← The Athletic Hockey Show
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- [00:00]
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- [01:24]
Laz
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- [01:42]
Max Boltman
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- [01:43]
Laz
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- [01:45]
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- [01:47]
Laz
Visit bestwestern.com for complete terms and cond. This is the athletic hockey show.
- [02:19]
Max Boltman
Hey everybody, Max Boltman here alongside Mark Lazarus for another episode of the Athletic Hockey Show. Jesse Granger going to join us in a little bit, but Laz, we've got a full weekend slate of playoff hockey to talk about. I wouldn't say that it began the most thrilling weekend to playoff hockey I've ever seen, but there was some really good stuff on Sunday to save it. So let's start this with a question. We're going to do some takeaways from everything that's taken place in all the game ones around the League. But I start with a question for you. Who came up bigger on Sunday? Tage Thompson, your S, Levkovsky. They both came up huge. Let's. Who are you more impressed by on Sunday?
- [02:56]
Laz
God, why don't you just ask me to pick my favorite child while you're at it? You know, for me, I fell in love with your eyes. Slavkovski. Like, I just. It was the first time I really got a chance to see him play, like, shift after shift after shift, game after game after game, really locking on him. And he's just fabulous to me, that's the guy here. Like, that's the star we're minting here. We could talk about Porter Martone, and we could talk about Tage Thompson and all these great young players that are coming up, but this is gonna. I'm. I'm wildly overreacting to one game. This is going to be the Uri Slavkovsky playoffs, where he just stepped truly into superstardom. He is so good. And it's not just the skill. I mean, he had three power play goals. He's a great goal scorer. He's just a menace out there. He looked like, you know, he looked like Brandon Hagel. He looked like two Brandon Hagels stacked on top of each other in a trench coat, just running around, just laying people out and scoring all these goals. He was so good. He's so dominant. I love his attitude. I love listening to him talk. He's so poised. He's so chill about all this. He doesn't get too worked up about it. The big moment is clearly not too big for him. And, you know, if we're talking about overreactions, it's like, let's give him the cons, Smythe.
- [04:00]
Max Boltman
Right now, all three of them are power play goals. So there's a lot to get to in this game. But. But you mentioned, like, this is a player who, at the Olympics, we've seen do this before, so. So you say it's an overreaction? I don't know that it is after what we've seen him just do with Slovakia at the Olympics. I mean, he. He is the number one reason that they made it as far as they did. He started off that tournament the exact same way as this one. And it was this like, okay, you. You're a Slavkovsky big game player. Let's overreact. Except it just kept happening through the Olympics. Now it has kept happening into the NHL playoffs, and we'll see. It's early in this series, but I'm with you. I think Yuras Levkovsky has the official big game player stamp on him.
- [04:39]
Laz
And don't forget, he did this in the Olympics four years ago too, when he was like 18 years old, he led, he had like seven goals in seven games for Slovakia when the NHL players weren't involved. This is a guy who steps up when the games matter most. And he's so young and he's so big and strong. There's. The habs are still like learning how to use him. You know, if you could read like some of our Basu stories and you know, they're still trying to figure out is he a net front guy, is he a flank guy, is he a one timer guy that he could do it all. It doesn't matter what position you put him in. This is going to be just an absolute force in this league, especially in these big moments for so, for so many years to come.
- [05:12]
Max Boltman
As I mentioned though, all three of his hat trick goals on Sunday for Montreal, which comes in a win for the, for the Canadians, an overtime. 43 win. I don't think I said that off the top. All three of his goals come on the power play. And that owes back to a Tampa team that took some penalties they did not need to take. John Cooper, you heard him sound off on it after the game. Four offensive zone penalties. The worst of these is the one that set up the OT winner. It was the Jake Gensel penalty.
- [05:37]
Laz
Yep.
- [05:37]
Max Boltman
Look, I, I know what Jake Ansel's trying to do there. There's a puck coming through. He's trying to get a stick on it. You know, this is kind of where you see, kind of where you see havoc happen in the playoffs. Pucks coming through the slot and you, you get an awkward swing on it. Puck takes a weird bounce, it ends up a baseball swing to the neck. Montreal player, not a penalty you need to be taking with two minutes left in a tie game in the slot.
- [05:59]
Laz
No, and, and, and this is the thing, like, when do we start worrying about the Lightning? They won four games over the last three playoffs, all of them first round losses. They have discipline issues. Despite all their experience, Andre Vasilevsky's looking very human. At what point do we start like the Lightning? I feel like, especially this year with the Eastern Conference being so wide open and everyone being just kind of pretty good, everyone kind of defaults to the Lightning out of deference to what they did. You know, when they went to three straight Stanley cup finals and one two straight Stanley Cups. This is not a team that has that aura anymore. This is a team that does dumb things like that, that gets rattled, that, you know, is vulnerable to a 22 year old running around and kicking their butts out there like Stephkovsky, like, look again, overreaction. The Lightning could very well win this series, could very well win the Stanley cup or at least get to the final, especially in this Eastern Conference. But this team has completely lost the aura of invincibility it once had. And you know, you can hear it in John Cooper's voice, the way he was talking about those penalties. He called his team stupid. He said it was stupidity and he's not wrong. Like this is a veteran team that has played an unbelievable amount of playoff games and they completely lose their composure time and again.
- [07:04]
Max Boltman
Well, let's see how they respond to that before we, before we start.
- [07:08]
Laz
It's over. Series is over.
- [07:09]
Max Boltman
I think you're going to see a very good game from Tampa in response in game two because John Cooper has earned the ability to call his team out. He has a, oh, absolutely unimpeachable resume, unimpeachable rapport with this group of players. He's led them to wins. I think he's got the license to say pretty much whatever he wants and know that his team, they owe him one like that at the start of a series. And if it keeps going off the
- [07:31]
Laz
rails, I'll worry and the players will take it too. They will take it in the spirit it was intended. Like if you're a new coach and you call your team stupid, you might have a mutiny on your hands. But the players respect Cooper and know that when he says that A, he means it and B is probably right.
- [07:45]
Max Boltman
You talked about the Lightning in recent years though and what that made me think of was Andre Vasilevsky and we talked about this on the preview Lashawn made, made the very good point about it. And Vasilevsky has not been. He's had closer to a Conor Hella but kind of resume than he has to the Andre Vasilevsky resume the last three years in the playoffs and how much of that is due to like you said, this Lightning team not as bulletproof as it was during their golden era. How much of it is due to how many games he played during that golden era and you know, continues to play a lot of games in the regular seasons. You wonder about overwork there. Now he did play five less regular season games this year than last year and I, I wonder if that's not a coincidence as you try to kind of keep him fresher for the playoffs. But again, Yesterday gives up four goals on 19 shots. That is not, again, three of them on the power play. You kind of give goalies a little bit of a break there, but that's not the Andre Vasilevsky inevitability that we're used to in the postseason.
- [08:36]
Laz
No, he's not stealing games like he used to steal games like, look, Vasilevsky very well might win the Vesna Trophy this year. That's the kind of goal, the kind of season he had is the kind of season that the GM's reward when they give out the Vesna Trophy. So let's not like, say he's cooked or washed or anything here. But it's true. There used to be this aura about him where you could not beat him no matter what you did. Three power play goals would never happen against him because he would make three spectacular saves. And again, it's one game. But he has. We have seen a body of work now these last few years where he just doesn't look like himself. And maybe we can ask Jesse about this when he comes on later, but I don't know if it is the overworked. I mean, there's not a lot of goalies left that carry the workload that he does that play 55 to 60 games a year. And he's in his 30s now. He's not some young cat anymore. There's a lot of concern right now if you're the. If you're the boss, because you really don't have a better option.
- [09:24]
Max Boltman
Did you do that on purpose with young cat?
- [09:27]
Laz
I did a little bit as it was coming out. You know, I just went with it.
- [09:29]
Max Boltman
The poetry struck you. Yeah, I like that. No, I mean, look, I think we're going to see a response from Vasilevsky. I think we're going to see a response from Lightning in game two. But it's suddenly a massive game two for them. If you go down oh, two and you're going into Central Bell, that's a hard environment. That. That is a quick way to put yourself in trouble in a hurry.
- [09:47]
Laz
And this is a Montreal team where, you know, I didn't know what to. What expect, what to expect from them coming in. Like, they were clearly a good team, but they had really no track record in the playoffs. And you don't know how a young, exciting team like that is going to handle the rough and tumble playoff hockey. Maybe they. Maybe they just get overwhelmed by a veteran team. That's a proof of concept win. Because now the Montreal Canadiens know they can do this. They're going to believe in themselves that much more. And that's the kind of performance that can unleash a team to continue to play like that and not get timid out there.
- [10:16]
Max Boltman
They do have some players who have some playoff experience. Josh Anderson scored. He's got some playoff experience. Nick Suzuki was very good as always. He's got some playoff experience. Those guys stepped up when the Canadians needed him to. And they get a 10 lead in the series to show for it. The other side of the conversation we opened with, though, I thought was the best game of the night. Buffalo Boss. It didn't start out that way. It started out as kind of a slog. Started out as kind of the exact kind of game we thought that the Boston Bruins were going to need if they were going to win this series. They were going. They were not probably going to outshoot the Buffalo Sabres, but they were going to need their big guns, David Posternak and Morgan Geeky to step up. And they were going to need Jeremy Swayman to probably be the best player on the ice for 52 minutes. Laz, that was the case. They lead it two zero. They're, you know, the Sabers are doubling them up in shots, but Jeremy Swayman's got 30 plus saves keeping it silent. And then the dam broke and it was Tage Thompson breaking it.
- [11:09]
Laz
Oh, man. And for those 52 minutes that. That arena sounded so uncomfortable. There was so much. There's 14 years of frustration being poured into this one moment. You got guys tackling dummies outside the arena. It's just, it's like, it's totally. It's the most Buffalonian thing you ever saw. It's, it's my, you know, power bombing guys through tables like at football games. And then it was just immediately Jeremy Swayman took them all out of it and they're like, oh, God, here we go. It's just going to be more of the same. And then taste the stars do star things. What was it that, that Rasmus Dahleen said? Dogs being dogs? That was. That was Tage Thompson yesterday. It was a dog being a dog. He just said, screw it. You know, when he tucked that puck in after he made that big, strong move, like, this is a really skilled guy. He's also a massive human being. So he's able to win some of these puck battles when he really applies himself. We saw this again in Milan. When he really dials in, he can be one of those all around spectacular players. And when he tucked that puck in from behind the net, the, the weight that was lifted off of that arena, the, the cathartic scream. It's like, oh, God, here come the Buffalo Sabers. And we've been just waiting for this for so long. I know you're waiting for this in Detroit for, for your opportunity for this, but it's, it's so exciting to see Buffalo doing things like this.
- [12:16]
Max Boltman
Did you see a game in Buffalo the second half of this season? Like, were you there at all in person?
- [12:22]
Laz
No, I didn't.
- [12:22]
Max Boltman
As they've turned it like. And granted, these are great hockey fans. We' that building when Buffalo starts buzzing becomes a huge factor. And I saw this late in the season. Detroit was there. Detroit put up a huge first period and had a huge lead the whole rest of the game. When Buffalo woke up, that arena was buzzing and it was. It. You noticed it. And I have to imagine that was a huge part of what happened in the final eight minutes and how the Sabres were able to storm all the way back. You mentioned the Tage Thompson kind of wraparound tuck that he does. Shortly after that, he gets another one. And this was a Swayman mistake.
- [12:55]
Laz
So.
- [12:55]
Max Boltman
And I, I think I know what swimming was doing. He was trying to position himself so that he could kind of either push off or, or, you know, get to a higher shot, but Thompson just slides it on the ice and swimming lifts his pad opens the door for it. At that point, when that game's 2 2, the Sabers are winning that game. And I don't know that it was a guarantee they were going to win it in regulation, but that building was going to will them to victory. It did. And it was Matthias Samuelson who did it. And Matthias Samuelson. For those outside of Buffalo, that might not have been the name you're expecting to see here. You probably should. He. He is the. The guy who gets forgotten on that blue line because there is so much star power. The all the high picks are Asmus Stallion, Owen Power, Bowen Byram, who they traded for from the Colorado Avalanche. But Matthias Samuelson had a huge year this year. Massive breakout. 13 goals over 40 points. He had not been a high point producer this year or up up until this year, but he was in 20, 25, 26. This did not come out of nowhere yesterday for Matias Samuelson.
- [13:48]
Jesse Granger
No.
- [13:49]
Laz
And it's a reminder. All these teams that are rebuilding, that you really do need to rebuild from the back end out. Everybody wants to get your Bedards and your celebrities and your Martones and your Ford, you know, Frondell's and Hagens is. And you need those guys. But you don't win without a back end like that. So I'm like, look, I'm here in Dallas. Look at what Quinn Hughes and Brock Faber were able to do in game one. When you have those kind of players on the back end that can just control the pace of the play, just, you know, orchestrate the game from up top, it completely changes what a team can do out there. And Samuelson emerging gives them a top four that's unrivaled in this league. Possibly. Like, they're just so good. Like, and then you just see how important it is to draft, to develop, especially to develop, because it takes. It takes time. It takes patience with defensemen. But when you have two outstanding pairs and a third pair that you can actually just rely on, that does not screw up, you're going to win more often than you don't.
- [14:40]
Max Boltman
100%. And you said it. I mean, that's a good analog to what Minnesota has, is all those defense. It's not just that they're really good players. The motion that they create in the offensive zone, the havoc that creates for a defense, trying to figure out where is everybody knowing that if you're a step off, if you leave a lane open, they are seeming you and they're going to create a very good opportunity from it. That is how it feels when the Buffalo Sabres are cooking. And that's what it looked like down the stretch yesterday. And look, they had a ton of shots early in the game. It's just that once they got to Swayman, the momentum starts and then they were not letting off the gas. So the Buffalo Sabers pull out a win. And that one needed to be a win. Your first playoff game in 14 years at home, that had to be a win.
- [15:17]
Laz
My favorite, my favorite thing that came out of the post game in Buffalo was this quote by Tage Thompson. Because, you know, the Sabres have no experience like that. Like, there are very few players in their team that have played in the playoffs, obviously, because Buffalo hasn't been there in 15 years. Tage Thompson's like, basic, whatever, man. What was the quote? I think eight years of adversity is enough experience to get you ready for something like this. Like, there was no way they were going to come out and lay an egg in the first game, playoff game in Buffalo since, like the Truman administration. There was just no way.
- [15:43]
Max Boltman
Yeah, fantastic game.
- [15:48]
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- [17:34]
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- [18:36]
Jesse Granger
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- [18:48]
Laz
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- [18:51]
Jesse Granger
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- [18:57]
Laz
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- [19:11]
Max Boltman
I thought that was the, the highlight of the weekend for me was that that Sabers Bruins ending. I did think that the Tampa Montreal series going in would be the best series. I don't think that one did anything to change my opinion of that. But the series that I was down on and I, I already have to have a little bit of a Maya Culpa was Penn's Flyers. My, my feeling was that yes, like it's, it's historic rivalry. For sure, it's Sidney Crosby, but the on ice. You know, I kind of just figured this is a fairly clear Pittsburgh win Flyers. Great story to get in defensive team, but the Penguins would overwhelm them. Game 1 Last Philadelphia Flyers came out with something and their defensive approach gave the Penguins all kinds of problems.
- [19:51]
Laz
I thought, absolutely. And we talked about this a little bit in the last couple of weeks about beware the team that had to scratch and claw to get into the playoffs because they have been playing playoff hockey for weeks. Whereas the Penguins surprisingly kind of cruised in and they lost a bunch of games down the stretch. They were sitting guys. It's hard to flip that switch when you haven't been in the playoffs year after year. Like the Avalanche can flip the switch. The Dallas Stars should be able to flip the switch. The Penguins, even with all their great players, that can't necessarily do that. It's been four years, right. And you can see experience doesn't always mean poise. Sidney Crosby, you know, Travis Sanheim got under Sidney Crosby skin in game one of the playoffs. That's surprising. And you have to wonder, when it's an older team like the Penguins, do they maybe even grip the stick a little tighter knowing they only got so many kicks at the can here? You know, there's like, I think Glenn Gullets in Dallas called it like, you know, an extra bingo ball in the basket. You only get so many of these and you wonder if the older guys, like, maybe more tense than the younger guys who are, you know, kind of too young and dumb to know any better, to know that they should be overwhelmed by this.
- [20:52]
Max Boltman
Well, if Yanni Balkan wasn't Overwhelmed. I mean, he certainly came to play. He's productive. He almost, you know, he had a great look late in the game. But to me, I think the Penguins will find a way from this. It's just a matter of adjusting to the way that the Flyers play. They are a stout defensive outfit. They give you very little space. You're not going to get anything in transition. And I don't think Pittsburgh needs necessarily transition, but that's one of the ways that they do what they do. They're a big team, they can be a fast team. I think that what, they will get the cycle going a little bit more in game two once they're able to make some adjustments to the Flyers. But give the Flyers credit. This was a stifling effort. And as we talked about for the last week or two, the guy who wasn't here all year makes a big difference. Porter Martone is a, is an X factor for the Philadelphia Flyers. Stepping right in. Look, this goal was a poise goal, it was a patient goal. It's a, it's a ridiculous snipe. But the way Martone has to hang on to this puck and not panic, the way that you might expect it. 19 year old playing their first Stanley cup playoff game to handle that moment. I was very impressed by that.
- [21:50]
Laz
I loved his face after he scored. He was like, oh, my God, did you see what I just did? That was so cool. Like, I just. It's so much fun seeing these young guys, these new faces come in. You know, when Sidney Crosby scores in the playoffs, we're like, wow, Sidney Crosby, that's so cool. But when these young guys do it, when it's Tage Thompson doing it for the first time, when it's Porter Martone,
- [22:07]
Max Boltman
when it's cool, Cooley was kind of like that.
- [22:09]
Laz
Cooley, yes, exactly. The joy and the excitement, it reminds you, like, oh, yeah, this is really cool. This is really fun. And man, how is that 2025 draft looking right now? Obviously, Matthew Schaefer is otherworldly. Anton Fundella came into Chicago as a point a game guy. Porter Martone comes in, he's a game point a game guy. You know, James Higgins is playing right now. This is a, this has turned into a hell of a draft that we had last year.
- [22:32]
Max Boltman
It is. I mean, Matthew Schaefer at the very top immediately makes it. He's not that far off the celebrity level really with what he's doing on the blue line. But you're right, the supporting cast like, like Friendle and Martone were very nice. Prospects. I don't think anyone expected immediate point per game level production from them when they stepped into the league, and that's what it's been. And Martone, to his credit, continuing it into the postseason. Should we get to AVS Kings here before we. We have Jesse on to talk about this? The series he's covering last night, which got off to, I thought, a pretty interesting start as well.
- [23:03]
Laz
Yeah, I mean, everyone expected the ABs to roll, and they still very well might. They might sweep this series, but it might be two to one every game. This is what the Kings do. They went to, what, 30 something overtime games this year. Their entire MO is just like, let's keep it as close as possible and hope we get a lucky break toward the end. It's not really a recipe for success, but against a team like Colorado, they're so. The Kings are so frustrating to play against. They're just. It's not fun to play the Kings. It's not fun to watch the Kings, but the Kings do what the Kings do and it works. And you know, Colorado is so much better. There's so much deeper. I mean, that Logan o' Connor line was great. Again, they were so key in that 2022 run they have. They just come at you in waves, but the Kings don't let. They just. They're the wave breakers, right? They just sit there clogging up the neutral zone, standing five men abreast on the blue line, and don't let you pass. They are a horrible team to watch, but they're, they're effective in what they do, and they're the kind of team that can give the ABS fits?
- [23:57]
Max Boltman
Well, I was torn yesterday between thinking like, okay, this game, the way that this game one played out, is this a sign that, like, okay, the Kings are going to give the AVs more of a fight than we gave them credit for. I don't know if you saw there was a lot sweet picks in that athletic staff predictions article in this one. Is the way that this played out a sign that, you know, the Kings are going to give the as more trouble than we gave them credit for, or did they just hold the AV scoreless for 35 minutes and still lose that game? Did they just, like, miss their. One of their few best opportunities to steal a win here?
- [24:26]
Laz
It's possible. I mean, I'm curious to see how Game 2 looks because, like, again, we talk about confidence, building performances, and, and that's a loss. But if you're the Kings, you got to feel a little bit better about this matchup after game one than you probably did going in. Like you said it was more than half of the athletic staffers picked a sweep. I've never seen that.
- [24:42]
Max Boltman
I don't think so.
- [24:43]
Laz
Any of our things. Like that's how lopsided. I mean, the Kings had like 22 regulation wins or something this year. Like they had like one more regulation win than the Blackhawks did. Like, this is not a good team, but they are effective at what they do. And once you start believing, hey, maybe the gap isn't so great. Maybe we can stay in the series. You know, belief goes a long way in the Stanley cup playoffs.
- [25:02]
Max Boltman
Well, that psychological thing plays both ways. I don't know how much you guys talked about the, the President's Trophy curse on the Western playoff preview, but we have seen it. You know, the, the team that wins the President's Trophy has not been winning the Stanley cup at the end of year. And I wonder how much of that is is partly due to like, oh, we were the best team all year, but this team's like really pushing us. And there's a little bit of, I don't know if there's a little bit of like kind of psychic shock to that.
- [25:24]
Laz
Well, I think part of it is it's like the opposite of the Flyers thing, right? Like when was the last important game the Avalanche played? Like there was a brief moment there where the, when the Stars had like a 15 game win streak where maybe they were going to lose the top seed. And then it just wasn't even close again after a week after that. So they have not played an important game. And this isn't a team that, you know, they lost in the first round last year to Dallas and 2022 is. That was four years ago now. So they don't have that, that credibility that you can just flip that switch. They're so talented and they're so good and everybody knows it. But switching into playoff mode, you can get caught wrong footed if you've been kind of on cruise control for three months. And I think that's as much as anything is what's happening here once the as find their sea legs and kind of kick it into gear. And Dallas is in the same way down here where it's like they look like they were, they were half asleep in their first game.
- [26:08]
Max Boltman
Put a pin in that. I want to wait for Jesse for that one.
- [26:12]
Laz
You do see a lot of times these like heavy favorites not play with that, that emotion that you expect in a game one. Whereas a team like the Kings. Hey, man. Winning a couple of games against the AVs, that's their Stanley Cup. Let's go. Let's go. Try and do it. So eventually the ABs will figure this out and they'll start rolling. But the Kings don't make it easy. That's their whole thing. It's just to be annoying as hell.
- [26:32]
Max Boltman
Yeah, I think they accomplished that in game one. But it's just a matter of like, can they. Can they repeat that recipe against the Colorado Avalanche or do the Avalanche make the kind of adjustments they need? They're like, all right, we know how to kind of crack this a little bit more.
- [26:44]
Laz
It's exhausting to play that way. Like, it's. You have to be like on your. It's like Carolina to a large degree where you have to be just on your toes and aggressive like the whole time, defending constantly. So you have to have a huge amount of buy in to do it. And, you know, through one game, the Kings had it.
- [27:00]
Max Boltman
All right, let's take a quick break right there. We'll come back with Jesse. We got a few more series to talk about.
- [27:08]
Laz
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Laz
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- [29:18]
Max Boltman
all right, we are back and let's bring in now Jesse Granger. Jesse, you covered the late game last night, Vegas and Utah. And there was, there was some tension in that one for a while. Utah put up a really good push early, but. But in the end it was Vegas coming out on top. Let's just start kind of start big picture. What was your takeaway out of that game one?
- [29:35]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, to me it looked like a big, strong experience team playing against a fast, young, inexperienced team. And Vegas's advantage won out in the end. I thought for the first period ut and by the way, I picked Utah in six in this series. I thought the speed would be too much for Vegas to handle. And for the first 20 minutes, it did look like that. They were skating all over them. Logan Cooley scores a goal, a gorgeous goal. Super individual effort by him on that play. And then as the game goes on, Vegas starts laying hits. Ivan Barbashev is just battering everyone he sees on the ice. And by the midway point of the second period, Utah did not look like the faster team. They were getting into scrums with the Golden Knights. Everything became kind of just a grind, which is exactly what Vegas wants in this series. And by the third period, Vegas looked like the better team. They're getting to the inside. They score three straight goals to win the game. Yeah. So I think Utah showed flashes of why they can win this series. But it's going to be tough.
- [30:37]
Laz
I'm going to show my age here. But Vegas really reminds me of those 2012, 2014 Kings teams where they would kind of play one way in the regular season and then they'd get to the playoffs and they would play that hard, heavy, bruising style. And I remember asking Dustin Brown once, I'm like, you know, why don't you guys always play like this? Because if you played like this for 82 games, you would not make it through the season. Like, you physically can't do what we do for more than two months. Even the two months is asking so much. And Vegas reminds me like that when they get into the playoffs, they are a different team. Like, we've all been underwhelmed by Vegas almost all season long, but then they get into place like, oh, yeah, Vegas. Oh, crap, here they are again. And it's. They really do remind me of those. Those big, heavy Kings teams.
- [31:17]
Jesse Granger
It's funny, I had that almost that same conversation with Ivan Barbashev last night of like, wow, you look like a different player. He's like, well, yeah, like, you can't do that for 82 games. But. And Barbashev is such an important player for this team, and he had 61 points this year. And when I looked at that number, it shocked me because he didn't feel nearly as impacted for this team. Like, I. I mean, I remember going into just a few weeks ago, I was thinking, if this team needs to clear cap space, Barbershev is a guy they could move. Like, he hasn't had as big of an impact this year. And then you go into last night's game, and he was arguably their best player on the ice. Like, he was just laying out everything that he saw. And then that bleeds into the rest of his game. Like, he starts feeling good about his game. When he's doing that, all of a sudden he's making extra passes. He's. He's better with the puck. So, yeah, this. This team looks different. Ivan Barbashev kind of led the way.
- [32:04]
Laz
Who was it that he drilled early on? Was it Ian Cole? That really kind of set the tone? And all of a sudden, Utah's like, oh, God, what's going to happen to us today?
- [32:10]
Jesse Granger
And so clean. That's what I loved about it. Like, you don't like. It's so hard to. The guys are so fast. The hockey is so fast nowadays. It's hard to hit someone that hard without breaking some rule. It was perfectly clean. He just absolutely obliterated him in the corner.
- [32:24]
Max Boltman
Did last night. Did the outcome and the way that the third period played out, did it change? I mean, you said you had Utah in six to begin. Jesse, did it change your opinion on the series at all?
- [32:33]
Laz
Yes.
- [32:33]
Jesse Granger
I didn't think Vegas could do what they did last night to Utah. So yes it does. I think it's going to probably be a seven game series. I think Utah could still win this. Like I said, they, there were flashes last night where Gunther and Cooley did what I expected. I will say the area that Vegas was the best last night that I, that I didn't expect, I guess is their breakouts were so clean. Like I thought Utah's forecheck would force them into errors that they could because that's the only way Utah is going to find space is by creating turnovers. Because once Vegas is back and set in its defensive zone, there is no space. They're, they're, they're such a well coached team and that's going back to Bruce Cassidy. Tortorella is kind of just keeping the same system going. There is no space. The way you get space against this team is by forcing them into errors and then taking advantage before they can get set up. And last night Utah just basically did none of that. We'll see. It's, it's, it's, that's one game and we've seen these series. You think that game one is how it's all going to play out and then it's completely different when you get out there in game two. But through one game, Utah was not able to generate the turnovers I expected them to.
- [33:37]
Laz
But they committed one like that. The, the turnover that led to, I think it was the Nick Dowd goal. The deflection of the Noah. Yes, that, that was Vegas applying pressure and an inexperienced team, you know, kind of soiling itself when it happened. And it led directly to the game winning goal.
- [33:51]
Max Boltman
The other thing too, like I was thinking last night as I'm watching the Eichel Marner Stone line and I was thinking like, what would a line have to look like for me to think that an opposing line has the edge against those three? All of them could be on a Selkie ballot this year. The answer is probably the McDavid dry seidel combo line that you could see from Edmonton around from now in Vegas. But even then, like Utah has some great fast young talent. That is a smothering matchup line. Jesse?
- [34:18]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, they're really good. I mean we haven't seen a ton of them all three together. We were, it was kind of surprising when they skated that way the last couple days before this game. Tortorella said, like the morning of like we're not sure if we're going to stick with it. We're not sure how Long. We're going to stick with it. I hope it works. They were dominant after two periods. Stone. I think his like with Stone on the ice it even strength. The shot attempts were 25 to 5 in favor of Vegas. They were just absolutely dominating with that line on the ice. My concern was to me, this Vegas team, this is the worst their depth has been in a long time. And this is what happens with teams that win the cup. Like you slowly get that chipped away. We've seen it with Tampa. We've seen it with all these teams. I was concerned that if you load up that top line like, well, they better score three because no one else is scoring. And then you get a goal from Colton Sissons who has scored like almost none this year. Nick Dowd comes in and scores a goal. If you can load that lineup the way they have and then you're going to get goals from those guys, you win the game like you. You can't lose a hockey game getting goals from Colton Seasons and Nick Dowd with that top line playing as many minutes as they did. So that's the recipe.
- [35:23]
Max Boltman
If they were going to lose that game, a big part of it would have been the second goal. It's a fluky goal, but I want to get your take on kind of how it came together. Do you? Carter Hart had come out of the net and tried to go for a wrapped puck. I don't know. I think he was back and mostly set. But whenever a goalie leaves his net and the goal happens right after, that's part of the conversation. The poke with the stick is a little reckless, but ultimately it's a bad bounce off his D man. Like how do you sort through that one?
- [35:48]
Jesse Granger
I think the only mistake Hart made was trying to get that puck because it wasn't from the red line. It was from the blue line and it wasn't even contested. It was a. It was an uncontested dump in from the blue line that was fired around the board. So like it's I. This is a split second decision. But that's what hockey players are judged on is their split second decisions in. In super tough moments. He probably shouldn't have gone after that puck. He didn't get to it. It's not surprising that he didn't. He's. He's a really good skater and even he couldn't get back there. It's not surprising based on where that puck was released. So to me that's the only mistake. I thought he got back into his net as quick as you could ask. He made the save. Like you said. It was a, it was a poke with his stick, but he made the save. And just an unfortunate bounce off of his own defenseman into the net. I. The only way I can fault him there is the decision to leave the net in the first place.
- [36:37]
Laz
All right, if we're talking about blaming goalies, let's, let's move on to Dallas down here against the. Well, because Jake Ottinger, the last playoff game he played was the one that got Pete DeBoer fired with. DeBoer, threw him under the bus, pulled him after two shots, two goals in, in Game 5 last year against Edmonton, threw his goalie under the bus. And this was Jay Gottinger's first chance to play in a playoff game. Since then, they lost 6 to 1. I think maybe one of those you can fault Jake Ottinger on, but the appearance is really, really bad. And I'm curious what you thought about that performance, Jesse.
- [37:10]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, I, I could picture Pete DeBoer sitting in his living room like the Leonardo DiCaprio once at upon a time in Hollywood, like, pointing at the screen like, no, it's like you said, I don't think you can really put it on Ottinger. But I will say that, like, I think Ottinger is a great goalie, but he's not trending well. And I just mean, I mean, that big picture. Over the last couple of years, he has not been the goalie that we saw when he first broke into the NHL. And he hasn't been the. He's a big guy, which normally those big guys are like the more positional blocking guys. But when he first came into the league, he was the I can steal a game for my team goalie. Like, I remember that Calgary series. That's still in my mind, one of the best goalie performances I've ever seen, like, in the last, like, 10 years was that series. And I feel like Ottinger, he's such a cerebral, smart guy. You talk to him. It's like I could talk goaltending to with the guy for hours because he's so interesting in the way he thinks about things. This is speculation for me. I'm. I haven't. I don't even cover otten a daily basis. But what I think is, I think he's overthinking things. I think he's a little too much in his head. He's not the reactive, like, goalie that he was when he first came into the league. And I think he. It looks like he's guessing on plays more than he should and like that's part of the job, right? Like you're anticipating what's going to happen. You're guessing. To me, if he would just get out of his head a little bit and react a little more and be the old, like the goalie he was when he first came into the league, I would. I think he's a better goalie when he's playing that way. And I just feel like lately when things go a little wrong, you start thinking even more, oh, what, what am I doing wrong? What can I do to fix that? And it's just, he just doesn't look like the best version of Jake Ottinger recently.
- [38:50]
Laz
This is my third spring residency here in Dallas. I've been around him a lot and I'm always, I'm impressed by how mellow he is. But I always have a tough time reading goalies because a lot of goalies don't show emotion. A lot of goalies are like bonkers. But a lot of goalies like their whole thing is that they have a short term memory and you got to stay even keel. There are times where Jake Ottinger is just a little too even keel for me. Like, I just want to see a little bit of fire out of him. I want to see him be mad at himself. I want to see him, you know, point the finger at himself and really just kind of like, you know, I want to see him be angry after a game like this. And he's always so calm. It's probably a credit to him. You probably have to be that way. But man, I just want to see a little bit of fire out of the guy.
- [39:30]
Max Boltman
Do you think? I mean, the regular season, Jesse was not up to Jake Ottinger standard either. I think that's kind of what you're talking about with this trend line here. Is there lingering effects like when you get pulled from a playoff game after two shots? Like, is there a lingering effect into the next season or is what kind of you guys are both saying that it just would be water off his back anyway? Like, how do you view that?
- [39:50]
Jesse Granger
I don't think so. Especially with how unanimous the like, reaction from everyone else in the world was when that happened. Like if, if, if people were like, if we were debating it whether and like half the people thought that peterboer was in the right for pulling him, then maybe it could like get in your head. But the fact that Pete DeBoer pulled it, everyone in the world was like, wow, that was dumb. And Then they fired him.
- [40:10]
Laz
Yeah.
- [40:11]
Jesse Granger
And then, and then like before the game, ESPN is running a promo where like 16 different players are saying that Pete DeBoer is an idiot. It's. It's hard for, it's hard for Ottinger to feel like. I, I don't know. To me, that would just be like, well, that was a mistake by Pete. It wasn't on me type thing. I don't know.
- [40:27]
Max Boltman
And as you mentioned last, like, not a lot of these goals were like easy or I don't know which one of you guys said it, but not a lot of these were easy. Point the finger at Jake Ott and Chicano goals. This was a, a Minnesota Wild clinic year. We've probably spent, done them a disservice by spending the whole first half of this segment talking about the team that got blown out in this game instead of them. Who they. They took this to the Dallas Stars. Minnesota. I thought it was exactly what you want to see if you're the Wild. Your Stars are active early in the game that you get the power play going really well. This was exactly how I wanted it to look if I'm the Minnesota Wild.
- [40:56]
Laz
Yeah. Dallas played this game like it was game 53 of the regular season. And the Minnesota Wild played a playoff game. They were in it, they were involved, they were attacking. They had, they had the Stars on their heels the whole time. Every single time. The Stars even got the puck on their stick, Minnesota just took it right back. It was all. It wasn't even one and done. It was none and dones in the offensive zone. And Quinn Hughes and Brock Faber were so dominant. Kind of what we were talking about earlier with what words, Rasmus, Dalin and, and Samuelson and all these guys in Buffalo can do, they just controlled the game to such a degree that it was almost laughable. They were toying with the Dallas Stars and we're not used to seeing that out of a Dallas team and we're also not used to seeing that out of a Minnesota team. This is a much more even matchup than when you know your typical matchup here would be that the Stars have been to the conference final three straight seasons and the Minnesota Wild have lost eight straight first round series. So this is, this is a leveling off of these two teams now where this really is a toss up of the series and Dallas better get its act together tonight in the late start because you know, you fall down two. Oh. To this Wild team. It's hard to imagine winning four out of five against them.
- [41:58]
Jesse Granger
Minnesota Looks so good and as I do, I'll go to the goalies. And I thought that the decision by Hines, the way the NHL is going, where teams are playing goalies in tandems, this is. I feel like it didn't used to be a skill that coaches needed, but choosing your playoff goalies and managing how you use them through the series is becoming a more and more important part of an NHL coach's job. And I think the easy choice would have been to start Gustafson. Hines goes out on a limb, starts the rookie. I thought it was the right decision. He's been better since the Olympic break and we talked about it a little bit last week in the the. In the playoff preview. Wallstedt is specifically really, really good at stopping the exact shots. Dallas creates more than anyone.
- [42:40]
Laz
Yes.
- [42:40]
Jesse Granger
Dallas scored 157 goals in front of the net more than any team in the league. Wallstedt is so patient on his edges. He doesn't drop early, he doesn't guess like we were talking about with Ottinger earlier. And he in those one on one with it's the goalie versus the shooter situations. And I'm not just talking breakaways, I'm talking puck comes over to the weak side. It's you versus the goalie. Wallstedt is just nails in those situations and I think he's the right goalie to start. He looked, he didn't. He didn't have to be the hero in game one. His team was much better. But I love how he looked. I love the guts it took from Heinz to start the rookie right off the bat and it worked.
- [43:15]
Laz
You're absolutely right that he was the right call and all those stats that you mentioned or why. But we still don't know if he's going to be any good in the playoffs because the Stars barely tested him at all. There were two opportunities they had in the second period or elite in the first. I think it was where Wall said made two really nice stops on two golden chances for. For Dallas. But that's all he saw. Like Dallas was. They were just completely timid. They were just. They no pressure in the offense. They had 04 check. They were not getting the nest. You weren't getting those Jason Robertson, Miko ran and chances on the doorstep that they do so well. So I the the Stars tonight, they have to come out and they got to come out firing, right? They've got to come out and test this kid because I agree. I think he's the right goalie and I think he's A really good goalie and he can absolutely win this series. But you got to test him. You got to at least you know you can't just let him dip his toe in the water like you did in game one, because now he's got some confidence. He hadn't. Walstead admitted to being nervous all day on Saturday before game one. And then you just let him have this like, quote, unquote easy first game in the playoffs. Now he's got confidence. Now he's going to be a little more comfortable. Dallas really, really blew an opportunity by coming out so weak in game one.
- [44:19]
Jesse Granger
I keep this going with this narrative. I keep talking about Wallstedt's stats against the best teams. When he plays against the elite teams, he's like a 9:30 safe percentage. And then against the bad teams, he's just like, eh. I'm telling you, I know it's still young. This is a big game. Goalie like this is. He may not be Patrick Wa, but the style, the mentality, the. The guy who just like, wants all the pressure. Give me the best teams, give me the pressure. That's what I feel about Jesper Wallstead.
- [44:45]
Max Boltman
Well, speaking of tough goalie calls, Jesse, the one I was the least expecting this weekend was Carolina pulling Brandon Bussey out of the.
- [44:51]
Jesse Granger
Out of the net.
- [44:52]
Max Boltman
Not pulling him, not putting him into the net, and starting Freddie Anderson. And boy, did Freddie Anderson make that look like a really, really good decision.
- [45:00]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, I was very surprised by it. The guy was the best goalie all year for them. I mean, he set. How many NHL records did he set this year? The fastest goalie to 5 wins. The fastest goalie to 10 wins, to 20 wins, to 25 wins, to. He was unreal.
- [45:13]
Laz
He.
- [45:13]
Jesse Granger
He struggled after the Olympic break, I will say that. But it's not like Freddie Andersen was setting the world on fire. I mean, he finished with the worst statistics of his entire career. And he's been playing a long time. But Brindamore goes with the veteran. That's kind of how he is just in all of his coaching decisions and it turned out to be the right one. And I also, like, early on when I saw this decision, I was almost kind of like, upset. Like he's like Brenda Moore is robbing us of the Brandon Bussey story. Like, I feel like that's one of the better stories in hockey this year was this kid coming out of nowhere. He's an older player who hasn't really had a chance. He comes in, sets the league on fire. And now we don't Even get to see it play out in the playoffs. So I was kind of like upset at Brindamore for it. The more I thought about it and you're watching Freddie play in the game and it's like. And I was actually. I was kind of like arguing online with Hurricane fans and one of them mentioned, think of it this way. Now they have Freddie Anderson, who's playing well and has been a good playoff goalie. And they have Brandon Bussey just waiting in the wings in the event that they need him at some point. So I still think Bussey may play a role in this. I don't. I picked the Hurricanes to come out of the East. I would be stunned if Freddie Anderson plays every game of that. I would be stunned if that happens. So I think Brandon Bussey will still play a role here. But. But Freddie Anderson was good in game one.
- [46:31]
Laz
I swear, Jesse, you can take any goaltending situation and turn it into a positive. This is not a positive. Freddie Anderson is not. He has not been good in the playoffs. He's been good in the first round and a half or so over the years. He's a. He always falls apart in the playoffs. I like Freddie Anderson good regular season goalie, good early in the playoffs goalie. And Brandon Bussey was a disaster down the stretch. That's why Freddie Anderson's in there. It's not because Anderson earned it. It's because Brandon Busse lost. And the fact that we are still having this conversation about the Carolina Hurricanes that all these years into this incredible run, they had this incredible machine that they've built down there and they still don't have a goalie. I just don't understand how we keep having this conversation. How has Carolina not addressed. And Brandon Bussy was a great story, but you don't solve your situation by picking up a guy off waivers from Florida early in the season. It's just incredible. Incredible to me that we're still talking about the Carolina Hurricanes goalie in this Eastern Conference. They should be able to run away with the. With. With this playoff tournament. And because of their goaltending, I don't think they will. And you clip that, put it on social that Carolina is going to. They need a goalie. They don't have a goalie. They never have a goalie.
- [47:35]
Max Boltman
Look around though, at all the teams in the playoffs last like finding a goalie on waivers and having him be your goalie in the playoffs is. Is not as crazy as it might have sounded five, 10 years ago. A lot of the heavy hitters Are not in the playoffs here. A lot of these goalies are on their second home. They've been on waivers.
- [47:51]
Laz
It's wow, we got guys like Anton Forsberg is starting in the playoffs. You know, Carter saw Carter Hart playing Dan Vladar. It really is incredible how hard it is to find a goalie, but, man, it's been enough years find a goalie, man.
- [48:03]
Jesse Granger
I think what it is is the fact that there are, like, five of them who are just clearly in a league of their own, and then the, like, sixth best goalie in the world through the, like, 45th best goalie in the world. The difference is so small. Like, these guys all the same guy, right? Because, like, it used to be there weren't goalie coaches. So goalies taught themselves. So, like, some of them were way better at it than others. And, like, the differences were massive in, like, the 90s and, like, early 2000s. To me, all these goalies have been trained. Every movement they make has been precisely honed since they were five years old. So they're all so similar. It feels like you just need the guy who's feeling it that week. And the 45th best guy in the world who's feeling it is better than some top 10 guy who's not.
- [48:48]
Laz
So what we're saying here is, as I've been saying all along, since you've been doing this show with us for years, is goaltending is nonsense. You are not an expert on anything. Nobody knows what they're talking about. Goaltending is stupid. That's what you're telling me.
- [48:59]
Jesse Granger
Voodoo, right? Voodoo is the word everybody likes to use.
- [49:02]
Max Boltman
Oh, my gosh. I'll say this. I picked the sens in this series, and I picked them in part because I thought in a series where I think shots are going to be at a premium, Brandon Bussey was. Was a variable. He could go one way or another. And I thought that was enough to. And it still could be. This was still a very tight game.
- [49:17]
Jesse Granger
Game.
- [49:18]
Max Boltman
Freddie Anderson made a huge save at a crucial moment of this game, Jesse, that. I don't know if Brandon Bussey makes that save.
- [49:24]
Laz
The.
- [49:24]
Max Boltman
The athleticism. There were multiple actually, in this sequence. The one that everyone's going to point to is the. Is the overturned goal where it looks like Bathurson puts the puck into the net. And it's. It's into Anderson's glove over the line, But Anderson actually kind of wedged it between the glove and the post. There was another very athletic save shortly after that on Brady Tkachuk. Like he really competed in this game. There was two moments there. This ends up a 20 game. This could have easily been a 21 game for the Sens. This could have been a 22 game going to overtime. It shots were at a premium early. It was like 15, nine through two periods opened up a bit in the third. But Anderson I thought was the, the difference in the reason that Carolina came out in this one.
- [50:02]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, I mean he, he made like two really nice saves and that's about all he did the whole night because
- [50:09]
Max Boltman
well, there weren't that many shots to go around like.
- [50:11]
Jesse Granger
Right.
- [50:11]
Max Boltman
I can't think of that many Carolina looks that didn't go in the should have.
- [50:15]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, I mean like you said the shots are. I think it was like three nothing shots total through like 12 minutes into the game. And I'm like are we ever going to see the goalies in this game? It's, it's these two teams did the same thing all year. You look at their underlying metrics. They don't give up any shots. They take all the shots. Which of those is going to play? Like are they both going to be able to get a ton of shots? No, neither of them can get a shot. It's going to be basically a one shot game. There, there is going to be a four overtime game between these teams because the way they play it just sets up for that. It's going to happen at some point. We're the marathon game of the first round will be coming from that series. I don't know. Like does Bussy make the save that Freddie Anderson does? I think he could. Like I think they're both similar goalies in that they excel in making those off schedule saves that aren't like reading the play perfectly and getting into the right spot. It's just kind of of be an athlete, get your hand in front of it. They both kind of excel at those saves and obviously Freddie made a huge stop. I'm not going to say that Bussy wouldn't have made it.
- [51:16]
Max Boltman
Fair enough.
- [51:17]
Laz
I covered a four overtime game in Raleigh a few years back and it was fun as hell. You know it's funny, the Hurricanes have this reputation as being awful to watch and Max and I were talking off air about this. I disagree strongly. I think he does too. I love watching the Hurricanes play but they have to be the worst team to play against. Like if you're a hockey player, like it's just a nightmare. Like there's other teams like your la's and your Seattle's that muck it up and slow the game down. But Carolina does that. But they're also so fast and so relentless. It's like, it's like a, like a full court press at all times. Their forecheck is so tenacious and they're so quick and they muck it up defensively and make it difficult to get through the neutral zone. It must be so hard to play for Rob Brindemore, but it must be so much harder to play against this team. They are just an absolute machine.
- [52:01]
Max Boltman
Well, Laz, and you talked earlier about the kind of the Kings and you can't play this kind of hockey all year. If there's a. If there's a theory for why the Canes haven't been able to kind of get over the hump in the playoffs, part of the theory is that they play this style of hockey all year. There's not another level to get to. Like, it's not that they're the necessarily the physical, banging level of the Kings, although I do think they forecheck pretty hard, but they are just kind of this repeatable, like, every moment matters team. And I think that's what makes for, in some ways, a really exciting playoff series between these two. Even without a lot of goals, without a lot of shots because it's so much tension. You know, any. Any goal could be the deciding factor.
- [52:39]
Laz
It's a double edged sword too, though, right? Because like, they will play this style no matter what, against any team, no matter who it is, and they don't make adjustments. Like, Rod Brynamore is like, this is how we win. And that's why when you get to that conference final and you're starting to play really good teams that make adjustments and figure out how to beat it, the Hurricane's like, no, this is what we do. And then they lose because they're not adjusting back.
- [52:59]
Jesse Granger
I also think it's when it's the regular season and you're only playing them once or twice, like they're just a blip on the radar. Like, you don't get used to it. The pressure in your face, the fact that you have to make the passes quicker than you're used to. And then over seven games, it's like, okay, we've seen this three nights in a row. Like, I think, I do think teams start to get a little more adjusted to it. Whereas in the regular season, it's like by the time you're adjusted to it, you're down three, nothing and you. And you're already thinking about the next game on Your schedule. So screw it.
- [53:27]
Max Boltman
Yeah, it's a very good point.
- [53:28]
Jesse Granger
I mean I.
- [53:29]
Max Boltman
Seeing this team over and over again, whatever cracks you can find, you actually have time to exploit it over a seven game series. You do not in. In a one off here. One more series. I want to talk about before we let everybody go. Today is the one that hasn't begun yet. The Oilers and the Ducks. To me this is, you know, especially with the way the Ducks kind of limped into the playoffs. Like I, I think the Oilers are ramping up. I think this has the potential to be a pretty short series. But there's a lot of young exciting talent on the Ducks that, that I think hopefully we at least get some exciting H out of this.
- [53:56]
Laz
Yeah, this is the team we wanted to see. Like the Sharks. We all wanted to see Sharks, Ducks.
- [54:00]
Jesse Granger
Right.
- [54:00]
Laz
We all wanted to see just the complete defenseless, all offense, all gas, no breaks style play. This is the next best thing because that's kind of how the Oilers play too. They're just not as young doing it. This could be a lot of fun. I agree with you. It's probably going to be short. The Oilers have been playing really well. Anaheim kind of limping into the playoffs here getting you know, the pillow fight by default really just because nobody else was able to come and take that, that spot from them. But it should be really high octane hockey should be complete opposite of Sens Canes where it's just going to be all shots on goal. And you know, if we get one series where every game is 5 4, 6, 57 6, I'm here for it.
- [54:34]
Jesse Granger
Yeah. Best case scenario is that the Ducks skilled young forwards can score with Edmonton and then it's on McDavid and dry Seidel to just single handedly like Will. They're talking to the net and Anaheim's defense has gotten better. But if you look at the like style of defenseman Truba and Gudis and Carlson, like those are big heavy footed guys who are not built to defend Conor McDavid on the rush. Like that is. It's going to be ugly for those guys trying to defend Conor McDavid. It's going to be Lukash Dostall. Please save us a lot in this series. And I think the best case scenario is we get these back and forth high scoring games. The worst case scenario is, is it's kind of what I saw here in Vegas where the older experienced team just kind of bullies the other team. And it wouldn't surprise me at all. Like I have Edmonton in a long series. It wouldn't surprise me at all if Edmonton just comes in and the Ducks don't score the way we expect and Edmondson just runs all over him.
- [55:32]
Laz
Sean Gentile had a piece today on the Athletic about how Connor McDavid, the Oilers have to win this year to keep him. Basically, like, to keep him happy. What, What. What does that mean? Does that mean another trip to the final? Does that mean win a round or two? Does that mean they have to win the Stanley Cup? What do you guys think has to happen for Connor McDavid to go? You know what? I will stay here long term.
- [55:53]
Max Boltman
Well, this year and next year, right? I mean, you. You kind of got. Technically it's this year, next year, in the year after that, on the contract, but you probably need to know by the end of next year. I think if they get back to the finals, you can certainly still be like, it's right there. It's. You're on the doorstep up. I just don't think you want an early exit. And an early exit casts huge doubt into the direction of everything, obviously. I mean, for him, nothing is going to sate the. Sate the hunger until he's hoisting the cup. I mean, I don't think there's any doubt about that. I don't know that he. He gets a lot of fulfillment out of it, but I think you can sell. Look, we keep getting right to the final. We're right there. You're not finding a team that's closer than us.
- [56:31]
Jesse Granger
Yeah, I agree with that.
- [56:32]
Laz
It's.
- [56:33]
Jesse Granger
We were talking about it here in Vegas and it's. The teams are so in such similar spots. It's so similar in Edmonton where the playoffs are all that matters. And your entire feeling of the franchise comes down to what happens in these, like, few weeks or longer. If the Oilers were terrible this year, they just weren't a good hockey team. They sucked flat out. Oilers, not a good hockey team. And if they lose this series, that will be how you feel about the Oilers going forward. Whereas if they win a few series, then you. Then the. Then the regular season is poof, vanish. Who cares that we didn't care in the regular season and the players will think that we didn't care.
- [57:08]
Max Boltman
They said that. Did you see that?
- [57:10]
Jesse Granger
Right? You can say that, but, like, if you lose in the first round, then your feelings after the series, after the season are maybe we do suck. Whereas if you win a few series, it's like you just completely. The regular season did not exist and you Feel like, yes, we have one of the best teams in hockey. It's. It's fascinating how that works, but it's true. And it is that way for most contending teams.
- [57:31]
Laz
Yeah, I feel that after the podcast sometimes I'm like, you know what we do suck.
- [57:36]
Max Boltman
They let us know when we do. That's for sure. Did you see, you saw the McDavid quote last. That was like, you know, I don't think this group. I don't think the regular season does it for us basically. Did I. I wonder if that's almost him trying to psych himself up as like. Yeah, that's all this was. It's just, it's group. It's the regular season.
- [57:54]
Laz
See, you know, the, the Blackhawks used to say that all the time. Time like they would be like, you know what, whatever for the 16 where the one seed. Where the eight seed. We're going to be fine. But they earned that right. They won championships and now the Oilers, they've been to two straight Stanley cup finals. They have won a lot in the playoffs. They've sort of earned the right to think that. But I really think feel like you have to have a championship under your belt in order to treat the regular season like a non issue. So they're not quite worthy of that sentiment. You have to, you have to have won it in order to feel like it.
- [58:23]
Max Boltman
I just mean do you think he really does feel like it or do you think he's almost like absolutely feels like that.
- [58:28]
Laz
When you, when you've played as many playoff games as he has in the last couple of years, when you are flying to, you know, Seattle for a Tuesday night game, that who gives a crap about. You absolutely feel that. These teams that into the lightning feel like this a lot. The Panthers feel like this a lot. The Blackhawks used to feel like this. The Kings used to feel like this. The Penguins used to feel like this. It is really difficult to get up for most regular season games when you have played on the biggest stage for the biggest prize imaginable. So I absolutely think he believes that. I don't think it's like some like mind game that he's trying to play with himself. I, I don't know if he's earned the right to say that, but he absolutely believes it and it's completely understandable.
- [59:06]
Jesse Granger
I, I totally agree that he believes that. I don't know if I believe it though. I mean the Oilers are worse. Like they're. The debt, the forward depth is worse than it was a couple years ago. The defense maybe you could argue the defense is about equal. The goaltending is definitely worse and that's going to be what the spotlight's on tonight and for as long as they're in the playoffs because they as for as bad as Stuart Skinner and everybody wanted to put all the blame on him. He was good in the playoffs and got them to cup finals and they traded him and without question got worse in net. So we'll see how that plays out.
- [59:42]
Max Boltman
A lot of good stuff out of the game ones here. I'm sure there's going to be a lot more in the game twos which will kick off tonight. That is going to do it for us today. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Athletic Hockey Show. The Sean Frankie Corra will be back with you on Wednesday. We'll talk to you soon.
- [60:01]
Jesse Granger
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Laz
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- [60:55]
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