The Ben Shapiro Show Ep. 2319 - MTG Revolts Against Trump, MAGA!

Date: November 17, 2025
Host: Ben Shapiro
Podcast: The Daily Wire

Episode Overview

This episode centers on the escalating feud between Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene (MTG) and former President Donald Trump, examining the internal fractures within the MAGA movement and the broader Republican Party. Ben Shapiro dissects MTG’s public criticisms of Trump, her alleged motivations, and the media’s responses. The episode also delves into pressing policy debates, especially on economic "affordability," government spending, health care policy, and recent developments in immigration enforcement and high-profile news stories.

1. MTG vs. Trump: The Public Feud

The Boiling Point

• [01:19] The simmering conflict between MTG and Trump erupted after months of her criticisms.
• MTG has been distancing herself from Trump, retailing what Shapiro calls a “TEMU version of MAGA” and becoming a media darling for legacy outlets.
• The feud reached its apex when MTG accused Trump, on CBS, of protecting pedophiles related to the Jeffrey Epstein files:

  "Rich, powerful people should not be protected. That is completely wrong...the government will not protect the predators."
  — MTG (paraphrased by Shapiro) [03:06]

Trump's Retaliation

• [03:36] Trump posted on Truth Social withdrawing support for MTG, using mocking nicknames and referencing her “complaints.”

  “All I see wacky Marjorie do is complain...She was at 12% and didn’t have a chance unless she had my endorsement, which she wasn’t about to get.”
  — Donald Trump (quoted by Shapiro) [04:45]

• Trump also entertained backing a primary challenger in her district.

MTG's Response

• MTG alleged Trump lied about her and accused him of fighting "to stop the Epstein files from coming out."

  “Most Americans wish he would fight this hard to help the forgotten men and women of America…”
  — MTG, in text to Trump [05:35]

• She distanced herself personally: “But I don’t worship or serve Donald Trump. I worship God. Jesus is my Savior...” [06:15]

2. The Epstein Files Controversy

Accusations and Denials

• [06:40] MTG claims Trump's opposition to releasing Epstein files proves his intent to shield powerful figures.
• Trump responds: He supports releasing the Epstein files and says, “We have nothing to hide.” [07:12]

  “House Republicans should vote to release the Epstein files...not fall into the Epstein trap, which is actually a curse on the Democrats, not us. Make America great again.” — Donald Trump (Truth Social, read by Shapiro)

• Shapiro calls the suggestion that Trump is protecting Epstein “ridiculous,” explaining it’s being used as a “wedge” by MAGA splinter groups.

Legacy Media and Safety Rhetoric

• [08:33] MTG on CNN: Claims Trump calling her a traitor puts her life in danger.

  "...those are the types of words that can radicalize people against me and put my life in danger." — Marjorie Taylor Greene [08:40]

• Trump’s blunt reply:

  “I don’t think, frankly, I don’t think anybody cares about her.”
  — Donald Trump (via Shapiro) [09:19]

3. Power Struggle within MAGA

Splinter Groups and Conspiracy Motives

• [10:10] Shapiro contends MTG and allies (e.g., Thomas Massie, Steve Bannon) are using topics like Epstein and foreign policy differences—especially regarding Israel—as leverage to wrest control of MAGA from Trump.
• MTG has speculated about Israel’s role in Epstein-related conspiracies, though Shapiro insists there’s no evidence.

  "If there's evidence, present it. I'm all in favor of all Jeffrey Epstein files being released. All of it."
  — Ben Shapiro [13:25]

• Bannon and MTG are painted as seeking to redefine MAGA for their own purposes.

Redefining Trumpism

• Shapiro emphasizes:

  “MAGA is President Trump. Period. End of story...to claim the mantle of Trumpism without Trump is a bizarre move.” [16:35]

4. Economics and Affordability Debate

Trump’s Tariff Policy and Affordability Plans

• Trump administration floats $2,000 direct payments funded by tariff revenue, but Shapiro critiques this as “helicopter money”:

  “That is not going to solve the price of living problem. That is just helicopter money. Helicopter money increases prices.” [23:43]

• Trump claims tariff policies reduce inflation.
• Shapiro corrects media claims using a Fed study:

  “What the study actually says is that tariffs eventually lower inflation by leading to economic depression.” [25:20]

  • Paraphrase: Tariffs briefly increase prices, then demand craters as jobs are lost and consumption drops.

Government Spending and Democrat "Blackmail"

• Democrats press for more spending on food and health subsidies, threatening political fallout if not renewed.
• Shapiro likens this to addiction:

  "This is the magic opiate that is government spending. Once you get people used to a certain level...then it starts to flatten out and you need more government spending to achieve the same high." [28:50]

Healthcare and Obamacare

• Ongoing battle over ACA subsidies. Senator Tim Kaine threatens Republican blame if subsidies lapse:

  "It would be political malpractice...Americans will see who's standing with them and who's standing against them on affordability of health care."
  — Tim Kaine (quoted by Shapiro) [32:47]

• Shapiro asserts Democrats always outbid Republicans on subsidies—"play stupid games, win stupid prizes." [30:32]
• Suggests genuine affordability comes from more supply, less demand stimulation.

5. In-depth Healthcare Policy Discussion

with Avik Roy, Foundation for Research on Equal Opportunity

Why U.S. Healthcare Is So Expensive

• [42:15] U.S. spends more and subsidizes more per capita than any industrialized nation.

  "Not only do we spend way more on health care than other industrialized countries, but we actually subsidize healthcare more per capita than any other country in the world." — Avik Roy [42:15]

• Wage and price controls from WWII-era and employer-based insurance are cited as root distortions:

  “That system, that 80 year old system of your employer being the middleman...was the fundamental distortion that has led to every other problem...”
  — Avik Roy [44:22]

Health Savings Accounts & Reform Strategy

• Health savings accounts alone can’t fix healthcare; insurance regulation must also be reformed.
• Roy’s strategic proposal: Trade a temporary ACA subsidy extension for bipartisan deregulation of the individual insurance market. Only with 60 votes in the Senate could real regulatory reform be achieved and preserved.
• Shapiro underscores: Deregulation will be slow, piecemeal, and require patience.

6. Immigration Enforcement and News Roundup

New York vs. ICE

• NYC politicians, notably Zoram Mamdani, vow to resist ICE:

  "...calling ICE a rogue agency and vowing to stop it from enforcing the law with deportations."
  — Ben Shapiro [49:13]

• Shapiro notes Trump’s border policies have boosted recruitment and morale among border agents.

Other Notable News

• Hunter Biden: Compared Trump to Hitler, then argued Trump is "worse" due to lacking ideology. [52:20]
• Michelle Obama: Claims U.S. “isn’t ready for a woman president” due to sexism; Shapiro disputes this and calls out ongoing complaints from leading Democrats. [53:38]
• Thomas Crooks (Trump rally shooter): New details suggest he shifted from pro- to anti-Trump in 2020; had online connections to extreme communities and ideology. Shapiro urges transparency on investigative files.
• Venezuela & International Affairs: Briefly teased for members-only content.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• [04:45] Trump on MTG:
  “All I see wacky Marjorie do is complain, complain, complain. She was at 12% and didn’t have a chance unless she had my endorsement...”
• [05:35] MTG’s text to Trump:
  “Most Americans wish he would fight this hard to help the forgotten men and women of America...But I don’t worship or serve Donald Trump. I worship God.”
• [13:25] Shapiro on conspiracy theories:
  “If there's evidence, present it. I'm all in favor of all Jeffrey Epstein files being released. All of it.”
• [16:35] Shapiro on MAGA:
  “MAGA is President Trump. Period. End of story.”
• [25:20] Shapiro on tariffs:
  “What the study actually says is that tariffs eventually lower inflation by leading to economic depression.”
• [30:32] Shapiro on Democrat spending tactics:
  "This is the magic opiate that is government spending."
• [42:15] Avik Roy on subsidies:
  “We actually subsidize healthcare more per capita than any other industrialized nation.”

Key Segment Timestamps

• MTG vs. Trump Feud / Epstein Files: 01:16–09:19
• Splintering of MAGA Movement: 10:10–16:35
• Economic Affordability / Tariff Policy: 23:43–28:50
• Government Spending / Obamacare Debate: 28:50–36:50
• Healthcare Policy Interview (Avik Roy): 41:12–49:00
• Immigration, Biden/Obama/News Analysis: 49:02 onward

Tone & Style

Ben Shapiro’s signature rapid, combative, and analytical style frames the entire episode. He utilizes sarcasm and sharp invective, particularly against political opponents, as well as MTG and those he sees as challenging Trump’s ownership of MAGA. Shapiro’s skepticism toward government intervention is consistent and underlies his economic and policy commentary.