← The Balance Theory
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- [00:00]
A
I won't go too far into it, but I never, ever spoke about. And I probably still won't speak about, but I'll let people know, probably for the first time, they'll hear it here.
- [00:11]
B
She turned a personal training gig into a business worth nearly half a billion dollars. From a small gym in Adelaide to Time magazine. Kayla Itzinas is not just a trainer. She is one of the most successful entrepreneurs of her generation. How have you actually diversified your wealth?
- [00:27]
A
The first thing that I did was property and then commercial property, moving into, then investments. You just don't want to have all your eggs in one basket. People read that or they see your name. We call it Kayla Tax. I remember specifically speaking to an agent to buy a house. It's a million dollars, and they'll tell you, oh, it's 10. That is a lot of money for this area. And he said, well, you can afford it. I remember the doctor coming in and saying, it would be wise to elect a cesarean because you might most likely will end up in emergency situation. Being someone in the fitness industry and being known as the queen of abs, I was like, oh, my God, what does that mean?
- [01:07]
B
I had kind of all these feelings surface around the stigma I had associated with a C section about it not being this. I'm not giving birth.
- [01:14]
A
I vividly remember having a C section, and someone came and said, oh, you took the easy route.
- [01:20]
B
If we remove fitness from your life, what do you think that you would be doing?
- [01:24]
A
People find that crazy that I'm not just a burpee either. Love that. I can go on stage and teach a strength class, but it's not all I do. I would so love to.
- [01:37]
B
All right, balancers, welcome back to another episode of the Balance Theory. Today, I'm rejoined by a guest who was with me about two years ago now. So, Kayla at Cenis, welcome back to the show.
- [01:47]
A
Thank you so much for having me.
- [01:48]
B
I'm excited to have you on because since last time we connected, a lot's happened. I've had a baby. Ended up having. Thank you. Ended up having a C section, which I know is something you've experienced.
- [01:59]
A
Absolutely.
- [02:01]
B
So there's a lot that we can unpack, some new things we can talk about, and I also want to get to know you a little bit more beyond just the fitness stuff that we talk about all the time. So I'm excited to, I guess, dive into those aspects.
- [02:12]
A
Let's do it.
- [02:14]
B
So tell me, how's your trip to Dubai been? This is your, what, third, fourth, fifth time here?
- [02:18]
A
Yeah, like, six, seven, eight, nine. I love Dubious Dubai. Every time I come, I come during the wintertime, obviously, and it's just so beautiful. It's so relaxing. Don't have the kids with me. They're being looked after by Mum. But also, like, it allows me to work as well and have a bit of a break, because it's crazy.
- [02:38]
B
Yeah.
- [02:38]
A
Where I am.
- [02:39]
B
I can imagine. And so you're here for the Dubai Active Show. So I came when you did two years ago. That's a mix of you. You know, you do. You talk on stage, you sit on panels, you run the fitness show. I've always been curious. Have you always had that confidence to be on stage? And obviously, you get interviewed a lot. Like, have you always had that confidence to speak publicly? Or is that something you had to develop?
- [03:00]
A
No, I vividly remember the first ever time I had to speak, like, publicly. And I'm talking about, like, when I'm, like, younger, younger. And I was in school and it was. We have, like, a house captain, right? And you have to go. This is like, in primary school. You have to go for a house captain. And I was. Had a piece of paper with what I wanted to say, and I remember standing up, and the piece of paper just kept shaking and shaking. And I was like. And I said, I don't know why I did this, but everyone said, look, you're gonna win. You're gonna win. Like, you're the most. Most athletic. And I scrunched it up, and I was like, I really just want to give it to. And I said my friend's name. I was like, just let her be house captain. And that was my way of getting out of speech.
- [03:39]
B
And so I assume you didn't get the color captain role.
- [03:42]
A
Listen, I didn't get it. But my next was then I didn't have to do anything. I don't remember anything other than my first interview on tv. And I had a headset placed, like, something in my ear, and I could hear people talking, and I was so nervous, and I felt like I could hear my heartbeat. And I was. I could hear me breathing. And they were talking. I said, farah, I feel like I have, like, people talking in my ear. Like, I feel insane. And they said to me, kayla, we can get. We can hear you, and we can guarantee you're not insane. I'm, like, more nervous. And then all the lights shut off, and it was just me and the camera. I was like, I hate this. And then as I've continued to grow and have, like, doing Things like this, being one on one with a person and building up that confidence, having them listen to you, oh, it is so much better than just sitting in front of a camera talking. I don't know how people do it.
- [04:31]
B
Honestly, it's. It's actually crazy when you think that talking to like, say we're talking now, right, there's a few people in the background. Or even when you're sitting on stage in like a panel format that actually feels quite comfortable versus you literally being on your own and, and talking to a camera, which is strange because you're on your own and there's no one there, like listening and judging. But I had the same experience when I started the podcast. And it's funny because it's such a important skill in today's day and age, where a lot of business is driven from online content. So you're also someone who puts out a lot of content. Both workouts. You do a lot of talking to camera. How did you get over, like, those nerves? Is it something you still feel like? Have you gotten better with it?
- [05:11]
A
Honestly, my biggest advice is like, I think the nerves come from uncertainty and like, obviously they come from a little bit of self doubt. Everyone's going to say, like, you know, think, oh, I might sound silly or I'm not good enough. But I think that the uncertainty, if you are talking about something that you're not quite confident with, you start to question what you're saying, you might stutter, you might wrap your arms around and you sort of give this vibe of, I'm not really confident, but I'll answer because you're asking me. And that's when people get nervous, because when you're sitting on a panel, sometimes, sometimes you don't know what they're going to ask you and they ask you something, you're like, oh, crap. Like, I'm not 100 confident. So you might do something like this. Whereas I've learned if you, if you stick to a knee, if you stick to a niche, people will only ask you things that you know. So I can sit shoulders back, I can answer confidence, I can laugh, I can make jokes. That's why on stage I feel really confident, because I'm like, I know, I know how to do this. It's the waiting behind stage and the nerves of, are people going to show up? Like, is this gonna be good enough? You want it to be good for them? So, yeah, it's. You slowly build up, but the more confidence you have in what you're saying, the better it becomes.
- [06:15]
B
Yeah, that's definitely, like, an important starting place. And then, like, that gets compounded. Say it is online content, right? You're putting it out there. Then if people start attacking what you're saying, that's like a whole nother level. Right. Like, you could still be confident in what you're putting out there, but then you've built up so much courage to share content, which I don't think a lot of people appreciate how hard that is to do. But there's so many people in the bandwagon of just, like, you know, coming in and writing nasty things or just being the Debbie Downer in the corner. How do you. Assuming you deal with comments like that on a regular basis, how do you kind of navigate that, in contrast with, like, your confidence of putting things out constantly?
- [06:55]
A
I think right at the beginning, I was really confident with what I was doing. That when I used to get upset or angry is if someone would say something like, you know, for example, if I posted a transformation photo and they would say, she looked better before, I would, like, automatically want to jump to a defense or. I noticed it a lot with. When I became a mum and I would say something online and everyone would be giving their opinions. And I vividly remember having a C section, and someone came. Actually came up to me in person and said, oh, you took the easy route. And I was like. And then those comments would circulate online as well. And I'm like, that's. It's just so hard to not say anything. And also, I think it's really difficult in this day and age when people are able to. For example, anyone could grab this piece of content, stitch it, take out a few words here and there, make a piece of content, and within. If you say something with enough certainty, I'll look like the bad guy.
- [07:57]
B
Yeah. Out of context, you can still.
- [07:58]
A
It can be out of context. And that's really, really hard to deal with. And I think that's why a lot of people refrain from doing podcasts, which are recorded like this, for example. I'm waiting for someone to do it, because they will. They'll grab a piece of content, they'll stitch it, and it's absolutely nowhere near what you were saying.
- [08:18]
B
So how do you, like, navigate that in terms of yourself personally? Because it's, you know, whether it's a comment or people going to the extent of stitching things.
- [08:25]
A
Like, I think if you were to sit there every single day and try to defend everyone, it would be all too consuming. Your mental health would absolutely plummet. And you would lose focus on what your mission is. So it's really a case of, as much as it sucks, ignoring it and sticking to what you know, what you're confident with and your niche and what you love. It's almost like when I talk about food, I'm like, add good stuff in. Don't try and remove stuff. Like, don't try and take out your battery life trying to defend things that you didn't actually even say. Just start adding in good things, stick to, like, what your goals are, and everything just gets a lot easier.
- [09:05]
B
I think that's nice advice, especially, like, whether you're someone listening who wants to start doing content, or maybe they already have, like a bit of a following. Like, really, whether you have a hundred followers or 100 million, like, doesn't matter. Sticking to your mission and, and just doing what you do will connect with the people that it's meant, you know, you what I learned early on because I used to get, like, personally attacked because obviously, like a podcast, you can watch many podcasts, but the reason you stick to a particular podcast is you might have an affinity for a particular host or the style or anything. So I used to take things really personally. But at the end of the day, you can't make content for everyone. Not everyone's your customer, not everyone is your audience. Not everyone is your target market. It's like you're going to connect with. It's going to land with the people that align with you, and there's not going to be everyone. So you just have to accept that.
- [09:48]
A
I feel, and I think that's really hard. I think also as a person, I'm sure you're the same is you don't like when people don't like you because you like you. And so if someone doesn't like you, like, oh, why? And you really want to delve into, oh, why don't you like me? And it is really difficult. And you are right, you do have to just understand that that person isn't your consumer. Not everyone can like you. Everyone has their own opinion. They're entitled to their own opinion. And you don't need to sit there trying to sway and change their minds 100%.
- [10:19]
B
So you brought up the C section, which is something I want to chat to you about. I actually don't know your birth stories, but were they elective or was it something that happened in the moment?
- [10:28]
A
No. So they were elective. So won't go too far into it, but I lost a baby before I had Ana, which I never, ever spoke about. And I probably still won't speak about, but I'll let people know, probably for the first time. They'll hear it here and then from there. Having had Anna, I was very, very paranoid that I was going to lose Anna. So I knew she was a girl, and I would go every single week to get scanned to make sure she was okay. And the doctor's like, you don't have to do this. Like. And I was like, no, no, please. Like, I need to see. And then I remember the doctor coming in and saying, now I just need to talk to you about something. And that is, like. That was the worst words that I could ever hear. I was like, no, something's wrong. And they're like, nothing's wrong. Your cervix. I hope I'm saying this right, that if something was tilted, the lighter maybe. No, no, my sir. I think my cervix was tilted. Something was tilted. And they're like. So the way that she's going to try and come out, if you're trying to do this naturally. Anyway, long story short, everything was a blur because I thought there was something wrong. And they said, listen, it would be wise to elect a cesarean because you might most likely will end up in emergency situation and being someone in the fitness industry and being known as the queen of abs, I was like, oh, my God, what does that mean? Like, does that mean I'm never going to be out of work? You know, you just lose your mind for a bit. And the doctor said to me, I've done this. I do this all the time. Like, it's going to be perfectly safe. You're going to have a healthy baby. Me in tears anyway, had the cesarean, and it was. Honestly, I just. It was beautiful. Like, I always thought, like, you know, you see all these things, people push out their baby and they get handed. It was honestly the same experience. Like, I still got to see her, I still got to hold her. It was just magical. So then the next time I had. When I had Jax, I also had a cesarean, and I honestly don't have anything bad to say other than the recovery is hard. It is very hard. But it's also hard if you have an vaginal birth and you tear. It's actually just hard in general. Sorry, I'm just on to. Let's just start there. It is just hard, the recovery. It just sucks. But we get through it.
- [12:46]
B
I want to ask you something, because I had a similar experience. Like, I was, you know, touchwood. I had a really good pregnancy. But towards the end, the baby was sitting breech, and they were like, to me, she's unlikely to move. She's not going to turn. And I'm like, no, I'm going to do all the things, did all the acupuncture, all the movements. The girl did not turn. She did not want to turn. They were like, basically, this is the safest way. Book it in. I had the same experience. It was actually a really calm morning. The experience was, like, pretty. Pretty nice. Like, it wasn't what I had envisioned for my birth.
- [13:18]
A
Like this.
- [13:20]
B
I. In the moment when I kind of had this moment to accept that I was having a C section. And this is what I want to ask you. I had a bit of. I had kind of all these feelings surface around the stigma I had, I had associated with a C section about it not being this I'm not giving birth, right? I felt like, you know, maybe what that person said to you is the easy way out. I had all these thoughts and feelings in my mind that made me feel like I wasn't. My body kind of wasn't doing something right. And I really had to unpack that and sit in the discomfort of I'm not doing it the way I thought it was gonna. Was gonna be. Did you have anything like that come up for you?
- [14:00]
A
No, I actually didn't. And I'm gonna be really honest. The way that the people, the health care professionals were around me made it seem like it was going to be the easiest thing in the world. It was an absolute breeze. The way that they talked to me about the scar, they said, listen, like, you know, people in emergency situations, like, you don't get to. Sometimes you don't get to choose what your scar looks like. They're like, because you're electing, like, you know, everything's going to be very neat. It's going to be very, like, very, very clinical. And for me, I'm a control freak. So I was like, okay. Like, I know everything. So this, for me was like, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. And everything went really, really smoothly. What happened and where I started to question myself was Anna had collagen reflux. And everyone was like, well, that's because you gave birth that way. That's why she has it. That's why she's like that. And if you had just had a vaginal birth, then she wouldn't have had colic and reflux because of all. And I was like, oh, my God, I've done the wrong thing. Like, then I remember them saying, oh, she Might be having a reaction to your milk. And I was like, oh, my God. Something that I'm doing. Something like, it's. I. And it's so much. You put so much pressure on yourself and your hormones are going everywhere and you're. You've got raging anxiety because you have just. It's just so wild. And then to have that pressure on top, it's just.
- [15:17]
B
There's, like, so much that goes into it already that you like all these excess comments, like, things like that. People don't even know what you've been through, what led, like, whether you chose it from the outset or whether there were circumstances that led you there, like, what, what. All that surfacing for me, like, made me realize at the end of the day, like, as long as baby's safe and healthy and, you know, the mom's mum, being calm is actually such a big role. So maybe before, I have to admit, like, pretty transparently, I maybe did have some judgment on people who just elected straight away I didn't understand because it was so far from, like, what I would choose for myself. But going through this and realizing there's just so many variables, even if it goes your way, it's still not, like, it's still not going to happen the way you think. It's just. It's just such a unique experience that there's. It's really just taught me to go with the flow when it comes to that. But let's talk recovery for a second. Getting up off the bed first time, like, was very hard for me personally. How did you feel in that moment when you, like, you know, you've kind of gone through it. It's been like a calmish experience. It's gone the way you thought you had your, like, tick, tick. It's all gone to plan. Getting up off the bed first time.
- [16:25]
A
The first time I got up off the bed, I cannot explain any other feeling. And I don't want to put anyone off because you just have to do it and you have to go through it. I felt like every organ in my body was about to fall out of me at once, and it was just this extreme shooting pain. And what they told me was, they said back in the day, perhaps when your mom gave birth to you, she might have stayed in bed for a few days just to, like, recover. We really encourage you to get up and. And walk and move. This is what we do now, right? So I was like, all right, like, I'm going to be able to do this. Obviously, I had so much help, but just Initially standing up, I internally screamed. And then I think it stayed like that for, yeah, a couple of days. And then the worst moment I had where I had to get up by myself and, well, Jay obviously had me each time is I just had got home and I was lying in bed, and we had just renovated our house, and I don't know, for whatever reason, there was a spider in our room. And. A spider.
- [17:32]
B
No, no, no. Rapid movements.
- [17:34]
A
And it bit me. And immediately my arm started burning and stinging and going red and swelling. And I was like, you're joking. I have to get up. I was like, I have to get up. I'm like, waking J up. Jay, he's like, push me up. He has absolutely no idea what's going on. He's thinking, there's something wrong. I'm like, a spider's been. I was like, this is going chaotically. I just want to rest. So I'm dealing with a spider bite. Stitches, pain. It's just wild.
- [18:00]
B
Well, that's a lot. What kind of spider was it?
- [18:02]
A
I have no idea.
- [18:03]
B
To be burning like, it's.
- [18:05]
A
I have absolutely no idea. An Australian spider.
- [18:07]
B
Yeah. People freak out about this is, like, what they think everyday life is like in Oz. I can meet so many people here.
- [18:13]
A
I've never been bitten by a spider before, and I get bitten like that when you're.
- [18:16]
B
When you're recovering. Um, you know, for me, it was pretty similar. Like, getting up was just this moment of. I've never not had any core strength. Like, you know, that first moment, you're like, there's nothing there. Like, I'm actually not supporting myself right now through my core. Yeah, that was a bit of a wow moment. It did get better every day, like, pretty quickly. But that initial 24 hours was pretty hard. Like, the first time having a shower first, I'm going to the bathroom. All of that was like a bit of a hit me in the face type moment. But you know, what was actually, like, the. I wonder if you felt this too. I thought during the actual C section, I thought I'd just be laying there, the curtain would be up. Like, I'd be numb, it'd be chill, and then I'd just get my baby. And again, I'm not trying to put anyone off. I just wish I kind of had a bit of context around what it would actually be like. Like, my body was actually moving around quite a lot. And that, like, freaked me out a bit. I felt like I was being handled. Obviously, they were being quite gentle and doing what they had to do to get the baby out. But, like, you feel pressure, no pain. There was definitely no pain, but I just didn't expect to be. I felt like I was being handled. Like, honestly is the only way I can describe it. And that really put me off in the moment. Did you. Were you. Did you experience anything like that?
- [19:26]
A
Absolutely the exact same thing. And, like, obviously, you have to be delusional now, looking back, thinking, how are they going to make a small incision and then just slowly get a baby out? Like, just. It's just not going to just pop out. Like. And so you don't realize that they're actually manually pushing the baby out. Like. Yes. You can't feel anything, but you feel extreme tugging. Your body's going from left to right, like you're trying to remain calm. And then I think every mother thinks this. All you are thinking in your head is, I just want my baby to be alive. Like, I just want to hear the cry. Like, you're. For some reason. And I've spoken to so many mothers. They're like, something is going to go so wrong. And they hear the cry and it just all goes away.
- [20:10]
B
Yeah, it's like that moment of anticipation.
- [20:12]
A
But you're just like, please be alive, please be alive, please be alive. And you're getting sort of, like, thrown around this table, but you can't feel anything. But it's also so uncomfortable. And then suddenly it just. Every single thing, every pain that you felt, all the reflux, the sciatic nerve pain, like, anything that you had just goes. And you're like, why? What? Like, I remember not being able to breathe the day that I had jacks because I had such bad reflux. I was like, I literally can't even lie back. Like, I was sleeping sitting up, and it just all went. And just this. It's just the most wild thing in the world.
- [20:46]
B
And then that beautiful moment that comes after.
- [20:48]
A
Yeah, the. The cry. And I remember because I had so much. I think I had a reaction to the spinal and just really, really, really. Or maybe it was the anesthetic, just the real, real shaking. Like, I had this extreme shaking. I remember saying, I'm gonna drop him. I'm gonna drop him, because I put him. And, like, I didn't even have him. He was wrapped up. And Jay. Jay really had him. And I was like, I'm gonna drop him. And just chaotic. In that moment, I think it really takes two days before you're like, ah, I've had a baby. Yeah, After a cesarean. And I got so jealous of my friends, one of our friends, they had a baby at home.
- [21:22]
B
Oh, beautiful.
- [21:23]
A
And they were just on the couch watching movies. Like, it was all just, like, done. Like, I was like, no way. You can get up and walk around. That's wild.
- [21:32]
B
I know everyone's experience is so different and, you know, like, I'm sure you feel the same way. You wouldn't change it for a second to have your kids. I just, I wanted to chat to you because I felt. I wish I had known that I would be moving so much during the surgery and, like, people just being honest about that first moment where you stand up. All in all, like, leading into it, because mine was elective and, like, we had a book date and time, I had a full night's sleep. We woke up really calm. Like, it was actually a very relaxing lead in. So, like, I felt really ready for that moment. It wasn't like a spontaneous, which, you know, some people really want that, but all in all, you know, however it happens, it's beautiful. And yeah, I just wanted to chat to you a bit about your experience there. Recovery. I'm now at the three and a half month mark, so I've literally just started training again and just gotten to that point where I feel like I can and I feel, like, empowered and strong to do so. But I have to admit, like, at around six weeks, I was like, I'm just going to go for a walk for like, my husband's like, just do 20 minutes. I'm like, okay, I'm on the treadmill. I'm feeling so good. I'm going to do 45. And he's like, no, you should have just done 20. And then I got off and it was this moment of, like, then I was in pain that. That night. So don't listen to me, don't do that. But it was this moment of like, I feel the same, but I'm actually not in the same body. It was like a very disassociating moment for me. Did you have sort of any experiences like that?
- [22:51]
A
Yep. I. I was actually really good. For some reason, I, like, really stuck to the whole, do not do anything. The doctor said do not do anything for six weeks. And I did absolutely zero. Like, I didn't do anything. The first experience on the treadmill, I walked in increments, but I remember my scar always on my right side burning. And I was like this. I did have the exact same moment. I'm like, this isn't. This isn't old me. This is like new me. And so I Just hate the language of, I don't know, if you ever hear people saying like, oh, you know, you're not going to bounce back the same, or bounce back or those words. I'm like, you're not, you're actually not the same person as you were before. You are a whole, you are building from scratch, a whole new you. You have different responsibilities, you have different priorities. You have a whole different body that has just birthed a child. Like, that is so amazing. And then you're, you're at zero and you just get to build back up. And I think I'm more proud of my body now than ever. And you will be too, obviously. Three months is so early, like, so early. But like you, anything you do now, you'll be extra proud of yourself because you've prioritized your health and your wellness. Like, if you even go to the gym once, you're like, I did it.
- [24:12]
B
Yeah. Oh yeah. Productivity means something very different these days. But no, it's nice to finally be getting back into it. And, and like, what you said, like starting from scratch, like, I did have to sort of rebuild my core from scratch, but I actually feel like any inefficiencies I had before, maybe I was stronger on one side or actually using my core properly, like having to actually go back to basics and start with deep breathing and learning to brace again. Like, I actually feel like I'm rebuilding on a stronger ground.
- [24:38]
A
I mean, I really love that.
- [24:39]
B
So it's, it's actually been a really nice experience for me. After I got over the fact that I was like trying to get back. Like, I was just itching. I was like, I just want to move. Like that makes me feel so good. But it's been really nice now and I'm starting to like, build it up.
- [24:51]
A
So I think women would love to hear that.
- [24:53]
B
Yeah, no, you really get the opportunity to rebuild yourself. And like, if we're talking about confidence, like having confidence in your body for what it's just done, like, you just honor it in a completely different way. So, yeah, none of that bounce back culture here. We're like rebuilding and like learning ourselves, which is really nice on this topic. You know, there's obviously a lot of advice out there for women in fitness, people that are pregnant and training. What do you think men specifically get wrong when it comes to giving females advice on fitness, especially in pregnancy?
- [25:26]
A
If I'm looking for advice about pregnancy or post pregnancy, I'm looking for advice from the experts. And the only expert that I really truly see in this field is someone who is fully experienced pregnancy and post pregnancy and that is a woman. So I think that is nice if a male can help in any way, but with advice. I want to be so careful with what I say. But if I am taking advice, it's from a person who's had a baby.
- [26:04]
B
So do you think that because, you know, obviously you can get qualified in like pre and postnatal training.
- [26:10]
A
That's so nice. You can get qualified in anything.
- [26:13]
B
So do you think then that irrespective if you're a female or male, if you haven't gone through pregnancy, then you're not someone that you would go for specifically?
- [26:22]
A
I think when it relates to this topic and which is pregnancy, I would be taking advice from someone who has definitely had a pregnancy and understands what that means. Yeah, for sure. I'm like, I am being very careful as I answer this because I don't want to put anyone down. There are specialists in this field that are male, that are doctors. I understand that. But I think that when it's fitness advice and you're consuming fitness content, especially if you're on social media like Instagram, Tick tock, it would be wise to perhaps take advice from someone who's actually had a kid.
- [26:56]
B
If you are as well, you're just saying where you would seek advice from. Not to say that one is more.
- [27:02]
A
And I'm not saying you can't have a male trainer postpartum who can take you through postpartum exercise that have been approved by a doctor for sure. But it's specific advice.
- [27:13]
B
Yeah.
- [27:14]
A
Think like. And I just remember, like, even when I didn't have kids, me trying to give advice to or me even like I would say like, why, why are you late to your session? And they're like, oh, you know, the kids. It's like all the kids. Like, I'll just ignore the fact now I'm like, oh my God, the kids. I get it. Like even that sort of stuff, like, you just have to kind of get it, like be a parent.
- [27:33]
B
Yeah, yeah, I get it. I want to change topic a little bit now. Obviously you've built like an incredible business with sweat. You started off pting, you've built it now to an online app with like millions of downloads. But beyond that, how have you actually diversified your wealth in other, in other avenues, like outside of. Because. And the reason I want to talk about this is, you know, it's one thing to build a successful business, but then it's like, how do you make your money work for you and I feel like a lot of people wait until they've made the money to start thinking about those things. But I think it would be really interesting if you're, if you're open to being transparent with how you've diversified your wealth just for other people to get an idea on, like, what even are the options, you know, to do.
- [28:15]
A
So I think the first thing that I did was, I think it was a safe option was things like property. So starting with just residential property then, or like renovations and then commercial property, moving into, then investments. You just don't want to have all your eggs in one basket. And I think it's really hard, especially now with a saturated fitness industry and an app. You know, it might not always be there, it might not always work. And I think so when you're starting something, if there is an opportunity to be able to put your money somewhere else. And so many people are doing way cooler investments. They're doing bitcoin and there's crypto and there's all this. I would love to. I feel like I'm almost like so far past that I can't even like, go back to. And I shouldn't say that. For me, it was property and commercial property that I think is. Has been really, really awesome. But also I ended up getting an amazing wealth management team as well that can help me with really good investments as well. And it's really good to have people like that on your team, not just doing things willy nilly.
- [29:18]
B
Yeah. I was just going to ask, like, do you have someone that personally like or manages like a portfolio for you? Because it's hard to know. Like, I mean, I work in the legal investment space, so I have clients that are in crypto, commodities, property development, all of that. So I've kind of learned bits and pieces through doing that. But in terms of actually making investment decisions on how to diversify wealth, like, that's something you want to allocate to a professional.
- [29:42]
A
I believe so. And I also think, like, I make a joke with my friends that obviously, like, we have articles online that talk about finances and things like that, selling the business. And I think that when people read that or they see your name, we call it Kayla Tax. So it's like when they see it, they're like, oh, everything becomes more expensive. So you go to buy a house, which, you know, let's just say it's $1 million, and they'll tell you, oh, it's 10 because it's you. I remember specifically speaking to an agent and saying, oh, you know, that is a lot of money for this area. And he said, well, you can afford it. And I was like that.
- [30:13]
B
You're kidding.
- [30:13]
A
Rude. And I wonder if you'd say that to a male.
- [30:16]
B
You should have, like, an alias name or have.
- [30:18]
A
I do. That's why I have a wealth management team that's, like.
- [30:21]
B
It's a private client. They're, like, inquiring off of. Yeah, that would be. I mean, obviously there's a lot of perks to having the kind of reputation you have, but I suppose that would be one thing that people might take advantage of. Hey, absolutely.
- [30:33]
A
I think it's also, like, hard for. Not hard for me, but it's just interesting to see in 10 years, people still speak to me so much. And I like that you've changed, sort of like the path and how you. And the questions that you ask. Because they talk to me about fitness. What's your favorite exercises? You know, like, if you could have one food for the rest of your life, what would you have? And I'm like, that's not me anymore. And I think that. I think people find that crazy that I'm not just fitness. Just. Yeah, just a burpee. Which is, I think, still what they see me as. And it's. It's almost like when people say, when you see someone from high school, oh, you haven't changed, or you've changed so much, and they're like, yeah, that was, you know, like 20 years ago. Like, that's really weird. And I think people do that with me as well. They're like, oh, you're Kayla. You do burpees. I'm like, no, you're the PDF girl. Yeah, you're the PDF. You're the ppg. I know, and I love that. And I love that. I recognize that. I truly. I said. Even yesterday, I said, I love that I can go on stage and teach a strength class. And people come up to me and they know me as Kayla, a women's trainer and a voice for women in the fitness industry. I love that so much. But it's not all I do.
- [31:45]
B
Yeah, of course. So humor me. If we remove fitness from your life. Like, that being something that you spend your time doing, what do you think that you would be doing for, like, work or business?
- [31:57]
A
I would. I would so love to say not fitness, but I truly love it. I think, like, investing in cool things. I love supporting my friends. They have amazing brands. It's like being an investor in them, being an advisor in them, that would be something that I would do if I wasn't doing fitness. But I really love what I do. I really, really do.
- [32:23]
B
But.
- [32:23]
A
And I love my friends and I love their businesses. So that's what I would do. Yeah, like investing, advising.
- [32:28]
B
Yeah, that's cool. I've kind of thought that too like with what I've done with legal because I moved out of working for a law firm, now I'm consulting on a private basis and even to that effect, like sitting on the board level where you have like a bit of equity but you advise and then you also like can grow with, with a business, like something like that would be cool because you've obviously acquired so much commercial acumen like building not just the app but like, you know, your community, your online following, etc, so that's definitely an avenue you could go down. You can even do it in tandem with app.
- [32:57]
A
Yeah. I think like even being a advisor for just on behalf of women in, when it comes to fitness and going into things like gyms and hotels and advising and saying, you know, if I was working out here as a female, what would make me feel comfortable? And like just I love doing that sort of stuff. And I had a meeting today with actually someone that owns a hotel here and they just said, look, you're a female. What are the pros and cons of this hotel? And that's cool. Is it? And he was like, that is so valuable. Thank you so much.
- [33:24]
B
You know like Dubai is one of these cities where it's really funny, when I moved here, people would ask me questions like as a woman can you drive? As a woman can you work? I don't think they realize how kind of westernized Dubai is as a city in the Middle East. And I appreciate where that, the context of where that question comes from. But in saying that because of I guess more religious, traditional ways of men and women kind of being more separate. In one of the gyms that I train at here they actually have a women's only section for those women who prefer, you know, they might have a headscarf, they need to take it off to train, et cetera. They have female only gyms. So actually having those spaces that are just for females and then layering that on top with like what actually works in this space, what's, what's the need? Like this city would actually be a perfect place to do that kind of consulting for because there is a market for that.
- [34:11]
A
So much so. But even like Australia we, I go to a, I used to go to in Adelaide, a really, really big gym and it Was known for a body, as a bodybuilding gym and it had a women's only section. And I remember putting on my story being like, it's a women's only section. And it looked identical to the other section. It was just women's only. And I loved going in there. I felt so comfortable. We need more of this. I don't know why I feel more comfortable. I just do. I just love it.
- [34:34]
B
You know, I have this weird thing too. Like if I go into a gym and like say there's all the squat racks are taken or there's like one, I almost feel like, you know, when there's these big guys there, they're squatting heaps. I'm there with like my 60 kilo bar. Whatever.
- [34:45]
A
That's a lot still, please, whatever it.
- [34:47]
B
Is, it wouldn't be that much now. But you know, comparatively, I kind of feel like I shouldn't be taking up space here. Like, I'll leave it for the big guys type thing. Like, I have that still in my head and I've been training for years and I'm confident in the gym. So I find just being in like a separate section, like, I just feel more comfortable taking up space, which is so weird given, like, I'm actually really well versed in training in the gym. I don't get nervous going in. Yeah, it's weird that I think still happens.
- [35:11]
A
It might just be here because. And like, this is me talking up Australia. Australia is so, so amazing. The women are taking up all the space in the gym.
- [35:23]
B
That's great.
- [35:24]
A
They are like. It is, it is so boss to see that the guys just sitting there waiting while the women do that have like taking over the whole strength section of the gym. And I love that. And. But I do think there is a space for that women's only section to make them feel comfortable. And it's not just for religious reasons. I think it's just comfortability. I would love a women's only gym. I remember one gym I went to was a beautiful gym and had a women's only section and it looked like a yoga room. And I was like, this isn't women's only. You're. You've got no equipment in here.
- [35:56]
B
Yeah. Like, what do you think we're going to do in here?
- [35:57]
A
Yeah, this is a yoga studio.
- [35:59]
B
Yeah. Interesting. To close off our chat, I want to ask you a little bit about parenting, which is not something we've spoken about before. And given you've got a boy and a girl, I'd love to know Your thoughts around do you think we need to parent boys and girls differently?
- [36:15]
A
That is so interesting and something I haven't really thought about. I'm trying to think about how I parent my kids. I'm. I think I'm stricter for some reason with my son. Then I think that Anna is naturally very. And maybe this is just, this is just my kids. But she's very empathetic, she's very kind. Like she can read emotions. I remember when I, the first joke I ever made, she like hit me as a joke like on my head. I went to laugh and I went. And she started crying. I was like, oh my God. I was just joking. Like my son would never do that. So I think I'm a little bit more stricter with. Don't do that. Like we don't do that. Respect. And I think it comes from my culture. I just want him to be respectful and kind and not being so careful here. Not raised how the older generation of men were raised. Like I don't want to ever see my son sitting on a couch whilst a family of women are cleaning in a kitchen. Like I don't want to see that and I'm very conscious of that just because of how I was raised. So I think I have that in the back of my mind when I'm parenting my kids. But both my kids manners, respect and, and being kind.
- [37:39]
B
Do you think it's less about like boys and girls and more about personality and just tweaking like your parenting style to their personalities?
- [37:45]
A
Yes. Like Jax is nuts. Yeah, it is. Like honestly, my kids are amazing, I'm very lucky. But it is, it is tweaking to the personality because they are going to be who they're going to be. Like I was always going to be this. It's just. It is what it is.
- [38:04]
B
Yeah.
- [38:05]
A
What do you think?
- [38:06]
B
Well, I've only got a girl so far and my sister has a boy who they're nine months apart. He is very high energy and just from what I'm hearing again like I don't have a boy but it just feels like it might be the testosterone in the young boys that just have a lot more energy and so the things they need to do, the ways they need to expend their energy, maybe the activities they like. It feels like are going to be a little bit different to say what the girls like. I don't know if that's so much a personality thing versus like a gender based thing but I do think fundamentally as like men and women like our roles as Humans, I think, from a biological standpoint, are a little bit different, and I think that's going to overflow into the things that we need to do or want to do. So, yeah, I think as a parent, maybe there's an. There's an element to lean into that. But I do think personality is probably a little bit more important because you're going to have kids that are more curious and more reserved. Like, I've got this friend, she's got a daughter who will literally sit down and just eat, like, one rice grain at a time, and then my nephew will literally throw shit everywhere and eat off the floor. You know, like, kids are just so different. So, yeah, I think. I think maybe there is an element leaning into, like, our biology in terms of our energy levels and things like that. But overall, you want to raise, like, good contributors to society, kids that are confident to do what they want, that know your family values, that respect other people. So I guess those are core things that are going to be the same.
- [39:30]
A
Yeah, I. I want. I want this. The kids spark for as long as possible. And I. I said, like, as sad as it is, I was looking at my kids and I was, like, looking at the older kids and watching them play, and one of the older kids was really doubting herself. And I looked at my husband, I said, when do they lose that spark and how does that happen? I'm scared. Like, I don't want my kids to ever. My kids are very confident. Like, they're always. They're always talking, saying hello. Like, when did I lose that? I want them to ever lose that. Like, when does it happen? Is it school? Like, is it friends? It's. So I'm very, like, cautious and conscious. But I have a question for you, which is just out of curiosity. If you were to have a boy, you were raised, I assume, in a traditional Italian family, what do you see the differences now? Just looking generationally at your, for example, your dad or your grandpa, what do they do or not do or not do?
- [40:28]
B
Look, same thing, you know, like, my grandmother would always be the one on a Sunday in the kitchen doing everything. All the aunties, it's the same sort of thing. Very female kind of responsibility in that domain in the household. And the father's the breadwinner, and, you know, all the uncles sort of sit around, put their feet up at the end of the day. I've married an amazing man who helps me around the house. So they're going to mirror what their dad does. They're going to help out. Like, I Do most of cooking purely because my husband sucks and I don't want to eat shit food. And I actually really enjoy cooking as well.
- [41:00]
A
But.
- [41:01]
B
But, you know, like, he always helped me clean up. He'll do things around the house he needs to be told. Like, he doesn't have that eye of like, oh, there's a pile of washing here. I might just hang that out or fold it, but it does help. So I think from my point of view, they're gonna, we're gonna act as mirrors to them in terms of what a household and how it operates.
- [41:17]
A
Yeah, totally agree.
- [41:19]
B
That generation, you know, my grandparents, I've only got half of them around, but they don't live like in the same city as me, so I don't know how much exposure they'll get to that version of the household, I suppose.
- [41:31]
A
Yeah, I think I have a lot of opinions, which I won't say of people comparing their families like the older generation to today. And like, women will compare their grand grandma and their mum and their tasks to them. Men will also be like, well, da, da, da. That used to happen back in the day. I'm like, well, that isn't the case now. So your kids are going to exactly what you said. Mirror your parenting style now with the modern ways of women work. Women are powerful. Like, women have jobs, then men sometimes have to stay home. Both me and my husband work, so that's what the kids see.
- [42:18]
B
Yeah. And look, everyone's different. We're lucky to live in a time where we as females, you know, especially if you're in a privileged position, you have the choice of maybe be working or not working and staying at home. And so I think just depending on what your household needs, like that's going to be what's mirrored. If it is that dad works and mum's at home, you know that it's really hard for someone to work full time and do the housework. Like, we know that we, we're working women, working mums. So I think whatever your situation is, like, you will mirror that to your kids and, and everyone will just teach their kids what, what they want, I suppose. And no, there's no wrong or right. But for me personally, it's like we have a very shared. My husband helps me a lot. Like I definitely take on more of it. I don't mind. It's my preference. I like keeping my house a certain way.
- [43:02]
A
That's me.
- [43:03]
B
But he does help and that's important to me that my kids grow up knowing they should help, you know, or want to help.
- [43:08]
A
Yeah.
- [43:09]
B
Be forced to help.
- [43:11]
A
No. I'm just such a control freak. Yeah. I'll do everything. And then. And then my husband's like, I can't do anything because you've done it first. I'm like, I need to be done perfect.
- [43:18]
B
Yeah.
- [43:19]
A
I need to fold it this way. I need to smelled this way. I needed to everything.
- [43:21]
B
I saw these things. Like, my toxic trait is that I want my house to look like no one lives in it.
- [43:26]
A
Jay just sent me that. No one lives in us. Nobody touch anything. I saw a video of this family that I follow and the dad is. Got a blower on the kids because I've got sand on them before they walk into the house. And he's like, take your shoes off. He's blowing down the kids. I'm like, that's literally me.
- [43:42]
B
Yeah, I fully get that. All right, I got two rapid fires for you before we close off. What's one thing that everyone thinks is healthy that you think is actually not?
- [43:52]
A
My brain automatically went to like, like going like all out with your fitness journey and. Yeah. Letting it consume you. I don't believe that it's a healthy way to live your life.
- [44:04]
B
What's the. What's the better approach then?
- [44:07]
A
I don't want to say balanced, but a balanced lifestyle where you're able to have your say. You have. This is not rapid fire. I'm very sorry. But you have.
- [44:19]
B
Rapid fire doesn't have follow ups.
- [44:20]
A
You have non negotiables. Right. That you have in your day. So it's seeing your family. It might be having a coffee in the morning. It might be, you know, you're spending time with your kids. And I think you need to hit those non negotiables before you let a fitness journey consume your entire life. Because really, at the end of the day, and I just spoke about this with someone else, the most beautiful person you know is beautiful on the inside. It's not necessarily like the fact that they're shredded or they have muscles or they look like a Victoria's Secret model. It's the fact that they are so beautiful on the inside. And you're letting a fitness journey consume you because you want to physically look a certain way is unhealthy.
- [44:53]
B
Yeah. Like, if you can't enjoy your nonna's lunch on the Sunday, like, what's the point?
- [44:56]
A
Honestly? That's what I've been saying the whole time. What is the point?
- [45:00]
B
Yeah. Last one. What's the biggest lie the health industry is selling right now?
- [45:05]
A
The same thing the all out. The, the, the. I love, I love the longevity stuff, but it's like doing all of it at once. You must do it because it helps you live longer and this and that. It's like, okay, but like, also, we're women. We work, we're busy, we have kids. Like, we don't have time for a two hour gym session with an ice bath and a sauna and a red light therapy. Then we need to get a facial, our nails done, our hair done, our this and that, our toenails. And it's like, dude, I don't have enough time or money to do this. Stop. That's my rant.
- [45:37]
B
Fair enough. Well, Kayla, thank you so much for coming back on the show. It was nice to chat about a few different things and, you know, in the coming years, as long as you keep on coming to Dubai, we should keep catching up and seeing as your kids grow. As my kids grow, like what different things pop up. But it's been really nice to connect with you.
- [45:53]
A
Thank you. Thank you so much.
- [46:07]
C
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