Kimmel Returns to Late Night After Trump's Failed Crackdown

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Beat with Ari Melber

Episode: Kimmel Returns to Late Night After Trump's Failed Crackdown
Date: September 24, 2025
Host: Ari Melber (MSNBC)
Notable Guests: Molly Jong-Fast, Michael Hirshhorn, Ankush Khardori, Drew Nieporent

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Overview

This episode centers on the dramatic return of Jimmy Kimmel to late-night television after a brief suspension under intense pressure from the Trump administration’s FCC. Ari Melber explores the saga as a case study in free speech, governmental overreach, corporate capitulation, and public resistance, featuring Kimmel's triumphant monologue, expert analysis, fresh reporting on the Trump DOJ, and cultural commentary.
Additional segments offer insights on shifting media landscapes and a brief culinary culture interlude.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Kimmel’s Return: A Free Speech Flashpoint

• Kimmel was temporarily pulled off air after Disney caved to pressure from the Trump-aligned FCC to silence his criticism of the administration ([01:09]-[03:18]).
• Outcry and backlash forced Disney to reverse its decision, allowing Kimmel’s return—a "free speech win against powerful forces."

"What we saw last night—Kimmel's return—is the first time he has addressed this roiling, ongoing censorship plot, the pressure on him and his team. So this monologue crystallized a free speech win against powerful forces."
— Ari Melber ([02:36])

2. Jimmy Kimmel’s Monologue: Grace, Sarcasm, and Seriousness

• Kimmel opens with satirical compliance:

  “Disney has asked me to read the following statement and I agreed to do it… To reactivate your Disney and Hulu account…”
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([03:34])

• He reflects with gratitude and candor on ABC's history of allowing editorial independence:

  “For almost 23 years, I've done almost 4,000 shows… Even when it made them uncomfortable…they've defended my right to poke fun at our leaders… I was not happy when they pulled me off the air. I did not agree with that decision and I told them that… They welcomed me back on the air and I thank them for that.”
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([03:41]-[04:49])

• Kimmel invokes late-night history and the stakes of government censorship.

  "This show is not important. What is important is that we get to live in a country that allows us to have a show like this..."
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([08:26])

• He contextualizes the Streisand Effect: the government’s attempt to silence drew more viewer interest (6 million live, 15M+ YouTube views).

3. Cultural and Legal Dimensions

• Ari frames the incident within historical and legal precedents—citing the First Amendment and the “Streisand Effect.”

• Kimmel calls out ongoing affiliate blackouts and likens U.S. government pressure to repressive regimes:

  "I've… met comedians and talk show hosts from countries like Russia, the Middle East, who tell me they would get thrown in prison for making fun of those in power... That's not American. That is un-American."
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([08:26])

• FCC Chairman Brendan Carr’s threats are compared to “mafioso” tactics; cross-party figures (Ted Cruz, Ben Shapiro, etc.) are thanked for defending speech rights.

4. Panel Analysis: Resilience, Resistance & the Media Landscape

• Molly Jong-Fast: Applauds Kimmel for showing courage "elites" lacked; expresses hope for broader resistance to anti-democratic maneuvers.

  “It was something extraordinary because…up to now we've had this massive failure of elites…nobody has stood up, nobody has had guts until him…”
  — Molly Jong-Fast ([16:34])

• Michael Hirshhorn: Stresses "resistance works" and appeasement begets more attacks.

  “What we're seeing is working is what worked in 2016, where people got together and they were like, this is not who we are… appeasement doesn't work.”
  — Michael Hirshhorn ([17:41]-[18:41])

• Both note the media’s vulnerability as attention shifts online; defiant, outspoken moments like Kimmel’s can still rally mass support.

5. Free Speech: Laws vs Values

• The group discusses the need for liberals to reconcile support for free speech with past instances of "cancel culture."

  “We need to think through from the left what a vibrant free speech culture looks like and how we engage with people who don't agree with us.”
  — Molly Jong-Fast ([23:59])

  "Either you think peaceful speech is how we want to govern ourselves or not."
  — Ari Melber ([24:54])

• They distinguish between constitutional rights (government limits) and free speech values (social norms).

6. Trump DOJ News: Targeting James Comey

• Breaking news segment: Trump’s DOJ is reportedly preparing to indict former FBI Director James Comey, appointing a new, loyalist prosecutor over objections.
• Ankush Khardori (ex-prosecutor): Expresses doubt over the legal merits and doubts grand jury would indict knowing the overt political pressure.

  “The problem... is that it has been national news for most of the last week that Trump has been pressuring these people to prosecute James Comey... you're not going to be particularly generous to the government.”
  — Ankush Khardori ([30:30]-[31:42])

7. Other Highlights & Lighter Segments

• Brief discussion of the Dallas ICE shooting (factual update).
• Drew Nieporent (restaurateur, Nobu) shares stories of building an international restaurant empire ([36:24]-[43:47]) and weighs in on food safety, ad overload in modern life, and the cultural cachet of fine dining.
• Viral humor: "radioactive shrimp" (panel jokes about food safety, government role).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Disney was quick to fold to government pressure to oust him, only to fold again days later when the pressure in response proved mighty… Kimmel thanking his employer…thanking the public and the many people who spoke out against this censorship.”
  — Ari Melber ([04:49])

• “Brendan Carr, the chairman of the FCC, telling an American company we can do this the easy way or the hard way… In addition to being a direct violation of the First Amendment, is not a particularly intelligent threat to make in public.”
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([09:20])

• “I want to thank the people who don’t support my show… but support my right to share those beliefs anyway. Like Ben Shapiro, Clay Travis, Candace Owens, Mitch McConnell, Rand Paul, even my old pal Ted Cruz. I don't think I've ever said this before, but Ted Cruz is right.”
  — Jimmy Kimmel ([13:10])

• “If by anti American he means anti American Constitution, fact check: true. This is fundamental stuff. The Trump White House lost this round. They're backtracking now from the censorship goals they admitted in public.”
  — Ari Melber ([10:16])

• “[Kimmel’s return] was an important moment… because up to now we've had this massive failure of elites... nobody has had guts until him… There was something about this that felt like, oh, yes, you can stand up for yourself, you can fight back. It is possible… We still have some time.”
  — Molly Jong-Fast ([16:34], [19:04])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:09] – Melber introduces the Kimmel/Disney/Trump censorship saga
• [03:18] – Jimmy Kimmel’s return monologue (comedic statement, gratitude, free speech reflection)
• [05:54] – Reference to Tonight Show history, Streisand Effect explained
• [08:26] – Kimmel compares U.S. freedom to other countries, condemns government actions as "un-American"
• [09:20] – FCC threat, bipartisan defense of Kimmel’s speech
• [13:10] – Kimmel thanks ideological opponents for defending rights
• [16:15] – Molly Jong-Fast and Michael Hirshhorn panel: resistance, cultural shift, media analysis
• [23:21] – Risks of complacency, left’s need to embrace free speech values
• [27:47] – Breaking: Trump DOJ seeks Comey indictment; expert analysis on process and legal weakness
• [36:24] – Culinary culture feature: Drew Nieporent on Nobu, food culture, and the changing restaurant industry

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Tone & Language

The episode blends Ari Melber's analytical, measured style with layered expert perspectives and Kimmel’s sharp mix of wit and earnestness. Panel segments feature candid, emotionally-invested commentary with both humor and urgency.

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Conclusion

This episode of The Beat with Ari Melber uses the unprecedented attempt to silence a late-night host as a lens through which to examine urgent themes around the First Amendment, governmental abuse of power, corporate responsibility, and cultural resistance. Kimmel’s willingness to fight back becomes a rallying point for broader calls to defend free speech, both constitutionally and socially—even as looming threats and deeper divides persist. The episode closes by underscoring the need for vigilance, cross-partisan defense of fundamental rights, and the enduring power of public resistance.

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Transcript

[Kelly Ripa]

Hey there, it's Kelly Ripa. And if you've been listening to my podcast, we are knee deep in season three. And if you haven't heard it, it's time to get on board. After years of interviewing celebs on camera, I finally get to bring you the real conversations that take place when the cameras aren't rolling. Where else are you going to hear Michelle Obama talk about keeping her girls out of Page Six? Hilaria Baldwin's hilarious reaction to Alec running for office? Or Jeremy Renner's lucid hallucinations about Jamie Foxx? Nowhere else. It's raw, it's honest, and best of all, it's off camera. And believe me, that's where you get the good stuff. So download. Let's talk off camera with Kelly Rippa now. Wherever you get your podcasts.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

The scariest sound to hear in a factory floor is silence. That means something somewhere broke. And now you're paying the team to wait. Maintain X is the asset and maintenance management app that brings your unplanned downtime to zero. Maintain X helps you build preventative maintenance schedules and manage work orders in real time. Try for free@maintain x.com that's maintain in.

[Ari Melber]

The letter x.com welcome to the Beat. I'm Ari Melbert. We have news that's coming in, almost breaking, but more like to use the term developing I because the Trump DOJ may be seeking an indictment of James Comey. That's something we've heard a lot about. The president has demanded it. We have a legal expert coming up. So that's a big developing story, even though we don't yet know what will happen there. We begin with what Nicole and I were just discussing. Late night host Jimmy Kimmel is back triumphantly returning to his show last night after staring down a government effort to censor and silence him. It's a Trump effort that first looked shockingly effective last week when corporate giant Disney gave in to the Trump FCC chair's blatantly unconstitutional demands. Demands that all legal experts who've seriously looked at this say would fail in court if they were tested in court. But they weren't, because Disney first folded Kimmel, then stood strong, the censorship sparking a massive revolt that really did go beyond some of the many skirmishes we have in politics right now. And it led to Disney's then unusual reversal of its own suspension to start this week. And so after so many people, literally millions of people, had weighed in in some way on this effort to silence Kimmel, I just want to remind you of something fairly basic, but that's part of the news. We tell you things that you might already have a hunch about what we saw last night. Kimmel's return is the first time he has addressed this roiling, ongoing censorship plot, the pressure on him and his team. So this monologue crystallized a free speech win against powerful forces. I'm going to show you some of the key points. Because Kimmel mixed grace and appreciation with jokes about some of the absurd facets of what he dubbed a still quite serious struggle. That's about a lot more than any single comedy show.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

A lot of people have been asking me if there are conditions for my return to the air. And there is one. Disney has asked me to read the following statement and I agreed to do it.

[Ari Melber]

Here we go.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

To reactivate your Disney and Hulu account.

[Ari Melber]

I've been.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Fortunate to work at a company that has allowed me to do the show the way we want to do it. For almost 23 years, I've done almost 4,000 shows on ABC. And over that time, the people who run this network have allowed me to evolve and to stretch the boundaries of what was once traditional for a late night talk show. Even when it made them uncomfortable, which I do a lot every night, they've defended my right to poke fun at our leaders and to advocate for subjects that I think are important by allowing me to use their platform. And I am very grateful for that. With that said, I was not happy when they pulled me off the air on. I did not agree with that decision and I told them that. And we had many conversations. I shared my point of view, they shared theirs. We talked it through and at the end, even though they didn't have to, they really didn't have to. This is a giant company. We have short attention spans. And I am a tiny part of the Disney corporation. They welcomed me back on the air and I thank them for that.

[Ari Melber]

That's true. And he's probably not spinning there. He understands quite clearly in the larger economic math how that spec on the balance sheet could have been wiped away. But it wasn't. Partly because people cared, partly because of you, if you cared. Kimmel, summarizing that in a diplomatic way. The reporting and evidence we have suggests Disney was quick to fold to government pressure to oust him, only to fold again days later when the pressure in response proved mighty and apparently surprisingly large for them. So Kimmel there thanking his employer, the broadcaster, thanking the public and the many people who spoke out against this censorship. And I'm going to show you A little bit more of that point in a second. But again, we're balancing the big weighty issues and the cultural moment. And so he made this other nod to a bit of TV lore and history when Tonight show host Jack Par had first returned to the airwaves after he previously walked off that show in an internal clash over editorial choices.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Anyway, as I was saying before I.

[Ari Melber]

Was interrupting, as I was saying before I was interrupted, if you're a real comedy nerd or history buff, you can feel the echoing there. And it speaks to something, that free speech and the ability to do this in whatever method people choose. Some people do comedy, some people do politics. Some people are just artists and writers until they find the government comes for them, too. This matters across history. Kimmel joking about how the government crackdown was going to grow his audience. Nicole Wallace and I just discussed that. With the TV ratings coming in, last night's show was a ratings bonanza. 6 million live TV viewers online clips of this monologue are going viral, passing 15 million views on YouTube in under a day. The count is still rising as we speak and report. It's already now Kimmel's most watched monologue on YouTube ever. Now, that type of interest and response to people saying, don't watch this or we might take this away or the government doesn't want you to see this actually matches a wider communications dynamic you might have heard of. When you try to suppress something, you sometimes draw more attention to it. This is called the Streisand effect. For a time when the star's effort to hide and suppress a single picture of her home ended up backfiring and drawing far more interests. So it is a fact that there's more interest in Kimmel's monologue. But. Yes, but. I'm sorry, there's always a but these days that still will only matter in reality if there is the freedom to find the material and get it. The Streisand effect does not work in North Korea or places with legal practical tech limits on what you might find on your TV or on their version of what they call the Internet, which is censored. Which is a point Kimmel also made last night, referring to autocratic countries and noting that while he is back on air right now and you just saw the interest online on YouTube, many local affiliates are still today stopping Kimmel's show from being shown under this spat, impacting up to a third of ABC affiliates. There are signs, and some of this is still being reported out, whether that aligns with the MAGA government crackdown so those are businesses making those decisions, but are they doing it for political and governmental efforts? Kimmel reflecting on that while guarding America's First Amendment freedom.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

This show is not important. What is important is that we get to live in a country that allows us to have a show like this. I've had the opportunity to meet and spend time with comedians and talk show hosts from countries like Russia, countries in the Middle east who tell me they would get thrown in prison for making fun of those in power. And worse than being thrown in prison, they know how lucky we are here. Our freedom to speak is what they admire most about this country. And that's something I'm embarrassed to say. I took for granted until they pulled my friend Stephen off the air and tried to coerce the affiliates who run our show in the cities that you live in to take my show. That's not legal, that's not American. That is un American.

[Ari Melber]

And it is so dangerous.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Brendan Carr, the chairman of the fcc, telling an American company we can do this the easy way or the hard way and that these companies can find ways to change conduct and take action on Kimmel or there's going to be additional work for the FCC ahead. In addition to being a direct violation of the First Amendment, is not a particularly intelligent threat to make in public. Ted Cruz said he sounded like a mafioso, although I don't know if you want to hear a mob boss make a threat like that. You have to hide a microphone in a deli and park outside in a van with a tape recorder all night long. This genius said it on a podcast. Well, one thing I did learn from Lenny Bruce and George Carlin and Howard Stern is that a government threat to silence a comedian the president doesn't like is anti American. That's anti. And Niagara.

[Ari Melber]

If by anti American he means anti American. Constitution fact check. True. This is fundamental stuff. The Trump White House lost this round. They're backtracking now from the censorship goals they admitted in public. Kimmel pointing out that even nowadays when MAGA may get away with a lot, that was too much and that it was, as he put it, less than a genius move. But compare Trump's recent confessions that he will try to punish critical coverage by yanking broadcast licenses with what they're saying today. Having lost this round. Well, they can't admit that they lost or that they had a censorship plot going, even though we all lived through Trump talking about it last week in his FCC chair. So briefly, I want to show you the misleading statement from the White House today. Which is still a sign they know they're losing and need to say other stuff. They claim the whole thing was about ratings and not Trump's attacks on free speech.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

They give me only bad public listening or press. I mean, they're getting a license. I would think maybe their license should be taken away.

[Ari Melber]

Take away their license because they're not covering the government the way it likes. That's the stated position of the President. And today his spokespeople say the opposite. Which again, separate from the credibility, you'd prefer the government and the White House wasn't misleading so much, but that itself is a basically confession, an awareness that they're losing this and need to get back off it because it didn't work, at least on this one for Kimmel. Trump is still threatening abc, though. Last night, as Kimmel was walking out, he posted an evening statement that he'll test ABC out. Let's see how we do. Last time I went after them, they gave me $16 million. They this one sounds even more lucrative and he means it. Trump proving the very point that so many have warned about and that apparently Disney chief Bob Iger and others didn't understand. They are very smart, experienced people. They have a lot of strategic advisors around them. But they didn't figure out that surrendering and paying Donald Trump off only invites more attacks. That's true whether you're Disney or Harvard or some of these law firms that have not exactly cloaked themselves in glory or legal planning. Now some big companies are going through this their time in the. In the box. I want to show a little more of something else, Kimmel said, that delves more into our side of the road news and politics, because he very thoughtfully made a point using this big platform and audience to shout out some of the people who stood up for free speech values. Precisely regardless of whether you agree with the said speech.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

I want to thank the people who don't support my show and what I believe, but support my right to share those beliefs anyway.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

People who I never would have imagined.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Like Ben Shapiro, Clay Travis, Candace Owens, Mitch McConnell, Rand Paul, even my old pal Ted Cruz. I don't think I've ever said this before, but Ted Cruz is right. He's absolutely right. The President of the United States made it very clear he wants to see me and the hundreds of people who work here fired from our jobs. Our leader celebrates Americans losing their livelihoods because he can't take a joke.

[Ari Melber]

He was.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Somehow able to squeeze Colbert out of cbs, then he turned his sights on me and now he's openly rooting for NBC to fire Jimmy Fallon and Seth Meyers and the hundreds of Americans who work for their shows who don't make millions of dollars. And I hope that if that happens, or if there's even any hint of that happening, you will be 10 times as loud as you were this week. We have to speak out against that.

[Ari Melber]

Powerful Kimmel with the receipts, using his platform to acknowledge and thank the people who came up and stepped up for him, but also very aware of the way we live now and the career he's had. He knows how things work and how fast you can be hot or not or whatever, and saying, don't just stand up for him. Stand up for these free speech values. And he seems to think, based on his experience, that Donald Trump's not done with this. That when he says he'll go after the parent company in other ways for money or a shakedown, that he will. That when he says he'll go after NBC or these other outlets, that he will. And that requires a sustained response. There's an old saying in politics that it's a thin line between the impossible and the inevitable. Meaning sometimes something that you don't think could ever happen happens. And when that thing is bad and you say, how is it that In America in 2025, you can have a leader who, whether you agree with his politics or not, it's not really the point. You could have a leader who openly tries to abuse government power, to sacrifice or end the very First Amendment of our Constitution, the basis for all the rest of our civic dialogue and democracy. How can that be inevitable? Well, that's where we are, and the rest is up. As Kimmel said, rest is up to us. I want to bring in Vanity Fairs, Holly, John Fass, an MSNBC analyst and author, and Michael Hirshhorn, who's here with his interesting portfolio. He has worked in anti Trump democracy efforts. He's also a very, I would say, acclaimed, if it's possible, acclaimed reality TV show producer. A lot of people don't think of that field that way, but he created a lot of reality TV and has thought a lot about this culture, politics blend. Is that fair?

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Yeah, I mean, I think at this point, culture is politics. And so I think it's right and important that you take this Kimmel story as seriously as, I don't know, salt talks might have been taken seriously 40 years ago.

[Ari Melber]

What did you think Kimmel was achieving last night, what he was expressing?

[Molly Jong-Fast]

I think it was an important moment. I think it was something extraordinary. And it was something extraordinary because up to now we've had this massive failure of elites and across the board, nobody has stood up, nobody has had guts until him, and he could have chosen not to do that. So personally, I feel like a little spring in my step. I got emotional watching him. How this plays out, as you said, depends on whether other people get any guts and whether there's a broader shift towards people sacrificing immediate self interest and short term gain for a longer term principle.

[Ari Melber]

Here was Kimmel on that point I mentioned on the ratings last night.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

He had no talent. And more importantly than talent, he had no.

[Ari Melber]

Because a lot of people have no.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Talent, they get ratings, but he had no ratings.

[Ari Melber]

Well.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

I do tonight.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Yeah, look, he did crazy numbers last night, which I think is a sign that this has broken through. I think about when Tom Hanks got Covid, that was a moment a lot of Americans saw that Covid was real. Maybe Jimmy Kimmel being censored by Disney and nexstar, maybe that's the moment where Americans see that this is real. But what I think is the most interesting about this is resistance. And I'm here to tell you, even though people got sick of the catchphrase, it actually works. What we're seeing is working is what worked in 2016, where people got together and they were like, this is not who we are. And I think it's a real important and valuable lesson because if people don't resist, like what we saw with all of the different elites, the billionaires and the universities and the lawyers, when they get together and make these deals with Trump, they are captured institutions. They are no longer within the bounds of the law. Because all of these deals are not really. They're extra at best, they're extra legal. Right. They're sort of their own nebulous thing. And so those people have no protection. And so Donald Trump knows that, and he keeps going and going and going. And what we see here is that appeasement doesn't work. Honestly, you really see how when Cherry Redstone canceled Colbert, it was actually really every step got us here has gotten us to more censorship and being less free.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Yeah. I think one of the things I've diagnosed, I mean, we all know a lot of people that are very high up in their various professions. A lot of people have not gotten to the point where they understand that they're not safe unless they do something. And until Kimmel, I was in a kind of constant low state of depression. And there was something about this that felt like, oh, yes, you can stand up for yourself, you can fight back. It is possible. Everything isn't. Like the clay hasn't hardened yet. We still have some time.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

I would just add that Donald Trump's polling the worst he's ever pulled. Okay. He's underwater on the economy. He's underwater in Texas for the first time ever. Like, this is not a popular president. The fact that people are scared of him because we're all soft and not used to this kind of thing may be true, but it doesn't necessarily reflect reality. And you can see this from stores like Target. You know, they were boycotted for going and stei and, and it was, it was real numbers. And that's what we're seeing here. I mean, these are real numbers for Kimmel. And I think it's a really good example that people want to normal American democracy.

[Ari Melber]

And Michael, the President and his sort of chief here at the FCC seem to understand that comedy and culture and mainstream discourse outside of political nerds matters a lot to them. It matters to how they're understood in the culture. And they have a schizophrenic or split messaging. Oh, it doesn't matter. And the ratings decline and oh, I mean, if the ratings were low enough, presumably they wouldn't spend so much effort trying to stop Colbert.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Kimmel.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Right. I think, I mean, I think the reason they felt they had that power is that traditional broadcast television, establishment media, establishment newspapers are in a kind of long term decline and they're vulnerable. And what I thought was interesting is the delta between the numbers that Kimmel had on ABC and the numbers that he had on YouTube.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

And so there's this big shift happening that is allowing them to kind of hammer away at broadcast because the numbers aren't what they used to be. These companies, these conglomerates used to be all powerful and right now they're not. And that's what makes it a kind of both scary moment, but also promising moment. Right. The irony is that if Kimmel was kicked off of ABC for good, and he still might be, he would do very well on YouTube, on Instagram, on TikTok. And a lot of people that have been sort of booted out of traditional media are now having a very vibrant future online. So it's a weird moment.

[Ari Melber]

And Michael, I'm also curious your view on picking the enemy because Jimmy Kimmel might play one way to a really hardcore MAGA base. They see him primarily through the lens that he criticizes Trump. But this show has been on 23 years. He hosts award shows and Other things, precisely because of. A lot of Americans know him as a star. They might by now know he's critical of Trump, but first and foremost, he's a star. And that seems to be different than other folks they've picked on.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Right. I think he's a star in a different way than Colbert is. I mean, Colbert has always been like, you know, a fine French wine for a very specific sensibility and taste, whereas Kimmel is a much bigger star. I think it is notable when you think, and this is something you know well, which stars they're not picking on. And it's interesting that they're not going after Beyonce, they're not going after Bad Bunny, they're not going after Jay Z. There's still a lot of cultural power, and if anyone knows cultural power, it's Donald Trump.

[Ari Melber]

How has Colbert aged as a wine?

[Molly Jong-Fast]

A fine wine.

[Ari Melber]

A fine one. Yes. In conclusion, do you think that people will hear what Kimmel said or the next time they go after someone who's slightly less famous and maybe in a slightly less blunt, dumb way? There's a risk they can get away with it.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

I think there's a big risk. I think just to go on a slight tangent, there's a lot of work I think we have to do because the vulnerability on the left comes from years of cancel culture. And I think when I speak to my kind of normie friends or my kind of soft MAGA friends, they're always going to. What about me? About. About. You guys didn't complain when Megan Kelly was kicked off the air, when Tucker Carlson was kicked off the air. And I think we have to do a little bit work on our end to kind of shore up our understanding of what free speech means to us.

[Ari Melber]

Now, clearly you're saying to your fellow liberals.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

To fellow liberals, and clearly there's a. It's a lazy analogy because it's not like the government stepped in. But still, I think we need to think through from the left what a vibrant free speech culture looks like and how we engage with people who don't agree with us.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah. And you're speaking about the difference between free speech law, which is constitutional jurisprudence that governs what the government can do, where they were wrong. And I've reminded folks of the 90 rulings on that as of last year. And then free speech values, which we talk about on campuses and elsewhere. What we saw sometimes some liberals do, for example, in the campus context, which is say this speaker shouldn't be welcome, shouldn't be allowed to talk. Right. They're not the government. They're just saying they're unwelcome because of their views. And that is against free speech values. You put it politically. I would just put it as someone who practiced First Amendment law.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Ari Melber]

It's not a part time thing.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Correct.

[Ari Melber]

Either you think peaceful speech is how we want to govern ourselves or not?

[Molly Jong-Fast]

Yes. And I think on the, on the left we might embrace some of the hurly burly, some of the inappropriateness, some of the kind of raw speech that is how people speak to each other. I think would be a very powerful political move.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

I just would add that that may very well be true. I'm not disagreeing, but I think you can't take what's happened with Kimmel out of that. This is happening because Donald Trump and his government want it to happen.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah, Cracked up.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

So I think, well, there certainly is whataboutism and there certainly are people who will say that I do think this is part of the federal government trying to, you know, inject crony capitalism into making deals and saying, you know, we, if you want to make this deal and sell Paramount to Skydance, you need to do these three things.

[Ari Melber]

Right. The shakedown. And that's very clear. Michael Hirshhorn, I want to thank you. Molly comes back, the Trump DOJ eyeing James Comey. We're back in 90 seconds. Foreign.

[Kelly Ripa]

Hey there, it's Kelly Ripa. And if you've been listening to my podcast, we are knee deep in season three. And if you haven't heard it, it's time to get on board. After years of interviewing celebs on camera, I finally get to bring you the real conversations that take place when the cameras aren't rolling. Where else are you going to hear Michelle Obama talk about keeping her girls out of Page Six? Hilaria Baldwin's hilarious reaction to Alec running for office, or Jeremy Renner's lucid hallucinations about Jamie Foxx, nowhere else. It's raw, it's honest, and best of all, it's off camera. And believe me, that's where you get the good stuff. So download. Let's talk off camera with Kelly Ripa now. Wherever you get your podcasts, sometimes an.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

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[Ari Melber]

Breaking news out of the Trump DOJ, MSNBC and the Washington Post reporting on an effort by Trump's Justice Department to seek a new and first ever indictment of longtime Trump critic and former FBI Director James Comey. The charges center around Comey's 2020 Senate testimony, according to these initial reports. There is no actual paper on this, so we don't know if it's just that other things or whether they'll even get this indictment. But it at that time involved questions and prosecutors are preparing to seek the indictment as early as Thursday before a grand jury which legally still must approve this. As for that testimony I mentioned, they're just looking at whether that testimony was false. The statute of limitations puts a deadline of Tuesday. MSNBC's Kendallanean and Carolyn Ling breaking some of this news reporting. Comey expected to be indicted. The charges could, if they go forward, be brought by the very controversial brand new prosecutor in Virginia, Lindsey Halligan. She was appointed only after Trump's prosecutor, who was just picked this year, made a apparently legal decision that there wasn't the evidence to charge Comey. Trump then publicly clamoring for his attorney general to bring charges by name against Comey and other opponents. That itself breaks all protocol and endangers those cases. I have a prosecutor on this news. Next, new reporting. The Trump DOJ may seek an indictment of former Director Comey. I'm joined by former federal prosecutor Ankush Khardori, who covers these stories with Politico. Your thoughts on this news?

[Ankush Khardori]

Well, there's a long way to go, I would say, given the sort of fuzziness of the news. And you, you touched on that in your introduction here, Right? First of all, it's not clear how far along this has gotten in the approval process. To me in particular, whether the attorney general herself has signed off on even seeking the indictment. And then, of course, you have to find someone who will present it to the grand jury. That person could end up very well being Lindsey Halligan, for all we know. And then you have to persuade a grand jury to indict the case. This is the extraordinarily rare case where I have some real questions about whether the government will actually be able to indict this case. I actually used to prosecute cases for a period of time out of that office, but in the. Out of that district, excuse me, but a different office. And based on the reporting that you referred to earlier, this seems like a very, very weak case.

[Ari Melber]

You're saying. Maybe even more. I'll let you continue. You're saying that everyone knows the old saying, but that James Comey might not be the proverbial ham sandwich here.

[Ankush Khardori]

Yeah, exactly. And I'm not sure I've ever said that before about. And the criminal investigation. But the second part of this is, I don't know, you know, they may have more than what has been referenced in the reporting to date. That's often the case. The problem that overhangs all of this, though, is that it has been national news for most of the last week that Trump has been pressuring these people to prosecute James and Comey. And Trump confirmed that news in his social media posts over the last few days. And most, if not all of the people they're going to try to seek this indictment from will have heard that news.

[Ari Melber]

Right. So we have it up. We'll put it back up. Because the Times coverage, and it comes from his own post, is where he names Comey and a sitting Senator Schiff and Letitia James, who's been cited and MSNBC reporting mentioned the pursuit of her. But that would be, of course, a separate matter in case. And you're pointing out judges would be very skeptical of cases that are called in by the president against his perceived opponents.

[Ankush Khardori]

I'm actually, I'm actually going one step further than that. And the grand jury, I'm saying the grand jurors may have reservations about indicting a case knowing this information. Right. Ordinarily, the threshold is very low to get an indictment from a grand jury. You just have to convince a dozen of them that you have probable cause to believe this person committed a crime. But if you know this information that Trump has been posting about, and that's been all over the news for most of the last week about Trump wanting this, these people to, to prosecute his enemies and removing a U.S. attorney, installing a someone who had no prosecutorial experience and whose only relevance is having worked for him in the position, then you are not going to be particularly generous to the government. You're going to resolve every doubt in your mind, even on the low standard against the government, because you're not an idiot. You've been in the world seeing these things, right?

[Ari Melber]

You're saying that you can see the world around you. And while no government veteran is above the law, you have to take into account, as you said in your reasoning, what evidence is being presented. And if it's weak and being phoned in illicitly for potentially unlawful purposes, people are going to know that. It's interesting. And yes, in our presentation here, we're both reporting on the pursuit of it. Trump himself called calling for it. But as you said, nowhere near a place where this has yet happened. Ankush Khaduri, thank you and we'll be right back. Turning to another major development, there was a deadly shooting at an ICE field office today in Dallas. A detainee killed, two others injured. The suspect also found dead on a nearby roof with a self inflicted gunshot wound. Authorities say he was a 29 year old registered independent, had a criminal record. Officials have not yet specified a motive. But here are some of the remarks during today's briefing. I can confirm at this time that the FBI is investigating this incident as an act of targeted violence. It is unfortunately just the most recent example we've seen of targeted violence. Early evidence that we've seen from rounds that were found near the suspected shooter contain messages that are anti ice in nature. Authorities concerned about those messages, the violence and the effort to target that facility. Officials indicated no law enforcement agents were hurt there today. We'll continue to follow that story as we learn more about the horrific events. We're going to fit in a break, but there is a backlash to some of those bizarre medical claims from the White House. The Fantasy footballers are on SiriusXM.

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[Ari Melber]

We still have time for some fun around here. You might need a reservation for this fallback. I'll explain right now. Two excellent guests. Friend of the Beat. You might recognize her from earlier in the program. Molly Jong Fast, a writer, an analyst, the Fast Politics podcast hosts. Her new memoir, how to Lose your Mother is now a New York Times bestseller. You can still get it right now. Google how to Lose youe Mother. Pick up a copy. We like it. We like you. Full disclosure and making his Beat debut, the famed restaurateur Drew Drew Niperin.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yeah, that's good.

[Ari Melber]

You say it.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

My mother used to say, yeah, pouring wine and paying rent. Nippor rent.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah, I was pretty much there. But it's.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

You did all right.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

It wasn't like the set up, whatever it was the other day yesterday.

[Ari Melber]

He's known for many restaurants which are profiled in this book, but perhaps most for Nobu. He works there with part owner Robert De Niro, but we've seen Everybody there. Beyonce, LeBron Taylor, and even the Obamas. This is the type of restaurant that was profiled in an acclaimed documentary, who is the Emperor of Japan?

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

They won't know his name, but everybody knows Nobu.

[Ari Melber]

The greatest ever Nobu. London, Tokyo, Dubai, all over the world.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

I told Nobu, if you ever want.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

To open a restaurant in New York, let me know.

[Ari Melber]

How do you get to that level? You can find out in his book. Google this and buy it. I'm not trying to be difficult. Stories from the restaurant trenches Even though to build an empire like that, you were difficult sometimes. It includes tales of From Nobu, the first restaurant Montroche.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yes, Montroche Exactly.

[Ari Melber]

Tribeca Grill and so many more. You are a real leader in your field. Thanks for coming on the program, Ari.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

I love you. You know that. It's nice to be here.

[Ari Melber]

It's great to have you. We're going to get to your book. But, Molly, what's on your fallback list?

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Oh, radioactive shrimp.

[Ari Melber]

Let's go.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

They need to fall back. Look, there's a reason the federal government exists, and it's to monitor our food and make sure we don't eat radioactive shrimp. Not good. There's no pro. Radioactive shrimp contingent.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah. I think we can agree on this.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Yeah. There's no radioactive shrimp caucus.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

I'm just gonna say shrimps have made a comeback in America. They actually had a shrimp cocktail index the other day of all these restaurants, like suddenly shrimp cocktail, which is you take four shrimp, you put em on a plate, and that's some genius culinary thing. My question is, how do they know it's radioactive?

[Ari Melber]

Is there a scanner or something?

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

I mean, it's.

[Molly Jong-Fast]

It's crazy, right?

[Ari Melber]

Well, you. You're in the biz.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Ari Melber]

What do good restaurants do to protect against getting bad food or dangerous food?

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Well, radioactive, first of all, it's the most important thing. Yeah. The food has to be wholesome. So you have to have great purveyors of great food. And then. And we've worked with our purveyors for 100 years. In fact, Nobu, the relationships he's had. We're open 31 years. Relationships with the fish purveyors. But you have to be scrupulous because food has to be wholesome and delicious. And it starts with the way it's brought in.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah. On your fallback list, I know you wanted to weigh in on this misinformation coming out of the White House.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yeah. I. I am from the era of doctors came to my house. They made house calls. Shirley and Sidney Colan. I mean, I trusted my doctors.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

And if the doctor said, take Tylenol because it's going to ease the fever, the pain, I was like, of course. What we witnessed yesterday is just such a. It's diabolical almost. You know, women should not feel that they, you know, just talk to your doctor. Your doctors are going to give you the advice. Your hands are in, you know, your fate is in the hands of the doctor. And to be able to demonize overnight, Tylenol is ridiculous.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Tylenol does not cause autism. And women are not responsible for giving their children autism. More importantly, and I think that, that there were a lot of bad There was a lot of bad stuff that came out of the White House with that announcement.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah, it's really wild. You also feel too many ads.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Too many ads. Yes. The dystopian ad story. Yes, too many ads. Too many. There are too many ads.

[Ari Melber]

You want the companies to fall back.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Fall back on putting. So the story is ads on refrigerators and these refrigerators that have little televisions that play ads.

[Ari Melber]

And in uk, people are calling it dystopian, where you can use a public restroom, one of them. But you have to watch the ad to really get full access, which really feels like one of those Black Mirror episodes or any terrible show about the.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Future feels a little 1984.

[Ari Melber]

Yeah.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

That's unbelievable. I mean, my mother and my brother were in advertising when I would change the channel. You know, this is in the 60s. My mother would get upset with me because she had cast the commercial, so she wanted to see the commercial. I didn't want to see the commercial. But, you know, I mean, for me, the most important thing is changing the channel so you don't have to watch the ads.

[Ari Melber]

So I. Fast forward, by the way, my family growing up.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Fast forward.

[Ari Melber]

When I was little, I was only allowed an hour of TV a week, so it was precious. And my parents would often mute during the commercials. And then I didn't realize, so I went to, you know, you go to someone else's house and they would leave the sound on. My mom's a sociologist. She's not into, like, the extra ads. And. And I realized, oh, other people are listening to these things. They were, like, screening them out. Now it's ads everywhere. And just like with phones, it's a part of our. Our life that we should. I'm glad you brought it up, Molly. Have some constructive social commentary and critique on. Because you don't need 10,000 ads. It's. It's distortive. I do want to get to the restaurant industry, where you're a leader. We put together a quick mash, we call it in the biz, because you've had many great restaurants. Nobu, of course, has become this global icon.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

56 around the world.

[Ari Melber]

56. Let's look at some of that, right? I have a busy week. Do you.

[Ankush Khardori]

I'm gonna. Thursday.

[Ari Melber]

No boo. You came back. I let you set the date. No boo on the plate.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

So we're at Nobu. I'd watch it. Tamara, watch it. I'd watch it.

[Ari Melber]

But you wanna. You wanna watch it.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Nobu.

[Ari Melber]

Nobu. As Future said there, and it is a classic nobu Nobu. Nobu. Nobu.

[Jimmy Kimmel]

Right.

[Ari Melber]

Future your tell us about your life, which is in this book of building these restaurants from scratch.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Well, I'm a New Yorker through and through. I grew up downtown, Stuyvesant High School, Cornell Hotel school, worked on a cruise ship, worked at McDonald's. Do the hamburgers today in Madison Square Garden, by the way. So that's full circle.

[Ari Melber]

You were an American captain at a French restaurant.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

I was an American captain in a French restaurant. And that was breakthrough. And then lucky. I was working at La Grenouille one night and that was the four star New York Times. And I'm pouring a bottle of Le Montracher. And originally the idea for my restaurant was American Silverado Trail, Napa Valley. And I see this and I was like, monrochai. Why am I trying to reinvent the wheel? That's the name and that's what we opened with. A fabulous chef, David Boulay got three stars seven weeks after we opened with a 16, three course menu. And it was like storm, the best deal. And it was like winning the lottery without being able to collect the cash. And then Robert De Niro showed up one night. We opened the Tribeca Grill five years later. And then I've opened 40 restaurants in 40 years between 1990 and today.

[Ari Melber]

We'll do a lightning round. I got 30 seconds.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Yeah.

[Ari Melber]

The best way to get a reservation at Nobu is me. The key to a great cooked meal is.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

The key to a great meal is great ingredients. And don't be too fussy.

[Ari Melber]

The difference between liking food and being a foodie is a foodie could be.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

A lot of bs. I mean, liking food is different. I don't conflate the two.

[Ari Melber]

Respect. Because I have a friend from Seattle who's big into being a foodie and I always tell him liking food is not a personality.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

I like food.

[Ari Melber]

The book, I'm not trying to be difficult. Pick it up wherever books are sold. We'll be right back.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Thank you so much.

[Ari Melber]

That does it for us. Hey, this is Jeff Lewis from Radio Andy live and uncensored.

[Podcast Advertiser/Announcer]

Catch me talking with my friends about my latest obsessions, relationship issues and bodily ailments. With that kind of drama that seems to follow me, you never know what's going to happen.

[Ari Melber]

You can listen to Jeff Lewis live at home or anywhere you are.

[Michael Hirshhorn]

Download the SiriusXM app for over 425.

[Ari Melber]

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[Michael Hirshhorn]

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[Ari Melber]

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