Mixtape Is a Musical Magic Trick

Summary

The Besties – "Mixtape Is a Musical Magic Trick" (May 15, 2026)

Episode Overview

This episode of The Besties, featuring Russ Frushtick, Chris Plante, Griffin McElroy, Justin McElroy, and special guest Lucy James, is a vibrant, heartfelt discussion of Mixtape, a coming-of-age narrative adventure game from Beethoven & Dinosaur (publishers of The Artful Escape). The Besties dissect what makes Mixtape a singularly effective musical and nostalgic adventure, as well as the discourse surrounding teen sincerity, nostalgia games, and the universal ache of leaving adolescence behind. The team also touches on related pop culture, reader mail, and their favorite moments from Mixtape, with a lively spoiler section in the final act.

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Main Topics and Key Insights

1. What Is Mixtape? (04:48–05:38)

• Summary: Chris succinctly frames the game as an "adventure game about a trio of teenagers in Northern California in the 1990s, on the eve of their last night together before they part ways into adulthood." Gameplay intersperses animated, lightly interactive film with tactile, music-driven minigames and emotional vignettes.
• The developer is Beethoven & Dinosaur, teaming up again with Annapurna after The Artful Escape.

"It's a kind of adventure game slash walking sim. But it has a really great licensed soundtrack that has already been added to my Spotify." — Lucy James (08:10)

2. Why Mixtape’s Approach Works (09:18–15:59)

• Expectations vs. Experiences: Griffin and the crew admit initial skepticism, assuming Mixtape would fall flat like many similar coming-of-age games. But Mixtape’s unique combination of tightly paced, emotionally resonant vignettes synced to carefully selected music proved surprisingly effective.
• The Musical Structure: Chris likens Mixtape’s design to a musical: "You talk and talk until the emotions are so high...then, boom, you bust into song. Here...when the emotions are that high, that’s where you play."
  • Interactive memories (making a slushie, skipping stones, French kissing via dual-stick controls) give players control at emotional peaks, not just action beats.
• No Fail States: The minigames are intentionally frictionless—failure neither halts nor rewinds progress, which the team admires for maintaining narrative flow (15:59–17:08).

"It’s an experience that you enjoy... because of the pacing. You’re never in a thing for more than three minutes... you're always moving to the next thing." — Justin McElroy (15:59)

3. Character Dynamics & Sincerity (11:00–12:41; 20:17–21:54)

• The cast gleefully debates Stacy Rockford as an "insufferable" mixtape-making friend—insufferability being central to the teen genre’s charm rather than a flaw.
• Griffin: "Kids suck, dude. They're not crazy. They all say crazy shit." (12:38)
• Chris and Lucy draw parallels to Lady Bird, Dazed & Confused, Empire Records—where flawed, overconfident teens stumble into profound moments, which the game captures beautifully.
• The discussion reinforces that teenagers’ cringe-worthy behavior is not a barrier but a feature that enables emotional connection.

4. Nostalgia and Universality (13:31–19:44, 46:52–56:25)

• Refuting “Not My Childhood” Discourse: The Besties argue that Mixtape’s blend of specificity (NorCal, 90s culture) and artifice (flying through fields, hyper-real parties) makes it widely relatable on a thematic level, if not literal.
  • Justin: "The Beat by beat might not sync with your life... but it would be surprising if anyone didn't find some relatable, like, oh, here's that person I hate for no really good reason."
• Desire for the Feeling, Not the Facts: The team contends that Mixtape is more about emotional universality and wish fulfillment than exact realism. It's akin to Ferris Bueller or Booksmart—nobody had this exact life, and that's the point.
• The soundtrack, while period appropriate, avoids the "Garden State trap" of preciousness or forced discovery, instead working as a genuine emotional amplifier.

5. Music and Sense Memory (18:22–19:44)

• Lucy articulates how the integration of music with tactile memories mirrored her own connection of songs to life events:

"There is something so wonderful about the marrying of emotion to music and I think I feel that specifically... even though I didn't grow up in the Big Suck, I grew up in the northeast of England. But there were so many parallels..." — Lucy James (18:33)

6. Design of Playable Moments (14:14–17:08; 59:05–61:15)

• The minigames—tongue-joining French kisses, skipping stones, making slushies, skating, snapping to songs—build intimacy and nostalgia.
• The team highlights the emotional resonance of small, mundane interactions, reinforced by the game's constant movement from vignette to vignette.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Chris Plant (On Stacy):
  "She is insufferable. But I think that is the point... The worst thing about this friend and best thing is, you're like, fuck, they were right. Like, this music is good. Harper's Bazaar does, in fact, fucking rock, dammit." (11:00)

• Griffin McElroy (On Teen Sincerity):
  "It's like, yeah, because they're kids, man. And they're like, kids suck, dude... That's so, so, so deeply relatable on a really deep, primordial level." (12:38)

• Lucy James (On Relating to the Game):
  "There were so many ways I could relate my experiences to this game. The music just really helped. I can't, I can never have silence. I'm one of those people. So. I loved it." (19:44)

• On Pacing:
  "You're never in a thing for more than like three minutes... and you're always moving to the next thing." — Justin (15:59)

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Spoiler Discussion (43:10–61:49)

The last third of the episode features a major spoilers segment.

1. Bittersweet Endings & Realism (46:52–49:29)

• The game leans into the reality that life moves on. The trio’s story doesn’t wrap with an artificial happy ending—Stacy leaves, the group parts ways, their big dreams stay big.
• Griffin: "You spend the whole game saying... at the end, maybe she'll cancel her trip... That doesn't happen. Like, everyone kind of sticks to the path... That's bold." (46:53)

2. Friendship of Circumstance (45:38–47:17)

• Chris notes how high school friends are often "friends by circumstance," and Mixtape captures the sadness and inevitability of drifting apart.

"The sadness of the game... is seeing somebody have to tell that to people that they love... The hurt is inevitable..." — Chris Plant (45:38)

3. Tactility of Connections (49:29–51:24)

• The team highlights moments like the "Don’t Let Go" minigame (holding both triggers to keep holding a friend’s hand), and how the use of controls—fusing or separating, choosing who leans closer in a photo booth—subtly shapes the story and the player’s interpretation of relationships.

4. Nostalgia as Structure (56:25–57:10)

• The framework of reliving memories, flying through childhood or wish-fulfillment scenarios, and meditating on what could have been, is central.
  • Chris compares it to "mixtape of teen movies," with moments pulled from classics like Dazed and Confused, Ferris Bueller, Booksmart.

5. Universal vs. Specific (57:10–58:45)

• Mixtape is intentionally not set in a precisely “real” place or exact timeline, mirroring the fuzziness of memory and collective, aspirational nostalgia.

"It's a fantasy of these pieces of childhood... No one had this teenage life... look at the day that Ferris Bueller has, it's fucking crazy—but you watch it and love it." — Lucy & Justin (57:10)

6. Favorite Playable Moments (59:05–61:15)

Each host/guest picks their favorite minigame:

• Russ: BJ Thomas sequence in the rain, floating memory with synchronized audiovisual cues (59:05)
• Griffin: Van renting movies while drunk ("the execution is goddamn... so funny") (60:03)
• Lucy: Opening road-skateboarding to Devo—evokes pure youthful energy ("go down the road to Devo... trying tricks, yelling car!") (60:32)
• Chris: Photo booth flashback with dual leaning, subtle storytelling ("...you end up taking photos... those photos mean something very different depending on how you do that") (60:55)

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Side Segments

After the core discussion, the team jumps into:

• Mailbag: Questions about legacy controllers, PC compatibility, and the quirks of the new Steam controller (notably, it sometimes "Wilhelm screams" when dropped from 3 feet) (25:32–31:01).
• Honorable Mentions:
  • Widow’s Bay (Apple TV) – a horror-comedy gem; love for horror/comedy fusion.
  • Martin Short: Life is Short (Netflix) – a comfort-watch documentary for Second City TV era fans.
  • Blueprints (game) – Russ’s ongoing updates and colorblind patch woes.

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Memorable Quotes With Timestamps

• On Genre Blending:

  "[Mixtape] is a musical. Where a music number like the singing would happen is when you play... it's these very tactile things: making a slushie, skipping stone... it's not—"
  — Chris Plant (14:14–15:01)

• On Emotional Timing:

  "There's a scene where Van Slater is like, he's made an album... when a superhero gets bit by a magic rat... that feels like a purpose to me. I found that... put something into words I had never been able to before. And it was coming out of the wispy, mustachioed mouth of this virtual teenager."
  — Griffin McElroy (20:17)

• On Fantasy vs. Realism:

  "Look at the day Ferris Bueller has. It's fucking crazy. But you watch Ferris Bueller and love it..."
  — Justin McElroy (57:12)

• On Player Agency & Narrative:

  "...controlling both hands and controlling two things at once is one of my favorite tricks of the game... when you control two things, you end up telling a story."
  — Chris Plant (49:29)

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Final Thoughts

"Mixtape" receives unanimous praise for its nuanced approach to nostalgia, coming-of-age tropes, musicality, and the emotion and interactivity only games can provide. The Besties crew notes that despite—or because of—its heightened, wish-fulfillment style, it captures the universal longing, uncertainty, and bittersweet joy of the nights that mark the end of youth.

"Go and play it right now, because I want to talk about all the spoiler stuff." — Chris Plant (22:21)

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Navigation

• Mixtape Introduction: 04:48
• Game Structure/Music as Emotional Trigger: 09:18–15:59
• Teen Sincerity & Nostalgia: 11:00–13:31
• Game Design & Flow: 14:14–17:08
• Mailbag and Controller Talk: 25:32–31:01
• Spoiler Section Begins: 43:10
• Bittersweet Endings & Universal Nostalgia: 46:52–57:10
• Favorite Playable Moments: 59:05–61:15
• Episode Close: 61:49–

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This summary preserves the original tone and wit, focusing on the game’s themes and the hosts’ playful camaraderie while skipping ads and formalities.

Transcript

[A]

I'm glad you're all here. This is a very important moment. Lucy especially I'm glad that you're here, because I've come up with a business proposition that I think you're all going to be very interested in. You know when you're waking up in the morning and you feel like you want fruit, and you don't want normal fruit like a blueberry or even a raspberry, you want something quasi tropical, maybe a little bit tangy, that's got seeds in it, the whole feeling. You know that feeling?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So your business proposition is the kiwi.

[A]

Griffin people have already invented the kiwi, so the idea that I would bring the kiwi seems like a pretty simplistic idea. You guys are getting on the ground floor of something that I don't think anyone has come up with.

[B]

Jeff Kiwi.

[A]

That's pretty good.

[D]

Pretty good.

[B]

Is it that.

[A]

It's not Jeff kiwi.

[D]

Okay.

[B]

It's better than that.

[A]

Appealable kiwi.

[C]

Appealable kiwi.

[D]

What? It's just nice to look at.

[A]

No, no, no. Oh, Jesus Christ. Like an orange? Yeah, like an orange.

[C]

More of a rind than a skin situation.

[A]

So you don't need a knife, you don't need a peeler. You're just peeling it off and kiwi is inside. So instead of being stuck with an orange, you've got kiwi, which is.

[C]

It's great, right? It's great. I'll invest. I'll tell you why I don't like touching the hair. I like eating a kiwi. I don't like to touch the hair. It looks like a gonad, and I just can't. It's not my favorite fruit to touch. All fruit, I think, should have a peelable rind apple. Give me the choice of do I want to go nuts on it. And I know I'm not one to talk about eating fruits with the rind on it. I realize that this opens up old wounds, but. But give me the choice whether or not to remove it. That's all I want.

[D]

What do you say to those people who eat, you know, who just eat it like an apple, who don't peel the kiwi and just go straight in. I'm not one of those people, but I know they.

[A]

Okay. I was worried for a second because you might have to be booted off of this guest spot.

[C]

That's wild.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That would have been horrible. It's the hairiest fruit for every normal person on the planet. I think they're gonna be thrilled. And the good news is, I'VE also already got branding figured out, which I know. You know, if you're just in the supermarket, you see a kiwi, you wouldn't necessarily notice, you know. Okay, so think about a hard boiled egg, also peelable.

[C]

Right, right, right.

[A]

So what we're doing is we're mashing up the two and what do we end up with?

[C]

Hard boiled kiwi frag.

[B]

Can I.

[D]

What are you mashing up to get frag.

[C]

Where is the FR coming from?

[A]

Egg. It's a fruit egg.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

And it's in the shape of an egg and it's a kiwi fragrance.

[C]

I know that you don't want fruit egg.

[B]

You don't want to like split the money because there's a lot of money to be made here.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

With fruit eggs. I think we do need to go find a partner and we go with Geoff Keighley's peelable Kiwis Appealable Peelables.

[D]

That's it.

[C]

Okay, so Chris is on branding.

[A]

But wait, wait, wait. Or Frank or frag.

[B]

Okay, now you're.

[A]

I do see you can fit frag on a shirt. You can't fit what you just said.

[C]

Jeff Kiwi presents Frag.

[D]

Frag.

[B]

I like that. I like that.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

It's a world exclusive.

[C]

Yeah. Can we get the RD team on next? Getting the fuzz off of peaches. Otherwise perfect fruit. Weird mouth feel when you go in the skin. Just give it to me. Smoot shiny, please.

[D]

I got the mine from Del Monte on the phone.

[A]

Oh, good.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

He says yes.

[A]

Oh, no.

[B]

He says, well, you canceled.

[A]

He's got a lot of a lot of time on his hands.

[C]

My name is Griffin McElroy. I know the best game of the week.

[B]

My name is Christopher Thomas Plant and I know the best game of the week.

[A]

My name is Russ Rushik. I know the best game of the week.

[C]

Let it rip, Lucy.

[D]

My name is Lucy James and I know the best game of the week.

[C]

Welcome to the best season where we talk about the latest and greatest in home interactive intergamement. It's a game of the year club and you just by listening have become a member of the. This week we are talking about a coming of age charming adventure music odyssey called mixtape with Lucy James from Friends per second. Thank you for joining us for this conversation.

[D]

Thank you for having me. I like that there's no better guest for someone with the experience of growing up on the US west coast than a British person like me.

[A]

Well, it was made by, I think an Australian person.

[B]

I think we're okay.

[C]

Also the childhood depicted in this game was had by nobody. So Chris Plant what is Mixtape?

[B]

Mixtape is an adventure game about a trio of teenagers in Northern California in the 1990s on the eve of their last night together before they part ways into adulthood. It plays a bit like an interactive movie where largely swaths are animated film, the controller being handed over for the big emotional beats. It was made by the Australian developer Beethoven and Dinosaur and published by Annapurna. The two previously partnered on the Artful Escape in 2021. Another music game soaked adventure. Did I write that?

[A]

I just did that right off the dome.

[C]

Yeah, that was right off the dome. That was.

[B]

I'm trying something new. It's called Being Prepared.

[C]

Whoa, that's so good. So yeah, that's Mixtape. We're gonna talk more about it after this short break. Has this ever happened to you? You get that hungry dinner time feeling, but you haven't done anything to cater to that? Well, fail to plan and plan to fail is what I always say. I came up with that and I also came up with this great way of solving that issue and that is Factor. Factor has meals built around your nutrition goals, including high fiber, high protein and carb conscious options. No matter what your diet is, Factor's gonna have something in their extensive menu that's going to not only give you the nutrition you need, but also tickle your taste buds. I'm talking about short rib Calabrese, I'm talking about truffle butter, filet mignon. I'm talking about Korean style salmon and gochujang sauce. So many tasty meals. That's just what's on the menu this week. They're always changing it up. They deliver it straight to your door. It's ready to eat in just two minutes so you have more time for everything. You love doing that isn't, you know, preparing meals and failing to plan. Everything I've gotten from Factor has been super tasty, super fresh. And if you've been looking for a meal service, I can't recommend this one Enough. Head to FactorMeals.com Besties 50 off and use code Besties50OFF to get 50% off and free daily greens per box with new subscription only while supplies last until September 27, 2026. See website for more details. Can I start off by asking a question? Which is how come anytime, like a coming of age sort of tender adventure game comes out, the conversation that sort of happens around it reveals all of us just to be the biggest fucking dorks who have ever lived or consumed any media Ever. The number of people who are like, that's not how my childhood went. Nostalgia. I don't think so. You didn't spend your childhood flying around, hovering through beautiful fields, riding dinosaurs. Riding dinosaurs. Shut the shut. Just hush everyone. But not us. We are here to have a. I think a better talk about mixtape.

[B]

I think this is actually gonna probably be the best and only conversation you need to hear about mixtape. I think that's, that's gonna kind of promote it. Is that Lucy, do you wanna tell people like a little bit of like what the hell this story actually is? Who is Stacy Rockford, Van Slater and Cassandra Marino?

[D]

These are a pair of a trio of little punks. Their last day of high school and they have this big wonderful road trip planned. But Stacey has kind of thrown a wrench in the works and she is actually leaving the group to go to New York to find Bella deltone who is a premier Hollywood music supervisor. Because Stacey's lifelong dream since I think she's known since she was in eighth grade that she wants to be a music supervisor because her skill is to make mixtape. So she's made this one great soundtrack that will be the backing of their one last night as they go to the classic Hollywood, Hollywood high school party. They need to find booze, be with the cool kids, avoid Ginny Goodspeed. And they get. And they kind of have this little nostalgia fueled trip down their friendship. They talk about what it's going to be like in their futures that are as yet undefined. And it's basically just. It's a kind of adventure game slash walking sim. But it has a really great licensed soundtrack that has already been added to my Spotify and yeah, really good.

[C]

I started playing this yesterday and finished it over the course of the day. It's not the longest game in the world. I think I was putting it off one because we're also playing another game that is incredibly compelling but also because, I don't know, I feel like I've played games like this in the past and they have fallen so flat for me because one of these different things, whether it's like the soundtrack or the framing or the, you know, whatever, just if it doesn't work for you, then the whole thing kind of doesn't. I just assumed this game was not gonna be for me. But I think they do a really good job of sticking the landing on just this core concept of like this is a person who makes soundtracks to their life. I know that sounds insufferable, but actually for a video game, it's a really, really, really good framing device. And the songs they pick are pretty dope.

[B]

Yes. For me, the music really clicked because it's not contemporary music. Like, it doesn't fall into the Garden State trap of. You have to hear this new song. It's gonna change your life. And not to say that that soundtrack is even bad. I love the Shins, my friends.

[D]

Yeah. It was just everything around the soundtrack that was bad.

[B]

Yeah.

[D]

I was thinking, she's doing this little thing. Oh, God.

[A]

Oh, no.

[C]

Quick, don't think too hard about Garden State.

[B]

People can't see what Lucy did, but it was somewhere between Natalie Portman and the Child and the Shining doing Red Ruffles. Yeah.

[C]

No.

[D]

Cause that's the thing. She's like, oh, I just like to do something that no one has ever done in this spot in space and time. And it's just. I can't think about it.

[C]

And then she does the thing the kid from the Shining does. Like, we know that someone's done that before. The kid in the Shining did it. What are you talking about here?

[B]

The main character. I want to get your read on this because I feel like I'm not seeing this part in the conversation. She is insufferable. But I think that is the point. The character Stacy is your friend who makes mixtapes and is your friend who's like, I know you want to listen to your favorite music, but have you actually ever heard of Lush? Maybe you would rather be listening to Silverchair right now. And you're like, no, actually, I want to listen to what I like. And they're like, no, no, no. We're gonna put in some Roxy Music. And then eventually, the worst thing about this friend and best thing is you're like, fuck, they were light.

[C]

They're good.

[B]

Like, this music is good. Harper's Bazaar does, in fact, fucking rock, dammit.

[C]

Yeah, I feel like this is another part of the annoying part of this conversation is people saying like, well, this character. These teens say the most insufferable shit.

[B]

Darnit.

[C]

And it's like you're telling me that if a character in some way has a fault, that they are. All of a sudden you can't have any kind of emotional sort of connection to them. When I think it's a staple of the genre that this is, which is the coming of age kind of teen comedy. Like your Superbads, like your book smarts

[A]

or like Dazed and Confused, I think.

[C]

Is it Dazed Confused, like your Ferris, especially Empire Records Ferris. Bueller's Day Off. Right? Like Lady Bird, like, Lady Bird is terrible. Like, that's a terrible person who, like, says the. But it's like, yeah, because they're kids, man. And they're like, kids suck, dude. They're not crazy.

[B]

They all say crazy shit.

[C]

I think it's easy to write this thing off as like, a nostalgia play because that term has become so firmly commercialized in the way that, like, Stranger Things is like the nostalgia show that people talk about because they, you know, they. They eat old Eggo waffles. I'm having trouble thinking of 80s shit. They go to a big mall and everyone has the craziest hair. But, like, this whole game is just about, like, being a senior in high school and about to become an adult and having this, like, huge vacuum in your life that you're about to create by leaving all this stuff that, that you know and trying to fill it with just like, shit you think is cool. And that makes you an insufferable hipster. That's. I don't know. That seems so, so, so deeply relatable on, like, a really deep, primordial level.

[A]

The Beat by beat might not necessarily sync with your life personally, but it would be surprising if anyone watched this and didn't find some relatable, like, oh, here's that person I hate for no really good reason. Like, everyone has that in their life, which I don't know. I. I think this game clicked for me in a really big way. Lucy earlier described it as a walking sim, which I do understand where that comes from.

[D]

Yeah, it's a hybrid of things. It's more adventure game, you know, I. But let's say it's like, I would. I would. I would just say there's just so much being thrown at the. At the wall when it comes to, like, describing the game, when really it's just, you know, it's a story, a great story, Right.

[B]

I think I know the formula to this game. And it's genre. It is a musical. And where a music number like the singing would happen is when you play. Because in a musical, it's like you talk and talk and talk until the emotions are so high it can't be described anymore. And then, boom, you bust into song, right? And here it's. You talk and talk and talk and there's a lot of talking. Like, there are large place parts of this game that are just unplayable. Animated film. And then you get to a sense memory and it's like, oh, you have to feel this. And that could be like tongues, French kissing. That could Be digging through a drawer like a drunk drawer for old ticket stubs. It's these very tactile things making a slushie where you're blending all the flavors together. Skipping stone it's not.

[C]

Yeah, dude, I played that skipping stone minigame for a long time.

[B]

Oh, man.

[C]

Because I thought, like, yeah, I bet I'll get an achievement or something.

[A]

Greg Miller is somewhere crowing over his platinum in fucking mixtape for skipping stones.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. The nature of the construction of this game is like a story punctuated by these memories set to music. And each one of those little memories is like a tiny minigame. Feels dismissive, but like it is the. You see something and it reminds you of your first kiss. And then you go into this song that you've set to the soundtrack of your first kiss. And then you French kiss with two tongues. And one stick controls one tongue, one stick controls the other tongue. And you just slap them together until you stop. And there's not like a. You're not collecting. There's no fail state. There's no, like, there's no fail state, I don't think for anything in the entire game. Right? Nothing is really up in the air.

[A]

You can like if you. So there are skating sequences and if you like accidentally hit a car, it'll rewind like a VHS tape and that's about it. Which is fine. I mean, there's been actually a lot of shitty discourse about the like, is this a game? Fail state? No fail state, whatever. Go back and play Journey. You can't fucking lose Journey. And no one was making a big hullabaloo about whether that was a game or not. Like it's an. For lack of a better term, it's an experience that you enjoy. And I actually think part of the reason it works in ways that like a lot of these videos, very, very narrative heavy games don't work for me is because of the pacing. Because you're never in a thing for more than like three minutes. Three or four minutes is like the cap and you're always moving to the next thing. So I remember in their last game, which I liked, I thought it was a good game, but like there would be long dialogue sequences or long just like 2D platforming where you're walking around a ship or something and it just killed the momentum. And here you're constantly moving, even if you're just having a conversation because those conversations lead to little interactive bits. You feel like you're constantly moving forward.

[C]

I think that the pacing is great and the non interactivity I think kind of gives way to something really cool and profound when it starts to kind of synchronize with the music. Like, I talked about doing the Skipping Stone game for a long time, partially because, one, I thought there was something going on. And also it was one of the more interactive parts of the game. But also there's a sequence that is so kind of lovely where she's having this memory about a time that her friend ditched her. And this song most of all plays, and it goes to black and white. And then you sort of just control her as she floats through frozen time and can kind of just sort of sway to the music. At a certain point, snaps start in the song and Stacy starts snapping along with the beat out of, like. I don't know. That stuff is so, like, you don't have to do any of that. There's no reason to do any of that. But the game gives you so many opportunities to just, like, get on its wavelength in a really kind of straightforward, simple way that I feel like hooked me more. More times than it didn't.

[D]

I was gonna say I'm a kind of person who. I don't necessarily deliberately soundtrack my life to music, but I have a very strong pull and a very strong tie to certain songs from certain parts of my life.

[C]

And, yeah, Limp Bizkit.

[D]

Well, no, like, I have a very strong connection to, like, Static by Beck when I was playing Okami back in, like, 2006. I, like, I have just weird connections with certain things. And so I really love the way that those moments were punctuated by songs, even if they weren't the ones that I would listen to. And it just. There is something so wonderful about the marrying of emotion to music, and I think I feel that specifically in my real life. And so even though I didn't grow up in the Big Suck, I grew up in the northeast of England. But there were so many parallels that I could make to my own life, especially the big one where you were going out over the field. And I think they say, let's waste an afternoon. It's never wasted. Which was a really beautiful line that I thought. And it just reminded me of the amount of time that, yeah, my friends and I did waste a bunch of time. There was a big field at the back of my house. You'd have to cross it to go to the supermarket, which we would do pretty much every day. And it was just. I don't know. There were so many ways that I could relate my experiences to this game. And the music just really Helped. I can't. I can never have silence. I'm one of those people. So. I loved it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, it's terrific. I think we're going to do a like a full on spoiler at the end of this episode after the honorable mention so that people can stop if they don't want to have it spoiled if they haven't played it yet. But yeah, I would really, if anyone like digs on narrative gameplay at all. I think this is like one of the most unique approaches to a narrative game that I've ever played. It just is incredibly capably put together and I think a lot of people are really going to enjoy it.

[C]

I think so too. I think the writing in this game is so. I don't know, it is so representative of when this coming of age genre kind of worked the best. Where the characters say a lot of really kind of inane hipster shit that a senior in high school who has reached sort of the top of the. This very local food chain sort of succumbs to. And it's tough because it is cringe worthy stuff that they say at times. And then there will be a scene that is like really, really beautiful where a character will say something really, really profound. There's a scene where Van. I forget his last name. Your sort of stoner wastoid buddy talking Van Slater is like, he's made an album, he doesn't want to play it for anyone. But he has this bit where he talks about the sort of creative process and what he enjoys about it and how when a superhero gets bit by a magic rat that gives them their powers, all of a sudden they have a purpose. And he's like, if you decide to make an 8 minute long synth odyssey, you've got some homework to do to learn how to do that. And that feels like a purpose to me. I found that to put something into words that I don't know, I had never been able to before. And it was coming out of the wispy, mustachioed mouth of this virtual teenager. I adored this game. I really, really loved it a lot. And I feel silly for kind of holding it at bay because I assumed it was going to be something that it really was.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's just a hard pitch. It's hard for you to really connect to it until you're playing it. And that's just unfortunately the nature of it or fortunately I guess the nature of it. So in that way I think it's on game pass. Things like that, like they're and 20 bucks? Yeah, if you want to buy it. So realistically, not huge investment. I'm sure if you were waiting, you might come on discount at some point. But overall, like, man, go and play it.

[B]

Go and play it right now because I want to talk about all the spoiler stuff. So you go and play it, and then you hit pause and then come right back. This episode is brought to you in part by Rocket Money. Rocket Money has been saving me from my bad habits lately. You see, I like watching really gnarly niche horror movies, and there are so many streaming services available to watch those on. And I just sign up for all of them. Not really intentionally. You see, it says, hey, you need to sign up if you want to watch this. And I do. And I set a reminder to myself to maybe get rid of it. And then I forget. And then, look, I'm not. I'm not proud of myself. But Rocket Money, it will just go through all of those decisions I've made, and they'll get me set up. It will get those bills off my plate. Rocket Money it is a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. They can automatically categorize transactions so you can see where your money is going and set budgets to for certain categories. The app consolidates all of your accounts into a single dashboard so you can see your entire financial picture in one place. And the great thing about that is if I'm saving money on all these subscriptions I don't need, I can just buy some nice 4k horror physical media that I'm going to just love forever and ever. At least that's what I tell myself. Let Rocket Money help you reach your financial goals faster. [e-mail] Besties that's RocketMoney.com Besties RocketMoney.com Besties

[A]

this episode of the Besties is sponsored by ritual. You know, this is the spring, the weather is nice. I'm gonna adventure out in the world. And you know what? I don't want to be thinking about my gut health. I want it stable. I want it good. That's all very important. And to that end, I've been turning to ritual. You know, probiotics are only able to stay in the gut for a few days or weeks at a time. So consistent use can help support the benefits. Don't let your gut keep you from going with rituals symbiotic. Plus, you only need one capsule a day for simple, streamlined gut support. I have been using Rituals Symbiotic plus. So easy it has like a minty scent to it, which I appreciate and also just helps keep everything in my belly feeling good, which is exactly what I'm looking for in this time of nice weather. Symbiotic plus is a 3 in 1 biotic formula with clinically studied pre pro and postbiotics in clinically studied doses to support a balanced gut microbiome. You just have to take one daily mint scented capsule for bloat gut and regularity support Support a balanced gut microbiome with ritual symbiotic plus save 25% off your first month at ritual.combesties that's ritual.combesties for 25% off your first month

[C]

usually we do a sort of B segment here. We're going to hold off because we're going to do the rest of our end of show business before we do Spoiler Discussion on Mixtape so Russ, do we have anything from the reader mailbag that you want to dump out?

[A]

Yeah we do. We have a couple letters from folks. This one comes from bucklingswashes. This is in reference to our Seiros episode that we did last week and I mentioned the game Outland, which was a Metroidvania that that team made. Russ mentioned outland and the Xbox 360 version is still available for purchase and backwards compatible on Xbox One and Series consoles. So that's good. That's one way to play it. I kind of wish it was on PC but whatever.

[C]

Oh, did you say it wasn't? You couldn't get?

[A]

Yeah, as far as I can tell there is no version available on PC anymore. But yeah, you can play it on. I probably own it on Xbox360. So that's something. The other letter comes from Steven in relation to the Steam controller conversation that we had. I was testing out a Steam controller. I continue to really love it, but I do have some notes, but I'm going to read Steven's email first. There are now methods of making the PS5 controller work with full wireless capability on PC. I'm curious if those in the best of you feel with this in mind, is the Steam controller the ideal PC controller? Okay, so a couple things. One, I just like the fact that it works. Like you don't have to like install GitHub drivers and whatever else to get it to work. But the note that I do have for people and I don't know that I made this clear enough in the last episode, if you're playing a lot of games that aren't in Steam, so maybe they're on the Xbox Store, maybe they're on EGS or whatever. The Steam controller will not work out of the box. I think there are workarounds to get it working, but it's going to be a little bit of a pain in the ass for 98% of the stuff I play on PC, it's on Steam, so it's not an issue for me. But even like, itch I would be mindful of, like stuff on itch might not work. Although I do think you can add itch IO stuff to Steam to work around that way.

[C]

I also, after spending however long the PS5 has been out, I don't love the DualShock 5 or if that is in its name, interesting.

[D]

I don't either.

[C]

I don't know. I don't know what it is about it. I feel like in some ways it's ergonomically really great. I really despise the triggers. I think they feel pretty bad. I understand kind of the concept of there being a modular resistance there that they can use to emulate things in games, and I hate how that feels every time. Like in Seiros, you get that little bit of tension at the half squeeze. So you know when you've switched to a weapon's alt fire mode. I thought that felt really bad. I think using that makes the triggers feel like, so squishy and kind of weird. And they're also a little too far away. I have like decent sized hands. They're a little far away from where I like hold the grip. I don't know. I would much, much rather use a 360.

[B]

Lucy, do you get the hand cramps from the.

[D]

Yeah, I can't use a DualSense.

[C]

DualSense, yes.

[D]

I mean, the fact that they called it the Pro version, the DualSense Edge, tells me that they don't have a single woman working in marketing on that control.

[A]

Have they been making motherboards this whole time? Because it has motherboard energy all over it.

[C]

The DualSense Edge does sound like a men's razor that has like nine blades on it and produces its own.

[D]

Sounds like something you'd. You'd find at a CDO store. But no, I can't do it. I can't do it because I just get really bad hand cramping with it and I use the feel like such a broken record. I have the. The. What is it? The Xbox Elite Series 2? Cause the back pedals are great.

[C]

That's my. Yeah, it's a little heavy. Honestly, it's a little heavy. My favorite video game controller in my house is a fucking Powera nano switch controller. It's like this big. It's like a baby set, but like my hands kind of get perfectly around it and there's no extra sort of like space and everything. It just. I have to move my fingers so, so little. Because it's a tiny little baby controller.

[B]

I don't know.

[C]

I don't need much bigger than that.

[A]

Lucy, did you try this? Have you tried the Steam controller?

[D]

I did, yeah. I like it a lot. I did put a hold on a pre order thing, so I'm just waiting on my email because I'm just fully in the Steam ecosystem at this point.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, who isn't?

[D]

Russ, have you dropped it yet? Have you done that thing?

[A]

I heard about this this morning. Lucy, do you want to tell. I haven't dropped it, but you should tell people what happened.

[D]

So if you drop the Steam controller, I can't remember the height that it has to fall.

[B]

I think about three feet.

[D]

Three feet? It'll scream. We'll get the little Wilhelm scream. Not every time. I think they said every six or eight times. But you'll get a little scream.

[C]

What?

[A]

Yeah, the controller screams when you drop it.

[C]

Why?

[A]

They thought it was funny.

[C]

Yeah, fucking why, man. Like, is the controller a little. Is it a little bit heavier? I guess that's a good point, Chris. Yeah, you're gonna get a lot of smash Steam controllers.

[B]

It's just like when Nintendo, you know, when Nintendo made all the cartridges taste so good.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And people, like had to keep eating them.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, that's right.

[C]

For sure. That's exactly.

[B]

Don't do that, guys. Like, don't do that. Do I have any more questions?

[A]

It hasn't come up. I think that's it in terms of reader mail, which means we can jump into honorable mentions before we dive into the spoiler heavy mixtape conversation. Lucy, have you been playing anything of note or watching anything? It doesn't have to be a game. You could talk about anything.

[D]

I can't talk about what I've been playing because of embargoes, but I have been watching Widow's Bay on Apple tv.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Chris Plant is a big fan of Widow's Bay.

[B]

I watch no tv. I watch Widow's Bay.

[D]

It is the only show that we tune in other than Vanderpump Rules, which we are slowly getting through. We're almost at Scandival. Very excited. Widow's Bay is the one thing that we tune into Every week. And I thought it came out on Wednesdays. It comes out on Tuesday evening. So we watched the latest episode. It is as if. So it's an Apple TV show. You wouldn't know because Apple is notoriously terrible at promoting anything other than severance. But it is Matthew Reese from the Americans, and he is basically playing a Basil Fawlty esque character who is the mayor of. Of a New England island. And it is basically he's trying to promote tourism. And unfortunately, the island is just haunted as hell. Horrible bad things have happened there. And so it is this comedy horror mix up that is absolutely hilarious. There is a joke from the first episode with a calendar. Chris, do you know what I'm talking about? I think about every day and it just has this. But the horror is so effective. Like we were watching last night's episode, which is the episode all about the book, and it is fantastic. It's like edge of the seat stuff.

[B]

What I think they get with the horror writing is that horror and comedy are both the same thing. They both are gonna work because they surprise you. It's not what you suspect or expert.

[D]

Yeah. It's all about the buildup and then the payoff.

[C]

Yes.

[B]

And because of that, they can build up. They can be like, we are building up something, but you don't know which it is. So it's going to catch you off guard either way. And oh, it's so good. Like, they're like. They're literally just like shaking it in front of you. Like it's coming for you. It is coming for you. Please just tell me what it is so I can know if I can be happy or really upset in the writing is just. I love Seaside horror. It's some of the best stuff.

[C]

Why is it. Why is this? I mean, I feel like so many different examples from classical literature have tapped into this, but there's something about the seaside where everything. It's.

[B]

Because it's so big and deep, we don't even, as people know what's at the bottom.

[D]

We don't need to know.

[B]

Like, at the bottom. It could be.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I didn't know this about my wife until, like, literally a year ago. We were at the beach and Shar returned to me and she's like, it's what I'm most scared of. And I was like, what? Out of nowhere, she loves the beach and she's like, it's what I'm most scared of. And I was like, why? And she's like, you could just keep falling forever. And she's like, anyway, I'm gonna go

[C]

get our kid Popsicle time.

[D]

My favorite thing about Widow's Bay, though. So I never saw Parks and Rec, but I know that some of the writing staff worked on Parks and Rec, and my friends say that you can definitely feel that vibe. The creator of the show, Kate Diploid, I believe Dippold. Dippold is maybe most famous for the infamous. Thought I was going to a Halloween party. Went dressed as the Babadook, but it was more an adults drinking wine vibe. She's the Babadook from that incredible tweet. And so, yeah, it's fantastic.

[B]

That is incredible. Also, the director is Hiro Mirai, who is the longtime collaborator of Childish Gambino and Flying Lotus, director of Atlanta. Really one of the best directors working today. And you feel it big time. On top of it being well written, there's a tough needle to thread between the balance of humor and scares, and they nail it. Also, I will say there are people who are like, I don't like horror. I think you will still like this. I would put it more in the thriller camp, the kind of like 60s 70s thriller, than.

[A]

It's not weapons.

[B]

It's not weapons? No. You're not getting. No. Not even actually remotely Weapons.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Sometimes Rachel, my wife Rachel, wants to watch Weapons, but she doesn't remember it very well. She hasn't seen it. She doesn't remember what it's about. So she'll watch a trailer and she'll be like, no fucking way, man. That's the scariest goddamn trailer I've ever seen. And then, like, a month will pass and she'll be like, let's just watch a trailer for Weapons, just to see

[A]

if I can get into it.

[C]

It's just like, no. Why is that guy, like, yard singing that guy's face? Holy shit. No. No weapons. Get out of here. I love Matthew Rhys, man.

[B]

Let's go someplace nice, like the beach in the open ocean.

[C]

I mean, I think we're all playing the same other game right now that is embargoed and can't talk about at the moment.

[A]

Well, I'm not. Well, I am. But I am also playing another game that I can talk about, and that game is called Blueprints. Yay.

[C]

Oh, fuck, yeah.

[B]

There it is.

[C]

Our weekly Blueprints update.

[A]

Progress is being made, folks. I'm on day 12.

[C]

Are you still playing with Alex?

[A]

I'm still playing with Alex, my wife. We are playing, yeah. Usually a day or two a night now that the runs have gotten considerably longer. It's usually one day because a run could take like an hour or more. We're on day 12. How do. I mean, does it matter? I mean, I guess I can do this without spoiling anything.

[C]

How many permanent upgrades? Sure, it's like a big metric.

[A]

Just got the server room unlocked. Oh, cool. As well as we just unlocked the gem mines, that's permanent upgrade. We also have the orchard and the. And the side house. We have the basement key stored in the. What's that? Co Check room. So Batesman is living in there while we figure things out.

[C]

That's fine.

[A]

We are. Are viciously taking notes on.

[C]

Have you finished? Have you made it to room 39?

[A]

Okay, no, so I think it's room 46 and 46 have not made it there. But man, the notes are thorough and we've made a lot of progress on it and it's delightful. I will say this, though. As far as I can tell, the colorblind patch is still not on switch 2. I check every single night.

[C]

That's so wild.

[A]

So far, I will say there's really two major things that I've seen that like, for sure I cannot do. One of them is the billiard. The. The dart board puzzle. And one of them relates to the breaker room. There's like a light thing in the break room. Neither of those at all possible for me to do until that patch drops. But thankfully I have my wife who. Whose eyes work good for her. But it is, I think for people that are still waiting if you want to play it on console. Just a heads up, as far as I can tell, it's not at least on Switch 2. It might be on the other platforms. Google seems confused whenever I ask this question because it keeps referring back to yes, the patch is out, but it's only out on PC, so keep an eye on that. But that's a good video game. I'm glad I'm the first to play it. It's fun.

[C]

I've been watching Rachel and I watched almost all of the Martin short documentary called Life is Short on Netflix, which, like, there's been a real sort of a huge generous crop of this exact type of documentary for different people lately. We watched the John Candy one and the Steve Martin one and there's just. This is an era that is being pretty heavily plumbed for documentary fodder. Mel Brooks had another good one and man, I could watch, I think, an infinite amount of home movies of like that Second City TV all star cast, all fucking hanging out together. I would watch just that On a loop, basically forever. It goes into his whole career not quite as exhaustively as some of these other documentaries. The movies made by Lawrence Kasdan, who is a very prolific writer, wrote a bunch of Star wars movies and a bunch of movies that Martin Short was in that were not successful, that a lot of people haven't even heard of at all. And so they're like old friends who have known each other for a while. And he's the one making the documentary about Martin Short. And so it's. A lot of it is far more kind of like personal. Like, there's an extended sort of bit of the movie where they talk about how his wife bought this lake house, I think, in Toronto, sort of sight unseen. And they just have parties and they have a lot of home movies of like Tom Hanks coming over to play bingo or Catherine o' Hara coming over to, you know, play. Play croquet in their yard. Like, so much of the movie is just these people who are gods in my mind, all like hanging out together and trying to make each other crack up. And like, it's interesting to. To learn about Martin Short, but there's not a think I. I don't think there's a ton to learn here. Did any of you guys watch any of these documentaries, like the John Candy one or the.

[A]

The only one that I've watched that isn't an SCTV one that is similar is the Garry Shandling documentary, which was fantastic. Strongly recommend that. So I'm familiar with the format of it.

[C]

But a lot of them are like the John Candy one in particular. Obviously he's been gone for a while, so they can't get the sort of current perspective. But a lot of it was on sort of his struggles to have this identity as a big funny guy and sort of the baggage that comes along with that. And this movie is. And bear in mind, we have about 20 minutes to go. We stopped it last night. Cause we felt like obviously he's had some personal tragedies sort of lately. And I don't think the movie's going to have the most sort of upbeat ending. So obviously I think that the conclusion of the movie is going to be pretty sad. But there's just so much. There was a lot in the John Candy doc too. And the Steve Martin one of just like these comedy people who I idolized growing up in this unseen footage of them just kind of hanging out. I love that shit, man. Can't get enough of it.

[A]

That's lovely Plant. Do you have anything you want to Just Widows Bay.

[B]

I'll second that. I wanna talk about the spoilers, dude. I just wanna talk about the spoilers so bad.

[C]

Let's say right here, friends who are listening, who do not want to be spoiled on mixtape, which again, I would encourage you, and maybe this is bad practice to host a podcast and to say this, but I finished it in about three hours, three and a half hours. You could really get through this thing. So you know, if. If that doesn't sound great to you, thanks for listening to besties. Thanks to all our patrons on Patreon.

[A]

Wait, let me shout out a couple patrons on Patreon just in case they are the ones that don't want to be spoiled. I don't want to make sure that they don't get cut out. Props to Jeff, Jeff C, Camv, Cameron and smells like fun. Thank you for being members of our Patreon. Thank you to everyone else who supports our show. We have a new episode of the Resties out right now and we have the bracket battles episode, which is the pre Justin departure bracket battles episode forever in our hearts, our EP, Justin McElroy, we thank you for all.

[C]

We didn't give him credit last week

[A]

and you know what? I think it's important that we internalize that credit from now on so that even though it might not audibly big ups you, sir.

[C]

Thank you for everything you do.

[A]

What happened in our hearts.

[C]

Maybe you could make a jingle in our mouths.

[D]

We gotta just like something you just play.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[C]

Executive producer Dustin McElroy. Something like that. Yeah, that's strong. Okay, so if you don't want to be spoiled on mixtape, understandable. Please turn off your device or change it to another thing.

[B]

Turn off your phone.

[C]

Turn off your phone completely.

[A]

Before we get into deep spoilers, I want to hear briefly from Chris Plant because Stacey. My read on Stacey is that she is basically him going into college, but for snobby films. Is that a fair assessment?

[B]

Kind of. I was snobby, but I don't know if I was actually snobby about film in that way yet. I think I was just annoying. I think that's what you're getting at. And the answer is yes, that was me. So the game, like we said, is about Stacy who is about to go off to New York and they had this road trip that they were going to do because her friend Cass is going to go to college in Southern California. I think probably like usc, ucla, maybe UC Irvine. And Van is going to name five

[C]

other Southern California universities.

[B]

You see, San Diego, Please don't do this. I'm writing for this. But yes, the. What is relatable about that to me is I loved my high school friends, but many of us were friends. I think this is common by circumstance. Like, you are making friends with people who are like, well, this is the closest to who I am that is available to me from this pool of 300 to 700 people at my high school. 669 people went to my high school. I will never forget that number. Nice. Thank you. But there is that feeling of I found in the game. Oh, these people are a good fit for this moment, and they are realizing that they will probably never see each other again, at least in this capacity. And I think that is the sadness of the game. And I think that's why Stacy being insufferable is important, because she doesn't really belong here. All of them don't necessarily belong where they're at. And seeing somebody have to tell that to people that they love or not tell it, but tell it in so many words is like a hard thing. That's a really tough moment. And I think that's what I found really relatable about it in, like, that mix of, like, sadness and not wanting to hurt people and them not wanting to hurt you. And, like, the hurt is inevitable is kind of what this game is getting at.

[A]

Yeah, the game doesn't show this, but I can picture the, like, oh, it's the first time back at. In town for a holiday break or whatever it is.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And, oh, I actually had this other thing and, oh, we can do like 30 minutes here and get a coffee and catch up. Oh, and that's actually not going to work. No, We'll. We'll catch up again. And then six years passes. Like, that's.

[C]

The game doesn't show. I think very purposefully, the game doesn't show that. It also doesn't. Since we are in full spoiler territory here, the game starts to sort of dabble in. Not dabble in. That sounds like a sort of accidental way of approaching it. There is this sort of unspoken romance angle that I felt coming off of all the main characters. There's this sort of, like, light, polycule sort of suggestion that is happening here. And you spend the whole game saying, like, oh, and, you know, Stacy's ruined these plans. She's canceled this road trip they've been planning for years now. And you think, like, you know, at the end, maybe she'll cancel her trip and, you know, she'll show up and be like, we're gonna hit the fucking road. That doesn't happen. Like, everyone kind of sticks to the path, right?

[A]

Everybody, sort of.

[C]

The suggestion is that, yeah, tomorrow they're not gonna see each other and, you know, may never again. I thought that was, I don't know, bold. I think the much easier answer would be to do it the other way. But, like, it also would feel like a contradiction to the sort of entire bittersweet vibe of the entire thing.

[D]

I think what makes that ending so effective is the setting being that 90s pre online era where, you know, like, even when I left my relatively small city, let's be real, but, you know, to move to London, you know, that was still. Facebook was around, you could text people. Whereas at this point, your world was so small and it was, you know, those friends of convenience who were around. And the fact that someone leaving would. That would be the end of things. Like, you would miss so, so much. There wasn't an easy way to catch up on everything. And I think that's what really resonated with me is. Cause I missed when my world was that small. You know, I miss when, yeah, for sure. Going and hanging out at the Green in Newcastle was the big thing that you did. You know, those stories that they do, little vignettes of. Of just like a random. What could be a random night are the things that you still hang onto years and years later. And so for me, it was kind of this sort of longing for that time, even though I never experienced it. And when it comes to the friendship, it's like I had friendships like that. And I think the. Particularly in the final third, when it's the bubbling sadness between all three of them, it's like they are approaching every conversation as if it's going to be the last. Which I think makes that ending moment, which is the don't let go. Let go. Yeah, that really hit.

[B]

Can you describe how that.

[C]

Not the first. Like, yeah, not the first time a game has pulled that idea, I think, where you're holding your friend's hand and you have to hold in both triggers to do it. Cause it's sort of a mini game. And it says, don't let go. And then the don't disappears after a while. And I kept on holding it just because I still had this part of my brain that was like, I bet if I keep holding on, I bet there's another ending where I do go. But, like, no, I can tell y' all right now there's no sort of bonus to be acquired for holding the maybe there's an achievement for, like, you held on to Van's hands for four hours or something, but you got to. And it immediately pans out to this, like, needle drop moment that, like, hits.

[B]

Yeah, that. Controlling both hands and controlling two things at once is one of my favorite tricks of the game. And it reminds me of what Hazelight Studio was doing before they started doing co op with brothers. Because when you control two things, you end up telling a story. So, like, you have the tongue. The French kissing game where you zoom in and you are just two giant tongues. And how engaged those tongues are is telling you who is interested. There's another moment where Slater and Stacy, when we flash back before Cassandra had entered, their little trio are taking a photo booth photo set together. And you are controlling how they lean into one another. And there is a like story there. Are they both leaning into each other. Is Stacy leaning in more? Is Slater leaning in more? And you end up taking photos of this. And those photos mean something very different depending on how you do that. You don't have to read it that way. That's like, the game isn't forcing you to think about that, but it is giving you that opportunity to kind of cast your own version of the story with that subtext.

[A]

And I think the. Yeah, the romance stuff ties into that is like, I think, to Griffin's point, I agree. I think it's all done intentionally. There's like, a real logic to it. But the fact that no one is acting on anything tells you either, like, they weren't ready or it wasn't actually. Like, it was purely platonic. Like, your. Your mind kind of goes to a lot of different places. And the fact that the game doesn't give you a set answer of, oh, here's that moment when Stacy and Van are departing and they have a big romantic kiss. Like, I would have killed. It would have ruined the ending for me if that's how it ended. Because it's not a game about that. It's a game about experiencing the moment they're in and then realizing you have to let go.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

It is also, I think, a reason why I've read a lot of writing about this game of people who were not sort of able to connect with it on a sort of nostalgic level. And I joked earlier that, like, no kid had this life. And that is also, I think, purely intentional. The place that the game takes place in is not real. It's not a real place, but it's also not necessarily set in a very specific part of the country, I guess there is the map that you do.

[A]

Pacific Northwest, Northern California.

[C]

Yeah. There's lots of redwoods and pines, so you can do the math from there.

[B]

Time is also places.

[C]

The time period, right.

[B]

1999. But it really, it's.

[A]

Is it 99? I thought it was earlier than that.

[B]

I think it's 99. But they have even said, I mean you have a cassette player, a vinyl player, CDs, you have CD burning, CRTVs. Like it is I think a little bit displaced from time. But it is, I would say Elder Millennial.

[C]

What would you. Or Gen Xer. Gen X. I would say somewhere in that gap, I would say between late Gen X, early, early Elder Millennial.

[D]

Like the fashion is very.

[C]

It felt like the time that the game was taking place was around the time I was like a toddler and so like I didn't, I didn't know when Portishead's debut album Dummy came out in 1993, I was six years old. So I wasn't necessarily in that, that vein. But I, I think the reason that some people kind of fail to not fail but don't have trouble connecting with it sort of on a nostalgic level is that I think the story and a lot of these sort of like the coming of age genre that this game is I would say pretty closely modeled after like a Ferris Bueller or a whatever like a Booksmart is. It is like wish fulfillment. It's like aspirational in a way. Like I never, I never went to a fucking kick ass party with like 200 people at it.

[D]

Do they exist by the way? Because I mean that's, that's such a.

[C]

I, I don't think so.

[A]

They do. I went to one when I was in high school. It was my last. I was pretty straight edge in high school until my graduation night.

[B]

And it was voluntarily. Were you incel. Straight edge or volunteer?

[A]

No, it was just, you know, it was like a theater kid. So like drawing theater kid, straight edge, pretty straightforward. Like, oh, we're just gonna hang out at the diner and drink sodas, whatever. Anyway, I went ham on that last night and in my memory probably not 200 people and probably not burning a cottage down, but that's what it felt like in my memory.

[C]

Yeah, it's played. So much of this game is cartoonish, including its art style. Right. It has that spider verse 2.5D kind of choppy animation style that is like really fucking slick. Really well done here. But also it's like at that party, the Camilla Cole who's like the coolest girl in town comes down in a beam of light from the sky. There's so much deeply unserious stuff happening here. So it's like this is the last day that everybody would love to have. Like I would love to have memories of me fucking going down mountain on skateboards with my friends and doing fucking tricks and then going to this kick

[A]

ass party, having a standoff with her dad in the road.

[C]

Yeah, like that doesn't, that doesn't happen in real life, but you can still kind of like love that because you understand that it's like good and it represents something that is so desirable.

[B]

It's also a mixtape of teen movies. Like that party that you're talking about is Dazed and Confused. I think there's moments that are borrowing even from some moments from like last episode.

[D]

This is the Ferris Buella escape through the running, escape over the fences.

[B]

There's a good chunk. The other thing I'll say about the nostalgia of it all is like it is quite literally the point of the game. It's not running from that. It is a game structurally. And I don't think we've actually talked about this, that is about reflecting on memories. The entire structure of the game is going from one person's room to the next and then looking around the room and remembering moments that have already happened. So the game is really playing with how do we, big fish style, remember things? It is also very much playing with Peter Pan and not wanting to grow up. I don't think it's like an accident that you fly many times in this game. I think it is really aware of the Peter Pan syndrome that is kind of at the heart of the game. So it is a game about nostalgia. Like it's not, I think at the very beginning, Griffin, you said, you know, this isn't the here you want Transformers, here's your Transformers slop, you little piggies. Yeah, we, yes, we're looking at the past, but we do actually want to think about how we think about the past, which is a. It's a different thing.

[D]

I mean, to tie it all together. I spoke to Johnny Galvatron, who's the writer and director back at Dice, so back in February, and I asked him about, you know, why this kind of Norcal Portland setting. And he was like, well, I didn't go to America until I was in my 30s. And for an Australian who's from the outside looking in, America is like this fantasy land. And I was writing a fantasy story. So where else would you set It. Other than places like California and Portland. And I think that's reframed how I approach mixtape because it's like it is a fantasy. It is a fantasy of these pieces of childhood that maybe someone would have had a part of it. Maybe two things. But no one had this teenage life instead of.

[A]

I mean, look at the day that Ferris Bueller has.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, it's fucking crazy.

[C]

Yeah, there's no way, man. But you watch Ferris Bueller and love it, despite the no. 1. This is what drives me crazy. I know I brought this up when we started talking about the game, but I really do feel like when a game like this comes out, it is part of this broader conversation. A lot of it's coming from people who are not approaching the shit in good faith, even remotely at all, which I understand that that is there, but I feel like people with these types of games have so much trouble with. Like, it's not representative of my own sort of experience. And therefore, who is this thing for when it's like, really, this isn't represented. It's a cartoon. Like, it's very, very cartoonishly sort of presented a lot of the time. And it uses the framing and it uses the insufferable tone of its characters sometimes. And it uses the music to tell a bigger thing about the moment that you stop being a kid and this stuff that you've rocked with for 18 years is all of a sudden not as. Not as big a part of your life anymore, maybe gone entirely. And that's so. That's so universal. And it doesn't seem to be a gap that people struggle with in movies because people watch Ferris Bueller and no one's like, I don't even live in Chicago. It's like, fucking calm down, guys. I know it's bad form to talk about, like, the. The conversation or whatever the. The discourse.

[A]

I think it's worthy because if you look on Steam right now, like, there's a lot of downvotes for quite frankly, bullshit reasons, like, yeah, right.

[C]

And it's. It's. Oh, man, that's. That shit is always frustrating, but it's. It's just. It's. It's embarrassing, man.

[B]

I want to wrap with a little splash of joy from each of us, which is. I would love to hear Yalls favorite, like, minigame, like, playable moment from it.

[A]

I. I mean, it was mentioned earlier, but I think the BJ Thomas sequence in the rain where Stacy sees the. That Cass has lied to her about going out and spending time with Jenny Goodspeed and Then seeing that whole sequence play out in slow motion as she's, like, floating backwards. And there's a great beat in there where you're flying over the school and the song is playing and there's bus drivers are on the roofs of all the buses, clapping. I don't know if it's in that sequence or one of the other ones, but that moment I thought was so fucking good.

[B]

Good stuff.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Griffin, how about you?

[C]

That one's up there for me. I really. I love David Gray. His music I've enjoyed for a long time. And there's like an extended sequence where you're kind of like rebuilding, or it's like a memory of you putting together the Ritz, which is their, like, derelict cabin in the woods hangout. That's like a few different things. Oh, fuck. No, it's the van. Van. Trying to rent me.

[A]

Damn it.

[C]

That's so spot. Oh, so fucking fuck. Oh, I can't believe I forgot about it. Your van. And you are. The other two are like, hey, go in there and get us movies. He's like, I'm fucking super drunk. And they're like, please just do it. And you just stumble around and it. I don't know if we describe it, it's not going to sound funny, but the execution is. God damn.

[B]

You knock over everything.

[C]

You knock over everything. And it's so funny. And you hear the warped voice of the cashier the whole time. Like, come on, man. It's good.

[D]

I feel like my answer is kind of basic because it's the very opening of the game, but going down the road to Devo, it's so good. But it's like I forgot that when we were kids we would yell car. You know, even just that moment, like trying to do tricks and just. Yeah, that is such a good Devo song too. It's become my top played of the year already.

[C]

Do you have a backup, Chris? I'm sorry, I took yours.

[B]

You check mine, but I'll a bonus. The photo booth sequence, the flashback with Slater.

[C]

So good.

[B]

So good.

[C]

There's so much work in there.

[B]

I did not know that song. Wichitai Toe by Harper's Bazaar.

[C]

It was really good.

[B]

It's real good. It's real good.

[C]

You mentioning the car thing made me think. I kept thinking about Wayne's World a lot while playing it. And Wayne's World obviously had that kind of confessional style. Turn break the fourth wall and the head banging. And the head banging. That's more, I would say, like high fidelity sort of butter there's a lot

[B]

of high fidelity in here. A lot.

[A]

Yeah, it's a good fucking game, man. Good game.

[C]

Really good. Really, really good. Glad I played it. Okay, that's really gonna do it. We've done all of our ending of show business, so we're probably just gonna wrap up. Lucy, thank you so much for joining us. Where can people find your.

[D]

Thank you for having me. I'm Lucy James. Games on, everybody. You can find me Avoiding discourse on the Internet.

[A]

And you've got the Friends Per Second podcast, which is fantastic. Highly recommend it. Friends of the Besties, certainly.

[C]

Okay, we're not gonna do the rest of our shit. We're just gonna say, oh, wait, what's next week?

[A]

Oh, we're gonna play Forza Horizon 6 next week.

[C]

Oh, okay.

[A]

It's a car game.

[B]

We are coming so dangerously close to telling people what game we're playing right now.

[C]

Yeah, that's true. I'm excited to play Forza Horizon 6, the game we're talking about. Ain't it, though? Keep chasing those clues, gumshoes. So join us next week for automotive bit of revelry with all of us. I mean, Lucy's not going to be here. Lucy's going to be doing other important stuff.

[D]

I'm with you emotionally.

[C]

Cars, man.

[A]

Thank you.

[C]

Good. And hopefully our listeners are as well. Thank you so much for listening to the Besties. Keep on listening to the besties because shouldn't the world's best friends play the world's best games? The Besties is executive Produced by Justin McElroy. You're welcome, besties.