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- [00:00]
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- [01:06]
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- [01:50]
Max Boltman
This is the athletic hockey show prospect series. Hey everybody, Max Boltman here alongside the Athletics Scott Wheeler, Corey Promen and Flow Hockey's Chris Peters for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show Prospect Series. Guys, 2026 NHL Draft is finally in the books. We've been talking about it literally for a year since the day after the 2025 draft. And then I think there was a lot that happened here that went according to plan here. Corey all year, I think the conversation was about a few things. Number one, Gavin McKenna, he goes number one of the Toronto Maple Leafs. Number two, how tightly packed a group of top players there were in this class, particularly on the blue line. And I think that was borne out by the way that the top of the draft went. There's a defenseman that goes at number four. Maybe we thought a defender would have gone a little higher than that at certain points of his class, but it's not the defender we thought. It's Dax and Rudolph that probably Tells you a lot about how tight the top group really was.
- [02:51]
Scott Wheeler
Yeah, obviously Buffalo thought that Rudolph was the best defenseman in the class, and based on the New York Rangers post draft commentary, they thought Albert Smits was the best defenseman in the draft based. I think the Calgary Flames thought they got the best defenseman in the draft in Carson Carls, and I think the Seattle Kraken thought they got the best defenseman in the draft when they took Chase Reed. The San Jose Sharks thought they got the best player in the draft in Ivar Stenberg. Their general manager of my career said they had Stenberg one on their list. So I think, you know, everyone always has different opinions on players, but I think at the very top of the draft, you don't see that much diversity in the top three, top five, top six in terms of opinions. I think it kind of shows how tightly clumped up that draft was. I mean, if there was points during the, let's say, the 2021 draft where I had Dylan Genther number one and then he wasn't, but in hindsight, that wouldn't have looked, you know, like a bad, you know, unreasonable, even though he went ninth overall in that draft. I think this is going to be a draft where somebody who went 6 to 10 is going to become one of the very best players in this year's draft or may. And maybe it is someone like a Daxton Rudolph, even though that he. We never really discussed him at 4. He was always a guy that we considered in the group and thus we maybe we shouldn't have been too surprised that someone else thought he was at the top of the group.
- [04:12]
Max Boltman
I think that's what makes it interesting though, Scott, is like you have all these teams that, you know, especially when you say afterward, like New York didn't have to say that they had Smiths as their top defender in the class. Right. So they've kind of staked their claim now to it. Smith's is they're. They're not just comparing them to the guys who went after.
- [04:25]
Scott Wheeler
It's the guy.
- [04:25]
Max Boltman
And really only one guy went before, but it's a little bit of putting it out there.
- [04:29]
Corey Promen
Yeah. I think there's also a lot of patting yourself on the back. That tends to happen in the 24 hours immediately after the draft. But it does feel, to Corey's point, it feels like they're telling the truth this time, like there is a case
- [04:40]
Chris Peters
for Ivar Stenberg to be number one on the San Jose Sharks list. We talked about my player poll on
- [04:46]
Corey Promen
or Scouts poll on the, on the broadcast last night, there's a case, teams made a case to me for all five of the defensemen as the number
- [04:53]
Chris Peters
one defenseman in the draft class.
- [04:54]
Corey Promen
So there, there was sort of belief, different camps of belief on all of these players. Rudolph, I think, was still a bit of a surprise to be the first defenseman taken of that group of five. But his play in the playoffs with
- [05:07]
Chris Peters
the Prince Albert Raiders, the production, the
- [05:10]
Corey Promen
offense, the size, it's, it's all very real.
- [05:13]
Chris Peters
And so I don't think we could sit here today and sort of do. If we're doing winners and losers, I
- [05:18]
Corey Promen
don't think we're calling the Buffalo Sabres
- [05:20]
Chris Peters
losers for making that pick like that was a very defensible pick there.
- [05:24]
Scott Wheeler
You could all.
- [05:24]
Max Boltman
You make a case, I mean, Keaton Verhoff of the group of five that we talked about all year, Keaton Verhoff went fifth of those five. It wouldn't shock me, Chris, if the San Jose Sharks would have had him two, three, maybe even one for themselves, who knows?
- [05:38]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, I mean, obviously it was a great outcome for them to land Verhoff in that range. There wasn't a guarantee that any one of the right shot defenseman was going to be available at that point. But in the end they had that opportunity. So we talked about it throughout that there is a jumble and you know, in talking to scouts, it was not always about, you know, getting the order right first it was getting the groups that you wanted together. And that defense, that group of defensemen was for a lot of teams, a singular group. And then it was just getting the order right after that. So it's not a surprise that everybody had differing opinions. But now you, you look at how it played out, everybody can feel happy about it because of the way that it played out, because now they did get their guy. But the question is, where does it go from here? And I think when we talk about Dax and Rudolph in particular, I think when you're looking at these defense and we're talking about risk profile and other things like that. And for me, Dax and Rudolph, why he was one of the lower ones on my personal ranking was a bit of a higher risk profile because I wasn't as big a believer in some of the defending that I saw from the others, including Chase Reed, who, you know, was the guy that we all had pretty high. So that's going to be the conversation that I think, you know, all these guys, we said it last night, these guys are going to be tied to each other for the rest of their careers. We're going to be comparing and contrasting them for the rest of time. Rudolph might have the best offensive profile of the group. I think Reeds is close, you know, so that's the thing is like we're talking about, that's the kind of hair splitting we're talking about here.
- [07:10]
Corey Promen
Ironically enough, Keaton Verhoff started the year as the consensus number 1D prospect. Chase Reed finished the year, at least in my scouts poll, as the consensus number one D prospect. They're both the last two in that
- [07:22]
Chris Peters
group of five to get picked.
- [07:23]
Corey Promen
And I think that we never got to see who was. Who the top D were for the Toronto Maple Leafs, but I believe the top d after Gavin McKenna for the
- [07:30]
Chris Peters
Toronto Maple Leafs were Keaton Verhoff and Chase Reed, who were the last two in that group selected.
- [07:34]
Max Boltman
We talk about order matters a lot with these things, right? I mean it may be, hey, you look back and you think, oh, the whole league must have had it in this order. It's not always the case like that at all. Corey, what's the league been saying in your conversations with people since the draft about how the top of this shook out?
- [07:48]
Scott Wheeler
I think Rudolph has definitely been a surprise to a lot of people and I think the league were. Was always big supporters of Dax and Rudolph and they loved a lot about things about his game. I think when you talked about Rudolph, the, the conversation always turned to like, well, what's special about him that's different than the rest of the players? He's not necessarily the biggest, he's not necessarily the fastest, he's not necessarily the most physical. Maybe he has the most offense. But I mean, you know, his production was close to Carl's. His production is close to, to. To Reed and the under as an underage. Verhoff scored more than him in the Western League. So I think that's where the struggle was, is like he's a great player. Was he really the best though? I think that is a very reasonable conversation to have despite how great of a regular season and great playoff he had. And he's obviously six two and a half mobile right shot with legit skill and hockey sense. He's obviously a great player. I just. And I be curious what you guys think too. Like what do you think the Buffalo Sabers rationale was to get them all the way to the top ahead of those guys. Like I have a hard time picked. You could always, you always try to see things from other people's perspectives, even if you disagree like, okay, well what you think was their argument and I'm having a really hard time with it because I think all these other guys had equally good, if not better arguments to be the top defenseman.
- [09:07]
Corey Promen
I think if you're making the case
- [09:08]
Chris Peters
for Daxson, it's about the offense and the silkiness of the hands and the playmaking and what you touched on it last night, he made some of the higher end skill plays of that D group this year. I think that would be, that would be the case.
- [09:21]
Max Boltman
Look at the way that they've built their team to get here. I mean they've always really valued puck moving and like the blue line that they've had was built on a bunch of really good puck moving defensemen. It wasn't necessarily the Verhoff types that have gotten them here. Even Owen Power, who's their six six guy, more of a puck mover than a bruiser.
- [09:36]
Chris Peters
Corey.
- [09:36]
Scott Wheeler
I do wonder where Rudolph fits with the, with their team. Long term, I feel like he's best utilized as a power play guide. I don't know if he has to be a power play one guy. I think he could be a, you know, I think he's gonna be able to tilt the ice at even strength and he could be a really good power play 2 guy. But I do want to run a team that already has long term commitments to Rasmus, Dalina, to Owen Power. Will Rudolph really be utilized to the, to the best of his abilities?
- [09:59]
Max Boltman
Well, let's say Rudolph's ELC doesn't start two years. I think that's reasonable, right? How much does Darling even have left on his deal five years from now when that ELC is up? Is there any term left on the
- [10:09]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
deal at that point?
- [10:09]
Scott Wheeler
I would hope they, they think he's sticking around though. Well, yeah, but I'm saying like, I
- [10:12]
Max Boltman
mean at that point you're talking about like a 30 to 33 year old darling on another contract. I think there is one more year on his deal left at 11, but you know, Rudolph will still be a very young player at that time. Like, I think that there's a natural evolution to that. It's not the worst thing for a team to kind of have an heir apparent to its top power play guy. And maybe you could argue they already kind of have that in one power.
- [10:30]
Scott Wheeler
Yeah. And I listen, I think Rudolph's got elite hockey sense and you see the skill, it's great. Like I said, I just, I struggle when I watch him saying, is he significantly more skilled than Carl? Is he significantly More skilled than Chase Reed. I think there's. I think you could say if you're really ranking him, he might be one, but I don't know if it would be one with a bullet like that. That would be my hesitancy given that, you know, the defensive issues that, that Chris may alluded to. But if you want to say who's the most purely talented, gifted player of all five of these defensemen, I guess I could see the argument that you can get to Rudolph at one, and Darlene's a killer.
- [11:08]
Corey Promen
But Owen Power isn't a particularly hard player.
- [11:11]
Chris Peters
Redeem Murtka isn't a particularly hard player. They just acquired Olin Zellweger, who's not a particularly hard player. And the hardness is kind of the thing with Rudolph that scouts wondered about as well. So you don't have. I mean, Matthias Samuelson has that and Darlene certainly has that. But you do wonder a little bit about some of their guys lacking that. Maybe a little.
- [11:30]
Scott Wheeler
Yeah.
- [11:31]
Max Boltman
Chris, with Chase Reed, I mean, he's a guy that we talked about so much and how high could he go? Could it be as high as 2? I'm curious, like, when you look back on the eval on him, do you think it was a lack of kind of an elite trade? I mean, he was kind of the guy who's good at everything. But maybe there's not a. Whether it's the skating or the offense, I guess you could make the argument. But is it, is that the theory here?
- [11:49]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, I mean, I think there's a couple of things. One is that we, we talked about it last night was that while he is an offensive, good offensive player, the numbers were not up to the level of a Rudolph or even a Carl's at that point. And so that was a, was a factor for sure. You know, that's, that's. The other thing is like, I do think like the Albert Smith's pick. Other ones like that where I'm just like, wow, how did that, how did that happen? Like, you know, that's. Those are some of the ones where I'm a little bit more, you know, surprised by than. Than even Rudolph, because you can at least say there was that, that trade. I think Chase Reed to me is a lot more based on a projection too, because we don't have the long track record of the. Just the highest elite level competition that he has compared to some of these other guys, but still have a really good book on that and we've gotten to see that. So that's the thing where I'm just, you know, I still fail to see, you know how we ended up at 7. I think if you're the Seattle Kraken, you have to be celebrating to the because not only did you need a defenseman, you might have gotten the best one and now and so that's, that's the thing where I just see him as the ceiling on him being so high and you know, but that's also can be scary for teams at times where it's like is he what happens if he doesn't reach it?
- [13:03]
Scott Wheeler
You know, I feel as widely reported too that if that Bowen Byron trade doesn't happen, it was widely expected that Chase Reed was going to be the first defenseman picked by the Chicago Blackhawks.
- [13:13]
Max Boltman
Yeah, there's rhyme to a guy that we know they've liked and already left shin off there.
- [13:16]
Corey Promen
Right.
- [13:17]
Max Boltman
You, I think you make the case that Chase Reed is a better version of the same profile as already Lev should off.
- [13:21]
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- [13:21]
Scott Wheeler
But my point is getting back to just how tight the group was. It just depends who was picking when at that spot was going to find how the rest of the draft went.
- [13:31]
Max Boltman
Yeah, absolutely. All right, let's take a quick break right there. We're going to come back, we're going to talk about some of your guys favorite classes from the weekend.
- [13:42]
Jonathan Fields
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- [14:11]
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Scott Wheeler
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- [15:24]
Max Boltman
All right, we're back. And before we start talking about your guys favorite classes, I just want to lob this one up because this one's mine. I don't know as many of the day two guys right as you guys. I gotta go a little bit off sentimentality here. When I saw the Penguins take Liam Ruck in Round one, my only hope was please let Marcus lacks to pick 39 so they can keep these two guys together. And it does play out exactly that way. What are the Penguins getting in this duo that were the top two scorers in the Western Hockey League this season?
- [15:49]
Corey Promen
They're getting two of the smartest players in the class, unquestionably.
- [15:53]
Chris Peters
That is their identity. That's their DNA. They think the game at a very high level.
- [15:57]
Corey Promen
And they don't just think it at
- [15:59]
Chris Peters
a very high level in this sort of twin telepathy way where they're linked up and they know where each other are.
- [16:04]
Corey Promen
And that is a huge part of it.
- [16:05]
Chris Peters
And it's going to continue to be a huge part of it.
- [16:07]
Corey Promen
And they're going to prove, I think next year they're going to be the
- [16:10]
Chris Peters
one of the best duos yet again in the whl. They're returning to Medicine Hat. I think they're going to prove over time at North Dakota that they can do it together at that level, that they can point at that level.
- [16:20]
Corey Promen
The real question is, are they going,
- [16:22]
Chris Peters
are they both going to be equals in the NHL? And if one leg's behind, how are the Penguins now going to, to navigate that dynamic with the two of them moving forward here?
- [16:32]
Corey Promen
But it's a great story. They're awesome kids. They have a long way to go in the gym. They're two of the least developed kids physically in this draft.
- [16:40]
Chris Peters
So that's going to be a huge
- [16:41]
Corey Promen
part, make or break for them. The skating has to get better for both of them. But it's, it's, it's a bet on the skill level and it's not a bet dissimilar to the Ben Kindle bet that they made a couple of years ago. Like you can draw some lines. Kindle's going to be a center in the NHL. I think both of these kids are
- [16:57]
Chris Peters
going to be wingers.
- [17:01]
Corey Promen
But it's, it's, there's some Similarities now and now, suddenly that group is excused.
- [17:05]
Chris Peters
Smaller. They drafted Pierce Bowie today. Another sort of 511 guy in that mold.
- [17:10]
Corey Promen
That mold. Galvas, Thomas, Galvis. There's, there's, there's a theme there. And that's been a theme for Wes Clark and Kyle Dubas going back a long time. Now they got to.
- [17:21]
Chris Peters
They got to turn these kids into NHL players, and that's going to be a very tricky process for them to navigate.
- [17:26]
Scott Wheeler
I think Kendall's a better skater than the rucks, though, and also I think he's a little bit more detail off the puck, too. My concern now with the rucks, with the Penguins, is not that they don't have the offense for the NHL. They have the skill, they have the hockey sense of score in the NHL. When I think about winning teams in the NHL, you know, because you got to figure these guys have to play in the top nine. They're not fourth line forwards in an NHL roster. So now you're devoting, you're projecting anyways. You're going to be giving two of your nine roster spots to 511 and a half below average skating wingers. You know, it's hard for me to think of championship rosters where you had two real, two important spots devoted to that player type. Maybe you'd have one, but two, and then you have a small center now in Kindle. If they were to build a contending roster from that core, it would be a very unique one. Not saying it's impossible. I like both players, particularly Liam. I like Liam Marcus. I had a little harder time with getting around on that one, but Liam, where they got him was fine, but I don't know, it's. It would be not unique or, you know, one and one, but it'd be close to it in terms of, you look at what recent cores tend to look like. Even the small core that Carolina had, all of them were really good skaters. All them were super hard to play against. I don't know if the rocks kind of fit that mold.
- [18:44]
Corey Promen
And they told teams like they were
- [18:45]
Chris Peters
not shy about it. These were not kids who were saying, we'll go our separate ways, we'll play a part.
- [18:51]
Corey Promen
I think if it went that way, they would have. But they were very upfront with teams
- [18:55]
Chris Peters
at the combine that if you're taking us, we want you to try and make this happen for us. And the Penguins were the team that delivered on that.
- [19:02]
Max Boltman
Is that fair, Chris? Cause, I mean, I almost think for twins like, this could very well be a situation where they Literally are better together than they are apart. I mean, I think there's some fairness to that.
- [19:11]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah. I mean, we'll. We'll never know. So, I mean, like, that's, you know, I don't know that it matters. I mean, and you wanted the sentimental one. I wanted the comedy. I wanted the chaos. I wanted somebody to take them early and force a trade or something like that. Yeah. But no, you know, I think the Penguins made the commitment. As soon as you saw Liam selected, you knew that Marcus was going to be the next pick. And I do a lot.
- [19:32]
Max Boltman
Basically said so, yeah.
- [19:33]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
And he did. And I think a lot of teams are just like, all right, well, that's fine. If you want to use the 37th pick on Marcus, that's. That's fine, Will. You know that. But that's, that's. The other thing is, like, you know, there's. There's that question of, you know, draft value. There was. One is clearly more valuable than the other. You know, you're. You're also kind of making that commitment with a pretty significant asset with so much talent on the board still. So, you know, that's the other kind of conversation. Could they have waited what teams have been like, I guess we're just going to have to not pick them, you know, so that's, that's the other thing that could have happened. But clearly the, The, The Penguins made a commitment to doing this, and now we'll see how it works out, because as there, There's. There's a lot of uncertainty there, I would say.
- [20:17]
Corey Promen
And it's very possible that one of
- [20:19]
Chris Peters
them separates from the other at some point. Here we.
- [20:22]
Corey Promen
They're not twins, but we just watched
- [20:23]
Chris Peters
Bradley and Josh Nadeau go through it. They played together in the bchl. They played together at the University of Maine. They were both huge points players at
- [20:31]
Corey Promen
both of those levels. And then you get to the next
- [20:33]
Chris Peters
level, and there's a big, big difference between Bradley Nadeau and Josh. No one's a first round.
- [20:38]
Scott Wheeler
Not identical twins, though.
- [20:39]
Corey Promen
No, I know, but there's the two 511 playmakers who pointed almost identically and yet were never viewed at any step
- [20:48]
Chris Peters
of the process as equal prospects.
- [20:50]
Corey Promen
And I, I do think there's a chance that that happens here for Marcus
- [20:54]
Chris Peters
or Liam where there becomes a bit of a gap at some point, and that's going to be the challenge for
- [20:58]
Scott Wheeler
the Penguins, but it's not going to be next year. I don't really love their. Their decision to go back to the Western Hockey League next year. Like, I And I realize this, maybe they didn't find the recruit they got. They were late in the recruiting process. Maybe there wasn't the openings there that they wanted. They got to wait a year. But you figured they're just going to go back and have 50 points each in the Western League.
- [21:15]
Corey Promen
I just figured at their size, they
- [21:16]
Chris Peters
would have had a real. I think that was the factor. At their size, I think they would have had a tough time.
- [21:21]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
They would have, yeah, no question about it. And I think North Dakota, they both recently committed there. They were not going to have the spot for them this year. And that's the thing. A lot of teams weren't going to have the spot for the two of them.
- [21:32]
Max Boltman
All right, so that's my favorite class on that alone, basically. Scott, your favorite class. Factoring in the day two picks now,
- [21:40]
Corey Promen
it doesn't really factor in the day two picks, but I still love what
- [21:44]
Chris Peters
the San Jose Sharks did.
- [21:46]
Corey Promen
I think the San Jose Sharks have positioned themselves here to win a Stanley
- [21:50]
Chris Peters
cup at some point.
- [21:51]
Corey Promen
Like, I think that's the path that they're on and not frankly, failure to reach that, similar to where the failure
- [21:58]
Chris Peters
of the Leafs to reach that. And for a long time the failure of the Edmonton Oilers still have, have not gotten there.
- [22:03]
Corey Promen
The core, the nucleus that they now have, the firepower up front, the high picks they've invested up front. Now, having invested two first round picks this year in defenseman plus Sam Dickinson, you've got to get there now.
- [22:16]
Chris Peters
And that's a very, very hard path to navigate. The Buffalo Sabres didn't navigate it.
- [22:22]
Corey Promen
Jack Eichel left like it's you. They're going to have to thread the needle with all those guys.
- [22:26]
Chris Peters
They're going to have to keep Michael Misa and Ivar Stenberg and all of these guys happy behind Macklin Celebrini. They're going to have to make sure
- [22:33]
Corey Promen
that they're three high D picks that they've used become stars for them or if not stars, that all three of those are very good pieces of their top six moving forward. But it's there, it's right.
- [22:45]
Chris Peters
It feels like it's now right there in front of them.
- [22:48]
Max Boltman
All right, well, Scott took the big one off the board. Corey, what about you?
- [22:51]
Scott Wheeler
Well, I think San Jose had a great, you know, had a great draft that day one was just marvelous. But I actually think Toronto's draft class in total was the best draft of the weekend. And I say that knowing that I've kind of become, in some circles, the. The main. Gavin McKenna critic in some regards, even though I think he's a wonderful hockey prospect. But I think when you look at not just McKenna as the day one pick, they didn't have another day one pick. Then you look at everything that Toronto was able to do on day two, in part due to getting some draft picks from ascending Brad and Carlo to St. Louis. I just thought the day two picks were just solid acquisition after solid acquisition. The defenseman they brought in, Alex Bilecki, you have Ethan McKenzie, all really good skating, smart, competitive players. Then you have Mons Goodmanson, who I thought was one of the best defensemen at the U18 World. You know, big physical presence who can really shut down players at even strength. They got Patrick Plumans, who I thought was the best goalie at the U18 World. So just a lot of talent that they injected into their farm system to go with McKenna. And I think they fundamentally changed their pipeline over the course of this weekend. I think they actually now have a really strong farm system right now, which is not something I think we were ever saying about Toronto over the last couple of years after they were really trading picks. So I think they leave the draft in a really good position and not quite at the level of San Jose and Toronto. But I would also like to give a shout out to Vancouver because I think this was one of the first time the Vancouver Canucks has really invested in the draft, that they've tried to acquire draft picks. So they tried to then use the draft picks. I think they had, you know, one of the best drafts I've seen from Vancouver in a while. They get Caleb Malhotra and Adam the Votney on day one. They start off day two with Brooks Rogowski and Nicholas Aaron Olsen. They know that have two really good young center prospects in Rogowski and Malhotra. The kind of center prospects they have had a long time, you know, since Pedersen and before that, you know, God knows how long, you know, go back to Horvat and whatnot. And you know, with Novotny, Aaron Olsen to go with Willander to go with Zeve Boyam. They've got a lot of more work to do, but I think this weekend was a really solid start for the new administration.
- [24:56]
Max Boltman
Chris, how about you?
- [24:58]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, no, I agree with that. Those four picks from Vancouver was, was really, really strong and sets them up well. And yeah, getting a few extras later was good, but I'm staying in Canada. I'm staying in Western Canada. I'm going with the Calgary Flames and I, you know, I thought they had a really Strong first day getting Carson Carl's. Yes, he was the second defenseman of the two on my board. But when you also consider the factor, it's probably that you got to give a little bit of an extra boost to the western Canadian kid. Right. Especially if he's a farm boy on top of it. So we saw that. I think that he's going to be a real difference maker in their system. He's exactly what they need relative to what they have right now in their system. So that's huge. Think Jack Hextall. Not afraid of the Americans altogether, but you know Jack Hexall comes in solid two way center, a guy that's going to provide some depth. Probably middle six guy. More likely a number three kind of center with some energy. I like him a bit better than some of the prospects they, they're, you know, than their later picks last year. So I think that that enhances their system a little bit more. And then also like Chase Harrington, it was a guy that had some teams had a first round great on but they also got the best goalie in the draft. And Tobias Trey Ball, that was probably one of the bigger things here is he's going to UMass next year. He's going to be able to play probably two, three years in college, go straight in, get his AHL service time under his belt and then be ready to go. A lot of teams had circled him as the top goalie in the draft. He was the first goalie selected at 42nd overall. That was big. And even though I didn't love all of their picks because well, we could talk about the Joe Iginla pick later but that was one of the bigger surprises of day two. They, they did get one of the better overagers in the draft. And Igor Barabanov, who is a big guy, 90 plus points in the OHL last year they got him at 100th overall. So I like the value that they were getting from that pick as well.
- [26:43]
Corey Promen
Two of the meaner players in the
- [26:45]
Chris Peters
class in Carl's and Harrington too.
- [26:47]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, absolutely physical.
- [26:48]
Corey Promen
Two guys ask about this big time,
- [26:51]
Chris Peters
this class like just hard to play against.
- [26:53]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah. And Hextall is a, is a, is a dog as well. Like he at his best. He is a high compete player and
- [26:59]
Max Boltman
really I would let you know, broaden it out beyond the literal draft picks. They also added Simon Nemetz this week and they had a former number two overall.
- [27:06]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Exactly. So there's a lot of good things happening and they could have. They picked Joe Ginlow and they could have also added Adam Nemet.
- [27:14]
Chris Peters
They need a star forward or two
- [27:15]
Corey Promen
there somewhere along the line here, but
- [27:18]
Chris Peters
there's a lot of other pieces in place.
- [27:20]
Scott Wheeler
I think a week ago you would look at the Calgary Flames rebuild and have some sort of bleak assessment of where they are. Like yeah, you like Zane Parekh mat fake read and had had a nice year when his first year pro. You said there's a lot of work here to do. They've, you know, you look at all the ways they need to fill out a roster. You say, well they need this, this, this and that. You get to the end of the draft process, they're rebuilt's not over, there's still some pain left. But I think you look at what they acquired this weekend and you could see a path forward to getting out of this funk for the Calgary Flames.
- [27:47]
Max Boltman
All right, so just to recap, Chris Peters, the Calgary Flames Corey Promen, the Toronto Bay Police with an honorable mention to the Vancouver Canucks. Scott Wheeler, the San Jose Sharks. These are the favorite draft classes of 2020. We'll take one more break, be right back with the biggest surprises of the weekend.
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- [29:41]
Max Boltman
all right, we're back. And before we go today, I want to just talk about the biggest surprises of this draft class here. We'll take Rudolph off the board. We talked about him quite a bit in segment one and I would love, especially if these picks could focus on day two, some stuff I didn't hit on the live stream a little bit. Biggest surprise of the draft for you, Scott.
- [29:57]
Corey Promen
Probably Oleg Kouliabkin. The Halifax Mooseheads skilled forward, Russian import, pointed this year, but it felt like
- [30:08]
Chris Peters
junior points whenever I watched them play. He's a 510 guy without a lot of pro attributes and he went in not just in the second round. He went in the heart of the second round and was the first pick that the Tampa Bay Lightning made.
- [30:22]
Corey Promen
I have not been impressed. They had a reputation.
- [30:24]
Chris Peters
The Lightning had a reputation that I think carried them for a long time with the success of Braden Point, second round pick Kucherov, second round pick hitting on Headman, etc. They have not drafted well for me in a long time here and they were my least favorite class coming out of this year's draft.
- [30:41]
Corey Promen
That has been a bit of a theme for me. You look back at their picks of the last five, six, seven years. They took Benjamin routine, routine and finish
- [30:51]
Chris Peters
lit up the Finnish Liga this year in the fourth round last year.
- [30:55]
Corey Promen
That's a positive pick for them.
- [30:56]
Chris Peters
I was scrolling through their picks over the course of the last little while here. Not a lot of, not a lot of those picks for, for the Tampa Bay Lightning. So.
- [31:06]
Corey Promen
But that Oleg going that early, like I, I bet you that.
- [31:09]
Chris Peters
I bet you the brass with the Halifax Moose Heads were surprised that he went where he did.
- [31:14]
Max Boltman
Corey, how about you?
- [31:15]
Scott Wheeler
I know you said let's focus on day two. I would have said cool Yapkin as well. That was the one one for me. I mean, nice, nice player, good skater. I don't think he's like, you know, we think of five, 10 guys that have success in NHL, they need to be, you know, physical, hard, get to the inside. That's not really what he is. So like I have some questions on that one there. I've really struggled with the Jackson Culver pick. It's actually kind of funny. I feel like if you look at the online discords with Auto, it's all it's been about more about Jonas Lagerberg cone and I actually like the player. I like that pick. I think if they didn't take him, he was going like a couple of spots later. But cover at 32. I, I understand that he's six two. He can skate, he has good aesthetic skills and there's the whole like the story about how he hasn't had much high level hockey experience. But there were other six two guys who can skate and have offense who you didn't need to wonder how they're going to do as they, as they develop and get older. Like Chase Harrington. Yes. You know, did they really need to take the bet? Act 30 at 32 felt a little rich for me.
- [32:16]
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- [32:17]
Max Boltman
Chris, how about you?
- [32:18]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, so I kind of telegraphed it. I already said that Calgary was one of my favorite classes, but the, the Joe Iginla pick was a tough one for me to kind of wrap my head around. It was done me probably, probably one of the first ones where I mean Colby Atkins surprised me, but I still had 80 points. Yeah, he had a lot of points. Joe Iginlo was about a half a point per game player in the, in the WHL. He's 5, 10. There's, it's hard to see, you know, a third round pick in that player. Like I understand the story obviously the Gimla family connection, all those different things. Jerome McGinla, great player, you know, they did not get tiege in his draft year, you know, all those different things. But you know, at the risk of, you know, looking very foolish later, if they know something about Joe Iginla that the rest of us don't or that not a lot of other people see with the number of picks that they had that probably could have gotten him a lot later.
- [33:09]
Corey Promen
Was anybody really going to be. Maybe they know something we didn't. But was anybody really going to be working in the late third round to jump on him?
- [33:16]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
I, I doubt it. And so, you know, they did make five picks before that, which I think I guess gives you some license to take swings. But this felt a little too familial for me to feel like that was a good use of an asset. I mean, I think the good thing is, is that they did make some better picks later. I mean of all the players that they picked, I would probably rank him last of those players.
- [33:39]
Scott Wheeler
And it's due to the third round like, like Max, when Detroit took Keenan Draper was in the seventh round even then that caused that ruffled some feathers. But at least you're like, oh, you know, at that point in the draft, if you actually do like the player, it's fine. I think given the optics, given the fact that the player just really hasn't accomplished that much, he's not that big. It's the dude in the third round. I mean it, it requires asking some tough questions. Other organization, I think.
- [34:04]
Max Boltman
Yeah. All right, before we go, I want to set an over under here. Three and a half players from this draft class to play 30 plus games in the NHL next season over under Corey.
- [34:16]
Scott Wheeler
So we're talking McKenna, we're talking Stenberg, we're talking Albert Smith. And who'd be the other candidate you think is going to play well?
- [34:22]
Max Boltman
I'm asking if there's another one.
- [34:22]
Corey Promen
Is there, is there a Ben Kindle coming?
- [34:25]
Scott Wheeler
I mean it'd be hard for me to say. I'm not even sure Smith's plays right away. He might need to go to the American League to start. I think the safe bet right now is McKenna and Stenberg.
- [34:33]
Max Boltman
So just two then.
- [34:34]
Scott Wheeler
So I think, I think so.
- [34:37]
Chris Peters
Our colleague Thomas Drance asked me the same question earlier and I, I went with two. Like I think it'll be those, those two picks.
- [34:43]
Scott Wheeler
I think Smith will play games. It could be like how left Shunoff's rookie see, you know his draft plus one season when maybe he starts in the American League then he comes up second half or he makes the team goes that goes up and down because they're going to have that luxury within with the American League time. I mean, I mean he's an awesome player. I love the players. Maybe, maybe he just blows them away at camp and he sticks from, from day one, but I don't think it's a guarantee.
- [35:04]
Corey Promen
Carson Carl's did consider giving it a
- [35:06]
Chris Peters
go, but it sounds like he's locked in on North Dakota at this point.
- [35:10]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, I think so but I'm gonna say it's, it's going to be under, but it's going to be three that play 30. I think Smith's plays 30 games in the NHL next season. Yeah, and so that's, that's, that's what I, I think the, the one guy, there's one guy that I'm looking at that I don't think anybody would pick to do it and the one guy is Winnipeg. Giving Vigo a chance.
- [35:32]
Scott Wheeler
It's not unreasonable.
- [35:33]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, he's played pro hockey this year. He played at the World Championship. It's not, hey, what, what else is going on?
- [35:39]
Scott Wheeler
No, that's a good call actually. I see, I could see that one actually happening.
- [35:43]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah. So that's one I, I, I'm not calling it, I'm not going to take the over but I think of the, of if we're talking Ben Kindle, guys. V goes that, I mean and you
- [35:51]
Scott Wheeler
think of what he did in the SHL towards the end of year he was playing minutes and 90 minutes.
- [35:54]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
His playoffs were and men's worlds.
- [35:57]
Max Boltman
Yeah, we know that the college defense path tends to be doing two years. When you are Keaton Verhoff and your first college year came when you're 17, is that still a two year thing? Could we see 10 games of Keaton Verhoff at the end of this season?
- [36:13]
Scott Wheeler
I think that's in the cards, yes. I mean it depends how his year goes but I think he's going to
- [36:17]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
have a big year in, in the cards. I, you can't rush that asset and I, I, I, I would need to see a big jump from him to think that that's possible.
- [36:25]
Max Boltman
Well, what you could do is you could play his college season. You could turn him pro, give him the taste and then just the plan B. Barracuda or right summer.
- [36:33]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, you could, you could. I, I just think there's a lot of work that's still left to be done there.
- [36:37]
Chris Peters
Reed and Rudolph aren't going to be one and done either and play at the end of the year. Carl's. Carl's might play in the spring.
- [36:44]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, I would, I would bet this Carl's is going to be a one year player.
- [36:47]
Corey Promen
Yeah.
- [36:48]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
No, no question.
- [36:49]
Chris Peters
Yeah.
- [36:49]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
So all right.
- [36:50]
Max Boltman
We talked about a little bit McKenna, Stenberg, I mean more points you would say long term obviously McKenna but in year one would you take Stenberg to outscore McKenna next year?
- [37:01]
Corey Promen
I think it's going to be close
- [37:03]
Chris Peters
and I would probably lean Stenberg now. The X factor there is William Nylander
- [37:09]
Max Boltman
and Austin Matthews, Macklin, Celebrini and Will Smith.
- [37:12]
Corey Promen
I think, I think, I think they're
- [37:14]
Chris Peters
going to be in a pair though. Like I'm not and I don't know what their coaching staff is thinking or what their management group is thinking in terms of lineup construction but putting those three players together feels like a tall ask of those three terms of the age outside of Macklin in terms of the age I'm sure like to Foley is going to be on one of those lines and Chernyshaw played a little
- [37:34]
Corey Promen
bit with Will Smith and Macklin celebrating
- [37:35]
Chris Peters
maybe chairs there they like Colin Graff. Like there are other players that they're going to mix and match in there. My guess would be that stenberg's on the second line. But is he on the, is he on PP1? Probably. And I think from a readiness standpoint he's, he's closer to ready to make a real consistent game to game impact than Gavin McKenna is. I think Gavin's going to have more peaks and valleys.
- [37:57]
Scott Wheeler
I think they're both between 50 to 60 points. I think like it's going to be neck and neck kind of like what Scott said. I would lean Stenberg just because it kind of feels like celebrity is on some sort of alien trajectory right now and like if he even gets a chance to play on his line for a considerable amount of time, he's just going to get a lot of helper points, let's put it that way.
- [38:21]
Max Boltman
Take them. Take them how you get them.
- [38:22]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Yeah, I mean I'll just for the sake of being contrarian I guess, you know. You know, I think, I think McKenna is going to be put in the positions to, to have the points now. I. The thing that we talked about, that Jack Hughes kind of trajectory of a rookie year where there's going to be those peaks and valleys. He's insulated far better in, in Toronto and that to me he is that good hockey sense wise where put his stick on the ice. He's probably going to have 40 points, get a little bit more. He's probably going to have 50 and get a little bit more. He's probably going to have 60. So yeah, I think, I think, I think 40 points is the low water mark.
- [39:01]
Max Boltman
All right, well we'll call that a draft weekend guys. Great work all weekend. Make sure I know you guys got more, more to do here. Make sure you go on theathletic.com and read everything that Scott and Corey have to offer coming off this draft. And of course on flow hockey from Chris.
- [39:12]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Thank you.
- [39:13]
Max Boltman
Thank you guys for tuning in with us last night for the round one live stream. If you didn't see that you can find that on YouTube. Go watch it back. We had a lot of analysis on every pick. So if your team made a pick on Friday, there was a lot to say about it. You can find that on YouTube. And remember to subscribe to the athletic Hockey show on YouTube. We'll be back with with with more
- [39:31]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
for you next week.
- [39:32]
Max Boltman
We'll talk to you soon. Par le tu francais hablas espanol? Parl italiano.
- [39:43]
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- [40:17]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Why have I asked my electrician I found on Angie.com to bury my pet hamster Nibbles in our yard for me? Because I was so moved by how carefully he buried my electrical wires, I knew I could trust him to bury my sweet Nibbles after his untimely end.
- [40:31]
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Huh?
- [40:31]
Flow Hockey's Chris Peters
Nibbles gone too soon. May he scurry in peace.
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Scott Wheeler
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- [40:48]
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