The BEMA Podcast: Episode 448 – "Talmudic Matthew — Secret"
Release Date: May 1, 2025
Host/Author: BEMA Discipleship (Marty Solomon and Brent Billings)
Guest: Al Grover Fricks
Introduction
In Episode 448 of The BEMA Podcast, hosted by Marty Solomon and Brent Billings, the discussion centers around a pivotal passage from the Sermon on the Mount, specifically focusing on Jesus’ teachings about prayer. Joined by guest Al Grover Fricks, the hosts delve into the historical and Rabbinic contexts of the Bible, examining how Jesus’ directives on prayer contrast with contemporary and Greco-Roman practices.
Exploring the Sermon on the Mount
[00:00 – 02:07] Setting the Scene
Marty and Brent open the episode in a metaphorical "prayer closet," a space symbolizing private prayer away from public display. They reference a recent deep dive into the "problem of reward and wages" and set the stage for a more relaxed yet insightful discussion on prayer.
Key Passage Discussed:
"But whenever you pray, enter into your inner room and shut your door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you."
— Matthew 6:6 (paraphrased)
Personal Reflections and Initial Reactions
[02:07 – 03:01] Marty’s Personal Connection
Marty shares a personal anecdote about how this passage influenced his departure from the Catholic Church, highlighting the discomfort with repetitive prayers like the rosary. He remarks:
"This was one of the key passages that made me leave the Catholic Church, the repetition and the many words."
Brent humorously acknowledges the European pagan influences, hinting at the historical context they will explore.
Talmudic Interpretations of Prayer
[04:06 – 14:06] Foundations of Jewish Prayer Practices
Brent outlines the structure of Jewish prayers during Jesus’ time, emphasizing the Talmudic rules that governed prayer length and frequency. He shares insights into how meticulous the Rabbinic tradition was about prayer duration, including humorous and practical anecdotes:
"They said, never let your prayer be interrupted, even if you are getting bit on the ankle by a poisonous snake. If you do, the snake will die and not you."
(06:32)
This sparks a lighthearted comparison to modern parental experiences with interrupted prayers:
"For me, it makes me think of my prayers at home with the kids, which are constantly interrupted."
Greco-Roman Prayer Practices
[17:01 – 28:09] Contrasting Jewish and Greco-Roman Prayers
Brent transitions to comparing Talmudic prayers with Greco-Roman practices, categorizing them into three types:
-
Civic Ceremonial Prayer:
- Structure: Invocation of deity, reason for prayer, and request.
- Example: "Jupiter Optimus Maximus... we beseech you to protect our city and grant us prosperity."
- Insight: These prayers were short, formal, and lacked personal emotional depth, contrasting sharply with the Rabbinic emphasis on lengthy supplications.
-
Household Prayer:
- Structure: Short petitions for household well-being.
- Example: "Father Mars, be gracious, keep away disease, barrenness and disaster."
- Insight: These were concise and pragmatic, designed for daily domestic life without the extensive theological discourse found in Rabbinic or magical prayers.
-
Magical Prayers:
- Structure: Elaborate invocations with divine names, repetitions, and complex formulas.
- Example Extract:
"I call upon you, headless one, who created earth and heaven... Deliver him from the demon that holds onto him."
- Insight: These prayers were highly ritualistic, intended to manipulate supernatural forces, often blending Greco-Roman and Egyptian elements. The hosts note their length and complexity as a key differentiator from Jesus’ teachings.
Notable Quote:
"This is one example from that milieu of what it sounded like, which makes Jesus's version cray in comparison. Right. He says, get out. All done." — (27:15) Brent Billings
Jesus’ Teachings on Prayer: Motivations and Practices
[29:03 – 35:59] The Heart Behind Prayer
Marty and Brent dissect Jesus’ admonition against long prayers, questioning the underlying motivations for lengthy supplications. They explore whether such prayers are driven by a desire for attention, personal ego, or a genuine relationship with God.
Key Questions Raised:
-
Motivation:
"Do we rely on liturgical books because we don't think our own thoughts are organized enough?"
— Brent Billings (32:23) -
Trust in God:
"Do we believe that God actually sees us and is actively part of our lives, not just a distant egoic Zeus?"
— Brent Billings (33:31) -
Participation vs. Passivity:
Marty introduces the idea that prayer should not be an excuse to disengage from active participation in God’s work:"We are supposed to be partners in carrying out whatever it is we are praying for."
— Marty Solomon (37:17)
Notable Quote:
"We are participants. We are partners in what God is doing in the world." — Marty Solomon (38:23)
Practical Applications and Modern Implications
[35:59 – 46:34] Aligning Prayer Practices with Jesus’ Teachings
The hosts discuss how contemporary prayer practices can be reexamined in light of Jesus’ instructions. They emphasize the importance of sincerity over length and encourage believers to evaluate whether their prayers stem from a heart of trust and partnership with God rather than a need to impress or manipulate.
Key Takeaways:
-
Sincere Connection:
Short prayers can be more meaningful when they come from a genuine place of trust and reliance on God. -
Active Faith:
Engaging in both prayer and actionable steps reflects a balanced and authentic faith practice. -
Community and Partnership:
Believers are encouraged to see themselves as active participants in God’s plans, working alongside Him rather than relying solely on lengthy rituals.
Notable Quotes:
"If we do come from a tradition which practices lengthier prayers, what's our heart motivation for checking the box on those lengthy prayers?"
— Brent Billings (32:40)
"We are supposed to be partners in carrying out whatever it is we are praying for."
— Marty Solomon (37:17)
Humorous Interlude: High School Book Discussion
[40:19 – 46:34] Lighthearted Exchange on Youth Literature
The episode takes a humorous detour as Brent and Marty discuss old high school books like Every Young Man's Battle and Every Young Woman's Battle. They poke fun at the exaggerated titles and content, adding levity to the conversation while subtly reinforcing the importance of understanding and addressing modern spiritual and ethical challenges.
Notable Moments:
-
Brent on Book Covers:
"The COVID art is of a poor woman walking by. She's blurred out... We wouldn't want to have to see her face." — Brent Billings (42:13)
-
Marty’s Commentary:
"It helps you understand your hunger for attention from guys." — Marty Solomon (45:16)
This segment underscores the hosts' ability to blend deep theological discussions with relatable, everyday humor.
Conclusion and Final Thoughts
[46:34 – End] Wrapping Up with Insights
Marty and Brent conclude the episode by reiterating the importance of heartfelt prayer aligned with Jesus’ teachings. They urge listeners to move beyond rote recitations and engage in authentic, sincere conversations with God. The hosts emphasize community support, mutual growth, and the shared journey of understanding faith in a complex world.
Final Encouragement:
"We are partners in what God is doing in the world."
— Marty Solomon
They also tease upcoming episodes, including a future discussion on the Lord’s Prayer with guest Josh Gumpson, promising continued exploration of prayer practices and their biblical foundations.
Key Quotes with Timestamps
-
Marty Solomon:
"This was one of the key passages that made me leave the Catholic Church, the repetition and the many words."
[02:10] -
Brent Billings:
"Never let your prayer be interrupted, even if you are getting bit on the ankle by a poisonous snake. If you do, the snake will die and not you."
[06:32] -
Brent Billings:
"This is what you're supposed to say versus Jesus says different stuff when he's doing exorcisms or healing people."
[28:09] -
Marty Solomon:
"We are supposed to be partners in carrying out whatever it is we are praying for."
[37:17] -
Brent Billings:
"We have to believe that he's listening already, that he's good, that he wants to give us what we ask for already before we ask it."
[34:23] -
Marty Solomon:
"We are partners in what God is doing in the world."
[38:23]
Final Notes:
Listeners are encouraged to visit vamontoceptorship.com for show notes, resources, and ways to connect with the hosts. The episode emphasizes the balance between prayer and active participation in faith, highlighting the enduring relevance of biblical teachings in contemporary spiritual practice.
This summary captures the essence of Episode 448 of The BEMA Podcast, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven’t listened while retaining the depth and engaging nature of the original discussion.