Did Brady Tkachuk quit on the Ottawa Senators?

Summary

The Athletic Hockey Show – June 22, 2026 Episode Theme:
Did Brady Tkachuk Quit on the Ottawa Senators?

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Overview

In this episode, hosts Sean Gentili, Frankie Corrado, and Sean McIndoo dissect the blockbuster NHL trade that sent Ottawa Senators captain Brady Tkachuk to the Florida Panthers, reuniting him with his brother Matthew. They analyze the fallout for Ottawa, the structure and logic of the deal, team-building strategies in the current NHL landscape, Canadian fan sentiment, and whether Tkachuk “quit” on the Senators. The hosts also touch on wider themes of player movement, NHL "super teams", and shifting league dynamics, followed by a discussion on NHL general managers under pressure.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Brady Tkachuk Traded to Florida: Inevitable & Ironic

• [01:49 – 04:23] The panel opens with immediate reactions to Tkachuk's trade, reflecting on the inevitability of the move.
  • “It was the worst kept secret … where there’s smoke, there’s fire … here it is, it happened.” (Frankie Corrado, 03:06)
• The Tkachuk-to-Florida rumors had persisted for some time, especially once Samoskevich was moved out of Florida, suggesting a big deal was imminent.

2. Deal Structure Analysis & Ottawa’s Direction

• [03:06 – 05:46] Ottawa’s return: a package heavy on high-value draft picks, but no immediate roster replacements.
  • “You trade your captain … and do not get a single roster player back … there’s no reasonable way you can spin that as ‘we’re not taking a step back’ unless you’re not done. … These picks are currency.” (Sean McIndoo, 05:02)
• The Senators, with numerous holes in their lineup, need to leverage these draft assets into meaningful roster improvement – especially at winger and on defense.
• The deal is characterized as a “gift card” trade: Ottawa accepts flexibility over immediate help.
  • “Just get me a gift card next time, because I’m going to take that and get what I want … that’s how Ottawa approached it with the picks.” (Frankie Corrado, 05:46)

3. Is Ottawa’s Return Fair? Context Matters

• [06:31 – 10:18] Debate on whether Ottawa got enough—key given Tkachuk’s limited destination list.
  • “Am I delusional? I don’t think the return is that bad … in a vacuum, it’s not a bad return.” (Sean Gentili, 06:31)
• Florida GM Bill Zito’s approach is highlighted for remaining honorable despite leverage, offering a fair return.
• The trade is compared to Florida’s 2022 acquisition of Matthew Tkachuk—again, the Panthers acted decisively as other suitors hesitated.

4. Brady Tkachuk: Overrated or Underrated?

• [08:59 – 10:07]
  • “Brady Tkachuk has always been overrated based on his last name … but he is a very good player who has a skill set that is becoming increasingly unique.” (Sean McIndoo, 09:01)
• The group agrees he’s a high-value power forward, though reputation may be inflated by family ties.

5. Florida’s Ambitions and the Hellebuyck Rumor

• [10:22 – 14:03] With Tkachuk, Florida becomes the Atlantic’s “top of the division” team (Gentili, 10:57).
• Speculation the Panthers are preserving Anton Lundell for a potential Connor Hellebuyck trade to fully address their goaltending needs.
  • “Are they going to go out and get Connor Hellebuyck too?” (Unidentified Host, 12:49)
• Ottawa now turns to leveraging draft assets for NHL roster pieces, with suggestions like Philip Hronek and Brock Boeser from Vancouver as potential targets.

6. Super Team Era? Not Quite

• [22:40 – 29:41] The show rejects simplistic comparisons to the NBA “super teams,” instead citing a more multi-faceted NHL trend:
  • “I think we are zooming out a little bit too far … there are crucial differences [from the NBA] that are getting left out of the discussion.” (Sean Gentili, 22:40)
• The attraction of markets like Florida, Dallas, and Vegas is due to management, success, lifestyle, and tax factors—but none singlehandedly explain the trend.

7. Canadian Market Challenges & Player Preferences

• [29:48 – 32:02]
  • “Maybe hockey players aren’t as big and tough as we thought … maybe they actually like to be coddled.” (Sean McIndoo, 29:48)
• Discussion on why top players often avoid Canadian or northern teams—media scrutiny, market pressure, and lifestyle play significant roles.

8. Implications for the NHL and the NHLPA

• [31:22 – 32:02] Concerns about markets feeling like “feeder teams” for U.S. “super teams” and whether this perception could damage league integrity and collective bargaining equity:
  • “Perception is not reality, but perception is kind of the reality … that’s a big, big problem if it happens for the NHL.” (Unidentified Host, 25:22)
• The no-movement clause epidemic (75 of top 200 salaries) is flagged as a future discussion point.

9. Did Brady Tkachuk ‘Quit’ on Ottawa?

• [20:05 – 22:40] The show confronts the episode’s core question:
  • “When you’re the captain, the face of the team … and you say ‘I don’t want to be here anymore,’ you’re quitting, you’re quitting on your team … that just really diminishes [your reputation].” (Sean McIndoo, 20:10)
• Corrado counters by noting that players are increasingly empowered and franchises have long acted ruthlessly in their own interests.

10. Fanbase Psychology and Ottawa Reaction

• [16:28 – 19:22] Sens fans’ “good riddance” reaction surprises hosts; a quick about-face from previous admiration.
  • “This band aid fell off for the Senators … it was barely even attached.” (Unidentified Host, 17:41)
• Comparison drawn to Dylan Larkin’s trade request and subsequent shift in Red Wings fan sentiment.

11. GM Hot Seats: Who’s Feeling the Heat?

• [34:28 – 41:31] Discussion about general managers under the most pressure as the draft and free agency approach:
  • Stan Bowman (Edmonton): “Pressure … not only for his current job, but his future jobs as well.” (Sean McIndoo, 35:40)
  • Growing scrutiny on long-tenured or recently extended GMs like Kyle Davidson (Chicago), Steve Yzerman (Detroit), Chris Drury (NY Rangers), and Kevin Cheveldayoff (Winnipeg).
• Many struggling teams have already turned over their GMs; the hot seat list is evolving rapidly.

12. Wrap-Up: Leafs Big Move, Jonathan Toews’ Last Stand

• [44:38 – 52:13]
• Leafs sign Toronto native Darren Raddysh to a big contract—high risk, high reward.
  • “If he can play like last year, he’s well worth $8 million … there is at least a realistic world where he’s a bargain.” (Sean McIndoo, 46:43)
• Salary cap management is now flexible enough to absorb long-term “bad” deals.
• Jonathan Toews retires after a final season with his hometown Jets; hosts reflect on his importance to Winnipeg and the poignancy of a beloved player choosing to come home.
  • “He did everything his body would let him do … now he knows … and hopefully he can leave with some peace.” (Sean McIndoo, 51:20)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

On Ottawa’s Return (05:02)

“You trade your captain … and do not get a single roster player back … these picks are currency.”
— Sean McIndoo

On Florida’s Leverage (08:33)

“He’s got what he wants … what a way to cash in for the Panthers … the beat goes on, one perfect move after another.”
— Frankie Corrado

On Player Reputation (09:01)

“Brady Tkachuk has always been overrated based on his last name. … [But] he is a very good player who has a skill set that is becoming increasingly unique.”
— Sean McIndoo

On Fan Reaction (17:41)

“This band aid fell off for the Senators … it was barely even attached.”
— Unidentified Host

On Leadership and ‘Quitting’ (20:10)

“When you’re the captain … and you say ‘I don’t want to be here anymore,’ you’re quitting, you’re quitting on your team.”
— Sean McIndoo

On the ‘Super Team NHL’ Narrative (22:40)

“I think we are zooming out a little bit too far… There are crucial differences [from the NBA] that are getting left out of the discussion.”
— Sean Gentili

On NHLPA Management (31:36)

“Marty Walsh … at some point might have to say, guys, individually, I love that all of you are doing this, but collectively we’re supposed to get 50% of that pie … and that pie ain’t getting any bigger if you all keep trying to go to Florida.”
— Sean McIndoo

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Key Timestamps

• 01:49: Hosts react to news of the Tkachuk trade
• 05:02: Analysis of Ottawa’s return; implications for Senators’ rebuild
• 10:42: Are the Panthers the division favorite now?
• 12:49: Speculation on the Hellebuyck trade and Florida’s future moves
• 16:28: Fan reactions and “good riddance” sentiment in Ottawa
• 20:10: Did Brady ‘quit’ on the Senators?
• 22:40: Player empowerment and the “super team” discourse
• 29:48: Why do players avoid Canada? Modern NHL market dynamics
• 34:28: GM hot seats – league-wide job security analysis
• 44:38: Leafs’ high-variance Raddysh signing
• 49:59: Jonathan Toews’ retirement and legacy in Winnipeg

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Tone & Style

• Analytical, humorous banter, candid, with a mix of skepticism and empathy for fans.
• The hosts are critical but measured, blending insider perspective with fan sentiment.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Show

This episode is a must-listen if you want:

• A grounded, nuanced breakdown of why and how the Brady Tkachuk trade happened
• Honest discussion on the ripple effects for both Ottawa and Florida
• Broader themes of player empowerment, Canadian market struggles, and “building a winner”
• A candid, sometimes irreverent, always insightful look at the state of the NHL

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End of summary. This covers all main discussion points, context, and memorable moments from the June 22, 2026 episode of The Athletic Hockey Show, excluding advertisements and non-content segments.

Transcript

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[Sean Gentili]

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Terms and conditions apply. This is the athletic hockey show.

[Adam Grant]

What up?

[Sean Gentili]

What up? It's the Athletic Hockey show for June 22, 2026. I'm Sean Gentili, joined by Frankie Corrado and Sean McIndoo. Boys, we're gonna talk GM hot seats. We're gonna talk Darren Radish. That's all coming later in the show. There was a trade of note that took place in the NHL yesterday. I'm going to tell you where I was when I, when I, when I knew that something like this was going to happen. I was in the car coming back from a wedding pretty close to Erie, Pa. We're driving hour and 45 minutes down the road. See the Sam Miscavige trade happens. Florida sends him to Seattle and I knew, I knew it was going to be something. I didn't know who it was going to be. We find out by the end of it on Father's Day that Brady Tkachuk, Florida Panther joins Matthew Auto centers get a pretty solid draft pick return. We'll talk about that in a second. But man, I think we're the first people to talk about this here on the Athletic Podcast Network. Frankie, we'll start with you, man. What was the thought that ran through that dome of yours whenever you saw that the trade went down? Did it feel as inevitable for you as it did for me.

[Frankie Corrado]

It totally did. Man. It was the worst kept secret that this was something that was going to happen at some point. And like, where there's smoke, there's fire, where there's a podcast and it's being talked about, chances are this is something that was going to become a reality. So here it is, it happened. And I had a similar thought to you when I saw that Samoskiewicz deal go down. I was like, huh, is that Hellebuck or is that Brady Tkachuk? Two names, Those are the only two names that popped into my head and sure enough, it's Brady. And you know what? Florida Panthers, we all thought they were this candidate of a team to just turn it around next year and be right back in the mix. They just added Brady Kachuk. They added one of the premier like power forwards in the NHL wingers and he's going to play on the same line as his brother probably. So yeah, the Florida Panthers are going to be for real next year. We'll see what they do in net. But for the Ottawa Senators, it looks like a deal that a rebuilding team would make because you're bringing back all these high value picks. So now it's up to Steve Stales to turn these around and say I got the pieces I need. Because you need a winger to replace Brady. You probably needed a winger already and you need a defenseman, like a serious defenseman. So can he cash in on all that currency? Is the big question.

[Sean McIndoo]

Yeah. And he, he, as we're recording this, he, he's doing his availability and he has reiterated already as part of that,

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

that this is not, he does not see this team taking a step back next year. Now every GM says that all the time, but in this case, when you trade your captain, your supposed leader, your third best player, best player, maybe your

[Sean McIndoo]

second or third best player, probably not even that high if, if you're going by playoff performance.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But the face of your team, you, you trade that guy away in a

[Sean McIndoo]

deal where you do not get a single roster player back. There is no reasonable way you can spin that as we're not taking a step back unless you're not done. And these picks that they got, while nice, are currency. They're not. Don't, don't.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

If you're the Ottawa Senator scouting staff,

[Sean McIndoo]

don't get your hopes up too high because they now have a lot of picks to work with but a lot

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

of areas of need and according to

[Sean McIndoo]

the gm, a clear mandate that this

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

is about continuing the Progress of the

[Sean McIndoo]

last couple of years, not about taking a step back and reloading for five years from now.

[Frankie Corrado]

Can I just say something like I'm sure you guys have been in a situation where maybe it was a grandma, maybe it was an aunt. They got you a gift Christmas, it was for a birthday. And you're like, I guess, you know, it's really, it's a nice thought. What you wanted to say was, hey, grandma or Auntie sue, just get me a gift card next time because I'm going to take that gift card and I'm going to get what I want. And I feel like with the Ottawa Senators did they told Florida, I don't want your Samoskovich unless it's Lindell. I don't want it. So give me the gift card and I'm going to go shopping how I see fit. And the gift card, obviously the draft picks. So that's kind of how they've approached it. Throw an extra draft pick in there. I don't need a warm body. I'll go find a different warm body that I like for my team.

[Sean Gentili]

Am I delusional? I don't think the return is that bad. And I'm not, I don't mean I'm not trying to knock Brady as a player. I know all the jokes about him being the, you know, the third best senator are flowing and they have been for the last 18 hours. I don't like in totality, given what we know about the situation, given what Pierre LeBrun, you know, this, the kind of bits and pieces that he's reported about it. There's a good piece to that extent on the site right now. We knew that this was going to be Florida, right? We know like, yeah, he was a. Minnesota's there and yada, yada, yada, Minnesota, Carolina. I think if, if we are working under the reality, which is that it was always going to be Florida, even though there was, you know, some kind of cursory move made to leave four teams on the list so Steve Stales could maybe juice up their. Juice up the return. I think it could be worse. Honestly, I do. I think ninth overall this year they get the. Another first round pick. Another first round pick in 2029. Like, I don't. Am I, am I thinking about this wrong? I don't know if this, I don't know if this is just based on, you know, because everybody and their mother knew that there was really only one destination for this guy. But I feel like that it was in a vacuum. We'll see what he does with those picks, I suppose, but in a vacuum, it's not a bad return. I don't.

[Frankie Corrado]

I totally agree, man. Think about, like, Bill Zito. This guy's in a position where he could put the screws to anyone. When a player says, I just want to go to Florida or I'm going to give you four teams and Florida is one of those teams. But like, I kind of think Bill Zito's been pretty honorable through this. This, like this. And just thinking of other deals that have happened where, like, you know, like, guys have wanted to go there and it's like, no, I'll. I'll give you a fair market return. I want to conduct business in good faith even though I'm in a position of high leverage, even though I've got

[Sean Gentili]

you guys over a barrel here.

[Frankie Corrado]

Because actually he's got, he's got what he wants. And like, they, like, what a, what a way to cash in for the Florida Panthers. Are you kidding me? You have one bad year, you get a really high pick. You part with a forward that maybe didn't fit your forward group the way the other guys do, and now you're turning this around like, I can't believe it. Like, the beat goes on for the Panthers, just like one, like, perfect move after another, it seems like.

[Sean McIndoo]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I think two things can be true.

[Sean McIndoo]

Brady Tkachuk has always been overrated based on his last name.

[Frankie Corrado]

Is that right?

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I think so. I think if he was, if, if, if he wasn't Keith's kid and he wasn't Matthew's little brother, I don't think

[Sean McIndoo]

he's viewed the same way.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And it is also true that he

[Sean McIndoo]

is a very good player who has

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

a skill set that is becoming increasingly

[Sean McIndoo]

unique in the NHL as far as being like the classic power forward winger. And he brings a lot of value to a team.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Did the Senators get enough value? Maybe not. You know, I don't think this is a trade that if you just put

[Sean McIndoo]

it in front of, of their front office a few months ago and say this, they're not going to be sighted. No, they wouldn't do it, but under

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

the circumstances, yeah, they, they did. They did just fine. And you're right. I mean, this is, this is a lot like the Panthers Matthew Kachuk trade where it was another situation where everybody knew the team had to make a move, everybody was waiting around and, and the Panthers just elbowed their way to

[Sean McIndoo]

the front of a.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Back then a pretty decent lineup of teams and said, we're ready to. We're ready to drive off the lot right now?

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Here is, here is our offer.

[Sean McIndoo]

We want to do this today.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And they kind of did that with this one as well. And obviously there's a time crunch.

[Sean McIndoo]

You're dealing with a ninth overall pick that you can only move for the next couple of days, that you presumably are not going to have a pick like that again anytime soon.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I don't know.

[Sean McIndoo]

Here's my question.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Give me a number one through eight.

[Sean McIndoo]

Where do the Panthers rank right now in the Atlantic Division as far as you projecting next year?

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Let's not say standings, let's not say who finishes where, who comes out of

[Sean McIndoo]

that division, who's got the best odds to be in the conference final representing the Atlantic and the Florida Panthers one through eight. And I'm guessing it's, it's not going to be six, seven or eight.

[Sean Gentili]

They're still, they're on top of that division for me.

[Sean McIndoo]

Are they one?

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Are they ahead of? I mean, Montreal and Tampa, I think are the only two teams you, you

[Sean McIndoo]

put in the conversation. Even.

[Sean Gentili]

I'm done, I'm done believing in the Tampa Lightning. Like I've picked them to win too many playoff series over, over the last, over the last couple years. Like they're back in show me or shut up mode. I think so. I, so I will. You know, I. And Montreal. Frankie, you've. I, we've talked about this, I think in some capacity. Like we, we love the court. There's. There are holes on that roster still that, you know, they're not, they're not, they're not world, it's not world ending stuff, but they have, they have some slots to fill and they have some questions to answer before I'm ready to put them in that group. So I think it's, maybe you can call it 1A, 1B. But I, man, it's tough to not look at and I know that all these guys are old and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, but I get there

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

and they have no goalie. We literally, we think they don't have

[Frankie Corrado]

a, they have a plan, though. They have. And I wonder if like, you know, they could say what they want about Anton Lindell potentially being their number one centerman at one point. I don't know how much down the road Florida looks like. I wonder if Florida just looks at and says we're going to win right now and we'll figure the rest out later.

[Sean McIndoo]

So.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Yeah, so let's just, let's just say the quiet part out loud. The Ottawa Senators were told by Florida Lundell is off the table.

[Sean McIndoo]

Don't ask about it.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Was that because, as has been reported, the Florida Panthers just love this kid

[Sean McIndoo]

and think he's a big part of

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

the future, or was that because they've already got something in their back pocket and I'll just say Connor Hellebuck and he's a big name that would go in that deal.

[Sean McIndoo]

And so they're going to manage to pull off both of these because they

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

don't have, they don't have the trade assets to go get Connor Hellebuk right now. Unless Lindell's part of it.

[Sean Gentili]

Correct.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But they do have the cap space. As much as they just got a big ticket, they could still make it work. Cap wise. Are they going to go out and get Connor Hellebuk too?

[Frankie Corrado]

I think so. Hold on. Look at it from the Winnipeg jets point of view. They're dying for a centerman. Like they, they need someone to play under Mark Scheifele and if Hellebuk doesn't want to be there, you're going to tell the Winnipeg jets, listen, we can do Lundell. They would sign up for that in a heartbeat. Now it's a hypothetical. We'll see if it happens. But boy, like that, that gets the deal done.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, we know the conversation has happened.

[Sean McIndoo]

I feel like we can say with pretty good.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, the two teams have talked.

[Sean McIndoo]

They're. They. I can't imagine that they haven't.

[Sean Gentili]

Lundell makes more sense for the jets than draft picks do. Like, if you're ot, you can say like, all right, fine, we'll take the picks. We can use them. We can try to flip them for Jason Robertson or whatever. Like whatever. Whatever they're trying to convince themselves is going to happen here. That's easier to do with Ottawa, I think where Winnipeg is in their lifespan. Excuse me. Especially looking for someone to play behind Scheifele as long as they have. I think Lindell is an easier fit for Winnipeg. So it would make sense that you'd want to keep your powder dry if you're Florida there.

[Frankie Corrado]

Yeah, dude, if. And if I'm. If I'm Steve Stales now, my, my process is I need to identify the rebuilding teams that are going to value picks and who do they have that are good players that can help me win. Right now the first team I think of is the Vancouver Canucks. They would love to draft as much as they possibly can. Okay, so who do they have? Do they have a right shot defenseman who's really good, who can play a lot of minutes. They do. Philip Hronick. Do they have a scoring winger who's on a. On a big ticket that maybe helps reduce the cost of acquiring Philip Hronick? Because I can eat that whole ticket potentially, and take it off their hands while they get an asset back? Yeah, they do. In Brock Besser, like, I think that's the first call you make if you're Steve Stales and see if there's a way you can package those guys together. Unless. Unless I'm like pie in the sky in that. But I think that makes a lot of sense, especially with Travis Green having familiarity with Brock Besser already.

[Sean Gentili]

It's interesting. I, I hadn't. I haven't been online enough in the last 24 hours to see if that got floated, but that makes tons of sense, man.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Yeah, there was a lot of Jason Robertson talking. I. That doesn't make sense to me because there's a reason.

[Sean Gentili]

I just started that, by the way. That's. That's like. I'm just. That's like the, you know, okay, like, whatever, go, go.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Another American player who is.

[Sean McIndoo]

It has contract leverage and control and, and all of that, and unless he really wants be your guy, I don't think that makes sense.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

You know, the other piece that's been

[Sean McIndoo]

talked about is offer sheets that this does potentially, you know, that the, the

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

picks they acquired can't be used in

[Sean McIndoo]

the offer sheets, but it frees up their own.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Potentially.

[Sean McIndoo]

They could feel better about taking a swing at somebody. So. So that's an option, too. I think there's a few ways that. That the Senators can go with this.

[Frankie Corrado]

The Jason Robertson thing is. Is. I. I can't see that happening. Do we know, like, his brother plays in Toronto, right? Like, his brother's been sometimes dangled on the market forever.

[Sean McIndoo]

Do.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Do American players like playing with their brothers? Is that a thing?

[Sean McIndoo]

I don't.

[Frankie Corrado]

What. What I'm saying is, like, if. If anyone knows the intricacies of a Canadian market and how crazy it can be, it would be this guy. Like, he's not. He doesn't have to put himself through that. So why would he. Unless you're going to pay him.

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah. You just pay him more money than anybody else would. Like. I. I don't. I mean, sure, that. That always talks ultimately, but I don't know.

[Sean McIndoo]

I gotta say this.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Here, Here is the thing.

[Sean McIndoo]

And, and this is maybe me being in Ottawa, that has really landed with

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

me because, Sean, you said you hadn't

[Sean McIndoo]

seen a ton of the online chatter.

[Sean Gentili]

I. At least. Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I. I have been shot at the

[Sean McIndoo]

reaction from Senators fans because my first

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

reaction when this deal came down, I tweeted it out. I said, you know, this is a decent return for Ottawa, but, man, what a kick in the teeth for Sense fans because you've. You've been told for years, don't worry, this isn't actually going to happen. I know. You know, everyone's connecting the dots. It's not going to happen. The owner said it, the GM said it, the player said it, and then

[Sean McIndoo]

it happened exactly the way everybody always thought.

[Sean Gentili]

It's incredible. It's incredible.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And I. What's amazed me is how many Senators fans are.

[Sean McIndoo]

Are throwing the good riddance on this guy.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And I will tell you, it wasn't like that 48 hours ago.

[Sean Gentili]

Nope.

[Frankie Corrado]

All right.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And I'm not. I'm not saying there weren't some Senators fans who had real reservations, and especially

[Sean McIndoo]

about, you know, the. The way things happen with the Olympics and the. The politics of it and the fallout from that.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Absolutely. But you weren't hearing that. If you went into the places where Sens. Fans go, you weren't hearing a bunch

[Sean McIndoo]

of, we gotta get rid of Brady.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But as soon as the trade happened, like, you know that sometimes you use the metaphor of, like, you gotta rip off the band aid. You hear that a lot. This band aid fell off for the Senators fam. This band aid was barely even attached.

[Sean Gentili]

Floating.

[Sean McIndoo]

Floating on the top.

[Sean Gentili]

Floating on the top of the pool. Yeah.

[Frankie Corrado]

Yeah. Good at the band aid came off, though, Sean, because think about if you're Steve Steos and you're like, okay, let's play this year 100%. Let's just, let's go into this year and see what happens, because I'm in win now mode and I need to do well this year. So now you carve out a year out of that deal. What's your value next summer? He maximized, I think, the most he could possibly get for Brady doing this two years out and allowing Florida to get that extra year out of it.

[Contentful Advertiser]

And.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And if you're looking for a backlash, it so far has not happened.

[Sean McIndoo]

In fact, it has been the opposite.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And we've got you already.

[Sean McIndoo]

You can already kind of feel like the knives are out. And I'm sure there's going to be some stories in the next couple of days about, you know, the teammates thought this or this is what happened behind the scenes. I don't know how much of that will. Will get out or not, but this

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

fan base, I. I have almost never

[Sean McIndoo]

seen A situation where a player who

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

was this popular in a fan base

[Sean McIndoo]

has been traded and almost kind of look at each other and go, you know what? Good, good riddance, good riddance.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Every fan base does it to an extent. But you know, if, if, if Connor Helbuk leaves when Quinn Hughes left, if it's Austin Matthews, whoever, the next big star in a Canadian team who leaves, you're gonna have that kind of internal backlash. And in Ottawa right now, it's an

[Sean McIndoo]

awful lot of them are.

[Sean Gentili]

Did we not see a little bit of that with Dylan Larkin when he made his trade? When he, when he made the trade request, though, I feel like we saw that from, from Red Wings fans who immediately took on, you know, adopted some of the language that those of us who are like, Dylan Larkin, pretty good player, like, not a 1C on contender. And then all of a sudden, after years of having that debate, they swung over to that side in a matter of, you know, 15 minutes when we found out that the trade request had been made.

[Sean McIndoo]

And you know, what part of that is, is that as a fan in hockey, you, you can always sell yourself on the intangibles.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

You can always sell, you know, somebody can, can look at Brady Chuck and go, this guy's been a 30 goal, 70 point guy. Why are we acting like he's a heart trophy candidate? This, this is what he is.

[Sean McIndoo]

And you can go, yeah, but the leadership, he is our leader, he is our captain, just like Dylan Larkin.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And when the captain quits, and I'm sorry, it, I, I, players have a right to use their leverage and, and what have you. But when you're the captain, the face of the team, the leader, and you

[Sean McIndoo]

say, I don't want to be here

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

anymore, you're quitting, you're quitting on your team, you're saying, I want to win. We can't do it here. I can't pull you over the finish line. I need to go somewhere else where someone is pulling me over the finish line. You're quitting. And I think that just really diminishes in a way that, you know, maybe a, a Quinn Hughes or a Mitch Marner, like it doesn't land the same way with the fan base because those guys weren't supposed to be the guy.

[Sean McIndoo]

They didn't sign up for that.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And, and Dylan Larkin did. And Brady, you, you take the captaincy in an original six or Canadian market, and then after a few years, you go, is this too hard? I wanna, and I don't, I don't wanna, I don't want to bury Brady Chuck too much because the chance to play with your brother is a big deal. And you know, that is I, I

[Sean McIndoo]

get that to an extent.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

It, it doesn't bother me as much

[Sean McIndoo]

with him as it does with Dylan Larkin.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But you're still the captain. You're supposed to be the one tampering with other players to get them to come to you. Not getting, not being on this group chat, being sold on, you know, get

[Sean McIndoo]

out of, get out of where you are and come, come golf with us.

[Frankie Corrado]

The thing is though, the thing is Brady was the captain of the Ottawa Senators. Brady wasn't the captain of his little circle and someone else is the captain of that circle. And that matters more in the grand scheme of dad. I'm just saying. And one thing about like players using their leverage. And let's not forget Bo Horvat was the captain of the Vancouver Canucks. Drafted there, developed their mentored under the Sedan twins. He was never supposed to be not a Vancouver Canuck. You know what happened there? They neglected his contract and they said, ah, we're going to do J.T. miller and we'll figure the rest out. And you know what? So this time it's the shoes on the other foot. This is a player doing something else. And teams have had their way of doing things to players. Listen, I understand they make a lot of money. I get it. Chartered flights, fancy hotels, all that stuff is amazing. Right? But let's not pretend that teams are just so, like, they have this soft touch and they're so great. Like maybe players can be just as cutthroat as teams right now. And yeah, it sucks for the fan base. It's not meant to be a shot at the fans. It never is. It, I don't even know if it's meant to be a shot. It's just these guys have more say and more power than they ever have. After years of not having that.

[Sean Gentili]

I think there's some degree of overreaction taking place here. Like, I, I, I, it's, It sucks for 31 other teams that everyone wants to play for. The Florida Panthers, I suppose, but I think we are zooming out a little bit too far. I think it's gotten a little reductive with like the, the super team discussion. Like this isn't the same as everyone, everyone wants to draw parallels between now in the, the current moment in the NHL and like 10 years ago in the NBA. And that's not quite the same thing because back then, you know, you can look at Kevin Durant And Kyrie Irving. Not to go too far in, into the weeds with, with NBA stuff, but those guys wanted to play together and they didn't care where it was. They were like, let's take the reins, let's find it. Let's find a team that has three max slots available next season and let's make ourselves a package. We're not necessarily trying to go to New York. We're not necessarily trying to go to Houston or team X or team Y. That was a big part of the Super Team era in the NBA is those players being like, we want to go, we're gonna, we're gonna go chase rings together.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

We're.

[Sean Gentili]

The destination is secondary. The important thing is that, is that we're playing together here. It's more like, let's go do it in Florida or let's go do it in Vegas for a variety of reasons. So I, I think people are trying to, you know, compare the two a little bit more closely than, than they, than they should.

[Frankie Corrado]

It's just. That's an easy thing to.

[Sean Gentili]

It is, yeah, totally. And I get it. It's like, it's, it's not, it's not completely incorrect, but there's like crucial differences, I think, that are getting left out of the discussion.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And it is cyclical in a way.

[Sean McIndoo]

Five years ago, the Florida Panthers were the team that nobody wanted to play for because they never won anything. And when you thought of the Florida Panthers, you thought of like a piece of plywood where the glass should be. That was what that team was.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And so things change. And there was a time 10, 15 years ago where the absolute class of the league franchise was the Detroit Red Wings. And now they're the team whose captain

[Sean McIndoo]

wants to bail on them and go play in Florida.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

So, yeah, maybe some of this is just. It's. Maybe it's a little cyclical. And maybe right now it's, it's the Canadian teams or the, the Northern teams that are feeling it, but it could always swing back. And the NHL shouldn't. I mean, the NHL shouldn't overreact.

[Sean McIndoo]

Not that the NHL has ever overreacted to any problem. Right.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

We know how the NHL deals with

[Sean McIndoo]

problems, real or perceived. They sit back, they wait until it's absolutely too late, and then eventually they do something that nobody is happy about.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But I gotta say, perception is not reality, but perception is kind of the reality. And if you get a bunch of fan bases that come to believe that their team is actually just a feeder team for a handful of all star teams in Markets that don't generate much in the way of revenue and that if you're a fan in Winnipeg or

[Sean McIndoo]

Ottawa or Toronto or wherever, that your

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

job is to pay high prices and, you know, have, have the highest TV contract. And all of that stuff is so that money and players and everyone can flow down to Florida and Vegas and

[Sean McIndoo]

they can win their third and fourth and fifth Stanley Cups.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

It, it doesn't even have to be real for eventually you hit that tipping

[Sean McIndoo]

point and a fan base or a big chunk of it goes, you know what? Screw this. And that's a big, big problem if it happens for the NHL.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

If, if. Because three years from now we could

[Sean McIndoo]

be talking about, you know, geez, everyone wants to win.

[Sean Gentili]

Go play for San Jose or whatever.

[Frankie Corrado]

Yeah, dude, sure, 100%. Like, we've seen it. Like, how many times have the Edmonton Oilers got players because guys want to play with McDavid and want to win. For a while there, people wanted to hitch their wagon to Austin Matthews and Mitch Marner and William Nylander in Toronto because they thought that was a team that was going to have a chance to win. I mean, Pittsburgh Penguins, like, guys wanted to play with Crosby. These are not, there's not palm tree destinations. But what they were at the time were well run organizations that had a lot of success in the regular season, some of them had a lot of success in the playoffs, and guys wanted to be there. There would have been conversations in the NHL between guys at dinner or on the bus or, you know, warming up on a bike and you're down in Florida and you're like, man, imagine these guys ran a real tight operation down here. Everyone would want to be down here. Like those, those are conversations that, that happened. And guess what? Vegas came onto the scene. They run a great operation. Florida runs a great operation now Dallas does. Like, that's just, that's the way things have turned. And you can't always be at the top of your game forever. Case in point, Detroit. But at some point, the pendulum will swing and we'll talk about a different

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

set of problems and it, and yes, and I agree with that, except that

[Sean McIndoo]

there's a certain point where you go, okay, what exactly do people want here? You know, you want, you want an

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

organization that's going to treat you well. So everyone goes to Vegas, really? The most cutthroat, backstabbing organization in the entire league. That's where you're going to go? Well, no, we want to win. Okay, you want to win. The Florida Panthers just missed the playoffs. The Winnipeg jets, when they were winning presidents trophies, couldn't get anybody to go there. So I, I feel like some of the explanation fits and then some of it just doesn't because it's, it's all well and good. I've seen lots of people say, hey, Canada, you want some players? Try winning some games. You had the President's Trophy winner last year and nobody wanted the issue.

[Sean Gentili]

The issue is that there's no smoke and gun explanation for any of this. And this is sort of, I feel like this is the, kind of, the way that dialogue is moved online over the last couple days is like, you can't just say that it's the no tax thing. You can't just say that it's the weather. You can't just say that it's the quality. Like, we have, like we're, we're staring at our rundown for the show and we have eight different things that are, that are like in play here, right? And people want to attribute it to one thing at least vis a vis the Florida Panthers or, or the, or the Vegas Golden Knights. And it's not just one thing. It's a bunch of different boxes that are, that are checked in favor of those of those organizations. So yeah, Vegas doesn't care. But whatever, whatever, you're, you're in Vegas. And yeah, there's the, the weather's great and your wife's going to have a great time there and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, like there's enough things when it comes to the three teams basically that people are talking about now as it relates to the super team discussion that where they, they all have a whole lot of things going for them right now and it's not going to be that way forever. But that's, but that's the way it is right now.

[Frankie Corrado]

Right?

[Sean Gentili]

And a big part of that too is the personality types of the guys, of the guys that are, that are, that are, you know, in, in, in the discussion here. Like if, if, if Matthew Tachuk wants to go live in Florida and play hockey in Florida. Like I like that's just the, that's the, the, those are the cards that the Carolina Hurricanes were that, that, my God, that the Calgary Flames were, were dealt.

[Frankie Corrado]

Right?

[Sean Gentili]

Like there's a bunch of different things at play. It's not just one, not just one lightning bolt fix for any of this.

[Sean McIndoo]

Let me, let me just throw this out there as is, Is there an overarching factor? I'm going to throw this out there. I think we might have to come to accept or at least to, to consider. Maybe hockey players aren't as big and tough as we thought they were.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Maybe hockey players actually kind of, they kind of like to be coddled. They kind of like nice warm weather and everyone's going to treat you well and you don't have to sign any autographs or do anything hard. And again, like, I, I can't. The, the, the, the juxtaposition of this all happening against. I don't even know if New York

[Sean McIndoo]

is open again after that parade they just had of.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Here's what happens when you get this explosion of emotion and fan. You know, all of these guys are. And the idea that that was happening at the same time, that all of these big tough hockey players were probably watching it, going, oh, that, that looks scary.

[Sean McIndoo]

I couldn't do that. I'd much rather

[Sean Gentili]

your Maple Leafs are showing here, my man.

[Frankie Corrado]

What's the, what's, what's the old saying? You got it made in the shade, right? Like everyone loves flying under the radar. You can, you can make mistakes here and there and you're not going to get picked apart for it, right? But you play in a big market and the littlest thing can become the biggest thing. Did you look at someone weird on the bench? Because the camera caught it. And that's going to be on the four hour morning show, the two hour lunch show and the three hour drive show and it's going to be on SportsCenter and everything else. And it's like no one even saw it in a different market.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And, and, but if, if the league was 30 of those different markets, nobody's

[Sean McIndoo]

making millions of dollars in this league because nobody's watching it. So at some point and, and I

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

guess that'll be my last thing because

[Sean McIndoo]

this is a whole other topic to get to.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I do think this is an NHL problem.

[Sean Gentili]

Supposed to have a 35 minute show today, buddy. Come on.

[Sean McIndoo]

I think it's an NHLPA problem as much as anything. And Marty Walsh at some point might have to say, guys, individually, I love that all of you are doing this, but collectively we're supposed to get 50% off.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And that pie ain't getting any bigger

[Sean McIndoo]

if you all keep trying to go to Florida.

[Frankie Corrado]

I felt, I felt a duty to player empowerment. I felt a duty to wear some NHLPA merch today.

[Sean Gentili]

And then we can also have the no movement clause discussion next week or something because that's a big part of it.

[Sean McIndoo]

Do that.

[Sean Gentili]

75 of the top 200 cap hits have, have no movement clause counted. Counted. Today we can we can table that discussion, folks? The upcoming release of the Hockey 100. It's the definitive ranking of the greatest players of the game we all love so much, is set to release ahead of the 2026, 27 NHL season in October. You can pre order the link in our episode description. There's also a piece that McAdoo wrote last week explaining what we did, explaining that the series that we ran a few years ago that's now been updated and rewritten in parts for the book. So check that out again. There's a link in the episode description and there's a piece on the site Going to talk about GMs on the Hot seat coming up next.

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[Sean Gentili]

all right, a few of these guys came up in the first segment, but we are talking GM GMs on the Hot seat as the draft barrels towards us, as July 1st does as well. We're talking. We're talking Steve Yerman, Craig Conroy, Kyle Davidson. Even even though he got a even though he got a contract extension, Jury blah.

[Sean McIndoo]

Blah.

[Sean Gentili]

The reason this is top of mind guys is and the reason this discussion is taking place is due to the great Stan Bowman, who as of this afternoon, has committed $12 million for next season to Jason Dickinson, Connor Murphy, and Trent Frederick. The discussion starts with him. Is he Macindu on the top of your personal list? Because he certainly feels like he's at the top of mine.

[Sean McIndoo]

Yeah, I would say.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, hot seat as far as

[Sean McIndoo]

who's getting fired, maybe there's other guys that you could come up with, but hot seat as far as who's under the pressure? Yeah, I mean, that's, that's clearly it. And, you know, I would have said that before the Mike Babcock decision, but

[Sean Gentili]

didn't even bring that up.

[Sean McIndoo]

But, yeah, Stan Bowman is, is definitely the guy who is.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, he, he feels like he's

[Sean McIndoo]

not only on a hot seat for his current job, but his future jobs as well. You know, like, there's that. That old line from Moneyball about, you know, I'm coaching for my next job. At this point, I don't know that there is a next job for Stan Bowman at anything approaching the level he wants. If this all goes bad now, when you got Connor McDavid, maybe it won't all go bad. Maybe it goes good. And next thing you know, you're. You're having one of those parades and we all move on to the next thing. But, yeah, I can't imagine there's anyone under more pressure than Stan Bowman right now. And I don't, I don't know if we're off to a great start.

[Frankie Corrado]

I'm trying to think of, like a movie somewhere along the way that had all these a list celebrities. And it was like, you saw the preview and you heard the names and you said, that's. That movie's gonna be incredible. Are you kidding me? And if you were the Edmonton Oilers, like, and that commercial came on Stan Bowman, Mike Babcock, Connor McDavid, and I'm like, whoa, that team, like, how are you going to beat that in a world where Mike.

[Sean Gentili]

Mike Babcock is coaching an NHL team in 2016?

[Frankie Corrado]

And then it blocks and then it just, it goes to the box office. And a few people went to see it and it flopped and the word got out and then no one went to see it anymore. And I, like, it feels like that's what the Oilers are at this point, where they're just throwing, like, big brand name guys at the wall and seeing if something sticks for them. And yeah, there's a lot of pressure involved in there, but, like, it feels like maybe it's happened quietly. Maybe it hasn't. The GM turnover in the last two to three years in the NHL has been incredible. Like, we have so many new GMs in the last two to three years that if you look at guys that are on the hot seat, you have to look at names like, okay, we just mentioned Stan Bowman. He hasn't been there very long. Kyle Davidson, supposed to be working on this whole rebuild for Chicago, and they can't get going anywhere. Obviously, the Dylan Larkin news doesn't land well in Detroit, and Steve Yzerman has been there quite a while right now. But, like, there's a lot of teams that have moved on from GMs recently and have a new guy that's really trying to build up their organization at this point. And, you know, I think the, the best example of getting like a new GM bump is obviously Buffalo, but they have to continue that and Yarmo's got to make the right moves now or, like, you know, I'm not, not going to say that Buffalo is going to be back where they were because it was an incredible season and they, they deserve everything that they earned. But, you know, it's just, there's been a lot of turnover over the last few years. As far as general managers go.

[Sean McIndoo]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Typically when you talk about this, you look at, you go, okay, who are the teams that haven't made the playoffs

[Sean McIndoo]

in a few years and who are their GMs?

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Most of those teams have made changes already.

[Sean McIndoo]

I mean, they've, they've sort of moved on from, from a lot of these.

[Sean Gentili]

Had the turnover. Yeah, it's.

[Sean McIndoo]

So, Yeah, I, I don't know. It's.

[Sean Gentili]

We didn't mention Chris Jury. I don't, I, I feel like he's, he should be, we should have. And, and he should be in this discussion. But he's also got the asterisk, the asterisk next to his name because he's a James Dolan guy. We've seen James Dolan in various points over the course of his, over the course of his tenure, keep people in jobs way longer than he should have just because he likes them personally. And I think that's, I think that's part of what's at play here.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

What do you think the Knicks winning

[Sean McIndoo]

does to the James Dolan experience? If you're Chris Durie, I think he

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

just in, Is he just in a good mood and he's, he's hungover for and you're okay, or is he suddenly going, oh, this, this winning thing feels a lot Better than what we normally do.

[Sean McIndoo]

We should try that.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And also because that would be a

[Sean McIndoo]

very owner thing to do, right?

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Just agree to the rebuild and then

[Sean McIndoo]

call the guy in a year later and go like I changed my mind

[Frankie Corrado]

though, to, to a lot of these owners. Isn't there a part that, like, I'm a smart owner, I hired the right guy and you're all going to see it and it's like, this is, this is my guy and you'll see how smart he is. And like part of the owner firing the GM is an admission I got it wrong and now I got to find a new guy. Like, and I don't think they want to do that very often.

[Sean Gentili]

And I think that's, that's what gives jerk. Because like James Dolan, you know, he moves out, moves out Jeff Gordon and the power struggle goes, that goes to jury and blah. Like he's like pot committed with that guy in a very real way. And again, like regardless of what happened with the Knicks, you know, I, I, this is a, this is a guy who doesn't, who doesn't learn from his mistakes. Like, I, I feel like that was the blind squirrel finding an acorn there

[Sean McIndoo]

of a, over the last, over the last few years.

[Sean Gentili]

I'm not sure he's going to take the lessons learned and apply them.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

You're right.

[Sean McIndoo]

He might not want to admit a

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

mistake, especially since where did Jeff Gordon go? Did he go to a team that's having any kind of success? He's in Montreal right now just absolutely

[Sean McIndoo]

laughing and loving it.

[Sean Gentili]

I'll tell you what, if any, if anybody tells James Dolan that they wanted, that they want a couple playoff rounds, he's going to be really upset.

[Sean McIndoo]

He'll be. Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Let me throw a name out there

[Sean McIndoo]

that I don't think we've mentioned yet, but it is a guy who's been in a job for a long time and you talk about GMs who seem to have good relationships with owners, but things can run out.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Do you think Kevin shoveled off's in any trouble?

[Frankie Corrado]

I heard Dregs was talking about they're working on an extension in Winnipeg.

[Sean Gentili]

I won't believe that. I won't believe that Cheval day off is done in Winnipeg until, until the ax falls on him like he feels a job for life guy somehow still against, against all.

[Frankie Corrado]

He's won a lot of trades. And look, I mean, well, in trades

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

he's, he's done well in trades when he makes them, he may have to

[Sean McIndoo]

make a big one right now that, that he probably won't do well in.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But I, I do think people will

[Sean McIndoo]

understand, just like with Steve Stales. Like, you know, people understand circumstances at

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

play and it's, I mean, there we, we talk sometimes about, you know, certain

[Sean McIndoo]

people and while they know the market and it's usually kind of nonsense, but

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Winnipeg is a very unique market in the NHL and maybe Kevin Shoveled away

[Sean McIndoo]

understands it better than anyone else. But when you look at frustration from

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

a fan base, certainly Winnipeg was up there this year.

[Sean Gentili]

Let's just say enjoy Anton Lundell Chevy. That's, that's what I said. See how that goes. He signed through 2030 though. Lindell is. So you don't have to have that discussion whenever that trade inevitably happens. Frankie, what are you doing this week?

[Frankie Corrado]

We did our draft preview show this morning, so that's up on tsn. So we were, we went through our first round and then that's about it. Actually, it's pretty quiet for me, I'm not gonna lie.

[Sean Gentili]

All right, buddy, I think the three of us are back for one more show on July 8th. Have a good summer. Have a good couple weeks and then we'll reconvene after, oh, that wonderful free agency day. So we'll talk to you then.

[Sean McIndoo]

See you, bud.

[Hannah Burner]

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[Sean Gentili]

Sean McAnuita, Big Toronto Maple Leafs player. Bit of player movement there. So I'm wondering, what have you learned?

[Discover/Clio Advertiser]

What have we learned, Sean?

[Sean McIndoo]

I learned that Darren Radish apparently does not appreciate my attempt to garner sympathy for the Canadian markets because at in

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

the midst of all of this crying

[Sean McIndoo]

about it, we have the Toronto kid,

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

comes back home to the Maple Leafs,

[Sean McIndoo]

leaves Florida in order to do it Anna on a very big contract. Let's be honest, I think this was,

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

this was less about I want to go play for the hometown team and

[Sean McIndoo]

more about there's one team desperate enough to throw this kind of money at me.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But I gotta be honest, I don't hate it. I think this is a extraordinarily high risk reward.

[Sean McIndoo]

Signing even more so than most of these big contracts EC get handed out,

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

given the age, given the track record,

[Sean McIndoo]

you know, all of those things.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But very often we talk about deals

[Sean McIndoo]

in hockey being high risk, high reward

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

from a team perspective, when they're actually high risk, medium to low reward in the sense that it's like a team signs a guy and you say the best case scenario is that this deal is fine and then the worst case

[Sean McIndoo]

scenario is everything underneath it. Right.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Like I've seen this, this contract's been

[Sean McIndoo]

compared to like David Clarkson.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

David Clarkson was a guy where if he had been everything the Leafs thought they were getting, he would have been

[Sean McIndoo]

fine for the money he was being paid.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

That was the upside.

[Sean McIndoo]

And the downside was it could be a disaster.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And obviously it was this could be a disaster. This could be a David Clarkson level

[Sean McIndoo]

disaster for the Leafs. Absolutely.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But there is an upside here. There's an actual upside which is if this guy keeps playing like last year. If last year was kind of for real. I mean, he got Norris votes last year. Look at the 13 or 14 guys

[Sean McIndoo]

who got Norris votes.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

There's none of those guys are ever going to be available in trade.

[Sean McIndoo]

And then there's one guy and the lease.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Give up a fifth round pick and they're paying him 8 million and change. If he can play like last year, he's well worth 8 million for as

[Sean McIndoo]

long as he can maintain that level.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Huge if. Absolutely a huge if. But there is at least a realistic world where next year we're sitting here and he's had another 65 point season, let's say, and you're going, yeah, the Leaf's got a bargain. This, this guy for 8 million is,

[Sean McIndoo]

is fine as their number one offensive defenseman.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

We'll see how it works out. But at least I like the fact that there is room up top, which

[Sean McIndoo]

you don't always see in these deals that, where, where the risk is obvious and scary at the other side.

[Sean Gentili]

I think 8 million is just a number. We're going to have to get used to guys like Darren Radish making like that's just, that's just the way it is. Like if he's, if he plays. You said it, man. If he play more seasons or four more seasons the way he played last year, you said that's money. That's money well spent.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And then the other thing is, and,

[Sean McIndoo]

and I'm sort of forcing myself into this is.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I've the term right. Eight years. Obviously by the end of it, this

[Sean McIndoo]

is going to be a bad contract by the end. But I've, I've kind of.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

We've seen so many teams get out

[Sean McIndoo]

of bad contracts in various ways that I no longer think that they're as disastrous as I often do, you know?

[Sean Gentili]

No, because you can, you can retain some. Retain some. Retain a little bit of salary, maybe throw in. Throw in something else and then boom, it's, it's, it's fixed. It's not that. It's. It's. I mean, it's not a death sentence the way it was.

[Sean McIndoo]

Even David Clark, the Leafs found an escape hatch on that somehow. And, and let me see teams do it and, you know, we'll see how it goes.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And the other point that, that a couple people have made is if, if Ryder steps in and he plays, he plays well and he lives up to the contract, great.

[Sean McIndoo]

Awesome. You've got a team that is maybe

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

back in the playoff mix. Austin Matthews maybe wants to stay. Who knows? If he, if he comes in and he goes back to being the 30 point guy and it's a disaster. It's probably a disaster as part of an overall team. Disaster means Matthews is leaving and Nylander's leaving. And so, honestly, you have bigger problems.

[Sean Gentili]

You're gonna have bigger problems than Darren Radish.

[Boost Mobile Advertiser]

Exactly.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Like, what's, you know, the downside is, you know, oh, so what? It'll be like the 8th biggest problem you have, which is a depressing way to look at it, but also, it's hard to imagine a world where this

[Sean McIndoo]

contract is the worst thing that the Leafs have to deal with. Let's put it that way.

[Sean Gentili]

It's true. I learned that in Winnipeg there is a Jonathan Taves sportsplex. It was in the piece that Murat Attesh and Mark Lazarus wrote yesterday to commemorate Jonathan Toew's retirement from the NHL after a gazillion regular season games. He, I guess he purchased and runs the former Dakota Community center, which is where he played as a kid, and that's where he made his retirement announcement. Learning that hammered home, like, I feel like Taves playing for the jets was something that was a huge discussion point at the start of the season. And then we realized pretty quickly that it wasn't going to end the way anybody wanted. And that's a bummer. Like, I think, I think having this kind of retrospective that happens when he announces his retirement, you know, it reminds you how cool that could have been if it would have worked out the way that, you know, Jonathan Taves and Mark Chipman and Kevin Cheveldeoff, you know, envisioned when that deal was struck last year. So, you know, happy trails to Taves, man. He was a great player for a long time. The end wasn't necessarily the way that he, you know, the way that anybody wanted it. But, you know, it, it, it, the way it's being treated and the way it's being written about and discussed, it really does hammer home how important that guy is to the city of Winnipeg. And that's something that, that's something that's always cool to be reminded of.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And that's, that's why I don't mind that he, he came back and, and

[Sean McIndoo]

gave it a try for a year and then it happened in Winnipeg because,

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, we see this a lot and it's, it's a very entitled things

[Sean McIndoo]

that, that fans do.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

But, you know, you see like, Jerry Rice plays a year for the Seahawks and you as a fan, you go, I kind of wish he didn't do that. Right.

[Sean McIndoo]

Like, there have been a lot of

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

guys where you look back and you go, I wish they hadn't come back

[Sean McIndoo]

or played that last year or whatever.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

And, you know, I didn't need to

[Sean McIndoo]

see the Matson Dean in Vancouver year.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I wish they had just. And, and in this one, I mean, the circumstances were, were very unique. But the thing that makes me happy for Jonathan Toews is even going through that year that he went through and realizing that, you know, he didn't really

[Sean McIndoo]

have it the way he used to.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Now he knows. And, and for a while it looked like if he, if he never came back, he would always wonder. And, and now he knows. He gave it. He gave it a try. He did everything he could.

[Sean McIndoo]

He did every.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Everything his body would let him do. Now he knows and, and hopefully he

[Sean McIndoo]

can, he can leave.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Even though it's. It's relatively early in his career still. And, you know, it's. Hopefully he can leave with some peace

[Sean McIndoo]

and some sense of, I left it all on the ice and now, now I can move on to the next

[Sean Gentili]

chapter and he gets to stand at the Jonathan Tave Sportsplex and see people wearing Jonathan Taves Winnipeg jets jerseys. Like, that's worth the cost of admission, man. Even though, like I said, ended and ended, ended a little early and a little inauspiciously, it's still, still, still, still a cool thing and still a Canadian

[Sean McIndoo]

icon who wanted to come back and finish his career. Career in Canada.

[Sean Gentili]

Imagine that.

[Sean McIndoo]

The last, the last of them with

[Sean Gentili]

wish Jonathan Taze would have tried to finagle a trade to the Florida Panthers.

[Sean McIndoo]

There's still time.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

There's a. You have. When UFA Day hits,

[Sean Gentili]

future Florida Panthers 4C Jonathan Taves announced his retirement.

[Sean McIndoo]

Yeah.

[Sean Gentili]

All right, buddy. What do you got coming up this week?

[Sean McIndoo]

Oh, boy. What do I got? Draft stuff. We're gonna. We're going to take some, take some looks soon, huh? The various drafts and we got the hall of Fame announcement coming in about an hour. So I've got the, My. My latest class of the hall of Very Good.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

This is not as. Not an insult.

[Sean McIndoo]

This is a compliment to go into the hall of Very Good. And it's. It's usually a fun day.

[Sean Gentili]

So remember, guys, I'm glad we took a year off from you telling me why I'm wrong about Henrik Setterberg being a, being. Being a Hall of Fame caliber player.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

I mean, you are, but that's, that's taking a break. Glad you learned.

[Sean Gentili]

Thanks, buddy. And thank you to the listeners and thank you to the viewers. Your support means a ton to us and we love having you. Max, Corey Scott, Chris Peters, Tons of draft content coming up later this week into the weekend. Enjoy it and we're gonna have you covered from here on out.

[Liv Perez]

Hi, I'm Liv Perez from the let's Get Dressed podcast and this episode is presented to you by Depop. If you've been meaning to clean out your closet, but it feels so overwhelming, my best piece of advice for you as a fashion expert is to start with one thing. Depop. Depop makes it so simple to give your pieces a new home. Just snap a photo and their AI powered listings. Fill in all the details for you. And here's the best part. Make money easily with no selling fees on Depop, no seller fees means that you earn exactly what is yours. Another perk. There is someone out there who's going to love that piece the way that you did and who doesn't love making room for something new too. Download the Depop app and list your first item today.

[Boost Mobile Advertiser]

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[Leden Advertiser]

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[Boost Mobile Advertiser]

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[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Let's get in the tour bus and hit the road.

[Boost Mobile Advertiser]

No, not a tour bus. It's a regular car we use to deliver and set up customers phones at home or work.

[Leden Advertiser]

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[Boost Mobile Advertiser]

We deliver and set up phones. It's not a tour.

[Unidentified Male Host (possibly co-host)]

Oh you're definitely a groupie.

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