Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (9:26)

Republican shutdown, the longest shutdown, of course, in American history. And as Democrats, we've repeatedly maintained that we will sit down anytime, anyplace, with anyone in order to reopen the government to find a bipartisan path forward to enacting a spending agreement that actually meets the needs of the American people. Which means trying to drive down the high cost of living because America under Donald Trump and Republican policies has become far too expensive, while at the same time dealing with the Republican health care crisis. And that threatens to drive up premiums, co pays and deductibles to levels that will be unaffordable for working class Americans because of the Republican refusal to extend the Affordable Care act tax credits.

Ben Shapiro (10:11)

I love that this is somehow a Republican health care crisis. When Obamacare was created purely by Democrats, it was subsidized increasingly by Democrats. And so basically it's a Republican crisis. If Democrats can't get the cost curve down, it's a Democratic crisis because Obamacare is a gigantic fail. It is a big fail. It has not made Americans healthier in any measurable way and it has not bent the cost curve in any serious way. Meanwhile, Democrats, particularly in purple states, were recognizing that the shutdown was getting worse and worse. This is a point that was made by the treasury secretary on Sunday morning. He said the impact of the shutdown continues to get worse. Are we starting to see, see a permanent impact on the economy?

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (10:52)

Sure, George. And good, good to be with you. And we've seen an impact on the economy from day one. But it's getting worse and worse. We had a fantastic economy under President Trump the past two quarters. And now there are estimates that the economy, economic growth for this quarter could be cut by as much as half if the shutdown continues.

Ben Shapiro (11:16)

And this is something that the American people are getting very, very tired of, is beginning to hit home for people who are not government employees. People are having their flights delayed. For example, Sean Duffy, the transportation secretary, he said that even if the shutdown ends, it's going to take a while for these kinks to work themselves through the system.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (11:32)

I think the number is going to be substantial. Again, you look at the trend line, Jake, and it's only gotten worse as we've gone through the shutdown. We're day 40 now and you know, we saw the largest number of outage of controllers was On Halloween the 31st. Those numbers were, were, were 61. Yesterday it was 81. And the controllers that I've talked to said a lot of them we can miss one paycheck. They told me that virtually none of them can miss two paychecks. And so they're going to be confronted with the idea of, as you mentioned, going to get a side job, a second job to make ends meet, to put food on the table, put gas in the car, to pay their rent. And a lot of these controllers who are young, Jake, they, they, they don't make a lot of money. They're just getting into the business of being an air traffic controller. So they make less than $100,000 and they live in a really expensive place. They're the single income earner and they have a kid or two at home. It's very challenging.

Ben Shapiro (12:30)

Okay, so again, he's not wrong about this. And this is what purple state Democrats were feeling. Now the problem for Democrats is that we have been highlighting for a while the split in the Democratic Party and it is a very real split in the Democratic Party between people who actually want to get things done and people who do not want to get things done. Between the so called moderate Democrats, people like presumably Abigail Spanberger in Virginia or John Fetterman in Pennsylvania and the increasingly progressive wild eyed Democrats. And so a lot of these Democrats who broke ranks here are coming under significant fire. According to Fox News, John Fetterman put out a statement saying, saying after 40 days as a consistent voice against shutting our government down, I voted yes for the 15th time to reopen. I'm sorry. To our military SNAP recipients, government workers and Capitol police who haven't been paid in weeks. It never should have come to this. It was a failure. Senator Katherine Cortez Masto of Nevada, she said, I've consistently voted against shutting down the government because I know the pain it's causing working families. From TSA agents to government contractors. We must extend the ACA enhanced premium tax credits, but that can't come at the expense of millions of Americans across our country impacted by the shutdown. She said with the government open, we can focus on passing a full bipartisan budget for 2026. Similar sentiments from Senator Jackie Rosen of Nevada, who narrowly, like, very narrowly retained her seat, as you recall, over Sam Brown in Nevada. Very, very tight race there. She barely kept her seat. The concession we've been able to extract to get closer to extending the Affordable Care act tax credits is a vote on a bill drafted and negotiated by Senate Democrats. Let me be clear. I will keep fighting like hell to ensure we force Republicans to get this done. But here's the thing. This was a misbegotten strategy from the very beginning. The only thing it got them was a political win because again, it got Democrats out to the ballot box. That's all. It got a bunch of Democrats out to the. And I guess that is a political win. I mean, right? They did better than they might otherwise have been expected to be in, say, the Virginia House of Delegates. But they were willing to take the American people hostage, politically speaking, in order to get what they wanted here. And this is the first government shutdown that I can remember that I can recall, in which the government was shut down not in order to exact concessions to lower spending, but in order to exact concessions to increase spending. Like, that's an amazing thing. Saying I'm not going to fund the government so I can get more funding for the government is a pretty insane proposition. And that's what Democrats were doing here. Senator Jean Shaheen, she said, with the government reopened, it's time to move quickly to ensure we keep health care premiums from skyrocketing. Senator Tim Kaine Similar statement. The legislation will protect federal workers from baseless firings, reinstate those who have been wrongfully terminated during the shutdown, and ensure federal workers receive back pay. Now, again, as I say, Democrats are very, very upset. Many Democrats are really upset. So Democrats are trying to pretend there's no crack within the coalition. Senator Adam Schiff, one of the worst senators in the United States Senate from California just this Sunday, he was saying there are no cracks in the Democratic coalition, which. Well, I noticed a few.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (15:24)

There have been some talks in the.

Ben Shapiro (15:25)

Senate between Republicans and Democrats trying to forge a possible compromise. Is Democratic unity crumbling on this?

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (15:35)

No, I think what we're seeing is a lot of cracks within Republicans. As you see now. Over a dozen Republicans in the House, for example, say they want to fix the Affordable Care act problems. That's. Those are the cracks I'm seeing. You see cracks, I think, even within the White House as the president acknowledges that their lack of focus on bringing down costs, the shutdown and all its economic impacts are affecting him. They're dragging him down.

Ben Shapiro (16:02)

Okay, so again, this is, this is weak tea, because as you can see, Democrats are very, very, very upset immediately upon the announcement that enough Democrats had voted to end the shutdown, that the shutdown will in fact come to an end. Alexandra Ocasio Cortez, who has her eye on 2028, put out a statement. The average monthly SNAP benefit is $177 a person. The average ACA benefit is up to $550 a person per month. By the way, we should note at this point that that's actually a fair bit of money. I mean, you're talking about 42 million Americans who are on SNAP, and you are talking about tens of millions of Americans who are on aca. So when you're talking about increasing the federal debt and the deficit, this would be your giant driver right here. People want us to hold the line for a reason, says aoc. This is not a matter of appealing to a base. It's about people's lives. Working people want leaders whose word means something. So apparently what working people want is for Democrats to run headlong at a wall repeatedly in order to demonstrate their fealty to the principal. This, by the way, seems to be the common sort of perspective on government shutdowns. The enthusiastic members of the base constantly want members of their party to run headlong at walls to achieve in the end, very little. Government shutdowns typically just don't work. They don't tend to work for the party that is out of power. But they do provide an excellent way for politicians to pretend to be uber committed to the cause. So, for example, Chris Murphy, who, again, I have no idea why Chris Murphy thinks that he is a thing. You're not going to make fetch a thing, my dude. And you know, as, as a person with a, with pretty weak facial hair game, I got to say Chris Murphy makes me look like Matt Walsh. Here's Chris Murphy trying to explain that it's just terrible that they ended the government shutdown after the elections on Tuesday.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (17:46)

It just became absolutely clear the American people do not want Democrats to be bullied into submission. They want Democrats to fight for their health care. They want Democrats to fight Trump's illegality. Bullies gain power when righteous people yield in the face of their wrongdoing. I didn't want this shut down. I. I want it to end, but not at any cost. And of course, I wish that there was a path to saving this democracy and saving people's health care that didn't involve pain. This shutdown hurt. It did. But unfortunately, I don't think there is a way to save this country, to save our democracy without there being some difficult, hard moments along the way.

Ben Shapiro (18:40)

Okay, so, you know, again, that is. That's an angle. That's an angle. Chris Murphy attacking his own party, suggesting that his own party is insufficiently committed to the fight. Bernie Sanders, of course, has made his entire bones over doing this. This is Bernie Sanders shtick. So here it was, old man ranting at Moon, talking about how it's very bad that Republicans and Democrats will move together to fund the government. We need the government to be unfunded so that it will be even more funded forever. Here we go. Bon Santos.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (19:11)

Tonight, eight Democrats voted with the Republicans to allow them to go forward on this continuing resolution. And to my mind, this was a very, very bad vote. What it does, first of all, is it raises health care premiums for over 20 million Americans by doubling and in some cases, tripling or quadrupling. People can't afford that when we are already paying the highest prices in the world for health care. Number two, it paves the way for 15 million people to be thrown off of Medicaid and the Affordable Care Act. Studies show that will mean that some 50,000Americans will die every year unnecessarily. And all of that was done to give a trillion dollars in tax breaks to the 1%.

Ben Shapiro (20:01)

Okay? So as per his usual arrangement, all this is nonsense. The idea that 50,000Americans will die because you didn't vote the way Bernie Sanders wanted you to vote is totally specious. There is no evidence to support this proposition. But in the end, for Sanders, again, it's always about looking for some sort of dragon to slay that never quite gets slain. But if you give him enough power, then maybe the dragon will get slain. Here's Bernie Sanders saying, america wants us to fight against Trump. That's the biggest thing we need. Americans, they. What they want more than anything else is for us to just say, trump, Trump, Trump, and then fight and then lose and then fight some more.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (20:33)

As everybody knows, just on Tuesday, we had an election all over this country. And what the election showed is that the American people want us to stand up to Trumpism, to his war against working class people, to his authoritarianism. That is what the American people wanted. But tonight, that is not what happened. So we've got to go forward, do the best that we can to try to protect working class people, to make sure that the United States not only does not throw people off of health care, but ends the absurdity of being the only major country on earth that doesn't guarantee health care to all people. We have a lot of work to do, but to be honest with you, tonight was not a good night. Thank you.

Ben Shapiro (21:20)

Okay. But it was a good night for him because now he gets to divide the Democratic Party even further. Alrighty. Coming up, Gavin Newsom sounds off Zorn Mamdani, AOC the entire left wing of the Democratic Party up in arms over, you know, people actually going back to work. First. Did you know that when your metabolism is working properly, you feel the benefits in literally every aspect of your life? I found a valuable tool that gives me insights to create a healthy metabolism for my body. It's called Lumen. Lumen is the world's first handheld metabolic coach. It measures your metabolism through your breath, lets you know if you're burning fat or carbs, giving you tailored guidance to improve your nutrition, workouts, sleep, and stress management, which we could probably all use. These days. All I have to do is breathe into my lumen first thing in the morning. I know exactly what's going on with my metabolism. Then Lumen gives me a personalized nutrition plan for that day based on my actual measurements. Now, Lumen is great. It's super easy to use. You can take it on the road with you. Your metabolism is your body's engine. It's how your body turns food into fuel. Optimal metabolic health means easier weight management, improved energy levels, better fitness results, and better sleep. Lumen provides crucial insights and helpful guidance to improve your metabolic health. But it requires effort and lifestyle changes to see the results. Winter is the perfect season to build strength from within. Stay energized, stay resilient, take charge of your metabolism. Go to Lumen Me Shapiro to get an additional 10% off your lumen. That's L U M e n me slash Shapiro for 10% off on top of any offers or sales running on their website. Also. Alrighty, folks, let's talk about something that actually matters a lot. Honoring American veterans on Veterans Day. Of course, Legacy Box has been with the Ben Shapiro show for years. They've helped preserve the memories of over a million families. Now they're teaming up with all of us here at the Daily Wire to give back in a major way. Legacy Box is donating ten grand worth of Legacy Boxes to American veterans. So those incredible stories of service and sacrifice don't just get lost to time. Here's where it gets personal. If there's a veteran in your family, head on over to get.dailywire.com legacybox or click the link in the show notes. But even if you don't have a veteran in your life, you still have a legacy that's worth preserving. Right now, Legacy Box is giving all of my listeners exclusive access to this deal in honor of Veterans Day. Just nine bucks per tape to digitally preserve your family memories. Legacy Box is the world's largest digitizer. They've helped over a million families relive their most important moments, digitizing every tape, photo, film reel by hand right in Chattanooga, Tennessee. If you order right now, you can still get your digitized memories back in time for the holidays so you can relive those precious moments as a family again. I did this for my parents and now they can see what they were like as children with their parents. I've done it for my own family. It's great. Whether it's a loved one in uniform or your family's holiday mornings, preserve those stories that shape you. Head on over to legacybox.com Shapiro today to preserve your family's history. That's legacybox.com Shapiro Gavin Newsom doing the same thing. Gavin Newsom says that the Democrats are galvanizing people with the shutdown. This sort of performative politics is very bad for the American people. Unfortunately, it has become de rigueur. The more that you yell at your own party, the more that you are perceived as authentic by the segments of the base that wants you to be president, I guess. Here's Gavin Newsom.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (24:14)

Bottom line is the president United States canceled a meeting with the two leaders because of public pressure before the government shutdown. He decided to have that meeting. He didn't invite you and others in, which for Donald Trump in and of itself is remarkable. He just instead sent out a true social with Trump 2028 hats and then he went golfing that weekend before the shutdown. Shortly thereafter, he had no interest or energy into avoiding this government shutdown. He has no interest or energy to end it. Today he's the president of the United States. As someone who's an executive chief executive of state larger than 21 state population. Populations combine the fourth large economy. You have a responsibility in that role to convene to bring people together. That's why there's a government shutdown, period. Full stop. What the Democrats, though, have done, and I give Jeffries and Schumer tremendous credit, is they've galvanized people of all political stripes, rural, urban, suburban.

Ben Shapiro (25:13)

So again, this is Gavin Newsom running for president. And this is the thing. As much as these so called moderate Democrats are voting with Republicans to end the government shutdown, the reality is their base is captured by this brand of crazy. And this brand of crazy is probably going to decide their next presidential candidate. Which is why, again, while Democrats keep saying that Abigail Spanberger is the future of the party, I have some doubts. I have some doubts. I think that Zoran Mandani is far likelier to be the future of the Democratic Party because I've yet to see a moderate movement, a truly moderate movement, arise from the Democratic Party anytime in my lifetime. Every time you think they're going to moderate, they move even further to the left. Even when they elect somebody like Joe Biden, who's supposed to be a moderating anti Bernie influence, he then adopts Bernie's exact plan and starts implementing those at scale. Zorma Dani by the way, the mask is coming off for Zoran Momdani. It was all fun and games when he was just talking about affordability, but now, as the Washington Post is pointing out, of all places. By the way, got to point out, the Washington Post op ed page seems to have changed the orientation pretty significantly since Jeff Bezos made some changes over there. It makes it one of the more interesting reads now. According to the Washington Post editorial board, a new era of class warfare has begun in New York and no one is more excited than General Lisimo Uzoran. Mamdani witnessed the Mayor elect's change of character since his Tuesday election victory. Mamdani ran an upbeat campaign with a nice guy demeanor and perpetual smile, papering over a long history of divisive and demagogic statements. New Yorkers periodically checking in on politics could understandably believe he simply wanted to bring the city together and make it more affordable. That interpretation became much harder after his victory speech. Across 23 angry minutes laced with identity politics and seething with resentment, Mamdani abandoned his cool disposition and made clear his view of politics isn't about unity. It isn't about letting people build better lives for themselves. It's about identifying class enemies, from landlords who take advantage of tenants to the bosses who exploit workers and then crushing them. His goal is not to increase wealth, but to Dole it out to favored groups. The word growth didn't appear in the speech, but President Donald Trump garnered eight mentions in the days since winning. Mamdani's favorite word has become mandate. He won decisively. Now he wants to pursue his agenda from the rent freeze to free childcare and buses. And as mayor of New York, his control over taxes and transportation is limited. He needs approval from the state to raise taxes. His transition team includes several New York political insiders who understand how to pull the levers of power. So it'll be interesting to see whether Mamdani gets away with it. By the way, it is. It is fascinating to see. Mamdani's first move was to go to Puerto Rico as mayor of New York, where he promptly went to a mosque and people chanted Alhu Akbar for him. We are so proud of you, brother.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (27:53)

So all yours.

Ben Shapiro (28:02)

And the guy standing next to him is. Is wearing a. Some sort of garment that has on it the. The word Palestine with the Palestinian flag. I mean, Mamdani was running for mayor because that is his number one issue. It always was his number one issue from the time that he was young. Yeah. The fact is that everything else is sort of slathering over the Students for Justice in Palestine politics with a Marxist patina. Meanwhile, the biggest problem for Mamdani and for the Democratic Party is which way does the state of New York go? So it'll be fascinating because the state of New York is now a microcosm of Democratic politics. Which way does the state of New York go? Toward Mamdani or toward Kathy Hochul? So Kathy Hochul is the governor of the state. She is running a very, very tight race right now with the newly announced congresswoman, Elise Stefanik, who's now the newly announced Republican candidate for the governorship in New York. Very tight race. And she has to, on the one hand, fend off Stefanik, who's critical of her, and on the other hand, fend off Zoran Mamdani, who. Who wants to radically increase taxes in the state. And here she was saying, well, no, we're not going to do what Mamdani wants. We'll see how long that lasts. Because if she loses that Democratic base, it's quite possible she loses the election as well. I cannot set forth a plan right now that takes money out of a.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (29:13)

System that relies on the fares of.

Ben Shapiro (29:15)

The buses and the subways.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (29:17)

But can we find a path to.

Ben Shapiro (29:19)

Make it more affordable for people who need help? Of course. Course we can. And so child care. Child care. I already committed To.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (29:26)

So we'll be on a path to.

Ben Shapiro (29:27)

Get there because I'm committed to this as mom governor. I get it. But also to do it statewide right now, it's about $15 billion, the entire.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (29:36)

Amount of my reserves.

Ben Shapiro (29:39)

Okay, so again, she is stuck. She's stuck in Iraq and a hard place. Meanwhile, Mamdani's hypocrisy knows no bounds, says Zarmani, of course, is reliant on other people's money, which presumably is why his victory party in New York City, according to the New York Post, was charging $22 for espresso martini coolers, $15 for glasses of Riesling white wine, and for water. For water, like 13 bucks a pop, 10 or 12 bucks a pop for hot dogs. I mean like again, the socialism, it costs a lot of money, it turns out. Joining us online is Senator Rick Scott. He of course was elected to the Senate in 2018 from migrate state of Florida. And he has been all over this story broken by the New York Post originally about the Zar Momdani mayoral campaign and how it was powered, at least in part by foreign influences. Senator Scott, thanks so much for taking the time.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (30:27)

Really appreciate it doesn't make you mad. And you know, we, we, we have laws in this country. Follow the law, okay? Get elected the right way. So I think, look, what we have to do on all these things is make sure people do the right thing. They follow the law and if they don't, they need to be investigated.

Ben Shapiro (30:48)

So what exactly is the allegation here and how does it violate the law?

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (30:52)

Well, we can't take contributions from foreigners and foreigners are not supposed to influence our elections. And so when you get a donation, you have to look at who it is. And you shouldn't be accepting donations from foreigners. And as sure appears they did. Now after the election, they're sending the money back. But the other thing we have to look at is we have to look at these, I think we need to really look at these foreign organizations that went to get out the vote and things like that. And look at the legality of that is also because it's not just money into your campaign, it's these groups that come in that are foreign, foreign backed or trying to influence our elections. They should not be able to influence our elections.

Ben Shapiro (31:32)

So Senator Scott, you know, I assume here we're talking about the nonprofit Desus rising up and moving called Self Drum and its political arm Drumbeats. Apparently, according to the New York Post, they've built the most effective field operation in city politics. In recent memory. So they describe themselves as essentially a domestic program that, sure, it's filled with South Asian and Indo Caribbean immigrants, but it's essentially an American organization. You seem to suggest, and the New York Post seems to suggest that there is some untruth to that.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (32:01)

I think we got to get the facts. Let's, let's get the facts. Tell us who their donors are and what did they do, right? And you know, so if, you know, look, if it's legitimate, it's legitimate. Prove it's legitimate. But doesn't it look pretty bad and, you know, you know, been the other thing you, the other thing. When you're in politics, what you don't want to do is do things that look bad. So if you have nothing to hide, put the information out there and let people make a good decision.

Ben Shapiro (32:28)

So obviously there's been a lot of suspicion also about the gaming of algorithms surrounding Zaramdani. I know that there's been a lot of concern that, particularly on TikTok and also on X, that there is foreign bot driven influence regarding Mamdani. Have you heard anything about that?

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (32:42)

Well, it's what you read, but no, look, it's clear, okay? TikTok is controlled by the Communist Party of China. It's anti America, it's anti our way of life. It's a despicable government, okay? They're using every influence they can. So with, so the problem with TikTok is if you look at, if you, if you, you can do all the analysis you want, if you look at TikTok vs Instagram and look at how they treat the Tiananmen Square, how they treat, you know, Trump, how they, you know, how they do all this stuff. It's clearly anti American values.

Ben Shapiro (33:16)

And daily wire reports, quote, independent analyses show that networks manipulated engagements summon foreign audiences to Mandani on Instagram. By the end of his campaign, fewer than 50% of his online engagements from viral posts came from American users, which is a complete reversal from the clear domestic majority. At the start on TikTok, content favorable to Mamdani and hostile to Andrew Cuomo searched 55% beyond organic reach. And apparently, again, as we mentioned, on the ground, the patterns seem to be identical. That there are foreign political movements that apparently have been, at the very least, they appear to have been influencing operations inside the United States. That requires more explication. So, Senator Scott, what's the next step in investigating all of this?

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (33:54)

Well, well, number one, we, we need to look into it. Number two, let's follow the law. Okay? TikTok has to be sold. It has to be controlled. It can't be not. It cannot have any control by the Communist Party of China. None can have. None. That's the law. And that needs to get done as quickly as possible.

Ben Shapiro (34:13)

Well, that is Senator Rick Scott from Florida. He's all over this particular story and we will keep tabs on it as it unfolds. Senator Scott, thanks so much for the.

Guest/Interviewee (various, including Senator Rick Scott) (34:19)

Time and I'm glad you're in Florida. And thanks, thanks for your voice, by the way.

Ben Shapiro (34:26)

Thank you. One of the problems here is just for the American body politic, because one of the things that we have seen here, look, I'm pointing out the problems inside the Democratic Party. Obviously, we've spent a lot of time talking about the problems inside the Republican Party, but the American people are deeply unhappy with our politics right now, like truly unhappy with our politics. And I think there is a reason for that. And the reason is everyone is lying to them and they are buying the lies. And then it turns out the consequences of those lies do not result in people awakening. They just result in people turning to the next grifter who walks up the block. I point this out because there's an interesting Wall Street Journal piece today looking at the polling data, quote, U.S. elections are sending a consistent message. Americans are deeply frustrated with their government's inability to solve problems. The latest example arrived Tuesday in rebuke of President Trump as voters rallied to Democrats in hopes they can better address affordability and other major challenges. That pushback was delivered just 12 months after the President swept all seven of the top battleground states in a show of Republican dominance. The rapid fire swing in fortunes for both parties is the result of a narrowly divided nation quick to throw out elected officials seen as slow to improve their lives. To many Americans, government is literally not working, as evidenced by a federal shutdown that has now stretched into the longest in US History. So if you look at the last couple of decades, control of Congress and the White House has seesawed between the parties significantly more frequently, with the Senate, House and White House all changing hands four times. Propelling the shift is the fact that many voters want bigger changes from Washington. Nationwide in the 2024 election, according to the Journal, roughly 3 in 10 voters said they wanted total upheaval in how the country is run. Now, there is a fascinating graphic that I want to show you about public trust in government, which is now near its historic lows. It is down in the 20% range. So take a look at this. Okay. Back in the mid-1960s, early 1960s, trust in government was very, very high, like up near 80%. And then as government radically grew over the course of the Great Society programs from LBJ and in the era that followed the Nixon and Carter era, it absolutely nosedived all the way from almost 80% all the way down to below 30%. That's as the government grew. It's as the government became, quote, unquote, more helpful to your lives as the government intervened more and more and spent more and more. That is not a coincidence. As government grows, people expect more from the government. And when the government fails to deliver, they get disappointed. So during the 1980s, when Ronald Reagan said, the government is not going to fix your problems, you're going to fix your problems, and I'm going to get government out of the way, trusting government went up again. You can see it in the polling data. It went from about 30% into the mid-40s. And then near the end of the 1980s, it started to decline again. It declined all the way until the mid-1990s. And then in the mid-1990s, something happened. What happened in the mid-1990s? The Gingrich revolution. Bill Clinton started to make deals to cut the size and scope of government, including on things like welfare reform. And then trusting government started to go up again. It started to increase all the way up to 50% by about 2000. And then what happened? The government started to radically grow again under George W. Bush. People forget George W. Bush was not a fiscal conservative. George W. Bush was a, quote, unquote, compassionate conservative. And leaving aside the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, he spent an awful lot of money. It was he who expanded Medicare Part D. It was he who expanded the no Child Left Behind Act. It was he who did steel tariffs. And the trust in government continued to decline until finally it seemed to crater out around 2010, in the aftermath of the Great Recession, at around 20%. And it has been there basically ever since. So for people who are big proponents of big government, I have a question. Explain this chart. Why is it that there seems to be an inverse relationship between the size and growth of government and trusting government? If government is so amazing at everything, if government is so great at everything, why is it that in the eras where government is cut, trust goes up, and in the era where government grows, trust goes down? Why is that happening? This is a deeply important point, really important, because you have politicians on both sides who are fully incapable of just saying the truth. They're afraid the American people will get angry at them if they Say the truth. The truth is the vast majority of problems in the lives of Americans are. Are not solvable by the government. There are many problems created by the government skewing of markets. If you look at a chart of the products in American life that have grown more expensive over the course of the last 30 years and the products that have grown less expensive, significantly less expensive over the course of the last 30 years, something shocking occurs. The products that have grown more expensive are all subsidized by the government. Education, college education, health care, health insurance. Right. All these things have continued to go up because they are subsidized by the government. And the government skews the markets. And then there are, you know, the everyday products you use, like your tv, like your phone. Right. These things have all gone down your dishwasher. All these things are less expensive and better. Why? Because markets work to make things cheaper and more plentiful. And government makes things significantly more expensive by skewing the incentive structures. And yet no politician will say this. Every politician is doing a version of what Zoran Mandani did in New York. It's why you see people on the right who are praising Zorman. Well, he said affordability a lot. I hear this a lot from people on the right. He did talk about affordability. And if President Trump just talks more about affordability, that means that he'll win. No, it doesn't. The party in power is going to be blamed for lack of affordability. The party out of power is going to claim that if you gave them power, they will solve the affordability problem by having more power. This is a race to the bottom in terms of centralized government control. But here's the thing. It doesn't get better. It doesn't get better because if each party pledges that they will expand government in ways and times of their own choosing, and then they fail, and then the other party just does the same thing, then trusting government is going to continue to crater. It's going to continue to go down. We need someone. For the love of Mike, we need someone to just say the truth. I can't fix a lot of these problems. You can fix many of these problems. The best thing that I can do is get out of your way. Deregulation, lower taxes, less government interventionism in your life. Now, again, this doesn't mean getting rid of the benefits immediately that people need to live on because they've been made dependent on the government. But yes, transitional plans away from those things would be a good thing, because otherwise they will eat our Federal budget, as indeed they already have. If you wonder how he got to a 38 trillion dollar debt, that is how he got to a 38 trillion dollar debt. The convenient thing is to blame discretionary spending. It is not in fact discretionary spending in the main. It is the fact that people constantly come in and say they're going to solve all your problems if you just give them more money and more power and more centralized control. And then people. This is why people are ping ponging between the parties. Because Republicans say that and then they don't fix it, and then Democrats say it and they don't fix it, and then Republicans say it and they don't fix it. At some point the American people are going to have to get wise to this political grift. Now, Peter Thiel, he did an interview at the Free Press, pretty interesting in which he was talking about capitalism in ways I didn't particularly like. But one thing he said is that we are in what he called a political boom market. And I think that's right, because we have lived, we now live in a time where people so little trust themselves and risk taking and the free markets that they're willing to toss their power and at any demagogue who will tell them that he can solve their problems. And guess what? Your problems ain't getting solved this way. They are not. Zor Momdani is not going to make your world more affordable. Tariffs, centralized government policy will not make your world more affordable. They will not. Signing giant stimulus checks is not going to make your world more affordable. We've tried it. It fails. You know what makes your world more affordable? People being left alone to produce and trade and live the free lives that they were guaranteed under the U.S. constitution. That's what makes things better and more affordable. It's why America is the envy of the world. Every other country on earth tries this centralized government policy junk and has been trying it for legitimately centuries, going all the way back to mercantilism. The notion that if we just try it hard enough this time it's going to fix it. I see zero evidence that that is in fact the case. Alrighty. In a moment we'll get to the state of the economy. What is going to change? Can the Trump administration really lower the prices first? Anywhere worth going is worth going in. A pair of awesome boots and Tokovas makes finding your perfect pair easy. Whether you're a generational rancher, a lifelong cowboy, or just trying on your first pair of boots to Kovas crafts quality western footwear for Everybody. With over 200 meticulous handcrafted steps, their boots deliver that broken in comfort from day one. Plus their in store experience is second to none. Think expert staff, complimentary beverages and free customizations to make your boots truly yours. 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But I do wear Tacova boots because they're just that comfortable. They're just that excellent. Right now get 10% off@tokova.com Shapiro when you sign up for email and texts, that's 10% off at t e c o v a s.com Shapiro to covos.com Shapiro so you cite for details to Covus point your toes West. Now the reason I'm talking here about the sort of model of politics that has broken into the mainstream and now seems to be more rising on both sides is because it's not going to fix our problems. It's not going to fix our problems. If you actually want to bring down prices, if you actually want affordability. We know the things that make affordability happen here on planet Earth. They are free markets, deregulation, they are free trade, comparative advantage. That's what brings prices down. Now that's not going to affect everybody equally beneficially. Some people are going to do a lot better than others. Some people presumably will be the victims of what Joseph Schumpeter, the economist, called creative destruction. Every time you have a new industry or a more competitive business that comes up, somebody loses in that particular zero sum game. But the thing about the market is that it has many iterations. And so even if you lose in that particular game, you then get to come back and do it again and become even more competitive. That is why free markets always drive prices down. It's why when there are people out there who are critical of, quote, unquote, luxury products, we have to understand that every thing that you now consider to be a necessity, a staple of your life, was once a luxury product. The food that you eat at your table is significantly more diverse than the food that your great grandparents ate. Why? Because at one point, it was a luxury for rich people. And then it turned out a lot of people wanted it and there was competition to bring it to the people, and the prices went down. That was true of cars. It's true of microwaves. It's true of centralized air conditioning. It is true of your cell phone. Literally every product that you use was once a luxury product. It's why when you go back, go back and watch the old movie Wall street and you see Gordon Gekko walking around with a cell phone, everybody's like, ooh, ah. And it looks like a. A shoebox that he's holding to his head. And now every single person, including the poorest American, has a cell phone. Hey, that's what free markets do. But it seems that no one is even willing to argue for free markets these days anymore. And then why are we surprised when we disappoint? Because if you keep using a screwdriver to try and knock in the nail, you're unlikely to be successful. So there's a lot of angst on the Republican side of the aisle about the state of the economy and also about the Trump affordability issues. Secretary of the Treasury Scott Bessant, who of course understands capitalism better than I do, Scott Besant, he says that we are going to bring prices down over the next years and months.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (46:24)

I can tell you the what we're not going to do is what happened under the Biden administration, where, you know, the administration and the media, gas gaslit everyone and said, oh, you know, there's a vibe session. You don't understand how good you had had. And what happened then was we had the worst inflation 40 or 50 years, 20 to 23%. But the basket of goods and services for working Americans was up more than 30%. And what we're seeing is we had to stop the increase first. Now we are starting to see price prices level off, come down. You know, gasoline is down, interest rates are down, some mortgages are down. And I think we are making substantial progress on that. And I think over the coming months, in the next year, prices are Going to come down.

Ben Shapiro (47:17)

Okay, well, that may very well be true. I hope that that's true. I think one of the ways the prices probably come down is if sometime next year when the Supreme Court rules on tariffs and probably strikes down a lot of the tariffs, the markets open up again, which would be very, very good. But I'll tell you what's not gonna bring prices down is things like proposing 50 year mortgages. So President Trump over the weekend decided that he was going to promote what he called 50 year mortgages, that President FDR had promoted the 30 year mortgage. And under President Trump there would be a 50 year mortgage. Okay. The problem of course, with the 50 year mortgage is that it skews the risk incentive cycle. What a 50 year mortgage actually will do is create a bubble in real estate as more and more people take out a 50 year mortgage on which they will presumably pay tons and tons and tons of interest. And then, don't worry, 20 years down the road, everybody will complain about the interest payments that they are making and how much more they are paying than the actual principal. And then we'll have a 75 year mortgage and meanwhile the prices will continue to go up. That doesn't generate actual lowering of prices. What generates actual. Again, when you have a supply demand problem, increasing the demand will, without increasing the supply, does not actually lower the price, it increases the price. If you want to increase the supply and lower the demand, or just increase the supply and maintain the same demand, or even increase supply faster than demand, you will get lowered prices for the same reason. When President Trump says that he is going to push out a $2,000 tariff dividend to Americans, that the amount of money the federal government has received in via the tariffs allows for the payment of $2,000 to every American family. That is inflationary. It's a stimulus check that is going to increase prices because that's just helicopter money. Helicopter money means that everyone has more money in their pocket and then they take that money and they spend that money, then the prices temporarily go up. None of this is counter inflationary. President Trump put out a statement saying people that are against tariffs are fools. We are now, I assume that means Milton Friedman and Friedrich Hayek and Ludwig Mises. We are now the richest, most respected country in the world with almost no inflation and a record stock market price. 401ks, our highest ever. We are taking in trillions of dollars and will soon begin paying down our enormous debt. $37 trillion record investment in the USA, plants and factories going up all over the place. A dividend of at least $2,000 a person, not including high income people, will be paid to everyone. Well, Scott Bessant, the Treasury Secretary, is like, well, I don't know about that $2,000 dividend thing. He also promises, no, no, no. A dividend of at least $2,000 a person, not including high income people. How is he going to pay that.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (49:45)

Dividend of $2,000 a person? It's not about taking in the revenue. It's about rebalancing. And the revenue occurs early on. And then as we rebalance and the jobs come home, then it becomes domestic tax revenue. The $2,000 dividend could come in lots of forms in lots of ways, George. You know, it could be just the tax decreases that we are seeing on the President's agenda. You know, no tax on tips, no tax on overtime, no tax on Social Security, deductibility of auto loans.

Ben Shapiro (50:22)

Okay, so, you know, again, you know, the fact that that's. Keep walking. This back centralized government policy is not going to fix the affordability problem. It isn't. Historically, it has not. Name a massive government intervention that made the cost curve go down. Really? Name like one. Please explain how. Unless what you're talking about is so thoroughly screwing the economy that you end up with a deflationary cycle like the 1930s that you could theoretically do, you could really screw up the economy so badly that demand drops off a cliff and then you have people burning their grain in their backyard to artificially inflate the prices. I guess you, I suppose you could do that. Scott Besant was trying to explain President Trump's tariffs on Sunday as well. He said the goal is to rebalance trade.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (51:03)

It's completely consistent that the revenues come in at the beginning. Then as we rebalance, which is the goal of this, bring back high paid manufacturing jobs to the US Then it will then morph into domestic tax revenues. You know, President Trump has consistently fought for the American worker and we are seeing trillions of investments in the US that would not have occurred without the tariffs.

Ben Shapiro (51:34)

You know, again, I have doubts. And we'll find out if the American people feel the same way. It turns out that the classical economic thoughts about tariffs, in my view, tend to be correct. And we'll see how this all pays off. Meanwhile, the media are indeed complete trash. They have been complete trash for a very long time. This became extraordinarily clear. And I mean, this is really an amazing thing. Apparently the director general of the BBC resigned on Sunday amid scandal after the British state broadcaster shared doctored footage of President Trump speaking on January 6th is. According to the New York Post, Tim Davy, who's headed up the BBC for five years, said he was taking ultimate responsibility for recent mistakes made in a statement that was published by the BBC. Apparently that came after it was revealed that their flagship news program, Panorama, spliced together two separate clips of President Trump talking on January 6, 2021, implying he had directly told his supporters to storm the Capitol, which of course is not true. The program, which was aired one week before the 2024 presidential election, completely misled viewers by by showing Trump telling supporters he was going to walk with them to the Capitol and fight like hell. But his full quote was that he would walk with supporters to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard. But then the BBC cut out the part that was relevant to make it sound like he was, you know, going to lead them in storming the Capitol. Apparently, senior executives at the BBC ignored and dismissed a series of serious internal complaints, according to a 19 page memo. And now the head of the BBC is gone, which is perfectly appropriate. But it demonstrates the lengths to which the media tried to go in 2024 in order to prop up the ailing candidacy of Kamala Harris. Pretty impressive, impressive stuff. Well, joining me on the line is six time Emmy award winning actor Kelsey Grammer. Of course, you know him from a wide variety of amazing shows ranging from Frasier to Cheers and so much more. He has a brand new movie that just came out, it's called the Christmas Ring. Kelsey, thanks so much for taking the time. Really appreciate.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (53:28)

It's a pleasure, thanks.

Ben Shapiro (53:31)

So why don't you tell me the story of the Christmas Ring, at least the premise of it and why people should go see it. Sure.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (53:37)

The Christmas Ring. We didn't reinvent the wheel. Karen Kingsbury has written a lovely tale about redemption, forgiveness, love, looking for love, loss, a bit of grief and you throw in some Christmas miracle stuff. And the idea that we are children of God, we're all children of God and we all look for, for the blessings of Christmas, you know, the redemption story. And, and love is, love is what defines it all. It's, it's, it's for kids, it's for anybody that still cares about just their love and their life and their family. And it's also, it honors the veterans in quite a way. And that's, it's premiering on, on Veterans Day 11, 11, 11, which is, you know, 11th minute, 11th hour, 11th day veterans tank.

Ben Shapiro (54:25)

So let's talk about that angle of it because it really is quite Beautiful. Apparently the film features 100 background actors who are active or retired military members. Is that right?

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (54:34)

Right. Active duty. Yeah, they. And they, they. They featured them in the, in the scene. There's a scene at the end, toward the end of the movie where they feature and in a tribute to those who serve. And yeah, it's actually quite lovely. There was even a. A World War II veteran among them, who I think is 102 years old, named James Daniels. And it's a cool thing. I mean, my, My own family, my granddad served in World War II and he would have been 122 right now instead of 102, but he was, he was quite a guy and, and their lives were defined by service. And that was an interesting thing. Great to be raised by.

Ben Shapiro (55:11)

Kelsey, it does seem as though there is a revival that's happening right now in Hollywood, or at least outside of Hollywood, in terms of material that actually is friendly to conservatives, that isn't looking down at conservatives, and that actually is quality driven as opposed to sort of just pandering. What do you make of that?

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (55:31)

Right. Well, you know what, I look on it as a kind of a. It's about time groundswell of, of a rebirth of a sense of faith and the sort of the consistent interweaving of both conservative principles, which is basically to, you know, save what's good about us and, and. And faith, which is also. That saves what's good about us. And I think. I think those two things are. Are twinned in, in the new movement. And I do think there is a sense of entertainment People finally caught on that these people have money too, and, and that they'd like to see some entertainment that's geared toward them at the same time.

Ben Shapiro (56:11)

Well, Kelsey, I would be remiss if I didn't ask, as per one of my producers, he's very excited. Also, just as a side note that you are going to be in Adventures Doomsday. So that's. That's very exciting news as well for a lot of folks.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (56:23)

It's been. It's very exciting news for me because, you know, 20 years ago I did it and we premiered the film in can. And all the producers came up to me and said, we've just cracked this whole new idea for the, for the ongoing series. And I thought, I finally. In a big franchise, I've made it. And they said, we're going younger and you guys are all gone. So I thought, oh, well, that's sort of a bit crestfallen after that. But it was, it was a fun, kind of, you know, a dish best served cold. When they came back 20 years later and I did a little revival, I did a little appearance on what, what was called the Marvels and people really responded to it. It's been great. I've been going around the world. They're actually people to go, oh my God, you're back. You're beast. So it's been really fun.

Ben Shapiro (57:12)

Well, that is Kelsey Grammer. You can go check out his brand new movie again. It's coming out. It'll be available in theaters on Veterans Day. It's titled the Christmas Ring. Definitely worth the watch. Kelsey, thanks so much for stopping by.

Guest/Co-host (various, including Kelsey Grammer) (57:23)

Thank you. Nice to talk with you, Ben.

Ben Shapiro (57:26)

Alrighty, folks. Coming up, we're going to jump into a little bit of foreign policy and a shocking story about apparently discriminatory hiring at Coca Cola. Remember, in order to watch, you have to be a member. If you're not a member, become a member. Use code Shapiro at checkout for two months free on all annual plans. Click that link in the description and join us. It's okay not to be perfect with finances. Experian is your big financial friend and here to help.

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Ben Shapiro (58:24)

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