Why the Maple Leafs should sell on the season

Summary

The Athletic Hockey Show – January 28, 2026

Episode Summary: Why the Maple Leafs Should Sell on the Season

Episode Overview

This episode of The Athletic Hockey Show, hosted by Sean Gentili, Frankie, and Haley, dives into the Toronto Maple Leafs’ disastrous homestand, their plunging playoff hopes, and the urgent question: Is it time to sell off assets and initiate a retool? The panel discusses the team’s current state, fan and media reactions, front office decisions, and wider implications for the Leafs' future. The episode also touches on NHL trade deadline moves (notably the Devils-Islanders deal), the Buffalo Sabres’ ascent, and insightful banter around NHL culture and Olympic hockey snubs.

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Main Episode Topics & Key Discussion Points

Leafs Hit Rock Bottom: The Homestand from Hell

[01:42–10:38]

• Context: Leafs lose 7-4 to Buffalo, ending an 0-4-1 homestand, effectively torpedoing recent playoff hopes.
• Haley: “Tonight's game doesn’t mean anything, but the homestand means it's over. It’s done... They blew all that in a five game home stand in which they lost all five. Four in regulation, really. Four blowouts almost...” [02:32]
• Leafs had fought back into the playoff race but collapsed massively at a crucial point.
• “This Leafs team is done.” — Haley [03:53]
• Frankie: “If your mind wasn’t made up prior to this homestand, this homestand should have been the deciding factor.” [04:56]
• All usual talk of playoff bolstering has been replaced by a sobering focus on failure.
• Sean points out persistent issues: “They’re bad in some of the same ways they were bad at the start of the season... this is the fulfillment of the team that they showed us... in October.” [05:32]

Notable/Telling Moments:

• The arena emptying out with minutes left, fans booing loudly. [07:15]
• Discussion of how media and fan criticism (especially on TSN) have become especially harsh—and warranted.

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Time to Sell? Facing the Future, Retooling on the Fly

[10:04–14:37]

• Toronto is now “eight points behind everybody who matters.” [05:32]
• UFA asset discussions: “If you could trade [Calle Jarnkrok], he’s a UFA. Scott Laughton, you might have to trade Scott Laughton.” — Frankie [09:30]
• Early trade rumors, e.g., Bobby McMann linked to the Oilers.
• Halting the perennial “all-in” approach: “This is always the, the cautionary tale of quote, unquote, all-in.” — Frankie [09:56]
• No need to tear it all down: “Matthews, Nylander, Tavares... there’s a decent foundation there... This is not, you got to start from scratch again, but you have to do something.” [10:04]

Notable Quotes:

• “Toronto is the team that fits the definition of a retool for me.” — Frankie [10:04]
• “I would rather retool around Auston Matthews at 28... than Sidney Crosby at 37.” — Sean [10:44]

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Management, Accountability, and the Path Not Taken

[11:12–14:37]

• Should Brad Treliving get to oversee the retool?
  • “If he accepts where the team is at and says... we need some draft capital... then you can probably say so.” — Frankie [11:47]
  • Discussion on the role of new CEO Keith Pelley: “Let’s actually try something that has not been tried when it comes to the Toronto Maple Leafs in the last decade. Let’s try to make some tough decisions.” — Haley [12:35]
• Urgency with the Olympic break and trade deadline approaching: time to create a market for tradable assets, not “do it the easy way, which is what they’ve done on every big pivotal decision” in recent years.

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Marner Fallout and Fanbase Emotions

[14:37–17:22]

• Examining the “domino effect” of Mitch Marner leaving for Vegas: team age, on-ice leadership, and emotional impact.
• Frankie: “It can’t be this much for one player, but... it just feels like that decision has sent this team into a place that they can’t recover from...”
• Marner’s muted homecoming and fan attitudes: “Good night for the people who want to say Leaf fans are too quiet... bad for the ‘toxic fans’ crowd.” — Haley [15:38]
• Venting about the Department of Player Safety and unfairness toward the Leafs.

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Honest Assessment – What Went Wrong (And What’s Left)

[17:22–18:04]

• “Last year, they were a team that were floated by... elite talent... bunch of career years, high shooting percentage... goaltending... Less talented players [now], less hot players, and a goaltender who... isn’t good enough to bail them out...” — Sean [16:17]
• Leafs' original-six status and big-market legacy provide neither success nor immunity from hard truths.

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Should There Be a Public "Letter"?

[18:04–18:35]
Joking about whether Brad Treliving needs to release an open “letter to fans” à la New York Rangers to announce the team is selling/retooling.

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Sabres’ Surge and What the Leafs Can Learn

[18:35–21:41]

• Buffalo’s transformation from similar rosters year-to-year to being “a culture changer.” [19:05]
• “Kevin Adams is going to get GM of the Year votes.” — Haley [19:11]
• Fun with possible playoff matchups: “As of today, [first round would be] Detroit vs. Buffalo: the two longest playoff droughts going head-to-head.” — Frankie [21:09]

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Trade Talk: Devils & Islanders In-Metro Deal

[24:46–33:22]

• Discussing the Devils shipping Andre Palat (and his tough contract) to the Islanders in exchange for Maxim Cyplikov and a pick, while also absorbing minor assets back.
• “For Tom Fitzgerald? He clears off a bad contract and now he's got room to go get Quinn Hughes. Go do it.” — Haley [25:41]
• Haley/Sean note: smart move, but “a day late and a dollar short”—should've happened much sooner if the aim was to salvage the season.
• Islanders’ low-risk, playoff-push moves lauded: “The Islanders have earned some reinforcements.” — Haley [29:58]

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NHL Olympic Rosters, American Player Snubs & Caulfield's Streak

[33:22–36:53]

• The group riff on which US-born scorers were omitted from the Olympic roster, highlighting Cole Caulfield’s scoring tear.
• “So, three of the top five American born goal scorers are staying home. It looks crazy.” — Frankie [34:42]
• “He's a better overall player than I think people give him credit for.” — Frankie on Caulfield [35:39]

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Fun, Lighthearted Closing Banter

[36:53–39:52]

• Upcoming Habs game where Avalanche will don iconic Nordiques jerseys in Montreal, promising nostalgia and possible tension.
• Frankie’s travel story, praised for broadcasting with the Red Wings, and weathering “Snowmageddon.”

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What We Learned: Closing Reflections

[42:12–49:39]

• Sean and Haley riff on league oddities, notably the fines for players (Willie Nylander, Mikhail Sergachev) flashing obscene gestures at cameras—further fueling Leafs' persecution complex.
• Frankie muses on teams “letting agents find a trade”—the ultimate player-punt, with Evander Kane as current example.
• Short notes on professional writing workflows and newsletter duties (in-jokes for regular Athletic readers).

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• “This Leafs team is done.” — Haley [03:53]
• “If your mind wasn't made up prior to this homestand, this homestand should have been the deciding factor.” — Frankie [04:56]
• “I would rather retool around Auston Matthews at 28... than Sidney Crosby at 37.” — Sean [10:44]
• “Let’s try to make some tough decisions. Let’s try not to take the path of least resistance again...” — Haley [12:35]
• “It can’t be this much for one player, but man, it just feels like that decision [to let Marner leave] has sent this team into a place they can’t recover from.” — Frankie [15:04]
• “Toronto is the team that fits the definition of a retool for me.” — Frankie [10:04]
• “Three of the top five American born goal scorers are staying home. It looks crazy.” — Frankie [34:42]

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• Leafs Homestand autopsy: [01:42–10:38]
• Selling/retooling debate: [10:04–14:37]
• Management & accountability discussion: [11:12–14:37]
• Marner fallout & fanbase: [14:37–17:22]
• Sabres’ rise: [18:35–21:41]
• Devils/Islanders trade breakdown: [24:46–33:22]
• US Olympic roster snubs/Caulfield: [33:22–36:53]
• Fun closing banter: [36:53–39:52]
• ‘What We Learned’ & wrap: [42:12–49:39]

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Episode Tone & Style

The episode offers a candid, occasionally biting, but ultimately insightful tone—with mix of Leafs exasperation, genuine analysis, light sarcasm, and lively repartee.

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Takeaway for New Listeners

This episode is essential listening for Leafs fans ready to move from hope to realism, and for any NHL watcher interested in the mechanics, psychology, and drama of major-market collapse and retool. The panel’s blend of stats, locker room perspectives, media savvy, and fan empathy creates an engaging, thoughtful, and highly current conversation.

Transcript

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[Frankie]

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[Frankie]

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[Sean Gentili]

Like I said, this isn't a joke. So the knock knock was just you knocking?

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[Frankie]

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[Haley]

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[Frankie]

This is the athletic hockey show.

[Sean Gentili]

What up?

[Frankie]

What up?

[Sean Gentili]

It's the Athletic hockey show for January 28, 2026. We are recording this boys, in the PM on January 27, 2026. It's our first night record of the season and it is taking place on a particularly fortuitous evening, is it not? We. We'll start. I almost said the local game. It might as well. It might as well be with you. With you too. Buffalo 7 Toronto 4 closes out a 04 and 1 road trip or home stand rather for the Leafs. We'll talk about the Sabers later.

[Haley]

But.

[Sean Gentili]

But as always, we need to ask the question. Dgb, let's start with you. What does this mean for the Toronto Maple Leafs?

[Haley]

I. Tonight's game doesn't mean anything, but the home stand means it's. It's over. It's done. They, to their credit, had fought back into the playoff mix with a strong, you know, a strong month, I guess since the. The Christmas break. Maybe, maybe a little less than that. But they had run off the sort of Stretch they needed to get back into it. And then they blew all that in a five game home stand in which they lost all five. Four in regulation, really. Four blowouts almost including the Friday night game, which was there the biggest game of the regular season. Just as far as the fan base goes with Mitch Marner coming back where they just didn't show up. I mean, just seemed confused that there was a game going on. The sort of performance that you just, you, you see that and you go, oh, okay, they're done. And then Colorado, I mean, I, I don't know if anyone from the Colorado Avalanche even showered after that game. They probably didn't need to. That that's how much effort it took to come into Toronto and beat the Leafs. And then tonight, I mean this is two teams headed in complete opposite directions. And I, I, maybe the Sabres flashed the high beams on the way by, but that was about it. This, this Leafs team is done 2512.

[Sean Gentili]

Goal differential on the side, by the way. Just want to say it. Oops.

[Frankie]

This, this feels very foreign for this team. We're approaching late January and usually the talk is who are they going to get to bolster this thing up and who are they going to get in the first round and are they going to get past that opponent and how is this year going to be different? We look for reasons why this is going to be the year that they do it and now they have to like, they have to face the fact that they're not a good team. If they were to even sneak into the playoffs, which I don't think is going to happen, they're not going anywhere. So they have to make a decision here to start to recuperate some stuff. All they've traded as prospects and picks and now they're without Marner, who's, you know, playing for Vegas and their first place in the Pacific. And it's not any better. It's actually way worse than it ever was. So if your mind wasn't made up prior to this homestand, this homestand should have been the deciding factor. That you lose five games in a moment where you had to win some because you're going on the road and you got to go out west and you went 0, 4 and 1, you have your answer. It's there for you and you don't have to search very far.

[Sean Gentili]

And they're bad in some of the same ways that they were bad at the start of the season. I know Dom tweeted some stuff out statistically, but they're sub 40x goal percentage over their last 10 games, which is abysmal. But they're pretty close early on, too. Like, this is the fulfillment of the team that they showed us to. They showed themselves to be, I think, in October. And of course, you're not going to just pull the, you're not going to pull the chute in cell on October 28th or whatever. I'm not suggesting that, you know, that, that, that was a viable move, but it's a pretty bad hockey team and they've been a pretty bad hockey team at various, at various points throughout this. So, yeah, now eight points behind everybody who matters. That's, that's ugly. TSN broadcast was rightfully super harsh on them. I saw Jesse Blake from the.

[Frankie]

No way. Yeah, the TSN broadcast was harsh on the Leafs.

[Sean Gentili]

I mean, wow.

[Frankie]

I don't know anything about that.

[Sean Gentili]

Should text your, text your boy.

[Haley]

Oh, dog.

[Sean Gentili]

Tell him, tell him, tell him, tell him. Great job. Really tough, tough. I will unexpectedly. Tough stuff. I thought, you know what's funny? I thought, I really thought he would have liked the effort that they put out there today. I was shocked to see.

[Frankie]

You know what's funny? Now, now, now that we're on this, I don't mean to cut you off, but teams like, want the Leafs treatment sometimes from us. Be careful what you wish for because we rip the leaf sometimes and it's like we don't do it to a lot of, we don't really do it to the, the smaller market teams. But for some reason, when the Leafs open themselves up to it, it's like, it's like it's a green light special. Like you, you, you can get it. It's just, you know, it's kind of the way the business works.

[Sean Gentili]

Like the place is emptying out. Like the, the arena was emptier than usual with five and a half minutes left and the people who are there booing. I know Jesse Blake from the Steve Dangle podcast tweeted, you know, a video showing them showing that much. I mean, this feels like, you know, Sean, I, I know, I know you said the, the home stand overall was the signal, but tonight, not just because the way that they played, but because of the team that did it to them and the stakes that had been set for this game specifically, whether or not we buy that, that it was as important as Craig Brubian Co. Made it out to be. This game in particular, man, this feels. We don't want to, we don't want to put nails and coffins in January.

[Haley]

But like it Feels.

[Sean Gentili]

It feels close enough.

[Haley]

It's close enough. And, and look, there's. There's a week before the Olympic trade deadline, and then you got a couple of weeks. So I, I don't know when, when the selling needs to begin, but it certainly should. But, I mean, you talk about tonight, I honestly feel like it was good news for the Maple Leafs that you didn't get any real big, loud chance about firing anyone. You know, there, there wasn't the. And maybe it's just because Baruba and True Living, they're. Those three syllable names are harder to chant than the one or twos. Maybe that's what's protecting them. But remember, this was the last home game before the Olympics. Leaf fans are not going to see this team up close for another almost a month.

[Sean Gentili]

And they're gonna figure out like, real soon that tree is one syllable and chief is one syllable. And that works, that works well paired.

[Haley]

With the word fire.

[Sean Gentili]

If it, if you're trying to. If you're trying to.

[Frankie]

Well, doesn't it, doesn't it, doesn't it make you think about last year and how all in they were like, that's as all in as you can be. You're doing one last dance with Marner. You're trading for Carlo, you're trading for Lawton. You got picks, you got prospects going out the door. Frazier, Minton, see you later. Grabenkin, see you later. And now, like, this is always the, the cautionary tale of quote, unquote, all in. And what happens when you run into Florida and you lose in that situation? Now you're left picking up the pieces. And we can diagnose it, right? Like, everyone can diagnose it. But the solution, I mean, it's not, it's not exactly like, outlined specifically, but you can figure it out. Like Cali on Croak, if you could trade him, he's a ufa. Scott Lawton, you might have to trade Scott Lawton. Like, you might have to trade Bobby McMahon. Like, you might have to see if there's a team that wants to have.

[Sean Gentili]

By the way, we have, we do. We have Elliot Friedman and Bob Stauffer. Both are already connecting Bobby McMahon with the Oilers. Specifically, like, right, that's where we are in the season. The Bobby McMahon trade rumors are a twirling on Jan.27.

[Frankie]

And they're not wrong for, for thinking that and saying that this is, this is where Toronto's at. Ufas, you got to get something for them. I'm sorry. Like, and you have to start to Toronto is the team that fits the definition of a retool for me. I don't think it's like, I don't think it's completely broken. This is not something where you tear it down to the studs and you say we got to start all over again. There's a decent foundation there. Let's call a spade a spade. Matthews, Nylander, you know, Tavares will give you good minutes. Like there, there's some. This is not. You got to start from scratch again, but you have to do something.

[Sean Gentili]

You know, they should take notes from Kyle Dubas.

[Frankie]

There you go.

[Sean Gentili]

Reads.

[Frankie]

No kidding.

[Sean Gentili]

I would rather retool around Auston Matthews at 28 or whatever than Sidney Crosby at 37. Like take, take some. Take some.

[Haley]

They, they did it.

[Sean Gentili]

Why can't. Why can't you?

[Frankie]

Okay, so are people paying attention to Geno Malkin and what he's doing this year? Because they should be. Guy's unbelievable this year.

[Haley]

They should.

[Sean Gentili]

That team is, that team is good with him and bad without him. Like that's like been the takeaway of the last like six weeks. Yeah.

[Haley]

So I, I'm, I'm going to do the thing that I love to do most. I'm going to grab this, this thing and pull it back to the Maple Leafs. Kyle Dubas is not walking in that door to fix this team.

[Sean Gentili]

He walked out of it.

[Haley]

Should Brad Treliving be the guy who starts this process?

[Sean Gentili]

No.

[Haley]

Given that there is a multi week break in the season coming up, is Brad Treliving the guy that gets to start fixing the mess that Brad Treliving and others created?

[Frankie]

I'll answer this for you. If he accepts where the team is at, if he accepts where the team is at and says, I fully understand that this is, this is something, there needs to be changes and we need to get some draft capital and maybe a prospect or two and we need to change things. But if you're going to say that no, we, we can do this, we're not giving up, we're going to throw more at this then no, then he shouldn't. But I think if he, if he, if he looks at it the right way, which the way everyone would look at it and says there's going to need to be some changes, then you can, you can probably say so because I don't think he's had that moment yet. He's been in try and salvage this thing mode from the moment he got there and now you're not there anymore and, and it's.

[Haley]

This is. You Know Keith Pelly with the guy that none of us had heard of a year and a bit ago, but suddenly he became the big boogeyman of Toronto sports. Very funny. This guy's going to be there. This guy is going to bloom over everything. And I think we've seen him maybe three, three times in public, a couple of which probably would have been, you know, with the Blue Jays, when things were going good, time, time for Keith to make some calls. Time for him to take off the glasses, you know, give him a, give him a little fog and a little clean, put them back on, fresh set of eyes. And let's actually try something that has not been tried when it comes to the Toronto Maple Leafs in the last decade. Let's try to make some tough decisions. Let's try not to take the path of least resistance again, like always. And let's, let's go out there and actually make some tough calls. And you know, the, the Olympic break is an interesting one because that there's no trades, of course, but you can talk, you can get things set up, you can put names out there, right? How often does it happen that every year there's a couple of guys whose names just keep, seem to percolate in the media? Scott Lawton was one of them last year. By the time the Leafs gave up a first round pick for him, you're going like, who is this guy? And I'll say, Scott Lawton's grown on me. I'm, I'm enjoying the season he's having. He's one of the few guys I like watching on this team. But let's get back to that. Let's, let's get that name out there again and see. Maybe it's not a first round pick this year, maybe it is, who knows? But let's see what you can get for some of these guys. I mean, we always hear about how this is this big media market in Toronto and everybody always talks about the Leafs and all this stuff. Okay, great. Use that to your advantage. Get some of these guys names out there and let's see if you can start creating a market for them. Or you sit back and you go, oh, you know, we want to see what happens after the break. And you, you do it the easy way, which is what they've done on every big pivotable decision they've had to make for the last decade.

[Frankie]

It's amazing that like, this is the domino effect, is it not? The domino effect of one player. And I know people are sick of hearing about it, but okay, Guys have gotten older, guys have aged. Every team has gotten older. Really. Like, I don't know, maybe there's a few that have brought in some younger players, but generally players get older every year. And this is the, the, the fallout from Marner leaving.

[Haley]

It can't be like, it can't be.

[Frankie]

This much for one player, but man, it just feels like that decision has sent this team into a place that they can't recover from at this point. It's funny, like, I just, I just called the game Habs Vegas, and Marner's out there. He's playing center, he's playing the point on the power play. He's kind of doing everything. He's fine. Like, you know, it's fine, but it's almost weird for him as well. And he was getting booed louder almost tonight in Montreal than he was in Toronto at times.

[Haley]

That bad on Friday. Really strange, the hype that was not a rough ride for Mitch Marner at all. Tough night for the people who want to love to say how toxic Leaf fans are and how they're so hard on the team, but good night for the people who want to say the Leaf fans are too quiet and all this other stuff.

[Sean Gentili]

So I'm, I've, I'm siding with Leafs fans. I'm saying they're not that toxic and they do have in fact like a viable beef with the Department of Player Safety over the Nylander sub. This is crazy.

[Frankie]

That's crazy.

[Sean Gentili]

We live in strange times.

[Frankie]

Yeah, no kidding.

[Haley]

Welcome aboard, buddy. It's terrible. You're going to hate it.

[Sean Gentili]

I mean, Tron, ultimately, like this goes back to what I said before. Like this shouldn't surprise anybody. Like last year, they were a team that were floated by three things. Primarily elite talent. You take Mitch Marner out of that equation, bunch of career years, high, high, high shooting percentage. I. They're a PDO team. I know people hate, people hate saying that, but like, you know, a bunch of guys on season long heaters to some extent, remove that from the equation. And you had Stolars who when he was in the lineup last, last year looked like a Vesna candidate. You know, he wallpapered over whatever mistakes that shooting percentage and elite talent couldn't. Couldn't take care of. And what do we got now? Less talented players, less hot players and a goaltender who, between him and between Solars and Wall, obviously who was, who is in that tonight? Guys who just aren't, who aren't good enough to bail, who haven't been good enough to bail. Him out on a consistent enough basis. Like, I'm not surprised by this. Like, like, I don't. It's sounds lame, but it's true.

[Frankie]

I'll say this, I'll say this about, you know, the Leafs and I think the Rangers fall into this category as well. Just because you're original six and you play in a big market, you got really fancy arena and you're always known for kind of being a big spender and being in the mix, you're not entitled to like be in the mix. You actually have to put it together and be good. And the Rangers have recognized that. They put out the letter. They did letter 2.0. And the Leafs are basically going to have to recognize that with their actions here. Like, I'm sorry, they're, they're at that point and so like, we'll see what they do about it. But this is where they're at. These, this is the cards they're dealt and now they have to make the most of it.

[Haley]

So, so let me, let me just ask you this. Do we need Brad Treliving to write a letter to kick off this sell sellers market or does he just go up to the press box and lean over and give the finger to all the players on the ice to let them know? Because that's 5,000 bucks. I don't know how much it costs to get a good professionally scripted letter put together. It's probably pretty similar.

[Sean Gentili]

Just put, just if you write a letter, just make sure it's on Boston Pizza letterhead, that's all.

[Frankie]

Yeah, well, hey, if you're, if you're Toronto, don't you look at this, this Buffalo Sabres team and say they didn't change that much from year to year. They traded Paterka, they brought in Doane, and they got Kesselring. And Kesselring's been injured most of the year. And you're like same goalies pretty much side for Colton Ellis, same D, same forwards. But they're dummying people.

[Sean Gentili]

Dylan looks, he, there's shifts that he takes on a nightly basis where you're like, this dude is.

[Frankie]

This guy's good gamer. That, that guy's a culture changer. He's a kid. He's a culture changer.

[Haley]

I've said this a couple of times in a couple of places and TSN was talking about it tonight. So I, I'm upset because I thought I was going to get to, this was going to be my thing. I'm planting the flag right now. Kevin Adams is going to get GM of the Year votes. You don't think it's going to happen. Kevin Adams is going to show up on at least one battle.

[Sean Gentili]

Who votes on. Who votes on that?

[Haley]

The GMs vote on it.

[Sean Gentili]

GMs on it.

[Haley]

The GMs really one G. There's going to be a GM out there, remember? And there's precedent. Scott Houston got votes the year he got fired. Some GM out there is going to look at his fellow fallen colleague and say everybody blamed him. They stuck the knife in his back. But his team was secretly good, just like my team is secretly good.

[Sean Gentili]

If everybody, actually nobody should ever get fired.

[Haley]

That's.

[Sean Gentili]

That, that, that's the big takeaway here.

[Haley]

Well, that's either the takeaway or the takeaway is you can fire your GM and change literally nothing else and completely transform your team or just, or just.

[Frankie]

Play like a team. Who gives a. You know what, like when Toronto went on that they were what, oh, eight, zero and two run. And it's like, it's amazing how much you can make up for when you just like skate and work and compete and you're like urgent to win. And then, oh, four and one later and you're like, what the hell was that? That's nowhere.

[Haley]

Every night. I mean, come on. What kind of.

[Frankie]

And I wasn't an every night kind of guy. I was a press box. I was every night in the press box. I don't know what it's like to do that every night.

[Sean Gentili]

Sabers every night. Sabre's man 19, 3 and 1 in their last 23, 91, 56 goal goal differential. That's so streak out there tonight.

[Haley]

I'm so happy for those fans and that fan base and that building for that first playoff game or whoever it's against. You know, even if it's, you know, even if they're playing Tampa and they're down the series to nothing for game three, like, who cares?

[Sean Gentili]

That series will take place. That series will take there.

[Haley]

Get Montreal.

[Frankie]

As of today. As of today it's Detroit. As of today, it's the two longest playoff droughts going head to head in the first round. Wouldn't that be something? Hockey town in Buffalo. That would be really cool.

[Haley]

That's the series that we need.

[Sean Gentili]

We're gonna see the top three Norris trophy vote getters in that series. It's more exciter. It's Erasmus Dahleen and it is of course Matthias Samuelsson, don't you mean?

[Haley]

And potentially the top three GM of the year vote getters as well.

[Sean Gentili]

Menorah Morrison.

[Frankie]

Don't you mean Noritz cider, as they refer to him, I believe sometimes. And I think that's Daniela. Bruce came up with that on a Red Wing trademark. Yeah.

[Sean Gentili]

Oh, that's enough. That's enough about the leaves, boys. 23 minutes. Good God. We have a trade to discuss. We're gonna do that after the break. Stick around.

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[Sean Gentili]

Perfected. All right, we are back boys. We have another metro division metro area trade to discuss. It is another one that involves the New York Islanders who traded for Carson Susie from Seattle a couple days back. This one I think is a little more interesting and it's a somewhat, somewhat unexpected because the Devils moved Andre Paot seemed like he had an unmovable contract. They found a way to shuffle that off to the Islanders. They get back Maxim Cyplikov and a third round pick. Well the, the Islanders rather got a third and a six for, for taking on Plots contract. Sean, let's, let's start with you. I, I guess what are, what are the initial thoughts here? And on a scale, on a scale of one to, on a scale of one to 10, how surprised are you.

[Haley]

That we saw Andre for 10 out of 10 for Tom Fitzgerald? He clears off a bad contract and now he's got room to go get Quinn Hughes. Go do it.

[Frankie]

Yeah.

[Sean Gentili]

What's the, what's the, what's the date on the calendar? This is, this is December 11th, isn't it?

[Haley]

I'm being told that maybe it's a bit late on that. Look, I don't, I do like it for the Devils. You know, this is to get out from under 6 million bucks next year at the cost of a third round pick essentially is, is a good bit of business. We have seen teams have to pay significantly more than that to get out of similar contracts. So in that sense, good job. But if I'm a Devil's fan, I'm sitting there going great, where was this two or three months ago or in the off season where we could have maybe done something significant in and not be doing this in the second half of what looks like it's going to be a lost season.

[Frankie]

I wonder if this is the first time in NHL history that two trades were completed in a row where none of the players have to actually move. They think about that. They don't have to move their homes like they're just reporting to a different stadium.

[Sean Gentili]

Susie, he got on the lirr and.

[Frankie]

Just bopped over man, it's hilarious. It's kind of crazy, right? And, you know, the way these teams do road games, essentially, it's like a black car picks you up in the morning, you go to the different rink, and then you go take a nap at the hotel, then you go play the game, and then, like, a car carpools and brings you back to your place. It's pretty wild how it works in that area. So it is. You know, it's interesting that it's these three teams doing trades, but we just went on and on, right? We just went on and on about the Leafs and how bad they're playing and how it's time to sort of re. Reshuffle things. New Jersey's got one less point, and New Jersey's got a minus 22 goal differential, and Toronto's got a minus 9 goal differential. So, hey, good. Clear some money off your books. That's great. You needed to. Because clearly that got in the way of things the last time. Not. And also some trade protection and things of that nature. What's the next move for Jersey? Is it throwing more at this group, or are they going to sort of reevaluate where they're at? Because, like, I remember us talking about New Jersey earlier this season thinking, well, it hasn't been their year in the past. It's not their year this year. How much do you keep throwing at it and saying, like, well, we're right there? I don't know. I don't know. But it doesn't feel like they're. They're any closer or should be any closer.

[Sean Gentili]

It's the weirdest part of this deal, I think, to some extent, is that I get it. Devil's fans were happy to move on from Andre Palat. Like, he's. It's a.

[Haley]

It was a.

[Sean Gentili]

Felt like a bad contract when they signed him to it, frankly. And it is only been proven as such over the last couple to the point where now, six hours ago, it seemed like it was unmovable. So, you know, golf clap for.

[Haley]

For.

[Sean Gentili]

For moving. For moving on from it, if you're Tom Fitzgerald. But, like, the amount of flowers that I saw thrown at the Devils for doing this is kind of bizarre because it. Because Sean, you. You alluded to this. Man, this is late. It's a day. It's a day late in a. In a dollar short. And like, yes, it frees up money or it frees up cap for the summer. And it, you know, potentially, if it. If they want to. If they want to dive back in and make make some kind of short term win now, move like they have the flexibility for it now, but like the damage is done, man. So I, so I look at this and I, and you know, this isn't some fleece job by fit by Fitzgerald. Like, he had to send assets back, you know, to, to the, to the Islanders too. And then the timing of it just makes it. It feels like a wash at best. I think in a lot of ways, I like it more for the Islanders. I mean, I know not to pull back the curtain too much, but the three of us were talking before the show. Like, I like, I feel like. I feel like we're kind of on the same page with that. Like, I like this as much for the Islanders as they do for the Devils.

[Haley]

Yeah, for the Islanders. Feels like a case with, with this and especially with the Susie deal, where it's like a new GM comes in and he's got a team that nobody thinks is going to be all that good yet. You know, you've just picked first overall and, and you sort of look at it, you go, all right, well, let's, let's see what the players do and do. Can they earn some. Some support for me. Can they earn some reinforcements? And they have. They've gone out. The Islander has been one of the best stories of the first half. And now you're sitting there going, okay, look, I'm, I'm not going to trade our best prospects away for help right now. I'm not going to go and be trading first round picks, but I'll bring in some help. Yeah, I'll go and get you guys some, some. Some veterans to, to plug in and, and help you make that playoff push, because you have earned that and, and they have. And so without. Yeah, I mean, really, you can look at this and say, traded away a third to get Susie, got a third back in the plot. Deal added some veterans, took on some cap hit, but cap it you could afford.

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah, not that a bad bit of work.

[Haley]

I don't mind it.

[Frankie]

I find it interesting for the Islanders because, like, over the last couple of years, didn't everything feel stale with the Islanders? Like, this is. This is as good as they are, right? They're. They're just kind of stuck here. And then, you know, they've changed some things around. Sorokin's been unbelievable. Horvat has had a monster year. Barzal still doing his thing. You go up and down that lineup and you're like, guys are. Guys are playing better. It's predominantly like a lot of the Same guys. You know, there's. There's a few guys added here and there, like Drew in or Anthony Duclair, but, like, those guys aren't massive needle movers, but everything seems to be working there. Then you're like, okay, Andre Palat, like, was really good for Tampa on their runs when they won Stanley Cups. Ultimately, that's the reason why he gets a deal that pays him $6 million a year. Like, everyone's finding it on the island. Can Andre Palat find it as well? Like, is there just something going on there where guys are finding that renewed sense of purpose? So, like, to DGB's point, like, I could see that being the case. And if you get. You get into a playoff situation, maybe he has a little bit of that pixie dust level left over from the Tampa days. Who knows? Like, there's a reason why teams want to pay and acquire winners, get labeled as a winner. There's. There's a job for you. Someone wants to bring in the winning culture and see if that rubs off on their group, and he has that.

[Haley]

We should also say, though, 20 goals one time for Andrew Pilot. 60 points one time, and both of those were over a decade ago. We're not talking about a guy who's a couple years removed.

[Sean Gentili]

Sneaky. Sneaky old, for sure.

[Haley]

It's. It's. He's.

[Sean Gentili]

I don't get it, though.

[Haley]

Sneaky anymore. He's.

[Sean Gentili]

I mean, whatever.

[Haley]

He's freaky old is what he is.

[Sean Gentili]

We're 13 months away from them sending Andre Palat to somebody for a third rounder. When they retain 50 like those, they'll. They'll turn. They'll turn that into something. I. I think I've talked my. If I. I didn't do the trade grade on this, I think it was Myrtle and Harmon, but I. I think. I think I've talked myself into it over the last couple minutes. Right? I think. I think I'm looking more for the Islanders. Very, very interesting. Frankie, what was it? 4, 3, 3, 2.

[Frankie]

Yeah.

[Haley]

Habs.

[Sean Gentili]

Habs over Vegas. That was in overtime. That was the. That was the game you watched. It was Jake Evans with the ot. With the ot.

[Frankie]

Guess who scored again tonight. Cole Caulfield.

[Sean Gentili]

A small. A small American now.

[Frankie]

10 goals since January 2nd, when USA named their Olympic roster.

[Haley]

Because he's using up all his energy now because he knows he's got arrest coming up. It's an unfair advantage. Montreal American players that they can just leave it all unrest.

[Sean Gentili]

I love the fact that. That the NHL gives us a very Easily findable option to sort scorers by nationalities. So we'll just, let's, let's take a look at this. United States sort by goals. Jason Robertson. Jason Robertson. 30 tied at the top with Cole Caulfield who has 30.

[Frankie]

They're both on the team, right?

[Sean Gentili]

Third place. Yeah, they're, they're there too. One of the extra forwards on, in, in that group is Alex the Brinkett third in American.

[Frankie]

Oh, he's on the team too.

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, it had it, it happened. You just missed it. Tage fourth, Matt Bodie fifth. Okay, so three of the top five American born goal scorers are staying home.

[Frankie]

It looks crazy. Sweet, crazy.

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah.

[Haley]

And Paige Thompson wasn't on the last team. I mean he had to sit out one tournament to, to finally get his chance.

[Frankie]

Did in. Thompson went to the Worlds, did he not? Like that was his thing. He went to the Worlds is like usa, usa. I'm here and I'm pounding my chest and now he's on the team.

[Sean Gentili]

I think if I would have showed up at Worlds over the summer, I probably would have made the team. That seems like that was, it was that easy. Like that's, that's all these guys needed to do. The question is who in the next, you know, eight days or whatever, who is going to make this look even worse? My money is on Cutter Gautier who's tied for 10th in goals by American born players. It's him, it's him. Tied with Kyle Connor. Let's see, let's see him going on a little spell here. Maybe finish with more than, you know, Matthews or Larkin or one of those guys.

[Frankie]

Sweet, sweet. You know what, good for, good for Caulfield, man. He's got, he's got an infectious enthusiasm for the game. Like not just scoring goals. He's very enthusiastic for scoring goals. It's, it's, it's very evident. It's clear he's on a six game goal streak. He's got nine goals in that span. But he's a, he's a better overall player than I think people give him credit for. Like this perception that he's just a one dimensional goal scorers. It's not true. He's a really good player. So good for him, man. Like he's just, and he's class like he's never going to say anything to like show up the situation. He's doing his thing, helping the team win. Go usa.

[Sean Gentili]

He's, he's all, you just remember that. Just, just remember Cole Caulfield 30 goals in, you know, 52 games or whatever it is. And he's a, and he's a nice kid too. Just, just remember that American hockey fans, whenever this seems, losing, losing games by one goal and, and making, making you very, very angry pre and post game in the process. It's going to be great.

[Haley]

It'll be fine. Because you've got the veteran leadership of the apparently 57 year old Jackson Lacombe.

[Sean Gentili]

Leave Jackson.

[Haley]

We didn't want to take a second photo there, guys. Like maybe, maybe just one more Jackson.

[Frankie]

You want to look like you're not.

[Haley]

Having the worst day of your life right now.

[Sean Gentili]

Brock Nelson looks 100. Like whatever. They're like, they're, they're doing these guys dirty with these, with, with these, with.

[Haley]

I gotta tell you, I got a real issue with Brock Nelson because he needs to stop scoring because he's gonna make me update my material about, you know, bro. Oh yeah, you're gonna have all these guys and Brock Nelson's there and, you know, meanwhile, he's on his way to 45 goals this year.

[Sean Gentili]

So Brock Nelson writing it, right. He's making us realize that it was actually fair and smart for him to write his name and pen for, for this roster, like over this.

[Haley]

That was clearly it. Yeah.

[Sean Gentili]

Oh, brother. Frankie, what's up with you? The next. For the rest of the week, do you have, are you working more? Can you go home?

[Frankie]

You know what? We got a really cool night in Montreal on Thursday. It's Habs Avalanche. And the ABS are wearing Nordiques jerseys here in Montreal. Now, I haven't been able to confirm if they're going to wear the blue ones, but I think it would be really cool if the Habs are wearing their reds and the avs are wearing the blue Nordiques. I think that's must see stuff, so we'll, we'll see how that kind of unfolds.

[Sean Gentili]

That's interesting.

[Haley]

That could be a fun one. Be careful on those pre post intermission skates before the period. The warm ups, they get a little, they get a little ugly between those two teams.

[Frankie]

Yeah, yeah, I'm sure there's going to be some nostalgia in the air. So. Yeah, that's, that's what I got going on. Um, I got to give a little shout out if you guys don't mind.

[Sean Gentili]

Sorry. Goodbye. Goodbye.

[Frankie]

I had a great, like, I had a great time with Kenny Daniels doing the Red Wings broadcast, filling in for Mickey. It was so much fun. Those guys are like, you can totally understand why they're ranked the top show in the NHL every single year. So that was, that was really cool. But as you know, it was Snowmageddon in Toronto on that Sunday. Every flight was canceled. Like it was a disaster getting out of there. And my flights were going to be like jammed up until Tuesday. And obviously I had work, I had a Habs game to do, like, you know, stuff going on so that they, like the Red Wings were kind enough to fly me back to Detroit on the plane. And then I rented a car and drove back to Toronto through the snowstorm. So just like really flashy drive. You know what, I was just happy to get home. Like first class by them. It was really nice. So big thank you.

[Sean Gentili]

I'm going to gas you up here too, man. Like, I had multiple people on Twitter and wherever else, you know, I had one person in particular on Blue sky was like, tell, tell Frankie we loved him. We did it.

[Frankie]

That's nice.

[Sean Gentili]

Did a, did a, did a great job. So whatever.

[Frankie]

That's good. It's a, it's an unbelievable, like team effort. They're doing that show. They're awesome.

[Sean Gentili]

Kenny Daniels. Fun time.

[Frankie]

Legend, legend, legend.

[Sean Gentili]

Take it easy, bud. We'll talk to you next week.

[Frankie]

See you fellas.

[Commercial Voice]

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[Frankie]

Hey, it's Adam Grant from Ted's podcast Work Life, and this episode is brought to you by ServiceNow. AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built into. That's why it's no surprise that more than 85% of the Fortune 500 companies use the ServiceNow AI platform. While other platforms duct tape tools together, ServiceNow seamlessly unifies people, data workflows, and AI connecting every corner of your business. And with AI agents working together autonomously, anyone in any department can focus on the work that matters Most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for [e-mail].

[Sean Gentili]

All right, there goes Frankie. Me and Mac and DO are going to tell you what we learned in a minute. But before that, you folks listen to us. And now we want to hear from you. We're asking you to fill out a quick survey about you and your podcast habits by going to theathletic.com survey26. That's S U R V E Y26. Three lucky entries will win a $100Amazon gift card, which is great. And whether you're a long term listener or a new one, we want your feedback. So Again, that is TheAthletic.com survey 26s u r v e y 26. The link is also in our episode description. Do that and we'll be your best friends forever. All right, Sean, I'm going to start. Here's what I learned.

[Haley]

What have we learned, Sean?

[Sean Gentili]

We touched on this with Frankie. It was a very upsetting time release realization. I think I had this afternoon around the time we found out or the last couple days when we found out that William Nylander had been fined five GS for shooting the bird to a cameraman from the press box. I thought that was ridiculous enough as is. And then we saw Mikhail Sergachev. Was it the same day? Was it the day after do something?

[Haley]

It was, let's say, 24 hours.

[Sean Gentili]

Yeah, 20 within. Yeah, 24 hours later, let's say do the same thing to a cameraman. Coming up, coming off the ice. Like I don't know if I needed the circuit ship of it all for it to really land. I have made fun of you on mic and off for years, years over.

[Haley]

The many people have.

[Sean Gentili]

It was Fair and warranted.

[Haley]

I, I thought at the time, yeah.

[Sean Gentili]

About Department of Player Safety is having an anti Leafs bias, but I, I think I'm starting to come around because that is 100% welcome. Peros or whoever. Somebody. Somebody important was watching, was watching that broadcast and was like, yeah, George Perros.

[Haley]

Put out like a. Like the Department of Player Safety put out a statement. I should say I've got no problem with finding guys for flipping the bird at a camera. I think that's. That's. It's a dumb thing to do. I pretty sure Willie Nylander didn't endanger any players by doing that. I mean, I think. I know he's got the.

[Sean Gentili]

I think Chris Tanev might have sprained his neck when he whirled it around to yell at him at some point.

[Haley]

That Chris Tan of lower body injury from kicking Nylander under the table going, stop smiling.

[Sean Gentili]

You're gonna get us all gonna get fined.

[Haley]

So. Yeah, well, well, welcome to the resistance, man. It's where the bandwagon is filling up slowly. Slowly. But good seats are still available.

[Sean Gentili]

Does it Bo. Like, the other question is, though, does it bother me that the Department of Player Safety has it over the Toronto Maple Leafs? And that is a whole nother debate. So we'll. We'll. We'll say we will save that for another time.

[Haley]

Yeah, you're just, You're.

[Sean Gentili]

You're.

[Haley]

You. You buy the premise. You just don't know if you buy that it's a negative thing.

[Sean Gentili]

Not sure. Not sure if I think it's a bad thing or not.

[Haley]

Fair enough. I. I learned. I learned two things. I learned that my house is super dark at night as we record this, and I'm. I'm sitting here with like eight spotlights on me and feels great, like I'm sitting in a. Sitting in a closet somewhere. I also learned that. Well, I mean, the. The Canucks are in full tank mode. Not surprisingly, they. They moved on from Sherwood Thatcher. Demko shut down for the season, which, you know, obviously he is hurt, but that is a. You can. You can play it cautiously when, when the towel is being thrown in. And we got. One of my favorite things in sports, which is Evander Kane being told, go, if find your own trade, your agent can start calling other. I mean, this happens in hockey a lot and it happens in other sports. It's not a hockey thing, but I just love the idea of a GM being like, dude, do you think I'm not trying to trade this guy? Nobody wants him. But you know what? Go ahead. Here's 31 phone numbers you call around, you see if anybody wants this guy and let me know if they do. And I, man, as somebody who often when I'm looking at like my own to do list and I'm like, man, I wish I had somebody I could just offload some of this to. Good job.

[Sean Gentili]

Also for anybody who pays attention to the NBA, it comes on the heels of an all time great quote from Mike Dunleavy, who's an exec with the Golden State Warriors. Not quite a similar situation, but you know, there's an unhappy player, Jonathan Kaminga who wants to be traded. Dunleavy said, and again, all timer, he said, well, you know, when there's a trade demand, there has to be demand from other teams to acquire the player. So they're like, we're trying, I don't know, like we're doing, we're doing our best here. Like work with us do so like give us, give us something, something to work with here.

[Haley]

Like you would assume that they would give the, they would tell the agent like here's like a minimum cut off of what we're looking for, right? But even then, I mean the, so the agent just comes back and he's like, yeah, Columbus said they would do a fifth round pick. Okay, okay, thanks.

[Sean Gentili]

See you later.

[Haley]

Get on that.

[Sean Gentili]

You know, we don't want, we don't want to, we don't want to deal with this anymore. We have a, we have a goalie who we signed for a half a billion dollars in 25 years that you know, has bad hips and knees and groins and whatever else. You have bigger, bigger fish to fry here in Vancouver.

[Haley]

A lot bigger.

[Sean Gentili]

Sean, what post is going to be live on the website by the time people listen to this?

[Haley]

I don't, I, I don't know that there will be one. Actually this week is weird because. Lazy because A, I'm lazy. And although you're welcome, if you want to write a post for me, you.

[Sean Gentili]

Can go ahead and do that.

[Haley]

See, no, I did, did the thing. I'm also doing double newsletter duty this week, so that is okay.

[Sean Gentili]

Talk about someone who's lazy.

[Haley]

The lazy James Myrtle has refused to, to do the newsletter. And I mean we were in disarray. We thought we were gonna have to scrap the whole thing. But I, I bravely stood up and I said, I, I will do it. And so yeah, that's if you're, if you're somebody who, and a lot of people have said this, you love the newsletter but you feel like the Tuesday editions are a bit better than the Friday this coming Friday is going to be. It's going to be one of the good ones. See if you can spot the differences.

[Sean Gentili]

I can sub for the Tuesday edition. I can't, I can't do Friday. I'm busy. Sorry.

[Haley]

Sean Gentili's doing next Tuesday and every following Tuesday, the remainder of the season.

[Sean Gentili]

I've done it a couple times.

[Haley]

I, I if fun, right?

[Sean Gentili]

It's, it's fun enough fun, right? All right. Good luck with that. Good luck to Frankie, wherever, wherever he is. He's. It's a fly back to Toronto Shovel's driveway, probably thanks to him. And thanks to you fine folks for listening to the Athletic Hockey show. We're back next Wednesday. Probably not recorded on Tuesday night, but you never know. And Haley and I have the next show, which will record as anticipated and as typically scheduled on Thursday. So see you then.

[Commercial Voice]

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Savings versus Comparable Verizon plans plus the cost of optional benefits, plan features and taxes and fees vary. Savings with three plus lines include third line free via monthly bill credits. Credit stop if you cancel any lines. Qualifying credit required.

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