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- [00:02]
Ayo Akamolere
Right now you're probably listening to this podcast on a wireless network. The same wireless network you use for all your swiping, scrolling and athletic FC streaming. But if you're a first responder, you shouldn't have to compete with MyVoice to get a clear signal. That's why there's FirstNet, a clear wireless lane built with and just for first responders. So in an emergency, first responders get there first. Because a network that's not just for anyone helps everyone. To learn more, go to firstnet.com or visit an AT&T store for details.
- [00:36]
Verizon Advertiser
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- [01:06]
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- [01:34]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
The Athletic FC welcome to the Athletic FC podcast with me, Ayo Akimwalere. The relegation race looks set to go to the wire after Tottenham's draw against Leeds. So have West Ham been given a lifeline? And why do spurs keep pressing that self destruct button? Alright, in with us for this one. We've got Jack Pitt. Brooke, look, we've also got Dan Kilpatrick as well. So it ended one all at the Tottenham Hotspur stadium. That means spurs are now two points clear of West Ham with two matches still to play.
- [02:09]
Dan Kilpatrick
Here comes Longstaff.
- [02:11]
Jack Pitt
Oh, he's rattled the frame of the goal.
- [02:13]
Dan Kilpatrick
I think Kinski got a hand on this one.
- [02:16]
Jack Pitt
That is some stop because Longstaff has hit this as well as he possibly could.
- [02:22]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
So we have to start with that save from Kinski. I Mean, potentially, Jack, could this be the save that keeps spurs in the Premier League?
- [02:32]
Jack Pitt
It could be. If Longstaff had scored then and Leeds had won, then the gap would have been only one point between spurs and West Ham. Spurs would have felt totally broken, I think, by that outcome. It would have given West Ham a huge boost going into that Newcastle game. On the other hand, football matches and football seasons are made up of so many little moments. You could argue that the decision not to give the penalty when Nimacha tackled Maddison a few minutes after that, maybe that was the. The turning point, the decisive moment. Because obviously, if there had been a penalty and Tottenham had scored, they would now be four points ahead of West Ham and looking really, really in the box seat. So I don't think we can boil it down to any one moment, but it's. That was certainly a huge moment and one that left everyone's heart in their mouths.
- [03:18]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, I mean, the Kinski one's really fascinating, Dan, because are we potentially looking at spurs future keeper here? This was the guy that was hauled off after, what, 17 minutes against Atletico Madrid. And actually look at him now. He's found himself composed and actually making some really vital safe source. Spurs, if there is a light in this sort of Relegation kind of conversation.
- [03:37]
Dan Kilpatrick
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think he has been one of the bright spots of Deserbi's tenure so far. I mean, there have been several, to be fair to Deserbi, but he's been really impressive, and all the more so because of what happened in Madrid. And I think we are probably looking at Tottenham's future number one or number one for next season, whatever league spurs are playing in. Because I think Kinski could. Could play in either division, to be honest. And I think, you know, that the signs were there before he started producing these performances as well. I mean, Kinski was signed by Spurs a couple of years ago because he can use his feet. You know, he was more of a modern goalkeeper than I think they had in Vicario. And obviously the two mistakes he made against Athletico that we all wondered if he'd be remembered for were with his feet. But actually he's a good kicker. He's confident and calm when he's in possession. And we have seen evidence of that in the last few games. And he's looked like a really good shot stopper as well. And I think it's. The Kinski redemption is testament to his mental strength, because a lot of people, myself included, really assumed or wondered if Kinski would ever play for Spurs. Again after that game in Madrid and there were obvious comparisons made with Loris Karius, who really, you know, four years later, his career hasn't really recovered from what happened to him in the Champions League final, you know, and it was a slightly smaller stage for Kinski, but it was kind of felt just as horrendous as that, didn't it? But you know, a few weeks later he's taken advantage of Dakari having a hernia operation. He. He's kind of stepped into the breach. He's played very, very well. Made some saves, notably against Wolves with that last minute free kick and obviously again last night with the Longstaff save and the one in the first half from Joe Roden as well, which was a smart stop that could, as you say, make all the difference and eventually kind of keep spurs in the Premier League potentially.
- [05:35]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Okay, whilst we're talking about players, Jack a tell of two halves. Sorry I stole that from Sky Sports, but I thought it was really good.
- [05:45]
Jack Pitt
Now tell lights the touch paper.
- [05:50]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Well, Ampadu came onto it.
- [05:52]
Jack Pitt
He was caught there. Jared Gillet had a good look at it. I mean, Matis tell didn't know that Ampu was coming in, but I think he certainly catches him.
- [05:59]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Look, an outstanding goal and one side her and then given away a penalty with an audacious overhead kick which I thought was quite bizarre. But also there was this wayward cross as well that he played. I mean quite. He's been quite confident under Deseris since he's been playing, but just an indication that this kid, as talented as he is, is still incredibly raw.
- [06:20]
Jack Pitt
He is very raw. Yeah, like he's. I love his, the way that he tries things and tries to take stuff on and I think his goal is testament to that. Like not many players would take that shot on, never mind having the technical skill to execute it. So that was a fantastic moment. But he's definitely, he's definitely kind of raw in possession. He does, he makes mistakes, he puts teammates in trouble. Like he's not the only. That's not unique to him. He's only 21. He doesn't really have a huge amount of top level experience. Like obviously when spurs bought him, they were buying. They're kind of buying the talent more than you're buying the kind of here and now output. The moment where he nearly crossed for, I think for one of the Leeds players to head in, I think it was Justin. Yeah, that was obviously like a bit, a bit panicky and he does have some moments in possession where he doesn't make the right decision. Obviously the penalty is again typical to that. Like it's just a lack of game awareness. I think he doesn't realize that Ampadu is making the run behind him and he can't just do the simple thing of heading it away. But clearly De Zerbi was really nice about him afterwards. Said he was going to give him a big hug, said he's a young player, he's going to learn. So I think that I think he'll continue to be in the team. It's not like spurs have got alternatives in their front line, but yeah, it just shows the kind of the two sides of the coin with such a young talented player.
- [07:32]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, I guess it's kind of indicative of where spurs are right now in that. Dan, you know, there are some interesting players playing for spurs right now. A lot of them are currently injured, but you know, we just don't get that consistency with this team. There could be potential big game players but at the same time the team just seems to pull the grenade when it seems to be doing well.
- [07:52]
Dan Kilpatrick
Yeah, I mean, and this, this is the problem spurs and De Zerbi have got. I mean, De Zerbi can do many, many things on the training ground. You know, he can give the players confidence and I think he's done that. And he can give the players something to believe in and I think he's done that. And he can give the players tactical instructions and a game plan and information on the opposition. But you know, what he can't give them is more experience at the highest level and experience of these pressure situations specifically. And I think we saw that with tell, you know, obviously a talented player who produced that great moment at one end but then made I think an inexperienced decision to try a kind of acrobatic clearance in his own box at the other end. And that was costly. And the other thing that De Zerbi can't give them is kind of more quality, more technical quality. He can't make Richarlison stop scuffing his shots, which he's been doing his whole career. He can't make Richarlison into a more lethal finisher. And this is kind of particularly true of the front three at the moment more than anywhere else in the pitch because he's only got three foot forwards. We don't know if Solanke is going to be back for Chelsea in a week's time, but for the last couple of games he's had three fit senior forwards and those are the guys he's got to play and that, you know, that really limits what he can do. So while I think he's made an enormous amount of progress in the short time he's been at spurs and deserves all the credit for that, he cannot make these players better technical players and he cannot give them kind of more experience of these pressure situations.
- [09:21]
Jack Pitt
Yeah, I think the biggest single takeaway from yesterday's game is the lack of quality and depth that Tottenham have up front. They've only got three foot forwards at the moment. Tell Richarlison and Colin Moane, all three of those have started the last two games. Spurs didn't have any fit forwards on the bench yesterday. And yeah, Tell scored a really nice goal which was great. But spurs really needed to get two nil ahead in that game and kill it. I think they obviously weren't able to do that. Richarlison missed a series of chances. Kolmoane still doesn't really produce enough in the final third for me. And I think that I don't think the issue's the manager. They've got a great manager. I don't think the issue is the players commitment. The players worked really hard. They're really trying to make De Zerbi's tactics come true on the pitch. The issue is just quality. It's quality and availability and depth. And that is the thing that's held, that's holding spurs back at the moment. And that's the big question mark going into their last two games.
- [10:08]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, well, spurs lucky to get a draw yesterday because obviously victories over Wolves and also Aston Villa. I don't think spurs have won three games in a row since February 2025. I mean, that last 10 minutes at least. And then you've got the extra time. Leeds look like they were hungry and ready to go.
- [10:24]
Jack Pitt
Yeah, I mean, you could argue that. On the other hand, spurs had far more chances. I think during the course of the game they had a lot more possession. Richarlison could easily have had a hat trick. Pallini missed a good chance. Spurs had tons of corners. That's even before you get to the disputed penalty at the end. So I think it's probably at least as true to say that spurs were unlucky not to win as Leeds were unlucky not to win.
- [10:48]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Okay, gents, I'm going to ask you the question bluntly because yesterday I had a text from a West Ham fan saying massive result. That it's going to the wire, folks. Everything on Newcastle away. Come on, Chelsea fc. I can't believe I'M actually saying that he says, look, lineup for West Ham coming up. They have got Newcastle at home and. Sorry, they've got Newcastle away and they've got Leeds at home. Spurs have got Chelsea away and Everton at home. What are you thinking? Optus saying relegation chances For West Ham 85%, Tottenham 15%. What are you saying, Dan? I'll go with you first.
- [11:26]
Dan Kilpatrick
Well, I'd rather be Spurs. I'd rather have two extra points on the board. And I think it's kind of because last night felt disappointing from a Spurs point of view. It's sort of easy to forget the spurs gained a point on West Ham over this match week. I think my big concern as a long suffering spurs fan is that I just write off Chelsea away every year and have done, you know, I'm only 38, but suppose I've won once in the last 36 years. So for pretty much the entirety of my life I can just write off Stamford Bridge, you know, Chelsea away as an opportunity for spurs to win points because they just don't tend to do it. And not only do they tend to lose there, they tend to kind of lose their heads there. And you know, we've seen. You could make a. I could make a very compelling case now that, you know, pretty much Ange Postecoglou's entire tenure collapsed around games against Chelsea due to injuries and suspensions and whatnot. So, you know, that is my big concern. But yeah, I'd rather be Spurs. I think West Ham are going to have to win both their games because the thing is spurs can get four points and they'll stay up because they've got two points on West Ham and they've got goal difference, which I think is 11 at this stage, which isn't going to be overturned. So he's supposed to have two and a half points on West Ham, really. So I think West Ham are going to have to win both. My concern from a Spurs point of view is obviously Chelsea and then a very competitive Everton side who might be playing for something on the final day. And the home record of course, and you know, I can see it going down to the wire and I can see just absolutely zero football being played in that Everton game for an hour and it just being absolutely horrible. So I hope it doesn't come to that. And of course another big frustration from last night is easy to say now, but if spurs had won, they could have stayed up without kicking another ball. Because if West Ham had gotten lose to Newcastle on Sunday, then spurs are safe before they even kick off against Chelsea. So it certainly from that point of view, felt like a big opportunity missed for me.
- [13:21]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah. Who's got the bigger chance of going down?
- [13:23]
Jack Pitt
West Ham? West Ham, definitely. I think those Opta numbers seem. That's not quite how I see it. Like 15% seems really, really low.
- [13:32]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
It's really low.
- [13:32]
Jack Pitt
Like 15% would imply that the odds on that would be what, six to one? Which I don't imagine many bookmakers would be offering people at the moment on this. It feels to me more like a kind of 60, 40, you know, it's still 60, 40 in spurs favor. I would definitely rather be Spurs. The two points on the board make
- [13:48]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
a big difference, even with the way the Chelsea game. Spurs are really not great against Chelsea.
- [13:53]
Jack Pitt
That's true. But I think. I think more important than spurs historical record against Chelsea, which I actually don't think counts as much as people think it does. I think spurs performance levels in the last four or five games averaged out, have been pretty good. Not brilliant. They're obviously a flawed team. There's a huge lack of attacking quality up front, as I've just said. But I think the overall kind of commitment and consistency and application and clear tactical plan, that really counts in their favor. I think Chelsea are just a lot more inconsistent. I think there's big question marks about the, you know, what's going on there. They've obviously changed manager again. McFarlane's not going to be manager for that much longer. They've got the FA Cup Final just before this game. I wonder how much emotional energy they'll pour into that. I just think that. I think that spurs might actually come into that game in a better place than Chelsea. Now. I know that, you know, mental scars, etc, all that, but I think that. I don't think the spurs players need to be too intimidated by it being Stamford Bridge. And I think that De Zerbi will be absolutely hammering that message home to his players between now and next Tuesday night.
- [15:01]
Dan Kilpatrick
Spurs for him, in the last four games, the bigger picture is they're unbeaten in four. They've won two, they've drawn two. That's kind of two points a game, which is obviously, you know, top three or four form when extrapolated over a whole season. And it's kind of the form that West Ham were briefly on. I would, you know, say they were for about 10 games after they beat spurs actually in mid December. Was it that they, you know, they were very competitive. But they've lost the momentum now and, you know, with two consecutive defeats, albeit it was unlucky against Arsenal. So I would say also in spurs favor is they although the Leeds game and the Brighton game both felt very frustrating at home, maybe more like defeats than wins. Spurs have points and I say they've got the momentum now as well.
- [15:51]
Ayo Akamolere
This is the Athletic FC podcast with IO Accumulere. Right now you're probably listening to this podcast on a wireless network. The same wireless network you use for all your swiping, scrolling and Athletic FC streaming. But if you're a first responder, you shouldn't have to compete with myvoice to get a clear signal. That's why there's FirstNet, a clear wireless lane built with and just for first responders. So in an emergency, first responders get there first because a network that's not just for anyone helps everyone. To learn more, go to firstnet.com or visit an AT&T store for details.
- [16:34]
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- [16:53]
Jack Pitt
I'll send you text America's best network
- [16:56]
Dan Kilpatrick
based on root metrics Best overall mobile network performance us second half 2025 four
- [17:00]
Jack Pitt
new lines and a limited welcome and autopay. See verizon.com for details. Hi, it's Mark Bittman from the podcast Food with Mark Bittman. It is getting warmer and it's time
- [17:10]
Dan Kilpatrick
to go outside and start grilling.
- [17:12]
Jack Pitt
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- [17:17]
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- [17:19]
Dan Kilpatrick
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- [17:25]
Jack Pitt
Whole Foods has Teton waters, ranch hot dogs and sausages made from grass fed beef. Shop for all of your summer favorites
- [17:33]
Dan Kilpatrick
at Whole Foods Market.
- [17:41]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
What isn't in spurs favor and you all know it, and we've spoken about it several times, is their home record away record, third best of the league behind Arsenal actually in City 26 points but home record second worst in the league, 12 points from 18 games. I mean what is this down to? Because postecoglou struggled at home, obviously Thomas Frank struggled at home as well in many respects. Is it new stadium curse? I'm trying to decipher it because this was supposed to be the grand new opening of a new era for Spurs. This stadium, that's what it symbolizes.
- [18:11]
Jack Pitt
Yeah, it's a huge question. It's obviously been what, seven years now since they moved in, so quite a long time. I think that, I think there's a bit of an atmosphere issue there. I think that that's, that's inseparable from ticket prices. Fans generally feeling a bit, bit let down by the running of the club and by the underperformance of the team in recent years. I also think that spurs have struggled to consistently play the sort of football that you would associate with teams who are good at home. Like they've. Yeah, they have a dominant football manager now in De Zerbi, but they didn't for most of this season. And you know, they had and Postecoglou who did play that kind of dominant football for the first, I guess 18 months of his tenure. But even then before him they had a series of defensive or counter attacking managers. So it's not like they've had that clear identity of imposing their game on the opposition at home. So I think there's a few issues there. But you're right, it's. It's so hard to do anything if you can't win home games. And it's now what, more than five months I think, since the last one. And that's why a lot of spurs fans won't want it to be decided on the final day. They would love this to be wrapped up before the final day.
- [19:17]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah. As a long suffering spurs fan, Dan, can you put your finger on it why this home record isn't great at all, particularly this season?
- [19:25]
Dan Kilpatrick
No, I can't put my finger on it. And you know, I think in, in one respect it's kind of self perpetuating. Like, you know, the longer you don't win at home, the more the pressure builds up. I think that does feed into, you know, the players to an extent. Jack covered I think some of the issues there. I mean, another one is I just don't think spurs have built the squad necessarily to dominate matches in the way they're expected to at that, you know, amazing stadium. Kind of goes back to that old Pochettino quote about, you know, building a great house but, you know, putting some nice furniture in it. You know, they haven't done that. And even in the kind of final couple of seasons of having Kane and son playing at their best, they still felt like a team who were much better suited to playing in transition and kind of counter punching. And the amount of Times I've gone to spurs or watched them on TV in a home game when they're playing a so called lesser team, they're expected to kind of get on the ball and break them down and they've just been completely unable to do that, you know. Well, I've lost count in a way. It just comes down to I think that the sort of poor squad building and mismatched.
- [20:35]
Jack Pitt
Yeah.
- [20:35]
Dan Kilpatrick
Sort of inconsistent recruitment and strategy over the last however many years.
- [20:41]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Jack, you've written on the Athletic recently about spurs senior players stepping up. James Madison made a long awaited return. I mean, I can't remember the last time I saw him. He came on at the 85th minute, had 22 touches. He also spoke to our colleague Jay Harris in the mix and after Monday's game about facing some dark days over the last year. Must be a relief to have him back, especially with the talent. But also a bit of a, I guess a leadership head on his shoulders.
- [21:07]
Jack Pitt
Yeah, it was a great moment in the stadium when he came on. He's obviously been out for more than a year with two consecutive knee injuries, so it was lovely to see him get that big ovation when he came on. I did think he made a big difference his, his willingness to take the ball under pressure to try and create things in the final third, his confidence in knitting play together like spurs don't have anyone else like him and they've really, really struggled this season without him. You know, he nearly won that penalty at the end. He played a lovely back heel through to Conor Gallagher who couldn't quite get a shot away. So yeah, he did make a big difference. I'm sure they would be in a much different position if he had been available for most or even some of this season. But clearly De Zerbi really likes having him around and he'd been. I'd actually been on the bench for the last few weeks even before he was really ready to play, just because he's such a positive character. And I think that just underlines what an important person he is to Tottenham.
- [21:56]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Okay, Dan, let's talk about desert being. We've spoken about it on this podcast. You know, there are still some fans at spurs who aren't sure about him, but he was appointed. In the March international break, spurs were 17th and also one point from safety. His record so far, two wins, two draws and one defeat, putting them two points clear of West Ham, currently in 18th. Look, remember this is a team that hasn't won in 2026 before Deserbi's arrival What's been the biggest change for you since Thomas Frank has left to. Now obviously we've had Tudor in between as well. Dan. Obviously there are better results, but is it more to do with the attitude of the team?
- [22:38]
Dan Kilpatrick
Yeah, to an extent, yeah. I mean, I just think he's. I think he's just got the players interested and excited and giving them something to believe in and get behind really Frank. There was no strategy that I could see under Frank. It was not clear how spurs were trying to win games other than reduce everything to a series of 50, 50s and then try and score from set pieces. And I think top level players, a big club like spurs just can't get excited about that. And it became pretty clear early on in Frank's tenure, particularly now we look back with hindsight that the players just weren't bought in and then Tudor was almost just an extension of that kind of nothing football. And I think De Zerbi's come in quicker than we all expected, really. He has got them playing a version of kind of De Zerbi ball. You can see Kinski and the center backs putting their foot on the ball, inviting the press in. You can see the forwards at the other end pressing very high and very aggressively and you know, the team looking to kind of play through their opponent when possible and. And I think the players have responded well to that. I think he's also been very good in the media. You know, we saw him talking up tell last night after, you know, the mistake for the penalty, saying you want to give him a hug and a kiss and you know, he's a good young player. This can happen, you know. Also noted that he was putting a bit of pressure on Leeds in the media last night, saying, you know, I expect them or I imagine they're going to play just as well against West Ham on the final day. So, you know, he's spoken well, he's given the players something to get behind and I think, you know that he's obviously just a kind of charismatic, impressive character and you know, I think that's given. Given everyone a lift.
- [24:22]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, I gotta say it feels quite timely considering there's a lot of negativity surrounding spurs right now, obviously with relegation, but also having someone who's turned up getting on with the job, I think even said after the game, you know, I've got a good group of players here. He's not letting any sort of negativity settle. Those optics are quite good, especially for the media.
- [24:42]
Jack Pitt
Yeah, I think he's realised that he has to be positive. There's no point in being defeatist about any of this. The only way through this is by trying to keep the players motivated, trying to keep them happy, trying to keep that good energy. And so even after the Brighton game, where obviously they conceded that 95th minute equaliser to Rutter, he said in the press conference afterwards, like, I don't want to see sad faces. I don't want to see crying. If anybody shows up to training on Monday with a sad face, I'll send them home. And so he's, he's really, I think he kind of understands what fans want to hear and he understands what players need to hear, that positivity, that optimism, which there hasn't really been any of at Tottenham this season. So he's made a really, really big change in that respect and I think that has been really valuable to them.
- [25:31]
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- [26:30]
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- [27:00]
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- [27:30]
Ayo Akamolere
You're listening to the Athletic FC podcast with Ayo Akamolere.
- [27:34]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Well, that result has a big impact on West Ham. They're now in with a chance of staying up despite the heartbreak of losing to Arsenal on Sunday. So let's hear from the Athletics West Ham correspondent, Rossane Thomas, who sounds very relieved.
- [27:50]
Roshane Thomas
Hi, this is Roshane Thomas, the West Ham correspondent for the Athletic. As you can all see, I have a smile on my face for the simple reason being that West Ham have been handed a lifeline in their Premier League survival battle following Tottenham Hotspur's 11 draw with Leeds United. Look, if I'm honest, following that controversial loss to Arsenal, I thought Nido would have found it hard to lift the players this week because had Tottenham beaten Leeds, the gap would have grown to 4 points. Whereas now, following Verdure, the gap is 2 points. So, all to play for ahead of this weekend's game against Newcastle United. And St James's park is the ground that West Ham have done well at more recently. So, all to play for. I like to think last night's result would give the players that extra from training this week. And yeah, all to play for. Because look, if West Ham do get relegated, then it'll just have a huge ramification in terms of the financial impact of the fire sales. Club captain Jared Boren. I find it hard to believe that he'll stay in the championship, so he'll probably leave. You got Croel Somerville. He'll have many seaters this summer, irrespective of West Ham won a championship on the Premier League. You have Matthias Fernandes, who in my opinion is the player of the year due to how consistent he's been. The best buyer of the summer transfers in the summer window. I think you have Malik Juve, the left back. He's also been good. My one worry about West Ham going down is I'm not sure if West Ham will come up at the first time of asking. We've seen clubs like Leicester, well, Leicester now going to play in League one next season. Other clubs like Charlton Athletic, Blackburn, you know, all these great clubs that are the struggle to come back. I do fear that could be West Ham. That's due to the potential nature of the fire sales for summer if they do go down. So hence why Premier League survival, which is so important.
- [29:27]
Dan Kilpatrick
So let's see.
- [29:28]
Roshane Thomas
Let's see what happens. I'm still going to have a smile on my face because I still think it's possible, providing West Ham beat Newcastle this Sunday. Let's see.
- [29:35]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, Russia makes some really interesting points there because 10 years on from moving to the London Stadium, West Ham could be playing championship football next season. Rochen also talks about the ramifications. Spurs and West Ham are two Premier League teams, gents who have had big success in Europe over the last couple of years, at least. But mismanagement and a fragile infrastructure in the background is basically fundamentally what has got them to where they are right now. Rashane says something which really pricked my ear, Jack. If West Ham go down, is there a chance they don't come back up?
- [30:08]
Jack Pitt
I don't know. It's a really good talking point. I think a lot will depend on, well, Nuno Bowen, Fernandez are probably the three people I'd be most interested about. Some of the recent signings haven't been that bad, but Somerville, obviously, Somerville's been fantastic. So I think a lot will depend on who stays and who goes. That will depend on finances. Obviously, there's a huge question about strategy, direction. You know, David Sullivan's come under an awful lot of pressure this season. Karen Brady's left. There've been other senior departures. So there's big question marks about the running of the club going forward. Who's going to be making those decisions? Will there be the right sort of decisions made? The football side of the club has obviously been huge, you know, huge, huge changes, kind of almost year on year in the last few years. You know, they've often. They've rarely since Moyes has left. I don't think they finished a season with the same manager that they started it with. I mean, look, obviously Tottenham and West Ham can't both go down, but if they did both go down, hypothetically, I think I'd probably bet Tottenham to come back up.
- [31:09]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah. Do you buy that? I know if you're a Spurs fan and maybe slightly biased, Dan, but like, you know, if West Ham and Spurs did go down, then there's a chance that spurs would be the better of the two to come back up.
- [31:20]
Dan Kilpatrick
I think. Yeah, I think so. Probably just because I think spurs have enough young players and enough kind of quality in the squad that would stick around for them to have less to do. Whereas I think Rashane touched on it there, you know, that there might be a fire sale at West Ham. But, I mean, obviously I've Thought a lot about spurs going down over the last couple of months. And, you know, there's part of me that thinks they would just walk the championship and win it with 110 points. And another part of me that thinks, well, the reason they're in this position the first place is, of course, chronic dysfunction from the top down. You know, they've been mismanaged for. For years and years, and, you know, the current decision makers of the club have completely botched this season and, you know, no sign, as it stands as we speak today, that they're going anywhere. So, you know, why would it be any different in the Championship, which is a very competitive league? And I think you can make exactly the same case about West Ham. You know, West Ham fans will tell you that, you know, they've had some good managers over the last few years, and Nuno is another good manager, but the problem at the club is David Sullivan and the now departed Karen Brady and the people kind of making the decisions from the top that they feel have got them in this mess. So, yeah, I think in that sort of hypothetical where they both go down, I'd probably back spurs to finish higher. But, you know, the reason big clubs like spurs and West Ham get themselves in these situations tends to be because they make mistake after mistake after mistake. And I don't think we should assume that just because they're in a, you know, slightly less competitive league, they would stop making those mistakes because the evidence suggests that the people running those clubs are not particularly great at it.
- [32:56]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Yeah, I just want to touch on your emotions before we all go. Dan, what does it feel like being in this position, potentially knowing that the team you supported all your life could be going down into the Championship, because, you know, there's a huge chance they won't. But at the same time, are you allowing yourself to mentally even entertain that fact?
- [33:18]
Dan Kilpatrick
I've never said this on a podcast before, but I've got this thing sometimes where my. If it's really cold, my fingers go numb and go white.
- [33:29]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Have you got radars?
- [33:30]
Dan Kilpatrick
Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's bad circulation. And, like, it very occasionally will happen if I'm really stressed as well. Like if the kids. You know, normally it's just a cold, but sometimes the kids are really winding me up. Like, I'm like, oh, God, my Reynard's. Anyway, I got it when Leeds scored last night. It never happens to it. I've been watching the football before. I felt a couple of my fingers going tingly and numb. So that will give you an indication of sort of how I'm feeling about it, I think. But I actually went into that game feeling very relaxed, kind of looking at the Villa performance and thinking spurs are going to be okay here. But you know that that didn't last. I mean, the truth is, it's been a funny season where I felt really kind of dispassionate and disconnected and apathetic at times, particularly when Frank and Tudor were in charge. Feel more invested now, but the, the kind of possibility of spurs actually going down has only really began to really begun to sink in in the last couple of weeks, I would say. Before we were kind of talking about it, but it still seemed like a almost like an abstract concept. And now I'm like, well, it's probably going to go to the final day, isn't it? And then all bets are off. Anything can happen. So, yeah, very, very much kind of mentally preparing for it now, I think it's fair to say.
- [34:44]
Host (likely Ayo Akamolere or main podcast host)
Okay, well gents, two games to go. Let's see who beats the drop. Jack, Dan, appreciate your time. And also Rushem for joining us a little earlier. And also thank you guys for joining us too. We'll be back soon.
- [34:57]
Ayo Akamolere
You've been listening to the Athletic FC Podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroo and Jay Beal, with editing by Paul Iliff and Nick Thompson. The executive producer is Adey Moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free, including our dedicated club shows. Search for the Athletic Wherever you get your podcasts. You'll also find us on YouTube at the Athletic FC Podcast, so make sure you subscribe. The Athletic FC Podcast is an athletic media company production.
- [35:34]
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