Podcast Summary: "How to Know What's Real: How to Win at Real Life"

Podcast Title: How to Age Up
Host/Author: The Atlantic
Release Date: June 10, 2024

Introduction

In the episode titled "How to Know What's Real: How to Win at Real Life," hosts Andrea Valdez and Megan Garber delve into the intricate relationship between games and real-life cognitive and emotional development. Exploring games not merely as forms of entertainment but as profound tools for understanding human behavior, societal structures, and personal growth, the conversation is enriched by insights from C. Th Nguyen, an associate professor of philosophy at the University of Utah and a philosopher of games.

The Fundamental Role of Games in Human Society

Andrea Valdez opens the discussion by contrasting traditional board games like Monopoly and Twister with modern, more complex video games. She emphasizes that despite the evolution of games, the intrinsic human desire for play remains unchanged. As Valdez states:

"Games are just one of the most fundamental activities that humans have."
[02:13]

Megan Garber echoes this sentiment, highlighting the primal connection games foster among individuals across different cultures and historical periods:

"They're almost Primal. Right. And because of that, they can... connect us not just to each other in the moment and to each other across cultures, really, but just like you said to the humans of the past and the cultures of the past."
[02:53]

Defining Games: Beyond Entertainment

The conversation takes a philosophical turn as Megan introduces C. Th Nguyen to discuss the essence of what constitutes a game. Nguyen references Bernard Suits' definition from "The Grasshopper," which posits that:

"To play a game is to voluntarily take on unnecessary obstacles to create the possibility of struggling to overcome them."
[05:41]

He further elaborates that games are distinguished by their voluntary constraints and the joy of the process rather than the pursuit of an external goal. For instance, running a marathon within the rules defines it as a game, rather than simply reaching the finish line by any means.

Nguyen adds:

"In games, you're trying to do something, but you're just not trying to get the thing itself independently."
[05:41]

This perspective underscores games as structured experiments in living, where participants engage with alternative value systems within a controlled environment.

Games as Experiments in Living and Value Systems

Expanding on Suits' definition, Nguyen draws parallels between games and John Stuart Mill's concept of "experiments in living." He suggests that:

"What are games but experiments in spending some time with other people under an alternate conception of the good and where that alternate conception of the good is specified by the point system in the game."
[26:21]

This analogy positions games as miniature societies where different governance systems, value priorities, and social interactions can be explored and understood without real-world consequences.

Case Studies: Games That Illustrate Philosophical Concepts

1. Rock Climbing as a Game

Nguyen shares a personal anecdote about how rock climbing served as a game that provided intense mental focus and immediate feedback, likening it to a form of meditation:

"Rock climbing gives feedback that slaps you in the face. So, like, if you're climbing and your mind drifts, you're going to fall 10ft."
[05:18]

This experience exemplifies how certain activities, though not traditional games, embody game-like structures by imposing rules and providing direct feedback.

2. Root by Cole Whorley

Nguyen discusses "Root," a modern board game that simulates political conflict between factions with differing ideologies:

"Each side has completely different roles, a completely different political alignment, and a completely different way of working and thinking."
[09:28]

Playing "Root" allows participants to engage with and understand opposing political perspectives within the safe confines of a game, fostering empathy and strategic thinking.

3. Imperial

Described by Nguyen as an "incredibly interesting" and "evil" game, "Imperial" simulates World War I through the lens of shadowy investors manipulating country fates for profit:

"If you step into this game... it's a game about manipulating shared incentives."
[15:17]

Nguyen credits "Imperial" with teaching him valuable lessons in negotiation and shared incentives, demonstrating how games can impart real-world skills and ethical considerations.

4. Train by Brenda Romero

Megan Garber introduces "Train," an art piece masquerading as a resource management game, which culminates in a revelation connecting the game's railway system to a Nazi concentration camp:

"The game... transforms it into this really galling and gutting exploration of complicity and really what complicity feels like."
[20:17]

"Train" serves as a poignant example of how games can be powerful mediums for conveying complex emotional and ethical narratives, challenging players to reflect on their actions and societal structures.

Games as Educational and Empathetic Tools

Andrea Valdez touches upon recent research exploring games' ability to foster empathy. She references a study where players experienced racial bias within a game, leading to increased perspective-taking:

"It's a really complicated area of research right now. And that particular study... speaks to the power of games and how we use them in cognitive and empathetic development."
[22:30]

This highlights the potential of games to serve as educational tools that promote understanding and emotional intelligence.

Balancing Simplicity and Complexity in Games

Nguyen discusses the delicate balance games maintain between simplicity and the complexity of real-life values:

"Simplicity and clarity, I think is the greatest virtue and the greatest danger of games in life."
[23:42]

While games offer clear metrics and defined objectives, real life is inherently complex. Nguyen advises treating games as practices for stepping into and out of oversimplified value systems, using them as tools for self-reflection rather than replicating real-world value judgments.

The Gamification of Society

Andrea Valdez introduces the concept of "the game" as a societal phenomenon where life becomes highly gamified through ratings, likes, and competitive structures:

"Our society has become so gamified through ratings, through likes... trying to win, with trying to game the system."
[28:35]

She suggests that recognizing and articulating this gamification can help individuals create distance from it, fostering a healthier relationship with societal expectations and metrics.

Conclusion: Games as Mirrors and Laboratories for Reality

The episode concludes by reinforcing the idea that games are not just entertainment but are reflective of and interactive with real-life complexities. They provide a sandbox for experimenting with different value systems, enhancing empathy, and developing strategic thinking.

Andrea Valdez humorously remarks on the meta-game concept:

"I just lost the game."
[28:56]

This light-hearted moment underscores the pervasive nature of games in our lives and the subtle ways they influence our thinking and behavior.

Overall, "How to Know What's Real: How to Win at Real Life" offers a profound exploration of games as integral components of human culture and personal development, challenging listeners to rethink their perceptions of play and its significance in shaping reality.

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Andrea Valdez [02:13]: "Games are just one of the most fundamental activities that humans have."

• Megan Garber [02:53]: "They're almost Primal... connect us not just to each other in the moment and to each other across cultures."

• C. Th Nguyen [05:41]: "In games, you're trying to do something, but you're just not trying to get the thing itself independently."

• C. Th Nguyen [26:21]: "What are games but experiments in spending some time with other people under an alternate conception of the good..."

• Megan Garber [28:56]: "I just lost the game."

This episode invites listeners to view games through a philosophical lens, appreciating their role in mirroring societal structures, fostering personal growth, and serving as laboratories for experimenting with alternative ways of living and interacting.