Scott Galloway Wants You to Resist and Unsubscribe

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Best People with Nicolle Wallace

Episode: Scott Galloway Wants You to Resist and Unsubscribe
Date: February 16, 2026
Host: Nicolle Wallace
Guest: Scott Galloway

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Overview

This episode centers on Scott Galloway’s “Resist and Unsubscribe” campaign, which pushes for individual agency through targeted tech boycotts as a response to political unrest and corporate complicity in authoritarian trends. Nicolle Wallace and Galloway engage in an energetic, frank conversation about tech giants' roles in enabling troubling political movements, the power of economic boycotts as everyday activism, and the importance of personal and collective action in defending democracy and values.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The “Resist and Unsubscribe” Campaign:

• Call to Action: Galloway advocates unsubscribing from tech services (e.g., OpenAI ChatGPT, Amazon Prime, Apple TV+, AT&T), arguing that these platforms significantly impact company profits and market behavior when a critical mass cancels services ([02:48], [04:22]).
• Economic Power: “The most radical act in a capitalist society is non participation.” – Scott Galloway ([02:54])
• Practicality: The campaign offers a practical way for people (especially those unable to join in-person protests) to express dissent and exert collective influence with minimal personal disruption ([02:48], [16:28]).

Tech Companies’ Complicity & Rationalizations

• Corporate Excuses: Tech executives justify inaction by citing fiduciary duty to shareholders and fear of retaliation from the administration. Galloway challenges this by calling for loyalty to American values and democratic principles ([06:14]).
• Historical Parallels:
  • Galloway draws comparisons between current US industry leaders and captains of German industry during the late Weimar Republic, warning against appeasement and the dangers of waiting out autocracy ([08:24]).
  • Highlights the economic motives that overrode the defense of rights in historical regimes, noting that passivity leads to dark consequences.

Agency and Values

• Individual Agency:
  • “Action absorbs anxiety.” – Dan Harris, quoted by Galloway ([02:54], [16:28])
  • Boycotting is cumulative—small actions add up and shift economic incentives.
• Redundant Subscriptions: Anecdotes from participants reflect surprise at forgotten, redundant subscriptions, often saving substantial money ([15:45]).
• Comparison to Dry January: Just as people reevaluate alcohol consumption, they can reassess digital consumption—benefiting financially and morally ([05:46], [16:43]).

Masculinity, Protection, and Leadership

• Redefining Strength:
  • The ultimate purpose of acquiring power or influence is to protect others, not just shareholders.
  • “What’s the point if you don’t protect others?” ([12:13])
  • Critique of business leaders who fail to use their power for public good.
• Role Models:
  • Minneapolis community members are lauded for mutual aid and civic responsibility in the face of tragedy ([13:52]).

The “Bunker Mentality” and Generational Shifts

• Critique of Elitism:
  • Wealthy elites trying to “build moats” around homes or plan escape routes to New Zealand are contrasted with those investing in community resilience ([13:15], [13:52]).
  • Dismisses nihilism among youth and elites alike, emphasizing constructive societal investment.

Political and Cultural Inflection Points

• Trump Administration’s Decline:
  • Galloway notes plummeting favorability for Trump and senses a growing backlash, even among moderates and some on the right ([17:35]).
  • Cites historical American recoveries from dark periods for hope ([17:35]).
• Infighting on the Left:
  • Galloway is critical of the left’s inclination to “redistribute virtue” and over-police allies, warning that this internal division threatens electoral outcomes ([22:52]).
  • “What’s worse than fighting with your allies is fighting without them.” ([23:48])

The Epstein Files and Institutional Credibility

• Department of Justice Critique:
  • Both express outrage at the DOJ’s inaction toward Epstein victims, alleging “delay and obfuscation” ([21:04]).
  • “It feels like our Department of Justice is a Department of Delay and Obfuscation or Department of Propaganda.” ([21:04])
• Media Distraction:
  • Galloway believes focus should be on criminal accountability—not peripheral shaming of anyone loosely associated with Epstein ([25:39]).
  • “We are being too harsh on the outer circle... and we are being way too lenient on the people who actually raped children.” ([27:16])

Reflections, Impact, and Closing Thoughts

• Family Conversations:
  • The boycott movement can generate meaningful family dialogue about values and civic action ([29:02]).
  • Humor: canceling Netflix prompts “Memo to self: smother dad in his sleep tonight.” ([29:14])
• Protest vs. Effectiveness:
  • “In my whole career, I’ve struggled with the difference between being right and being effective.” Timothy Snyder’s reminder: “It feels really good to do things with other people.” ([28:38])
  • Everyone will want to look back and say they did something ([29:02]).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• Economic Impact of Boycotting

  • “If you were to just unsubscribe from OpenAI’s paid ChatGPT, you are taking $10,000 out of their market capitalization because that’s $240 a year. They trade at 40 times their revenues.” – Scott Galloway ([02:54])

• On Agency and Action

  • “Action absorbs anxiety.” – Dan Harris, quoted by Scott Galloway ([02:54], [16:28])
  • “The most radical act in a capitalist society is non participation.” – Scott Galloway ([02:54])

• Why CEOs Stay Silent

  • “You’re going to be dead soon...do you want to be known as the guy who got your shareholder value up 3% or the guy that did the right thing, even when it was really hard?” – Scott Galloway ([06:14])

• Historical Parallels

  • “History is brutally clear. Appeasement and waiting out a slow descent into fascism does not end well.” – Scott Galloway ([09:40])

• Masculinity and Duty

  • “What’s the point if you don’t protect others?... Why would you want to get this success if you couldn’t protect others?” – Scott Galloway ([12:13])

• On the DOJ and Epstein Files

  • “It feels like our Department of Justice is a Department of Delay and Obfuscation or Department of Propaganda.” – Scott Galloway ([21:04])
  • “We are being too harsh on the outer circle... and we are being way too lenient on the people who actually raped children.” – Scott Galloway ([27:16])

• On Infighting on the Left

  • “What’s worse than fighting with your allies is fighting without them.” – Scott Galloway ([23:48])
  • “We are very good at eating our own young.” – Scott Galloway ([23:58])

• Family and Conversations

  • “Try canceling Netflix when you have two sons. They literally gave me that look. Memo to self: smother dad in sleep tonight.” – Scott Galloway ([29:14])

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Suggested Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:48] — Intro to “Resist and Unsubscribe” and rationale
• [04:22] — Practical guide: how to opt out & “Ground Zero” companies
• [06:14] — Tech leaders’ motives, historical analogies
• [08:24] — Parallels to late-stage Weimar Republic, fascism warning
• [12:13] — Duty, masculinity, and protection
• [17:35] — Possible political inflection point, historical context
• [21:04] — DOJ critique over Epstein files
• [22:52] — Infighting on the left, dangers to organizing
• [27:16] — Media distraction in Epstein files
• [28:38] — The value of doing something
• [29:14] — Family dynamics, real-life impact of boycotts

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Tone

Frank, impassioned, deeply reflective, yet practically focused—Wallace and Galloway blend urgency, wit, and frustration at the political and tech status quo. The episode is accessible, direct, and at times sharply critical, but ultimately hopeful about the impact of collective action.

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For listeners and non-listeners alike, this episode offers a timely primer in harnessing economic power and individual action for systemic change, while candidly dissecting the obstacles and emotional stakes involved.

Transcript

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Scott Galloway]

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[Nicole]

Hi there everyone. Welcome to the Best People Podcast on Deadline White House. We recently had the chance to talk to entrepreneur professor podcast powerhouse Scott Galloway to talk about his Resist and Unsubscribe campaign. At its core, it's about doing something. Doing something, even if it's just from our phones or our keyboards. And it basically advises us to unsubscribe from the big tech companies that are enabling Donald Trump and ice. Scott and I sat for a longer conversation and I wanted to share it with all of you here. Not just because Scott Galloway is one of our best people. We've already had the chance to talk to him for the podcast, but because the conversation is about everything we're covering right now, it was illuminating and it inspired me to do a little bit of canceling. So without further ado, this is the Best People and this is Scott Galloway. Scott, I follow you. I look for your posts when I wake up because you're a few hours ahead of us in London and I've been riveted by the effort to sort of speak out using our keyboards. And I think I've watched your coverage of Minneapolis. I think it changed something in this country. But not everybody is either able or willing to go out into the streets and protest. But there is something that every single person can do and this idea of agency. I want to talk to you about the tech boycotts. Explain.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, it's always good to see you, Nicole. And thanks for having me on. So when Secretary Noem described an ICU nurse serving veterans as a domestic terrorist, I think I like a lot of people, I felt very frustrated and even sense of anxiety. And my friend Dan Harris at 110% happier, says Action absorbs anxiety. And I'd like to think I've stumbled upon something that most Americans don't recognize, and that is they have a very potent weapon hiding in plain sight. And that is the most radical act in a capitalist society is non participation. And that if you were to just unsubscribe from OpenAI's paid ChatGPT, you are taking $10,000 out of their market capitalization because that's $240 a year. They trade at 40 times their revenues. And 10 companies responsible for 40% of the S and P companies highly sensitive to subscription revenues. And if you look at when the President has crisply walked back his actions, whether it's plants, annex Greenland or tariffs, it's when the markets go down.

[Nicole]

Can you take us through? I think you've got, especially in my audience, a feeling of people who've been frustrated by not knowing what the how was an audience that has been frustrated by watching Democratic party leaders not fight. And I think that what has changed, and I agree with you that one of those moments is the killing of Alex Preddy and obviously 17 days early, the killing of Renee Nicole Goode. But I think that what has pierced that is this idea of agency. And I wonder if you can just be really practical and really how to for us, what are the companies?

[Scott Galloway]

So if you go to resist and unsubscribe, I've listed what I call ground zero. And these are tech platforms that the President seems to listen to and in some instances are enabling his infrastructure in ice and who text me and I'm sure they text you with one narrative around I hate what's going on but aren't willing to speak out.

[Nicole]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

And these companies are highly sensitive to any slowdown in subscription. And then there's what I call the blast zone. And that's companies that are directly enabling ice. But the whole point is the most famous economic strike is the Montgomery bus strike. And there was a very cinematic moment where a very brave woman refused to give up her seat. But what actually caused the change in the bus systems policy was a year long carpool effort that took $2 million out of the municipal bus systems coffers. That's when they decided to desegregate the bus system. So this is meant to be a cumulative effort. And you can either have five families not buy groceries, which will have a $10,000 impact on Kroger's market cap, or you could unsubscribe from one streaming media platform. And the free gift with purchase here, Nicole, is you're going to find out like me that you had Amazon One since 2000, the Healthcare 2020 that cost you $199 a year, that you had three Apple TV plus accounts that you didn't know about. This is an easy way to save money and not miss it. So like dry January when you might calibrate your drinking, this is a way to save money and send a signal.

[Nicole]

I mean, I also feel that their actions seem to be worse. I mean they are the executives that stood shoulder to shoulder with Donald Trump at his inauguration, which was an appalling spectacle. But I think Tim Cook was at the White House in a tuxedo the day after Alex Preddy was killed. Why do they act so immune to the things that enrage not 30, 40% of Americans, but 67% of Americans don't approve of Donald Trump?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, I can tell you what they tell me, and I have empathy for them, is that they're a fiduciary for shareholder value and they just want to wait this guy out. And while they may not agree with all his actions that a good autocrat and kleptocrat does a very good job of punishing anyone that goes first. So everyone is kind of scared to speak out. In addition, if you'll notice, the people who he parades around have avoided tariffs, might get carve out some Chinese tariffs, might get a government backed program that helps pay for their data centers or their chips programs. But the retort is the following. You have some fidelity or you should have some loyalty to fair markets, to civil rights, to American values that have made you a billionaire and built these incredible companies. And what I try to do, and I've spoken to about 20% of the CEOs on the list, is appeal to their emotions. And that is these are all older men. You're going to be dead soon. When you're, you know, when your kids are around you towards the end, do you want to be known as the guy who got your shareholder value up 3% or 10%, or do you want to be known as the guy that did the right thing, even when it was really hard? So for the life of me, Nicole, I can't understand why these guys, this is such an incredible opportunity to demonstrate some leadership and speak out and have the 70% of the American public stand up and say, right on, brother. So to me, this is not only the wrong decision, it's an economic opportunity for one of them to take a leadership stand.

[Nicole]

I hear, hear the same excuse. And I was obsessed with trying to find out where the padded room was where people were studying the first years of Putin, because Putin didn't see start the way he is now. Right. And neither did Orban. And it was pretty hard to get anyone to admit that they were studying what the early years of autocracy would be like. And I was so angry that companies didn't seem to feel or at least wouldn't say publicly that they had any skin in the game and the country having the rule of law. Does the assault on the Department of Justice or the dismantling of large swaths of the FBI shake any of their conviction that they have this fiduciary duty to go along, to get along?

[Scott Galloway]

I think they've even admittedly stopped using the term stakeholders. They just talk about shareholders now. But I'll leave it. If you want to talk about historical context, I'll go deeper than that. I only have one piece of art in my house and it's a picture of Otto Frank revisiting the basement or the attic that he hid out with his family. I want to be clear, I think it's unfair to compare the administration to the Third Reich. I think that's not accurate and not fair. However, I do think you can draw parallels with late stage Weimar Republic, where there was inflation, a loss of economic and cultural standing of middle class men. In addition, essentially what you had is the captains of industry, of German industry at the time of the biggest manufacturing companies were very worried about the rise of fascism. But Hitler said to them, if you keep quiet and support me, I will crush the trade unions and you will all get much, much wealthier. And then it got out ahead of them and there was no turning back. And one of the greatest societies of the last several centuries descended into dark. I think there are some analogues now where the captains of our industry are purposely avoiding American values and not Speaking out in hopes that they'll just get wealthier and they can wait these guys out. And history is brutally clear. Appeasement and waiting out a slow descent into fascism does not end well.

[Nicole]

Well, there's also the piece that we turn to you for all the time, and that is appeasement is the opposite of strength and masculinity. I mean, the weakness that they project by doubling and tripling, quadrupling down on what is exactly as you articulate a strategy of appeasing something that is not consistent with even their stated corporate values in a lot of instances.

[Scott Galloway]

And also, as you get older, you know, the good news is you become more thoughtful. The bad news is you become more thoughtful. And I think it's healthy for anyone who's registered some success, especially as individuals, to reverse engineer the things that aren't your fault and many of the things that aren't their fault that have resulted in them having billions of dollars, extraordinary lives built, amazing companies, competitive markets, lack of government interference, lack of socialism, picking winners and losers in companies, a respect for people's basic human rights, a respect and an embrace of immigrants, not terrorizing citizens, a state of calm. It feels as if there's just a total lack of fidelity or recognition to who either protested in civil rights movements, American households who invested in this technology to create prosperity, or people who stormed the beaches in Omaha. There's just a lack of appreciation for the sacrifices other people have made such that they could stand on the shoulders of other people, become billionaires, build amazing companies, and yet literally turn away or turn a blind eye to many of the civil liberties, the constitutional values that help them get where they are. So, in addition, I don't want to genderize it. I just think it's really upsetting and ungrateful and a lack of recognition and fidelity to the values that gave these people such extraordinary lives.

[Nicole]

Yeah, Alyssa Slotkin got at that a little bit yesterday. She was talking about a grand jury trying to indict her and failing. And I don't know what the question was, but she said, basically, my father, who died a couple weeks ago, taught me to right from wrong and to love my country. And this country has given me everything. I mean, that's true of all of us. I mean, it's given us everything. And to look through who feels like they owe the country something back. It's interesting and it's undeniable that the titans of business, the tech titans, the most successful people who've built their businesses here, do not feel that they owe the democracy A lifeline in this moment. Do you think that'll change?

[Scott Galloway]

I hope so. But going more specifically to talking about masculinity, I think you try and demonstrate skills and strengths such that you can acquire influence and power and economic security. But then the second leg of the whole shooting match is the reason we try and acquire this type of strength and power and influence is such that we can move to the second leg of the stool. And that is protection. And my question is, these individuals have more power and influence and strength, and congratulations, you've achieved that. But what's the point if you don't protect others? And who exactly are you protecting here? Okay, you're protecting shareholders. But is that why you've achieved the height of what it means to achieve the American dream, such that you can protect shareholders and at the same time make immigrants or citizens or people, citizens of Minneapolis so vulnerable? I mean, the whole shooting match is such that you can move to protection. And I just don't think these guys have gotten the memo that why would you want to get this success if you couldn't protect others?

[Nicole]

Yeah. And the Wall Street Journal has a story this morning about how they're building moats around their houses. Cuz they're so afraid. They're so afraid of political violence and high profile. I mean, they're going in the opposite direction. And on the other hand, you have these examples. My colleague Chris Hayes is interviewing Mayor Fry of Minneapolis. You've got these other examples emerging in our culture and in our politics and almost being sort of forged like diamonds right from the incredible tension of what Trump is doing to people. I wonder if you think there are different and better examples of what you're talking about, masculinity and protectors in the examples of Mayor Frey and Alex Preddy and even Renee. Nicole Goode.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. And I wanna be clear. Masculinity is a social construct, as is femininity. And a lot of men demonstrate wonderful femininity and a lot of women demonstrate wonderful masculinity. But I think that the people of Minneapolis has served as a great role model. They are trying to protect each other. They're trying to plant trees the shade of which they'll never live under, whether it's alarm systems informing people that they've never met or they may never meet that there's danger. So I'd like to think the whole bunker mentality, Nicole, I don't get, because I know some people have built bunkers. And the reality is, if things got that serious and crazy, you don't think Your pilot is going to fly you to New Zealand and then kill you and live in your bunker. You don't. They're going to. You don't think they're going to figure out. The people around you aren't going to figure out, oh, we're starving. Let's go take that person's stuff away and kill him or her. So I think a better strategy would be instead of trying to colonize Mars or build a micro New Zealand, maybe figure out a way to make this planet a little bit more habitable with your incredible intelligence and resources. So this nihilism that unfortunately is infecting young people. You want to talk about a cultural shift if you're 21. Since the age of 10, Trump has been the dominant political figure and the role model, performative course, cruel virality, focus on money, grift. It's shocking that we have a younger generation that is as grounded as they already are. But this nihilist go bag stuff, it just doesn't make any sense.

[Nicole]

Tell me anecdotally what you're hearing from people who have canceled and sent the message that you're. I mean, because I've wanted to do this, and I figured it out after Jimmy Kimmel was taken on the air. It took me three nights. I mean, it's not. It's not. We have to ask our kids how to do some of this, but just tell me what feedback you've had to the boycott of the 10 companies.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it just feels really good to be doing something with other people. And, I mean, on a very practical level, a lot of people called me and said, oh, my gosh, I didn't realize I have three Hulu accounts. I unsubscribed from AT&T was providing infrastructure to ICE. And what I found out in unsubscribing from AT&T and moving to Noble was that I had not one, not two, not three, but four AT&T accounts, and three of them were for iPads and Blackberries that have been in landfills for the last eight years. I spent $6,000 on recurring revenue payments to AT&T for devices that were no longer in use. So what I'm getting is a lot of anecdotal comments on how easy it was and how much money they're saving and that it, quite frankly, it just feels good to be doing something. Action absorbs anxiety.

[Nicole]

Yeah, I know. Dan said that to me at the beginning, right after the election, and I kind of resisted it because it was unclear what the actions were. But this is something everyone can do. Is there anything you've deleted that you miss?

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, I miss it all. I'm taking the tube.

[Nicole]

I've seen your pictures on the subway.

[Scott Galloway]

And the subway more. I miss my Suburban to the airport. I miss, you know, I just binged eight episodes of Heated Rivalry because I was about to give up hbo. Max. I miss it all. I love these things. What I found, though, is that, like I said, you're just going to find you have a lot of redundant spending. And just as try January gives you a chance to recalibrate or rethink your intake or your consumption of alcohol. At a minimum, this is a chance to save some money, recalibrate what you really need, what you don't, and have maximum impact on big tech. Send a signal to a the Trump administration and the markets that you are not down with what's going on for a minimal amount of disruption in your life.

[Nicole]

What is your sense since last time I talked to you about where we are in the Trump story, do you feel like we're at it? Do you believe in inflection points? Do you feel like we're at one?

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, but I've called an inflection point about nine times, and I've been wrong. But it does feel like something, you know, what, what I knew about the Epstein files, I didn't think there was any way that it could get worse. And it's gotten much worse. And when you look at the poll numbers across every group, the collapse in popularity and favorability among Trump is just staggering. So it does feel like we're at a bit of a tipping point now. I hope it holds until November. But, Nicole, you're sort of at the helm of the bobsled. It does feel different right now. It feels like the moderates and even the center right people are saying, when you have Joe Rogan saying I got this wrong, that's meaningful. So it does feel different and also it feels hopeful. Heather Cox Richardson, who's sort of my Yoda on this, says, don't fall into the trap of believing this time has no precedent. At one point, 1% of America who owned slaves control the government. At one point, we were taking people who were Japanese and putting them behind barbed wire and what was internment camps, many of whom had sons serving in the European theater. We have had very dark moments. And every time Americans have come back and our democracy has been stronger for it, and I'd like to think we're on the verge of that, recognizing that a legitimate Department of Justice, that the Constitution matters that we need co equal branches of government, that we need people with higher character making decisions on behalf of other people. That we have taken a lot of our institutions for granted and a lot of our freedoms for granted. And it requires more investment for many of those who have not been asked to invest.

[Nicole]

We're going to take a quick break right here. When we're back, much more with Scott Galloway. Stay with us. It's funny, the view at the front of the Bob City is mostly a blur, but I see some of those indicators myself and I track the manosphere we've talked about. I have a teenage son. I went to a Shane Gillis show and he had some pretty nasty things to say about Donald Trump. But he's pretty huge in that MAGA adjacent manosphere. Joe Rogan and Andrew Schultz have been brutal and a lot of it is rooted in the lie around the Epstein files. Do you have any theory on why they're taking on so much political water? I mean, I don't have any inside information, but they're taking on all this political water in their own base over the Epstein issue and it's confounding cuz it seems to be dragging Trump down on every other issue.

[Scott Galloway]

Look, I don't know about you, but the moment during the Attorney General's testimony that just sent chills down my spine was when the survivors or the victims were asked to stand up and how many of them had reached out to the Department of Justice and then they.

[Nicole]

Were all ignored to the survivors in the room. If you are willing, please stand. And if you are willing, please raise your hands if you have still not been able to meet with this Department of Justice, please know for the record that every single survivor has raised their hand.

[Scott Galloway]

And you think, let me get this, we have a Department of justice that doesn't want to hear from or interview the actual victims here. So it feels like our Department of Justice is a Department of Delay and Obfuscation or Department of Propaganda. Now I didn't think it could get any worse and it's gotten much worse. And I think all of America saw that there's a strong conspiracy element of people to the right who finds a lot of this not only very distasteful, but some of the conspiracy theorists may be right here. I'm now believing there must be some sort of intelligence or covert operations that were somehow weaved in this. But this does feel like it's activated a lot of people from both the far left and the far right. But whatever gets people on board with what I think is a stain on the American experience that needs to be starched out, known as the Trump administration. You know, I welcome it. What I hope we do a better job of is embracing imperfect allies. What I don't like about my brothers and sisters on the left is we have a tendency to want to redistribute virtue as opposed to redistribute wealth and move from indignants to ideas. Right. What are we going to actually do to improve the quality of the life of Americans?

[Nicole]

Rosie Perez said something about that. She's on my podcast this week and she said, I'm so scared. I said, why? She said, well, I'm afraid that the right will, you know, call me names and an idiot. But I'm afraid of the left. I fly a little blind to that sort of coming out of the right of politics. I am attuned to, and I hear and see all of their attacks on me. I'm a little less sensitive to what you're talking about, what she's talking about. But do you have a sense that that's getting any better, that the urgent need to win elections, every one of them, for a long time, is healing anything in their party or in their politics?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, just generally speaking, a lessening tide lowers all, but. I mean, Trump's just unpopular across everyone, but.

[Nicole]

Right.

[Scott Galloway]

I actually find that the left is worse in the sense that, I mean, you're. I would describe you largely, largely as a centrist. I consider myself a centrist. The algorithms hate centrist because a reasonable conversation doesn't get clicks. So they elevate the extreme left, and they elevate the extreme right, and the far right writes me off as a libtard, but I wouldn't say they're mean. They just kind of write me off the far left. When I say something that's not part of the orthodoxy. The far left treats me like an apostate. Scott, we thought we could count on you, and it's like you don't understand the assignment. So what I'm scared. And how we lose the next election is when people on the left use the wrong words or don't totally line up with the left's orthodoxy and they're called out as apostates and we shoot each other. We're in a trench fighting fascism that is coming across the plains and we're angry at each other because we're not holding the gun correctly. We're not. I don't like the way you're aiming. I don't like the words you're using. You got it 98% right. But this is where you got it wrong. We are very good at eating our own young. What's worse than fighting with your allies is fighting without them. And I worry that we're going to spend more capital and energy tearing each other down as opposed to focusing on the real enemy here.

[Nicole]

I have the same concerns. I always love to talk to you. You've been so generous with your time. Is there anything that's on your mind from where you sit across the pond that I didn't ask you about?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, just that the prime minister may have to resign here over Epstein. Right. Because one of his cabinet members lied about it. And yet we have a president who has mentioned more time in the Epstein files than Jesus is mentioned in the Bible or the term meth is mentioned in all eight seasons of Breaking Bad. You know, this is enough already. It is time for us. And it's a lot of different things. It's protest, it's economic boycotts. It's educating your neighbors, it's registering people to vote. But this is a moment in history for us. For those of us, like me, who were never called to serve in active duty, who have enjoyed extraordinarily low taxes, who have enjoyed unfair wins in my sales because of the prosperity and unearned advantage I got, this is our moment to push back.

[Nicole]

Let me ask you one more question about how they are handling the release of the Epstein files. Something that people don't realize is it's the same release. It is the release from DOJ that because of what's in there, about, as you said, someone Starmer appointed to be ambassador to the US he's got a possibly fatal political scandal on his hands. Is it that our politics are broken, or is it that their politics are more sensitive to child sex trafficking?

[Scott Galloway]

It's not a cult here of Starmer. He's evaluated. And there's a higher bar here. But I have a little bit, I think, of a different take on how the files have been released. And that is, it speaks to the lack of credibility of our institutions. Now, important institutions are. Because my understanding was this report was compiled by several agencies, including the Department of Justice. And I think what should have happened is the Department of Justice should have released the files in the following format. Criminal indictments against people engaged in child rape or providing that infrastructure for child rape. The second circle out, people who are hypocrites who wanted to be his friend. You know, if it's a cabinet member or if it's the president being mentioned 5,700 times, I can see some justification for releasing that. But the 98% of the ring light journalism and scrutiny and shaming that's going on here is nothing but a distraction, in my view, from creating incentives that a society needs such that people feel there will be a downside if they rape children. So whether a longevity expert is a creep or not, or a spiritual guru wanted to hang out with Jeffrey Epstein, I just don't think that matters that much. And I think it's a distraction from what is the real shooting match here, and that is in America. We need to imprison people who engage and facilitate child rape. I don't think this could have been handled any worse. We are being too harsh on the outer circle of people who had innocuous or superfluous contact with this man. And we are being way too lenient on the people who actually raped children.

[Nicole]

It's so perfectly put, and it's exactly what the survivors want. You know, yes, this was enabled, and yes, that's information that's now available. But what they care about are the statements they gave. And the statements they gave to the FBI are about the crimes that they endured. And that's exactly where the power of the story lies. I love your clarity. I love all your thoughts, and I really appreciate you for taking the time to talk to us. Can we do it again?

[Scott Galloway]

I hope so. Nicole, it's always good to see you. Congrats. You're an important voice. I don't know if it's because people know we know each other or we know each other a little bit. You are popping up in my feed like 10 or 12 times a day. So I feel as if we're.

[Nicole]

I look for you and Kara. I've looked for you guys on all this boycott stuff. I've seen some of the other interviews you were doing. I mean, my team will tell you I've struggled with how to cover it. You know, do I want to be for boycotts? That makes my old Republican bu. And even in Minneapolis, I didn't know what they wanted. And so I didn't really know how to cover their economic strike. Obviously, they were doing it as a community, but I've really been disoriented about it. And I think this is manageable. This is. Especially after people died in Minneapolis, I felt like everyone wanted to do something. I talked to Robert De Niro about this, and he said, I just, like, I don't wanna be doing this, but we can't do nothing. And I think that might be the dividing line when this is over, like, what did you do? And everyone is gonna wanna say they did something. Everybody.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, one of my heroes, Timothy Snyder, was talking about power of protest. And I said, sometimes I worry the more cinematic than effective. In my whole career, I've struggled with the difference between being right and being effective. And he said, scott, it feels really good to do things with other people. And I can tell you that whether resist and unsubscribe works or doesn't work, I can tell you it just feels really good. Like, dad, what did you do in the war? This is what I did.

[Nicole]

It's also a great conversation thing, you know, like, why are you, why are we in the subway? Because mom canceled Uber. Because mom, you know, like, it's a great thing within a family. Like, why, why, why, why are we, why are we down here?

[Scott Galloway]

Try, try canceling Netflix Uber. Try canceling Netflix when you have two sons. They literally gave me that look. Memo to self smothered dad and sleep tonight. I mean, it's created some interesting conversations.

[Nicole]

We need baseball to start right so that we can get. We can cancel all of our subscriptions. Thank you so much. Please come back whenever anything's on your brain that we can help get out. Please come back. Please, please come back.

[Scott Galloway]

Thank you, Nicole.

[Nicole]

Thank you. Have a great night.

[Scott Galloway]

Cheers.

[Nicole]

Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to the Best People. You can continue to subscribe to our premium service on Apple Podcasts to get this and other Ms. Now podcast ad free. You also get early access and exclusive bonus content. All episodes of this podcast are also available on YouTube. Visit msnow. The Best People to Watch the Best People is produced by Vicky Vergelina. Our associate producer is Rana Shahbazzi. We had additional support from producer Will o'. Donnell. Our audio engineers are Greg Devins II and Hazik Bin Ahmad Farad. Katie Lau is our senior manager of audio production. Pat Berkey is the senior Executive producer of Deadline White House. Brad Gold is the executive producer of content Strategy. Aisha Turner is the executive producer of Audio. Madeline Herringer is senior Vice president in charge of audio, digital and long form. Search for the best people wherever you get your podcasts and be sure to follow the series.

[Scott Galloway]

Support is available 247 with VRBoCare. We're here day or night ready whenever.

[Nicole]

You need help because a great trip.

[Scott Galloway]

Starts with the right support.