Leslie Jones Asks MAGA: Why Do You Want America to Suck?

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Leslie Jones Asks MAGA: Why Do You Want America to Suck?"

The Best People with Nicolle Wallace
Guest: Leslie Jones
Date: December 15, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, host Nicolle Wallace welcomes comedian and cultural commentator Leslie Jones for an unfiltered, insightful, and often hilarious conversation about the role of comedy in politics, the dangers of authoritarianism, the power held by the public, and Jones's own experiences navigating fame and political commentary. The two dissect the Trump era, discuss the erosion of civility and truth in American society, and share deeply personal reflections on responsibility, courage, and hope.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Power and Purpose of Comedy in Politics

• Comedy as Truth-telling: Leslie explains how comedy gets to the truth at its core, making it especially threatening to those in power who wish to obscure reality.
  • “Comedy... it’s the truth. And not only is it the truth, we form it in a way that can really penetrate.” — Leslie Jones [07:44]
• Critical Thinking and Resistance: She argues for the essential role comedians play in providing alternate viewpoints in a media landscape dominated by one-sided narratives.

2. The Trump Effect: Media, Narcissism, and Society

• Trump as a Narcissist: Leslie observes Trump behaves like a classic insecure narcissist, obsessed with attention and unable to handle criticism—especially from comedians.
  • “I think that's the only reason that Trump ran is because Obama checked him.” — Leslie Jones [08:59]
• The Role of Media Attention: Both critique how media coverage—and even public attention—empowers Trump.
  • “The only reason this man is popular is because of us. If we decided to turn the Internet off for one day and just stop paying attention to him... he would lose his shit.” — Leslie Jones [00:47, 37:08]

3. Personal Experiences with Political Figures

• SNL and Meeting Trump: Leslie recounts her experiences during Trump’s SNL appearance, observing his insecurity and attempts to manipulate perceptions.
  • “He was changing the cue cards... I was like, Lauren, go talk to your boy. Something wrong? He can't read or something...?” — Leslie Jones [11:05]
• Insider Perspective on Political Entertainment: The discussion explores the tension between being political and maintaining broad comedic appeal, with Jones emphasizing deliberate self-censorship.

4. Fear, Self-censorship, and Courage in Public Discourse

• Being Courageous: Leslie discusses the need to be careful but not fearful in her commentary. She is deliberate in balancing honesty with a keen awareness of public sensitivity.
  • “Deliberate and careful. I look at it three or four times... I censor my shit a lot because they do say, hey, Leslie, you know, you have your certain fans that’ll be like, I don’t know if I liked what you said...” — Leslie Jones [15:05]
• Calling Out Cowardice: Nicolle and Leslie wonder why more celebrities and the press don’t challenge Trump, especially when he attacks marginalized groups.

5. Cycles of History & Repeating Mistakes

• Authoritarianism & Historical Memory: Both reflect on the frightening familiarity of current events with darker moments in world history.
  • “How are we repeating the worst part of history?” — Leslie Jones [22:57]
• Projection and Gaslighting: Leslie notes the irony in Trump's projecting his worst behaviors onto others, and how his supporters may be reluctant to admit mistakes.

6. Racism, Sexism, and Social Regression

• Racism as Ignorance: Jones frames racism as a result of being undereducated and lacking exposure to diverse experiences.
  • “To me, racism is uneducated. You're uneducated if you’re racist... you’re being fed propaganda and you're not using critical thinking.” — Leslie Jones [24:03]
• Misogyny’s Persistence: They discuss the resurgence of regressive gender roles and the mechanisms that try to keep women “in their place.”
• Incremental Erosion of Rights: Leslie highlights how small, calculated changes—especially targeting women—are used for social control.
  • “They're not doing just big things. They're doing little intricate things to mess with the system… all those professions are women.” — Leslie Jones [30:00]

7. Responsibility, Hope, and Action

• How Change Happens: Both stress the need for collective action—boycotts, speaking up, and reclaiming agency.
  • “If you didn't buy cigarettes for a week… it's just little shit like that we can do.” — Leslie Jones [44:57]
  • “If we stand together, nobody can stand against you.” — Leslie Jones [48:52]
• Complacency vs. Power: Leslie urges listeners to recognize their own power and not become complacent or overwhelmed by cynicism.

8. How Comedy Threatens Authoritarians

• Direct Targeting: Leslie points out that Trump's repeated attacks on comedians and satire shows highlight just how threatening comedy is to him.
  • “Absolutely. And then to think about it, he's a narcissist. So anybody that says something about him, that's a problem.” — Leslie Jones [34:53]
• Removal of Satirists: Both discuss how Colbert’s removal from late night was clearly an appeasement to Trump and symbolic of free speech erosion.

9. Urgency and the Path Forward

• ** Reckoning and Repair:** Leslie voices a desire for societal accountability and a reckoning for those complicit in harmful policies.
  • “I want a reckoning. I want a reckoning. Y’ all know y’ all did wrong stuff... I need a reckoning, because that's... the only thing that's Gonna make it right.” — Leslie Jones [51:40]
• Role of the Next Generation: Wallace raises concerns about generational damage and sustaining hope for rebuilding once the era ends.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the “Upside Down” political climate:
  “We are in the Upside Down. We, we are definitely there. And that’s why they’re trying to cut off the comedians... free speech... more information, more ways of seeing things, critical thinking stops what they get to do.” — Leslie Jones [07:49]

• On why Trump can’t handle comedy:
  “When [Trump’s] called out by comedians, that’s deadly. Because now I’m informing you, now I’m informing the crowd of what’s going on... more people pointing out the craziness that’s happening right now. Because what’s happening right now is not normal.” — Leslie Jones [07:44]

• On raising daughters and gender roles:
  “Like, there was none of that in my house. My mom had two jobs. And they brought their checks home and they paid the bills together. Now you got a lot of men, like, 50/50, what you bringing to the table? I wish my dad would have asked my mom what she bring to the table. She was like, dinner, motherfucker.” — Leslie Jones [32:30]

• On individual responsibility:
  “I'm more scared not to do it than to do it... Why would you let your dream slip away?” — Leslie Jones [28:18]

• On dealing with bullies and reporters’ responsibility:
  “Wouldn't it be the dopest shit if [a reporter] just let his ass have it?” — Leslie Jones [41:25]

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Important Timestamps

• Introduction & Banter: Leslie joins, jokes about “Nikki” and her famous live tweets during elections. [02:19–05:40]
• The Role of Comedy & Approach to Politics: [05:40–09:11]
• Trump as Host on SNL—Behind the Scenes: [11:03–14:13]
• Balancing Political Comedy & Mass Appeal: [14:45–17:30]
• Truth, Censorship, Don’t-Give-a-F*ck Attitude: [15:06, 17:00]
• Historical Parallels & Authoritarianism: [22:53–23:13]
• On Racism, Sexism, and Social Backtracking: [24:03–32:47]
• The Question: “Why do MAGA want America to suck?”: [33:23]
• Comedy as a Threat, Attacks on Satirists: [34:27–36:45]
• On Agency and Boycotts: [44:53–45:54]
• Hope for the Future & Call for Reckoning: [51:40–54:03]

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Tone and Language

The tone is energetic, direct, irreverent, and deeply personal. Leslie and Nicolle balance righteous outrage with biting humor, maintaining a sense of hope and resilience in the face of daunting political realities. Their language is candid and conversational, peppered with explicit honesty, warmth, and moments of self-deprecation.

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Takeaway Messages

• Comedy is an indispensable tool for exposing truth and challenging power, especially in times of political turmoil.
• Citizens have far more power than they believe; withholding attention, money, or participation can drive enormous change.
• Complacency and cynicism enable authoritarianism—courage, humor, and collective action are essential to arrest the slide.
• A reckoning is needed, but so is hope. The people have the power; using it is both a responsibility and a path forward.

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“We are the people. I’m so tired of everybody not realizing that we are the people.”

— Leslie Jones [37:08, 44:08]

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Transcript

[Leslie Jones]

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[Nikki]

You a very happy half off holiday.

[Leslie Jones]

Because right now Mint Mobile is offering you the gift of 50% off unlimited. To be clear, that's half price, not half the service. Mint is still premium unlimited wireless for a great price. So that means a half day.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment.

[Nikki]

Of $45 for three month plan equivalent to 15 per month required new customer.

[Leslie Jones]

Offer for first three months only. Speed slow 135 gigabytes of network busy. Taxes and fees extra. See mint mobile.com we are the people. I'm so tired of everybody not realizing that we are the people. The only reason this man is popular is because of us. If we decided to turn the Internet off for one day and just stop paying attention to him, stop retweeting and stop, he would lose his shit.

[Nikki]

This is a treat. We've been waiting for this since this podcast was birthed. Hello and welcome to the Best People podcast. One of the most special things that happened to any of us in covering the 2020 election was learning that this week's guest started to watch as well. She holds a special place in all of our hearts. I'd always been a fan, but I became a full fledged groupie after her 2020 election commentary. She gave me my first and only nickname. I'm gonna keep it forever. It's gonna be on my grave when I die, Nikki. But she says it better. And more importantly, she lifted Steve Kornacki from total fan favorite to cultural icon. She herself is an icon. A real superstar with a real side. You probably know her from SNL or her brilliant standup special. She has a new one out called Life Part two. It's brilliant and hilarious. Without any further ado, this is the best people. And this is Leslie Jones.

[Leslie Jones]

Yay.

[Nikki]

Hi.

[Leslie Jones]

What's up, Nikki?

[Nikki]

Oh, I love that. If I could make it my ringtone, I would.

[Leslie Jones]

It wasn't Nikki. It's Nikki.

[Nikki]

I love it.

[Leslie Jones]

You were tearing it down. You was tearing. It was just like. I was like, oh, Nikki gonna say it though, but Nikki gonna say it though. Uh oh, there go the glasses. Whenever the glasses come out, there's some important shit being said. She got her glasses on, so she's seeing every word. Trust me. She's seeing every word. Get him, Nick. I.

[Nikki]

It lifted us so much. I mean, 2020 was so crazy.

[Leslie Jones]

It was insane.

[Nikki]

And it was, like, still Covid, and it was crazy. And we had Kornacki and we had the numbers, and Josh Shapiro was the Attorney General of Pennsylvania. And there's one show where his son comes in and out, and you do.

[Leslie Jones]

The funniest thing, right, and run to the Supreme Court. And the cuckoo clock.

[Nikki]

His teenager comes in. And I have it saved. I watch it when I need to laugh.

[Leslie Jones]

I think I remember that because he was like, oh, oh. And he came back, and I think I remember starting to do that because I was like, oh, wow. This Covid thing, the pandemic, is making people have to film from their house. And I don't think people realize what's in their house. So it was my mission to, like, point stuff like that out, you know? And then MSNBC was the only station I was watching because I felt like I liked everybody on there. And I felt like y' all was the only one telling the truth.

[Nikki]

It meant so much. It still means so much. But I also think it made a million people redo their books and buy fresh flowers and move their pets onto the couches. Oh, my.

[Leslie Jones]

Do you remember the girl that was in the kitchen? And I said that she was in the kitchen. Then the next segment, she had an office. I was like, okay, girl, you got a promotion.

[Nikki]

And Phil Rucker, you know, who had the best, like, always had fresh flowers and, like, I guess that's what's really, really, really shines through.

[Leslie Jones]

And the guy with the old furniture, I was like, come on, man. I was like, this man knew Benjamin Franklin. He got Benjamin Franklin's rocking chair in his living room. What is Adam Smith? Adam Smith lived in a museum. It's like, what is happening? You remember that lady with the spooky library with the stairs in the back? I was like, is she a witch?

[Nikki]

She goes spiraling.

[Leslie Jones]

I was like, what is happening to this little funky room?

[Nikki]

Yeah, but, like, where does that come from where you're just watching? It's all live, right? And so, like, you're just.

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah, I'm a comedian. I'm a comedian, and I love doing crowd work. And we wasn't able to perform, so. So I was like, what better way to get some performing in and some practice in by doing crowd work on all of the news anchors. It was actually really funny. I'M always surprised at how everybody reacts to my tweets. When I started doing it for the Olympics, I was very shocked at how everybody was just like on board. And I was like, damn. I think people just be. They be bored with what they're fed all the time. And sometimes people like to have some lev, you know, just light, you know.

[Nikki]

I think too, it's like your whole. And I love that you play with fame. Like, the first line of the special, right, is like, they let me be famous. But you never hold that too tight. And so there's a real feeling with you. I mean, and I think the viral nature of your Olympics coverage and your election coverage is that you make us feel like you're watching just like we are.

[Leslie Jones]

Yes, exactly. And saying things that you're thinking, you know, and bold enough to say it out, but funny.

[Nikki]

Like, just like us.

[Leslie Jones]

Just make it funny.

[Nikki]

Fucking hilarious, right?

[Leslie Jones]

Make it funny. Exactly. My favorite thing.

[Nikki]

What is the inspiration? Like, what do you have to see to think like, yeah, maybe I'll do this. Maybe I'll send this.

[Leslie Jones]

I'm glad you asked that. Okay, so it was certain things, like Phil Rucker with the flowers. Cause I had seen him twice and I was like, okay, he keeps changing his flowers.

[Nikki]

He keeps.

[Leslie Jones]

And it's right by that blind. And I need him to know how beautiful that looks. So it was really like that. Like I would judge the room and he always changed his flowers for me. And then there was another guy that would change his ties for me. I was loving it.

[Nikki]

I remember one night, so after election night. And you know, like, it didn't end. It was like this election that didn't end. And we're sitting there in the breaks watching your clips from the previous block and came out of the break trying to turn them around to play em, you know. So it became viral in both mediums, right? Like online and on tv.

[Leslie Jones]

Oh, Nikki's about to. Nikki about to break it down. She about to break. Oh, there it is. There go the glasses. When she put on the glasses, she about to say some shit. And she got on her green top. Green means go. She is serious about shit today.

[Nikki]

It was so fun.

[Leslie Jones]

It was really awesome. I was like, okay, I like that. And I was like, do I need to be smarter or something? They was like, no, we need you as crazy and off kill as you are.

[Nikki]

But you are really smart about politics.

[Leslie Jones]

I'm very smart. You have to be smart, you know, to make it funny. You have to be smart.

[Nikki]

That's right. What is it about comedy that's so lethal to people that can't laugh.

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah. Because it's the truth. And not only is it the truth, we form it in a way that can really penetrate. You know what I'm saying? Like, if I could tell a joke about something that people are already thinking about and make it funny. Yeah, that's deadly. Because now I'm informing you, now I'm informing the crowd of what's going on. And this is what you see. Like we need more of that. We need more of that. We need more people pointing out the craziness that's happening right now. Because what's happening right now is not normal. We are in the Upside Down. We, we are definitely there. And that's why they're trying to cut off the comedians and, you know, free speech and they're trying to cut all of that out because more information, more ways of seeing things, critical thinking stops, what they get to do. I tour all the time. Every time I go to a town, I look at their source that they're getting. In a lot of these small towns, they don't get you guys, they get Fox. That's all they get. And you would not believe some of the stuff that they actually believe. So our job is to come out and go have some common sense, you know what I'm saying? Have some common sense. And you know this is funny and you know that this is wrong also. And then narcissists, narcissists don't like to be talked about. I mean, I'm gonna be honest with you, I think that's the only reason that Trump ran is because Obama checked him. Yeah, I think that's the only reason.

[Nikki]

Well, he's obsessed with Obama. He's trying to indict him. I mean, he's obsessed. I mean, he got.

[Leslie Jones]

He's just living rent free in that man's. I think that people like him are obsessed with people like Obama. Cuz that's who he wants to be. He wants to be cool like Obama. So bad.

[Nikki]

Cool, smart and attractive.

[Leslie Jones]

And he's not, he's just. I hate to say this, and I remember telling Lauren this, I was like, the reason that Trump is getting the way I was like, because he's a very aggressive white male and he's using Communications101 to just really bamboozle people. Just the way he talks. Anybody who has to back up what they're saying is definitely bamboozling you. Oh, it's great. Oh, it's really great. I'm telling you, it's the greatest thing. It's great. It's great. I've heard that from car salesmen, bad promoters. You know, he's the. What do they call it? The elixir?

[Nikki]

Snake oil salesman.

[Leslie Jones]

Snake oil salesman. Or the emperor with no clothes. And what? I think MAGA is still supporting because they don't want to admit that they made a mistake. And they did. And it's not just hurting us. It's hurting them too. It's hurting what we are. Okay. You know what's so crazy? Before I even got to know about politics, because I didn't know about that stuff until I started snl. You know, I always thought America was the place. You come with your dreams, and if you work hard and you do what you're supposed to, you make it.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

And now it's just. You know what's so scary is that everything that he said he was gonna stop from happening is the things that he's doing, which makes no sense. It's like projection.

[Nikki]

Do you think that some of that insecurity. I mean, did you see that? You were there when you hosted snl, right?

[Leslie Jones]

Oh, yeah. First of all, he was scared of me.

[Nikki]

Why?

[Leslie Jones]

Because I was honest and funny. Yeah. Like, he was changing the cue cards. So I went out to Lauren, and I was like, lauren, go talk to your boy. Something wrong? He can't read or something, because he keeps changing the cue cards. And that's a problem for us. Cause we have to have the cue cards right? So we know when we come in. And he's out there changing. So when he came into the table read. I will never forget this. He came into the table read. He had all of his scripts. And I remember this. You know why I remember this? Because I was thinking, look how small his hands are. And it was. It was before. It was before Rubio. It was before people started cracking jokes about his hands. So I was like, look how manicured and small are they?

[Nikki]

Really small.

[Leslie Jones]

They are so tiny. And he's holding all these papers. He looks like a lost schoolboy. You could tell he was intimidated by walking into this room of people who are scholars, and you're gonna have to read in front of them. So again, Nick K. I didn't know who this man was. I just thought he was the Apprentice. New York had been telling everybody how terrible Trump was, but I just thought of him as the Apprentice. So when he sat down and he. You could totally tell. It's just the mark of an insecure narcissist. He sits down, he puts all the Papers down. He grabs his flip phone. He goes, yeah, yeah, get rid of that. Sell that, Sell that. And then he flips it down. And then, you know, I noticed it. Everybody's ignoring him. Cause they're like, you're an idiot. But I noticed it. And I'm very much into making the host feel comfortable. So I was like, what, you just sell? How much money? You just make Trump, how much money?

[Nikki]

What'd he say?

[Leslie Jones]

He was like, ha, ha, ha ha. You notice? Huh?

[Nikki]

Do you think there was really someone on the other end of the phone?

[Leslie Jones]

No, absolutely not. And I love Lauren. Cause Lauren don't give a shit. Lauren was sitting there like, this is business as usual. This is business as usual. You know, I think a lot of people irritate him. You can tell when he's irritated by certain people, but you can also tell when he's like, let's just get this over with.

[Nikki]

I mean, how big of a deal do you think it was to Trump to be hosting snl?

[Leslie Jones]

I think it was big because, of course, he wants to be some kind of famous celebrity. I don't know what it is that he wants. Does he want everybody just to, like, he's the king? I just. I don't even get that. I don't even understand that. But, yeah, A lot of people, though, Nikay, take that as something really big for them happening, which it is.

[Nikki]

It is.

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah. It's very. It's very. Everybody didn't understand. Everybody was like, why are you bringing Trump on here? Everybody was mad at Lauren. A lot of people was mad. But I was like, lauren is a puppet master. Like, he has to satisfy the masses. It's not just California and New York that's watching this show. It's Omaha, it's South Carolina, it's North Dakota. All these people. And he has had this show on air for years for a reason. Cause he dictates to all of them. Y' all can't be mad at him from making this show worldwide. You just can't do that. You know, that's what it is.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

You can have a principal. Lauren used to tell me that all the time. He was like, listen, you have to draw a line between being political and being funny. What are you gonna be? Cause he told me, he was like, you gotta watch out how you doing this political stuff. People are gonna start thinking you a political comedian. He was like, you gotta watch. What do you want them to know you as? As political or as funny? And I told him, I want them to think of me, period. So Whether it's politically or funny, that means that people are listening to me. But I did understand what he was saying.

[Nikki]

Do you feel that pressure now? Because I think of you as being one of the few people that's both and right. You are both authentic and you have mass appeal. I mean, is that intentional?

[Leslie Jones]

You know, what's so funny? And I tell people this all the time. I censored the fuck out of my shit. Really censored the fuck out of it.

[Nikki]

Because, well, are you afraid or why?

[Leslie Jones]

Never, Never afraid. Careful.

[Nikki]

Deliberate. Deliberate.

[Leslie Jones]

Deliberate and careful. And I put it like this. Like when they started going back, looking at people's posts that they did 20 years ago. You go back on mines, all you see is shows. Because I knew then if I become famous, I. Anything I do can be something big. So whenever I'm making a post, I look at it three or four times. I listen to what I say, I hear it in my ears. What are they gonna be offended by? There's some stuff I never post. There's some stuff I don't talk about because I know people don't know how to have critical thinking and separating comedy before if I'm real or not. But so I censor my shit a lot because they do say, hey, Leslie, you know, you have your certain fans that'll be like, I don't know if I liked what you said and not that I listen to them. I am a entertainer and I like everyone to be satisfied. I'm just like, Lauren, I want to be able to perform for the masses. And in order to do that, you do have to have some discipline in what you say. Now if I'm in interviews and I'm doing stuff, I'll say all the stuff. You know what I mean? But when you're doing live tweeting like that, you really gotta be careful. You just gotta be careful. But you also gotta be brave. Cause there are some posts that I be like, I don't know about this one, but I have a feeling in me that it's gonna be okay. Now I've posted some stuff and it was not okay. Yeah, but that's why I think I get away with it, because I'm human about it.

[Nikki]

Well, do you think people are overcorrecting for that? Absolutely. I feel like you're in a small category where you will, even if it's just in interviews, say what we all can see. And there's so many entertainers who I imagine privately are seeing all the same things, but they're scared.

[Leslie Jones]

Well, how can I put this. Okay, let me say this. I don't give a fuck, Nikki. I have a don't give a fuck. That is diabolical. You know what I'm saying?

[Nikki]

Where does that come from?

[Leslie Jones]

From being a comic, from doing crowd work, from being brave enough to go up in front of people and tell jokes. You know, you got tell the truth. Yeah, yeah. So it's really. I do. I censor the hell out of my shit, though, because I know that I can come across really rough, but sometimes I don't. So it's kind of hard to answer that question.

[Nikki]

No, no, no, but I mean, look, I think that's the art, right? Like, that separates people that do what I do. The journalism, the commentary from the artist.

[Leslie Jones]

Absolutely, absolutely. Because this is another thing. People look into the wrong people. Like, you're not supposed to look to me to learn about the government. I don't know shit about the government. You're supposed to look to Nick K for that. No, now you come. Now you come to me.

[Nikki]

But more people, you know, but more people believe you. I mean. I mean, this is the. This is. You're talking about, you know? And I remember, look, I worked in government when people were getting their news from the Daily show, and that was a good thing.

[Leslie Jones]

Right?

[Nikki]

And you're not. I mean, you're part of that world, too. And I think that's a good thing. I think everyone has to let go. And if everyone is just telling the truth and doing their own piece of it, we're going to be all right.

[Leslie Jones]

I think so, too.

[Nikki]

Right?

[Leslie Jones]

That's a great way to put it. Yes, absolutely. Everybody just need to do their job. I think people stop doing their job. This is a question for you.

[Nikki]

Uh, oh.

[Leslie Jones]

What makes this man so powerful? Why are people.

[Nikki]

We do. We do. The attention we pay him.

[Leslie Jones]

That's what I was thinking. I was like, if we stop retweeting.

[Nikki]

Him, he'd lose his shit, he'd lose his mind.

[Leslie Jones]

Like, okay, but can I ask you this? Why haven't the reporters got together, like maybe 500 reporters and just take shifts like. Like send 10 in. And every time he say something, you're a fucking moron. You're absolutely killing the country. He kicks him out, another 10 come in.

[Nikki]

Look, I think the tension is that he won again, like, fair and square, he won. Here's what I don't understand about the Trump story. Trump does things that if you did it, or Steph Curry did it, or Justin Bieber did it, there would be entertainment, press or sports Press asking about his wellbeing. So Trump the other night, one night last week, posted 150 times. It came down to like three posts a minute. And I'm telling you, if a world class, he's the president of the United States. If a world class athlete or you or a singer or George Clooney did that, we would wake up. The Today show, if it was a celebrity, would be covering, you know, this weird behavior from a person in the entertainment world. ESPN would come up in the morning with concerned coverage if it was a baseball player or a football player. If Aaron Rodgers did that, tweeted 150 times, there would be sports. So. But because he's Trump, nobody even covers it.

[Leslie Jones]

If he was the Apprentice, we wouldn't care. He's the president. Do you understand? And that's crazy talk.

[Nikki]

And I think the other thing, look, I did this finally this week, and it's too late. He's calling female reporters piggy and stupid and dumb and insubordinate. And to your point, why don't people en masse say, I don't think that's cool and walk out? Because he would lose his mind if the press stopped covering.

[Leslie Jones]

Wait, wait, let me explain something to you. I don't understand how these people let that. I don't mean no harm. If he would have said shut up picking to me, I'd have been like, you fat, You stanking bastard, you wouldn't be able to talk to me like that. Who you calling piggy? You fat. She walked in on, I mean, like, how are y' all not losing your shit like that? He called a woman pinky. If Obama did that, Biden did that.

[Nikki]

They lose their mind.

[Leslie Jones]

Look, some of the stuff, they would have dragged Obama out to the yard and executed him right there with some of the stuff that he does.

[Nikki]

I think because he's been so crazy in the public arena for so long that people just shrug their shoulders. But that's the woman getting insulted. I'm starting to wonder about the people watching. Right? Because if you're, listen, I got a kid in school. If you're a kid in school, there's the same punishment for the bully and the people that watch the bully. Absolutely. So I'm starting to wonder psychologically about myself. Like I'm watching this happen and I don't say anything. Like at some point we are all part of the problem.

[Leslie Jones]

Yes, I. Oh, my goodness gracious, Nikki, what we gonna.

[Nikki]

Do? We'll take a quick break right here. When we're back, much more with my friend Leslie Jones, stay with us. Choose to lean into it.

[Leslie Jones]

Every Mazda is engineered to give you effortless control. I wake up, score holiday gifts.

[Nikki]

Everyone wants for way less at your Nordstrom Rack store.

[Leslie Jones]

Save on Ugg, Nike, Rag and Bone.

[Nikki]

Vince Frame, Kurt Geiger, London, and more. Cause there's always something new. I'm giving all the gifts this year with that extra 5% off when I use my Nordstrom credit card. Santa who join the Nordy Club at Nordstrom Rack to unlock our best deals. It's easy. Big gifts, big perks.

[Leslie Jones]

That's why you rack the McDonald's snack wrap is back. You brought it back. Ranch snack wrap. Spicy snack wrap. You broke the Internet for a snack? Snack wrap is back. Ba da ba ba ba.

[Nikki]

I started reading some books about authoritarianism because I'm like, wait, what? We're covering authoritarianism?

[Leslie Jones]

No, but this is what scares me though. Nikkei. How are we repeating the worst part of history?

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

Can you imagine Ronald Reagan saying that he's a Nazi.

[Nikki]

No. Or saying bad things about immigrants. Ronald Reagan is the last president of either party to do amnesty.

[Leslie Jones]

I'm just trying to figure out. Cuz I feel like there's a group of people that's like, yeah, the government needs to be changed and Trump knows how to handle business. And I mean, I'm not gonna lie, when he first said he was gonna run for president, I was like, oh, well, I mean, he's a good businessman that. You know what I was thinking about? I was thinking about that movie where they got the regular guy. I forgot what the name of that movie.

[Nikki]

Dave. Dave. I love that movie.

[Leslie Jones]

So that's what I was thinking. I was like, yeah, to the chief. He's the one we all say hail to. Dave Kovic was an ordinary guy. Mr. Kovik, your government needs your help.

[Nikki]

Really?

[Leslie Jones]

We just happen to look like the president? That's what I was thinking. I was like, yeah, Trump's gonna bring.

[Nikki]

In his accountants, be like, budget, smudge it. I love Dave. I love Dave.

[Leslie Jones]

But he's not Dave Dave. Correct cared.

[Nikki]

He's more like the Dave look alike. You know, he's just checked out.

[Leslie Jones]

Some of this stuff is so obliviously racist. Like, yeah. And then what's upsetting is when you hear people agree with him, when you hear the comments and you go, oh, my God, this is scaring me that we still have this world going on. To me, racism is uneducated. You're uneducated if you're racist. And I'm not talking about uneducated, stupid. I'M saying uneducated on what you're talking about. You're being fed propaganda and you're not using critical thinking. Like, when did critical thinking become a sin? Like, they use woke. Like it's a bad thing.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

Do you get what I mean? Like, when we get these tags on names like the dei, we gotta stop doing that shit.

[Nikki]

But I think that I've read that you believe that since you were young that people are not born with racism in their hearts or in their minds. They absorb it, they are taught it.

[Leslie Jones]

Or they experience it. Yep, absolutely.

[Nikki]

And I wonder what you think of some of that behavior being modeled at the highest levels of our politics.

[Leslie Jones]

Well, I feel like you should be able to be a politician or a judge if you have that type of. Do you get what I'm saying? Like, I don't understand Republicans. I don't understand the whole thing. When I was in. I remember being in this church. It was a Republican church. And I remember this dude coming up to me. I had made a face as something that the pastor had said, and I was like, why would he say this in the pulpit? You're not supposed to say stuff like that. Like the way that they use Jesus. I was like, jesus would never talk to none of y'. All. It's, like, crazy. And this guy came up to me and he was like, maybe you just don't understand what Republicans are. We earn our money and we feel like we should be able to keep our money. We shouldn't have to take care of anyone else. Everyone should be able to take care of themselves. He is saying this inside of a church. So I was just like. I was like. I just remember saying, is Jesus a Republican? I was like, this is bad. This is really bad. Like, it's scary. We are repeating the worst part of history. We should have flying cars right now.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

You know what I'm saying? We should have breathable air. We should have all kinds of stuff going on. And it's scary how behind we are.

[Nikki]

Do you think we're moving backwards, girl?

[Leslie Jones]

You know what I think? And I used to say that. You know what I think it is? I think that we are not fixing the problem. I feel like it's repeating, you know, when you don't learn your lesson, the lesson comes back again. So we didn't solve this the first time. Racism is a big thing. You know, we haven't solved that. We haven't solved misogynistic stuff. Like some of the stuff I hear men say. I say, do you not ever want to have sex with a woman again. Cause who. Who is listening to you and still being with you?

[Nikki]

Or do you think that if someone is with you and you have a daughter, do you want someone to talk to her? Like that girl?

[Leslie Jones]

When I did Ghostbusters, I could not believe some of the stuff. Cause it's very stupid for a man to tell us, oh, women can't be Ghostbusters, and then have your daughter's picture on your profile. So if your daughter came up to you and said, I want to be a Ghostbuster, you would tell her to her face that she couldn't be a Ghostbuster because she's a girl. My dad never said that stuff to me. My dad was like, you can be whatever you want as long as you work hard and learn how to do what it is you wanna do. Don't let nobody tell you cause you're a woman or because you're black, you can't do it. He would tell me that every day. I don't understand parents that don't tell their children that. And how are you raising your daughter? How are you raising your daughter? You raising your daughter or your son? Especially when people use religion. I be talking to God all the time. And I'd be like, man, you need to do something. You need to send somebody down here. And he was like, I did, and y' all killed him. So you're on your own now.

[Nikki]

Your dad told you to be undeniable.

[Leslie Jones]

Yes, he did. Because the whole thing behind that is be so good at what you do. And that's what I did. Everywhere I go, I be so good. You cannot deny me. You just gotta put me in the sketch. You gotta put me on.

[Nikki]

But what added pressure? I mean, that feels like. Like, really, that feels like a lot of pressure.

[Leslie Jones]

No, that's freeing. That's because you've given yourself permission to step out there and do it. Like, I'm more scared not to do it than to do it. Meaning that I would be more scared not to go up and perform than to go up and perform. That's more scary to me because it's like, if I don't.

[Nikki]

It's like letting it slip away, right?

[Leslie Jones]

Like, why would you let your dream slip away?

[Nikki]

I think I know what you're saying. After Trump won the second time, I think a lot of people were like, whoa, this is a scarier one. Like, the first time he had, like, serious people around him. This time he's just gonna, like, you know, pick me up on the way home and send me to jail, and it felt scarier. And I think your point is, like, it's actually worse than to let him see you sweat or to blink than to just. Just. Just, like, go do your thing and let the chips fall where they may. Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

That's why I'm not understanding. People know is why are y' all not calling that shit out? And then two, the people that are jumping on the bandwagon, we gonna remember you.

[Nikki]

Yeah. Like, we can see it.

[Leslie Jones]

And listen, this has really affected even comedy. Like, there's a lot of clubs I don't do anymore because they have MAGA bookers now. And it's like, let me explain something to y'. All that is not gonna last. And we.

[Nikki]

It's gonna end.

[Leslie Jones]

And the people that perform it, we're gonna remember you. Cause when it changed back and you calling us, I'm not coming to your club.

[Nikki]

I feel like it's. That plus the betrayal on free speech. I mean, they obviously have no interest in free speech.

[Leslie Jones]

Absolutely. Well, exactly. But you know what free speech is? Free speech is telling the truth. They don't want nobody to be able to tell the truth. This is what makes me mad, is that people are not looking at the little things that they're doing.

[Nikki]

Like what?

[Leslie Jones]

They're not doing just big things. They're doing little intricate things to mess with the system. It's very obvious that you make. Oh, this is not a profession anymore. And just so happened that all those professions are women. So it's very obvious that you don't want us to make our own money because you want us to be trapped at home. Because he thinks women are stupid enough to go, oh, I'm gonna just be trapped at home and have babies. What's wrong with you? The men that are like, oh, well, if you were a good girl and just stayed home, did your mama stay home? Cause my mama didn't stay home. My mom had two jobs.

[Nikki]

But then, what makes women go along with that? Girl?

[Leslie Jones]

I don't know many women that do. But I do know women that. And this is my thing. There are women that go for that. Go for them. Go get them. But you don't want them. You want us. You know why? Because we're valuable. You know, I can make my own money.

[Nikki]

And we threaten that with women.

[Leslie Jones]

Oh, my God. We threaten it like a mother. Cause you can't control someone who has critical thinking. I was talking to Erykah Badu. I went to her concert, and we were talking about submission. So I had to get the definition of what you think submission is. So for me, if I'm gonna submit to a man, which will never happen, I don't even understand. I don't even understand what that means. But if you're talking about submission of you find someone that you could be vulnerable with, that you can let your hair down around, and that he still loves you and gives you the nurture, but if you're talking about submit, like, stay home and take care, I'm, fuck you. Fuck you.

[Nikki]

But why? Why? Why? It's 2025. Like, why are we even having this conver? Like, how has that come back? Why is that bad?

[Leslie Jones]

Because there are now a lot of women who are not putting up with the bs, so they have to figure out a way to break us down to, like, overcorrect. I don't know if I said this in my special, but we. Y' all told us how crazy we was as women, and we invented Oprah. We solved our shit. You know what I'm saying? Y' all just didn't do that. Y' all didn't grow. Y' all stayed on the couch and continued to play your PlayStation.

[Nikki]

Like, we read the books.

[Leslie Jones]

We did everything.

[Nikki]

We read the books.

[Leslie Jones]

And then now you're stuck. And now you're mad because your woman has moved on and has developed and you haven't because you don't like yourself enough to do that. Like, men. Men are really arrogant. They have a lot of, oh, well, you're the woman. And then. This is what I don't understand. Where did they get that from? When all of our parents work. My parents work. Both of my parents. And they brought their.

[Nikki]

Mine too.

[Leslie Jones]

They brought their checks home and they paid the bills together. Now you got a lot of men, like, 50. 50. What you bringing to the table? I wish my dad would have asked my mom what she bring to the table. She was like, dinner, motherfucker. What you think? And get your ass up and clean up the table. Like, there was none of that in my house.

[Nikki]

Why do you think he won?

[Leslie Jones]

Why do I think he won? Because there's a bunch of people out there that really believe that he's the people's people. Like those MAGA people really think that he's gonn he's gonna save their country, but they're not realizing they're believing in the emperor with no clothes. I mean, think about any king that's gotten up there when he had that Great Gatsby party. I was like, dude, you're gonna pay for that. Yo, let them eat cake. Is basically what you saying. And you know what happened to her, right? You know what the question I have is? Why do y' all want America to suck?

[Nikki]

That's the $64 million question. Because RFK Jr. You can put him there if that's your guy, but he's gonna. And you can. You can do. You can do what you want. I. I guess. Unless the Supreme Court stops him with the tariffs, you can make everything more expensive, but that's gonna make people more upset, more stressed, more anxious. It's gonna put a strain on marriage. Like. Like, if you believe the things you said, everything you're doing hurts us.

[Leslie Jones]

And then, two, if we're supposed to be the greatest country and we're supposed to be all this, then everything should be. Our employment should be high, our education should be high. Like, why do y' all want us to be the dumbest people? I don't get that. I would think if I was the president, I'd be like, okay, so our country is behind. We need to do this, this, and this. Because we want to be just as good as the other countries. We should be embarrassed. As citizens. We should be embarrassed. And the fact that all those people voted for him, that scares me, because we have a percentage of people out there who don't have critical thinking.

[Nikki]

Why do you think comedy is so, you know, flashing red to him? I mean, when he. When they went after Jimmy Kimmel, I feel like that's the first time the Trump story started to turn in the second term because the American people were like, wait, what? And that's where I feel like even the Trump side knows that it's comedy that has the power to call him out and say things like, the emperor has no clothes.

[Leslie Jones]

Absolutely. Absolutely. And then to think about it, he's a narcissist. So anybody that says something about him, that's a problem. Oh, I mean, think about how he insults them. Seth Meyers. Oh, he sucks. He's just not.

[Nikki]

He's not funny.

[Leslie Jones]

He's not funny. Yes, he is. And that's why you mad. It's just like when I'm on stage and I destroy. I just did this at the Cellar. Destroyed this guy. Everybody, even his girlfriend, dying, laughing. Why I get a complaint. Why? He wrote a whole email. He wrote a whole email saying how uncomfortable he was because you shattered. Instead. Instead of laughing at yourself. Because I tell you what, you would have got a lot more love for me if you did. Whenever I'm hitting someone on the stage, I am trying to make them laugh, too. So I'm never saying anything that's, like, you know, very awful. But I do. I like to make people laugh about themselves so they can go and laugh later. They'll go to work and go, I went to a comedy show last night. Oh, my God. Leslie Jones said, I. Da, da da, da da. That's you bringing joy everywhere now. Instead of taking it like a little narcissist.

[Nikki]

But when you're there and you're looking out, I feel like you've got the narcissism radar.

[Leslie Jones]

You definitely know who you can mess with and not mess with. I always look in their eyes, and this guy looked safe. He looked safe. He was laughing. He couldn't do nothing but laugh because it was hilarious. It was hilarious. So it's like, think about it. Just go back to that dinner where Obama got and then dropped the mic, too. Like, did you see his face the whole time? His face was like. You know what I'm saying? It's like, think about all the people he's went after. Stephen Colbert. I can't believe that they did. I. That's when I was done. I was like, oh, I'm done with y'. All.

[Nikki]

Is there any doubt in your mind that Colbert was taken off to appease town?

[Leslie Jones]

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And that is the scary thing, that they appeased this man. That they appeased him. And then. And then when you get the backlash, think about it. This is what I told everybody. You don't have to. We don't have to put up with this shit. We can actually. We are the people. I'm so tired of everybody not realizing that. We are the people. Just like you said, the only reason this man is popular is because of us. Because of us. If we decided to turn the Internet off for one day and just stop paying attention to him, stop retweeting and stop. He would lose his shit.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

How do you kill something? Not feed it.

[Nikki]

Yeah, look, I mean, with toddlers, negative energy is as much of a reward to, like, the dopamine system as positive energy. It's indiscernible. Like, the brain doesn't decipher.

[Leslie Jones]

And you know what's so crazy with his popularity, Nikay? If he would've came out and said, put on your mask, wash your hands, I would've voted for him.

[Nikki]

Everyone would've. He didn't even have to necessarily have a different result. He just had to look like he.

[Leslie Jones]

Cared and leave it to the experts. These people done went to school for years, and you telling them fake news. You don't even know how to say a fetusinnine. I can't either. But listen, I'm not the damn president.

[Nikki]

I don't know why he doesn't just say Tylenol.

[Leslie Jones]

I think I'm thinking that people told him not to say Tylenol because Tylenol would be like, yeah, we suing you?

[Nikki]

My conversation with Leslie Jones continues right after the break. We'll be back in one minute.

[Leslie Jones]

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[Nikki]

Today with TikTok for Business, head over to get started.TikTok.com TikTok ads. The thing about Trump is he's so mean about everything else and everyone else.

[Leslie Jones]

But this is what I'm saying.

[Nikki]

It's funny that he can't I mean.

[Leslie Jones]

But he can't take nothing, right? Because he's so mean when he does it like that. He makes the people that believe in him think that he's standing up for something. And I don't understand how educated y' all are. Y' all would let him get away with that shit. Like, how is the press not tearing him apart? That's what I'm upset about.

[Nikki]

They're there to bring the news to their readers and their viewers, but they're. And I think bringing the humanity of that experience and finding the balance has to be the most impossible job in the world.

[Leslie Jones]

But let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question. Tell me, wouldn't it be the dopest shit if he did this to a reporter and they just let his ass have it? Like. Cause, like, he likes to cut people. That's what they do too. They talk loud. They try to over talk you and cut you off, but you gotta be louder. Like, if somebody. If he did that to somebody and they was like, you know what? You can't talk to me like that. And I'm tired of you being. And just let. And just everybody will be like, okay, she did it. I'mma do it. I promise.

[Nikki]

Look, I think that it's impossible to know the pressures that they're under. Of course, I would love to see that. You know, we have the privilege, right, of being able to say what we want. And you have a level of fame where you can say whatever you want.

[Leslie Jones]

Wherever you want, but not everybody got that.

[Nikki]

I think that's a real place of privilege and power. And, yeah, I haven't walked a mile in their shoes. I don't know. It's like, would I like to see it?

[Leslie Jones]

Right?

[Nikki]

Yes. But maybe the answer is that we have to say it for them. Right? Like maybe. Right. Like maybe we have to start watching these briefings and maybe. And I haven't taken a briefing live in a long time. Maybe I have to take them live. And maybe we have to say it for them.

[Leslie Jones]

Maybe, like, start live tweeting it again. Because I think it's a thing of giving people permission to do it.

[Nikki]

And maybe that, like, I've started to, like, as I'm getting older, like, maybe that's my role. Like, maybe instead of being mad that they don't do it, maybe I do it. And I think it's like any relationship. And for me, I think the first Trump presidency, I was mad the whole time.

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah, me too.

[Nikki]

And then the four years where I was worried about him coming back. I was scared the whole time. This time I'm sort of in awe of people to your point, saying like, well, I'm gonna do my thing. And like in every corner of the country there's someone doing something fucking awesome like there. I don't, I'm not sure what I would do, like if ICE came up to me with guns and said, get outta here. But there are people standing up to ICE in cities all over the country, which is heroic.

[Leslie Jones]

Absolutely.

[Nikki]

And people go into no Kings marches. More people identify themselves as part of the no Kings movement than maga. That's incredible.

[Leslie Jones]

Can I ask, okay, we hear all this ridiculous stuff. How is he getting away with doing some of the stuff he doing? Like taking holidays down and then putting this? How? I've never seen a president be able to do that without people checking him.

[Nikki]

I don't know. I mean, I think part of it is that the Republicans in Congress are the biggest wimps ever and they don't stand up to him.

[Leslie Jones]

Cuz they're afraid because like Gavin trolling him is the best thing. It's good if everybody started doing that. He can't get everybody correct.

[Nikki]

Safety in numbers. Do you think that more people will use their platforms as we head into the midterms to call them out?

[Leslie Jones]

I think so. I think there's so much stuff going on now and I think people are starting to really be affected by the things that he's like. It's starting to trickle down for real. I think there's still probably a small percentage of people that's like, no, I'm gonna roll with Trump no matter what. Like, and again, those are uninformed people. So I think everybody is starting to go, okay. I don't know why we're scared of this guy. We the people. We the people. We the people. I tell people all the time that we've become so complacent that we don't understand what we have to do. No one wants to lose their ne. No one wants to stop ordering from Amazon. You know, I tell people it's not that shit wouldn't have to last long. We shut Target down, what, two weeks? We shut them down. They still can't recover from what we did.

[Nikki]

Kimmel. Four days. Four days of people canceling Hulu and Disney.

[Leslie Jones]

Dude, if you didn't buy cigarettes for a week, don't go. I mean, it's just little shit like that that we can do to start showing, hey, like the fact that Starbucks is still filled amazes me. It really is a Very big show of we don't give a fuck. The way that they turn DEI into something that is just so blatantly racist you didn't even know what it meant. And it's just we can control this narrative. We are just too scared and complacent to do it. And honestly, I'll tell you, I didn't know about politics. The only thing I was caring about was being able to go to work, pay my rent. They want to be able to take care of their kids and they don't want to have to deal with politics. Politics is supposed to be boring. It's supposed to be all them boring people are up there making sure that the world runs right. That's what a normal person is thinking. The involvement of it now is kind of insane.

[Nikki]

Someone said to me, I think it was Doc Rivers. I asked him why the league, the younger players are so much less involved than LeBron and I mean, who was super involved in voting rights, who was super, super politically active. And he said the younger players don't think politics involves them. But what he's said to them is it's gonna involve you one way or the other, whether you get involved or not. It's gonna involve you, it's gonna affect you. Do you think that anything has changed in the last 12 months? Do you think people are starting to see the connection?

[Leslie Jones]

I think we're not gonna know until midterms. I'm gonna be honest, I don't think we're gonna know until midterms.

[Nikki]

There are a lot of signs that there's been a big swing. I think we just. And I think Marjorie Taylor Greene retired cuz she said we're gonn. You've got Republicans also saying there's gonna be a big enough swing that Democrats will take control.

[Leslie Jones]

Why are Republicans not embarrassed your party?

[Nikki]

I don't know.

[Leslie Jones]

I know one thing cuz everybody, when I go someplace and people tell me you should run for president, I said listen, this is the problem with that theory. No fucking celebrity should be a damn president. People who are in politics should do the political shit. I would be just as bad as Trump. I'm gonna shut down a city if a dude don't text me back. Detroit don't get shit until Tyrone texts me back. Like I'm just as ridiculous.

[Nikki]

I'd like to see that.

[Leslie Jones]

I would make ghosting illegal. You can't ghost me. I'm a ghostbuster. I'm gonna find your ass. You know, So I think that we just have this. I think the Internet has made everybody feel like they can be. They can do anything or I can be president. It's kind of. We're becoming a bad 80s disaster movie.

[Nikki]

Do you think that there'll be a correction on the other side?

[Leslie Jones]

I promise. I have the hope of it, but I'm really scared about the individual. There's so many people that have such different opinions. Like, I can talk to someone. I said to my assistant the other day, I was like, nobody should be buying anything for Christmas. You don't need shit. Why is we still celebrating Christmas and Thanksgiving? And she was like, what do you mean? It's. I was. And I was like, do you not see what's going on? And she was like, well, you don't have to buy presents. You can still have Christmas. And I was like, yeah, but people don't understand that. Like, we need to shut this shit down. And we're just so complacent because we're so trying to still have a regular life.

[Nikki]

It's the adaptive response to trauma. But you're talking about something. I mean, Scott Galloway is talking about economic boycotts. And I think it was sort of like an out there idea until Kimmel. And then you saw, you know, Bob Iger and Disney, they flipped on a dime in about 70 hours.

[Leslie Jones]

And that's what I said. People, do you see the power we have? Your power.

[Nikki]

Your power. People saw the power if we stand up.

[Leslie Jones]

And really, like, I just heard about. I saw this article about them knowing that ICE was gonna come to this elementary school. And the lady sent out the bulletin and made all the mothers and fathers and all the people show up at the school and just stand around. Because if you stand together, nobody can stand against you.

[Nikki]

Well, it's the safety in numbers. Look, I mean, I really felt like, oh, my God, the stuff Trump's saying is autocracy. And the people they target, they target, the comedians they target, the media they target, the corporations they target and take over the tech. Are you surprised that so many people rolled over? Yes.

[Leslie Jones]

Yes.

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

I still go back to the other presidents. If any of them would have tried to pull any of this, we would have just.

[Nikki]

What?

[Leslie Jones]

I'm gonna be honest. The insurrection fucked me up. I'm gonna be honest. I thought that that place. No one could do that. Like, what?

[Nikki]

Yeah.

[Leslie Jones]

And they did it. And then have the audacity to be scared that we're gonna do it. Everything that they're projecting, they think that we're gonna do, but they're the people who. Doing this stuff.

[Nikki]

Yeah. Do you feel when you go out and talk to people. Like, if I talk to people, there. There are a million assumptions about what I think because of where I work, which is kind of funny. I was just at Dick Cheney's funeral, and Rachel. My colleague Rachel Maddow was there, and it's like, the world's upside down, but people still, you know, make assumptions. I feel like you get people much more open because you're gonna make them laugh regardless of who they voted for. Do you feel optimistic that the whole country is starting to kind of nod along at what you're saying? Like, this isn't normal and this isn't working out for me?

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah. And let me ask you, why would you go to Dick Cheney's funeral?

[Nikki]

Look, so I worked for him, and I like. And I like that he was for Kamala Harris, okay?

[Leslie Jones]

Cause he shot somebody in the face.

[Nikki]

I was there in the White House when he shot his friend in the face. And there was so much shit going on in the Bush Cheney years that the morning that he did that, my colleague Dan Bartlett called me, and we talked about, like, four other things. And then he said, oh, one more thing. Dick Cheney shot a guy in the face. And I said, on purpose? And he said, no, no, no. It was an accident, but we got to figure out how to tell the press. You fast forward to the 2024 election, and Dick Cheney is one of the only Republicans, along with his daughter Liz Cheney, who's telling other Republicans to vote for Kamala Harris. So Dick Cheney is a perfect avatar for how crazy politics are right now.

[Leslie Jones]

I don't know. It just feels like the upside down world. You see somebody that's doing something completely terrible, like some of these influencers, these crazy folks, and we let them go because freedom of speech, of course, but there should be accountability, like gravity.

[Nikki]

Yeah. Things should fall.

[Leslie Jones]

Yeah. You can't continue to keep doing some wrong, you know? And you're not gonna pay for that.

[Nikki]

How do you think it ends? How do you think the ERA ends?

[Leslie Jones]

Girl, this is. I'm hoping. This is what I'm hoping that midterms people come out and vote like crazy to switch it over, and then the reckoning comes. Yeah, that's what I want. All everybody that work for ice, I want them in jail. I just want a reckoning. I want a reckoning. Y' all know y' all did wrong stuff. You know, some of the stuff you did was so wrong. I need a reckoning, because that's. To me, that's the only thing that's Gonna make it right. And then two. Do you feel this? Do you feel like everything is being broke apart for us to build it up right?

[Nikki]

Here's my problem. For my kids to build it up right. They're doing generational damage. And so I'm not sure we know what's going on inside. We see the stuff that's so messed up it spills into public. But my sense is that there's more happening that we don't know.

[Leslie Jones]

That we don't even know. Yeah.

[Nikki]

How do you find the people so traumatized and help them? And how do you find the people that were scared? How do you go find the people that were fired because of the political purge around dei? I mean, I think the reality is that especially in the military, but really in any institution, they're often the most accomplished people who had to be perfect to rise to the top of this institution. They just came in and blanket fired all of them and then blamed accidents on DEI hires. It's a smear that hurts people. Not just, you know, it hurts everyone.

[Leslie Jones]

It didn't even feel like no one came out and said, do you guys know what DEI actually means? Like, it just.

[Nikki]

They didn't care.

[Leslie Jones]

It just feels like that. And it's so obviously fricking racist to blame black people for the. It's just, well, do you know how much better we have to be than everybody else because we're black?

[Nikki]

The problem, too, is never what you say. It's what you think.

[Leslie Jones]

Yes.

[Nikki]

Yeah. I love talking to you so much. Can we do this again?

[Leslie Jones]

Obviously, yes. Nikki, we homegirls.

[Nikki]

I love you and I love the special, and I love talking to you. We gotta do this more.

[Leslie Jones]

I know, I know. Next time we'll have a lot more jokes.

[Nikki]

Well, I think we had to get this out of the system. We had to clear the pipes of all this shit in our politics, and then we can lighten up a little bit. It's getting better. I think it's getting better.

[Leslie Jones]

I'm gonna say I'm gonna have the hope that again, a lot of people are going to wake up and go, okay, we got to fix this. The only way it's going to get fixed is through the people. That's the only way.

[Nikki]

I love you. So we just scratched the surface. Thank you so much.

[Leslie Jones]

I'll come back again, baby, please.

[Nikki]

Thank you so much for listening to the Best People. All episodes of this podcast are also available on YouTube. You visit Ms. Now. The best People to watch. The Best People is produced by Vicky Bergelina. Our Associate Producer is Rana Shahbazi with additional production support from Delia Hayes and Lisa Ferry. Our audio engineers are Greg Debbins II and Hazik Bin Ahmad Faret. Katie Lau is our Senior Manager of Audio production, Pat Berkey is the Senior Executive Producer of Deadland White House Brad Gold is the Executive Producer Producer of Content Strategy, Aisha Turner is the Executive Producer of Audio and Madeline Herringer is Senior Vice President in Charge of audio, digital and long form. Search for the best people wherever you get your podcasts and be sure to follow the series.

[Leslie Jones]

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