← The Besties
The Besties
Is Outer Worlds 2 the Second Coming of Fallout New Vegas?
00:46:06
The studio that created Fallout: New Vegas has had a busy year, delivering Avowed, the early access of Grounded 2, and now Outer Worlds 2. This latest release comes the closest to the team’s legacy in the Fallout universe. But can it achieve those high highs without the beloved trappings of post-apocalyptic America? And would you believe it has strong feelings about capitalism?
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- [00:00]
Justin McKeroy
Here's what I'm saying. This is my problem with all games like this, okay? The moment I get a spaceship, yeah. I'm not going to do anything anybody wants me to ever again, forever, right? The moment I get a spaceship. Why am I concerning myself with these petty terrestrial concerns?
- [00:25]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [00:25]
Russ Frushtick
There's a little thing called gas money.
- [00:28]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [00:28]
Justin McKeroy
Okay.
- [00:29]
Russ Frushtick
How are you gonna fucking power your spaceship?
- [00:31]
Justin McKeroy
Are you.
- [00:31]
Griffin McRoy
Did you find a secret fucking.
- [00:33]
Justin McKeroy
Only fans. Only fans.
- [00:35]
Griffin McRoy
Did you find a secret menu option in the game that makes you put gas in the. The hub ship?
- [00:41]
Russ Frushtick
I'm playing on realism, realism mode.
- [00:44]
Justin McKeroy
You gotta harvest anodyne tablets from the ground and process them.
- [00:47]
Russ Frushtick
I get so tired when I walk around the planets. I get so tired. Yeah, I just needed a fucking nap.
- [00:55]
Justin McKeroy
I'm just saying if I get a spaceship and somebody's like, we need it. We heard there's a border dispute out and go fuck yourself.
- [01:00]
Griffin McRoy
No way.
- [01:01]
Justin McKeroy
Are you kidding me? I'm on Mars. I don't even remember you. I'm gone. I'm in space. I'm Captain Harlock. You know what I mean? I'm gone.
- [01:09]
Griffin McRoy
Starfield was a bad game by traditional standards, but it did kind of nail that one part of space exploration, which is you get your ship and then you just kind of fuck around and. Honestly, better.
- [01:20]
Justin McKeroy
What happened to Justin? I haven't seen him in a while. It's like. Actually he got a spaceship and he started going to these crazy planets. So far out there's nothing on them except power ups and he would like fly to these planets and I think he prayed or something and then when he came back he could float. Dude, that's what I'm doing with the spaceship. I'm going to find those planets.
- [01:38]
Griffin McRoy
Maybe we were too hard on Starfield.
- [01:40]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah.
- [01:40]
Justin McKeroy
When you say it in that specific and it only takes 20 seconds to say it's pretty good.
- [01:45]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah. Nah, we weren't.
- [01:48]
Russ Frushtick
No. That game fucking sucks.
- [02:08]
Justin McKeroy
My name is Justin McKeroy and I know the best game of the week.
- [02:10]
Griffin McRoy
My name is Griffin McRoy. I know the best game of the week.
- [02:12]
Russ Frushtick
My name is Russ Freshik. I know the best game of the week.
- [02:16]
Justin McKeroy
And welcome to the Besties where we talk about the latest and greatest in home interactive entertainment. It's a video game club and just by listening, you, my friend, have become a member. This week we are talking about Outer Worlds 2. Normally this is when Chris Plant would describe the game. He's not here, so rest fresh take it falls to you, what is Outer Worlds 2?
- [02:32]
Russ Frushtick
I don't know what Outer Worlds 2 is? But I know what the Outer Worlds 2 is. It's the sequel to the Outer Worlds.
- [02:37]
Griffin McRoy
Are you for serious?
- [02:38]
Justin McKeroy
I'll be right back with the pain in the ass Rush fushtick and the one I'm still talking to Griffin right after this.
- [02:46]
Russ Frushtick
This episode of the Besties is sponsored by Alienware. You know, a new era of power has arrived with the Alienware Area 51 gaming laptops, intentionally engineered to push more power to the CPU and the GPU for maximum performance. Combined with Intel Core Ultra 9 processors merging CPU, NPU, and integrated GPU into one AI optimized chip, it delivers fast, smart, and seamless performance across everything you do. So no matter what you're playing, Alienware ensures every game runs precisely as the developers intended. A new era of power is here, and all you have to do is take it. Discover Area51 today@Alienware.com Area51 laptops. That's Alienware.com Area51 laptops.
- [03:42]
Justin McKeroy
Outer Worlds, to me, has always been really interesting because I feel like it's one that I really liked and I think a lot of people really liked, but it didn't, for whatever reason, at least for me, seem to have as much of the staying power. I know the music kicked around for quite some time, but I felt like the foothold, the song, there's a couple of songs from it that became very like, big on YouTube and TikTok and stuff, but I don't know, it seemed like just sort of an obsessive fandom or something.
- [04:09]
Griffin McRoy
If I'm remembering the timeline kind of correctly, didn't Outer Worlds come out sort of Shortly after Fallout 76 was either out or announced? And I remember a lot of the response to that game was in conversation with the stuff that Bethesda's not really doing so much these days. And so there was a. I don't know, it became a point of comparison, like an inflection point about that. And it does feel like Outer Worlds 2 is free from a lot of that baggage and benefits from it a bit.
- [04:43]
Russ Frushtick
I think there was also an element of. There was an expectation, and this is on them because it was marketed this way of this being like New Vegas 2 effectively, right? Like, the first game was New Vegas 2. And given the fact that they were building this new game in a genre that they hadn't really fully explored in quite a while, it kind of felt like that promise wasn't totally met. Even though there were elements of that in the first game, it felt a little more Narrow than something you would see in Outer Worlds.
- [05:17]
Griffin McRoy
Can I set up Vegas? Can I try and set up what Outer Worlds is? Because I think that there's probably folks who either don't know or do get it confused with Outer Wilds.
- [05:26]
Russ Frushtick
Correct.
- [05:26]
Griffin McRoy
Which is a different game. But Outer Worlds is from Obsidian, the creators of New Vegas. And it is a. It is a first person sort of action RPG exploration game in the vein of a Fallout. You have a character with a set of skills that you invest points in every time you level up, giving you access to perks that change, like your character. There's a bunch of different weapons, bunch of different factions for you to work with, a bunch of stuff to explore. That's the basic setup of the game.
- [05:58]
Justin McKeroy
Yes. And I would say that tonally, and I don't know, this is maybe a bit more controversial, but you guys tell me. I've always felt like when Bethesda took over Fallout, it lost a lot of the humor and the cheek that was part of that series to begin with. And it's still in the DNA. But it's not as like, I think, when you're making a game as big as Fallout, I don't think they also wanted to make it as sort of like satirical.
- [06:20]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah. I mean, Fallout 2 got fucking downright wacky at times.
- [06:23]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [06:24]
Justin McKeroy
Super fast. So for me, I have felt like Outer Worlds is like, in some ways a more fitting sequel to Fallout because it's got a perspective and it is about consumerism in a way that Fallout games used to be. But now it's just sort of like, I don't know, it's laughing at its own jokes a lot. I feel like Outer Worlds is like there is a perspective. It is like a relentless capitalist satire that is very focused on this one specific. This one specific thing. Yeah.
- [06:55]
Griffin McRoy
I think Even Outer Worlds 2 does it better than Outer Worlds 1. I found the tone of Outer Worlds 1 a little bit grating because it was such a cartoonish, like, corporate hellscape. And that is definitely still the case here. But the way that they have kind of consolidated some of the factions. Right. In the first game, there were a bunch of different corporations vying for control of this one multi planetary system. And in this game, the game starts off with a bang and then there's like 10 years that you sleep through, essentially. And when you come back, Antis. What is it?
- [07:32]
Russ Frushtick
Anti's Choice.
- [07:33]
Griffin McRoy
Anti's Choice, which is made up of a corporate merger of Spacer's Choice and Anti. Something now, like, rules the galaxy and is like making an incursion into this authoritarian factions solar system that you are now in the middle of their great war. And also there's this religion based on math that's kicking around in there too. It's like everyone is. Everyone's sort of intention is extremely clearly laid out right from the jump. But it's not only played for laughs, like it's not only.
- [08:12]
Justin McKeroy
Silly.
- [08:13]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah.
- [08:14]
Justin McKeroy
What did you guys think of this game? The Outer Worlds too.
- [08:19]
Russ Frushtick
Sounds like you're setting us up.
- [08:21]
Justin McKeroy
I am because I feel like a lot of this is shoe leather to establish. It's kind of like Fallout, so.
- [08:26]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, that's.
- [08:26]
Griffin McRoy
That's totally.
- [08:27]
Justin McKeroy
Thank you.
- [08:29]
Griffin McRoy
I liked it. I like it. I'm still playing it. I like it more than I liked Outer Worlds 1. Outer Worlds 1 was a fine game that I feel like constantly pigeonholed me and my character into certain choices or locked me out of certain things because of how I was or was not built, leading to an ending that is pretty widely panned. I feel like for that game.
- [08:56]
Russ Frushtick
Where.
- [08:57]
Griffin McRoy
It'S so clear like you do the talking the bad guy out of it ending or you do the shoot the bad guy ending here, it's like, I don't know, it feels like they have done a much better job of making the world so much more interactive. Regardless of which way you've decided to build your character, it feels like there's a million ways to go about stuff. And that singular improvement has made the game a lot more enjoyable for me.
- [09:19]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, that's where the richest differences lie for me between this game and like recent Bethesda Game studios open world RPGs is because Bethesda's games have gotten so huge, I think from a scale standpoint, they feel like they can't offer those six solutions to a given side quest.
- [09:41]
Griffin McRoy
Right.
- [09:41]
Russ Frushtick
And here because you know, the. The areas aren't. It's not one giant open streaming map.
- [09:48]
Griffin McRoy
Right.
- [09:49]
Russ Frushtick
They can do much more focused stories and with more focused stories they're able to have a lot more variance in the solutions for a given thing. I also think the writing is just a lot stronger.
- [10:01]
Justin McKeroy
So I'm really. I think to me the thing that stands out the most while I'm playing this and it is the thing that I am. I like, I really appreciate, but I'm probably struggling with it more than I should is that it feels less directed than a lot of games like this would be. And I mean that in the sense of like, I'll give you an example this. There is a. I'm not going to use these specifics here, but there is a calamitous event where a ship that you're on is about to be brought down on a populated area. And the person that you're with says, you got to do something. And you're like, yes, absolutely, I'll do something. And then the only thing that's indicated on your HUD is an escape. Right? There is a computer in the room that you can use, but the only thing that's on the HUD is one place. And I just kind of assumed like, well, I guess I figure it out outside of here, but whatever. And then I got out the door and she was like, you just let it crash? And I was like, yeah, I guess there was. You did say I should do something on there, now that I think about it. So I reloaded my save, I looked around and yeah, I'll be damned. There's a computer there you can use to fix it. But the game wasn't like flashing it. It wasn't like, hey, this is pretty early on, so it's not a knock on the game. I hadn't sort of realized this was the level of like, of load. I wasn't playing with blanks, basically.
- [11:16]
Griffin McRoy
But that's cool. I do like that it does that. I actually really like that moment a lot because it does establish this feeling of like there's. You could be doing something. There is some. If you run into a building and there's a big armored dude in there and he's like, you wandered into the wrong building, now I'm gonna fuck you up. That's usually an indicator that like, you could have found like a vent that you snuck in or you could have.
- [11:39]
Justin McKeroy
It's better at hiding that, though. It's better A lot of these, like, deus ex, where it can be like, there's a great. On the left hand side that you can pull off with your strength, and then on the back there's a computer that you can hack open the door. And on the left there's a. A window you can sneak into. You know, it's not like it masks it better than that.
- [11:54]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, it feels more organic in the level design. I agree. There's a lot of situations where it'll be like a, theoretically an enemy base and obviously you can present like a fake ID to get in. But within that enemy base, there's just so much other side content that you can find if you just take the time to do it.
- [12:13]
Griffin McRoy
That's. That's.
- [12:14]
Justin McKeroy
They also make skills so important in conversation and not just skills like your talking skill, but, like, how aware you are of. I mean, almost every skill seems to play into dialogue a lot of the time. So it made me want to increase my skills just so I would know what I was talking about in conversations, which is not something I'd usually think.
- [12:33]
Griffin McRoy
And there's also attached to every skill some sort of mechanical benefit. So, like, your speech skill doesn't just unlock certain conversation options. It, like, increases the damage you deal to human beings. So, like, that's. I think the RPG systems in this game are second to none. I think that I have problems with this game. This is not one of them. This is a huge fucking issue for RPGs, especially this style of RPG. And the number of times trying to find that balance between, like, you're giving people enough stuff that they're doing that it feels like their own unique adventure while also not locking them out of stuff. Like, every time I see a computer that's like, hack it, I'm like, I have zero hack points. It's simply not the way I've gone. That doesn't bother me, though, because there's also, like, two or three other things in this room that I can, like, fuck with and feel like I have interacted with. That stuff is, like, so on point in this game.
- [13:28]
Russ Frushtick
I think. I think you're talking about, like, a peerless RPG system. I think the biggest differentiator, and we've talked about this a lot in other games, is do, like, when you level up, does that feel like an exciting moment?
- [13:41]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [13:42]
Russ Frushtick
Do the perks that you're spending or the points that you're spending, whatever it is, feel like things that would be immediately useful to your gameplay. And in this case, there are, like, I didn't count, I want to say, 75 perks in this game that you can see the full list right at the start of the game and work your way up to earning those perks by spending skill points in a variety of different.
- [14:00]
Justin McKeroy
Which is a cool way of doing it, by the way, where the. The perks are an offshoot of the way you spent your points so you're not, like. It reduces the chance that you're gonna, like, spec in a. In a weird way.
- [14:11]
Russ Frushtick
Right. It's a. It's building off of something that New Vegas did, where once you hit, like, level 10 in exploration, it unlocked a bunch of perks that ordinarily you wouldn't be able to get if you didn't have level 10. But here it's revealing all that stuff to you so it, you know, oh, this is something I want to work on. All that stuff I think is done again fantastically well in ways that I think this should be held up as a representation of like how to make this feel desirable.
- [14:40]
Justin McKeroy
Another cool thing that they did that I feel like a lot of games these days don't have the guts to that are in this genre is make ammo matter where like I was pretty frequently like running out of bullets in a way that like grounded me to the. It kept me in the scenario, it kept me talking to my compatriots, it kept me like really looking at gear because every gear that you get can be turned into scrap metal which you can turn into bullets. And a lot of times like I needed bullets because my thing was like a pistol. So I'm shooting out like every battle is like 50 bullets. So I'm like turning through a lot of ammo. But that keeps you like locked into the system. It keeps you like in the, in the world. It keeps you balancing these things.
- [15:20]
Griffin McRoy
I don't think it does as good a job with like itemization and I know we're getting like into the nitty gritty, but this is like a huge open world rpg so it is kind of important. Like there are sort of bog standard versions of different guns and some of those guns are like better than others, right? Like a heavy revolver is just going to do more damage than a light revolver. And they have mod slots that you can equip the guns with that you can either find in the world or craft. There's like a whole crafting build you can kind of go down in the game but it's not like a ton of options. And then you're also finding sort of unique pieces of gear of like armor and helmets and weapons that have a mod that's like you can't get otherwise that's slotted into them. So I felt like, well, I should really only be using those because they have like the coolest shit. And then you go a long time without getting stuff. I put a bunch of points in guns and sneak attack and so like I saw my numbers go through the roof. But it wasn't because of the weapons I was using. Like when I would find a new weapon, it was a little bit less exciting than like, oh, I just got this perk that does like doubles my sneak attack damage. If they're looking at a corpse of someone that I killed already, I will.
- [16:27]
Justin McKeroy
Say I spent too much time. I think you spend way too much time in this game. Like Trying to get your cursor on an item that is like a very small object, but like kind of slowly looking around a room and slowly picking up the items that are lying around. I think that it is not fun to try to get your cursor on the exact little bottle that you want to pick up and then pick it up and then look and see if you want to drink it or break it down. Like, it's. It's a little fiddly.
- [16:50]
Russ Frushtick
It is funny, though, because everything that you can pick up has utility. It's not like Starfield, where, like, you can pick up this microscope if you want to.
- [16:57]
Justin McKeroy
Sure.
- [16:58]
Griffin McRoy
Go for. Let me. This is the way that they handle food in the game, right? Think about Bioshock, where it's like you have your healing syringes, but you find a bag of potato chips, you eat that right away and it heals you or whatever. In this game, when you pick up food, it goes into your food inventory, and then under your health bar, you'll see a little knife and fork. You have a healing inhaler that you use as your only method of healing. And you can customize the inhaler. There's a medicine skill associated with it. But if you have food in your inventory, it shows you that symbol of the knife and fork. And then when you press the inhaler button, if you're not in combat, you automatically will eat the food you have in your inventory to heal you to full before you go for any of your meds. And they use that one button. There's one button for that. Like, that shit's real smart and real, real streamlined and real, real good. So it's a bit of a mixed bag.
- [17:45]
Justin McKeroy
Did you all listen to the. I wanted to hear if you guys listen to the radio much?
- [17:49]
Griffin McRoy
Fuck yes.
- [17:50]
Justin McKeroy
Did you listen to the radio much?
- [17:51]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, a little bit. Yeah.
- [17:54]
Justin McKeroy
It's really. I found it to be really interesting because they have a bunch of these, like, it's super in world. All of it is like, you know, it's ads for Auntie's Choice. It's like you meet a sort of like, faction that's obsessed with numbers and they have a radio station and all their songs are about math. Yeah, I wish it is that I'm right on the. On the line with it because I love this sort of shit, right? I love it. I love in world radio stations. Like, I loved, like when Laszlo had a station on gta. Whatever. There's just. It's like you have to have it on and it's not background, really. It's like you're listening to these songs and there's not a ton of them. There's like a good amount, but like, you're playing this game for many, many hours. Like, there's not enough radio that it's not like looping and it starts to get a little bit like, okay, guys, I need something that I can tune out.
- [18:48]
Griffin McRoy
I.
- [18:49]
Russ Frushtick
You don't have to have it on.
- [18:50]
Griffin McRoy
No, yeah. I mean, I definitely used it on the first planet and then when I got off the first planet, I was like, kind of.
- [18:55]
Russ Frushtick
And they'll like, tell you, like, oh, you got a new signal if there's like a quest attached to it or something.
- [18:58]
Justin McKeroy
Yes, this is what I'm saying. This is. I wanted to. I wanted to say, like, I eventually did turn it off, but, like, when you're listening to it initially, it's like, it's really great. It's a fantastic thing.
- [19:10]
Griffin McRoy
I have to say the thing that is. Oh, we should mention before I get into sort of like my main gripe, I think the gunplay feels fucking good. And that is not something that this genre is known for. I felt differently when I started because you start out with weak, shitty weapons. But as I have found different weapons with different unique perks and gone down a certain build and focus points into guns and unlock some gun perks. It feels pretty good to get in a gunfight. It is not like Fallout where once you are spotted and you lose your sneak attack bonus, it's like, oh, fuck. Like, now I have to shoot these like, clumsy guns. Like, I think they've actually done a pretty, pretty good job with the. The combat side.
- [19:55]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, there's. They also, I think in this game added like slide, like combat slides and things like that. So, like the mobility stuff, you have a double jump at one point.
- [20:03]
Griffin McRoy
So like mobility gadget. It looks like you disagree a bit.
- [20:07]
Russ Frushtick
Juice. Okay. Yeah, no, I. I thought it was. I thought they did a really, really good job.
- [20:12]
Justin McKeroy
They do a good job. The gun's still powerful. It also feels like your companions are helpful. They have like, special abilities that you can fire off that are nice. There's not a ton of, like, they seem to stick to themselves pretty much. Like, there's not a ton of like, other than like firing off that ability.
- [20:28]
Griffin McRoy
Like you're not telling them where to.
- [20:29]
Justin McKeroy
Go, changing their gear up as much. So you do like some basic leveling of them, but you're not like giving them all their equipment, which as far.
- [20:36]
Russ Frushtick
As I'm concerned is a boon.
- [20:37]
Justin McKeroy
Like I'd rather you do not want to have to deal with that.
- [20:41]
Griffin McRoy
My issue is this is something that they have not fixed from this genre of games. And I think that there is just a sort of like there are just some structural issues under the hood with quests and how all of that is handled. It is so rad that you are in this world, this set of planets where you can do whatever and you feel like there is a custom path that you are kind of blazing through it. But a lot of times I have been in a region where I am talking to people and they are talking to me as if I am in the middle of a quest that they're supposed to be on that I did not start. Like I missed the first kind of part of. And now I'm kind of jumping into the middle. There's a bit where one of the characters, the main buddy of yours, when you start the game, I think got hung up on a quest or something and he always had a little speech bubble over his head like he had something to say to me. And yet he.
- [21:44]
Justin McKeroy
I have that with another companion where she always.
- [21:47]
Griffin McRoy
And that stuff is. That stuff is so soul crushing. I feel like when you are investing as much time into this game as it asks for to feel like I've put maybe 25 hours into it. I've played quite a bit at this point and I feel like for the last few hours I have been like on a planet where I'm just sort of running around and every quest is like out of order and I'm pretty.
- [22:13]
Justin McKeroy
This is 100% my experience. I'm really glad I hear you saying this, Griffin, because I thought it was in my head. But the fact that you're echoing, it's not constant.
- [22:21]
Griffin McRoy
It's just like there are parts of the game and the part that I am in now just feels like fucking spaghetti. Like it feels like nothing. It is. And I've had parts of the game that are cogent where you show up and they say, here's the situation on this planet. Go out here, maybe you can find some help here, maybe you can find some help there. And it's like, okay, cool. Those are questlines that I get on. And then I've had entire hours long sections of the game where it just feels like jazz until eventually my main quest updates and it's like, oh, okay. So now I guess I go there.
- [22:49]
Justin McKeroy
There's. There is also the, the quests because it is a bit more open ended. There are quests that are sort of mutually exclusive that you don't necessarily. It doesn't make sure that are. That like, if you do them, you're going to rule out a whole other. And maybe if you're like, you know, if you're thinking about it and like, trying to logic it out, you know, maybe you're thinking like, well, if I do this, then that might rule out this other quest. But, like, when you're just playing a fucking video game, you're not like, you know, you're just doing the mission.
- [23:16]
Russ Frushtick
That happened a few.
- [23:17]
Justin McKeroy
Like, there'll be a lot of times where it's. It wouldn't be clear what to do if my, like, me knowing what I wanted to do narratively, it wasn't clear mechanically how I should be advancing that goal because everything's sort of like conscious.
- [23:31]
Russ Frushtick
That would happen a few times in like, Fallout where you'd like, complete a quest for a companion or whatever, and then suddenly there'd be like 16 pop ups of like, you failed this quest. You failed this quest.
- [23:40]
Griffin McRoy
Right? This game also does a thing a lot, which is, I will talk to someone and they'd be like, we need you to help with this. We're trying to negotiate with this labor union. Can you. Can you go and help us out? And it's like, sure. But then it doesn't give you a quest for like, sometimes you'll be asked to do something and you will not get a quest for it. And it's like.
- [24:00]
Russ Frushtick
Or it'll just be like something you heard and then you have to kind of like, sleuth it out.
- [24:03]
Griffin McRoy
Or sometimes it's nothing.
- [24:05]
Justin McKeroy
But sometimes it wasn't even that. Sometimes it wouldn't be that. The doctor gave me medicine for a guy and then didn't tell me the guys. I had met the guy earlier. That's the only reason I knew where the guy was. But like, there were also a couple of times where like. And maybe this is. I don't know if this is like a. A positive or a negative, I guess, but there was an area that there frequently be areas that look intimidating. They look like video game levels. And you're exploring and you're like, okay, I can get into here, so I'm going to go mess around. And then you'll start finding mechanics of quests. Like a switch that flips a thing and you're like, okay, I guess I'm flipping switches. And then I'll go do this other thing. And you'll go through a whole thing and you're like, I'm fighting a guy. I don't know. And then you do. You go find someone who's like, I've got a serious situation I need you to rectify. Like, oh, the factory. Yeah, man. I fucking did all that, dude.
- [24:55]
Griffin McRoy
Facility found, who I think is probably the final NPC for, like, one of the quest lines in the game. The whole time I'm going through the facility, it's like, this will be great evidence for fucking what? I don't know. Because I just found this place and I was like, this place looks cool. And I went inside and I didn't get a guy who showed up. Like, not yet. Not yet you're not. I'm gonna have some shit for you to do here later. Don't come in here. It's not ready yet.
- [25:17]
Russ Frushtick
I guess the question I would have is, is how much of this stuff is fixable? You guys are. I think I've played 10 hours, so you guys are further along than I am.
- [25:24]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [25:25]
Russ Frushtick
How much of this is, like, you know, with patches, over the course of a month or two or whatever, I.
- [25:31]
Justin McKeroy
Found that I feel like it is a friction between the amount of freedom they want to give you and the amount of, like, direction that some players might want. Because there's a lot of the times, if you think about it logically, you can usually come up with it, but more often than not, it would. Like, you'd get to, you know, you'd go for 20 minutes down a road and then you'd hit a skill check that you can't pass. And it's like, well, I guess I could fail this skill check and get a really shitty ending to this, this, this mission. But I've done all this shit. I'll just come back when I've improved my speech skill and I have a more satisfying ending to that mission.
- [26:09]
Griffin McRoy
I did that exact. I did that exact thing in that facility where my speech skill was one point too low to fulfill, like, a series of checks with, like, the final boss of the thing. And I was like, okay. So I left and I did other shit. And then I come back and the result was like, he was. Instead of starting a fight with me, he's like, okay, you can have the thing in my office. It's like, dude, I stole that thing from your office three and a half hours ago. I did all of that for nothing.
- [26:34]
Justin McKeroy
It is.
- [26:34]
Griffin McRoy
But that's the trade off, right? That's the illusion. You can't have the system that they have here without having that moment happen to you some of the time. That stuff doesn't bother me as Much as like something's going to break. Like something's going to break. Am I do I really want to keep playing this game and investing in this character who like maybe I'm not going to be able to do the rest of his shit. I have characters who I roll with, who I have maxed out all of their stuff and like pretty much finished their quest lines and I'm not particularly interested in them. And then I have my road dogs who for whatever reason won't start a conversation with me like, hey, can you go here so I can meet my old buddy and I can get some new skills points?
- [27:10]
Russ Frushtick
That stuff seems fixable.
- [27:12]
Griffin McRoy
It does seem fixable. It's just like frustrating in the state of the game. It's like that level of structural stuff in a game that you spend so much time playing is such a turn off and it's a bummer if you're.
- [27:24]
Justin McKeroy
Gonna do this stuff about not using a firm hand to guide people. Like to use the example I used earlier, right? If I don't know that that's not a bug. If I don't know, like, if you're going to give me that level of freedom your has to work perfectly. Because if I hit a bug where I'm like, well that's not. That was not me missing something, that was you, then I don't trust anymore. Like I don't have that trust anymore. Then I want you to put all the markers down. Because I don't have the faith that this is all working as intended. I don't know if this is how it's. I don't know if this is intentionally obfuscated or if it is a bug. And a lot of times in this.
- [28:00]
Griffin McRoy
Game like I just fail safes even if they are immersion breaking of like you show up to a facility, get like a fucking phone call or whatever from someone like, hey, good you found this facility. Can you look for this stuff for me? Instead of just like I went, oh, am I. I don't think I'm supposed to be here yet. Oh, that guy knows my name. I don't know his fucking.
- [28:21]
Russ Frushtick
I think, I think this to me feels like a very strong foundation for something that could certainly be cleaned up over time. I agree there's always going to be issues, especially with a game that's this open.
- [28:33]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [28:34]
Justin McKeroy
But I'm trying to be real because this is my shit and I'm going to keep playing it. I love this kind of shit, but it is also the kind of shit that I am most permissive of Flaws. Because it is.
- [28:45]
Griffin McRoy
This is the most. I have enjoyed one of these games since probably since Fallout four. Probably.
- [28:49]
Russ Frushtick
It really does say something.
- [28:51]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, I think they've nailed it. I think that they. It is an experienced hand who have made some really, really clever choices to sidestep a lot of the issues that this genre has faced in the past. And they've done it in a package that looks good, sounds good, feels really good to play, feels like the things you're doing are meaningful. And yeah, you're probably right. They probably will patch it out or release their Spacer's Choice Premium Edition or whatever at some point.
- [29:15]
Russ Frushtick
I mean, it's worth knowing. Also, when this episode, this Besties episode comes out, the game still won't be out for another four day, five days.
- [29:23]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah.
- [29:23]
Russ Frushtick
So that's not an excuse like the. Obviously. But I also.
- [29:26]
Griffin McRoy
You have to couch it a little bit because our experience may be different.
- [29:29]
Justin McKeroy
It is not mostly buggy, though. In my experience. I will say it. It was not buggy. It was. It was a. It seemed like a deliberate amount of freedom.
- [29:39]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, it.
- [29:39]
Justin McKeroy
It. You know, my. I just. I watched the. The Danny Boyle, Steve Jobs movie, the Aaron Sorkin wrote on the plane home because I was listening to Black Check and they have this argument that Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak have this discussion between number of ports in the system where Steve Jobs wants two because he wants a closed system they completely control. Wozniak wants eight because he wants the users to be completely in control. And it's the. How those two. Like that it reminded me of this game where it's that thing of like, wanting to have a completely polished, smooth, like uncharted versus.
- [30:12]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, of course.
- [30:14]
Justin McKeroy
Right. Versus, like, what's the other end? It's like stalker. Right. Like. Or Daisy or like that where it's like. Yes, exactly. Right. So it's. It's always that balance. It just feels a little bit on the edge of like. It feels like that it was more about. It's impressive that you can keep the immersion and get to the end of it and it still, like, holds together and it seems like that was more important to them than having something that's consistently sort of like, pleasant to engage with.
- [30:43]
Griffin McRoy
I would say I'll probably stick with it. Yeah, I genuinely, like, pretty. Pretty sucked in.
- [30:51]
Justin McKeroy
The writing's great to do. I don't know if we talked about that, but, like, the interactions between people and the. The. The moments and like, even data pads and stuff like that are all.
- [30:59]
Russ Frushtick
I would also add that, like this is the third game they've released this year that has been pretty fucking good. They put out Avowed. They put out Grounded two, and this.
- [31:09]
Griffin McRoy
That's wild.
- [31:10]
Russ Frushtick
No one. No one is doing that these days.
- [31:14]
Justin McKeroy
Yeah. Yeah. Don't let Obsidian, don't let Microsoft know how well you're doing. Whatever locks you change, just leave them changed.
- [31:25]
Griffin McRoy
Should we take a break?
- [31:27]
Russ Frushtick
Yep. This episode of the Besties is sponsored by Alienware. A new era of power has arrived with the Alienware Area 51 gaming laptops, intentionally engineered to push more power to the CPU and the GPU for maximum performance. Combined with Intel Core Ultra 9 processors merging CPU, NPU, and integrated GPU into one AI optimized chip, it delivers fast, smart, and seamless performance across everything you do. So no matter what you're playing, Alienware ensures that every game runs precisely as the developers intended. A new era of power is here. All you have to do is take it. Discover Area51 today@Alienware.com Area51 laptops. That's Alienware.com Area51 laptops. This episode of the Besties is sponsored by Rocket Money. You know, most of us know that we should take control of our finances, but it's hard to know where to start. Rocket Money is designed to give you the clarity and confidence to take that first step, helping you cut wasteful spending and take meaningful action toward your financial goals. Rocket Money is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. Their dashboard lays out your total financial picture, including bill due dates and pay dates, in a way that's easier, easy to digest, and you can even create custom budgets based on your past spending. Rocket Money has saved users over $2.5 billion, including over 880 million in canceled subscriptions alone. Their 10 million members save up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions today and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Go to RocketMoney.comBesties today. That's RocketMoney.comBesties. rocketMoney.comBesties Justin, you have a new device.
- [33:50]
Justin McKeroy
Thank you for not saying toy like my wife.
- [33:52]
Russ Frushtick
You have a new doodad that you like.
- [33:54]
Griffin McRoy
Oh, gosh. I think that's the color I got, too. That shit looks so good.
- [34:00]
Justin McKeroy
So I'm watching. As you can see here, I'm watching a video down on this screen of Ayn Thor. And up here, I'm playing the latest Rich work. Yeah.
- [34:07]
Griffin McRoy
Can you set up for the folks not seeing?
- [34:09]
Justin McKeroy
Yeah. So this is a. This is a device made by company called Ayn. They made most notably the Odin 2 and the Odin 2 Portal and the Odin II Mini. But those are their last a few devices. They're very well regarded. This is the Thor, which is a dual screen console. And there have been other like dual screen PCs, but this is the first dual screen Android console.
- [34:38]
Russ Frushtick
It's like a DS form factor, basically.
- [34:41]
Justin McKeroy
So yeah, a clamshell form factor. You've got a wide screen at the top, right. And then at the bottom you've got closer to like a four by three kind of square guy here. So you have two different form factors when you load a. The two screens are independent so you can get a game going on the top screen or an app or whatever. It's whichever is focused is what the controls will do. So if you tap on the bottom screen and then use the controls, you're controlling this. If you tap on this screen, use.
- [35:08]
Griffin McRoy
The controls and I'm assuming there's emulators like Melonds and Drastic and like the major sort of DS3DS emulators are able to use both simultaneously.
- [35:20]
Justin McKeroy
Yes, you can set it to use both simultaneously. You can also choose for certain apps that they'll always launch in the top or in the bottom or whatever. And there's also another kind of clever solution that they've done here is there's this button here at the bottom of the screens and this brings up sort of a home. It is just for this specific dual screen setup. So there is a button where you can switch from dual screen, bottom screen, top screen. There's also an audio slider where you can choose which screen is doing how. Right. So if you have like a game on this level and a video on this one, you can like choose and then you can also do the brightness independently on. On the screens. So it's all pretty well like, I mean all pretty well optimized for that. It feels pretty good to play the buttons. The only thing that I will say, I don't know if you guys can see this very well, but look at these.
- [36:13]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, they're grounded out just a bit.
- [36:15]
Justin McKeroy
So the. This is like we've got big chunky triggers on the twos and then we've got some these guys on the ones and they're kind of like behind this. It's not super comfortable. When the screen is like this, it's not super comfortable. Hit these. And I will also say that if you're someone that wants to play a lot of D pad stuff. This is not the most.
- [36:34]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, keypad's in the bottom left, so you gotta, like, curve D pads on the bottom left.
- [36:38]
Justin McKeroy
It's kind of a reach down here. It's not super. They have traded. I think it's always a question of, like, ergonomics versus pocket. I think that's. That's what you're up against. And this. They've made a little bit of a concession here. Right. You got rounded in the back. Ergonomics here. Rounded in the back a little bit. But, like, it's surprisingly, like, pretty chunky.
- [37:00]
Griffin McRoy
I saw it's about the size of a 2DS XL, if you remember that.
- [37:03]
Russ Frushtick
Here.
- [37:04]
Justin McKeroy
I have a DS. Let me grab one.
- [37:06]
Griffin McRoy
I have one of these bad boys ordered. And because it is coming from mainland China, it does take a minute to get your hands on one of these.
- [37:15]
Russ Frushtick
There's some fraught relationships. So maybe that's.
- [37:19]
Griffin McRoy
I've heard a little bit about that. Yeah.
- [37:21]
Russ Frushtick
Speak on that.
- [37:22]
Griffin McRoy
No.
- [37:26]
Justin McKeroy
See what I have handy here, this is a 3DS. So to compare this for you guys, I would say, I mean.
- [37:33]
Russ Frushtick
Oh, that's an original 3D.
- [37:34]
Griffin McRoy
That's an original 3Ds.
- [37:36]
Justin McKeroy
So it's original 3Ds.
- [37:37]
Russ Frushtick
So probably about 10% bigger.
- [37:39]
Griffin McRoy
It's about XL size of either the 3Ds or the 2Ds.
- [37:42]
Justin McKeroy
So this is a 2Ds.
- [37:44]
Griffin McRoy
Well, yeah, that's the crazy.
- [37:46]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah.
- [37:46]
Griffin McRoy
Single panel.
- [37:47]
Russ Frushtick
I. I think here's. Here's where I'm. Here's where I'm at with these things is I definitely know it's about.
- [37:55]
Justin McKeroy
It's also about the same size as this guy, the RG, the. We were talking about the 477M, the new Amber Nick guy. It's about. It's about that size.
- [38:03]
Griffin McRoy
Gotten all this in.
- [38:04]
Justin McKeroy
Yeah.
- [38:06]
Russ Frushtick
Here's what I'm gonna say. At this point, I don't know how to fit this much tinkering in my life.
- [38:15]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, sure.
- [38:15]
Russ Frushtick
And when you're talking about two screens in particular, I'd imagine. And tell me if this is incorrect. Even more tinkering required to, like, really get things working nicely now.
- [38:26]
Justin McKeroy
It is. I will say this. It is surpri. No, no. Broadly speaking. No.
- [38:31]
Russ Frushtick
Like, if you load up a DS ROM in whatever, an emulator for DS games, it works. Like, it recognizes the second screen and just works.
- [38:41]
Justin McKeroy
No, because part of it is, like, figuring out how you want to do it. Right. Some. Some games work better with, like, certain Screens oriented different ways. Like you have to fiddle with it. And it is not. There is like more. There is more tinkering. You're 100, right. And. And I honestly, this is probably the most damning thing. But Russ. Good. Russ said it and I think I agree with it. It still doesn't replace the 3Ds. It's not a replacement for the 3Ds. It's a very cool way of experiencing those things. And I will say it's a pretty good use case to have a walkthrough or something on one screen, a game on the other or something like that. Or if you have music or something you're zoning out to. All that stuff. Works really well. It feels good. The thumbsticks are really deep inset. I don't know if you can tell, but like to avoid the clamshell design. They're pretty. They're sunk pretty deep in there, which is not my favorite, but it's a.
- [39:37]
Russ Frushtick
That's. You kind of have to. If you're going to do the clamshell.
- [39:39]
Justin McKeroy
You kind of have to. Right. But like, I think they executed on this really, really well. I think that there's different form factor. I always. I hate getting into like the. The pricing and all these like the, the. The kludgy things. But there. The base of this is like 250, and that's for like the base model with 8 gigabytes of memory and then 16 is with a terabyte of storage for 429. So there's definitely a range. There's a range on that.
- [40:12]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah. I'm still in this mode of just like, I kind of like I have my. What is it? Flip 2. And it works well and I set it up and I took like whatever, a few hours to set that up and it works. And so I'm in this, like, dormant period where I just kind of just want things to work and I don't want to take a lot of time. But again, like, it'll happen like a year or two from now where I'll be like, okay, I'm ready and I'm going to commit a bunch of time to it. But for right now, I think I'm.
- [40:38]
Griffin McRoy
I think there's a lot of people probably doing that. I think that makes sense.
- [40:42]
Justin McKeroy
I think that this is a really. It's a really good one of those. And I think the dual screen thing is. I will say it's like. So I agree with you, Russ, in the sense that, like, it doesn't open up a whole lot of like, new doors. But I think that for me, I'm always thinking from like a preservationist standpoint too. And like, there's a lot of experiences, especially on like the Wii U and the three DS that are kind of like locked to those consoles.
- [41:09]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah.
- [41:09]
Justin McKeroy
So there is a. There is a respect at which you're right. But there's this other regard in which there's a lot of libraries that are kind of like that I are not as easy to explore. And like, these devices are kind of moving forward, trying to help keep that preserved. Like, so that. That part to me is like, if you're someone who just wants to play old games and like, just wants it to work, I think that you can usually like, lag behind about a year. And it's crazy how well these things will work. I mean, people will do it all for you. It'll be so easy. But if you're somebody likes to screw around new things, it's an exciting. It's an exciting area of screwing up.
- [41:45]
Griffin McRoy
And that catalog is so strong. DS and 3DS games are so. There's so fucking many good ones. And there hasn't been a great way to really do that yet.
- [41:53]
Justin McKeroy
But like, it's not coincidence that I have my 3ds, like in reach, like this way. I have my Vita within reach. Like, there's still like, I have my Wii U. I don't have a Wii U. Just kidding. Why would I have a Wii U?
- [42:08]
Russ Frushtick
We have some reader mail.
- [42:09]
Justin McKeroy
Oh, yeah.
- [42:10]
Russ Frushtick
Okay. We have a letter from Andrew. In talking about Steam Next Fest, I have only been able to play one game despite downloading close to 14. It's called desktop Defender. It's basically like a little window. This is me talking. It's basically like a little window that just shows up in the corner of your desktop. And it is like part Vampire Survivors, part progression game, Idle Game. But because it's so minimal, it kind of just sits in the corner of your screen and you like do a little. Some doodle things on the corner and then you just go back to working whatever you were doing. You get a gun to shoot incoming things, you get more xp, you get more upgrades, et cetera. We're all familiar with the format. I think the interesting thing here is specifically that it is just this like such a minimal, like side game, almost like Clippy showing up and you can have like a little moment and then you just go back to whatever you were doing, which seems kind of cool. It's called Desktop Defender.
- [43:00]
Justin McKeroy
Is this.
- [43:00]
Griffin McRoy
It's not Desktop Tower defense?
- [43:02]
Russ Frushtick
No, it's called Desktop Defender. It's on Steam.
- [43:05]
Justin McKeroy
I have not thought about Desktop Tower defense so long. I'm freaking out.
- [43:09]
Russ Frushtick
That's it.
- [43:10]
Justin McKeroy
You're playing it. You're already playing it. Desktop Tower defense. God, I haven't thought about that game in a hundred years.
- [43:17]
Russ Frushtick
March 2007 this other recommendation comes from Caleb regarding Steam Next Fest. I got the recommendation in the post Games Patreon for Tears of Metal. Having played it, it's a blast. I'm not usually one for hack and slash dynasty warrior stuff, but this one is greatly simplified version that feels good combined with slay the spire type rogue like path options. I had a blast and thought it could be a good diamond in the rough.
- [43:41]
Griffin McRoy
This does look cool.
- [43:43]
Russ Frushtick
Kyle has a quick shout out to me. I took Russ recent advice.
- [43:48]
Justin McKeroy
Just read your own goddamn emails, Russ.
- [43:50]
Russ Frushtick
Fuck.
- [43:51]
Justin McKeroy
Why don't we have to hear it?
- [43:53]
Russ Frushtick
I took Russ advice and downloaded Luigi's Mansion to play with my 4 year old and it went great. She's never really gotten to a game before because she's never equipped with using a controller to navigate a 3D space, but this game seems perfect for the level of approachability, so she's finally getting it. If you guys have any other pre K friendly game wrecks, they're always welcome.
- [44:12]
Griffin McRoy
Luigi's Mansion just hit the or it is hitting the Nintendo switch online. Like GameCube classics.
- [44:20]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, this was I think in context of Luigi's Mansion 3 which has co op, right?
- [44:25]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah. Right.
- [44:25]
Justin McKeroy
Cooper got really into to a T. Surely like that one a lot. Yeah, it's a pretty good one for youngsters. I think they'd have a lot of fun with that.
- [44:33]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, I mean Donkey Kong bonanza, but we've talked quite a bit about that. Solar Smash is an iPad game where you blow up planets with different things. Kids love that shit. Kids love blowing up whole planets.
- [44:48]
Russ Frushtick
It's a big one. We have one more letter. Smorgle sent a bunch of recommendations from Steam Next Fest but I want to call out one of them. Seance of Blake Manor is a first person puzzle game, sort of like Blueprints and Return to Obra Dinn. You're gathering clues, finding evidence, interviewing people, all the good stuff. Time passes when you look at objects so there is a real sense of tension in your moment to moment decisions.
- [45:10]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, I think Plant dropped the trailer for this in the Besties channel a bit ago and it does look real good.
- [45:20]
Russ Frushtick
Yeah, I agree.
- [45:22]
Griffin McRoy
I mean it just seems like it has Like. Like blueprints, but even spookier. Spooky blueprints. Whoa.
- [45:29]
Justin McKeroy
Check, please.
- [45:30]
Russ Frushtick
Someday I'll play blueprints. It still has not been updated for colorblind mode.
- [45:34]
Griffin McRoy
That's bonkers, man.
- [45:38]
Russ Frushtick
Anything else you want to talk about for honorable mentions?
- [45:42]
Justin McKeroy
I'm still playing. Do we talk about Clover Pain?
- [45:46]
Russ Frushtick
We did. We have talked about Clover Page.
- [45:48]
Justin McKeroy
Yes, I'm still playing. Clover Pit Merge Maestro. Nothing.
- [45:52]
Russ Frushtick
I wanted to call out a show called Extraordinary, which is on Hulu. British People. It's got British people in it. Tonally. I think it's probably pretty close to something like what we do in Shadows. It's not like a mockumentary format, but.
- [46:08]
Griffin McRoy
Otherwise, what we do in Shadows, that's good. Dude razzed his ass.
- [46:14]
Russ Frushtick
The premise. The premise of the show is basically, it's like our world, but every single person on the planet has a power of some sort. And some of those are weird. Like, you can. This person can rewind time 12 seconds, and this person can fly, and this person get. Blah, blah, blah. But the main protagonist of the show is 25 and has not received her power yet. So she's, like, in this state of rest development. But it's very funny and really well written and there's two seasons of that. And so if you're looking for something in the tone of what we do in the shadows, There you go.
- [46:53]
Griffin McRoy
I want to call out the undertale 10th anniversary album of remixes that came out, I think last week or the week before. Toby Fox got a bunch of different people together and did remixes songs from Undertale to celebrate the 10th anniversary. And some of them are such fucking club bangers. There's a version of Death by Glamour on there that absolutely fucking shreds. So we've been listening to quite a bit of that.
- [47:19]
Russ Frushtick
Is it stuff that Toby remixed or is it, like, fans?
- [47:23]
Griffin McRoy
I don't know. I don't know. His name's.
- [47:26]
Russ Frushtick
I ask mostly because, like, where's Toby finding the fucking time to do all this stuff?
- [47:30]
Griffin McRoy
Yeah, I don't know, man. I don't know. But, yeah, I've pretty much only been playing Outer Worlds, too. It kind of demands a lot of your. Your time.
- [47:40]
Justin McKeroy
All right, well, next week. What are we going to be doing next week?
- [47:43]
Russ Frushtick
Next week we are going to be playing Keeper. I think Justin's going to be diving into Keeper, which is the new Double Fine game. And Griffin and I will be playing Pokemon Legends Za, which is the new Pokemon game. Yeah. I might dip a little toe into Keeper 2 because I am I do like their games Keeper 2.
- [48:02]
Justin McKeroy
You already got it. Shit, dude. Damn.
- [48:05]
Russ Frushtick
But before we wrap up the show, I do want to thank the members over at The Patreon. That's patreon.com, the besties. You. We want to thank new members John Ben, Brennan B. And Curtis G. Thank you for being members of the Patreon. We have resties coming up on Tuesday. We have a new bracket battles episode coming up real soon for members of the Patreon. You can actually vote on which bracket battle we're going to do next. So keep an eye out for that for subscribed members. And we love you a lot.
- [48:38]
Griffin McRoy
Yep.
- [48:39]
Justin McKeroy
Beautiful. All right. Thanks, y'.
- [48:40]
Russ Frushtick
All.
- [48:40]
Justin McKeroy
Appreciate you. Be sure to join us again next time for the besties, because shouldn't the world's best friends pick the world's best games besties.