The BEMA Podcast: Episode 493

Vice & Virtue — Hope
Released January 22, 2026
Host: Brent Billings featuring Reid Dent & the late Josh Bossay

Episode Overview

This episode is a deep dive into the biblical and practical meaning of hope as a virtue—how our understanding of hope is often too thin or escapist, and what true, biblical hope asks of us. The conversation, featuring the late Josh Bossay, is both an exploration of hope’s theological depth and a vulnerable, practical reckoning with grief, longing, and action. The hosts also reflect on how hope is woven into community, justice, and incarnation—moving beyond individual optimism to a transformative, communal, and sometimes uncomfortable vision for the present and future.

Opening Tribute to Josh Bossay (00:00–07:21)

• Marty Solomon opens with a preface: This is a previously recorded episode with Josh Bossay, who has since passed away. Listeners are encouraged to skip if it’s too difficult.
• Mitch Lavender (00:52) shares a moving tribute, recalling memories with Josh and his family, their hospitality, vulnerability, and the impact Josh had on his life and community.
  • Quote: “The impression on our hearts is olam—everlasting.” (06:00)
• Mitch reads a heartfelt poem about friendship, loss, and gratitude, ending with:
  • “You’re gone now, no longer here. … Of course our time was too short, but the impression on our hearts is olam—everlasting.” (05:52)

What Is Hope? — Philosophical and Theological Framing (07:21–20:35)

The Depth of Hope

• Reid Dent launches the discussion by reading from T.S. Eliot's Four Quartets, framing hope as cyclical, mysterious, and profound (07:29–11:45).

  • “The end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.” (11:10)
  • “All shall be well. And all manner of things shall be well … the fire and the rose are one.” (11:18)

• Buechner’s perspective on Christian hope:

  • “Hope is ultimately hope in Christ… the hope that in him and through him all of us stand a chance of somehow conquering [sin and death] too.” (11:51)
  • “If Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile… If for this life only we have hoped in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied." (12:01) — St. Paul (1 Corinthians 15)

Thin vs. Robust Hope

• Josh Bossay reflects on how hope often feels trite—used as a platitude or a mask, rather than something transformative (13:13).

  • “Usually in cultural spaces, when I hear hope invoked, I kind of tend to prepare for it to be misused.” (13:26)

• Reid observes that we cheapen the big virtues—faith, hope, and love—by shrinking them or making them paler than intended (14:33).

  • “The tendency is to make them actually much less … than they actually are.” (15:02)

Cultural and Church Understandings of Hope (15:20–23:54)

• Josh: “A lot of times when we talk about hope, it feels like a trite response to massive injustice or horror, or just making a virtue out of plastering a smile on your face and moving on.” (13:26)
• In church, shallow hope often means “we believe we're right, so let's just stick to our guns...grit our teeth and get through anything.” (15:35)
• Outside the church, hope can devolve into “blind optimism … the American style of the perpetually happy” (16:34)
• Reid: Hope is not just about escape (“I’ll fly away” mentality) but about being “connected, grounded, and not denying the darkness.” (17:42–18:49)
• Hope misused: “We can use hope either like an anesthetic or a defibrillator.” (18:50)
  • “Hope drives us to action. … There’s a paradox of waiting and action.” (19:36)

The Substance and Paradox of Biblical Hope (20:00–41:42)

“Despite” as the Word of Biblical Hope

• “Biblical hope is real, but then says—despite [the hurt, war, and brokenness], something else is possible.” (19:37)
• Personalization: Josh speaks emotionally about his own health challenges and how hope is not about denial but about material and future restoration (21:30).
• “Hope says the glorious end of things will actually be a realization—real, material realization—of good that is woven into this, including your body, you know, in the creation.” (21:32)

Prophetic Hope and Feeling Fiercely

• Prophets are people of hope but also feel fiercely (“A prophet… is a man who feels fiercely.” — citing Heschel, 22:39).
• True hope reacts against injustice and pain—not with numbness, but with action.

Hope, Action, and Community

• Hope means “we're meant to be able to do something about it”—heralding, ushering in, or being a foretaste of what’s to come (23:40).

• Hope is not “perpetually OK with the status quo — it should be the opposite.” (24:47)

  • “There is an audacity to believing that something worth hoping in is also possible to happen.” (24:55)

• Brent notes the recording of these episodes is out of order, mirroring the nonlinear, web-like way vices and virtues are intertwined. (27:08–27:54)

Biblical Language & Images of Hope: Waiting, Gathering, Community (32:10–41:42)

Hebrew Words: Kava (Waiting/Gathering) and Yahal (Hope) (33:20–36:06)

• The word “kava” (“wait, hope, gather”) is first used in Genesis 1:9 — God gathers the waters, asking them to wait for what comes next.
  • “This idea of hope being something that gathers us together and can transform into solid, life-bringing community, I love that scan on this image.” (35:25)
• Hope is communal, not just individualistic; in the Psalms, you “wait for the Lord” (36:28).
  • But hope is also something God does—God hopes for fruit from his vineyard (Isaiah 5:1–2).

The Tension: Active and Passive Hope

• “Hope is about knowing when to act and when to wait—holding the vision of what you are hoping in so when it’s time, you’re ready to act.” (41:08)
  • “There is a real value for knowing when to do nothing… there is an importance to knowing when to take action and when to wait.” (41:08)
• Josh shares how, during cancer treatment, hope had nothing to do with denial or expecting a miracle, but with “being willing to still be present, still get yourself moving, because there is something that lies ahead.” (29:05–32:11)

Expanding Hope: Messianic Banquet and the Challenging Size of Hope (52:02–73:19)

The Messianic Banquet: Whom Is the Feast For?

• Scripture reference: Isaiah 25:6–8 speaks of a great feast for all peoples where God swallows up death forever. (53:32)

  • “Death itself is the main course, and tears are wiped from every face.” (54:06)

• Jewish Second Temple Texts (55:29–58:50): Show varied (often exclusionary or violent) visions of the end—some anticipating punishment or exclusion for “the nations” or “the wrong sort.”

  • The Targum and 1 Enoch depict a much more exclusive, even violent vision of who’s included or excluded.

• Jesus’ Parable of the Banquet (Luke 14:15–24; 59:32–68:03)

  • Jesus upends the expectations: the invited (the religious, the “right sort”) make excuses; instead, the outcast and even the stranger are brought in.
  • Quote: “Jesus is like, you’re missing it to the point that you are excluding your own selves.” (66:47)
  • Quote: “Is that the best thing that you can Hope for? … How big is your circle?” (68:04)
  • “If heaven is just a place for me to go to escape… I don’t know how that informs my action in the present. But if I have a biblical vision … it's a matter of justice, restoration.” (42:08)

• Reid: “Our hope is not just escapist, but a community-restoring force.” (42:08)

Hope Is Meant to Be Embodied and Incarnated

• “Hope is something that binds people together…” (73:19)
• “We’re not trying to sell people something... We’re showing people what the substance of heaven is through how we live.” (76:31)
• “The hopeful person is not unbotherable... The reason why hopeful people ought to get angry is because there is a recognition that it ought to be otherwise.” (22:38)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the True Substance of Hope:

  • “It is shockingly easy for [our vision of the future] to not reflect the image that God paints.” — Josh (73:19)
  • “The substance of hope is the substance of the gospel: what is the vision of the future we are painting for people?” — Josh (73:32)

• On Hope in Action:

  • “You embody in the present what you anticipate in the future.” — Reid (70:12)
  • “If you have an opportunity to bring the Kingdom 0.1% more into the world, do it. That extra inch makes all the difference.” — Josh (43:02)
  • “We can use hope either like an anesthetic or a defibrillator … hope should shock us into action.” — Reid (18:50)

• On Community and Inclusion:

  • “Is that as big as your hope is? Who’s sitting next to you at the table?” — Reid (68:03)

Key Timestamps

• 00:00–07:21 – Opening, tribute to Josh Bossay (Marty & Mitch)
• 07:21–12:11 – T.S. Eliot, Buechner, and the grandeur of hope (Reid)
• 12:11–15:03 – Theological virtues and finding deeper meaning (Reid, Josh)
• 15:23–20:35 – Shallow hope vs. biblical hope; hope as action and waiting (Josh, Reid)
• 20:35–30:00 – Hope in the face of grief and illness; personal stories (Josh)
• 32:10–41:42 – Hebrew words for hope (“kava”), community aspect, active vs. passive (Reid, Josh)
• 41:42–52:02 – Hope as engagement vs. escapist disinterest; small victories (Josh)
• 52:02–69:11 – Messianic banquet texts, inclusion/exclusion, Jesus’ parable (Reid, Brent, Josh)
• 69:11–76:43 – Incarnation, action, hope as binding, communal force
• 76:52–End – Self-examination questions, closing

Summary Self-Examination Questions (76:43–77:18)

1. When I feel hope stirred up in myself, what do I see in my mind’s eye when I imagine the end of things? Who is there?
2. In what way can I herald now the future I hope for?
3. What is the best we can hope for, and do I believe God wants that too?
4. Do I believe God can get there?

Closing Reflection

This episode is an invitation to reflect on the content and character of your hope—not just as a distant, individual escapism, but as a potent, messy, restorative force that gathers, includes, acts, and embodies the future God desires for all peoples. Hope, the hosts remind us, is meant to be incarnated now, in community, for the sake of the world.

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