Wemby Beats Thunder | NBA Cup INSTANT REACTION

Summary

The Athletic NBA Daily — “Wemby Beats Thunder | NBA Cup INSTANT REACTION”

Date: December 14, 2025
Hosts: Dave DuFour, Zena Keda, Esfandiar Baraheni (Es), Andrew Schlecht, Josh Robbins
Main Game: Spurs defeat Thunder in NBA Cup semifinal
Other Games Discussed: Knicks vs. Magic

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Episode Overview

This episode delivers an instant reaction to the Emirates NBA Cup semifinal in Las Vegas, focusing primarily on Victor Wembanyama’s triumphant return and the Spurs’ upset of the Oklahoma City Thunder. The hosts break down the dynamics of the biggest game of the night—the highly anticipated Spurs vs. Thunder clash—along with rapid recaps and analysis of the Knicks’ high-powered win over the Magic. There are deep dives into team culture, the strategic development of young rosters, the problem with late-game fouling, and a lively back-and-forth on how far the Spurs and Thunder might go in the playoffs.

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Spurs vs. Thunder: Wemby Returns, Spurs Stun Thunder

Victor Wembanyama's Impact

• Victor Wembanyama came off the bench for the Spurs in his return, instantly making his presence felt:
  • “First 36 seconds or so, he has two offensive rebounds, a defensive rebound, a put back and an assist. And you’re just saying, ‘Okay, well that guy has solved basketball again.’” (Dave, 07:52)
• Wemby’s on-court and off-court maturity recognized:
  • “I might be in love with Victor Wembanyama... the guy has perfect answers in this press conference.” (Dave, 06:48)
  • “How nice it is to be on a team like the Spurs that plays ethical hoops. And I can’t help but think that’s a shot at the Thunder.” (Dave, 06:50)

Thunder’s Letdown and Spurs’ Toughness

• OKC blew a big lead and struggled with execution and physicality:
  • “They felt like after they got that big lead... defensively, they didn’t execute well enough, they weren’t physical. I mean, I think they got punched in the mouth.” (Andrew, 04:05)
• Spurs’ guard rotation and defense stood out:
  • “I don’t think I’ve ever seen Shai (SGA) get blocked the way he was by Devin Vassell in the mid range. It was clean. It was great.” (Zena, 05:20)
• Physicality on both sides elevated the rivalry:
  • “Stefan Castle, like, he got literally, literally got end of the game, nose plugged up, bloody lip. Like it was a battle out here.” (Zena, 06:16)

Spurs’ Emerging Identity

• The Spurs played 12 games without Wemby and went 9–3, finding a broader identity and getting big steps forward from several players:
  • “Steph Castle getting to the rim. The Aaron Fox getting to the rim. Hit ahead passes have been huge for them. Running in transition, being physical.” (Es, 08:34)
• “This team is finding an identity without Wemby.” (Es, 09:01)

Notable Segment

• Wemby’s press conference highlight (06:50–07:26):
  • Responding about playing the Thunder: “It’s just great to be back, but it’s also good to be playing pure ethical basketball.”
  • Hosts joke this was a little dig at OKC, and marvel at Wemby’s perspective and communication skills.

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Strategic and Emotional Turning Points

OKC’s Fatigue and Killer Schedule

• OKC is not “tournament tough” yet and is feeling the grind:
  • “There’s got to be a little bit of a fatigue factor here... teams are ready for them.” (Dave, 04:20)

Spurs Bench Steps Up

• The Spurs’ depth showcased development, with four players scoring 20+ points:
  • “If you were to place a bet, perhaps with our betting partners, BetMGM... about if a team is going to have four players with 20 points or more, you’d definitely have picked the Thunder. But that’s part of what San Antonio’s done the last couple of weeks.” (Dave & Es, 17:45–17:53)

Defensive Adjustments and Physical Rivalry

• Emergence of a Western Conference rivalry:
  • “This is the rivalry, and I think that when you look at the Spurs and you listen to Victor Wembanyama in the postgame... The Thunder are where this Spurs team wants to be.” (Dave & Es, 06:35–07:02)

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Key Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Wemby’s Postgame on Spurs Style:
  “It’s just great to be back, but it’s also good to be playing pure ethical basketball that is intended.” (Wemby via Dave, 07:03)

• On the Excitement of the Matchup:
  “This team could make the finals...I’m not putting anything out of the realm of possibility for Victor Wembanyama.” (Dave, 19:49)

• On OKC’s Need for Improvement:
  “This is good for the Thunder to taste their own blood at this point in the season.” (Andrew, 18:27)

• On the Problem with Late-Game Fouling:
  “I’m tired of watching games come down to a free throw contest... the league has to do something because the watchability is awful.” (Dave, 14:08)

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Tactical and Roster Talk

OKC: What Went Wrong

• Jalen Williams’ struggles:
  “His wrist is still obviously bothering him; his handle, finishing, shooting...he’s hurting still.” (Andrew, 13:07)
• “They have a little bit of time off...they get to like taste the sting of a loss for several days, which I think is really good competitively for a team like this.” (Andrew, 18:59)

Spurs: Building for the Future

• Depth and Versatility: The “Slash Brothers” (Stephon Castle, De’Aaron Fox, Devin Vassell, Dylan Harper) finally all healthy in a game for the first time. (12:29–12:31)
• On Defensive Growth and Bench Physicality:
  • “Luke Kornet... when you have Victor still working on getting his breath back out on the floor, having him out there and not being a complete open door to the basket is huge.” (Zena, 24:44)
• Spurs’ front office credited for building with “double big lineups” and “extra ball-handling.” (Es, 24:18–24:33)
• The biggest team need: “Other than experience, they’ve got to shoot the ball really well come playoff time.” (Dave, 24:48)

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Big-Picture Discussion: Rivalries, Playoff Ceilings, and Culture

Will the Spurs and Thunder Rule the West?

• “This rivalry is what we’re going to see for the Western Conference for the next five years.” (Es & Dave, 22:53)
• On playoff potential:
  • “Second round?” (Zena, 19:43)
  • “This team could make the finals.” (Dave, 19:49)
  • “Nothing’s out of the realm of possibility for Victor Wembanyama.” (Dave, 19:57)
• But, “The playoffs are so different... Right now, the Spurs probably feel like they’ve got 11 or 12 guys. When you get to the playoffs, it doesn’t matter what your roster is—you’ve got seven.” (Andrew, 21:02)

OKC & Spurs: Mirror Images

• Both organizations lauded for their cultures, humility, and team-centric messaging:
  • “These teams are like mirrors to each other... they’re both culturally a match.” (Zena, 49:47)
• “The Thunder front office was kind of birthed from the Spurs. When they’re modeling their team, they modeled it after the Spurs, right down to the way the media is handled.” (Dave, 50:01)

Are “Superteams” Built or Born?

• “The Spurs are who they are because they won two lotteries... Robinson, Duncan... and now the third tremendous lottery win, Steph Castle.” (Josh, 51:04)
• “Oklahoma City has built itself less through luck and more through being opportunistic.” (Josh, 51:36)

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Knicks vs. Magic: Recap & Rapid Reaction

• Knicks beat Magic 132–120, with Jalen Brunson scoring 40.
• Jalen Suggs’s injury and absence of Franz Wagner left Orlando shorthanded defensively.
  • “Suggs was able to get out in transition. That was where they had their best success offensively...” (Dave, 37:14)
  • “Orlando, it’s not at its best when it plays in the half court, missing one and a half of its best defenders.” (Josh, 40:59)
• Knicks’ rising offensive firepower highlighted; hosts are bullish on Knicks as Eastern Conference favorites:
  • “I think they are the best team in the East.” (Josh, 38:45)

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“Memorable Moments” & Humor

• “Through Wemby, all things are possible. Maybe on a basketball court.” (Zena, 20:54)
• Flex Seal joke: “He’s like that one Duct Tape meme... flex seal.” (Es, 40:16)
• Euro house party story:
  • “At this house party, people discussing socialism...and then also playing beer pong with cups you get to like mouthwash at the dentist.” (Zena, 42:42–43:18)

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Key Timestamps

• Spurs-Thunder discussion begins: 02:52
• Wemby postgame & “ethical hoops” comments: 06:48–07:26
• Late-game fouling/esoteric strategy debate: 14:07–17:16
• Spurs ceiling/playoff talk: 19:36–21:32
• Cultural similarities between Spurs & Thunder: 49:19–50:54
• Knicks–Magic recap: 33:14–41:11

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Final Thoughts

• The Spurs–Thunder game in Vegas felt like the birth of a new Western Conference rivalry. Wembanyama’s return was the story—on the court, in the press room, and in the larger narrative about the NBA’s evolution.
• Both organizations are being lauded for their culture and process, with OKC modeling itself after the Spurs’ model, but the “luck versus opportunism” debate will continue.
• The end-of-game fouling issue is called out as a critical “watchability” problem for the league’s future.
• Knicks are emerging as a serious Eastern Conference threat.
• The move away from neutral Vegas sites to home courts for future NBA Cup semifinals is seen as a welcome change for atmosphere and competitive edge.

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For fans eager to understand the storylines, tactics, personalities, and culture shaping the NBA right now, this episode is a must-listen for the birth of a rivalry and the rise of a superstar.

Transcript

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[Andrew Schlecht]

Hey Andrew Schlecht here. This Tuesday at 8:30 Eastern it's the Emirates NBA Cup Championship Game on Prime. This year's quest for the cup has delivered incredible moments and jaw dropping highlights and they've been building toward this. The final two teams. I am so pumped for the NBA cup here at the NBA Daily. We will be there live in person ready to take in the cup. Ready to respect the Cup. And what's been really fun is that the players have been very motivated this year to win this thing and they have. Multiple teams have expressed this and you can see it through the competition and I cannot wait to see it. Live in Las Vegas the Emirates NBA Cup Championship Game Live from Las Vegas Tuesday night at 8:30 Eastern on Prime Eastern. And if you're not a Prime member, that's not a problem. Sign up for a 30 day free trial to get started today. The Emirates NBA Cup Championship Game this Tuesday at 8:30 Eastern only on Prime. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details.

[Dave Defore]

Good morning and welcome to the NBA Daily. I'm Dave Defore.

[Zena Keda]

This is oh I don't know why.

[Dave Defore]

Hey, Andrew Schwecht, we're in Vegas. If you're watching us live on YouTube, welcome. Thank you. If you're listening to the pod. Thank you, guys. We just saw the Oklahoma City Thunder get dealt their second loss of the season thanks to Victor Womenyama coming off the bench for the Spurs. Although they've been good without him, they were amazing with them. Andrew, I think I'll start with you because you went to the, the losing locker room after the game. All right. These guys wanted to win the cup. You told us.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Absolutely. They wanted to win the cup. Absolutely.

[Dave Defore]

But they're not tournament tough. How do you feel about it after the game?

[Andrew Schlecht]

I guess Vegas is the kryptonite of the Thunder.

[Dave Defore]

Really. Move the finals here.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Move the one you want to destroy the Thunder. Move the finals to Las Vegas. Yeah, they, the Thunder, the mood was very light in the locker room. They were joking around once we walked in there, as expected, they lost two games. It's certainly an unfamiliar feeling this season for them. But the constant message from the players, from iheart to Chet to Case and Wallace, who we talked to after the game, was that they did not execute well.

[Josh Robbins]

Right.

[Andrew Schlecht]

That they felt like after they kind of got that big lead that defensively that they didn't execute well enough, they weren't physical. I mean, I think they got punched in the mouth.

[Dave Defore]

They. Absolutely, yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And they, they were not good enough tonight.

[Dave Defore]

We. We were talking during the game.

[Esperahenny]

All right.

[Dave Defore]

How many times this year have we seen OKC look, the way that they looked at the end of the third quarter, beginning of fourth. I, I think I can mark twice. It was the Portland game that they lost when they blew the 20 point lead. And then the other night against Phoenix where it felt like, what, what is happening here with the Suns and some of this, I wonder. Like it could just be, look, this is a basketball team. They're not going to go undefeated. Right? But also there's got to be a little bit of a fatigue factor here. They've played so many games already. Like, we know how condensed the schedule has been for everyone around the week. And when you have to win every game the way that they are playing, like teams are ready for them. They are the champs. They're getting everyone's best effort every night. I mean, Victor Wimanyama came back because it's the Thunder and it's the cup, right? So he respects the cup, but they really respect the Thunder is really what it is. This is who they want to be. I liked the way that the spurs looked against him. I think it's a good matchup for the spurs and Zena. Like, they have the guards. That can really bother the Thunder up top.

[Zena Keda]

Absolutely. I mean, to your point, first and foremost, of how OKC has to play consistently. Even Victor Wembanyama called it out in terms of they haven't. The spurs haven't had the opportunity to win and enjoy winning consistently in the way that OKC has. And he talked about the fact that OKC plays the same way, whether they're going up against the number two, going up against someone in the NBA cup, or they're going up against the 15th seed. And I thought that was a lot of respect for him from him on that note, and why they could be potentially fatigued. But when you talk about the way that the guard rotation for the spurs came out and challenged them, I have. I don't think I've ever seen Shay get blocked the way he was by Devin Vassell in the mid range. It was clean. It was great. But that was just one example of how they were pressuring up. There was, I believe, a clip by Iman Shumpert talking about how OKC does such a good job of setting the tone physically that it makes referees go, okay. That's just how they play.

[Dave Defore]

They raise that vowel level. Right.

[Zena Keda]

And you saw the spurs match that energy. And it's funny, you talked about being punched in the mouth. Stefan Castle, like, he got literally, literally got end of the game, nose plugged up, bloody lip. Like it was a battle out here.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, yeah. Chet's mouth was messed up, too. I mean, it was.

[Josh Robbins]

It.

[Andrew Schlecht]

It got pretty physical.

[Esperahenny]

It did. Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Well, this is a rivalry, and I think that when you look at the spurs and you listen to Victor Wyama in the post game, which, by the way. All right, I might be in love with Victor Wyama. Okay. I'm just going to admit it. The guy has perfect answers in this press conference.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Give. Give us. Give us a taste of that.

[Dave Defore]

One of the things that he mentioned was how nice it is to be on a team like the spurs that plays ethical hoops. And I can't help but think that that's a shot at the Thunder.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah, it. Absolutely.

[Dave Defore]

And the Thunder are where this spurs team wants to be.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

No, look, it's.

[Esperahenny]

It's one of those things where he knows, he understands the messaging, and he was like, look, it's so great. The question was, hey, are you happy to be back against the Oklahoma City Thunder? Was it like an extra little bit the fact that you're playing against them. He's like, it's just great to be back, but it's also good to be playing pure ethical basketball that is intended.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Wemby's part of the problem now.

[Dave Defore]

Oh, no.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Wow.

[Esperahenny]

Look, I mean, I think that is an incredible answer. He had a lot of great answers.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah. Again, if you, if, if you are a fan of spurs, definitely go and watch this interview because I think it's pretty telling. And then the other guys, de' Aaron Fox talked about this. Victor Womenyama, that guy's a gamer and he wants to play.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Right.

[Dave Defore]

Like this is. And I know that we are exist.

[Esperahenny]

In this six man of the year.

[Dave Defore]

This league that the stars sometimes feel like they don't want to play. And he's apparently been just chomping at the bit, hoping for a chance to be able to be healthy and come back. And it showed, I mean, the intensity that he had the first possession of the game. I mean he comes in and he immediately gets an offensive rebound. Actually first 36 seconds or so, he has two offensive rebounds, a defensive rebound, a put back and an assist. And you're just saying, okay, well that guy has solved basketball again. But the spurs, you know, like they got the lead late in this game with him on the bench.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

And the way that they staggered his minutes, he was there for the close and I just felt like with about two and a half minutes left, it felt like the spurs were going to win the game.

[Esperahenny]

I think they, they found a recipe to win without him too. Not that they will be able to do it consistently, but in minutes, in spurts, they're able to get offense like you saw it in their stretch without him. Over the first 12 games that he was out nine and three. Yeah, offensively they figured out what they could do. Devin Vassell shooting the ball very, very well. Harrison Barnes knocking down his threes. But also on top of that, Steph Castle getting to the rim. The Aaron Fox getting to the rim hit ahead. Passes have been huge for them. Running in transition, being physical. It was fun because Steph Castle pregame talked about, postgame actually talked about how defense is non negotiable for them. Aggression defensively is non negotiable for them. For them to use that to get out in transition, run offensively. I mean this, this team is finding an identity without Wemby to.

[Dave Defore]

Let me ask you this, how many teams can you, can you count on one hand? It's going to be one hand that can get that many paint touches from Guards.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

On penetration against the Thunder, this is.

[Esperahenny]

By the way, the answer is the Oklahoma City Thunder. That's the other team. Because it's sga. Who's the best?

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

That's what I want to ask you, Andrew. Like, even coming into this game, I. I already knew I was excited for this game, especially after watching the Lakers game, because of how well they matched up and just their speed. We saw the Slash brothers, and of course, the Slash brothers has been this. Maybe Stefan Castle, dear Fox. Maybe de' Aaron Fox, Stefan Castle and Dylan Harper. Now, you got in Devin Vassell in that mix. But going into this game, I was like, this is gonna be such a great matchup because of these. This guard play and the defensive aspect of these games. But, like, what do you feel like it felt like for OKC to kind of look in the mirror tonight and get to play against the Spurs?

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, they hadn't really played against a team that was this competitive.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And that. That has this much size on the wing. I think that was a huge part of it, is that there's so many disruptors throughout the spurs roster that they weren't quite ready for it. And so I think that once they got up 16, I feel like maybe they, like, took their foot off the gas a little bit. Like, the attention to detail wasn't quite there. They thought that they were it. They had a similar feel to most games.

[Esperahenny]

Right.

[Andrew Schlecht]

They were just going to kind of coast to another win. And the spurs, once Wimby got in the game, it was life for them.

[Zena Keda]

What did you say? In the sand? This exact same palpable difference.

[Esperahenny]

It was a palpable diff. Now I can't talk. It was a palpable difference in the arena.

[Dave Defore]

Right.

[Esperahenny]

It was a majority spurs crowd.

[Dave Defore]

I would say probably rodeos in town, in case you guys didn't know that.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, we like rodeos, too. All right.

[Dave Defore]

I was about to say Oklahoma does the rodeo.

[Andrew Schlecht]

I mean, the spurs fans traveled and they were loud.

[Esperahenny]

Yes, they were really loud.

[Dave Defore]

Nobley Jersey in the crowd here. I mean, there was a guy with the coyote hat. The spurs were here.

[Esperahenny]

There was actually a picture of. To your point about Slash brothers Steph Castle, de' Aaron Fox and Dylan harbor in the step brothers picture.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

Classic step brother.

[Dave Defore]

Somebody like, homemade. Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Everyone was clearly here to see the new spurs mascot, Sarah Van.

[Dave Defore]

Oh, what was that?

[Andrew Schlecht]

What was that?

[Dave Defore]

Cerave is a lotion.

[Zena Keda]

They have a.

[Esperahenny]

They have like.

[Zena Keda]

I don't know what Sarah V. And I don't know if it's Spelled like Sarah that we know or like they do.

[Esperahenny]

It's C. It's both.

[Dave Defore]

Yes.

[Andrew Schlecht]

With a scene.

[Dave Defore]

And I, I. They made this mascot play defense, and I really thought we were gonna see a mascot tear their Achilles. You know, like, injuries are way up this year and capture mascot going down would just be.

[Zena Keda]

I'm sorry. To derail us.

[Dave Defore]

No, no, it's okay.

[Esperahenny]

All right.

[Dave Defore]

Speaking of derailing, I do want to derail us just a little bit because this game was awesome. It was a great game.

[Zena Keda]

Wait, before we get to that.

[Dave Defore]

Oh, sorry.

[Zena Keda]

I just really want to quickly say it was interesting to hear of the Slash brothers in post game. I asked Devin Vassell, like, what does practice look like for you guys to be pushing each other this way, et cetera? He was like, what's funny that you mentioned is that we haven't practiced together. The four of them had not practiced together yet.

[Esperahenny]

They haven't been healthy.

[Dave Defore]

First game that they've all been healthy.

[Zena Keda]

That's crazy to think about that.

[Dave Defore]

Okay. See also.

[Esperahenny]

No, they were missing Isaiah Joe.

[Dave Defore]

They're still missing Isaiah Joe.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah. So would have made the difference.

[Dave Defore]

Would have made. I mean, every single player on. On the Thunder might be a star, so maybe it makes a difference.

[Zena Keda]

Can I.

[Esperahenny]

Can I actually ask you this? So J Dub hasn't been all NBA J Dub yet, which is fine because the hand and everything. Like, he's still getting back up to shape.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

I thought he struggled tonight, especially against the length shot. Talk about the wings. But what, what did he say post game? If he talked.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, I, I didn't talk to him post game, but his wrist is still obviously bothering him. Like, his handles.

[Dave Defore]

You see him during games. He's wrapping it a lot. He's la.

[Andrew Schlecht]

He had ice on it after the game. I mean, there was a point here at the end of the game, he is just grabbing onto it, kind of bending over, and he's. He's hurting still.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And his. It's his handle, it's his finishing, it's his shooting. He did make a really big three that if the Thunder did win, we'd probably be talking about that three right now. But he is struggling for sure. Like, he's. He's not really close to what he was last year, and it's just going to take time.

[Esperahenny]

I was going to say. I think, I think that's part of the. This whole, like, next little phase for okc, next few weeks.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

Is getting him up and going because he. They need him so much.

[Dave Defore]

They're 24 2.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Like they get to just kind of do whatever they want.

[Esperahenny]

They're fine if they lose half their.

[Dave Defore]

Half their games. They're still probably the one seed. Yeah, it's pretty incredible what they're doing. Although I do think that the Nuggets are getting overlooked. All right, but let me derail us real quick because as good as this game was, again, the finish was awful.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Awful.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah, there's. There's too many fouls. I'm tired of watching into games come down to a free throw contest and the league has to do something because the watchability is awful. I don't get to see teams attempt threes even to tie the game up because of strategy. I understand. Listen, I'm a basketball coach. I get it. You want to win the game. And I'm not even knocking the teams for doing it. Although the spurs, even Mitch Johnson said Popovich was anti fouling up three ethical hoops. Is fouling up three ethical? I don't know, Mitch. We gotta find this out. But something has to be done from the league because it's taking away from the excitement of the games. This is an entertainment product no matter what.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

And also, how about like, it's not competitive. Not just is it not fun to watch, it's a little anti competitive. It's like winning on administration.

[Andrew Schlecht]

The thing that is competitive is to. Is too foul.

[Dave Defore]

Yes, I understand. So it's two wins. But I mean, it's.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah, yeah, I hear what you're saying. It's anti.

[Josh Robbins]

Like game anti fun. But.

[Andrew Schlecht]

But it's definitely the competitive, which. All the competitive things should flow back into the game and not against it.

[Dave Defore]

That's right.

[Andrew Schlecht]

So I do think that both these coaches are uber competitive and they know exactly what they need to do. But it would be great if the league did take that away because how much fun would it have been if it's thunder or down three, we come up an opportunity. It's five even. That's what we all do.

[Zena Keda]

Jada put up a three and we were all like. But the foul had happened and it just.

[Dave Defore]

We were talking about the strategy on this. You almost have to do. It's got to be a catch.

[Esperahenny]

And league has done this though, with transition take fouls.

[Dave Defore]

Right.

[Esperahenny]

They took that away because they realized, hey, we're not getting as many fast break opportunities. We're not getting as many dunks. Old teams are just fouling to get away with this.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

You need to be able to legislate that.

[Dave Defore]

I. I think that's going to come.

[Josh Robbins]

It'd be cool.

[Dave Defore]

This is the, the only issue that we've got right now. I think it's pressing for the NBA as far as like the presentation is the end of games between the fact that it just has no respect for my time, you know, 20 minutes to finish the last minute of a game is awful.

[Andrew Schlecht]

This is not about you, though.

[Zena Keda]

No, no, no, no. According to Dave, there is going to be a meeting tomorrow with the NBA.

[Dave Defore]

I'm going to talk to them about this.

[Zena Keda]

The top of the letterhead is Dave Defore's time is being wasted. Okay.

[Andrew Schlecht]

It is the fans time.

[Dave Defore]

It is the fans.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And it is like if you're trying to introduce somebody to the game, like, hey, watch the end of this crazy game. And it's like, wait, what?

[Esperahenny]

Right, yeah. Imagine saying, hey, it's a three point game. Tune in for free throws.

[Dave Defore]

The games are crazy at the end, but it's like somebody making a tuna and peanut butter sandwich. Crazy, right?

[Andrew Schlecht]

That's.

[Dave Defore]

There's no way that's good.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Ew.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

It's not fun to watch the free throw contest anyway. The game itself was amazing. The end was just rough. But this is a.

[Andrew Schlecht]

It's tune in for mathematical strategy at the end of the game. You know, it's like what it, what it turns out.

[Dave Defore]

Well, the finer points of coaching is kind of what you get. Like you have, you know, we're all in this all the time. So I can tell you, oh, this is the right strategy. But if it stinks to watch, it doesn't matter.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Right?

[Dave Defore]

Because this is a television show. And so they already changed the rules. They changed the rules all the time.

[Josh Robbins]

Excuse me.

[Dave Defore]

They don't, they don't call travels, they don't call carries, they don't call moving screens. Just create a rule for this. Like, you know, like, it's very easy.

[Esperahenny]

People get very opinionated about this, but I think it's simple to change. Yeah, it's a very simple way to adjust this. Under 24 seconds, make it so that it's a transition. Take Val or.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

Flagrant foul, two plus ball.

[Andrew Schlecht]

I do want to spin it back to the spurs, who were awesome tonight. And if before the game you were to place a bet, perhaps with our betting partners. Bet mgm. There you go. About if, okay, A team is going to have four players, they're going to have 20 points or more. Which team is it going to be?

[Dave Defore]

You definitely would have thought Thunder.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah, you would have picked the Thunder pretty easily.

[Dave Defore]

Okay, so.

[Esperahenny]

But that's part of what San Antonio's done the last couple of weeks.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

You know, I. Like I said Steph, Castle, Devin. Like they just did this exact same thing against the Lakers.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Lakers.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

All right, fast forward. We're April May, April May. These two teams meet in the playoffs.

[Esperahenny]

Give me a playoff series.

[Dave Defore]

How scared would the Thunder be? Like, I mean, they're not going to admit it, but that's got to be a scary team.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah. I mean, I think Victor Women, Yama is a matchup nightmare for every single team.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And Alex Crusoe did a pretty good job. Possession to possession on him.

[Esperahenny]

Nice poke outs, nice blocks.

[Andrew Schlecht]

They've. They've got some work to do and it's. This is good for the Thunder to taste their own blood at this point in the season. Yeah. Because they, they've. They're not a perfect team. No, there's no perfect team.

[Dave Defore]

Right.

[Andrew Schlecht]

They have played and looked like one, but you're just masquerading as a perfect team. Like they have work to do.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And so I think it's. It's good. And they have a little bit of time off. They get to go home. They do play the Clippers on Wednesday. That. That game was going to be flexed if they made the final. Now it's not flexed. It is going to stay on that Wednesday.

[Dave Defore]

Is that a home?

[Andrew Schlecht]

So it is home. Yeah. Against the Clippers. And so they'll get time to practice, they'll get time to watch film. They actually get to like taste the sting of a loss for several days, which I think is really good competitively for a team like this.

[Dave Defore]

So they're going to roll off like another 15 game winning streak.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah, they will.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah, they probably will.

[Esperahenny]

Let me ask you guys this.

[Dave Defore]

Unless. Well, well, let's not forget they do play the spurs twice.

[Esperahenny]

Twice.

[Dave Defore]

23Rd and on Christmas Day.

[Zena Keda]

Oh, Christmas Day will be great.

[Esperahenny]

This is the question I have for everybody. How far do we think a Spurs team like this goes? Because OKC is a fun playoff series. That's interesting. Cool. I like it. But how far do you think they.

[Zena Keda]

Can health everyone's health.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Def.

[Esperahenny]

What we saw tonight. Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

I got.

[Zena Keda]

Can they get to the second round?

[Esperahenny]

Okay.

[Zena Keda]

Second round. Okay.

[Esperahenny]

What do you got?

[Dave Defore]

This team could make the finals.

[Zena Keda]

Wow.

[Andrew Schlecht]

The finals.

[Dave Defore]

Wow. Listen, I. I'm not putting anything out of the realm of possibility for Victor Womenyama.

[Zena Keda]

That's a good point.

[Dave Defore]

Nothing. That's the guy. The guy was plus 21 in 20. I mean he was by far the best player on the court tonight.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

By far.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

And we. And He. This is his first game. He's on a minute's restriction. He was rusty, clearly rusty.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Didn't know where to be sometimes.

[Esperahenny]

Mitch Johnson said he was rushed.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

And he was out of wind. The guy was wrecked.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

From a. From a cardiovascular standpoint, this team, I. I don't know, man. Like, as good as the Thunder are. And they. They proved it.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

The spurs haven't proven anything. They haven't won anything at all. This will be their first playoff run. But there's so much talent and you know, the NBA is so funny about this. Like, it. It can happen in a way that feels overnight.

[Zena Keda]

I think that Victor Wembanyama has definitely entered the stratosphere. In which the way that the warriors say, if we've got Steph, you can't count us out. The way that any team that has LeBron says, if we've got LeBron, you can't count us out. I absolutely think that Victor Wembanyama has moved into basketball court.

[Dave Defore]

Through Wemby, all things are possible. Maybe on a basketball court.

[Andrew Schlecht]

I do also think that the playoffs are so different than any other setting.

[Dave Defore]

100%.

[Andrew Schlecht]

And right now, like, the spurs probably feel like they've got 11 or 12 guys. When you get to the playoffs, it doesn't matter what your roster is. You've got seven.

[Esperahenny]

Also imagine you have to go and play this OKC team in two more days.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

That's what the playoffs is.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

A team that knows what you're gonna. Adjustments.

[Andrew Schlecht]

A team that has made adjustments. A team that did win the title. I just think that I. I'm probably closer to where Xena is. I think they can win a playoff round, but it is really tough. If you haven't been there, you've not been through it.

[Dave Defore]

This was our thing last year. It's really tough, right? It was. They haven't done it before.

[Andrew Schlecht]

They'd already lost in the playoffs once.

[Dave Defore]

And that's with this team.

[Zena Keda]

I just think that's. I think that this guy's the biggest thing that. The only reason I'm like second round is because as great as the Slash Bros. That whole cohort was, the turnovers.

[Dave Defore]

Are a real thing.

[Zena Keda]

Right. Like Stefan Castle is still finding his way in terms of how do you impact the game quickly, but not in a rush. And we know he can get to the rim. We know he can get all that stuff done. But it's just if you've got someone scouting him and you've got a veteran guard defender on him, they can get in his head, I think. And there's possibilities there. And you saw the same thing with Dylan Harper. Dylan Harper had some turnovers as well. So I just think that in a circumstance, like, I mean, who would they match up with? Like if they matched up against Denver or someone, someone that's just got a little bit more veteranship that's been there before, that knows how to disrupt in a way that's not necessarily just aggression. It's just like we know this guy likes to.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah, yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Jump pass.

[Esperahenny]

Right. This is a seven game series.

[Dave Defore]

I don't think this is the final scene today. Right.

[Zena Keda]

But sure, by the time a ceiling.

[Dave Defore]

On what they're doing over the second.

[Zena Keda]

Half of the year could be crazy.

[Dave Defore]

They are building games.

[Esperahenny]

They are building a team that will get the respect of the Oklahoma City. I think they already have the respect. This is the next City Thunder.

[Dave Defore]

Seven years of the NBA. Exactly. These two teams.

[Esperahenny]

This rivalry is what we're going to see for the Western Conference for the.

[Dave Defore]

The next five years.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Unless they trade Victor 1 Binyamin in the middle of the night to the Lakers then for Anthony Davis. Because we thought the same thing about the, about the Dallas Mavericks. But I do think you're right. I think that, that this is going to be like the rivalry and it's going to be awesome in the Western Conference. This is a great preview of it.

[Zena Keda]

The mirror. Look how many. I mean, just think about it. All we said last year was just like all the treasure trove of guards. The treasure trove of talent. I'm looking at the spurs bench and Carter. What's Carter Bryant just sitting there.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Salivating, wanting to get it. Like, you know, I mean there's, there's so much talent that hasn't even been unlocked on that bench. Yeah, absolutely.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Well, Jeremy Sohan's getting dnt.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Jeremy Sohan, like, okay, rightfully, he's just, he's a big.

[Esperahenny]

He's a big.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Can I take a second to also.

[Zena Keda]

Just give love to Luke Cornett?

[Josh Robbins]

Oh, yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Because you talk about like people that impose their will out on the floor. Luke Cornett is not somebody that I'm necessarily like feeling like I'm gonna be intimidated by. But he does that somehow. Like, he does set a tone of. You're not gonna come in here easily. Right. You're not gonna make sure you're not gonna get by my guys and then get by me easily. And I just think that when you have Victor still working on getting his breath back out on the floor, having him out there and not being a complete open door to the basket is huge.

[Andrew Schlecht]

It's a spurs dad credit 1000 first.

[Esperahenny]

Front office because the way that they built in the summer knowing they wanted to be competitive was one double big lineups with Luke Cornett, Shout Out, French Vanilla. The other what? That's their nickname. They have a lot of Nick the ball handling. We need extra ball handling.

[Dave Defore]

The three guards sticking with Dear and Fox, which a lot of people said, hey, maybe they should flip Fox because they got Dylan Harper. I've never heard a team complain that they have too many guys that can get to the paint.

[Andrew Schlecht]

No off the draw.

[Dave Defore]

I mean to your point about like.

[Esperahenny]

How far this team can go.

[Zena Keda]

What.

[Esperahenny]

Is the thing that they lack other than experience?

[Dave Defore]

It's experience is the biggest thing. And then I mean they've got to shoot the ball.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Really well.

[Josh Robbins]

Right.

[Dave Defore]

Like this come playoff time, like they've got to be super consistent shooting the ball. This is why champagne gets so much run with these guys.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Consistency.

[Zena Keda]

He struggled tonight.

[Dave Defore]

Zena brought this up a few a few nights ago on the show where she talked about how you know Dylan Harper coming back. It puts Vasel in this interesting position tonight though I think we saw this is why Vassell is going to get so much run. Number one, he's going to take every three that comes to him. Number two, the defensive intensity.

[Zena Keda]

He became three and D. Exactly. He became a three and D solid guy. And that that's interesting because I wouldn't have put Devin vassell in the 3 and D category. But that is how you get minutes. You stay on the floor and he played well.

[Esperahenny]

Defense man.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Hey, Andrew Schlecht here. This Tuesday at 8:30 Eastern it's the Emirates NBA Cup Championship game on Prime. This year's quest for the cup has delivered incredible moments and jaw dropping highlights and they've been building toward this. The final two teams. I am so pumped for the NBA cup here at the NBA Daily. We will be there live in person ready to take in the cup, ready to respect the cup. And what's been really fun is that the players have been very motivated this year to win this thing and they have multiple teams have expressed this and you can see it through the competition and I cannot wait to see it live in Las Vegas. The Emirates NBA Cup Championship game. Live from Las Vegas Tuesday night at 8:30 Eastern on Prime. And if you're not a Prime member, that's not a problem. Sign up for a 30 day free trial to get started today. The Emirates NBA Cup Championship game this Tuesday at 8:30 Eastern only on Prime. Restrictions apply. See Amazon.com Amazon prime for details. What if sports were traded like markets? Now you can put your sports IQ to work in real time with Robin Hood Prediction Markets. It's not you against the house, it's you participating in a live market. You can buy or sell your positions live all game long. Use your sports knowledge in the moments that matter. Robinhood Prediction Markets changes the game. It's people moving the action so when momentum shifts, you can move with it. I always knew the game, but I never had a dynamic way to apply the knowledge. Now I can actually take part. Live in a market powered by people, you're no longer just a spectator. Play by play, you decide. Trade every play with Robinhood now available across the U.S. download the Robinhood app now to begin Future and cleared swaps Trading involves significant risk and is not appropriate for everyone. Events contracts are offered by Robinhood Derivatives llc, a registered futures Commission merchant and swap firm. As a small business owner, you don't have the luxury of clocking out early. Your business is on your mind 247 so when you're hiring, you need a partner that works just as hard as you do. That hiring partner is Linked in jobs. When you clock out, LinkedIn clocks in. LinkedIn makes it easy to post your job for free, share it with your network and get qualified candidates that can manage all in one place. I've been in a position where I need to hire many times and I never had the luxury of having LinkedIn jobs help me. As a user of LinkedIn jobs now I find it incredibly easy to find the most qualified candidates. Here's how LinkedIn jobs works. Number one post your job. LinkedIn's new feature can help you write job descriptions and then quickly get your job in front of the right people with deep candidate insights. You can post your job for free or you can pay to promote promoter jobs. Get three times more qualified applicants. Number two get qualified candidates and at the end of the day, the most important thing to your small business is the quality of candidates. And with LinkedIn you can feel confident that you're getting the best. Based on LinkedIn data, 72% of small businesses using LinkedIn say that LinkedIn helps them find high quality candidates. And finally, share it with your network. You can let your network know that you're hiring. You can even add the hashtag hiring frame to your personal profile and get two times more qualified candidates. Find out why more than two and a half million small businesses use LinkedIn for hiring today. Find your next great hire on LinkedIn. Post your job for free at LinkedIn.com Athletic MBA that's LinkedIn.com Athletic MBA to post your job for free. Terms and conditions apply.

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[Michelle Bernstein]

Hi, I'm Michelle Bernstein, an award winning.

[Dave Defore]

Chef, restaurateur and mom. I have a lot on my plate.

[Michelle Bernstein]

Including my psoriatic arthritis symptoms. That's why I was prescribed Cosentix. It helps me move better.

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[Sequoia Capital Host]

We all remember the choices that shaped the course of our lives in business. World renowned venture capital firm Sequoia Capital calls them Crucible Moments. Their podcast brings you inside the pivotal decisions that define some of today's most influential companies Hosted by Sequoia's Roelof Botha Crucible Moments Season three pulls back the curtain on the untold stories behind companies like Stripe, Zipline, Palo Alto Networks, Klarna, supercell and more. Hear about the make or break decisions, early stumbles and leaps of faith that turn scrappy startups into market defining forces. Once you're caught up on season three, check out some of the episodes from seasons one and two with guests like Steven Chen of YouTube, Tony Xu of DoorDash, Steve Huffman of Reddit, Brian Chetzky of Airbnb, and more. Tune in to Sequoia's new season of Crucible Moments to discover how some of the most transformational companies of the modern era were built. Crucible Moments is available everywhere you get your podcasts and@Crucible Moments.com go listen to Crucible Moments today.

[Dave Defore]

Derail the show just as a live stream. Who cares? Josh Robbins if has just joined us on the court and he's going to take a but I'm going to try to get Josh into the show as we move on to talk about the early game, which was not as exciting as the game in the evening. Josh Robinson, star of the NBA Daily Welcome. Welcome to the show, to the live stream.

[Josh Robbins]

We're live welcome.

[Zena Keda]

So we're happy you buttoned up. There you go. Right.

[Josh Robbins]

Can't show the credential.

[Dave Defore]

That's right. So the magic, I'm assuming the planes already left. They're on their way back home.

[Josh Robbins]

Must be, they must be somewhere over, what, Colorado now?

[Dave Defore]

Maybe.

[Zena Keda]

Maybe.

[Dave Defore]

I don't know when they left.

[Josh Robbins]

What?

[Esperahenny]

Did you by any chance get any sort of update on Jalen Suggs? Because he did leave with an injury.

[Josh Robbins]

I did. And I can just tell you that he had, he struggled to even rise from his chair in the post game locker room. Got showered and dressed. Teammate had to help him up. He was that sore, he was that stiff. Which is not to say he has a severe structural injury, but he took some really hard falls.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah, that one where he landed on his back and he laid there for a minute. I, I thought it was a back thing. But then he got, he got up and he was kind of working that flag.

[Josh Robbins]

It was his hip with about 35 seconds left in the second quarter. And then he collided with Carl Anthony Towns right over on that end midway through the third quarter. And hey, I, I'm probably irresponsible to make a guess, but it looked like kind of a hip pointer. Yeah, a severe hip Contusion.

[Zena Keda]

It's worth saying. He also had 26 points at that point.

[Dave Defore]

He was. He was awesome.

[Zena Keda]

Assistant. Unbelievable performance out of Jalen Suggs.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah. And he just could not move. He was already limited heading into this because he hurt his groin.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

Last Sunday against the Knicks, coincidentally at msg. And he just could not stick with Jalen Brunson tonight because of that. And it, you know, hurt his spirit that he wasn't at his.

[Esperahenny]

So what'd you think of the game overall? I mean, obviously, Knicks kind of took things away in the second half. Jalen Brunson was awesome. It felt like the Magic had something going in the first half with their pace and how they were playing with their guard play. What were your impressions of the game.

[Josh Robbins]

Overall for the first, what, eight minutes or so? Their offense never looked better. Yeah. Yeah. But it was fool's gold. That's a team that's predicated on its defense. And when the going gets tough and a game slows down, that's not when they're at their best. At least not at this stage.

[Dave Defore]

Right.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

Need to get stops. They need to get turnovers. They got neither of those for the most part tonight. And the Knicks look like a sharp team, like a razor sharp. No cut glass.

[Esperahenny]

Incredible.

[Dave Defore]

I don't think either team played much defense in this game.

[Zena Keda]

Really quickly, I'm going to interrupt and be the TV person here. The score was 132 to 120, New York Knicks. That's very important. And Jaylen Brunson was able to drop 40 points. Brunson had four of that 132. Significant. Just, you know, we haven't mentioned the score yet. We went right into Jalen.

[Dave Defore]

Someone has to be professional. Luckily, we have.

[Zena Keda]

I try, but keep going. Sorry.

[Dave Defore]

Making it so, you know, the. This game, I. I felt like there was a lot of intensity. You know, maybe it's because they just played a couple days ago. Maybe it's because Desmond Bain threw that ball, was playing dodgeball with OG Anunoby. I don't know. But it did feel like there's a little bit of. Maybe it's animosity or maybe it's just really intense competition between these two teams. But is this something where, like, Orlando, they look at this as like a measuring stick game and they got. I mean, they got handled. Like, how do you think they feel coming out of the this?

[Josh Robbins]

Well, they're not happy. They're not happy. They. They feel like this was something that they can learn from. However, the lesson should have been clear. To them from the beginning. The lesson is they're a defensive team. They didn't play much defense. However, Jalen Suggs, their best perimeter defender, hurt. Right. Anthony Black, two early fouls which their coach called touch fouls. And Jamal Mosley said that that took away a lot of their physicality and it showed the whole game long.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

And they're without Franz Wagner, who's.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

Maybe their most versatile defender. Yeah. And their best driver. And they missed. They missed him badly. They missed him badly.

[Dave Defore]

I mean, Suggs was able to get out in transition. That was where they had their best success offensively, was just trying to like basically just run the Knicks down. But the problem was they were giving it up the same way on the other end.

[Zena Keda]

There was no perimeter defense and then the back door cuts were killing them.

[Josh Robbins]

Yes.

[Zena Keda]

New York Knicks just kept finding ways to get back doors.

[Josh Robbins]

Loop cuts.

[Zena Keda]

The loop cuts. Exactly. And it wouldn't be so bad if you had someone in the back line of that defense.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

But I'm actually very excited for Nick spurs, by the way, as sort of a segue to this. Like, think of the offensive firepower of the Knicks and what we just saw the spurs do defensively to the Thunder. That seems like a nice head on collision for the Finals. Especially because the Knicks look even better offensively than they did last year. I think the pace that they play out. We talked about the place earlier.

[Dave Defore]

Well, Mikhail Bridges looks like he knows what he's doing.

[Zena Keda]

They're running drills coming up the court.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Like.

[Dave Defore]

Well, there was a. There was one possession where they had. It's two passes in a layup.

[Zena Keda]

That's what I'm saying.

[Dave Defore]

Right off a turnover. Two passes in a layup, which I don't know if the Knicks did that five times last season.

[Esperahenny]

A lot of ISO ball last year. And look, they have two of the best isolation guys in Cat and Jalen Brunson. But now it's, hey, we're moving the Rock a little bit more. We're pushing in transition and at the same time we're those, those little back door cuts that they could find. That's another source of offense.

[Dave Defore]

But you see the Knicks all the time. You cover.

[Esperahenny]

You've seen them a lot of the.

[Dave Defore]

Orlando feels that way.

[Josh Robbins]

Does.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah. Where do you, where do you put them in the Eastern Conference? Like, are they the best team that you've seen in the east so far?

[Josh Robbins]

I think they are the best team in the East. I regard Detroit very highly with how hard they play.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Right.

[Josh Robbins]

I don't think they have the depth or the overall offensive firepower to compete with the Knicks. I don't.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

I don't know what's going on with the Cleveland Cavaliers. They're not who they can be.

[Zena Keda]

We have questions as well, but you.

[Josh Robbins]

Saw tonight, and we've seen over the last week, that OG Anunoby, when he's playing and he's healthy. Oh yeah, he transforms. That Knicks team, most underrated defender in the league. Well, not within the league.

[Zena Keda]

And also maybe a three point corner, three point shooter as well.

[Josh Robbins]

Huge. So, so true. One of the most underrated players in the league, period.

[Dave Defore]

I would. Yeah. I mean, the rim protection that he provides is what allows the Carl Anthony Towns, Jalen Brunson pairing to tread water defensively. Yes. Because what we saw in this game, I mean now to a certain degree, I think Orlando took themselves out of their offensive rhythm by attacking Jalen Brunson so much. This happens a lot. I mean, you saw this. I mean, might remember like the Wizards used to do this when they would go against the Boston Celtics when they had Isaiah Thomas all the time, Bradley Beal and John Wall would just disrupt everything to try to post this guy up. I personally, and I know it is a league where you're going to find the guy and you're going to pick on him and you're going to try to go at him, but with OG Anunoby out there, the Knicks actually now have the personnel that they can scram, switch. They can, they can get behind and have the help come. And I think that Orlando would have been better served to just play their game and try to figure out the mismatches as they came along through the flow of the offense. That's, that's my feedback on O.J.

[Esperahenny]

Whack a mole man. He really is with, with defense. He plugs so many holes. He's like that one. Duct tape meme.

[Dave Defore]

You got flex seal.

[Esperahenny]

Flex seal. That's what he does.

[Josh Robbins]

I tried flex seal on the plumbing condo. Not for me it doesn't.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah, definitely not.

[Zena Keda]

That's right.

[Esperahenny]

Well, we just lost our flex sponsorship.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

Thank you, Josh.

[Josh Robbins]

Well, I got to be honest. And by the way, the fumes on that stuff is.

[Esperahenny]

Oh, yeah.

[Dave Defore]

It's probably toxic.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Oh, God.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah, it had me, had me concerned. It's a carcinogen, I think. All right, now we're going to get into trouble.

[Esperahenny]

Now we're liable. Flex.

[Josh Robbins]

Well, there is a warning, I think, on the, on the can.

[Dave Defore]

Well, definitely in California there's a warning. Right. So we're Safe.

[Andrew Schlecht]

At any rate.

[Josh Robbins]

At any rate, Orlando, it's not at its best when it plays in the half court, missing one and a half of its best defenders. Tonight it showed.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

And New York looked like an Eastern Conference finals team. At least. At least.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah. You want to give your pick for Knicks first?

[Josh Robbins]

I still think it's going to be the Knicks, but that was an impressive game. That game had a lot of. A lot to it.

[Dave Defore]

Let me ask you, you were in the. You were in the post game press conference with us after the spurs game. What do you think about Victor Wemanyama's just presence in that sort of environment? I like. I'm extremely impressed with this guy.

[Esperahenny]

Talking about aura.

[Dave Defore]

I am asking him a little bit about aura. The guy has like, he has a.

[Josh Robbins]

Thing when we talk about aura or charisma. That's our perception, right. Yeah. That comes from us.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

He's so impressive though, his command of English. How thoughtful he is.

[Dave Defore]

He's funny in English, which is. It's hard to be funny in the second language.

[Zena Keda]

That's very true.

[Josh Robbins]

Hard to be funny in the first language. Although if you're working with two hosts. A host like Andrew Schlicht and I don't. You guys had a net minus when he left the lineup and I came on. He's so impressive. But so are so many of the international players for whom English is their second language or maybe their third language or the fourth. It's incredible how composed they are. And for the most part, the international players are the best with the media. And a lot of us reporters wonder why is that?

[Zena Keda]

I think it's a cultural thing. I'll say this like people still read.

[Dave Defore]

Books in other places.

[Zena Keda]

I think that helps. I'll never Forget going to 18 years old, going to a house party. And I put that in quotes for those listening. Going to a house party with my cousin in Paris. And at this house party, people discussing socialism.

[Dave Defore]

Sure.

[Zena Keda]

In America.

[Dave Defore]

I've also done that in Paris.

[Zena Keda]

Yeah. Like. And I'm like, what's up with that? Healthcare, mind you. And then also playing solo cups. Excuse me, Beer pong with. Not solo cups, but rather like the cups you get to like mouthwash at the dentist. Like, that's how small the cups were. So you can imagine this game lasting beer pong.

[Dave Defore]

You know, you think you'd have better French shooters.

[Esperahenny]

I mean.

[Zena Keda]

It just. That was just. That's the cultural language is you have to come in ready to speak about various topics. If you aren't, you're looked down, you're frowned upon. And so it makes sense that they would take the time to reflect upon what they have to say and what they have to share. And knowing that that reflects upon their intelligence, their grasp of something, their, you know, their ability to communicate that. So it may, like seeing Victor respond like that wasn't very surprising for me in general. But that's not something that I think is valued in the same way in the American culture.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah, I will say I think there's something different to Wemby than even all the other international players that we look at. Like, of course, Jokic is not one to be up, out and about media wise. Giannis is very enigmatic as a personality, but I think there's a thoughtfulness to. You got to remember, Victor Weminyama is what, 21, 22?

[Zena Keda]

He's been doing this since he was like, like 15.

[Esperahenny]

He's been doing it for a very long time. He's played professional basketball. I think there's just a level of poise to him at his age that I, I don't think I've seen international or otherwise. It's. That's the part to me that's impressive.

[Dave Defore]

And it's. And he walked out. He's with the Spurs. I mean, I. Again, there's. If you're gonna. And of course, if I ran the league, there's no chance Victor Womenyama would have wound up anywhere but San Antonio. I told Andrew Schlecked I would move back to San Antonio nine months before the draft because I knew the spurs were getting that pick. There's no way that it wasn't happening.

[Josh Robbins]

So you, you're very entertaining. The three of you are so entertaining. But come on, let's just. You're not going to commit fraud. You were not. You would not have committed fraud.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Frozen envelope.

[Dave Defore]

I don't know if it's fraud or not. I would fake everything that I'd need.

[Esperahenny]

It's literally a criminal offense.

[Dave Defore]

Make sure that he wound up in San Antonio.

[Josh Robbins]

Now the most recent lottery results with Cooper Flag. Yes. And then. Or how about even Dylan Harper then go and say, sure, of course they look suspicious, but it's just that. It's just the bizarre nature of how those ping pong balls, the basketball guys.

[Dave Defore]

The best, speak to us through the NBA draft lottery. I'm just saying I would have a direct line to those basketball gods and do what they wanted ahead of time.

[Josh Robbins]

That line. You already have that line about that.

[Dave Defore]

Any final thoughts, guys, on the cup day? Because this was like a long day in the Gym for us, vibe wise, anything.

[Esperahenny]

This is. This is the take to have. This is the final time they're doing the semifinals here in Vegas. It's going at home. Home teams will be able to play those games. I think that will be a huge advantage for the teams that actually work in the group stages and in the quarterfinals to get to point differential and get home court advantage throughout the thing. One, that's huge. Two, Vegas is still trying to figure out its NBA crowd.

[Dave Defore]

This crowd actually wound up being pretty good for the second game.

[Esperahenny]

The spurs fans showed up and it.

[Dave Defore]

Was sick if it was in Oklahoma City. Yeah, this would have. This would have really felt like a special game at a different.

[Esperahenny]

Like a playoff.

[Zena Keda]

Right.

[Dave Defore]

Well, think about last year. You know, we got that OKC Cavs matchup. This kind of felt like that we had been circling. You know, we went through the schedule. I don't know how many times when are the Thunder. I almost said Spurs. When is Thunder gonna lose again? And we circled the 23rd.

[Esperahenny]

I didn't say the Spurs. I didn't say when.

[Sequoia Capital Host]

That's right.

[Dave Defore]

We were looking at the 23rd and 25th and we luck into this game with very little buildup. But it felt. This felt like a playoff game. I mean I think the atmosphere wound up good. Knicks Magic. It is. It was as dead in here as it looked on tv.

[Esperahenny]

Can you imagine a Knicks spurs cup final at msg?

[Dave Defore]

I think it would be pretty amazing.

[Esperahenny]

That'd be pretty awesome.

[Zena Keda]

Well, the finals always is gonna still be.

[Esperahenny]

I know, right?

[Andrew Schlecht]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

That's my pitch moving forward.

[Josh Robbins]

Right?

[Zena Keda]

Right.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

But I'm also thinking about just how much. How much more competitive and chippy would that Knicks Magic game have gotten in Orlando.

[Esperahenny]

Right.

[Zena Keda]

The Knicks on the road maybe.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

Going off in the way that they were. I mean I feel like it would have been especially considering the chippiness started at msg. You keep. I mean. Yeah, I think next year will be really fun.

[Dave Defore]

Having it at makes more sense and. And I actually wouldn't even mind the final being a home game and there's incentive for the team like the organization to put. To invest. You get. Get an extra home game. It's going to be a national television game and it's the cup. You know, I. I just. I don't know. We'll see what happens. I. I think this is. It's been good. But the Vegas for the final. Sure. But the Saturday thing I think is going to go or it's going to go and be better.

[Josh Robbins]

What's my thoughts thank you. I was going to interject anyway.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

My thought is the players and the team there is. That makes the game.

[Dave Defore]

Yes.

[Josh Robbins]

And the Oklahoma City Thunder were about to accomplish something early in the season that the basketball community has almost never seen. Almost never seen. And then Wemby, he's going to be the face of the league, and everybody in the world knows it. And he comes back. This just happens to be his first game back. It's an event because of that. Not because it's here in Vegas. Not because this is the NBA Cup. Although I think that adds to it. Let the lesson be it's the players who make the league.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Michelle Bernstein]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

And they. It was. It was electric because those guys are electric. The way they play, the way the Thunder are. Oh, by the way, Shay Gilgis Alexander plays with the Thunder and he's the reigning mvp. And his name hardly seems to have come up at all. Didn't even come up in the spurs press conference, which shows just how much Wemby is on everyone's mind. Yeah. Fairly or unfairly. But that was. To see those two teams go at it. That was something else. And there are going to be many, many more matchups between those teams.

[Zena Keda]

Josh, you make me think of something that is interesting. We know OKC to always be what the humble team. Always incredibly filled with humility. Oh, it was a team effort. It was a team effort. It was a team effort. What did we hear from every single person we talked to from the Spurs?

[Esperahenny]

Confidence, humility.

[Zena Keda]

It was a team effort.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Zena Keda]

They kept deferring to. Mitch Johnson was asked, what were you so proud about for Victor Webuyama? Like, what were you most proud about? He's like, I'm proud about the team.

[Josh Robbins]

Right.

[Zena Keda]

Victor Webanyama was asked the same thing. I'm just happy about the team showing up. These teams are like mirrors to each other. And it's so interesting that that also, I think, adds to the electricity that they provide is that they're both culturally a match.

[Dave Defore]

Okay. So the Thunder front office is. Was kind of birthed.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Esperahenny]

From the Spurs.

[Dave Defore]

And so when you, you know, when they're modeling their team, they modeled it after the Spurs.

[Josh Robbins]

Yeah.

[Dave Defore]

Right down to the way that. That the media is handled. I mean, every single thing about it has been. You look at hiring Mark Dagnall, like, that's a Spurs move. Everything they've done is mirroring what has been one of the best run franchises of the last 25 years in the NBA. And I think that if you're gonna. You're Gonna copy somebody. That's the one. Golden State's way harder to copy. Right. Oh, you get Steph Curry. That changed the culture there completely and.

[Zena Keda]

That changed the game.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah. And okay, but on a Steph Curry, it's really hard to do. But I think that what this, what the Thunder have been able to do in copying this person, I mean, you think other teams would maybe try to adopt a similar thing?

[Esperahenny]

I don't know.

[Josh Robbins]

Okay, so fascinating. Now we're, now we're going to go for another 45 minutes because look, let's just call it like it is.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

The spurs are who they are because they won two lotteries.

[Dave Defore]

That's right.

[Josh Robbins]

Duncan. David Robinson.

[Andrew Schlecht]

David Robinson first.

[Josh Robbins]

And now the third tremendous lottery win, Steph Castle. The last three drafts and so. And maybe they got the best talent of all with their third lottery win. Yeah. Where would they be without it? Right. Okay. Now, yes. All the people were in place to make the most out of the luck that they had. They wouldn't have gotten as far as they went.

[Dave Defore]

Right.

[Josh Robbins]

Without the smarts and everything that they've instilled. This Oklahoma City team has built itself less through luck and more through in.

[Esperahenny]

A cave, trading with a box of scraps.

[Zena Keda]

Well, being.

[Esperahenny]

Being opportunistic.

[Josh Robbins]

And also some help from Sam Presti's former.

[Esperahenny]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

Acolytes. Yeah, that's part of it. Not all of it. And then, oh, look, they land Jalen Williams at never troll because they see some qualities in Jalen Williams that the other 10, 11 teams before him. I don't know if someone drafted twice.

[Andrew Schlecht]

Sure.

[Josh Robbins]

I can't remember. Did not see. Yeah. And oh, by the way, they were more than happy to draft Chet Holmgren when they said, oh, he's too thin and all that stuff. Yeah, they recognized the gene. They had the picks or they had the players to trade to the clippers and saw SGAs being opportunistic.

[Dave Defore]

Yeah.

[Josh Robbins]

So.

[Dave Defore]

Well, all right, that's gonna do it for tonight. Thank you guys for listening. If you were on the live stream, that's great. Leave us a couple comments. Like the video. Leave us a five star review. If you listen to this podcast somewhere. For Zena Keda, Esperahenny, Josh Robbins and Andrew select, who's off here off camera, I'm Dave Dufour and this has been the NBA Daily. Thanks for listening.

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[Dave Defore]

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[Dave Defore]

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[Dave Defore]

Ask your rheumatologist about cosentics.

[Michelle Bernstein]

Guys, thanks for helping me carry my Christmas tree.

[Dave Defore]

Zoe. This thing weighs a ton. Drew, ski lift with your legs man.

[Sequoia Capital Host]

Santa.

[Josh Robbins]

Santa, did you get my letter?

[Dave Defore]

He's talking to you Bridges. I'm not.

[Michelle Bernstein]

Of course he did.

[Dave Defore]

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