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- [00:02]
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- [01:04]
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- [01:55]
Adam Leventhal
The Athletic FC hi there and welcome to the Athletic FC podcast with me, Adam Leventhal. So Liverpool will play Champions League football next season despite finishing closer to the relegation zone than they did to the champions Arsenal. So is that enough for Arna Slot to keep his job at Anfield? Well, with me for this one, we are joined by the Athletics Liverpool correspondent James Pearce and James Horncastle, who has his finger on the pulse of so many Things across the wide world of football is here with us as well. So Liverpool, they just crawled over the line, didn't they on Sunday with that one all home draw with Brentford fifth and failed to win any of their last four games. Drawing two and losing two. James, you've James Pierce, I should say we've got two James's Pierce. It's going to be like primary school.
- [02:53]
James Pearce
Yes sir.
- [02:54]
Adam Leventhal
Yes, quite. How do you feel after this season? Because it's been quite a drop off, hasn't it?
- [03:01]
James Pearce
Yeah, I think probably like most Liverpool supporters just glad it's over because it's been a struggle almost from, from start to finish. Of course, you know it started way, way back at the start of preseason last July in tragic circumstances with the, the loss of Diogo Jota. And you know, I think there was an acceptance then certainly internally it was going to be a really difficult season in the circumstances. But I think it turned out to be probably even tougher than anyone anticipated with a whole host of factors which I'm sure will come on to discuss contributing to, you know what Liverpool ended up with 60 points, their lowest total for, for a decade. 24 worse off than when they won the title a year ago, 23 goals fewer. Their worst goal return for a decade. And you know, defensively it was even worse. You know, 53 conceded. You have to go back to 1993, 94 for the last time Liverpool were that bad defensively in the Premier League and that was actually in a 42 game season rather than 38.
- [04:03]
Adam Leventhal
And I think it's important that we, we talk about that exceptional thing that happened outside of the normal realms of football and the loss of Diogo Jota right at the start because a lot of people will be thinking well how could they ever have the same sort of season as they did winning the title when they've lost someone from the dressing room. That can't be understated, can it?
- [04:27]
James Horncastle
No, I think that is unprecedented, Adam. And you know, we are not privy to how the players have handled that, who it's affected more, how the club has kind of tried to support coaching staff and players move on if they can move on. I still remember was it the first game against Bournemouth at the start of the season, the tears in Mohamed Salah's eyes after that game and it really brought home, if it needed to be brought home, how much that shocking news affected this group of players. And it's such a season of mixed emotions, extremes of emotions if you like, because in parallel to the death of Diego Jota which obviously meant that Liverpool's squad planning for the summer and this season radically altered in a way that they could not have predicted. You know, how Liverpool went about their summer I think also probably created quite a lot of excitement and expectation on top of what they achieved last year, which was a championship that I think few people expected them to win, maybe reflected too well on this team and group of players. But certainly the transfer spend that they had led a lot of people to believe, wow. This is the realization of the FSG model which was to be self sustainable and to still get themselves in a position within a self sustainable model to be able to spend with the very best and biggest clubs in Europe who are set up differently with sovereign wealth funds behind them. Everything that they have done to boost matchday revenue, commercial revenue, we saw it manifest in the spend that they had. And yeah, just listening to the statistics that James reeled off there, particularly the one about how many few goals that they've scored this season when everyone thought that signing Ekitike, signing Isak would if anything allow them to match the goals they scored last year, but probably do better than that and instead for it to be the reverse is extraordinarily surprising considering particularly how Liverpool's recruitment model under FSG and with the return of Michael Edwards, you know, has long been considered to be best in class, if not near infallible.
- [07:03]
Adam Leventhal
We'll sort of expand on a few of the points that you've, you've made there. James Pierce, let me come back to you on some more of the statistics to sort of just really dig into the decline in particular since the turn of the year. Only won seven of 20 since the start of this year. Finished 25 points off Arsenal, only 21 as we sort of said at the top there, 21 above West Ham, so closer to the relegation zone and they've lost as many Premier League games as Sunderland. Let's deal with the main topic, I suppose, and then maybe we can deal with why Arne Slot is in this situation. But does Arne Slot keep his job this summer?
- [07:50]
James Pearce
Everything at the moment points to that. You know, we haven't had definitive confirmation of that, although certainly the way that Arnas Slot has spoken publicly, you know, a week, a week left of the season, he said, you know, from all the talks I've had, I believe I will still be Liverpool manager next season. Certainly behind the scenes the messages have been that they remain supportive of him and you know, they've got a lot of sympathy for a lot of the factors that he's been wrestling with that they believe have been kind of beyond his control this season. You know, things like, you know, on top of Jota, you know, the injuries. So Liverpool barely had an injury last season when they won the league. And yet, you know, when you think back to the buzz over the signing of Alexander Isak, yet, you know he wasn't fit. Then when they tried to get him fit, he broke down. Then when they finally get him back, he breaks his leg. You know, young Giovanni Leone, this talented Italian defender comes in tears his ACL on his, on his debut, you know, Hugo Ekatike, one of the very few bright points in the entire season, you know, ruptures his Achilles. You know, Alisson, probably the best goalkeeper in world football still has missed what almost probably a third of the season due to injury as well. And then coupled with that, you know, you've had other new players like Wirtz who have struggled to adapt to I think a changing Premier League. Liverpool buy in technical players at a time when the Premier League's become more physical, more direct, more about set pieces. And then of course you throw into the mix established stars really losing their way like Salah, you know, like Gagpo, like Mac Allister Canate who had a torrid first half of the season, you know, those are all things that certainly the ownership and the people I've spoken to sympathize with. Slot over. But there is also an acceptance that he's made mistakes as well. You can't, there's not a free pass because I think in the same way as he deserved a lot of praise last season for getting the best out of players. Similarly, you can't, you can't just ignore the fact he hasn't been able to do that this time around. And he has made some selection decisions that left you scratching your head. He's made some tactical decisions that left you scratching your head as well. So I think it's actually a really, really difficult decision for the ownership because I've been surprised actually at just how many Liverpool fans have been demanding change. I went round a few of the pubs outside the ground purely for research purposes after the game on, on Sunday night. And you know, we're not talking about keyboard warriors, we're talking about people that follow Liverpool absolutely everywhere. And you know, a lot of them, you know, have said this the brand of football that they tend to have much more of a problem with. It's not number of people that said to me it's not about the results, it's about the lack of Entertainment that is the big worry going into this summer that if they stick with him, you just know that it will take very, very little next season for people to turn and for it to get very toxic. Because we all know, you know, that similar in a way there's parallels with the end of the Brendan Rodgers era where they stuck with him at the end of a really tough season, but then, you know, within three months of the following season they were forced to make the change.
- [11:00]
Adam Leventhal
I suppose, you know, the talk from the fans about the brand of football very much plugs into one of the, the main outbursts from Mohamed Salah this season and the second one which came out after the recent loss against Aston Villa when he was saying, you know, we need to return to heavy metal football and everyone that comes to the club needs to buy into that and it's non negotiable. James Horncaster, I'll come to you on this. And you know, referring also back to him, saying that he was thrown under the bus just before the end of last year. What have you made of Mo Salah's role in the destabilization of Arna slot?
- [11:45]
James Horncastle
Well, Saleh for many years I think came across as someone who is extraordinarily low maintenance. And I think what we've perhaps seen is as with some of these kind of personality types, you include Lionel Messi in this. These are powerful individuals by dint of the performances that they've put in for their clubs and countries over the years. And there is something that is quite low key diva about this. They obviously are extraordinarily ambitious. You know, you look at how Salah has been able to not only maintain form up until this season, but also, you know, sort of his, his physical attributes. You know, there was no sign this time last year that Mohamed Salah was declining on, on the contrary, you know, it, it was one of his best seasons ever where people were making the case that he should be winning a Ballon d'. Or. And looking back on last summer or last season, one of the stories James Pearce had to cover was the fact that you had three of Liverpool's symbolic players. All their contracts were up. Virgil van Dijk's contract was up. Trent's contract was up, Salah's contract was up. And from everything sort of we've been taught from Moneyball to the mythology of fsg, you always thought once players get to a certain age then you should be maybe thinking of moving on from them or not offering them a new contract. And I think FSG found themselves in A really difficult position last year with maybe you look at how old Salah is and then you look at maybe the data and project how long can he keep doing this? And they probably on the back of last season was like okay, this guy's not slowing down, we should give him a new contract when maybe in hindsight last year would have been the right time to move on. He could have left on a high winning the Premier League, could have left with Trent as well. Whereas Trent had to bear all the brunt of being this bad guy who's leaving. It probably would have made it easier on Trent had had Salah left at the same time. James will know this better than me because he watches Liverpool far closely than I do. But I suspect Mo Salah has missed Trent, Alexander Arnold this year a lot. And it has been very undermining I think for Arnie Slot to have Mo Salah come out as regularly as he has done and make the comments that he's made either after that Leeds game or in an Instagram post as he's leaving. I think it makes it very difficult for Slot when senior players like that are undermining him. And my instincts not going to Anfield and following this from TV and not sort of just being part of Liverpool Twitter is Arnie Slot sort of deserves a second chance because of what he did last year when he won the league unexpectedly. But as James says, the mood in the stadium, the mood around Anfield and the fact that not only Salah but you have, you have kind of quite a number of players that you look up to and think they are Liverpool senior players. Now I wouldn't say sort of showing a lack of faith in Slot but you know, their character has been called into question for different reasons. You know, be it Zabozlai on his commercial partnerships Tour or McAllister in Rome, you know, like there are a lot of things that are suggested beyond Mo Salah that it's difficult for Slot to continue and yet so it looks like he will continue.
- [15:35]
James Pearce
The Salah story has been one of the dominant themes of the season because as James said, his numbers last season were so incredible that it almost effectively forced FSG's hand in terms of given him the contract, you know, the two year extension that he obviously wanted. But it was pretty clear early on this season that it, you know, he wasn't going to be able to, to maintain anything like those standards. And the drop off has been huge to contribute 34 goals last season, only 12 this time around. You know, I wouldn't put the blame solely at his door. I think he's also been a victim of other areas of the team malfunctioning and of course the loss of Trent on that right hand side as well as, as played a part. You know Liverpool didn't, couldn't get him frequently enough into the kind of threatening positions we've been used to seeing from him. But also, you know, I think also it's fair to say he hasn't you know, had the same kind of impact at all. And, and of course when you go back to you know, late November when Slot dropped him, you know Liverpool had completely and utterly fallen to pieces. They'd lost nine out of 12 games at that point. And you know I actually think that Slot did the right if anything I thought the Slot was actually probably should have dropped him a couple of weeks sooner because you know it was the problem was because you weren't really getting anything out of him on the ball and we know that you know the defensive side of the game isn't, isn't his strong point certainly in the twilight of his career that Liverpool were just so open out of possession. You know I remember Cucarella talking after Liverpool lost at Stamford Bridge and he was very open about the fact that oh yeah, we knew that because Salah doesn't trap back there'd be loads of space to target down that flank and that's, that's how their winning goal came about. So I do have sympathy for Slot on that front. I know people have said well Klopp would have dealt with it differently. You know Klopp, you know, the Dutch are a bit blunt and you know, Klopp being more of a man manager would have you know, found a way to kind of keep things you know, on the down low more. But I'm not sure about that. I think you only have to go back to the end of Klopp's reign to see that you know, him and Salah didn't exactly see eye to eye then and that was around the fact that Salah had been left out of a game down at West Ham. So I think whichever Liverpool, whoever was in charge when the time came to decide, right, Salah is now no longer the first name on the team sheet. I think that was going to be an incredibly difficult thing to deal with. And you know when I speak to people internally about what's happened there this season they, they kind of make the point that you can't really have it both ways because the reason why Salah was able to be this absolute machine that barely missed a game registered, you know, mind blowing numbers of goals and assists year after year after year is this, you know, like this drive and belief that he is the best player in the world. And I think when things start to go badly, the flip side of that is probably not being able to take a step back and go, well, actually, yeah, I'm not still doing it because I think the problem was he probably still thought he was up there with the greatest players in the world when unfortunately the evidence was to the contrary.
- [18:53]
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- [19:00]
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- [20:01]
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- [20:41]
Adam Leventhal
James Pierce I just wanted to come back to you on this on your interview with Florian Virt and as to whether his words carry as much weight as Mo Salah. I might know the answer to this but but he did say about Arneslot. The outside world is always trying to create something between the team and the manager, but it's totally different in this building. We are working well every day with this manager and his staff. There is no thought about not being behind the manager. This is just something talked about on the outside. Is that a player just going through the normal motions of what a player should say about the manager or is that a feeling that permeates throughout the dressing room and obviously it doesn't matter about Mo Salah now.
- [21:27]
James Pearce
Yeah, I mean, it's very difficult to judge that, isn't it? I think you can only. It felt to me like Wirtz was being genuine in the same way as I thought he was being genuine. When I asked him about Salah's social media post, he was one of the players that liked it. And I said to him, you know, do you, do you, do you realize that the perception outside the club is that by you liking it, that was somehow you siding with Salah against Slot because you know, that is the way it's been interpreted. And he was like, no, no, no, nothing like that. He said, you know, I read it as Mo Salah saying this season has not been acceptable. This is not the Liverpool level. This is not what we expect. It has to be better. And he said, you know, I liked it because I completely agree with him. He said, you know, I didn't, I didn't see it as somehow against the manager. So yeah, I think, you know, Wirtz is someone as well who's come in for a lot of criticism this season. But I just think as well he's the kind of player that I think we will see him flourish to a much bigger degree when there's more stability around him in, in the team because it's been such a difficult environment to come in and, and really shine in this season. And I think, you know, people pounce on the, the size of the transfer fee, don't they? And they, you know, inevitably with a big fee comes big expectations. But yeah, I think you also have to appreciate, you know, when he signed he was 22, living, living away from home for the first time and adjusting to a new league.
- [22:53]
Adam Leventhal
James Horncart. So let me come to you on this. Let's try and spin it on. And I know we've obviously got the World cup coming up and that is going to sort of dominate for a lot of people. But how do you see this panning out over the next couple of weeks, maybe the next month when, you know, in some of the other leagues around Europe they like to sort of get stuff done at the end of the, the season we've already seen managerial transitions happen. We know that Xabi Alonso isn't going to be an option for, for Liverpool. He's. He's going to be at Chelsea. We know that Andoni Iriola is, is considering his options at the moment. He's been mentioned in the. In the same conversation as, as Liverpool. What are you hearing? What are you feeling about what will happen at Liverpool? I know it's a big question.
- [23:48]
James Horncastle
No. But everything we know about Liverpool, Adam, under Michael Edwards and Richard Hughes is they like to get ahead and they like to be long on the way of sort of planning signings and appointments. I never get the impression anything is improvised there. I remember Richard Hughes saying in the autumn that one of the benefits that they had when it came to appointing Slot was they knew Klopp was leaving and they had sort of a few months to basically look through the candidates, do their due diligence and then hire slots at the end of that. And certainly this time last year, you would say that that was a very successful appointment. Things are moving very quickly at the moment. Yeah, there are lots of clubs that are in the market for particularly coaches and trying to get ahead now so that they can plan their recruitment around the World cup. Because the World cup is going to be a big block on the transfer market this summer. Once that starts, managers and players will be focused on their participation in that composition. Agents are not going to be bothering their clients whilst they're at a competition that is the pinnacle of this sport and comes around every four years. So what's been interesting about Liverpool is that whilst no one has come out publicly to support Slot, the messaging, as James knows, has always been very clear because there have been lots of moments this season where you've seen other clubs sack their managers and Liverpool haven't done that. And whenever people have asked questions of Liverpool, you know, what are your intentions for Slot? The feedback has always been the same, that they retained confidence in Slot. And I know we're only into Tuesday of the first week of the after the season, but I would have already expected them to change or at least announce that they were moving on from Slot if they intended to do that. Because that's just what we've seen from other clubs around Europe when seasons have been on have been poor. So I'm sure they'll be having a series of review meetings across departments. I think what's the. And I'd like to get James's opinion on this is all of these guys, Slot, Richard Hughes and Michael Edwards, their contracts are up in 2027. And so it's not just Slot's future that's up in the air, it's all, all their futures. And obviously they, Hughes and Edwards appointed slots. Do they feel like they're in this together? Are they joined by sort of embarking on this adventure, what two years ago? What, what do you make of, of the fact that we have this almost end point, James, of 2027 where we're sort of unsure of the futures of all of those three?
- [26:52]
James Pearce
Yeah, yeah, I think it's, it's, it's a far from ideal backdrop, isn't it, to have that level of uncertainty? Because you're right, it's not just about Slot. You know, you look at, you know, Michael Edwards, when he came back two years ago, it was very clear at the time that crucial to luring him back because he'd already turned down the chance to come back as sporting director was FSG's commitment to buying a second club. He spoke about that at the time and when Liverpool put out the release that, that was crucial. Mike Gordon, the FSG president, emailed all club staff at the time, you know, talking about how we're going to embark on this multi club model. And of course we, we did the story I think back in March about the FSG ditch that, that they'd, the Edwards and Julian Ward who he brought back as technical director and Pedro Marquez as well, that came in as another senior figure. They'd, they'd put a huge amount of time and effort into kind of trawling across Europe, put together kind of 20, 25 different possible kind of proposals. They did a lot of like due diligence on it and you know, there was various ones that they came quite close to, you know, Bordeaux, Getafe, Malaga. There was even discussions about buying a stake in Monaco. None of it came to fruition. The FSG board didn't give the green light to any of it and now they've effectively said we're not going to do it. So we know that that has massively frustrated Michael Edwards. So, you know, is he going to stay around beyond 2027? There's a massive question mark there. You know, Richard Hughes as well, there's been so much speculation about him potentially going to Al Hilal in the Saudi pro league. You know, my information as we think stand at the minute is that he's fully committed to Liverpool for this coming transfer window. But I think again, big question mark over Richard Hughes beyond this summer. And I think, I think very much Edwards and Hughes came As a double act, I would be amazed if one stayed without the other. And then you wonder whether that, you know, does that almost have an impact in terms of what happens with slot as well? Because I think if you were going to change manager this, this summer, then would a new guy coming in be like, well what, what's the long term plan? Let's talk about the next three, four years. And it's like, well, so yeah, I think all of that doesn't help the kind of general sense of unease about the direction of the club.
- [29:14]
Adam Leventhal
Okay, so you know, from what you've said, and that's really interesting in terms of the extra layer of uncertainty which many people might not necessarily get their teeth into too much. So that's good to know. But how will that impact the here and now? And if work needs to be done, as James Horncastle was saying on player recruitment before the start of the World cup, even though players will probably be given a little bit of a breather before the World cup and still again being left alone as they will be at the tournament, what work needs to be done for Liverpool this summer to ensure that they are going to be challenging once again as they were two seasons ago and winning the title in terms of the tinkering that needs to be done in the transfer market.
- [30:02]
James Pearce
Yeah, I think there's two glaring priorities that just have to be addressed. The one is pace out wide that is massively hurt Liverpool all season. You know, the, the lack of energy and dynamism and ability to beat someone down both flanks. Not only have you had the kind of decline in Mo Salah down the right, but of course they, they sold Luis Diaz, didn't replace him because they thought well Cody Gakpo is going to go to the next level. We've got young Rio and Gamoa coming through. We don't want to block his pathway. But Gakpo's had an absolutely torrid season so you know, they have to clearly buy a Salah replacement. You know, we know that Jan Diamandi, RB Leipzig is the leading candidate as things stand at the minute, really exciting young player. I suppose the only concern on that front would be you're Talking about probably 85, 90 million pound plus for a 19 year old who's had one season in the Bundesliga. So yeah, pace out wide is one. The second one is more of a physicality and more of a combative edge in midfield because Liverpool have been far, far too easy to play through. You know, McAllister, as you know his decline this season has been really, really worrying. Gravenberg I think I've got a bit of sympathy for because I think he's suffered probably from, you know, others around him not being at the level, you know, Szabozlai again, you know, Liverpool's player of the season, one of the few bright sparks. But yeah, they have to buy, you know, at least one, if not two midfielders and then there's other work that needs to be done as well because you know, we're waiting to find out for definite whether Alisson is staying. You know, Mama Dashvili hasn't shown anything so far to suggest he's definitely going to be the long term number one. I think they need to go and buy a right back because Conor Bradley, you know, is going to be on his way back from a really serious knee injury and playing midfielders at right back, whether that's a Bosley or Jones has absolutely killed Liverpool all season because not only do you have a square peg and a round hole at right back but then it weakens your midfield as well by shifting someone out of there. You know, you look at Robertson going on at left back, I think they'll probably just bring Simicas back from his loan at Roma and have him as Kirk as his deputy. But then you know, they need to do more at the top end of the pitch as well. Chiesa who's barely had a look in, he has to be moved on. You got to replace him in the squad. And of course, you know, Ekatike 17 goal top scorer this season, probably going to be out till at least Christmas with that, with that Achilles injury. So. And you can't just rely on Isak because as we've seen this season, you know, is his fitness issues of have kind of been a major, major concern.
- [32:43]
Adam Leventhal
Jeepers creepers. They've got a lot of work to do, haven't they? James Horncastle, they're not going to be able to fit it in. It's a bit like you, you've got so much work on when are you going to fit it in with the World cup coming up.
- [32:53]
James Horncastle
No, it is, I mean also Konata, his contracts situation.
- [32:58]
James Pearce
Get us another one. Yeah, yeah. There was so much to mention. I forgot him. Yeah, yeah. I mean obviously they've got, they got Jeremy Jacques coming in from Rennes. Yes, there was 60 million pound defender which you know, that'll obviously complement Van Dijk and you've got Leone coming back from his ACL injury. He should be back in pre season. But yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean Kanate is such a weird situation that, you know, I can't think of anything really comparable where someone in his peak years is now down to what, his last four or five weeks of his contract, where, you know, he stopped and spoke to a group of us after the Merseyside Derby a month ago and basically said, you know, I'm staying. There's been a breakthrough yet, you know, since then nothing's been signed and there's still that uncertainty. And Joe Gomez as well has only got a year left on his contract. So yeah, yeah, even you can throw the center back. That's another one thrown into the mix.
- [33:56]
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- [34:47]
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- [35:12]
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Athletic FC Advertiser
This is the Athletic FC podcast with Adam Levantal.
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Adam Leventhal
James Horncastle. Does it does just underline the, the unpredictability of all of this. However, however, you know, strategically astute you are and you know, the good reputation that you, you might have, you know, up in the stands, the sporting directors, you know, the directors of football, things can be thrown off course and it's very difficult to then get things back on track because, you know, the next summer might have a tournament in that injury that you might hope can be, you know, time to come back in a summer might not be until, you know, later on the, in that year. So I suppose we also have to have sympathy for those trying to steady the ship at Liverpool as well, because it's tough and for Arneslot it is.
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James Horncastle
But I don't think there is someone certainly in English football with a reputation as big as that as Michael Edwards. He'd become this kind of mythological figure for the work that he'd done at Liverpool. And certainly every American owner who invests in a football team, be it in the UK or be it in sort of Western Europe, they look at Edwards as being like, I want that kind of guy, you know, I want the guy who can help me achieve success in a sustainable, sustainable way. I think if you were to say last summer at the close of the transfer window that Liverpool were going to be in need of, I don't know, maybe two, three, four more transfer windows to sort this squad out, people would be amazed because certainly the top line story from their summer transfer window was they signed Ekitike and then Isaac and it was like, why do you need both of these guys? And I think one of the issues for slot this season, I remember Antonio Conte saying this during this season with Napoli as well. They signed a lot of players and it was really curious. Conte often complains about teams not spending enough or buying enough. And it got to October, November and he was like, you've bought me too many players. There are too many people to integrate. I have to kind of bond a new group of players together. And it kind of feels like that sort of happened at Liverpool as well. Well, they brought in too many people last year and some have worked, some haven't worked. James mentioned Ekatike before his Achilles rupture. But again, considering the volume of trading that they did last year, it is surprising to me that they're short or feel short in so many areas. And squad planning is everything in a sporting director or technical director's role. And it's very surprising to me, even giving all the injuries and that sort of. It's very surprising to me that Liverpool find themselves in this situation given the reputation of the people at the top of the club.
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Adam Leventhal
And James Piers, let me give the final word to you. Is there the feeling that, you know, dressing room unity is almost the priority this summer and maybe there isn't a need to do a huge amount in the, in the transfer market considering what happened last summer. And also they're not going to have to deal with, with the words of, of Mo Salah as well, which has, as we've mentioned, been destabilizing for, for the dressing room and for, for Arneslot
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James Pearce
trying to repair that kind of, that kind of dressing room kind of unity and camaraderie and spirit. I think that that is going to be up there with the, the biggest, biggest challenges that, that have to be addressed. Because we know, don't we, that the idea that you just fix everything in the transfer market is just nonsense. You know, yes, of course the squad is in need of some urgent reinforcements, but you also need, you know, whether it's slot or whether someone else comes in that you have to revive the fortunes of a lot of those players that have, you know, their form has fallen off a cliff over the last nine months. You know, the answer isn't just to get a broom and kind of sweep it all out and, and bring in another seven or eight players or whatever because then the danger with too much change again this summer is you find yourself facing another season of transition and another year of players having to adapt to the Premier League. So I always think you're never as far away as kind of like sometimes people think. I mean, we've had on the walk on podcasts, we've had listeners say, you know, it's going to take five years for Liverpool to repair what's gone wrong. And it's like it doesn't work like that, does it? We've, we've seen it quite often in the modern era that clubs, you know, could have a great season, then a big drop off and then go back up there again. You know, one, one statistic that jumped out at me when I was doing the end of season kind of inquest piece Yesterday was the ESAC, Ekatike and Wirtz have played 118 minutes of football together. So when people say, well, how can Liverpool have such a terrible season when they spent, you know, 440 million? Well, it's like, well there's. What's that probably 350 million or whatever it is, in three players that have played just over one game of football together across an entire season. So, so I think there is that belief that, you know, Isak will kick on next season, that Wirtz will be a lot more influential. Kirk has now, you know, he's almost come out of Robertson's shadow. He has to kick on. You expect a lot more from Frimpong, you know, Leone, who we've barely seen Jeremy Jacques coming in that hopefully that will just foster some positivity. And of course, preseason is not going to be ideal off the back of the World cup and players coming back at different times. But you know, it is going to be different to last preseason because that was such a kind of horrendous starting point for, for the season that then kind of fell to pieces on, on so many different levels. So, yeah, there's a hell of a lot of work to do this summer. But the fact that they have salvaged Champions League qualification is crucial because, you know, they've got the, they've ended up with the same number of points as Klopp's team had in 15, 16 when they finished eighth. So they can count themselves lucky that 60 points gets you Champions League football. But we know for Liverpool's business model, you know, the financial windfall that guarantees you will help them try and put right the weaknesses that have cost them all season. But yeah, there's also a hell of a lot of work to do in terms of changing that dressing room dynamic and reviving players who have had such a torrid nine months.
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Adam Leventhal
James Pearce, thank you very much indeed. And do make sure that you read his review of the season and it pulls on some of the threads that we've been speaking about today on the episode. James, thanks very much for your time. James Horncastle as well. It's going to be busy at Liverpool. There's going to be 104 games to get through at the World cup as well before, before we kick on and think about what's going on with the Premier League's new season. But there's going to be so much, so many moves going on and I know that you'll be across all of it in the UK around Europe as well. So, James Horncastle, thank you very much indeed to you as well. Thanks very much for listening and we'll catch you next time.
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Athletic FC Advertiser
You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast. The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavroo and Joe Beale with editing by Paul Iliffe and Nick Thompson. The executive producer is Ady Moorhead to listen to other great athletic podcasts for free, including our dedicated club shows. Search for the Athletic Wherever you get your podcasts. You'll also find us on YouTube at the Athletic FC Podcast, so make sure you subscribe the Athletic FC Podcast is an athletic media company Production Foreign. This episode of the Athletic FC is brought to you by Hotels.com when you're booking a hotel, here's a simple question. Why wouldn't you use hotels.com it really is all in the name. As a member, you save up to 20% on hundreds of thousands of hotels around the world and earn rewards on every single stay. Which means the trips you're taking now help pay for the ones you're already dreaming about. And unlike some other places, there are no blackout dates. So when you want to travel, your rewards are ready to go. So whether you're planning a grand adventure to follow your national team around North America this summer, or whisking your special someone away for an escape because you've been glued to the football for weeks, make sure to book@hotels.com and start earning rewards. Because when it comes to comes to hotels, it's simple. Hotels.com it's all in the name.
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