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- [00:01]
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- [00:31]
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- [01:05]
Athletic FC Sponsor Announcer
This episode of the Athletic FC is sponsored by boss, businesswear provider for the US Men's national soccer team. Long before kickoff, the performance has already begun. For the players, the crest is not simply worn, it's earned. Boss understands what it takes to build something worthy of a crest. Constant refinement, precision in every stitch. And as the USMNT steps into the spotlight on home soil, the BOSS is outfitting those who wear the badge, empowering them to step forward with confidence, express their individuality and be their own Boss. In relaxed, lightweight and breathable tailoring from Boss Performance and soccer fans. BOSS has you covered too. Whether you want to look and feel as sharp as your hero's embossed performance, or show your pride from the stands in jerseys, polos and jackets in national colors and badges. Own the moment with confidence. Discover the Boss performance collection as worn by the US Men's national soccer team and the fan capsule of jerseys, polos and jackets in national colors. Wear your passion your way and be your own boss@boss.com or at your nearest Boss store, the Athletic FC.
- [02:13]
Adam Leventhal
Hi there and welcome to the Athletic FC podcast with me, Adam Levanthal. So Jude Bellingham and Harry Kane stepped up as England topped Group L, but are we convinced by Thomas Tuchel's side as the knockouts begin? Well, with me today are Tim Spears and Art d'. Rocher. Are we excited? The knockouts are about to start.
- [02:37]
Tim Spears
Tim yeah, this is. Yeah, the draw's really good, actually. It's very, very exciting. Very appealing. There Were some big matchups in there. And yeah, we discussed on the last pod, Adam, that the last round of the group stage wasn't quite living up to expectations. But we got some good drama on the last day and certainly with, you know, pretty much the last kick of the group stage in terms the Austria match. So, yeah, we got some. Got some good drama.
- [03:00]
Adam Leventhal
We did, we did. And I mean, it's important. We've discussed it before on the show. How much of it were you able to take in the wee small hours?
- [03:09]
Art d'Rocher
Yeah, for me it was just the England game and then catching up on all the rest of the action. So I think what's been really nice is just as Tim mentioned on his first appearance was not being spoiled overnight. So, thankfully, the highlights on YouTube that I've been watching, they don't include the scoreline in the. In the title or the thumbnail. So, yeah, I was able to catch up quite nicely this morning.
- [03:34]
Adam Leventhal
Let's start with England. Two nil winners over Panama finished top of the group. Croatia beat Ghana 2:1. They also went through in second and third, respectively. But at the MetLife for us was our England correspondent, Jack Pitt. Brook, let's check in with what he thought about it.
- [03:52]
Jack Pitt
Didn't think it was an amazing England performance. Bellingham was obviously the best player. I think the big issue I have with England is they conceded so many chances on the break. Just. Just the same as with the Ghana game as here against Panama, England look a bit too open. I wonder that will probably be what does for them if they come up against a better team later on in the tournament. England have got a bit of a problem in defense, I think. Rhys James obviously has a hamstring injury. We saw Jarell Quansah, who played it right back today. He went off with an ankle injury as well here in the second half. And that means that really the only fit fullbacks they have now are Nico O'Reilly, who started left back, and then Jed Spence, who came on at right back. John Stone's played the first game, hasn't played since then. And I think England suddenly look a little bit short of numbers in defence. I'm not really sure what the solution is, whether perhaps it involves bringing in a chalaba or moving ESRI Konsa over to right back down the line. But I think those selection issues in defence will probably be the biggest talking point between now and the Congo game. And of course, the return of Declan Rice. England missed Rice today. He didn't start. And I think England just looked really open without Rice there alongside Anderson to sweep up in the middle of the pitch. But that's the end of England's group stage. Now it's on to the knockouts.
- [05:09]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah, thanks very much to Jack. Let's pull on a few of those threads. Tim, let me come to you on first of all, the fact that England are top of the group. Everyone should rejoice and relax. Or is it actually a benefit as we kick on now with the knockouts?
- [05:27]
Tim Spears
Certain certainly is. For their first match, it's Dr. Congo and it could have been Portugal if they finish second. So, yeah, the route is sort of Dr. Congo, probably Mexico in Mexico, which, yeah, is tough, but that's. That would be an absolutely fabulous occasion. And then Brazil in the quarters, you know, we're all projecting. And second would have met Portugal, Spain and then maybe sort of Belgium, USA in the quarters. So, yeah, the logistics of it matter in terms of where they travel, but I'd be more bothered about sort of the difficulty and getting through the next couple of rounds and trying to build some. Some momentum, you know, ahead of what we hope will be sort of a last four appearance. That's got to be their minimum stated aims against the semi finals. So, yeah, it was really important to top the group. I don't think they were particularly convincing, but they've topped the group and that's the main thing.
- [06:09]
Adam Leventhal
What was your take on it, Art? Because obviously there were a number of changes made by Thomas Tuchel, some due to injury. We had Saka and Rashford in from the start, obviously Declan Rice on the bench. Rodgers was starting in there as well. Alterations at the back, which we'll come to. Were you happy with it?
- [06:31]
Art d'Rocher
Hmm. I'm not sure if happy is the word I would use, but for me, I feel like sometimes it's dangerous when you're going into games expecting to be, let's say, one or two and up by half time, because then if you're not, you're automatically disappointed. And I think that's probably the wrong way to go about it. I think for me, in the first, let's say 15, 20 minutes, I was actually quite pleased with how both the wingers were playing because after the first two games, a lot of people were waiting to see Saka and Rashford and what they could do. I thought with Rashford in particular, his willingness to just, you know, get the ball out of his feet straight away and put a cross into the box was quite refreshing after what Anthony Gordon's been doing in the first two games. So for me, I wouldn't say like I was overly happy. But again, a set piece, as we've come to be familiar with in the Premier League is what broke the deadlock. And I think everybody's kind of fine with set pieces now, even if they weren't during the season. So, yeah, I mean, it was one where I think they just had to get a job done and they did that.
- [07:37]
Adam Leventhal
Well, let's deal with the defence, Tim. Obviously Gerald Quansah started. Rhys James, we know, was injured for the game. Has Thomas Tuchel got it wrong not having Trent Alexander Arnold in there? Or is that just sort of natural World cup clamour and, you know, fans just trying to look in another direction, even though probably England do have enough?
- [08:01]
Tim Spears
No, I think we all said this at the time when he sort of picked the group. I don't think anyone's sort of, you know, getting clever after the fact. I mean, in the last four years, Rhys James has suffered 14 different injuries, many of which have been, you know, lengthy absences. Six of those 14 injuries have been hamstring related. So for Tuchel to say in his presser, we didn't see this coming. Well, I mean, I did, to be honest. I absolutely love the guy, but he's made of glass, you know, so to not kind of anticipate that that would happen because if England want to win this tournament, he'd have to play eight games in a row or, you know, or seven of eight games if you're resting for one of the groups. So he doesn't do that too often in his sort of recent career. So to not pick a sort of a. To not pick a guaranteed replacement at right back is completely baffling to me, to be honest. And now his replacement, Quansa, who wasn't convincing me anyway, I thought he had a really shaky game and Boiler Cats hadn't even done that well in the Bundesliga last season. He wasn't like he was ripping it up out there. So it's just a bit strange that the likes of, yes, Trent Alexander Arnold, but even like Lewis hall been, you know, a sort of. Or Luke Shaw been an orthodox fullback. They don't really have orthodox fullbacks in the, in the squad, so it's strange. You know, I looked at the back four last night of Quansa. It's a lovely little Rhyme, Gay and O'Reilly. And there's no way that England win the World cup without back four. I'm sorry, but they don't. And yeah, as soon as they come up against a really good attacking team, which they haven't yet, by the way. Then I don't see that defense holding up, to be honest.
- [09:34]
Adam Leventhal
Do you concur on that? That they're not going to win the World cup with the defensive department that they have?
- [09:39]
Art d'Rocher
Yeah, it's not where the strengths lie in their team. And to Tim's point on both fullback areas. I think when we've looked at the squad in previous tournaments, there's always been a bit of a confusion about right footers playing at left back with Kieran Trippier, for instance, and we're looking at this group. You've got the same against Ghana with Jed Spence playing there. I know he's played on the right side when Quansa came off injured, but also for me, when it comes to the selection, I do wonder how big a deal Thomas Tuchel put into the under 21 Euros last summer. So obviously England came out as winners in that tournament and I was out there covering it. And I remember at the time there was a lot of talk about how a lot of that group were actually given the goal of this summer and the World cup and how Tuchel was keeping an eye on it. And of course Livermento from Newcastle was his primary pick for right back other than Rhys James played in that tournament and that was Livermento's first ever tournament experience with England. Quansa was there as well, playing center back of course. But I do wonder how, how much stock Tuchel put into that tournament and what he saw because again, Elliot Anderson was another standout player from that, that tournament as well. And I just feel like he's maybe seen those guys perform there and felt maybe, okay, maybe they can replicate it for the seniors this summer. But of course not having Trent especially is quite confusing.
- [11:11]
Tim Spears
He may sort of stumble on a formula, but I don't think he knows his best 11, to be honest. Other than sort of Pickford and Kane and then the midfield trio of like Rice, Anderson and Bellingham, no one else has sort of cemented their place during this tournament. He's rotated in the other positions, but it feels like he's trying to work out what his best 11 is. And I guess he hasn't necessarily been in the job sort of too long, 18 months. But to be at the World cup and still sort of trying to find your best team and your best almost style of play as well. Again that doesn't look England may get to semi final great, but we're looking for them to win the tournament. That's their stated aim and I'm not sure how they do that while they're still trying to figure out their best team.
- [11:50]
Adam Leventhal
I hate to inject some positivity into this discussion. Let's talk about Jude Bellingham because he certainly did step up when England needed him, obviously scored the first set up the second. He's a reason to be cheerful. He's a game changer, Tim.
- [12:08]
Tim Spears
Yeah, no, definitely, yeah. And you know, the actual sort of the intent and the movement of the team, as sort of Art was saying earlier, particularly at the start of the game, was like really good to be honest. It was just that the quality was really, really bad, like ballooning crosses behind out of play or really bad misplaced passes. And we know that they can do better than that, so that perhaps bodes well for me. We know Rashford and can do better, but in Bellingham, yeah, he provided that quality that was really lacking with his finish for the first goal and then his, his assist for the second. And this was, this was like the best of Bellingham. All action, taking the game by the scruff of the neck. A bit of a virtuoso performance with his sort of, you know, his main character energy. This is him at his sort of very best. And I think from the evidence of England's three matches, they desperately need him to step up and be that player because other than him and Kane, everyone else is sort of underwhelmed in attacking areas. I think, you know, you say Gordon, Saka, Madwaque, Rashford have all underwhelmed to an extent. Bellingham and Kane are the only genuinely two world class players that England have. I think we're seeing that now and if they can step up, then, yeah, England still have a chance of doing something decent in this tournament and they both look in really good form to me.
- [13:21]
Adam Leventhal
I'd be interested to get people's thoughts if you want to drop your lineup for England's next game against Dr. Congo in the comments, wherever you're listening to this podcast or if you're watching on YouTube, drop them in there because it's always good to see what you think as well. Let's get your teams then for DRC Art.
- [13:39]
Art d'Rocher
So obviously Pickford and goal. I guess Spence has to play right back now again. He's gone with Konza and Gehe twice now in a row. But neither of those games have been convincing. No, but neither is John Stones when he played. So I don't know whether you have to go with Konza and Gehe just by default again and hope that they iron out those issues. Nico O'Reilly, left back, same midfield as usual. So Anderson, Rice, Bellingham. Then I'd go Saka, Rashford, Kane. The other thing I forgot to mention I liked about Rashford and Saka, even though the execution was in there, was rather than just staying out wide, they actually did try and cut inside and get shots off as well. There was the early one from Rashford that went just wide and that's something that I don't think and Gordon were doing enough in terms of, you know, disrupting the opposition defense and giving them more than one problem to solve.
- [14:39]
Adam Leventhal
Tim, are there any differences to the team that aren't named that you would make?
- [14:44]
Tim Spears
I think the only player I'd try to really get in that 11 would be Morgan Rodgers. I don't know if he can sort of work on one of the two flanks. I felt like Kane and Bellingham both really got in his space last night. You know, Kane obviously comes deep and Bellingham was really pushing forward. I didn't think Rodgers really had the chance to shine. But Madueke, I feel he's better off the bench. Saka just doesn't look fit or sharp to me, and I'm not sure how he gets that sharp. I feel like he's just going to have a tournament where he just sort of trundles through at sort of 6, 6, 7 out of 10 sort of level. I wonder if you can squeeze in Rodgers on the right just for something a bit different.
- [15:17]
Art d'Rocher
Just on Saka. And it's not just Tim because, you know, it's the discussion point that's been there since before kickoff actually on Saka, whether he's sharp enough. But I do think he's shown in that cameo against Croatia with that little shimmy away from Gvardiol that led to his assist, that he can still be explosive in moments. So I wonder whether it's just about picking him for the right, right games, right opponents and right moments, rather than, you know, looking at him as the star all the time. Kind of like I guess we saw with Messi. And I'm not putting him in that bracket, but Messi coming off the bench in their final group game last night.
- [15:59]
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- [16:01]
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- [17:01]
Adam Leventhal
fair use purposes only.
- [17:01]
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- [18:04]
Adam Leventhal
So we've dealt with England. The group stage is complete. We have our completed bracket for the knockout rounds. We'll get stuck into some of the standout ties a little bit later on, but just some of the headlines from those other games that we saw Saturday into Sunday. Lionel Messi, as we mentioned before, came off the bench. He scored again. Now onto six goals for the tournament. Two clear of the nearest challenges in the race for the Golden Boot as Argentina beat Jordan 3119 in total. Now for Messi, the first to score in seven straight World cup games as well, the records keep on tumbling for him. But Tim, just a quick one from you. We've seen Argentina play Jordan, Austria and Algeria. Can we tell from those wins and Messi's performance and how they're ticking at the moment that they are going to be as tough to beat as the last time around?
- [18:58]
Tim Spears
No, that's a really good point. And you know Cape Verde in the last 32 is not going to perhaps offer a huge amount more, more evidence in that, in that regard. Well, I think, I think they've looked like one of the most sort of complete teams, as it were. Obviously Messi scoring is ridiculous number of goals, but they do look like they can control a game. You know, I think we've seen with other teams sort of lacking the ability to sort of set the tempo and set the pace. And you'd expect this from, you know, the reigning champions, but also two time Copa America winners in the last few years. They know how to grind out results and win tournaments. So we haven't seen anything to disprove that yet. That they deserve to be one of the favorites. And their draw is astonishingly favourable. You know, they get Australia or Egypt in the last 16 and then the quarter final is going to be against either Colombia or Ghana or Switzerland or Algeria. Now that is a route that you would like to the semis. So maybe Adam, in answer to your question, we won't know for a few weeks yet just how good they are.
- [19:57]
Adam Leventhal
Let's deal with some of the other, the other issues. Nine out of the ten African teams at the World cup have reached the knockout rounds. Tunisia the only signed eliminated from the group. And we touched on the fact that England are facing Dr. Congo. Plenty of familiar Premier League players in their art. We've got Whissa, who's obviously been scoring, Tuenzebe, Siddiqi, Wanbasaka. There's even a Watford player in there, Edo Kayembe as well, formerly of the Premier League, of course. How do you think that the dynamic will work in that game? Because there is players in that DRC side that are very familiar with what those England players can do.
- [20:36]
Art d'Rocher
Yeah, I mean if you're looking at their whole back line last night, they all have Premier League experience. I know Mbemba less so than the others because he was at Newcastle for just a short amount of time about 10, 10, 11 years ago. But still, I do feel like they would pose a bigger threat than Panama did last night. And also when you look at how they played against Portugal as well, they were able to stay in the game even though they went 1 nil down. So for me, I'm not looking at Doa Congo as a given. I know England should expect to win that match, but especially with the goals that were both disallowed and allowed yesterday that they scored, I think they will definitely fancy themselves to, to cause an upset and I think it'll be another, another game where England have to really not, not feel like they're owed a win or try and coast through the game, but really show an intensity from minute one to get the job done. Again, more intens than they showed against Panama because, yeah, I feel like that's a game where you may feel like the favorites, but it can easily change once the whistle's blown.
- [21:42]
Tim Spears
I was working on the game last night and I have to say, whistle was the standout. I mean, I was kind of wrote last night. Who is. Who is this Whistler guy? You know, Newcastle fans won't recognize him. He scored one in 19 last season. Not only has he scored three so far, the same as Harry Kane, but he looks like a man possessed. I mean, he took his second goal fantastically well. And I think what you'd say about Dia Congo is they've shown a real couple of sides to their sort of armoury so far. The way that they defended against Portugal, I mean, Portugal didn't have a shot for about an hour during that match after they took the lead and they were against Uzbekistan. You know, they fell behind early on, but they didn't panic. They did actually equalize on sort of 18 minutes, but one of the worst VAR decisions of the whole tournament stops that goal being allowed. But they didn't panic and they can create chances. They have got pace. There are definitely ways that they trouble England.
- [22:32]
Adam Leventhal
And just one other game that I wanted to mention. Algeria 3, Austria 3. Now, I know that Iran were fearing that it was going to be a draw and it was all going to be cooked up and they were going to go out of the World cup, as it has proven, but there's no way that that could have been planned. Algeria, through Riyad Mahrez went three, two up a couple of minutes into stoppage time and then a Wolves player did it for Austria. Tim, you must have been so proud.
- [22:59]
Tim Spears
Yes, Sassa Collages bookended the group stage perfectly because Raul Jimenez sort of opened it. Another Wolves striker, Adam.
- [23:04]
Adam Leventhal
Of course, it's been the tournament of Wolves, doesn't it?
- [23:07]
Parloa AI Advertiser
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- [23:08]
Art d'Rocher
Thank you for saying that.
- [23:10]
Tim Spears
And yeah, Sassakolajic with a 96 minute equalizer. I think it was pretty much the last. The last kick of the whole game. And yeah, amazing scenes. I think the fix was on, by all accounts, from for the last sort of. The last sort of 10, 15. They were knocking it around side to side, but then Mahrez sort of scored from nowhere and all of a sudden Austria were out and had three minutes to save themselves and Kolajic did. And it's a really Nice story because believe it or not, he's suffered three ACLs in his career. He's barely kicked a ball for Wolves. Six foot seven inch, lofty striker, but he can use his feet really well. And he's been on loan to Lask in Austria last season. Got a full season under his belt, I think. Six goals, seven assists and won the double out there. And yeah, he squeaked Austria through with the last kick of the entire group stage.
- [23:53]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah, and I mentioned Iran, obviously they finished just outside those best third placed teams. There's going to be some more coverage on the athletic of Iran and their tournament and everything that that entailed to come. Any other winners, losers that you want to mention from the group stages of this World cup art?
- [24:12]
Art d'Rocher
I think Mexico, just because they're obviously a host nation that have got nine points from nine. So I think that's something that's worth mentioning. There are quite a few others, obviously. Cape Verde are probably the biggest winners, I'd say, out of everyone, just because no one really expected much from them coming into the tournament. And I mean the Uruguay game was amazing. I stay, I did stay up for that one, even though I don't know if 11 o' clock kickoff counts as staying up, but I stayed up either way. No, no. So, yeah, those are the first two that spring to mind in terms of, you know, winners. But I'm sure Tim has some other nominees as well.
- [24:53]
Tim Spears
I would say on the, on the losers, it's maybe been lost a little bit last night with Iran, you know, rightly taking headlines, but South Korea being dumped out, you know, in embarrassing circumstances for them. You know, the manager having to field questions about whether the players had food poisoning because they were so poor and, you know, son being dropped. And it's been a real, you know, they're sort of top 25 FIFA rankings and expected to do well. They've got players who play for PSG and Bayern and you know, they scraped through the group stage four years ago before losing in the knockout stage. They had a disgraceful Asian cup, the last Asian cup tournament where Klinsmann was sort of. Jurgen.
- [25:30]
Jordan Campbell
Klin.
- [25:30]
Tim Spears
Klin. Klinsmann was absolutely lambasted for what he'd done with the team. And now this, they're out in the group stage of an expanded World cup when they really shouldn't in that group that they had. So there'll be serious recriminations back home. And yeah, they've had a real shocking
- [25:45]
Adam Leventhal
tournament and unfortunately for Scotland fans, we have to put you in the losers category and Once it was confirmed, there was only a slim chance that they would be able to advance as a best third place team. Once it was confirmed, Steve Clark resigned. Yes, it was a first World cup for 28 years, but yes, it was a big disappointment. Let's hear from the athletics. Jordan Campbell.
- [26:08]
Jordan Campbell
Yeah. Well, I think the timing of the decision for Steve Clark to leave will come as a shock given it's only 48 hours since Scotland lost to Brazil. But I don't think the decision itself will be a shock. And that may sound surprising given he just signed a new four year deal before the tournament started. But you know, this is the third tournament Scotland have come to, the first two disappointed. There was a lot of talk about how this was going to be the one where there was no regrets. They were going to leave everything on the park and if they fell short, then they would do, they would do so going out in the sword. And I think after the three games you come away with it, you come away from it thinking there are smaller nations than Scotland here that have left a bigger impression on the tournament. And I guess you could sort of tell the defeatism and Steve Clark's voice after the Brazil game where he basically conceded they were going home before he'd even seen the other groups play out. And I guess he was disappointed in the sort of meek fashion that Scotland bowed out. Four goals in nine games. At major tournaments, there's no clear signs that Scotland have really progressed. And while Steve Clark deserves massive credit for getting Scotland to major tournaments again, they haven't been there since 1998. It does feel like the right time because Scotland just haven't made the strides. But there are bigger questions for Scotland to answer here. It's not about a manager or a group of players. There's a lack of talent coming through the pipeline and in a few years time I think you're going to see that problem come to head.
- [27:34]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah, thanks to Jordan. Yeah, some of those older players as well. Robertson, 32. McGinn, 31. McTominay, he's not old, but he is now 29. What's the biggest issue here, Tim? Is it the manager to blame or the players to blame? On the biggest stage, we've got to
- [27:50]
Tim Spears
say that they had a really tough draw. I mean they would have had to have claimed a result against, you know, Morocco, semi finalists last time, AFCON winners perhaps, or Brazil. Otherwise they needed what, a five nil win against Haiti to get through. That's, that's a, it's a really tough ask and we all said after the Haiti game, okay, they didn't play well, but a win was all that mattered. Obviously I guess we were wrong then. They should have gone out and thrashed them, but I don't think Scotland are sort of capable of that. They're not that sort of team, so I don't know, maybe it's a bit of a cop out. Just say they had a tough draw, but yeah, it's a pretty. It's a pretty tough draw, to be honest. They would have had to get a result against a very, very good team which was slightly beyond them against Morocco. So it's not been a disaster, even though it sort of looks like it.
- [28:33]
Adam Leventhal
Well, if you want more on Scotland and you really want to wallow, if you're a Scotland fan, then Michael Cox's piece on the Athletic he hasn't held back, ladies and gentlemen, Scotland are the biggest underachievers in world football, so you can get stuck into that
- [28:51]
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- [31:08]
Adam Leventhal
So it is day 18 at the World Cup. Do you know time? It is our quiz, Tim, up against Art. Two men who love a quiz. So this should be good. Here we go. Do you know which nation has competed at the most World Cups? That's 18 without ever winning the competition.
- [31:32]
Tim Spears
Well,
- [31:34]
Adam Leventhal
this is tense.
- [31:36]
Tim Spears
I'll have an early random guess at Switzerland.
- [31:40]
Adam Leventhal
That's incorrect. Thank you for your guess, though.
- [31:44]
Art d'Rocher
I'll have a guess at Mexico.
- [31:50]
Adam Leventhal
Oh, what a guess it was.
- [31:53]
Tim Spears
Yes.
- [31:54]
Adam Leventhal
Cider Roche.
- [31:56]
Tim Spears
That's really good.
- [31:57]
Adam Leventhal
Well done.
- [31:59]
Art d'Rocher
Let me say it was an educated guess.
- [32:01]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah. Don't do yourself down. That was just knowledge coming to the top of your head and straight out of your mouth. Yeah. Mexico's best finishes have been the quarterfinals in both 1970 and 1986, two tournaments which they hosted, of course. So well done to Art. So, as we know, the bracket is complete, as we've been mentioning, it is worth going onto the Athletic and looking at the round of 32 bracket because it's it. It just shows you where your team is and their path towards the final on July 19th. If you think they're going to get that far. Tim, what's kindest side of the draw? We've had a little mention of Argentina, obviously, but where else is the smart money on a team that you might not expect to advance? Maybe getting a little bit further than you thought they might.
- [32:56]
Tim Spears
I think if you're Senegal and you're asked to face an aging and vulnerable Belgium team and then United States in the last six. I know, I know, home advantage, but normally you would say, I think Senegal would beat the United States sort of, you know, seven, eight times out of 10, and that puts them in the quarterfinals and, you know, against a Spain team probably who hasn't convinced so far. So, yeah, I think. I think Senegal, despite finishing third in their group, will really kind of fancy their chances of a bit of a run. And then I think also anyone in Brazil's quarter of the draw, if Brazil, again, they look vulnerable to me defensively. I think they're going to be found out against sort of better opposition. So if you're Norway, I think it's there for them to make a surprise run to quarter finals potentially minimum just
- [33:43]
Art d'Rocher
on Brazil and obviously they're playing Japan. I'm not sure if people actually realize Japan beat Brazil in October, November, possibly. It was 3, 2. And Ueda, who scored twice in their second group game against Tunisia, scored a last minute winner that day. And it was another header. He scored I think nine headers in the Eredivisie last season out of his 25 league goals. So yeah, the Japan Brazil is actually one that I'm really looking forward to because I feel like Japan could upset things.
- [34:14]
Adam Leventhal
Yeah, and we mentioned him the other day, having got guidance from Robin van Persie at Feyenoord as well, who was obviously a fine header of the ball. So maybe some of that has rubbed off on him.
- [34:26]
Art d'Rocher
Yeah, I did actually ask Van Persie about this when I was out there last season because I was lucky enough to be there on the day that Ueita scored. So I asked him what, you know, what tips he's been given Ueda and one thing he actually mentioned was understanding when to drop back and get the ball off, you know, defenders and midfielders, which I think he's done extremely well so far in this tournament. And of course led to the assist that everyone was talking about in that Tunisia game, the little flick around the corner. So yeah, hopefully we can see a bit more and fingers crossed I can write about him at some point and get those quotes in.
- [35:04]
Adam Leventhal
Well, and you may have noticed that Tim a couple of moments ago mentioned Belgium against Senegal. He was sort of like bigging up that game as the game to be at. Was there any reason why you mentioned that game in particular, Tim?
- [35:18]
Tim Spears
Yeah, to be fair, I am, I am heading out to Seattle tomorrow and yeah, I will be, I will be there on July 1st. No, I mean I, I am. It looks like a great game, I mean but you know, two attack, attack minded teams, pretty even. I think Belgium Senegal has got sort of tie the round written all over it personally. But then, yeah, looking at the rest of the draw, Netherlands, Morocco really sticks out as two teams in the, in the top 10 of the FIFA rankings who would both fancy being sort of just below the level of favorites in sort of the next, next batch of sort of five, six teams that, that could, you know, be an outside bet for the tournament for them to be playing each other in the last 32, knowing that if they win, they get South Africa or Canada in the 16s. So you're almost looking at fantastic opportunities to get straight to the quarters if you win. But for the loser to be out in the 32s would be a massive, massive disappointment for whoever does bow out.
- [36:10]
Adam Leventhal
Well, let's focus on Canada because they begin the knockout stages in Los Angeles later today. It's starting today, if you hadn't realized. There are no rest days. We just crack on with this against South Africa. Let's hear from Joshua Cloak, who is the Canada correspondent for the Athletic.
- [36:28]
Joshua Cloak
All right, the big story from today's match day, minus one press conference with Jesse Marsh and Alphonso Davies, is will Alphonso Davies play for the first time in the World Cup? In Canada's round of 32 game against South Africa, Jesse Marsh said Alphonso Davies is ready to go. He spoke with more conviction than we've heard, and this is a story that's been lingering over this Canadian team throughout the entire World Cup. My guess is Alphonso Davies does play, but in terms of the game itself, Canada's going to need to rely on a lot more than Alphonso Davies to get their first ever knockout round win. Canada has better attackers in South Africa and we can expect South Africa to sit back a little bit. So it's going to be on Jonathan, David, Kyle Laron, Tajon Buchanan to find their game. They've had a great expected goals rate throughout the entire World Cup, a lot of that buoyed by their performance against Qatar. However, if they can make the most of their chances, they're up against a South Africa team that literally doesn't score very much. Only 15 goals in 10 qualifying games. One or two goals from the Canadiens should be the difference, and Alphonso Davies could be a big part of making
- [37:47]
Adam Leventhal
that happen, thanks to Joshua. Do you think Alfonso Davis, if he does start for the first time, can make this Canada side sing?
- [37:56]
Tim Spears
Tim, I don't know about Singh, but just his experience, his sort of calm nature and his quality would just add so much for Canada. They do not have many players who play at all at the top level of European football, but his big game experience more than anything. This is the biggest game of the careers of many of these Canada players. But Davies has played in the Champions League final and obviously played in plenty of huge games for Bayern Munich over the years. So just his sort of temperament and his presence in the team would make a difference for all the other players, I think, as well as his quality on the pitch. So yeah, I think it'd be a huge boost for him for Canada if he started.
- [38:31]
Adam Leventhal
And I know South Africa weren't particularly convincing in the opening game of the World cup, which is maybe one of the games that the broadest audience would have focused on. But do you think that's being slightly unfair to South Africa because they're going to have more experience, I suppose, of knockout football, playing in AFCON and being in these sort of situations. So I just wonder if maybe they might be underestimated a little bit, possibly.
- [38:59]
Art d'Rocher
I think the biggest thing for me in this is game management. And it's been quite interesting to see how South Africa's, especially the game against Czechia, because that was kind of more make or break than their third game, I'd say, because that's what kept them alive. And obviously in that game, they just kind of stayed in it for a while. It wasn't like they were, you know, throwing the kitchen sinker at the game until the real kind of late stages. So I think them showing that they're able to, you know, stay in a game and make it tough for an opposition and then go for it, I think adds an interesting dynamic to the game. But in terms of Canada, I think what they've shown in the group stages is that they don't need to rely on Alphonso Davis. And I think that's a really important factor going into the knockout stages. When you have him back and you can already say, okay, we've won a game without him, obviously it was Qatar, so maybe you do add a pinch of salt to that. But I do feel like in the other games, you've seen Jonathan, David and Laren score as well. So I think going into this one, they should feel confident, even though I think South Africa will have a bit more, you know, game understanding at this level.
- [40:15]
Adam Leventhal
Obviously, now we're in the knockouts, we can get penalty shootouts. And if it's tight and Canada aren't ticking quite as much. And as Josh was saying, South Africa don't score many goals. We may well get a penalty shootout. And Tim, South Africa have someone who is a gem when it comes to penalty shootouts between the sticks, don't they?
- [40:36]
Tim Spears
Yeah. Ronwin Williams is, I mean, arguably their sort of key player and a bit of a. Yeah, penalty specialist. Saved four, didn't he, in the shootout at Afcon a couple of tournaments ago. So, yeah, and it may be a bit of an attack v. Defense match, to be honest. You know, Canada are all about those sort of overlaps and vertical quick play. And their strength, as Josh was saying, is in Attack. I think it's a real shame this game isn't in Canada from their point of view. I think if you look at, you know, America's draw, wherever the US finished in their group, first, second or third, their path would have been all American to, to all the way to the final. And you know, there is another game in this round of 32 being played in Toronto and I don't think it would have been too hard for sort of the runners up of this group to play in Toronto in the next round. It's just, okay, fine, you can talk about home advantage, but it's just better for the tournament that the hosts play in their, in their home country. So that is a shame and it'll definitely add a different dynamic to the match. You know, Art talks about sort of game management and Canada have really been feeding off that crowd in their, in their home games in the group stage. So. So yeah, that's definitely to, definitely to South Africa's advantage that it's not been played in Canada.
- [41:47]
Adam Leventhal
Right. So we have finished the show. Tim, his bags are packed. His squad, clothing wise is picked for the World Cup. Just, just sum it up before you set sail to the beautiful tournament that you're going to be covering. How excited are you?
- [42:05]
Tim Spears
I'm gonna get the plane, not a boat for a start. It's just, it's just quicker, you know, just, just, just makes more sense. Yeah, no, I can't wait to go there. You know, we discussed Adam in the last pod that you know, the group stage certainly towards the end was it was a sort of a slight disappointment with sort of a lack of jeopardy. But if you look at that, some of the last 32 ties that we've got and for an English audience as well, they have to say, even though I'm setting sail, as you say to America, for an English audience, lots more games now are at more reasonable times. I feel like the tournament's. This is an international show obviously, but I feel like the tournament's really going to sort of kick off back home now as well. And yeah, we're all set. We're all set.
- [42:44]
Adam Leventhal
Adam, nice, nice. Doors to manual cross check. Safe travels for you, Tim. Look forward to your thoughts as the tournament progresses. Art, thank you very much once again on the show. Thanks to Jack, Jordan and Josh, the 3Js. That's fantastic to have them on the show as well. Remember, you can read all about all of the action as we head into this knockout phase on the athletic app for free throughout the tournament. So do get stuck in to everything there. Emma Peyton is going to be back with you tomorrow. Take care till then.
- [43:33]
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