left back. But the problem is a doggy throughout his free season at spurs has had so many recurring hamstring issues that it's difficult to sort of rely on him throughout the course of the season. We know that Jed Spence is capable of playing on the left or right and mainly has played on the left covering for a doggy when he switched on. Spence is an incredibly good 1v1 defender. He's good on the overlap but it just doesn't look perfect. It looks a bit clunky when he plays on the left because if he's playing with an inverted winger like Tell or Auduber then you. Then they end up sort of taking up the same spaces. They all want to come inside. So I think a doggy has made quite a big difference. But as I've said the frustration is he plays for two games and then he misses two games. He plays for two games, misses two games. But certainly his availability over the last couple of games has made a little bit of a difference. Just to give it a little bit more fluid and natural dynamic down that left hand side. You know you said it a minute ago about England, it sounds so obvious but having a left footed player on the left hand side of the pitch is actually quite crucial.

Matt Davis Adams (32:15)

Leads wise. Jay's mentioned earlier Carl about about spurs home troubles. That's be something Leeds are looking to pray on. I just had to look at their away record. It's pretty incredible. In the Premier League they've lost one of their last ten I mean they've drawn eight of those games but they're not coming here. D mob happy, right? If they win, that will be them safe. But they're not quite there yet. So this is still a dangerous opponent for Tottenham.

Karl Anka (32:36)

They're one win away from home. It's Old Trafford, isn't it? So you know, one of the very few stadiums where they're going to get a stat boost and be truly up for it. This Leeds team is fascinating. From the recruitment to making sure they get all their six. You know, I think it was all of their players signing. Some were over 6 foot and they very much went let's try and meet the Premier League where it is and meet this current moment. I think Anton Statch has been tremendous for them. He's the sort of player that could easily be playing Champions League football. But the fact Leeds have picked him up and the fact that he's been up for it and fired up and he set piece deliveries probably worth four to six points this season alone. Yeah, there is a lot to like about this Leeds team and how they've built a squad properly capable of Premier League football. This is what a fixture that my old football coach would say. These lots, they're no mugs. Be on guard. So yeah, if there is, if Leeds are to get another away victory, I think this could be the one.

Matt Davis Adams (33:33)

Back in North London for the first time after that flat performance in the FA cup semi final. That one's on Monday night. And now then all three UEFA finals will feature English sides this season. It's the first time that that has happened. Aston Villa faced Freiburg in the Europa League final in Istanbul after they overcame Forest in the semi. I have reworded this section of the show which originally said hammered Forest in the semi but I'm not quite there yet. Crystal palace saw off Shakhtar Danx to reach the Conference League final. They'll take on Rayo Vallecano in Leipzig. Forest have got Newcastle at home on Sunday and all of a sudden Kyle, I'm a bit worried again. Quite tough to pick themselves up off the floor and basically all the best players are injured.

Karl Anka (34:15)

Yeah, I'm really sorry Morgan Gibbs White but that looks like he's going to leave a very gnarly scar. He was on the bench. Did he warm up at least?

Matt Davis Adams (34:25)

I think he was there just in case it went to pens and he could do that. I think that was literally it.

Karl Anka (34:30)

That's good to know. I'd be surprised if he's heading a football this weekend or being asked to Play football with his feet this weekend. Maybe break glass in case of emergency or the final weekend of the season with Forest. I think just pick yourselves up and go again. Victor Pereira, he strikes me as someone who's been good at emotional regulation. At his time at two or three other clubs, when things were good at Wolves, he was quite good at going, all right, let's not get too high, let's not get too low. Let's remember what the important stuff is. So I think, yeah, I think Forest is safe. They had a nice little splurge of points at the correct time and they made hay over a particularly weak Chelsea team and they should be out of it. So. Difficult week, but okay.

Jay Harris (35:14)

Do you want me to make you feel better, Matt?

Matt Davis Adams (35:15)

Yes, please.

Jay Harris (35:17)

You're six points ahead of West Ham and they have three games left and your goal difference is far superior. So I wouldn't stress too much. I can't even tell you the last time a team got relegated on 42 points. But I think it's at least 15, 20 years ago. So I think you can sleep easy from this point onwards.

Matt Davis Adams (35:36)

All right. My only fear is that Sunday's a bit of an emotional dump. And then it's Old Trafford, which is tricky, and then it's Bournemouth on the last au Forest never, ever, ever, ever beat. So they lost to Villa midweek. Villa go to Burnley on Sunday. Their league form has dipped, Jay, in recent weeks, but they face Burnley this weekend, so that'll change.

Jay Harris (35:55)

Yeah, they face Michael Jackson inspired Burnley. So I'm sure you can come up with a better joke than I can. Villa are a strange one because it seemed like they're in sort of total turmoil this time a week ago when they lost the first leg. And it feels like there's just always this intense pressure on them to get into the Champions League because of their financial situation. But you'd still expect them to comfortably rollover Burnley because I don't mean this disrespectfully. It's going to sound like it, but I don't really know what Burnley are playing for at this point. It's been obvious for months and months that they were getting relegated. Scott Parker's gone. What is there to to do, really, than sort of just squeeze through these final three games and then have a reset?

Karl Anka (36:34)

It's not quite on the beach because it's not a happy place.

Jay Harris (36:36)

Exactly.

Karl Anka (36:38)

I mean, the thing with Villa is they've just had a lot of injuries. So Victor Lindelof played in defensive midfield on Thursday in something that made all The United fans go you up. Dan Bardell, a very good Aston Villa fan and podcaster, explained that it was very much Lindelof dropping deep when Matty Cash got forward to form a back three, which is. That's such an emery way to make sure you get square pegs into square holes. Even though the team might be depleted, the fact that John McGinn is back has really helped smooth things over. I'll be interested to see if John McGinn starts on the weekend, because I have a sneaky suspicion that two or three of those players are hungover as we're talking on a Friday morning. But yeah, yeah, this, this should be a fairly straightforward victory, maybe a chance for two or three Aston Villa fringe players. That feels weird to say when I've just said they've had a couple of injuries, but players that you're not normally used to seeing in a starting lineup get a couple of minutes this weekend because, yeah, as Jay has politely said, but I'm going to be a bit meaner. This Burnley team, they're just some dudes

Matt Davis Adams (37:36)

hiding to nothing for Michael Jackson. He can't be expected to heal Burnley, never mind heal the world, I suppose. Crystal palace against Everton. Jay, I mean, all eyes on the Conference League final, obviously, and it's felt like it's been all eyes on the Conference League for a few weeks now. I just wonder if they maybe need one more point to survive. They're on 43, but their running's tough. Right, they've got Everton, then it's Man City and Brentford away and are still at home. Are they already there? You in terms of being a Premier League concern next term?

Jay Harris (38:06)

I think so. Like I said a minute ago, because of the. The gap they've got to West Ham, they would need West Ham to pick up seven points out of nine in the next three, which I just don't see happening. I think in terms of Everton, this is, this is the sort of game they need to win if they want to have any hope of sort of staying in that conversation for qualifying for European football next season. So you sort of expect them to come out firing. Maybe they'll be in a slightly strange headspace after coming so close to beating Man City and then sort of conceding that late equalizer. But their performances under David Moyes have been pretty decent over the last couple of months and you can sort of see them getting a point or maybe winning at Selhurst Park.

Matt Davis Adams (38:45)

All right, next today we're going to switch our attention to the race for Europe.

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Karl Anka (40:41)

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Matt Davis Adams (41:43)

Manchester United confirm their place in next season's Champions League. They take on Sunderland at the Stadium of Light on Saturday. Carl's going to be in attendance for this one. Where are we at on the Michael Carrick discourse? Karl do you want to see him in the dugout next season? What can he do in the next few games to to persuade the higher ups to give him the job permanently or has he done all he can already?

Karl Anka (42:04)

I think it was interesting that he did his press conference on Thursday and he said he'd like some clarity over the situation, which is the first time Michael Carrick mildly let on to the fact that he's like lads, come on. I don't think it was him saying confirm it, but saying a little bit more clarity would was interesting. I think the direction of travel is he will probably get it now. United, the noises coming inside and around the club has been they they want to make sure the decision happens after the season is over. They want to look still look at some external candidates. However, you're looking at the external candidates now and unless they are going to go for Premier League manager who is going to be out of contract. So Klasner Iriola, Marco Silva, which I doubt Ireiola perhaps is the most intriguing one there but I'm not quite sure if Iriola has the the intangibles necessary to take care of a club of the size of Manchester United despite his brilliant work with Bournemouth so far. So I suppose they will make some sort of feeble attempt to interview an external candidate but then give it to Carrick before the World cup begins is my guesstimation. This is based on very little. I don't have the phone book of David Ornstein, I don't have the phone book of Laurie Whitwell. But I I'd be quite surprised if it's not Michael Carrick who's going to be in the dugout next season because he's done such a good job with this in this interim as well. He's put square pegs and square holes and he's made one of the things that sticks out is a lot of the interviews post match mixone bits of all the players. They often talk about clarity, they talk about simplicity that they talk about knowing what that needs to be done and wanting to do it. Mainoo said he would die for Carrick. Kunya said he'd like to keep him. Ahmad said it's not up to him but he'd like to keep him as well. So he's got buy in from addressing him. That was supposed to be the most complicated dressing room in Europe. At least until Real Madrid started having a weekend fight.

Matt Davis Adams (43:58)

Club certainly helped Carrick's cause. Beaten Liverpool as well. That's something every Manchester United coach wants to do. Liverpool kick off the weekend's action, therefore the level on points with Aston Villa and they host Chelsea on Saturday lunchtime. Feels like a good bounce back game for Arnold slot then. Jay, after what happened last week, yeah, definitely.

Jay Harris (44:19)

As we've said, Chelsea are just in sort of complete freefall at the moment. You know it better than myself and Carl but if there's any opponent you'd pick to play in the division at the moment it's probably Burnley or Chelsea. Right. Which is quite damning. But Liverpool are in such a strange place at the moment. I think this is one of their two final games at Anfield. They want to sort of send those players who are leaving this season out on a high. They still sort of need to, to pick up a couple of points just to make sure that Champions League is is secured. But I think it's more just the manner of erratic performances over the last few weeks which they need to to turn around and just show that there's some reason for optimism next season if Arnold Slot stays in charge. Because the last couple of months have just been erratic performance after erratic performance. And I don't watch Liverpool too much but it seems like just when they string two or three results together they'll go and do something wild like B2 nil down to United after 15 minutes or whatever it was on the weekend. So yeah, I think the pressure is on Liverpool to win that game convincingly because anything other than that will just further raise more eyebrows as to what on earth is going on there.

Karl Anka (45:24)

I don't know if Liverpool can win games convincingly. They can absolutely win games. They've got enough talent in, in both penalty areas, you know. Dominic S, despite everything has had a phenomenal season but winning games convincing. I'm not sure I'm looking at this. I'm Liverpool so bad off the ball, so real. What are you trying to do? I think a huge part of it is the fact that Alexis McAllister just doesn't look the same as he did last season. I believe he had some sort of surgery for a hernia problem. He was nursing towards the end of last season and he's come back and his hips are a little bit like the Tin Man. Unfortunately, he cannot twist and turn and be as mobile as he used to. And that causes so many problems when you've got a player like Gravenberg, who is a very good shuttler, but perhaps not a passer, and also was given license at the start of season to get forward. So they're so porous in midfield at times and the problem's out wide.

Matt Davis Adams (46:24)

All right, well, my response to that car will be they're taking on a Chelsea team with no permanent manager, no wins in six Premier League games in which time they've scored one goal, no fit wingers, no first choice goalie, could finish 16th, about to get beaten three nil in the FA cup final next weekend. I wonder, and I kind of see some comparisons with Chelsea and Man United, would a season without European football do them some good? I mean, there was all that chaos and venom against the ownership at United and it all felt a bit up in the air. And then a season where they play, what, 40 games instead of 60, and getting the right man in charge eventually seems to have completely changed the mood and their position in the league. Is that where Chelsea. Chelsea should be looking for inspiration?

Karl Anka (47:09)

Possibly. The turnaround at Manchester United was down to one. They had one of the best post windows, you know, one of the best summer transfer windows they've had since retirement. All three attacking players have contributed in vital moments and they. And they got a good goalkeeper in. That has just brought calm to the defense. It's also due to the fact that they have a very, very good attacking midfielder in Bruno Fernandes who's able to do the job of four or five or six players with Chelsea. I can see the possible not have European stuff. One game a week and we can focus on the training ground, but recruitment needs to be absolutely bang on this summer. And I could not tell you what Chelsea's transfer strategy is in terms of having a creative player. On the level of Bruno Fernandes. I don't think someone exists in the Premier League. And the problem I have right now is the closest analog to Bruno Fernandes, Chelsea, as is Cole Palmer, who, and you will know far more about this than I do, he looks like he should be getting surgery, but isn't getting surgery because he wants to go to the World Cup. He looks like football hurts to play right now and he doesn't look happy. And that's really sad because Cole Palmer in full flow is phenomenal. But he just. I look at your front, the front three options and the strongest front three, Xiao Pedro, Pedro Neto and Esteval Esteval's got. They were saying it was a grade four hamstring tear, which quite frankly, I've never heard of. I've heard of grade threes that take you out for three months, but a grade four, I'm like, oh, these hamstrings looking like Paul Pork. So take him out. And Yao Pedro, good football player. Pedro Neto, above average. So much money has been spent as Chelsea team, and they don't have the requisite quality for money spent. And I think that's the problem I have with Chelsea. I don't think going to one game necessarily solves all that. Chelsea are the person that's won a lottery ticket or gotten a bunch of money and they've bought a load of designer clothes and they're putting it all on and they don't dress well because they don't know the basics. Where is your white T shirt? Where is your dependable Levi jeans? Like, come on, mate. Moises Caicedo, I must say, is a very fine football player.

Matt Davis Adams (49:15)

He's a knackered football player, though, and that's a problem for quite a lot of them at the moment. Elsewhere, a few games with European qualification implications for what I'm calling the B Sharps. That's Bournemouth who go to Fulham. Brighton who take on Wolves. And we mentioned Brentford's trip to the Etihad earlier. Brentford are seventh between the Cherries and the Seagulls. Jay is a club that you know very well. What would it mean for them to be in Europe next season? Would you worry about the impact on their Premier League campaign, or is that just me being a Debbie Downer?

Jay Harris (49:45)

No, no, I would worry a little bit. But having said that, Brentford are a club who have routinely made people eat their words, myself included, because I raised my eyebrows about the appointment of Keith Andrews last summer. But I did say, if there's any club hierarchy who deserve credit in the bank and you should sort of trust them to make the right decision in that regard. It was Brentford and they. They've proved absolutely everybody right in that regard. Getting to Europe would just be a phenomenal next chapter of their story, because who knows where Brentford go? You know, this would be five years since the championship playoff final. So to have established themselves as a Premier League team and then to have got into Europe in that such a short time frame, to have sold key players like Tony and Bumo Raya Visser, to have lost their head coach, Thomas Frank, and brought in Keith Andrews to sort of go through all that change in turmoil and still sort of Improve year on, year on would be remarkable. And you know, I really want them to get into the Conference League of the Europa League and see what they can do because I think it would just be a phenomenal story. They've never been in Europe before. There are still fans who I occasionally speak to who say being in the Premier League is still a dream for us because for so long we were in League two, League one collecting money outside Griffin park because the club was bust and in just financial, a dire financial situation. So for them to have the prospect of maybe going to on a way trip in Belgium next season or the Netherlands or Poland or whatever, it would just be out of their wildest dreams. So I truly hope it happens.

Karl Anka (51:14)

Brentford and Brentford's first team I think would suit European football well. This, this rugged long throw in counter attack play. They're very, very physical, the physical team in the Premier League which means they will be the apex predator of the Conference League and probably end up hurting quite a few teams in the Europa League. It's that bit where you get on that Thursday Sunday treadmill. I'm not sure if two of their best play if Igor Thiago got injured or if Jensen got injured, would they necessarily have someone who can patch things in? You would say I would. I trust Brentford's recruitment team to go right, okay now we're going to play an extra six or eight games next season. This is how we recruit and thicken out our squad properly for it. I'd like to see it happen. I'm not sure if it's going to be as entertaining for Brentford fans as it could be for the curious outsider. Just want to see how these boys work.

Jay Harris (52:07)

I just think just quickly if you look at, as you've mentioned, Brentford's front three of Schada, Thiago, Dango, they've all had pretty good seasons. But then the players after that, Reiss Nelson's been injured so they'd need to make sure that they had an adequate backup. They probably need two adequate backups. K Fiero is a young striker who only arrived in Club Bruges, I think it was in January. I actually just reported with our colleague said Stafford Bloor the other day that they're trying to sign Yannick Schuster who's this talented Austria under 21 international. They would definitely need to sort of expand the squad because as you said, the starting 11 is strong and even players like Rico Henry, Aaron Hickey, Christopher Ayer, who haven't played that much this season, they're Premier League, not veterans. But they've got a lot of Premier League experience. The issue is they're not reliable in terms of from. From an injury and fitness perspective. So they definitely need to to tweak a few things. There need to be some investment. I'm sure some people will come sniffing around Thiago and Charda in the summer anyways. So how they deal with all that would have a big bearing on how they cope. That twin challenge of Premier League and Europe.

Matt Davis Adams (53:09)

Let's finish on Bournemouth then. Lots of comparisons I think between they and and Brentford. If Villa remain fifth and win the Europa League. Bournemouth, if they stay in six would get a Champions League place due to the extra performance related slot. If Liverpool finish fourth, that'd be a slot related performance. Where was I, Carla? I just wonder if, if Andeni Iriola might actually have gone a bit too soon. I mean what happens if Bournemouth qualified for the Champions League? Is he all. Actually I've changed my mind.

Karl Anka (53:38)

I mean I was surprised that he was not going to Athletic Bilbao. So the Spanish club this week announced that they're going to give a two year deal to Edin Terzik, the former Dortmund manager. Which is real, huh? Because I was there when United Drew Bournemouth 11 not too long ago and Nira was asked flat out like hey, the bill bao job's going to be available. Do you want it? And it's like no, no, no, no. And it felt to me like many managed oh no, I've definitely not already looked at houses in that area. So yeah, Iriola is a fascinating one in. He's proven himself absolutely phenomenal coach at a certain weight class and now the question challenge is is he good enough to go to a higher weight class? I am sure Chelsea have tried contacting him. It looked for a little bit like Manchester United might have been interested from a my mate thinks your mate mate is fit. That sort of work. So yeah, if there is a door open for IRO to come back and take care of Bournemouth and the Champions League, I hope that can happen. The thing I am always fascinated with this Bournemouth team is yeah there are games where it's when they play a really, really good performance at home and then like pans up to that booth where all the injured players are sat watching it and I'm going it's amazing that you're able to do this despite having so many players out. Is the way you're playing breaking players and causing problems and is that going to be sustainable? Is that going to be feasible if you start playing midweek fixtures as well. I don't know the answer to it. I would love to see the answer to it. I think Bournemouth Rise has been phenomenal and when they are in full flow and playing great football it is a joy to watch.

Matt Davis Adams (55:16)

Sure is. I mean Andonia would have to buy Marco Rosa a very nice gift, wasn't he? If he was going to backtrack and say, actually I think I'd rather stay on. So maybe not that likely. But still fascinating to see how it shakes out in the race for Europe. The title fight, the relegation battle, all that good stuff. We are very much at the business end of the season, but we are also at the end of today's pod brilliant weekend of Premier League action to come. Enjoy it if you can. My thanks to Carl and J and producers Jay and John and to you for listening. Have a great weekend. We'll catch up with you soon.

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Karl Anka (57:39)

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