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- [00:00]
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- [01:00]
Verizon Announcer
Okay, I have to tell you, I was just looking on ebay, where I
- [01:03]
Sean Gentile
go for all kinds of things I love.
- [01:05]
Verizon Announcer
And there it was.
- [01:06]
Mark Lazarus
That hologram trading card. One of the rarest.
- [01:09]
TurboTax Announcer
The last one I needed for my set.
- [01:10]
Sean Gentile
Shiny like the designer handbag of my dreams. One of a kind. Ebay had it and now everyone's asking,
- [01:17]
Verizon Announcer
ooh, where'd you get your windshield wipers?
- [01:19]
TurboTax Announcer
Ebay has all the parts that fit my car.
- [01:21]
Sean Gentile
No more annoying, just beautiful.
- [01:26]
Verizon Announcer
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- [02:13]
Kevin Kerr
This is the athletic hockey show.
- [02:28]
Mark Lazarus
Hey everybody. Max Boltman here alongside Mark Lazarus for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show. We are in the final week of the NHL season. And some questions are getting answered. Some still resolve the Atlantic race, the east wild card race. Those are settled, but we still got a lot to get to in the Metro. The Metro teams are battling for the final spot there. The Islanders, I believe, are eliminated now after losing on Sunday. Columbus is behind the eight ball. They lost to Boston. This might very well come down to Philly and Washington. So we're going to have Kevin Kerr join us a little bit later to talk Flyers. And right now, from D.C. let's bring in Sean Gentile. He's been around the Capitals all week. Sean, we are going to get to the playoff race with the Capitals, but we got to start with the story that everyone wants to know.
- [03:10]
Sean Gentile
I've. I've. I've been told over the last five days that the only thing that matters around the Washington Capitals is the playoff race. There's nothing else going on.
- [03:17]
Mark Lazarus
Yes, there's a little something else that we got to get to. It's Alex Ovechkin. I'm sure you were like me watching this one, looking for hints as to, you know, is this his final home with the Capitals. There. There were hints in each direction. I would say maybe, or maybe more so in one direction, but you never know who's. Who's nudging what. Dylan Strom gets himself tossed from the opening face off so that Ovechkin and Crosby can have the face off. But kind of looked like Strom's having to shove OVI into that moment a little bit, too. And when the Penguins are standing there waiting to shake his hand, another thing that I took is like, oh, they. They think this. OVI waves him off.
- [03:51]
Max Boltman
No.
- [03:51]
Mark Lazarus
What are you doing? Get off the ice. I'm. I'm not doing this right now. You've been around him all week. What do you make of this?
- [03:59]
Sean Gentile
What do I make of this? I think this is what we're seeing here. I think he sincerely hasn't made up his mind yet. I don't think he's got his decision made and has it sitting in a drawer somewhere. I don't think that's what's going on. I think there is some degree of uncertainty there, but I think every single sign is. Points to this being it. Like that. There's. There's not. There's no other way around it. Like you. I don't think we would have seen what we saw at Capital One arena today if there were a 50, 50 chance that he were coming back like that felt like a funeral. That felt that. That. That felt Like a wake kind of. It was, it wasn't, it wasn't a funeral. It was, it was more upbeat than that. But I, I think the fact that we saw that go down the way that it did tells us a whole lot. Ovechkin, we saw it last year. It points throughout the Gretzky chase. He's not an overly self reflective person, I don't think. I think he's, I think he's C ball, hit ball when it comes to a lot of stuff. I don't, I don't think he, he has much time for overthinking things and I think what we're seeing right now is that play out in a very real way. I think it's as simple as this for him. He hasn't made a decision, so he's not going to act as if he has. And I think that is sort of the skeleton key for what we've dealt with over the last five days, which has been constant questions in, in different cities of people trying to get him to say like yeah, this is probably it and it means a lot to me for reasons A, B and C and he's not going to do it because A, I don't think he's wired that way and B, the Capitals, as you said at the start, at the top of the show maxi, they have a very real chance to make the playoffs. So the fact that they're still in the mix gives him plausible deniability in a whole bunch of coverage to approach this in whatever way he wishes.
- [05:58]
Max Boltman
It sure seems that everyone else thinks this is it for him the way the, that Crosby and you know, Malkin, they sat the home game to play the road game doing their down the stretch load management out of respect to Ovechkin. That was as big a sign as any. And you've got like the Crosby trying to set up the handshake line. Like Max said in post game with his interview with, with our friend Tarek Al Bashir, he said it's been tremendous. He's using the past tense there. It feels like even he thinks it's the end. But yeah, I think, I think you've nailed this. He just doesn't want to commit just in case he changes his mind.
- [06:32]
Sean Gentile
Well, we've seen it in other sports in very recent history. We saw it happen with Tom Brady. He know he thought he was done and then decided that he wasn't. And you know it. He paid a price for it in his per personally and I think, I think reputationally, I think and I think I think we can look to that and see the hazards of committing to something like this when you're not 100% certain. So I think, I think that's, I think that's at play here. And I think another thing that's, that's in play is that the fans, particularly, obviously in Washington, certainly particularly in, in Washington, they wanted this moment and they deserve this moment to be able to chant his name and, and, you know, go crazy in the full context of the event, knowing that this is, that this is potentially the last time. They deserve to say goodbye to him while he's wearing a uniform in skates and playing in a hockey game that matters. Not in July at some, it' at a ceremony, not next season. They want it to happen now and to some degree they deserve that. And I think that's why this has played out in the, in the way that it has is this is how, this is how we treat legends when they retire. This is how it's supposed to work under the best of circumstances. And I know it doesn't it lucky are the ones who actually get, get to have it play out that way. And that's why, that's why it's been strange because this is Alex Ovechkin. If he leaves, he is going to leave on his own terms, but he's also, which, which we've seen so infrequently, you know, even from players, players of his caliber. Right. But, but he's also got, he's not willing to put 10 toes down on it, which is understandable to an extent, but it's made for a weird vibe over the last week.
- [08:22]
Max Boltman
Do you, if he said, if he said, you know what, I'm coming back one last season, he gets the Derek Jeter Victory Tour treatment. The mark, Andre Fleury, Andre Kopitar, to a lesser degree this year, where everywhere he goes, there's a ceremony, he's getting gifts from other teams. Does that strike you as something that he would enjoy? Does he want to avoid that? Does he not like the pomp and circumstance?
- [08:41]
Sean Gentile
I think he got his fill of it last year. Dylan Strom told me as much a couple of days ago in Toronto. He says, you know, it was, it was a very fun mark. You're, you know, you, you know, Strom,
- [08:52]
Max Boltman
I miss Dylan Strom deep.
- [08:54]
Sean Gentile
I, I, I, I miss Dylan Strom. And I didn't cover a team that had Dylan Strom on it for, for a full year. Right? He said, you know, I don't want to put words in his mouth. But I think last year was tough for him. I think, I think last year, you know, because of the pomp and the circumstance and all that surrounding the chase, I think, I think he got his fill, basically. And I. That's not direct quote from, from Dylan Strom, but it's, it's close enough. Like, he's like, I don't know if, I don't know if he wants to do this again. So I think that's absolutely at play here. But I also don't think that's the driving factor. I don't think he's approaching this in a dishonest way. I think he's just not 100% sure yet. So he's, he's not going to act like he is.
- [09:38]
Mark Lazarus
From a practical standpoint, there's really not much for Alex Ovechkin to chase at this point. There's always more wins to be had. You can talk yourself into, oh, you know, with the right moves, could they get a little better? But I don't think there's really a path for us talking about the Capitals as a top five or six team next year, necessarily. He's not going to get to a thousand goals that would require like a 70 goal season. It's just kind of one more year for one more year's sake. And I, I gotta imagine that's a factor in all this. At the same time, like, whenever he walks away from the Capitals, I. Sean, like, he's not the greatest player in NHL history, certainly in like the top 10. But I don't think there's any player in NHL history who has meant more to their franchise, singularly. Well, they got, they got Sid too, right? I mean, like the Penguins have. And they, they had Ron Francis, they had Jagger. Right. Like the Red Wings, I think Iserman. And how like no one. Ovechkin is truly singular, complete league of his own for the capital.
- [10:31]
Max Boltman
The thing about the Capitals is they have structured their entire business around Alex Ovechkin for like a decade now. Like, they, they don't. They avoided rebuilds because all that mattered was the chase for the goal record. For years, that was the company's number one priority. And I'm fascinated to see what they might do if they finally have an opportunity to go in a new direction.
- [10:50]
Sean Gentile
Here, here's what I'll say about where he ranks in that, in that, in that discussion. I do think Lemieux is number one there. That is that hometown bias coming from me, maybe partially. He kept the Penguins from moving three separate times.
- [11:06]
Mark Lazarus
Sure.
- [11:07]
Sean Gentile
So I think that, and I think you could argue credibly that there's not an athlete in the history of North American sports who matters more to one franchise than Mary Elmu does to the Pittsburgh Penguins. The fact that Alex Ovechkin is maybe number two is a tremendous testament to the importance of Alex, of Alex Ovek. So I don't, I don't draw the Lemieux comparison lightly. And I, I, I don't, I don't mean to, I don't mean to belittle what he means to that franchise, because if, if he's not, if he's not one, he's two, right? I, I completely, I completely agree with you there. You know, what they've said from the start is, is that it's his decision to make. So if he wants to come back next year, guess who's playing left wing on the first line with Dylan Strom and, and hanging out on the left circle on the power play? It's Alex Ovechkin. They're, they are going to do as he wants them to do. And I think that in and of itself is testimony to the importance that he has with head organization. And it's, and it's a, it's a testament to the, to the cred that he's built up and also the player to some degree that he, that he still is. I mean, he's, he's a wild watch these days because he's not moving, moving there all that much. But also he's, he's going to score 35 goals. So I don't know. Like, like, how do you, how do you reconcile that? It's a significant goals.
- [12:26]
Max Boltman
Last year, 33 goals. This, he's still a positive possession player. He is a black hole defensively, but he's still so good offensively and he's got that shot. He can outperform every metric.
- [12:36]
Sean Gentile
And he's got the benefit of having a coach who respects him and understands his flaws and is willing to mitigate them in a way that also still shows a very real degree of deference to his accomplishments. In Spencer Carbury, I think that is, you know, in Jack Adams last year deserved. Right? Like, like we're, like we're Spencer Carberry. His, his, his reputation is, is certainly, certainly intact. I'm not going to sit here and gas him up all that much. But I think the fact that he has found a way to, to maximize what Oveskin has left in the tank while also hiding, you know, some very obvious deficiencies in his game as A As a soon to be 41 year old man, I. That is. Don't underestimate the importance of Spencer Carvery to this, to this entire operation, to the way things have gone for Alex Ovestkin for the last three years. Because I don't know that there are a ton of coaches that would have the patience or the juice or the. I think to some degree, frankly, like emotional intelligence, it takes to, to manage. To manage what he's had to manage over the last little bit.
- [13:52]
Mark Lazarus
If he's not a Washington Capital next year, is he playing hockey in the khl? I mean, I know I'm asking you to kind of crystal ball a little bit here, but I think that's always kind of lurked in the background here is that, you know, it happened with Pavel Datsuk. He retires from the NHL, but he played multiple years in Russia. I mean, I'm of the impression that that's kind of on the radar here.
- [14:15]
Sean Gentile
Absolutely. I mean he's said as much like he's at multiple points throughout his career. And we're not talking 10 years ago or five years ago, we're talking in November on the podcast that Jeff Merrick and Bruce Boucher do together. Okay. Like he is. He has said that it is his intention whenever his North American career is over to play some amount of games with, with Dinamo. Right. Like we don't know if that's one game, two game, two seasons, three seasons. Like it's going to be some amount of time. I think that's the variable. But the idea of him, you know, wearing that uniform at some point is, is, I would say it's almost a fate of complex at this point.
- [14:55]
Max Boltman
It's not hard to imagine him doing the Yager route and just like owning a team and playing in five games a year to get sellouts and just scoring one timers every now and then and just being a part of it for sure, day to day aspect.
- [15:06]
Sean Gentile
And I think that's also, you know, you mentioned Yager. I, I think there, there's some parallels there too with what Pittsburgh has had to. Had to deal with as far as Jagger's retirement was concerned. Yes, like the, the overall shape of their careers were completely different. But you know, the way Yagur's post retirement, post NHL retirement plan kind of fanned out, he kept Pittsburgh waiting for a certain amount of time to honor him. And I think there is also probably some degree of concern and I would, I would say that it's short, it's short term rather than long term. But I think that's why we saw what we saw today. I think there is kind of a need to honor him while he's here, honor him while he's still in uniform, because we do know that when he's back in Moscow, he's going to be there on a permanent basis. Right. And once you're over there, we've seen it with Jagger, we've seen it from plenty of other great players. It's a little bit tough to get him back.
- [16:05]
Mark Lazarus
All right, well, then let's do what Alex Ovechkin would have us do right now and talk about the Capitals playoff race instead of his future right now, because it's real. It's still a little tepid. I mean, the Flyers have the inside track here. The Capitals and the Blue Jackets are going to play what amounts to an elimination game, and it does not mean that winner gets in, but the loser is eliminated.
- [16:23]
Kevin Kerr
They.
- [16:24]
Mark Lazarus
The Capitals would need to win that game and have Philly lose twice, which is tall odds, but it's not impossible. Carolina.
- [16:31]
Max Boltman
Carolina and Montreal, they got two legitimate
- [16:33]
Mark Lazarus
opponents, and Carolina's plan to lock up the one seed and Montreal, depending on what happens with Buffalo, could be playing with the division still in play. With home I still in play. Those are two losable games here. The Capitals are on a little bit of a push lately. Like, do you see them finding a
- [16:48]
Sean Gentile
way to get in if they beat Columbus on Tuesday, they have one point to play with. Like, that's, that's what. That's a major factor here is. You're not asking Philadelphia to lose twice in regulation. They can have an overtime loss or a shootout loss in there because of the tiebreaker. So I, I think that fact. And I haven't. I haven't looked at the updated playoff odds. I'm sure. I'm sure those will be up on the Athletic from Domestician by the time this pod posts. I don't know what their playoff odds are, but the fact that they own the tiebreaker with Philly is a huge. Is a huge, huge deal because Philly does have. Philly does have that. The schedule's tougher in Columbus. You know, it looks like a much more winnable game for Washington now than it did 10 days ago.
- [17:38]
Max Boltman
It's really incredible how this, this. This east race has kind of come back down to earth. I mean, the Capitals lost. What was it, 8 to 1 to the Rangers and 72 to the Devils earlier this month. And in March, everybody couldn't. Nobody could lose. And now nobody can win. And, you know, it's. The Flyers are the only team that's really playing well down this stretch. I mean, yeah, the Capitals just swept a home and home from Pittsburgh. That was a Pittsburgh team that had nothing to play for. It was kind of amazing how they,
- [18:03]
Sean Gentile
it was Pittsburgh and Wilkes Barre, I think, right? Pittsburgh yesterday and Pittsburgh today. Yeah,
- [18:09]
Kevin Kerr
man.
- [18:09]
Sean Gentile
I. Laz, you mentioned the Rangers loss. That felt disqualifying in the moment for Washington. And look, if they don't, if they don't make the playoffs, it's going to be because they didn't get two points out of the New York Rangers. Because if they miss, they're going to miss by one or they're going to miss by two with a tiebreaker, Right? In all likelihood. So you know, that that felt seismic at the time as it related to the Eastern Conference playoff race. And I think it's, it's still bearing out that way, even though, you know, this has dragged on a little bit longer than people anticipated and kind of taken a different shape than maybe we would have thought a few days ago.
- [18:48]
Max Boltman
Yep.
- [18:49]
Mark Lazarus
All right. That is Sean Gentili. Sean, thanks for doing this. I know you've had a busy week. We're gonna take a quick break right there. We'll come back with Kevin Kurz to talk about the other team that we just alluded to, the Philadelphia Flyers.
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- [22:12]
Mark Lazarus
All right, we are back and we are going to bring in now from Philadelphia Kevin Kerrs, who is covering the Flyers. We talked about the capital side of this playoff race with Sean in segment one. Philly's the pole position holder though, and they've been red hot really. Not just for like a couple weeks here now, but it is 16, 6 and 1 in their last 23. Kevin, what's gone right for the Flyers lately?
- [22:33]
Kevin Kerr
Well, you know, to me it starts with the defensive play and in goal and obviously goaltender has been in focus here for a little While the Flyers had the worst goaltending in the league last year. And Dan Vladar has just been a complete home run in that. He's been steady really since day one. He's been consistent. He rebounds from bad games, which we just saw him do again the other day in that win in Winnipeg, coming off of getting pulled in Detroit two days earlier. And defensively, you know, it's been a weird season because when Rick Talkett first got here, that was the part of the game that this team picked up pretty much right away. And obviously Talkett is known for his defensive style and being a very, very strong defensive coach. And that was why, if you look at, go back and look at the standings, the Flyers were hanging in it around Christmas time until early January and then it just fell off a cliff. I mean, they nosedived in January. They were given up high danger chances left and right. The goaltending wasn't bailing them out, but you didn't really blame the goaltenders for that. And then coming out of the break, you know, maybe they just were fatigued coming out of the break. They found that defensive style and a lot of the offensive things that I think, I think Talkett changed a little bit too. He tried to simplify things a little bit. So where there's a little less decision making both offensively and defensively and the team has responded to it. You know, Travis Sandheim has been a rock back there. He's come back from the Olympic break not fatigued at all. He even said he's playing his best hockey this season. Jamie Drysdale's improved defensively. Cam York doesn't do much offensively, but he's been a good partner for, for Drysdale. Rasmus Ristolainen, who was name was all over trade boards leading up to the deadline. He was a guy that Danny Brayer had a high price for. No team met that he's been paired with Travis Sandheim on that top pair. He's been playing really well. So to me that's where it starts. You know, they've refound that defensive identity they had early in the season and some other guys are scoring more often and obviously it helps a little bit. I'm sure you guys want to talk about this when you get Tyson Forster back, when you get a rookie like Porter Martone in the lineup, added to an improving Matt Vaymichkov, you're going to score more roles.
- [24:45]
Mark Lazarus
Well, let's hold off on Unmarton there because you mentioned Forrester and you know, you look at the arc of The Flyers season, early January, they're in a playoff spot and then it all kind of comes undone. And it's not one for one. And now obviously they're surging back with Forester. It's not one for one when all these runs happen, but it's kind of mapped a little bit to Forster's availability for them and in Forster's health is. They were, they were there and then they didn't. They were without him and they were, you know, in a huge lull. He's back. I know that the run back started before he came back and like I said, it doesn't overlap perfectly, but it's pretty close.
- [25:20]
Kevin Kerr
Yeah, I mean, you know, he's a guy that I've always thought Flyers fans, even Flyers fans locally, underrate him a little bit. But now we're on two coaches. Both John Tortorella and Rick Tockett have used the words Mark Stone when describing Tyson Forster's game as, you know, he's. He's big, he's got the long stick, he's great along the wall, he's got a great shot. I mean, they, they. There are a lot of similarities between the two of them. Obviously, Mark Stone is the more, you know, he's the bigger name now. And Tyson Forster still has some growing to do, but at the time Forster was hurt, which was December 1, everything pointed towards him taking a huge step forward this year. He was leading the team in goals. He had 10 of them at the time, which is a 40 goal pace. Defensively, he was outstanding. He was killing penalties. I mean, if you look at Dom's analytics, he had Forster in the conversation for a selkie because of how proficient he was defensively. So he's just one of those guys that every coach loves and every coach misses him when he's not in the lineup. And you know, from the Flyer's perspective, there are two things that, that he brings that they lack when he's not in the lineup. Size because he's a big guy. This, especially the time he got hurt, this was a smaller lineup, so they missed that right away. And a shooting mentality. You know, this team, there were too many guys throughout the course of the year when Forster wasn't here passing up shots or just not getting to those dangerous areas. That's never been a problem for Forster. He can get to the dangerous areas and he can rip it probably as well as anybody, if not better than anyone on this roster.
- [26:48]
Max Boltman
So I usually get wrapped up in these teams that make, make a run at the end of the season to get into the playoffs. They're in playoff mode. I always think that team's going to go on a run. I am a Flyer skeptic. I look at this team, I see a bad power play. I see a bad penalty kill. They've. They've been the sixth best team in the league since the Olympic break. They've only got eight wins, eight regulation wins in that time. Convince me that the Flyers, I mean, they're playing the Penguins in the first round, most likely. That's a winnable series. Penguins aren't scaring anybody. Convince me that they would be able to handle the Carolina Hurricanes in the second round. They're at that kind of a level based on how they're playing right now.
- [27:21]
Kevin Kerr
Yeah, well, I don't think. I mean, you know, I think they can get Pittsburgh a series because, you know, if you're looking at Pittsburgh, which is the team, you know, assuming they get in here, they're going to play that. That's a. That's a winnable series because I think the Flyers are deeper now than the Penguins, and I think they have the better goaltender now. You know, the Crosby factor, I wouldn't even necessarily pick the Flyers in the first round because the Crosby factor, he just kills the Flyers. And because as you mentioned, Mark, I mean, Penguins have. The Penguins have a top 10 power play and penalty kill. The Flyers are near the bottom. They have the worst power play, and I think they're 22nd or 23rd in penalty kill. So, you know, I'm skeptical that they could go on any sort of deep run. I think they could be Pittsburgh. But, you know, what you're looking from this team, what they've been looking for, management has been looking for from this team all along, is just improvement. It's a very young team. If you take their top nine, I averaged out their ages, the top nine forwards, the average age is something like 24.9. I mean, they got all these young guys in here. Maybe they're too young and stupid to even realize that it's going to be pressure situations. Right?
- [28:27]
Max Boltman
It works.
- [28:28]
Kevin Kerr
They surprised everybody. But. But, you know, they were looking for this group to. To obviously the addition Stany made in the off season. He wanted the team to get better. He wants this young core, especially those young wingers, to grow with some of the veterans that he kept around that he. And that he labeled as, you know, team leaders, so to speak, on and off the ice, like Travis Koneckney, Travis Sandheim, Shocketorier. And they've done that so that's, you know, the encouraging thing, I think, if you're a Flyers fan going into the playoffs, is that the team has gotten progressively better even from, from the course of, of three weeks ago to now. I mean, you know, they, I know they lost that game in Detroit, but they beat the New Jersey Devils easily in a game they needed. Before that, they go to Winnipeg, they take care of business. Seven to one they beat them. So, you know, they were getting those, you know, the, the shootout points earlier and the, and the loser points earlier. They're winning games more, more out right now. I mean, at least lately and more, more, a little bit more convincingly now. You know, they still have to do it one more time here over the, the final two. But even some of the games they've lost recently, there was a game in Washington that they lost. And then, you know, Max, you probably remember the game against the Red Wings in Philadelphia. The Flyers out chanced the red wings like 2 to 1 in that game, and they still ended up losing. So even the games that they've dropped lately, they've been in just about every game over the last little while.
- [29:49]
Mark Lazarus
Well, they played the Red Wings three times in the last two weeks, and so I've seen them a ton. And the first of those three matchups, which in fairness was the only one the Flyers won, it was a defensive clinic. I mean, they were locked down, kept everything to the outside. You know, I'm. My skepticism with them kind of has stemmed from do they have enough offense like that'll keep the games low scoring in the playoffs. But there's been an answer to that with Porter Martone. And you inject this skilled top 10 pick into your lineup and he puts up a point per game in his first two weeks in the league, that there's your skill, there's your offense that you've been needing. It's a lot to put on a young kid, but it helps.
- [30:24]
Kevin Kerr
I mean, the impact he's had was instantaneous. I mean, even his very first game in Washington D.C. i think three and a half minutes, he takes a delay, a game penalty. You're like, oh, geez, that's a heck of a way to start your career. And actually JSL James Higgins, I think, did the same thing. Took a hook in the Penguins, Columbus Bruins, Columbus game. But even throughout the course of that game against the Capitals, Martone got better as the game went on. And then by the third period, it was a five, four game and a close game. He's getting in the front of the net. He's creating chances, he's and all sorts of havoc. And then the next game, which I think was that Detroit game you talked about, Max, he had like nine shots on goal, scores the overtime winner against Boston, that was only a week ago now, I guess, in a must win game, scored another power play goal and then he finally got his first even strength goal Winnipeg. I mean it's, it's, it's every night this kid is making plays and you know, even a game like with the Winnipeg game, he didn't really have a great game altogether, but he still found a way to make a play. Strips Adam Lowry to defensive end, he goes the other way, gets a great pass from, from Travis Konneckney and he finishes it. And you know, much like I just said with Forster, the two things that this team has lacked are a shoot first mentality and size. And he's got both of those things. And that's why, you know, Rick Tocquet has likened Martone to Forster in that regard. As guys that, you know, they can win a puck battle on the wall, they can take the puck to a dangerous area, they can either shoot it or look to pass it. And you know, what Martone has done so far has been remarkable. I mean it has not been a fluke. His seven points in seven games is a legitimate seven points.
- [32:07]
Max Boltman
This is like, this is one of my favorite times of year when Those kids, those 18, 19 year olds come into the league at the very end. Like we're seeing it in Chicago with Anton Frondell, who's the third overall pick last year. He's been a point to game guy, centering his own line on the second line. They already took him away from Bedard. It's fun to see that. But what Martone, these are big games. Like Frondel is doing this in like a vacuum where nothing matters. He's just getting his feet wet. The fact that Martone is playing like this in these games that just have the weight of the world on him, it's been really impressive to watch him play.
- [32:35]
Kevin Kerr
And I think it actually kind of speaks to the way Danny Brier has gone about this rebuild positively, right? Because he wants to, you want to bring a kid into this sort of situation, but you don't want to the weight of the world to be on his shoulders and the way that this team is set up, I mean they've got other guys. Trevor Zegras, Noah Cates has been playing well. Connectne has had a little bit of a skid lately, but he's still Their leading scorer. You got Forster back in the lineup. Christian Dvorak has been, you know, great in the middle, especially lately. He's really been a nice addition. So, you know, whether the Flyers win tomorrow is not. Or when either of the final two games. It's not necessary. Porter Martone doesn't have to be going to bed tonight thinking, boy, I got to go out there and I better score to nut tonight or the whole city is going to hate me because we're going to miss the playoffs. I mean, there's other guys and other veteran guys that can get the job done just as well as he can. He shouldn't be thinking that it's all a playoff spot rides on his shoulders.
- [33:34]
Mark Lazarus
Well, Owen Tippett's been phenomenal.
- [33:36]
Kevin Kerr
Yeah, I didn't even mention Tippett.
- [33:37]
Sean Gentile
Yeah.
- [33:38]
Kevin Kerr
Yeah.
- [33:38]
Mark Lazarus
And he's another one who can kind of be instant offense for you.
- [33:41]
Kevin Kerr
Yeah, yeah. And he's. He's had a little bit of a snag these last couple of games, but, I mean, he was driving the bus before the Flyers got Forster and Martone even in the lineup. The whole reason they were able to stay around, I mean, a big part of the reason was Owen Tippett, and, you know, his name was floated out in some. Some bogus trade rumors before the trade deadline. And the very first game, coming out of the trade deadline was really the first game. You're watching them, you're like, geez, where's this guy been all year? And I remember talking to him just one on one after that game, and I asked him flat out, and I said, you're, you know, the trade deadline's over, your name was out there. Is it a relief at all? And I forget specifically what he said, but he basically said, yeah, he's like, I don't like hearing that. It's. It's, you know, you don't want to. It's part of the business. But you. You don't like hearing your name and trade rumors. And I actually go back to last year, and I remember talking to him in Toronto after Flyers traded Morgan Frost, Joel Farabee, and Scott Lawton, who were like, maybe his three best friends in the dressing room. And he was really impacted by that. I mean, he's. You know, maybe he's a. Maybe he's a sensitive guy. He's a human being. Right. You know, when you lose your. Your best friends and you don't come. You come to work every day, you don't see him anymore, things are different. I think that really affected him So I do believe there's something there that the weight of the trade deadline was, was a weight off of his shoulders. And I mean, the way he's not, not just on the ice, but the way he's carrying himself off the ice, the way he's talking even to us, like you can a confident guy that is 27 years old. So he's not young anymore. He's locked up here for I think seven more years after this one, six or seven more years after this one. And he wants to be a part of this. He's, he wants to be one of the guys leading the way. And you know, more nights than not, he has been lately.
- [35:24]
Max Boltman
You mentioned Trevor Zegras. I know the focus is on the now, right now in Philly, but what kind of deal is he going to get? He's an RFA. He's having a career best season. He's got like 25 goals. Like he's almost at 70 points. He's played every game, which is a big deal with him. What kind of contract do you think he's looking at? Because they got some big contracts to give out in the near future.
- [35:41]
Kevin Kerr
It's, it's such an interesting decision because, or even just a conversation because, you know, he's playing, he's played center since the trade deadline. Now he's done some nice things at center, but like, is he. Is Trevor Zegras a number one center on a contending team? Like, I'm skeptical of that. You know, even last, even the game against the jets, he, he didn't do a whole lot. He's matched up against Mark Scheifele, which is a tough assignment for everyone. But you know, he, I don't think Zegras is a guy that can handle that. And frankly, that's why if the Flyers are to play the Penguins in the first round, if you're the Penguins, I think you'd be happy matching up Sidney Crosby on Zegris in the middle all day long. So, you know, he, he was having his early success on the wing as, as a left wing with Dvorak as a center. Now he's been playing center lately. This team strength is on the wing. Obviously they still are looking for that top line center and that's going to be, I don't know how they're going to go out and get that. That's going to, that's, you know, number one on Danny Briere's list. But I don't think there's any question they want to keep Zegras around
- [36:42]
Max Boltman
You
- [36:43]
Kevin Kerr
know, if I had to guess, if I just pull a number out of the air, I'd say five years, 45 million, you know, 9 million a year. I think that's the going rate for a guy that's about a point per game guy. Maybe not quite that much. But I think, you know, Rick Talkett really likes them. You can tell that there's a really strong relationship there between the two of them. Yeah. And it's going to be interesting just because, not just because of Zegras himself, but because this team has so many young wingers now that, you know, do you do. That's the first question I guess the Flyers have to answer. Is Zegras a center or is he a winger? And then maybe you go from there.
- [37:18]
Mark Lazarus
Well, you could, you could mix and match a little bit. I mean, if you have Zegras, Mitchkov, Martone, Tippett, like I, you know, those are great winger core to build around. And if you need Ziegers to flex in and someone gets hurt, you can do it. I mean, there are other wingers I think can play third line checking Martin.
- [37:35]
Kevin Kerr
There are certainly. But in terms of money, I mean, centers make more than wingers, right?
- [37:38]
Max Boltman
Yeah.
- [37:39]
Mark Lazarus
So no, no doubt.
- [37:40]
Max Boltman
Yeah.
- [37:40]
Kevin Kerr
I'm sure his agent is probably now looking at him saying, hey, this guy's played center for the last four weeks. So he's, he's got, he, he deserves top line center money. I don't think that's something the Flyers would be to do.
- [37:51]
Mark Lazarus
Future problems for the Philadelphia Flyers though, they got, they got present business to attend to. That's where the focus is. Kevin Kerr will be all over it for the Athletic. Kevin, thank you for joining us.
- [38:00]
Kevin Kerr
Yep, anytime you guys. Thanks.
- [38:02]
Mark Lazarus
We'll take a quick break right there. We'll come back, we'll wrap this up.
- [38:09]
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- [39:09]
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- [39:39]
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- [40:13]
Mark Lazarus
All right, we are back. We've heard LAZ from the capital side of things. We've heard from the flyer side of things. So here's what I want to do. You know, on the, on the Wednesday show when Frankie leaves the pod, Sean and Sean always do. What have we learned? I want to kind of forward look that a little bit. We're going to do what will we learn this week? And it's just going to be the outcome of the of the three remaining playoff races here. So we got the guys we just talked to Philly or Washington or I'll still allow Columbus here. There's still a chance that the Columbus Blue Jackets can get in for the last spot in the Metro. We can do Anaheim or LA for the last spot in The Pacific and Anaheim, LA or Nashville for the last west wildcard spot. Unless you want to get really bold and say San Jose or Winnipeg, I wouldn't advise it.
- [40:55]
Kevin Kerr
But this is.
- [40:55]
Mark Lazarus
What will we learn? So let's start in the Metro.
- [40:59]
Max Boltman
I think we're going to learn. Oh, you want to go to the Metro first? All right. I. I still think it's the Flyers. I think they have the inside track here. I. I just feel like everyone else is playing like mediocre to. Okay. And they're playing well. They've got the juice right now and we've seen it time and time again in these kind of situations. Where is the team that gets hot at the right time wins this thing? And I think Philly's gonna. I don't think Philly's necessarily good, for lack of a better term, but I think that they're going to pull this thing out.
- [41:25]
Mark Lazarus
It's just they do have those tough game and we talked about it with Sean, like, Carolina comes out to clinch
- [41:31]
Max Boltman
a lot of weight.
- [41:32]
Mark Lazarus
I think Carolina comes out to clinch it and then Montreal, it's like they should get that one done. But you don't. You never know.
- [41:38]
Max Boltman
I mean, Carolina just played a game in where they sat like 11 guys.
- [41:42]
Kevin Kerr
That is true.
- [41:42]
Max Boltman
So, I mean, I don't know how serious they are worried about that at this point.
- [41:46]
Mark Lazarus
About the one seed?
- [41:47]
Max Boltman
Yeah, I just. I feel like that's not a. That's not a huge priority at this point, so.
- [41:51]
Mark Lazarus
Well, frankly, some of it might be. You'd probably almost rather play Boston at this point than Ottawa too.
- [41:58]
Max Boltman
Ottawa also red hot right now. Right. I mean, Ottawa's came out of nowhere. We thought Boston was like ensconced in that first wild card. Now they're flirting with the second wild card because of what Otto is doing. Absolutely. So there's no good, like it's a myth that, like, yo, you want to play this team in the first round. I feel like that never works out. Like, who would have wanted to play the Florida Panthers in the first round three years ago? Everybody would have wanted to play them. They were the eight seed. They barely got in. They were bad most of the year, but they got hot at the end and they went all the way to the Stanley cup final. You don't want to play the team that becomes the 2012 LA Kings. You don't want to be the play that hot eight seed. I'd rather face a six or a seven seed than an eight seed a lot of times because that eight seeds been in playoff Mode for weeks already at that point.
- [42:37]
Mark Lazarus
The thing is, the Capitals have also won seven out of nine here. Like, I know the two losses in there are bad losses. They have won seven out of nine. They've been hot, too. But I. I do.
- [42:46]
Max Boltman
You're.
- [42:46]
Mark Lazarus
You're right. The Flyers have the inside track, and all they got to do really is get one win out of those two games. All right, that sounds good to me. I'll. I'll ride that one with you. We'll go. The Flyers. Let's go to the Pacific or the. Yeah, the last Pacific spot. Anaheim or la. As we record this, it is Sunday night, so I'm asking you to do this on less information than our listeners will have as we record this. The Ducks trail 2 to 1 against Vancouver. If they lose that game, it might even change your opinion of the Anaheim Ducks here. What do you think?
- [43:14]
Max Boltman
I want to say the Kings win out, leapfrog Anaheim, and we get Oilers Kings for the 17th straight year. I am openly, actively rooting for it. I was just in Edmonton with the Blackhawks last week, and I was talking to all the Edmonton writers. I'm like, how much are you hoping to avoid la? And they're like, oh, God, not LA again. I think it'll be absolutely hilarious to get Oilers kings again. And I got to think, if you're the Kings, don't you kind of want that? Don't you need to slay that demon? Don't you need to kind of get out there and you have to beat them. You have to beat the Oilers. I want to see it. I want to see it again.
- [43:45]
Mark Lazarus
I think that the Ducks find a way to hold on. But I say that knowing that it could look very stupid by the time anyone hears this.
- [43:51]
Max Boltman
You know, it's amazing. The Kings have, as we say this, have 21 regulation wins.
- [43:57]
Kevin Kerr
And therefore.
- [43:58]
Max Boltman
I'm going to go on a tangent here. The Montreal Canadiens are flirting with the number one seed overall in the East. They've got 33 regulation wins. That's not a lot. The Minnesota Wild. I was. I'm doing Stars Wild next week, so I was doing a deep dive on that. The Minnesota Wild, right now, if they lose their last two games, will be the only team in NHL history to be 100 point team with just 30 regulation wins. Overtime is so prevalent now in these shootouts that we don't know who's good and who's not. I swear, we really don't know who's good. In a Stanley cup playoffs where There is no 3 on 3 overtime and there are no shootouts. Cole Caufield is awesome, but he's God in three on three overtime. Will he be God in five on five Stanley cup overtime?
- [44:41]
Kevin Kerr
I don't know.
- [44:41]
Max Boltman
He might be, but there are so little that we know because so many of these teams have padded their records in overtime, which is, hey, that's the regular season. That's the way it's drawn up. But it's just, I would love to see three point regulation wins to avoid this scenario because I don't know if the Kings are actually good or if they're atrocious. They like the same amount of regulation wins as the Blackhawks.
- [45:02]
Mark Lazarus
Well, you could say the same thing about the Ducks. Right? I mean, The Ducks have 25 regulation wins.
- [45:06]
Kevin Kerr
Right?
- [45:06]
Mark Lazarus
I mean, it's more than the Kings, to your point. But that's not many, especially some of the teams that we've been talking about here as we've talked about playoff, Playoff tie breaks.
- [45:14]
Max Boltman
And like, we know the Colorado Avalanche are good. Do we know the Montreal Canadiens are elite? Are they cup contenders? I have. They've 33 wins. They have lost so many more games than they've won in regulation.
- [45:27]
Mark Lazarus
I don't know.
- [45:27]
Max Boltman
I don't know.
- [45:28]
Mark Lazarus
The issue that would scare me for the Ducks is Dostal. Like, he's had some stinkers lately and he should be one of their biggest, like, aces in the hole here. But he's not in form right now and that, that would make me a little scared. But I will go with the Ducks there. Are you at least taking the Ducks for the wild card? You're taking the Kings for the Pacific?
- [45:45]
Max Boltman
Yeah, I think Anaheim holds on. I, I Nashville. I mean, Nashville has the tie break on the Kings, I believe.
- [45:50]
Mark Lazarus
Well, they have the tiebreak on both of them. They have 20.
- [45:52]
Max Boltman
Yeah, the tiebreaker. Both. Yep. You can't count them out. They've got what, San Jose and Anaheim at home. Those are winnable games. There's going to be a lot of juice behind those games because they matter to everybody involved. San Jose is still on the periphery here. A lot can happen in the west still, man. There's a lot, a lot more action in the west all of a sudden than there is in the East.
- [46:10]
Mark Lazarus
Yeah, the pillow fight turned interesting, so I guess there's that.
- [46:15]
Max Boltman
It could be. It's competitive. Doesn't mean it's great. It's still competitive. Yeah.
- [46:18]
Mark Lazarus
You still want to know who's going to win it? All right, Great week of hockey on tap. That's going to do it for us today. The Sean's will be back with you alongside Frankie on Wednesday. We'll talk to you soon.
- [46:34]
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- [47:04]
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