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- [00:01]
Reuben Amarim
Psoriatic arthritis symptoms can be unpredictable.
- [00:04]
Andy Mitton
I had joint pain and I couldn't move like I used to.
- [00:08]
Reuben Amarim
I needed relief.
- [00:10]
Mark Critchley
I got Cosentyx. It helped me move better. Cosentyx Secukinumab is prescribed for people 2 years of age and older with active psoriatic arthritis. Don't use if you're allergic to Cosentyx. Before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. Like tuberculosis or other serious bacterial, fungal or viral infections. Some were fatal. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms like fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough, had a vaccine or planned to or if inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, serious allergic reactions and severe eczema like skin reactions may occur. Learn more at 1-844-cosentix or cosentix.com.
- [00:55]
Andy Mitton
Ask.
- [00:56]
Reuben Amarim
Your traumatologist about Cosentyx.
- [01:00]
Andy Mitton
Thanks for selling your car to Carvana. Here's your check.
- [01:03]
Reuben Amarim
Whoa, when did I get here? What do you mean?
- [01:05]
Mark Critchley
I swear it was just moments ago that I accepted a great offer from Carvana online.
- [01:09]
Ayo Akimolere
I must have time traveled to the future.
- [01:11]
Andy Mitton
It was just moments ago. We do same day pickup. Here's your check for that great offer.
- [01:15]
Ayo Akimolere
It is the future.
- [01:17]
Reuben Amarim
It's.
- [01:17]
Ayo Akimolere
It's the present.
- [01:18]
Andy Mitton
And just the convenience of Carvana.
- [01:20]
Reuben Amarim
Sorry to blow your mind.
- [01:21]
Ayo Akimolere
It's all good.
- [01:22]
Mark Critchley
Happens all the time. Sell your car the convenient way to Carvana.
- [01:28]
Andy Mitton
Pick up. Times may vary and fees may apply.
- [01:33]
Mark Critchley
As a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 24 7. So when you're hiring, you need a partner that grinds just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is LinkedIn Jobs. When you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. LinkedIn makes it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network and get qualified candidates that can manage all in one place. Here's how it works. Post your job LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. Either post your job for free or pay to promote promoted jobs. Get three times more qualified applicants get qualified candidates at the end of the day, the most important thing to your small business is the quality of candidates. And with LinkedIn you can feel confident that you're getting the best. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of SMBs using LinkedIn say that LinkedIn helps them find high quality candidates. You can let your network know you're hiring. You can even add a hiring frame to your profile Picture and get two times more qualified candidates. Find out why more than 2.5 million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.combaseballshow that's LinkedIn.combaseballshow to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply.
- [02:56]
Ayo Akimolere
The Athletic FC welcome to the Athletic FC podcast with me, Ayo Akimolere. Manchester United have spent over £200 million in counting. But after continuous fall storms, will they deliver this season? All right, with us today, we've got Mark Critchley and Andy Mitton as well. All right, let's get into some of the numbers because on Thursday the Athletic's David Ornstein reported that Manchester United have reached an agreement for Benjamin Sesko in a deal worth around 85 million euros. Crit. Alright, great deal. But how on earth are United affording this kind of signing right now?
- [03:36]
Andy Mitton
It's a fantastic question because I don't know how many podcasts I've been on, especially this one over the last few months where I've said, united are skinned, they're not going to be able to sign anyone, they've got no money. Miraculous. Say, oh, you know, we're going to go bus by Christmas, et cetera, et cetera. Look, I think the thing to say is, going into this window, the message was very much that, that, okay, Kunya, yep, he's in. He's basically through the door. And Bumo, they're in negotiations for him as, as well, once those two deals got done, it was likely that United would then have to sell players in order to finance further signings. Now, likely there, I stress that word and it's the operative word in that, because that was the message that was given to me. Likely. And one thing that I was always conscious of when we were talking about this is that United have something called a revolving credit facility. Now, without getting too technical, this is essentially a credit card that allows to borrow money up to a maximum limit of £300 million whenever they're short of cash, essentially. And so there was always a possibility that United might use this. They've used it in previous summers when they've been a little bit light on cash and when they wanted to buy players in the market. Now, going into this summer, we almost didn't really. I sort of half expected that they wouldn't simply because the message and what Ratcliffe had said, there'd been a very Much a sense that United need to be more disciplined, they need to be more prudent with their money. After years of overspending, getting recruitment wrong, that's what had put them in the mess in the first place. That's why there's this hole in the. In the finances. And so we can't make the mistakes of the past. I think what's perhaps changed is just how badly last season went, just how embarrassing, frankly, it was to finish 15th in the league, to be outside of European football and a real sense of urgency within the club now as well. And at that executive level that things need to change. We can't repeat the mistakes of last season, whatever about the mistakes in the market of seasons past. So, look, there's confidence clearly in Ruben Amarim. I think you would take this as a sign of an endorsement of him. There's confidence in the executive structure around him that Ineos have put in place as well. And this is the moment where they've been back to say, okay, well, we believe that these players, this manager, this is the right way forward, here's the money to do it and let's not repeat what happened last season. And so the proof will be in the pudding. You could say that United are in a way going down a similar path that they've trod before. There's inherent risk within that, but I think the feeling within the club was that it was now or never and it was time to put the money where the mouth is, spend and bring players in who can hopefully bring them back to something a bit more respectable than 15th place in the league.
- [06:10]
Ayo Akimolere
What are the rumours saying about Beleber as well, from Brighton? Because that's another story that drops this week as well. I mean, he's not going to be cheap, is he?
- [06:18]
Andy Mitton
He's absolutely not. I mean, it's a deal that a lot of Premier League clubs would like to do. You know, one of the highest rated young holding midfielders in the league in European football at. And I think that if United do it, you're talking more than £100 million. You're talking Moises Caicedo money. That's certainly a benchmark that's been set by Brighton in the past and you'll be looking similar parameters to that now. United have tried to explore those parameters this week. I think part of the thinking there is that there's going to be a market for him next summer. So if we can try and get ahead of the curve, if we can do it now and get steal a march on other clubs, that will definitely be in for him in future then. Obviously that's a fever in United's cap and something that helps them going forward. I still think that it might be quite an unrealistic and unlikely deal to do simply because of the numbers that we're talking about. I wouldn't get too excited about it just yet, but it shows that United mean business. It shows the level of ambition and the sense of urgency again, that I referenced in the first answer that is there within the club right now. They want to be bringing in the best young players that are available and they're going to try and do that even if it may seem unlikely.
- [07:22]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, Andy, I've been listening to you guys on Talk of the Devils and you've definitely deliberated whether or not Shesko is the kind of player that Manchester United need know right now. In particular because, you know, you think about Rasmus Hojlund, it's had quite an interesting preseason. You still got Joshua Xerxe. There is a striker what Manchester United need right now.
- [07:42]
Reuben Amarim
Yes. And I've just been on the tour and speaking to lots of people at the club and if I had to identify two problem positions then it would be goalkeeper and. And striker. And I think the tour has only hardened some opinions about what Manchester United need. Actually not in those two positions because Andrea Nana is injured and Rasmus Hojlund actually did quite well with Critch. If you would have said to me at the start of the transfer window, Manchester United will be doing this, all the information I had was this wouldn't be something Manchester United are doing in terms of their outlay that they had to sell first of all. But it was explained to me in Chicago how United are doing this, that some revenues have come in from sell on fees. People like Anthony Elanga, Alvaro has gone to Real Madrid and then United have moved on. People like Marcus Rashford, who's one of the best paid footballers in the world. So that has made a difference. But Critch's point is absolutely right. This is needs must. There's a lot of good professional footballers at Manchester United, but good is not good enough for Manchester United. 15th was horrendous last season and if this Ineos project is going to work, there's got to be a substantial improvement pretty quickly as well. Otherwise people are going to lose faith in it. And I spoke to Omar Berarda 6 weeks ago about the idea of winning the league in 2028 and he was derided for reiterating the claims. And from his perspective, he's like we've got to have something to aim for. And I agree with that. But Manchester United need better players. They need goals. And I've been pretty supportive of Rasmus Hojlund. There's absolute mitigation, as there is with most things at Manchester United. And he's not had the chances that a strike would have had in teams of yore. He's made lots of runs with no reward to it. But equally, you cannot say that him or the vast majority of Manchester United players had a good season last year. And some of the responsibility has to be with the players. So Critch is right. The manager is being backed to the hill here. I spoke to him a week ago in Chicago. He comes across really well. Good communicator. But he needs more than words. He needs wins and he needs them now. And it's a tough start to the season. The signings have infused Manchester United fans. Sesko, absolutely, because that was unexpected. I think we're still going to see quite a considerable amount of movement between now and the end of the transfer window. Outgoings, incomings. I've always felt this. I thought there's going to be a lot of action towards the end. I think there's actually quite a lot of Manchester United players, apart from this so called bomb squad, who the club would listen to. I spoke to different people in in the United States and they were saying, what do you think Man United would do with this player or with that player? There's interest in a lot of Manchester United players and sometimes it takes a season to start and for the player to realize he's not really featuring for them to change their outlook. Andreas Pereira is a good example of that. He'd have a brilliant preseason and then the season would start and he wouldn't be featuring. He's like, my future's not here. And there's loads of examples of that going down the years. So optimism is high among Man United fans, especially when you consider the last competitive game. It's probably the lowest point I've ever felt as a fan, that defeating Bilbao against Spurs, there's got to be a big, big improvement. And I actually think there will be.
- [11:11]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, Chris, I've been talking to some of the tactics guys and we've been talking about the permutations of whether or not Benjamin Sesko does add more to Manchester United, for instance, or whether or not, you know, dealing with that midfield might make someone like Rasmus Hojlund's output much better. Does signing someone like Sesko solve Manchester United's problems? For instance, just like, I guess, does Gyoker solve Arsenal's problems, for instance.
- [11:34]
Andy Mitton
I think the idea that there's just one problem that needs to be solved at Manchester United is a bit of a fallacy and one that. The one that we go through quite regularly. But what I would say, I'd agree totally with Andy. That striker had to be a priority this summer because you look at the amount of goals in the league last season, I think it was 44, which was the lowest that United had ever scored in the Premier League era. Hojlund and Xerxe, I think they combined together, they had seven of those, which you obviously want more goals from your two strikers, especially two that you've spent upwards of £100 million on over the last two summers. So there was reason and cause to look at that position again and clearly Sesko ultimately is the preferred target and the one that they gone for. I do think at the same time that goals don't exist in a vacuum. Strikers don't perform in a vacuum. They. They. You could look at United last season and say, yes, maybe the strikers weren't scoring, but he was really creating many chances. Aside from Bruno Fernandes and perhaps, perhaps Amad Diallo as well, there wasn't a lot within that team. You know, the amount of times you saw that team try and build up from the back and play through with the progressive style that Amburin wants and essentially fail at it and get nowhere. And it was quite stayed and quite tired a lot of the play. There was fundamental issues there as well and I think that is why. Yes, okay, they've got Shesco. They've clearly identified the two number 10 positions as a priority before that as well. But we're talking about the labor and saying how unrealistic it is. Even if they don't ultimately get the labor because it is so unrealistic this summer, I wouldn't be surprised if they still go in for another midfielder because I think it's been a position of concern and a position that needs to be addressed for some time. I don't know about Andy over there in the US And I think Manuel Legato is a talented player who has. Who has specific attributes, are very good. He didn't have a good night against Everton and watching that game, you came out with thinking, if they're going to drop a lot of money on a striker, there's still going to be a huge issue in midfield that needs solving. They need. I'm not just picking on Ugarte there. I think they need to figure out what's the partnership. Is Bruno playing there, is he not who's the best partner for him? So there's still a lot of questions, but I think the way that United are moving at the minute, the intention that they have in the market, we will, I think, I think Andy's right. There'll be business done, incomings, outgoings, and we will get some answers to those questions before the end of the window.
- [13:49]
Reuben Amarim
I think Agarte's an interesting point, Chritch, and I think you're spot on. So I spoke to him after the game in New Jersey when he'd played well against West Ham and I get asked to speak to him because he'll only speak to external media in Spanish. But interestingly, he did his first internal media interview in English and he's a good lad. I had a long, long interview with him at the end of last season and he played well against West Ham, but didn't play well against Everton Atlanta. And that was pretty alarming to watch because if you think who Manchester United are going to come up against in the first game of the season, Zubi, Mende, Odegaard, Declan Rice, they're among the best midfield in the world and the mood would just slump if they get destroyed by Arsenal at Old Trafford. And so United know that they need to be decisive. Sesko is someone United have watched for years, is literally the number one target under Erik ten Hag. Of the 14 strikers on Manchester United top three list, he was number one, as in a long term high quality option, someone who was going to cost a lot of money. Interestingly, two years ago, United 40 would be 75 million and that's ultimately what he ended up costing. United couldn't sign him and they found it very frustrating with the player's agent. But from their perspective, they were like, no, we want the player to continue to grow and if he does grow, as we expect, then you will come back in for him and the deal will a be much more suited to him as a footballer and be much more lucrative for us, for the player, for the club and for the agent. So they've played a blinder really in how they've dealt with Sasko, and having more than one suitor has really helped as well. So I don't think that the labor is an absolute guarantee purely for financial reasons. I think if you say now to United, do you want him? Yeah, if you said to the player, do you want to join Man United? You'd absolutely get a yes. You say to Brighton and no Valbian are you going to give a player away for a nice cut price deal?
- [15:56]
Ayo Akimolere
Definitely not. Definitely not.
- [15:59]
Reuben Amarim
That is not happening. So compromise will be needed. Maybe some of Manchester United's players are attractive to Brighton, for example. With the players who Manchester United are trying to move on, they're likely to have to take a wage cut like Marcus Rashford did as well and the agents as well. They'll have to take less than maybe they would have hoped for. But this will all be trading. We'll see in the next few weeks.
- [16:21]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, super quickly in terms of outgoings, David Ornstein reported that Chelsea have stepped up their interest in Garnacho, which is probably great for United and their books, but what we're thinking about Sancho, critic and also Malacia, for instance.
- [16:33]
Andy Mitton
Yeah. So Garnacho looks like there's been movement there, Chelsea and United talking. So that is progress on that front. The issue with Sancho has always been that he's still one of United's highest earners. And if you were a buy in club, I don't think you'd look at Jadon Sancho's performances over the last two or three seasons in all fairness and say that he is worth the salary that he's currently on. And so there needs to be some sort of negotiation there. It's a very difficult negotiation. It's one that United have done several times already before sending him out on loan to Dortmund and Chelsea. Whether it'll be another loan, we'll see. His contract expires at the end of the coming season and there's a plus one option. I don't think in any reality that United are going to extend that. So there's work to be done there. Tyrone Malacia. I'm not aware of any interest in Tyrone Malacia currently. He's somebody who wouldn't move the needle as such in terms of wages and fee. I don't think like Sancho or Garnacho. And then there's Anthony as well, who obviously had such an impressive loan spell at Real Betis at the end of last season. I'm sure they'd love to make it permanent. The question is whether they've got the finances to do so. I think they've always been a club that hasn't been the most financially well endowed in Span football. Although they did break the world transfer record once. I actually found out when they brought Nielsen in 1997. So there you go.
- [17:44]
Ayo Akimolere
Knowledge. Knowledge.
- [17:45]
Andy Mitton
Yeah. Again, a lot more negotiation needs to go on there and it remains to be seen whether other clubs come to the fore. So plenty of work to be done on those players who we've been saying or some and United need to find solutions for them simply because there's really no way back for them under Reuben Amram. It's clear that he's drawn a line in the sand. He's moving forward with the group of players that he has right now at his disposal. So I wouldn't expect them to be be reintegrated or see them playing again. I think that line has been drawn and United need to find solutions for them.
- [18:16]
Mark Critchley
As a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 24 7. So when you're hiring, you need a partner that grinds just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is LinkedIn jobs when you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. LinkedIn makes it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network and get qualified candidates that can manage all in one place. Here's how it works. Post your job LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. Either post your job for free or pay to promote promoted jobs. Get three times more qualified applicants get qualified candidates at the end of the day, the most important thing to your small business is the quality of candidates. And with LinkedIn you can feel confident that you're getting the best. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of SMBs using LinkedIn say that LinkedIn helps them find high quality candidates. You can let your network know you're hiring. You can even add a hiring frame to your profile Picture and get two times more qualified candidates. Find out why more than 2.5 million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.combaseballshow that's LinkedIn.com to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply.
- [19:38]
Adam Leventhal
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- [20:53]
Mark Critchley
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- [20:55]
Ayo Akimolere
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- [20:58]
Andy Mitton
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- [21:01]
Mark Critchley
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Andy Mitton
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- [21:15]
Ayo Akimolere
I want to move on and talk about Reuben Amarim now, gents, look, this is a massive season for him, his first full season with Manchester United. You know, he's spoken about a cultural reset but also feeling more excited ahead of this season as a great piece by Laurie Whitwell, which is a really in depth interview with him. Andy, you've been out pre season with Manchester United in the States. What are you feeling from Amarim? What are you seeing that's different?
- [21:42]
Reuben Amarim
Publicly, as you say, he's infused, he's up for it. Privately, I think he'll have some frustrations because he wants to get more deals done. I spoke to quite a few players off the record in the United States and they're like, yeah, the mood's good, genuinely good. They've not always said that. They'd tell me if that wasn't the case, but we need players, so that's why you're seeing people like Sesko coming in. And you've seen a very close contact between Reuben Amarim and Jason Wilcox, Omar Barrada for example. They were all on the US tour. They were all speaking on a very, very regular basis. This is a very busy time for Manchester United. But the manager, as Chris said, absolutely being backed, he has all the power. His coaching group have absolute power and control, rightly or wrongly. And other people have been ostracized and pushed out of that. And am I comfortable with that? Not really. But then this happens in football. So yeah, you have to Accept that if he's a talented coach, he should be allowed to use those talents and to do well and to help Manchester United improvements. He had a lot of time on the training pitch in Chicago to push forward his ideas, and the idealised view of it is that it's going to look wonderful and everything's going to be fine. But we know that you don't just click on a switch and go from 15th to being league champions. It's a gradual process. I do think the dressing room. I know the dressing room is in a far better place. And when he took control in November, I was saying on Talk of the Devils repeatedly, it's a very complex dressing room and people are like, what do you mean by that? What do you mean by it? I just knew from all my sources that it was a very difficult dressing room and I think it's now less difficult. He's trying to do a cultural reset and we've heard that all before. We've heard it under Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and Louis Van Gaal and Jose Mourinho. I think he's probably going deeper and being backed than any of his predecessors to really start again with Manchester United. And that has extended not just to the football side, but the staff at the club as well, often with pretty sad consequences. Good people have lost their jobs. A lot of good people have decided this is no longer for them, because in the OSU are now. The decision makers are like, look, with respect, we know you're good, but we want to bring our own people in again. That happens in football. So you've seen it not just at Carrington, but at Old Trafford. And the job cuts have been well publicised. And I think United needed to trim because it was a loss, making football club 90 million a year on average. Something had to change there. But there are some really competent people who've just looked at it and gone, you know what? This isn't really for me. And they've got excellent jobs elsewhere because they're very good at what they do. So it's the football side and it's also the Old Trafford side. Major, major changes, more changes in the last 12 months than I've known in 35 years covering Manchester United.
- [24:39]
Ayo Akimolere
One thing I have noticed, Critch, since he came in last season, was sometimes his, I guess, too honest approach to, you know, press conferences and things like that. It feels like it's just part of his nature. You know, he's often spoken about how he thought about walking away. You know, he's spoken about Having his hands tied last season or fighting with his hands tied last season. What have you made about how he's delivered, you know, a lot of his chat to the press and also to his players?
- [25:06]
Andy Mitton
Well, honestly, as a journalist covering United, I'm not going to complain when someone's too honest in his position. You know, like, it's, it's. It's manna from heaven, from us sometimes. And I remember being sat in the press conference after the Brighton game in January when he described the team as the worst team in United's history. Now, that was. That was a comment that got a lot of traction. I remember being sat in the room at the time and it felt, honestly like. Like there was. There was a white. There was a context there that was perhaps being missed once it, Once it left the room that he was talking about how during that period when United would lose games or draw games, there was always some statistic like, this is the worst team since 1897 or whatever. So he was, he was. He was trying to frame it with that and acknowledge the fact that, look, they're not doing well right now and they know he knows what the stats say. That was at least my kind of read of it. But at the same time, you struggle to defend him on that front because he knows what he's saying in that moment. In fact, he even said, here's your headline. When a manager says, here's your headline, you're going to have to write that headline. And the thing about headlines is players read them and people read them in general, and people take that to be the whole story, essentially, often. And I think that was the case, actually, especially with some of the playing squad at the time when he said that, I think that didn't go down particularly well with everybody. And so he is honest to a fault sometimes, and I don't think it's always necessarily helped him in his relationships within the club and with his players. But what I would say, coming back to Andy's point there, that this has been such a period of drastic change, I think it makes sense a lot of the time to actually confront that, be honest about it, be direct about it. And he has now, as we're saying, got a group, a squad that he believes are all pulling in the same direction, that are all aligned to his vision, that are all with him moving forwards. And I think that, that. That perhaps doesn't happen if you aren't as direct and as blunt as he has been in his public dealings with the media. So ultimately, I've got to Say I respect it and I understand why he does it. And I think he's going to continue doing it because I don't think. Well, I think if we learned one thing about him, other than the fact that he's honest, is that he's quite stubborn, he's quite set in his ways, he's going to do things his way. And that's been abundantly clear ever since he came into the job last November.
- [27:17]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, Andy, this code of conduct. Every new coach at Manchester United obviously wants their new regime, new ideas, but I don't know, something feels really interesting in trying to reshape the attitude that the players have with Amarim. Can you tell us a little bit more about what this code of conduct means? Because I know they've got new medical staff and, you know, nutritionists, but he's really trying to enforce some sort of discipline here, isn't he?
- [27:40]
Reuben Amarim
Yeah, and with good reason. But as you said, as you asked the question, we've heard it all before. David Moyes banning chips. That gets your headline, which is quite right. I've actually spoken to David Moyes about this. I met him in Chicago. I've known him for a long time. Said, I never ban chips. So where does the truth lie on all of these things? Because there's often like four or five different versions. I remember Ole Gunnar Solskjaer coming in and genuinely making a difference. And every single Manchester United manager in the post, Fergiera, all says they left the club in a better place than the one they arrived in at. And they have absolute conviction when they say that they believe in it. And I think Reuben Amarin, if he left tomorrow, would say exactly the same thing, even though the team have finished 15th. So there's a lot of different versions of the truth in football, but I think we can see he's trying to make fundamental changes. He has absolutely been given power. So him and Jason Wilcox are very, very close. Almo Berarda, because it's all on them as well. You know, if Reuben Amarim fails, they are the people who've pushed for him. And this is all under Sir Jim Ratcliffe, who's backing these people. These people have got very good pedigrees. Jason Wilcox was excellent at Manchester City. Omar Berarda is very highly rated football executive. And Reuben Amarin, who several sources have said to me, you know, Manchester City wanted him to replace Pep Guardiola, so Manchester United have acted and got the man in less than ideal circumstances. He didn't want to come mid season, but he did come mid season and I think it has helped that he has come mid season because it's allowed him a half a season or a little bit more to get used to living in a new country, a new football league, his players. Who does he want? Who does he doesn't want? The media, which is very different to the Portuguese media. It's a global concern when you're at Manchester United. And someone said to me last week after I'd posted how well I came across in an interview, maybe you should do less talking and concentrate more on winning football matches. And I replied to that person, I don't normally reply on social media because it's just X is not a good place for a reason discussion. I said, if Reuben Amarin had his way, I don't think he'd be doing any interviews. But you are contractually obliged to do interviews when you sign the contract for any Premier League club, you're contractually obliged. I was like, oh, didn't know that. And he said himself when he was being far too honest. I'm sick of hearing my own voice. I'm sick of saying the same things. And people like Critch or I were sat 3 or 4 meters in front of him and I'm the one busying myself finding out when were Man United this bad.
- [30:36]
Andy Mitton
Okay, got it. Yep.
- [30:38]
Reuben Amarim
It's December 1933. And that was my start. I can remember where it was.
- [30:42]
Andy Mitton
Not 1897. I knew it.
- [30:44]
Ayo Akimolere
No going back and back and back and back.
- [30:47]
Reuben Amarim
And then you're thinking, is this. Are you sure we can't have been that bad then? No, this is definitely 1933. We've not been that bad for. And it's almost surreal because no one expected this to happen with Manchester United, so. So there's absolutely new people in charge of the club. Everything has changed. All the senior leadership team. I think there's only Colette Roach left. You know, the football analyst department has changed completely. The coaches, the youth system. It's out with the old and in with the new, big time. And there will be more. More changes. This isn't just going to stop. When the Premier League season starts, it'll be less dramatic than it's been in 24, 25, but still a long way to go.
- [31:31]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, Crit. I don't want to big this up any more than it needs to, but do you feel there's something different here?
- [31:36]
Andy Mitton
I would still question whether this optimism, this good feeling survives what is coming, because it's a hugely critical period. We've essentially arrived at a Similar moment that we were at a year ago, I think, where you had Erik Ten Hag in charge, but there was a little bit uncertainty. The season before had been so poor and the pressure was on from the very first moment. There was no margin for error. Perhaps it's not as extreme as then, because 10 Hag was very close to losing his job at the end of that season. But it does feel like a similar moment. But the noises, the things that we're hearing have been more positive than usual. And I think that is a reason or at least a little cause for optimism going into the new campaign.
- [32:15]
Ayo Akimolere
Andy, I want to talk about Amarim's relationship with Sir Jim Radcliffe. He's spoken about this sort of no BS relationship that they've got and I wonder what those conversations actually look like, because Sir Jim clearly is a big personality. Ruben Amarim is clearly a guy who knows what he wants. Do you think that's what works for Sir Jim? The fact that this guy actually isn't backing down and can actually stand up to him and say, actually, this is what I want. I don't agree what you're saying here.
- [32:40]
Andy Mitton
Yeah.
- [32:40]
Reuben Amarim
Ruben Amarin knows far more about football and footballers than Sir Jim Ratcliffe ever will. No ylane. But it's easy saying that. I've spoke to countless managers over the years where the president or the leading official at the club has actively interfered in team selection. I've spoke to Real Madrid managers who've said to me that they've been putting the major pressure to play certain players and to be fair to Manchester United and even to the Glazers. I've never heard any evidence of that at Manchester United. Now, if Sir Jim Ratcliffe has any ideas from a football perspective, I've no doubt that Reuben Amram is telling him, I'm in charge here. I'm the man. I know exactly what I am doing here. And that should be an education for Sir Jim Ratcliffe. You know, as a journalist, sometimes I watch games with coaches and you learn from them. And they'll say, did you see that? And you're like, nope. And that's why they are UEFA Category A coaches and you're not. And I don't mind if they have an honest relationship where they're joking with each other, where they're winding each other up. I've sat in a room with Jim Ratcliffe and spoke to him him for 40 minutes. You can have a very frank conversation, you can disagree, that's fine. Doesn't mean you never speak to him again. He's been extremely successful in business doing what he's done. You don't always have to agree with him. There's been decisions he's made with ticket prices, for example. I strongly disagree with him and told him about it. I didn't just moan on the Internet, I told him to his face about it. And that's communication. And there are previous Manchester United managers who've had no communication. Him they've literally not heard. Not just going to say Jim Ratcliffe because everyone will think Eric Ten Hag didn't hear from him. But I never had an understanding that Eric had the same relationship with Sir Jim Ratcliffe that Reuben Amarim has. So if they're talking after games, I think Jim Ratcliffe would be well within his rights to say, this is terrible. When's this going to end? And he can push back and go, actually, it's going to be really bad for the rest of the season. I'm just hoping that side of the. It is out of the way now and it's on all of them. You know, if Man United do badly, the manager will get stick, but Jim Ratcliffe will get stick as well. Omar Barrada will. Jason Wilcox will. So I like Critch's caution because there's a few giddy Man United fans now. One of them said to me yesterday, my Dad's put a 10 on United winning in the league.
- [35:12]
Andy Mitton
No, I don't know if a 10 is giddy. I don't know if that counts as giddy. Maybe, but the odds are giddy. The odds are really giddy for that.
- [35:22]
Reuben Amarim
And then he said, I'm just going for top four myself. And he was a lot more than a tenner. Part of me is thinking, I don't mind Manchester United fans smiling because for most of the last year, it has been so grim. So the problem is no games have been played. This is sort of, you know, the trans. The transfer junkies getting high on the. The hit of new signings and they all think they're going to be a success. Rewind back a year, people were saying that Agarte is going to be this. The solution to this problem. Josh Xerxe is going to be this. Nous Mazraui is going to be that. There's no guarantees that all the signings are going to work, but. And maybe I'm getting wrapped up in the preseason optimism here. I do think they will work.
- [36:14]
Ayo Akimolere
You're getting giddy, Andy.
- [36:16]
Andy Mitton
Transfer junkie Andy Mitten. I love what. That's it? Yeah, I love it.
- [36:28]
Ayo Akimolere
This is car Tracks with Turtle Wax. Your car says a lot about you. So if we asked your car what it would say about you, what would it say? Listen, you dropped one of those tiny cheeseburgers under the seat like last week and now we're both dry heaving the stench. Do us a favor, grab some Turtle Wax and let's get to work. This has been Car Tracks with Turtle Wax. You are how you car like you.
- [36:56]
Reuben Amarim
Know what, I'm just going to disconnect.
- [36:58]
Mark Critchley
From the world and disassociate and just open up my phone and start scrolling and it's like a way of escaping.
- [37:05]
Andy Mitton
But then once you're done scrolling, your.
- [37:07]
Mark Critchley
Problems are still there.
- [37:08]
Andy Mitton
Doom scrolling is something we all struggle with. On the latest episode of Mind if We Talk, host and licensed therapist Jesu Joe talks with singer songwriter David Archuleta.
- [37:18]
Ayo Akimolere
As he opens up about the emotional.
- [37:20]
Andy Mitton
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- [38:20]
Ayo Akimolere
Well, let's move on. Let's look ahead to this season. Manchester United have made new signings, possibly more to come. There will be no European football as well. Andy this what are the expectations from inside the club?
- [38:33]
Reuben Amarim
I think to finish in a position where there is European football next season. In fact, I know that. I know that that's the expectation inside the club. 15th is simply not acceptable. So I think that would be your minimum marker. What is European football? Because you know it's not just top five anymore. You can be going six, seventh, eighth. If United finished eighth and got into the Conference League, I'd hardly say that would be viewed as a resounding success. European football has been integral to Manchester United. The club is structured on not just European football, but Champions League football. And that affects everybody from the number of players that you need to the number of analysts you need and the whole fan psyche. I've written numerous articles on Manchester United European adventures. Even as a journalist, going back to last season, them when United drew Athletic Club in the semi final. I used existing contacts to get an interview with an Athletic Club player previous round Leon. I used existing contacts to get an interview with Nemanja Matic. That's all gone now. And those weeks between games really will feel drawn out and hopefully not too depressing because Manchester United are a little bit better.
- [39:47]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, it's not going to be easy, Critch, but can Manchester United afford to finish the season outside of the Champions League again?
- [39:55]
Andy Mitton
Again in the financial sense or in the sense that Both. Well, you're right to say both, to be honest, because they're both intertwined together, I think, financially. Look, another year outside of the Champions League would be the third consecutive, if it was another one, and that would be. Well, it would be unprecedented in the poster Alex Ferguson era. It would be a mark of quite how far the club would have fallen. But we're getting ahead of ourselves here and imagining that finishing. Finishing 15th again come May. Let's try and stay on the optimistic tip. I think outside the Champions League wouldn't be so much of a damaging effect as long as, as Andy says, I think there was European football Europa League, as long as there was a sign of clear progress, not just an improvement on 15th, because that's quite a low bar to have to just get over. But. But clear progress. And let's not forget that when Omar Berard is talking about title challenges in 2028, that's. That's three seasons away as we stand here today, it seems an ambitious goal. If it doesn't seem as ambitious come the end of the season, I think that will be a huge positive and something that United can work with. Perhaps another year in the bottom half would be more acceptable if United had been very restrained in their spending this summer and they'd shown caution and they'd looked after the pennies as we were told they were going to have to. But they've spent now and that brings expectation with it and those will only rise. And so I think, think if anything, that's sort of increased the expectation, increased the pressure. But then when isn't the expectation insanely high at Old Trafford anyway? That's always been the case.
- [41:28]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah. I can't believe I'm about to say this statement, Andy, but because it is Manchester United. But it does feel like Manchester United have been rebuilt from the ground up. You've got Carrington, new training facilities being built, you've got the stadium as well. This has to feel like an interesting point for the club in terms of where they want to see the club go.
- [41:48]
Reuben Amarim
Yep, Carrington had faded, much like a lot of the infrastructure at Manchester United under the Glazers, there wasn't enough investment going into it. So what was best in class in 2000 wasn't in 2023, and now it's had a serious makeover and we'll be up there. The bigger question is Old Trafford. We've seen the plans for that. A new stadium, a redevelopment. So Jim Ratcliffe favors a new stadium. How that will be funded, it still remains to be answered. So that's not going to be a quick fix. Ineosa change the training ground. They want to change or redevelop Old Trafford, as I've discussed, and absolutely want to change the football side of it. Money's gone into the club. Is it an ideal ownership? Not at all. The Glazers are still there, but it was put to me when the deal was done. So Jim Ratcliffe has done the only deal that he feels that he could get done. It's complicated. It's unedifying, as is much of football's ownership structure, not just at Manchester United. But you are right, it feels like a new start, more so this season than last season, because people were. They'd only just been arriving, so they couldn't really impact when you've been there for two weeks. But I think they've had a sense of weighing everything up and feeling like, okay, we've got to hit bottom before we can rise again.
- [43:11]
Ayo Akimolere
I know we're trying to stay on the relatively positive right now, Critch, but on Tuesday, you reported on the Athletic that the Manchester United supporters group, the 1958, will be protesting against Sir Jim Radcliffe ahead of the season opener. What. What is that all about?
- [43:27]
Andy Mitton
Well, I mean, we're used to these protests that become slightly more regular over the last few years, but certainly over the last two decades since the Glazes leverage takeover took place. So, yeah, the 1958 group, supporters group, one of several United supporters group, possibly. Maybe. I don't know if Andy would agree, but maybe one of the more militant ones that are around at the minute, certainly in terms of calling for these protests and these demonstrations, they called for another one. And this time they said that the difference with it was that they were Jim Ratcliffe himself would be a focus of it as well as the Glazers. Previously, they've kind of only solely been directed at the Glazers, and so that was called on Tuesday, but actually quite interesting development since then. I think some of the reaction to that, certainly online, was. Wasn't best. Well, it wasn't totally aligned with it. People were asking, why are we doing this now? You know, with this sense of optimism that we've been talking about. People felt it jarred slightly with that, and then the 1958 subsequently sent out a survey and we're asking for feedback and recommendations and a sentiment essentially to make sure that they were actually reflecting the fan sentiment on this. So I think that is actually an interesting note. Perhaps in the past when these things have been called, people have. Have gone along with it. Some people have attended, some people haven't. But this time there was a bit of pushback against it, and I think that perhaps speaks to that. There is this sense among fans that, okay, look, the Glazers certainly are a problem, but Jim Ratcliffe, despite a lot of the change that we've seen over the last 18 months, despite the cost cutting measures, and there's been songs against Jim Ratcliffe sung inside Old Trafford and on these protests as well, but there's still a sense that people want to see what in do, see their ambitions for the club, see how far this goes. It's not quite that level of opprobrium that you would expect with the Glazers just yet, so I thought that was interesting. We'll see if the protest goes ahead, I guess.
- [45:11]
Ayo Akimolere
Yeah, I mean, it's. It's very interesting because we're trying to look forward and we're trying to see where this new idea of Manchester United will end up. Andy. But let's not forget, there is still a lot of unrest with many fans as to what's come before and how things are actually moving forward. Forward.
- [45:26]
Reuben Amarim
The Glazers remain a significant issue for Manchester United and Manchester United fans. I think if you ask fans, would you like to see the Glazers leave tomorrow, you'd be getting 95% saying, yes, sir. Jim Ratcliffe is very different, as Critch has said. I still think the fact that money has been put into the club makes him very different to the Glazers. And in the eyes of most fans, that's still the case. And I think a lot of fans still want him to succeed. I want it to succeed. None of this is ideal, but I preferred it to state ownership, and a lot of United fans did as well. So it depends who you ask. You can get really swayed by seeing what you see online. It's often very different to the reality of actually being there at Old Trafford in real life. And, and I've learned that over 30 odd years writing about Manchester United. It's actually quite nice in real life going to games and at time you look on Twitter and it's just poison and it's toxic. I know that when I'm stood on Samat Busby way before the Arsenal game next week, providing Manchester's weather doesn't let us down again, I think the mood will be pretty positive, which is one hell of a turnaround when you consider the last game was in bil.
- [46:45]
Ayo Akimolere
All right, gents, let's end it there. Mark, Andy, thank you so much for your time. And before we end something, you need to keep your eye out on this Sunday, Adam Leventhal has been given insider access to the world of referees, looking at what it takes to be one. And he's explaining some of the new rules to look out for as well. Here's a taste. What if I was to tell you.
- [47:05]
Andy Mitton
That 97.5% of decisions last season were.
- [47:09]
Adam Leventhal
Deemed to be actual accurate?
- [47:10]
Andy Mitton
Well, accurate. And how many times did they have.
- [47:12]
Reuben Amarim
To come out and apologize?
- [47:13]
Andy Mitton
Well, you would think they would get.
- [47:14]
Adam Leventhal
More right because of all the VI.
- [47:15]
Reuben Amarim
That they've got and stuff like that.
- [47:17]
Ayo Akimolere
Nothing's going to be 100% perfect.
- [47:19]
Reuben Amarim
But I'm fed up of talking about var. I'd rather have a discussion about a.
- [47:22]
Ayo Akimolere
Referee and they be on their merits. If I'm completely honest.
- [47:25]
Mark Critchley
Yeah, 97.5. That is a very strong number. It does surprise me a little bit.
- [47:30]
Andy Mitton
It's undoubtedly, undoubtedly more scrutinized than ever. And unfortunately as well, I have to say more, more questioning around the motivations around decisions, less acceptance of the decision, just being a human decision made in the moment by somebody who's wanted to do a really good job, works hard day to day throughout their entire professional life to be the best possible version of themselves on the field, contributing to the game, delivering good performances. But if, you know, if they get a decision wrong, which is undoubtedly a decision that's taken with good intentions of trying to get the right call, but maybe missing the mark, in a moment people will form an opinion that there's.
- [48:08]
Mark Critchley
Something else behind that decision and there.
- [48:09]
Ayo Akimolere
Isn'T, that's inside the world of Premier League referees out on Sunday. Thanks for listening and we'll catch you soon.
- [48:16]
Adam Leventhal
You've been listening to the Athletic FC podcast The producers were Guy Clark, Mike Stavro and Jay Beal. Executive producers are Abby Patterson and Avi Moorhead. To listen to other great athletic podcasts for free, including our dedicated Clip Club shows, search for the Athletic on Apple, Spotify and all the usual places. You'll also find us on YouTube, so make sure you subscribe to the Athletic FC podcast.
- [48:49]
Reuben Amarim
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Andy Mitton
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Reuben Amarim
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Andy Mitton
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Reuben Amarim
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Andy Mitton
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Reuben Amarim
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Andy Mitton
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- [49:49]
Reuben Amarim
Carol, you're in remission.
- [49:51]
Andy Mitton
I think what gets me most about this whole journey that I've been through is is just how many jigsaw pieces come together to help someone like me. I've met people who have just packaged the drugs, just this white box saying World Courier on it.
- [50:05]
Reuben Amarim
But I want to better say thank.
- [50:07]
Andy Mitton
You to every single person that works on these things because they've saved my life. Every single one of them.
- [50:12]
Ayo Akimolere
Every minute, World Courier makes another life changing delivery. Learn more Search World Courier.